rogue gunman
Holger Freese
shoots people like the military doctor in Fort Hood? Would it be British as well as
American usage?
And what would you call a driver who went berserk and plowed into a crowd of people?
A rogue driver? Or rather a berserk or lunatic driver? Would his act be called a
mad drive or what?
I would much appreciate your answers.
Cheers,
Ho
Cheryl
I'm reminded of the old novel 'Rogue Male'.
You could call such a killer a 'rogue gunman', but I don't think that's
the most common usage now. I think they are usually referred to as mass
murderers, in North America anyway.
I wouldn't call the driver 'rogue', 'berserk', 'lunatic' or 'mad'. If he
did it deliberately, he would also be a mass murderer. More frequently,
such incidents seem to be caused by someone (often elderly)confusing the
gas pedal with the brake, or by the driver suffering a heart attack or
seizure while driving. Those incidents would be merely accidents, even
if the cause was mental confusion in the driver.
'Berzerk' is used for someone in a sudden rage who goes way beyond what
is necessary to kill someone else. That might cause the person to become
a mass murderer, but I think it also implies overkill. That is, a mass
murderer might decide to use a car to kill a group of people. If he were
also berzerk, he would keep driving back and forth over the bodies until
he calmed down.
Oh, and the novel was about a man who went outside all the legal
boundaries and constraints to attempt to murder an unnamed European
political leader (whose identity is easy to guess since the book was set
just before WW II). So he (the protagonist) was a rogue in the sense
that he was completely outside the law and any other restraint.
--
Cheryl
tony cooper
You could describe the person as a "rogue gunman"*, but there is no
"proper expression" to describe that person. The connotation of
"proper expression" is that this is the expression that best describes
the person. Since each situation is different, there can be no best
way to describe it.
The uses of "rogue" are generally descriptions of someone in a
specific group who commits acts that are contrary to what is expected
of someone in that group. The car driver would not be a rogue because
he/she is not part of group that held to certain expectations.
--
Tony Cooper - Orlando, Florida
the Omrud
I may be wrong, but it seems to me that this use of "rogue" comes from
"rogue elephant" - a dangerous wild elephant.
--
David
James Hogg
I think you're absolutely right. As the OED shows, it was first applied
to "An elephant driven away, or living apart, from the herd, and of a
savage or destructive disposition", then to other large wild animals,
then to disobedient horses, and finally to humans in the sense of "out
of control" -- quite far from the original senses of lazy or rascally.
--
James
Mike Lyle
> the Omrud wrote:
>> On 04/01/2010 14:23, Cheryl wrote:
>>>
>>> I'm reminded of the old novel 'Rogue Male'.
>>> Oh, and the novel was about a man who went outside all the legal
>>> boundaries and constraints to attempt to murder an unnamed European
>>> political leader (whose identity is easy to guess since the book
>>> was set just before WW II). So he (the protagonist) was a rogue in
>>> the sense that he was completely outside the law and any other
>>> restraint.
>>
>> I may be wrong, but it seems to me that this use of "rogue" comes
>> from "rogue elephant" - a dangerous wild elephant.
>
> I think you're absolutely right. As the OED shows, it was first
> applied to "An elephant driven away, or living apart, from the herd,
> and of a savage or destructive disposition", then to other large wild
> animals, then to disobedient horses, and finally to humans in the
> sense of "out of control" -- quite far from the original senses of
> lazy or rascally.
Household's title alludes, of course, to this characterisation of
animals: "rogue male" wouldn't have been a very natural expression for a
human, and plain "rogue" would have sounded more like the local tea-leaf
than an assassin. Indeed, in "roguish" we see that the word has been
diluted and shifted in the direction of cuteness. But we now have "rogue
states" --countries which one disapproves of and which do illegal things
on the international stage. One's own country and allies, of course, are
rarely rogue states, whatever they may do.
--
Mike.
Steve Hayes
Well I still think of "rogue" in terms of elephants -- creatures that are
large, powerful, unpredictable and dangerous, and likely to attack without
provocation. I'm not sure who thinks of that kind of behaviour as "cute" -- I
don't.
--
Steve Hayes from Tshwane, South Africa
Web: http://hayesfam.bravehost.com/stevesig.htm
Blog: http://methodius.blogspot.com
E-mail - see web page, or parse: shayes at dunelm full stop org full stop uk
Mike Lyle
Nobody does, and I didn't say any did. I referred to the adjective
"roguish", which does _not_ imply danger or aggression. OED has: < 3.
Playfully mischievous; arch, waggish. >, and the most pejorative use it
gives is < 2. Acting (or wandering) like rogues; knavish or rascally in
conduct.> The application of the noun "rogue" to solitary dangerous
animals isn't (so far in OED) recorded earlier than 1859.
--
Mike.
franzi
things external or internal to the group. Thinking of a neutral
example, if someone spoke of a rogue computer program, I'd understand
it to have, to a degree, the character of malware.
Things must be different in AmE, or why would an ambitious politician
entitle her autobiography "Going Rogue"? This is exactly what the
Omrud's elephants do before they are shot. This behaviour is not
usually a vote-catcher, except perhaps in the BNP.
--
franzi
R H Draney
>
>On Jan 4, 2:35=A0pm, tony cooper <tony_cooper...@earthlink.net> wrote:
>>
>> The uses of "rogue" are generally descriptions of someone in a
>> specific group who commits acts that are contrary to what is expected
>> he/she is not part of group that held to certain expectations.
The car driver would most certainly belong to the group of "drivers", a group
expected to maintain certain norms such as keeping to the street and not mowing
down pedestrians on the sidewalk...that's almost a textbook example of rogue
behavior....
>Things must be different in AmE, or why would an ambitious politician
>entitle her autobiography "Going Rogue"? This is exactly what the
>Omrud's elephants do before they are shot. This behaviour is not
>usually a vote-catcher, except perhaps in the BNP.
It's an odd feeling for me, defending that "ambitious politician", but the title
is said to refer to what her handlers claimed she did during the 2008
campaign...wouldn't follow instructions, went off on her own...by adopting the
phrase herself, one might even say she was speaking ironically....r
--
A pessimist sees the glass as half empty.
An optometrist asks whether you see the glass
more full like this?...or like this?
franzi
she didn't ask my opinion.
--
franzi
Jerry Friedman
> On Jan 4, 9:02 pm, R H Draney <dadoc...@spamcop.net> wrote:
...
> > >Things must be different in AmE, or why would an ambitious politician
> > >entitle her autobiography "Going Rogue"? This is exactly what the
> > >Omrud's elephants do before they are shot.
By the way, is "rogue elephant" any different from "elephant in
musth"?
> > >This behaviour is not
> > >usually a vote-catcher, except perhaps in the BNP.
The difference may be more in American culture. We've had many
decades of heroes, from Retief to Rambo, who defy authority with
results that turn out to be the best for everyone. (Actually, I don't
know how far that describes Rambo, but I'm sure he's a hero.)
> > It's an odd feeling for me, defending that "ambitious politician", but the title
> > is said to refer to what her handlers claimed she did during the 2008
> > campaign...wouldn't follow instructions, went off on her own...by adopting the
> > phrase herself, one might even say she was speaking ironically....r
And allusively. It was quite a while after I heard the title of her
book that I remembered the symbol of her political party is the
elephant.
> That is, shall I say, very courageous of her.
Well, that's one view.
> But I must remember that she didn't ask my opinion.
Or mine, but boy, I have one. (As Archie Goodwin once said.)
--
Jerry Friedman
Cheryl
Do you know, that interpretation never occured to me when I read the
book, but it certainly fits.
It was a clever title.
--
Cheryl
Steve Hayes
<mike_l...@REMOVETHISyahoo.co.uk> wrote:
It's not the noun, it's the adjective.
Yes, a rogue is a rascally fellow who might have some lovable traits.
But the adjective, as in "rogue elephant" or "rogue gunman" or "rogue state"
is a different matter. We're in ASBO territory here.
R H Draney
>
>On Jan 4, 4:20=A0pm, franzi <et.in.arcadia.fra...@googlemail.com> wrote:
>> On Jan 4, 9:02=A0pm, R H Draney <dadoc...@spamcop.net> wrote:
>...
>
>> > >Things must be different in AmE, or why would an ambitious politician
>> > >entitle her autobiography "Going Rogue"? This is exactly what the
>> > >Omrud's elephants do before they are shot.
>
>By the way, is "rogue elephant" any different from "elephant in
>musth"?
Don't think so...roguery is pure tantrum; musth has a purpose of sorts....
>> > It's an odd feeling for me, defending that "ambitious politician", but =
>the title
>> > is said to refer to what her handlers claimed she did during the 2008
>> > campaign...wouldn't follow instructions, went off on her own...by adopt=
>ing the
>> > phrase herself, one might even say she was speaking ironically....r
>
>And allusively. It was quite a while after I heard the title of her
>book that I remembered the symbol of her political party is the
>elephant.
I don't know that credit her with thinking on that many levels at once....r
Holger Freese
"franzi" wrote:
>But it also has connotations of destructiveness, whether of persons or
>things external or internal to the group. Thinking of a neutral
>example, if someone spoke of a rogue computer program, I'd understand
>it to have, to a degree, the character of malware.
>Things must be different in AmE, or why would an ambitious politician
>entitle her autobiography "Going Rogue"? This is exactly what the
>Omrud's elephants do before they are shot. This behaviour is not
>usually a vote-catcher, except perhaps in the BNP.
I wasn't so much interested in the use of rogue but wanted to know what
the usual expression is in British and American English for people who
run or drive around killing others indiscriminately. In German we use
"amok", e.g. "Amoksch�tze" for a gunman or "Amokfahrer" for a driver.
Cheers,
Ho
James Hogg
It doesn't sound natural to use "amok" as an adjective in English in
that way. The set phrase is "to run amok", so we would talk about "a
driver who ran amok", or possibly "a run-amok driver". The Google hits
for "amok driver" were probably written by Germans and other non-native
speakers.
--
James
Jeffrey Turner
Her base in the Republican party isn't so far from the BNP, as I
understand it.
--Jeff
--
The comfort of the wealthy has always
depended upon an abundant supply of
the poor. --Voltaire
Holger Freese
James Hogg wrote:
>>
>> I wasn't so much interested in the use of rogue but wanted to know
>> what the usual expression is in British and American English for
>> people who run or drive around killing others indiscriminately. In
>> German we use "amok", e.g. "Amoksch�tze" for a gunman or "Amokfahrer"
>> for a driver.
>
> It doesn't sound natural to use "amok" as an adjective in English in
> that way. The set phrase is "to run amok", so we would talk about "a
> driver who ran amok", or possibly "a run-amok driver". The Google hits
> for "amok driver" were probably written by Germans and other non-native
> speakers.
And what ARE the English versions of "Amoksch�tze" for such a gunman or
"Amokfahrer" for such a driver?
Ho
Cheryl
There aren't any. The closest you could come would be something like
'mass murderer' - and that wouldn't cover cases such as car accidents
that kill many people, but in which the driver had a heart attack or
something.
--
Cheryl
Chuck Riggs
wrote:
Except in parodies, "running amok" is most unusual today, from what
I've seen.
--
Regards,
Chuck Riggs,
An American who lives near Dublin, Ireland and usually spells in BrE
James Hogg
I see 75 examples at Google News, not a large number, it is true, but
enough to show that it's still in use. Interestingly, the first two
examples concern elephants running amok. Then there's a story from The
Telegraph ("Three policemen have been disciplined after four young women
ran amok in a police station, dressing up in officers' clothing"),
followed by a rather more serious story about the Yemen connection with
"the US military psychiatrist Major Nidal Hasan who ran amok at
Fort Hood".
--
James
the Omrud
> Chuck Riggs wrote:
>
>> Except in parodies, "running amok" is most unusual today, from what
>> I've seen.
>
> I see 75 examples at Google News, not a large number, it is true, but
> enough to show that it's still in use. Interestingly, the first two
> examples concern elephants running amok. Then there's a story from The
> Telegraph ("Three policemen have been disciplined after four young women
> ran amok in a police station, dressing up in officers' clothing"),
> followed by a rather more serious story about the Yemen connection with
> "the US military psychiatrist Major Nidal Hasan who ran amok at
> Fort Hood"
John Brunner, in his novel "Stand on Zanzibar", invented the term
"mucker" for one who runs amok. But it never caught on.
I see that "amok" comes from an Indonesian word which is spelled "amuk".
--
David
LFS
I use the expression quite frequently. This must say something about my
life.
--
Laura
(emulate St. George for email)
Jerry Friedman
> Jerry Friedman filted:
>
>
>
> >On Jan 4, 4:20=A0pm, franzi <et.in.arcadia.fra...@googlemail.com> wrote:
> >> On Jan 4, 9:02=A0pm, R H Draney <dadoc...@spamcop.net> wrote:
> >...
>
> >> > >Things must be different in AmE, or why would an ambitious politician
> >> > >entitle her autobiography "Going Rogue"? This is exactly what the
> >> > >Omrud's elephants do before they are shot.
>
> >By the way, is "rogue elephant" any different from "elephant in
> >musth"?
>
> Don't think so...
That is, you do think so?
> roguery is pure tantrum;
Or lifestyle, according to Wikipedia, which supports the distinction
you made.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elephant#Social_behavior
> musth has a purpose of sorts....
Speaking of irony, the Wikip article on her quotes her as saying
Walter Monegan, the man fired in "Troopergate", was guilty of
"egregious rogue behavior". It cites
http://www.adn.com/opinion/story/528420.html
> >> > It's an odd feeling for me, defending that "ambitious politician", but =
> >the title
> >> > is said to refer to what her handlers claimed she did during the 2008
> >> > campaign...wouldn't follow instructions, went off on her own...by adopt=
> >ing the
> >> > phrase herself, one might even say she was speaking ironically....r
>
> >And allusively. It was quite a while after I heard the title of her
> >book that I remembered the symbol of her political party is the
> >elephant.
>
> I don't know that credit her with thinking on that many levels at once....r
She has people to add levels for her. For that matter, though her
background is in journalism, she collaborated with the conservative
journalist Lynn Vincent and with editors at Harper Collins, according
to this AP article.
http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/entertainment/2009959513_apusbookspalin.html
I believed what you do, but I'm retracting it just so I can get in
ahead of our laureate (as far as I know):
A Short Palin Ode
Strophe:
Sarah seemed able to think on one level at once:
A horse-hockey mom who let hunters kill wolves, a dunce.
Antistrophe:
Now I ship oars from the Palin's-an-imbecile vogue:
This dangerous elephant's book is called /Going Rogue/.
--
Jerry Friedman
James Hogg
> I believed what you do, but I'm retracting it just so I can get in
> ahead of our laureate (as far as I know):
>
> A Short Palin Ode
>
> Strophe:
> Sarah seemed able to think on one level at once:
> A horse-hockey mom who let hunters kill wolves, a dunce.
>
> Antistrophe:
> Now I ship oars from the Palin's-an-imbecile vogue:
> This dangerous elephant's book is called /Going Rogue/.
Anything I can cant you recant better.
--
James
Steve Hayes
>Except in parodies, "running amok" is most unusual today, from what
>I've seen.
Yup, it makes headlines, bowling for Columbine.
Mike Lyle
> On Mon, 4 Jan 2010 19:47:01 -0000, "Mike Lyle"
> <mike_l...@REMOVETHISyahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>
>> Steve Hayes wrote:
>>> On Mon, 4 Jan 2010 16:44:19 -0000, "Mike Lyle"
>>> <mike_l...@REMOVETHISyahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>>>
>>>> James Hogg wrote:
No, it's the noun. In "rogue elephant" it's used attributively; and
sometimes the word is used without naming the animal. OED agrees with
me.
>
> Yes, a rogue is a rascally fellow who might have some lovable traits.
>
> But the adjective, as in "rogue elephant" or "rogue gunman" or "rogue
> state" is a different matter. We're in ASBO territory here.
Yes: we mentioned that several messages ago. See above.
--
Mike.
Mike Lyle
The woman gives me palindromic pains. (Which aren't what one might have
thought, but go for it, lads.)
--
Mike.
R H Draney
>
>Holger Freese wrote:
>>
>> James Hogg wrote:
>>
>>>>
>>>> I wasn't so much interested in the use of rogue but wanted to know
>>>> what the usual expression is in British and American English for
>>>> people who run or drive around killing others indiscriminately. In
>>>> German we use "amok", e.g. "Amoksch�tze" for a gunman or "Amokfahrer"
>>>> for a driver.
>>>
>>> It doesn't sound natural to use "amok" as an adjective in English in
>>> that way. The set phrase is "to run amok", so we would talk about "a
>>> driver who ran amok", or possibly "a run-amok driver". The Google hits
>>> for "amok driver" were probably written by Germans and other non-native
>>> speakers.
>>
>> And what ARE the English versions of "Amoksch�tze" for such a gunman or
>> "Amokfahrer" for such a driver?
>
>'mass murderer' - and that wouldn't cover cases such as car accidents
>that kill many people, but in which the driver had a heart attack or
>something.
They don't use it much in the (reputable) press any more, but the term of choice
used to be "crazed"....r
Mike Lyle
[...]
>
> John Brunner, in his novel "Stand on Zanzibar", invented the term
> "mucker" for one who runs amok. But it never caught on.
>
> I see that "amok" comes from an Indonesian word which is spelled
> "amuk".
Malay /amoq/, I believe. I've seen "amuck" in older literature, though.
The Indian Army Regs used to say that a sepoy who ran amok was to be
"shot or cut down without parley".
Since "mucker" already means "mate", I can see why the proposal might
not have caught on.
--
Mike.
Jerry Friedman
> Jerry Friedman wrote:
[palinode]
> Anything I can cant you recant better.
*Shuffles modestly*
I used to go to Temple Emanu El near Cleveland, so I had a good
example in the Emanu El cantor.
I'll just lope off now.
--
Jerry Friedman
James Hogg
Don't forget your coat.
By the way, are you the first person to draw attention (albeit
indirectly) to the fact that Greek "palin" means "backward"? Her
opponents could have made political capital of that if they had known
their Greek.
I don't ever remember coming across a "palinode", before, so thanks for
that.
And to Mike's "palindromic pains" I can add the interesting word
"palinspastic", with a meaning that is actually much better than it
sounds. The OED defines it as "Of a map, diagram, etc.: representing
features, esp. layers of rock, in what are presumed to be their original
positions."
--
James
Peter Duncanson (BrE)
I had a friend who had Palindromic Rheumatism.
--
Peter Duncanson, UK
(in alt.usage.english)
Paul Wolff
Too many thoughts, not enough time...
British pollies have caught the American idea of running for election
rather than standing still, for inspection as it were. One of my wishes:
that I could find again The Running, Jumping & Standing Still film.
Jumping for election? Now there's a thought.
When Sarah goes recursive and runs again, then you will find your
palindrome, of course. And she brings to mind (for reasons unknown) the
Divine Sarah, or Sara, Bernhardt, or Bernard, or Bernardt, of shifty
background and reputation (remember Tom Lehrer's song 'Alma'?). Whether
Wikipedia is true or false, it will save my keyboard if I point to the
page: <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sarah_Bernhardt>.
--
Paul
Robin Bignall
A mockery?
--
Robin
(BrE)
Herts, England
James Hogg
Was he from Bolton?
--
James
Nick Spalding
on Wed, 06 Jan 2010 15:34:42 +0100:
No, it was original equipment.
--
Nick Spalding
BrE/IrE
Peter Duncanson (BrE)
wrote:
>Peter Duncanson (BrE) wrote:
She wasn't.
Mike Lyle
> On Tue, 05 Jan 2010 14:50:33 +0000, LFS
> <la...@DRAGONspira.fsbusiness.co.uk> wrote:
>
>> James Hogg wrote:
>>> Chuck Riggs wrote:
>>>> Except in parodies, "running amok" is most unusual today, from what
>>>> I've seen.
>>>
>>> I see 75 examples at Google News, not a large number, it is true,
>>> but enough to show that it's still in use. Interestingly, the first
>>> two examples concern elephants running amok. Then there's a story
>>> from The Telegraph ("Three policemen have been disciplined after
>>> four young women ran amok in a police station, dressing up in
>>> officers' clothing"), followed by a rather more serious story about
>>> the Yemen connection with "the US military psychiatrist Major Nidal
>>> Hasan who ran amok at
>>> Fort Hood".
>>>
>>
>> I use the expression quite frequently. This must say something about
>> my life.
>
> A mockery?
There was a young fellow called Dockery...
--oops!, sorry! Ladies present.
--
Mike.
R H Draney
>
>British pollies have caught the American idea of running for election
>rather than standing still, for inspection as it were. One of my wishes:
>that I could find again The Running, Jumping & Standing Still film.
It appears to be available as an extra on the BBC DVD "The Peter Sellers Story",
and someone has kindly put it up as a bit torrent at http://thebox.bz ...since
my ratio's in good shape I've added it to my download queue; we shall see how
long it takes to complete....r
Mike Page
--
Mike Page
Pat Durkin
"franzi" <et.in.arca...@googlemail.com> wrote in message
news:e000a946-aa2e-4af0...@m25g2000yqc.googlegroups.com...
> On Jan 4, 9:02 pm, R H Draney <dadoc...@spamcop.net> wrote:
>> franzi filted:
>>
>>
>>
>> >On Jan 4, 2:35=A0pm, tony cooper <tony_cooper...@earthlink.net>
>> >wrote:
>>
>> >> The uses of "rogue" are generally descriptions of someone in a
>> >> specific group who commits acts that are contrary to what is
>> >> expected
>> >> he/she is not part of group that held to certain expectations.
>>
>> "drivers", a group
>> expected to maintain certain norms such as keeping to the street
>> and not mowing
>> down pedestrians on the sidewalk...that's almost a textbook example
>> of rogue
>> behavior....
>>
>> >Things must be different in AmE, or why would an ambitious
>> >politician
>> >entitle her autobiography "Going Rogue"? This is exactly what the
>> >Omrud's elephants do before they are shot. This behaviour is not
>> >usually a vote-catcher, except perhaps in the BNP.
>>
>> is said to refer to what her handlers claimed she did during the
>> 2008
>> campaign...wouldn't follow instructions, went off on her own...by
>> phrase herself, one might even say she was speaking ironically....r
>>
> that
> she didn't ask my opinion.
>
Wasn't the cowboy song "The Streets of Laredo" based on an English
song ("The Dying Rogue")? Oops! "The Unfortunate Rake".
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Streets_of_Laredo_(song)
In US culture, a special place of admiration is maintained for
mavericks (untamed/unbranded cattle, wandering outside the herd), for
outlaws and for rogues. And we didn't come by that in an odd way.
The Brits have traditions praising the rogue. Wasn't the Highwayman
just such a romantic outlaw figure? And the lone knights of the
Arthurian stories?
Well, in the US, we don't just praise outlaw heroes. Traditional
rugged individualism has led to some extremes, creating social
problems in limited areas or times. So we have the ongoing tension
about gun ownership, hunting animals regardless of season or
sportsmanship, etc.
Frankly, I think that is all SP has going for her, and many find it a
total bore, but admire the chutzpah (Oh, oh. The Jews had such
heroes, as well, and such spirit!)
tony cooper
wrote:
>>
>Wasn't the cowboy song "The Streets of Laredo" based on an English
>song ("The Dying Rogue")? Oops! "The Unfortunate Rake".
>
>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Streets_of_Laredo_(song)
>
There are so many derivations that you can't say "based on" any
particular version. A close antecedent to "Streets of Laredo" is
"Locke Hospital".
http://sniff.numachi.com/pages/tiLAREDST3;ttLAREDST3.html
English or Irish, though? Locke Hospital was in Dublin, but a
hospital for British soldiers with a venereal disease.
--
Tony Cooper - Orlando, Florida
Nick Spalding
on Thu, 07 Jan 2010 13:23:02 -0500:
There were Lock (no e) Hospitals in several places in the UK as well as
in Dublin. The first was in London which opened in 1747. Most of their
clientele were prostitutes, not soldiers or sailors.
--
Nick Spalding
BrE/IrE
Jerry Friedman
> Jerry Friedman wrote:
> > On Jan 5, 11:36 am, James Hogg <Jas.H...@gOUTmail.com> wrote:
> >> Jerry Friedman wrote:
> > [palinode]
>
> >> Anything I can cant you recant better.
>
> > *Shuffles modestly*
>
> > I used to go to Temple Emanu El near Cleveland, so I had a good
> > example in the Emanu El cantor.
>
> > I'll just lope off now.
>
> Don't forget your coat.
Where is Ross Howard, anyway?
(He was an a.u.e. poster, and I hope will be again, who often used the
line "I'll get me coat.")
> By the way, are you the first person to draw attention (albeit
> indirectly) to the fact that Greek "palin" means "backward"? Her
> opponents could have made political capital of that if they had known
> their Greek.
> I don't ever remember coming across a "palinode", before, so thanks for
> that.
The only poem I remember seeing classified that way is Yeats's "Easter
1916". At least it's a good one.
> And to Mike's "palindromic pains" I can add the interesting word
> "palinspastic", with a meaning that is actually much better than it
> sounds. The OED defines it as "Of a map, diagram, etc.: representing
> features, esp. layers of rock, in what are presumed to be their original
> positions."
I'd probably use some form of "reconstruct", but I'm saving
"palinspastic" for when I need it.
--
Jerry Friedman
franzi
> On Jan 6, 5:14 am, James Hogg <Jas.H...@gOUTmail.com> wrote:
>
> > Jerry Friedman wrote:
>
> > > I used to go to Temple Emanu El near Cleveland, so I had a good
> > > example in the Emanu El cantor.
>
> > > I'll just lope off now.
>
> > Don't forget your coat.
>
> Where is Ross Howard, anyway?
He became an entity, Honey Chile, and/or an SDC key. Not that that
answers the question for mutton value.
Time passes...
--
franzi