Sous-chef

Guy Barry

unread,

Nov 17, 2012, 11:19:07 AM11/17/12

to

I've just heard someone described as a "head sous-chef" (by Jane Garvey,
Weekend Woman's Hour, BBC Radio 4). I don't know much about the restaurant
business but isn't a sous-chef second-in-command to the chef by definition?
How can you have a head sous-chef?

--
Guy Barry

Athel Cornish-Bowden

unread,

Nov 17, 2012, 12:04:15 PM11/17/12

to

I don't know, but Flanders and Swann had someone (probably in Eating
People is Wrong) claiming to be the Chief Assistant to the Assistant
Chief.

--
athel

Dr Nick

unread,

Nov 17, 2012, 12:17:10 PM11/17/12

to

That, plus "head cook and bottle washer" (of uncertain origin as far as
I can tell), was the thing that came to my mind as well.

Percival P. Cassidy

unread,

Nov 17, 2012, 1:45:39 PM11/17/12

to

"*Chief* cook and bottle washer" is what I recall.

Perce

Andrew B

unread,

Nov 17, 2012, 2:07:19 PM11/17/12

to

That is the song in question, but its title is "The Reluctant Cannibal";
"Eating People is Wrong" is a line from it (and subsequently the title
of a novel by Malcolm Bradbury).

Whiskers

unread,

Nov 17, 2012, 2:09:38 PM11/17/12

to

If there are two or more under-cooks, perhaps one of them is the
under-cook-in-chief and gets to be in charge when the chief cook isn't
there.

I don't think there are any immutable laws about who gets called what in a
kitchen - but a battalion does need more officers than a squad.

--
-- ^^^^^^^^^^
-- Whiskers
-- ~~~~~~~~~~

Lanarcam

unread,

Nov 17, 2012, 2:15:37 PM11/17/12

to

Le 17/11/2012 20:09, Whiskers a �crit :

> On 2012-11-17, Guy Barry <guy....@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote:
>> I've just heard someone described as a "head sous-chef" (by Jane Garvey,
>> Weekend Woman's Hour, BBC Radio 4). I don't know much about the restaurant
>> business but isn't a sous-chef second-in-command to the chef by definition?
>> How can you have a head sous-chef?
>
> If there are two or more under-cooks, perhaps one of them is the
> under-cook-in-chief and gets to be in charge when the chief cook isn't
> there.

The sous-chef is the boss of the sous-sous-chef ;)

Peter Duncanson [BrE]

unread,

Nov 17, 2012, 3:15:38 PM11/17/12

to

Big kitchen.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sous_chef#Sous-chef

The Sous-Chef de Cuisine (under-chef of the kitchen) is the second
in command and direct assistant of the Chef.
<responsiblilities trimmed>.
Smaller operations may not have a sous-chef, while larger operations
may have several.

I assume that when there is more than one sous-chef in a kitchen one
will be more senior than the other(s).

This is a job description of a Senior Sous Chef:
http://www.corecruitment.com/job-descriptions/senior-sous-chef/

and a Sous Chef:
http://www.corecruitment.com/job-descriptions/sous-chef/

Presumably the Senior Sous Chef takes charge in the absence of the Head
Chef.

--
Peter Duncanson, UK
(in alt.usage.english)

John Varela

unread,

Nov 17, 2012, 4:05:38 PM11/17/12

to

On Sat, 17 Nov 2012 20:15:38 UTC, "Peter Duncanson [BrE]"
<ma...@peterduncanson.net> wrote:

> On Sat, 17 Nov 2012 16:19:07 -0000, "Guy Barry"
> <guy....@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote:
>
> >I've just heard someone described as a "head sous-chef" (by Jane Garvey,
> >Weekend Woman's Hour, BBC Radio 4). I don't know much about the restaurant
> >business but isn't a sous-chef second-in-command to the chef by definition?
> >How can you have a head sous-chef?
>
> Big kitchen.
>
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sous_chef#Sous-chef
>
> The Sous-Chef de Cuisine (under-chef of the kitchen) is the second
> in command and direct assistant of the Chef.
> <responsiblilities trimmed>.
> Smaller operations may not have a sous-chef, while larger operations
> may have several.

The NY Times restaurant review that someone pointed to in the
"Horrible Bashing" thread was about a restaurant with hundreds of
tables. That would warrant a really, really big kitchen[1] or even
multiple kitchens.

[1] http://preview.tinyurl.com/a2fydqa

--
John Varela

When the people find that they can vote themselves money, that will
herald the end of the republic. -- Benjamin Franklin

Mike L

unread,

Nov 17, 2012, 6:28:03 PM11/17/12

to

The trouble is, it's chefs all the way down. Quod absurdum est.

--
Mike.

Reinhold {Rey} Aman

unread,

Nov 17, 2012, 8:29:47 PM11/17/12

to

Lanarcam wrote:
>
> The sous-chef is the boss of the sous-sous-chef ;)
>

chef
----
sous

--
~~~ Reinhold {Rey} Aman ~~~
Rey's my name,
Lashon HaRa's my game.

R H Draney

unread,

Nov 17, 2012, 9:17:11 PM11/17/12

to

Lanarcam filted:

Some years ago, I noticed a want ad placed by a restaurant looking for a Sioux
chef....r

--
Me? Sarcastic?
Yeah, right.

Guy Barry

unread,

Nov 17, 2012, 10:12:45 PM11/17/12

to

"Andrew B" wrote in message news:k88n96$kn9$1...@dont-email.me...

If you can call it a "song"! Much of it (including the quoted line) is
spoken narration over the piano accompaniment, although the chorus is sung.

My favourite line: "Must have been someone he ate".

--
Guy Barry

Athel Cornish-Bowden

unread,

Nov 18, 2012, 5:44:21 AM11/18/12

to

On 2012-11-18 03:12:45 +0000, Guy Barry said:

> "Andrew B" wrote in message news:k88n96$kn9$1...@dont-email.me...
>
>> On 17/11/2012 17:04, Athel Cornish-Bowden wrote:
>
>>> I don't know, but Flanders and Swann had someone (probably in Eating
>>> People is Wrong) claiming to be the Chief Assistant to the Assistant Chief.
>
>> That is the song in question, but its title is "The Reluctant
>> Cannibal"; "Eating People is Wrong" is a line from it (and subsequently
>> the title of a novel by Malcolm Bradbury).
>
> If you can call it a "song"!

Hmm. That reminds me of one of my peeves. I dislike it when software
such as iTunes refers to any piece of music as a song. I don't regard a
movement of a symphony as a song.

> Much of it (including the quoted line) is spoken narration over the
> piano accompaniment, although the chorus is sung.
>
> My favourite line: "Must have been someone he ate".

--

athel

Peter Young

unread,

Nov 18, 2012, 5:58:47 AM11/18/12

to

On 18 Nov 2012 Athel Cornish-Bowden <acor...@imm.cnrs.fr> wrote:

> On 2012-11-18 03:12:45 +0000, Guy Barry said:

>> "Andrew B" wrote in message news:k88n96$kn9$1...@dont-email.me...
>>
>>> On 17/11/2012 17:04, Athel Cornish-Bowden wrote:
>>
>>>> I don't know, but Flanders and Swann had someone (probably in Eating
>>>> People is Wrong) claiming to be the Chief Assistant to the Assistant
>>>> Chief.
>>
>>> That is the song in question, but its title is "The Reluctant
>>> Cannibal"; "Eating People is Wrong" is a line from it (and subsequently
>>> the title of a novel by Malcolm Bradbury).
>>
>> If you can call it a "song"!

> Hmm. That reminds me of one of my peeves. I dislike it when software
> such as iTunes refers to any piece of music as a song. I don't regard a
> movement of a symphony as a song.

And a peeve here too. Windows Media Player even refers to a speech
recording as a song.

Peter.

--
Peter Young, (BrE, RP), Consultant Anaesthetist, 1975-2004.
(US equivalent: Certified Anesthesiologist)
Cheltenham and Gloucester, UK. Now happily retired.
http://pnyoung.orpheusweb.co.uk

bob

unread,

Nov 18, 2012, 8:03:05 AM11/18/12

to

Perhaps for a restaurant specialising in Native American cuisine?

Robin

Don Phillipson

unread,

Nov 18, 2012, 8:21:33 AM11/18/12

to

"Guy Barry" <guy....@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote in message
news:XNOps.359904$lz1....@fx28.am4...

When formally organized (i.e. in larger establishments)
the restaurant trade appears to recognize at least four ranks:
topmost = chef (permitted to cook anything)
next = sous-chef (qualified to cook some specialities)
next = apprentices (being trained in various specialities)
bottom = helpers (who do no cooking.)
I.e. sous-chef is a rank, say sergeant: and a large
kitchen probably has several sous=chefs, one recognized
as senior in authority to the others.

The US Mafia is supposed to have a rank called under-boss,
and I bet there are two or more under-bosses in some gangs.

--
Don Phillipson
Carlsbad Springs
(Ottawa, Canada)

Andrew B

unread,

Nov 18, 2012, 9:27:33 AM11/18/12

to

You can have a cadre of wily sous-chefs, if only in the game "Devil
Bunny Needs a Ham"...

Mark Brader

unread,

Nov 18, 2012, 5:08:19 PM11/18/12

to

Guy Barry:

> I've just heard someone described as a "head sous-chef" (by Jane Garvey,
> Weekend Woman's Hour, BBC Radio 4).

Compare the way that a small company may have one or two
vice-presidents but a big one may have a bunch of vice-presidents
and one executive vice-president who outranks the rest.
--
Mark Brader, Toronto | "Close your tag and give it a rest, Jason"
m...@vex.net | --FoxTrot (Bill Amend)

My text in this article is in the public domain.

unread,

Nov 19, 2012, 12:51:33 PM11/19/12

to

Le 19/11/2012 18:03, Reinhold {Rey} Aman a �crit :
> Lanarcam wrote:
>>
>> Reinhold {Rey} Aman a �crit :

>>> Reinhold {Rey} Aman wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Lanarcam wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> The sous-chef is the boss of the sous-sous-chef ;)
>>>>>
>>>> chef
>>>> ----
>>>> sous
>>>>
>>> No comments? Everybody got it?
>>>
>> I didn't, for one.
>>
> It's a simple puzzle. Read it in French, bottom to top.
>

Sous sous chef ?

Sous (est) sous chef ?

Cheryl

unread,

Nov 19, 2012, 12:59:13 PM11/19/12

to

Yes. I suppose it works better in French, but it could be read in
English as 'Sous under-chef' I suppose meaning either that a sous-chef
works under a chef, or that the person in question is an assistant to
sous-chef.

I used to donate blood at a place that had large posters with that style
of riddle hanging from the ceiling to amuse the donors and help them
pass time.

--
Cheryl

Reinhold {Rey} Aman

unread,

Nov 19, 2012, 1:39:32 PM11/19/12

to

Lanarcam wrote:
>
> Reinhold {Rey} Aman a �crit :
>> Lanarcam wrote:
>>> Reinhold {Rey} Aman a �crit :
>>>> Reinhold {Rey} Aman wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Lanarcam wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The sous-chef is the boss of the sous-sous-chef ;)
>>>>>>
>>>>> chef
>>>>> ----
>>>>> sous
>>>>>
>>>> No comments? Everybody got it?
>>>>
>>> I didn't, for one.
>>>
>> It's a simple puzzle. Read it in French, bottom to top.
>>
> Sous sous chef ?
>
> Sous (est) sous chef ?
>

Correct!

chef (3) "chef"
---- (2) sous (under, i.e., below)
sous (1) "sous"

I wrote your above "sous-sous-chef" in riddle-form.