AOQ Review 5-2: "Real Me"
Arbitrar Of Quality
threads.
BUFFY THE VAMPIRE SLAYER
Season Five, Episode 2: "Real Me"
(or "Current mood: Annoyed Current music: I Die In Agony - 'Make
It All Better'")
Writer: David Fury
Director: David Grossman
Remember what I was saying about this show having chutzpah? Well,
retconning (?) a new character right into the center of the show with
no actual explanation whatsoever, expecting your audience to accept
that you know what you're doing without reassurance... that's
chutzpah.
"Real Me" gets into Dawn's head a lot, with her running MySpace
entry giving an idea of what it's like to be a normal kid growing up
alongside a Slayer, and how an outsider will perceive the Scoobie
world. It's unclear to me how long she's known about her
sister's otherworldly ways, and whether or not this episode is her
first brush with death. The premise is okay and all, given that kids
that age have a remarkable capacity for jadedness and
self-centeredness, but kind of nondescript for me. Mrs. Quality liked
Dawn's voiceovers better than I did, overall - I think she's
still more of a character with potential at this point.
Oh yeah, the characters we've been following for the last few years
are also in "Real Me." Dawn isn't the only Summers who manages
to think that she has the hardest life in the world and that no one
could possibly understand how she feels. Her sister's closer to
being right about it. And we see a little of that from Harmony and
Willow too, actually; parallels and such. One of the better moments is
Buffy venting about being saddled with Dawn, and Riley being the voice
of reason, or at least the advocate for consistency in complaints.
"Thank you, logic boy. Did I mention this is a rant? Sense really
has no place in it."
It makes sense that Dawn would hate Riley and Anya (being intensively
patronized is as bad as corpse exposure), admire Willow and Tara as
cool geeks, and not care much one way or the other about Giles.
Probably most surprisingly appropriate is how much she likes Xander;
he's outgoing and entertaining, the fact that he's older masks the
loser factor, and just the fact that he talks to her the way he would
to anyone else is enough for some crushing. The dynamic between the
two of them is fun to watch. And then he's one of the ones Dawn
later overhears seemingly being so dismissive of her, and that whole
scene works better as a result. What's more worrisome is that Dawn
doesn't seem to have any of her own friends. I wonder if we'll go
into that at all.
Unfortunately, the most central relationship of all, that between Buffy
and Dawn, is pretty weak. The shared egocentric my-life-is-so-hard
feelings are okay, but the actual chemistry between them isn't
happening. Also a problem is the fact that I don't think our
incessantly squabbling sisters ever have an argument or do a bit that
isn't straight out of every family-based sitcom, ever. Anyone not
see the end coming where they show a brief bit of appreciation for each
other and then immediately go back to their old patterns? It makes
Joyce look like something of a moron too, putting her ideas about how
sisters should behave at a higher priority than the fact that Buffy is
keeping everyone alive.
Probably the place where I got most annoyed, though, was during the
parts focusing on Harmony and her new vampire minions. Last year I
praised "The Harsh Light Of Day" for doing so well with an annoying
character without annoying the audience. This time she started grating
on me. There's only so much high-pitched squealing and ditziness one
can take, and building so much of an episode around her is not a good
idea. Even the fact that the episode makes no secret about the fact
that it's laughing at Harmony gets to the point where the humor seems
like a self-congratulatory in-joke rather than, you know, funny. Which
isn't to imply that there aren't any good Harm moments, just that
there are too many Harm moments, of all kinds.
Said vampire and minions trigger some scenes in which Xander gets to
mix schoolyard name-calling with common sense and even a very
short-lived action-hero moment. This whole sequence, on both sides of
the commercial break, manages the mix of humor (Anya, lamp-wielder of
vengeance!) and tension that I think the rest of the episode was trying
for. Given the sinister ending of RM, I have to wonder whether
Dawn's invitation was really such an accident. But pure slip-up
isn't so unrealistic either.
The by-the-numbers plotting towards the end leads Dawn to run away, get
herself captured, and have Buffy save her. I don't really have
anything to say about the last act at all. That's a lie, actually,
since I'd like to at least mention two things: first is Buffy's
un-hero-like gratuitous violence with Spike (a nice little scene, that
one), and second, we once again get a mysterious ending, with Dawn's
"boy, is she in for a surprise." Could perfectly well be an
innocent little comment, but is delivered as if there's something
else going on. In which case it might get explained, someday. The
"you don't belong here" scene would likely tie into that too.
With the addition of Trachtenberg, we now have eight regulars, the most
in BTVS history so far. We're almost into _Firefly_ territory at
this point.
Are we meant to believe that Xander's doing construction again, or is
that just what he's telling people?
So vampires can only be invited in by a resident of a home. You'd
think Wesley, as a former Watcher, would've known that back in
"Somnambulist."
Lots of pop-culture references this week. Besides the non-verbal
homage to _The Empire Strikes Back_ in the teaser and the cute
reference to Hogwarts a little later, Buffy has a killer line towards
the end: "aside from the fact that most magic shop owners in
Sunnydale have the life expectancy of a Spinal Tap drummer..."
This Is Really Stupid But I Laughed Anyway moment(s):
- Xander seeing Dawn "as a woman," albeit one with a face full of
ice cream. Hell, the whole Anya-playing-Life scene.
- The way Spike mocks Harm's plan, she says they'll need a new one
and then ends up using the first one anyway
- "Ah, Mort. I trust you made our guest ... comfortable?" "You
told me to chain her to a wall." "Yeah, I know, I'm being, you
know, sarcastic or whatever?"
- Unicorn slayage
So...
One-sentence summary: A few wrong steps, but pretty okay overall.
AOQ rating: Decent
[Season Five so far:
1) "Buffy Vs. Dracula" - Good
2) "Real Me" - Decent]
MBangel10 (Melissa)
> A reminder: Please avoid spoilers for later episodes in these review
> threads.
>
>
> BUFFY THE VAMPIRE SLAYER
> Season Five, Episode 2: "Real Me"
> (or "Current mood: Annoyed Current music: I Die In Agony - 'Make
> It All Better'")
> Writer: David Fury
> Director: David Grossman
>
> Remember what I was saying about this show having chutzpah? Well,
> retconning (?) a new character right into the center of the show with
> no actual explanation whatsoever, expecting your audience to accept
> that you know what you're doing without reassurance... that's
> chutzpah.
I remember being really aggravated at the end of this episode because,
seriously, who the hell is Dawn? She never existed, was never mentioned
and now we're just supposed to accept her into the fold? I didn't do any
spoilers back then and this episode left huge burning question marks all
over the place w/ only a hint of something sinister that might be in the
mix. However, it was an aggravation that left me dying to see the next
episode just so that I could get a possible explanation.
Buffy is one of the few shows that can get away with something like this.
>
> "Real Me" gets into Dawn's head a lot, with her running MySpace
> entry giving an idea of what it's like to be a normal kid growing up
> alongside a Slayer, and how an outsider will perceive the Scoobie
> world. It's unclear to me how long she's known about her
> sister's otherworldly ways, and whether or not this episode is her
> first brush with death. The premise is okay and all, given that kids
> that age have a remarkable capacity for jadedness and
> self-centeredness, but kind of nondescript for me. Mrs. Quality liked
> Dawn's voiceovers better than I did, overall - I think she's
> still more of a character with potential at this point.
A few of them made me giggle. For example:
"Like Tara. (Cut back to Dawn in the bedroom) She and Willow are both
witches.
They do spells and stuff, which is so much cooler than slaying. I told
Mom one time I
wished they'd teach me some of the things they do together. A-and then
she got really
quiet and made me go upstairs. (She pauses in her writing and looks
puzzled.)
Huh. I guess her generation isn't cool with witchcraft."
"Just last week he went undercover to stop that Dracula guy."
Hee! Yep, Xander went undercover and in no way was under the thrall of
the evil, Unholy Prince - bator.
>
> Oh yeah, the characters we've been following for the last few years
> are also in "Real Me." Dawn isn't the only Summers who manages
> to think that she has the hardest life in the world and that no one
> could possibly understand how she feels. Her sister's closer to
> being right about it. And we see a little of that from Harmony and
> Willow too, actually; parallels and such. One of the better moments is
> Buffy venting about being saddled with Dawn, and Riley being the voice
> of reason, or at least the advocate for consistency in complaints.
> "Thank you, logic boy. Did I mention this is a rant? Sense really
> has no place in it."
>
> It makes sense that Dawn would hate Riley and Anya (being intensively
> patronized is as bad as corpse exposure), admire Willow and Tara as
> cool geeks, and not care much one way or the other about Giles.
I think she's more annoyed w/ Anya because she's Xander's girlfriend
whom Dawn is majorly crushing on (and the fact Anya treats her like
she's 10).
> Probably most surprisingly appropriate is how much she likes Xander;
> he's outgoing and entertaining, the fact that he's older masks the
> loser factor, and just the fact that he talks to her the way he would
> to anyone else is enough for some crushing. The dynamic between the
> two of them is fun to watch. And then he's one of the ones Dawn
> later overhears seemingly being so dismissive of her, and that whole
> scene works better as a result. What's more worrisome is that Dawn
> doesn't seem to have any of her own friends. I wonder if we'll go
> into that at all.
Well, we've only just been introduced to her... so we'll have to wait to
learn more about the 'sister that came out of nowhere'.
>
> Unfortunately, the most central relationship of all, that between Buffy
> and Dawn, is pretty weak. The shared egocentric my-life-is-so-hard
> feelings are okay, but the actual chemistry between them isn't
> happening. Also a problem is the fact that I don't think our
> incessantly squabbling sisters ever have an argument or do a bit that
> isn't straight out of every family-based sitcom, ever. Anyone not
> see the end coming where they show a brief bit of appreciation for each
> other and then immediately go back to their old patterns? It makes
> Joyce look like something of a moron too, putting her ideas about how
> sisters should behave at a higher priority than the fact that Buffy is
> keeping everyone alive.
That didn't annoy me as much, but the bickering did get a little
tiresome at times.
>
> Probably the place where I got most annoyed, though, was during the
> parts focusing on Harmony and her new vampire minions. Last year I
> praised "The Harsh Light Of Day" for doing so well with an annoying
> character without annoying the audience. This time she started grating
> on me. There's only so much high-pitched squealing and ditziness one
> can take, and building so much of an episode around her is not a good
> idea. Even the fact that the episode makes no secret about the fact
> that it's laughing at Harmony gets to the point where the humor seems
> like a self-congratulatory in-joke rather than, you know, funny. Which
> isn't to imply that there aren't any good Harm moments, just that
> there are too many Harm moments, of all kinds.
I've always gotten a kick out of Harmony, so I found her scenes fairly
amusing. Plus, we got Spike's reaction to her having minions, which is
one of my favorite scenes from the episode and then Buffy's reaction was
priceless. I mean, do you ever remember seeing Buffy laugh that hard
about anything? Ever?
>
> Said vampire and minions trigger some scenes in which Xander gets to
> mix schoolyard name-calling with common sense and even a very
> short-lived action-hero moment. This whole sequence, on both sides of
> the commercial break, manages the mix of humor (Anya, lamp-wielder of
> vengeance!) and tension that I think the rest of the episode was trying
> for. Given the sinister ending of RM, I have to wonder whether
> Dawn's invitation was really such an accident. But pure slip-up
> isn't so unrealistic either.
Also, did you see that kick that Xander pulled (when he kicked Harm out
the door)? Pretty impressive for one w/o special powers.
>
> The by-the-numbers plotting towards the end leads Dawn to run away, get
> herself captured, and have Buffy save her. I don't really have
> anything to say about the last act at all. That's a lie, actually,
> since I'd like to at least mention two things: first is Buffy's
> un-hero-like gratuitous violence with Spike (a nice little scene, that
> one), and second, we once again get a mysterious ending, with Dawn's
> "boy, is she in for a surprise." Could perfectly well be an
> innocent little comment, but is delivered as if there's something
> else going on. In which case it might get explained, someday. The
> "you don't belong here" scene would likely tie into that too.
The crazy guy saying that to Dawn definitely hinted at *something* being
off about the whole thing. I mean, without that I would have been really
ticked off.
>
> With the addition of Trachtenberg, we now have eight regulars, the most
> in BTVS history so far. We're almost into _Firefly_ territory at
> this point.
Almost....
>
> Are we meant to believe that Xander's doing construction again, or is
> that just what he's telling people?
Yes.
>
> So vampires can only be invited in by a resident of a home. You'd
> think Wesley, as a former Watcher, would've known that back in
> "Somnambulist."
>
That's correct. If you are a visitor and invite a vampire into someone's
home then the vamp still cannot enter. You have to be living there.
> Lots of pop-culture references this week. Besides the non-verbal
> homage to _The Empire Strikes Back_ in the teaser and the cute
> reference to Hogwarts a little later, Buffy has a killer line towards
> the end: "aside from the fact that most magic shop owners in
> Sunnydale have the life expectancy of a Spinal Tap drummer..."
>
> This Is Really Stupid But I Laughed Anyway moment(s):
> - Xander seeing Dawn "as a woman," albeit one with a face full of
> ice cream. Hell, the whole Anya-playing-Life scene.
> - The way Spike mocks Harm's plan, she says they'll need a new one
> and then ends up using the first one anyway
Technically, Harmony used Spike's plan. Her first plan was just getting
the Slayer to come out of her house with the hysterical "Slayer, come
out and Die!" sign. Her second plan wasn't even thought up until Spike
put it into her head. Which is hysterical because he was mocking her
with the infamous evil plan #19 that she wasn't even bright enough to
come up with on her own.
> - "Ah, Mort. I trust you made our guest ... comfortable?" "You
> told me to chain her to a wall." "Yeah, I know, I'm being, you
> know, sarcastic or whatever?"
> - Unicorn slayage
>
>
> So...
>
> One-sentence summary: A few wrong steps, but pretty okay overall.
>
> AOQ rating: Decent
>
> [Season Five so far:
> 1) "Buffy Vs. Dracula" - Good
> 2) "Real Me" - Decent]
>
I agree but it definitely falls on the higher end of decent. More like,
almost good?
Don Sample
"Arbitrar Of Quality" <tsm...@wildmail.com> wrote:
> A reminder: Please avoid spoilers for later episodes in these review
> threads.
>
>
> BUFFY THE VAMPIRE SLAYER
> Season Five, Episode 2: "Real Me"
> (or "Current mood: Annoyed Current music: I Die In Agony - 'Make
> It All Better'")
> Writer: David Fury
> Director: David Grossman
>
> Remember what I was saying about this show having chutzpah? Well,
> retconning (?) a new character right into the center of the show with
> no actual explanation whatsoever, expecting your audience to accept
> that you know what you're doing without reassurance... that's
> chutzpah.
Vg gheaf bhg gung guvf ernyyl vfa'g n ergpba.
> One of the better moments is
> Buffy venting about being saddled with Dawn, and Riley being the voice
> of reason, or at least the advocate for consistency in complaints.
> "Thank you, logic boy. Did I mention this is a rant? Sense really
> has no place in it."
An interesting line in her rant: "I *know* it's always been this way.
... But for some reason lately it's just really getting to me. I mean,
shes always around." I wonder if Buffy is actually picking up that
things *have* changed. She was the first to pick up that things were
not right in the Jonathanverse.
> Probably the place where I got most annoyed, though, was during the
> parts focusing on Harmony and her new vampire minions. Last year I
> praised "The Harsh Light Of Day" for doing so well with an annoying
> character without annoying the audience. This time she started grating
> on me. There's only so much high-pitched squealing and ditziness one
> can take, and building so much of an episode around her is not a good
> idea. Even the fact that the episode makes no secret about the fact
> that it's laughing at Harmony gets to the point where the humor seems
> like a self-congratulatory in-joke rather than, you know, funny. Which
> isn't to imply that there aren't any good Harm moments, just that
> there are too many Harm moments, of all kinds.
But...but...Harmony has minions! And she remains one of the few
vampires to ever figure out that when the Slayer shows up, it's time to
leave.
> We once again get a mysterious ending, with Dawn's
> "boy, is she in for a surprise." Could perfectly well be an
> innocent little comment, but is delivered as if there's something
> else going on.
I think it was just teen "I'm gonna show them!" talk.
> In which case it might get explained, someday. The
> "you don't belong here" scene would likely tie into that too.
The crazy guy talks about curds and whey, harking back to Faith's
"Little Miss Muffet, counting down from seven three oh" comment in
Buffy's Graduation dream. (The script for 'Hush' also has a reference
to the spider in Buffy's dream, but Joss cut it from the final episode.)
> Are we meant to believe that Xander's doing construction again, or is
> that just what he's telling people?
Yes, he has another construction job.
> So vampires can only be invited in by a resident of a home. You'd
> think Wesley, as a former Watcher, would've known that back in
> "Somnambulist."
Ya think? Of course he didn't know that Angel didn't need an invitation
into another vampire's lair.
> Lots of pop-culture references this week. Besides the non-verbal
> homage to _The Empire Strikes Back_ in the teaser and the cute
> reference to Hogwarts a little later, Buffy has a killer line towards
> the end: "aside from the fact that most magic shop owners in
> Sunnydale have the life expectancy of a Spinal Tap drummer..."
>
> This Is Really Stupid But I Laughed Anyway moment(s):
> - Xander seeing Dawn "as a woman," albeit one with a face full of
> ice cream. Hell, the whole Anya-playing-Life scene.
> - The way Spike mocks Harm's plan, she says they'll need a new one
> and then ends up using the first one anyway
> - "Ah, Mort. I trust you made our guest ... comfortable?" "You
> told me to chain her to a wall." "Yeah, I know, I'm being, you
> know, sarcastic or whatever?"
> - Unicorn slayage
And Harmony has minions!
>
>
> So...
>
> One-sentence summary: A few wrong steps, but pretty okay overall.
>
> AOQ rating: Decent
>
> [Season Five so far:
> 1) "Buffy Vs. Dracula" - Good
> 2) "Real Me" - Decent]
This is one of my favourite episodes, but there's so much stuff in it
that I can't talk about without going all spoilery. Someone remind me
to come back to it, after another half dozen episodes or so.
--
Quando omni flunkus moritati
Visit the Buffy Body Count at <http://homepage.mac.com/dsample/>
Apteryx
news:1149397185.5...@c74g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
>A reminder: Please avoid spoilers for later episodes in these review
> threads.
>
>
> BUFFY THE VAMPIRE SLAYER
> Season Five, Episode 2: "Real Me"
> (or "Current mood: Annoyed Current music: I Die In Agony - 'Make
> It All Better'")
> Writer: David Fury
> Director: David Grossman
>
>
> and Dawn, is pretty weak. The shared egocentric my-life-is-so-hard
> feelings are okay, but the actual chemistry between them isn't
> happening. Also a problem is the fact that I don't think our
> incessantly squabbling sisters ever have an argument or do a bit that
> isn't straight out of every family-based sitcom, ever. Anyone not
> see the end coming where they show a brief bit of appreciation for each
> other and then immediately go back to their old patterns? It makes
> Joyce look like something of a moron too, putting her ideas about how
> sisters should behave at a higher priority than the fact that Buffy is
> keeping everyone alive.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, and yeah. For me, it's Joyce's reactions that are the most
annoying.
> Probably the place where I got most annoyed, though, was during the
> parts focusing on Harmony and her new vampire minions. Last year I
> praised "The Harsh Light Of Day" for doing so well with an annoying
> character without annoying the audience. This time she started grating
> on me. There's only so much high-pitched squealing and ditziness one
> can take, and building so much of an episode around her is not a good
> idea. Even the fact that the episode makes no secret about the fact
> that it's laughing at Harmony gets to the point where the humor seems
> like a self-congratulatory in-joke rather than, you know, funny. Which
> isn't to imply that there aren't any good Harm moments, just that
> there are too many Harm moments, of all kinds.
Not for me. And she has minions.
>
> The by-the-numbers plotting towards the end leads Dawn to run away, get
> herself captured, and have Buffy save her. I don't really have
> anything to say about the last act at all. That's a lie, actually,
> since I'd like to at least mention two things: first is Buffy's
> un-hero-like gratuitous violence with Spike (a nice little scene, that
> one), and second, we once again get a mysterious ending, with Dawn's
> "boy, is she in for a surprise." Could perfectly well be an
> innocent little comment, but is delivered as if there's something
> else going on. In which case it might get explained, someday. The
> "you don't belong here" scene would likely tie into that too.
There is also Tara's odd reaction to being called one of the good guys. Lots
of mystery being hinted at.
>
> Lots of pop-culture references this week. Besides the non-verbal
> homage to _The Empire Strikes Back_ in the teaser and the cute
> reference to Hogwarts a little later, Buffy has a killer line towards
> the end: "aside from the fact that most magic shop owners in
> Sunnydale have the life expectancy of a Spinal Tap drummer..."
Funny and accurate. Does Giles think having a personal conection with the
Slayer will make him an exception, or is the rate of return just too
tempting to pass up?
> This Is Really Stupid But I Laughed Anyway moment(s):
> - Xander seeing Dawn "as a woman," albeit one with a face full of
> ice cream. Hell, the whole Anya-playing-Life scene.
> - The way Spike mocks Harm's plan, she says they'll need a new one
> and then ends up using the first one anyway
I don't think she had one, or at least not that one. She just adopts the one
he mockingly suggested as an example of a dumb plan.
>
> One-sentence summary: A few wrong steps, but pretty okay overall.
>
> AOQ rating: Decent
I agree about the few wrong steps, but I'd call it a Good. It has some great
cuts - "what kind of an unholy creature fancies cheap tasteless statuary?" -
cut to Harmony. "Buffy is not going to be happy about this." - cut to Buffy
laughing. "Believe me, nobody feels worse than her right now" (about Dawn,
after the fight at the Summers place) - cut to Harmony. And I love Giles
with his new car (though moving on from Wesley, I'm now having doubts about
Giles's Englishness - what kind of Englishman buys a sports car with
automatic transmission for his mid-life crisis? Jeremy Clarkson would not be
impressed).
Plus, and not least importantly, Harmony has minions :)
For me its the 55th best BtVS episode, 6th best in season 5.
--
Apteryx
(Harmony) Watcher
"MBangel10 (Melissa)" <mban...@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:PKGdnTfO05R...@comcast.com...
in case it might be spoilery. Question: Ng guvf cbvag va gur frevrf, qbrf
gur ivrjre xabj Naln jnf uhzna orsber fur jnf Nalnaxn gur iratrnapr qrzba?
Qvq zbfg ivrjref guvax gung Naln jnf grpuavpnyyl whfg n pbhcyr bs lrnef byq
(uhznayl fcrnxvat)?
<rest snipped>
==Harmony Watcher==
Don Sample
wrote:
> "Arbitrar Of Quality" <tsm...@wildmail.com> wrote in message
> news:1149397185.5...@c74g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
> >A reminder: Please avoid spoilers for later episodes in these review
> > threads.
> >
> > - The way Spike mocks Harm's plan, she says they'll need a new one
> > and then ends up using the first one anyway
>
> I don't think she had one, or at least not that one. She just adopts the one
> he mockingly suggested as an example of a dumb plan.
And he should know. He used it in 'Lovers Walk.'
MBangel10 (Melissa)
> In article <e5tu4p$rqc$1...@nntp.aioe.org>, "Apteryx" <apt...@xtra.co.nz>
> wrote:
>
>> "Arbitrar Of Quality" <tsm...@wildmail.com> wrote in message
>> news:1149397185.5...@c74g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
>>> A reminder: Please avoid spoilers for later episodes in these review
>>> threads.
>>>
>
>>> - The way Spike mocks Harm's plan, she says they'll need a new one
>>> and then ends up using the first one anyway
>> I don't think she had one, or at least not that one. She just adopts the one
>> he mockingly suggested as an example of a dumb plan.
>
> And he should know. He used it in 'Lovers Walk.'
>
Don Sample
"\(Harmony\) Watcher" <nob...@nonesuch.com> wrote:
> OK, I rot13 my following question because I didn't know the answer, and just
> in case it might be spoilery. Question: At this point in the series, does
> the viewer know Anya was human before she was Anyanka the vengeance demon?
> Did most viewers think that Anya was technically just a couple of years old
> (humanly speaking)?
Un ROT-13ed because we learned that Anya started out human, and became a
demon after she impressed D'Hoffryn with her vengeance against her
cheating boyfriend in 'Something Blue.' The same episode in which
D'Hoffryn offered Willow the job.
Don Sample
"MBangel10 (Melissa)" <mban...@comcast.net> wrote:
Hold the Slayer's friends hostage, to get her to do what he wants.
It wasn't his first plan, or his second, but it was the one he went with.
MBangel10 (Melissa)
> In article <XdmdndDeeobSHR_Z...@comcast.com>,
> "MBangel10 (Melissa)" <mban...@comcast.net> wrote:
>
>> Don Sample wrote:
>>> In article <e5tu4p$rqc$1...@nntp.aioe.org>, "Apteryx" <apt...@xtra.co.nz>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> "Arbitrar Of Quality" <tsm...@wildmail.com> wrote in message
>>>> news:1149397185.5...@c74g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
>>>>> A reminder: Please avoid spoilers for later episodes in these review
>>>>> threads.
>>>>>
>>>>> - The way Spike mocks Harm's plan, she says they'll need a new one
>>>>> and then ends up using the first one anyway
>>>> I don't think she had one, or at least not that one. She just adopts the
>>>> one
>>>> he mockingly suggested as an example of a dumb plan.
>>> And he should know. He used it in 'Lovers Walk.'
>>>
>> Actually they were two completely different plans. How are they similar?
>
> Hold the Slayer's friends hostage, to get her to do what he wants.
>
> It wasn't his first plan, or his second, but it was the one he went with.
>
just ended up messing it all up for him.
Don Sample
"MBangel10 (Melissa)" <mban...@comcast.net> wrote:
Give him Willow's spell book, that she had. Help him gather the
ingredients that he needed. Buffy didn't mess anything up for him. She
helped keep Mr. Tricks boys from staking his ass, and then Spike decided
to just give up on his whole plan, and leave town.
Elisi
> A reminder: Please avoid spoilers for later episodes in these review
> retconning (?) a new character right into the center of the show with
> no actual explanation whatsoever, expecting your audience to accept
> that you know what you're doing without reassurance... that's
> chutzpah.
I'm glad you think so! :)
> This time she started grating
> on me. There's only so much high-pitched squealing and ditziness one
> can take, and building so much of an episode around her is not a good
> idea.
But - Harmony has minions!!!!
Sorry. But it's a very funny episode that holds up very well. (I
re-watched a few months ago, and it's a continual delight. And there
can never be too much Harmony in my world! *g*)
> I don't really have
> anything to say about the last act at all. That's a lie, actually,
> since I'd like to at least mention two things: first is Buffy's
> un-hero-like gratuitous violence with Spike (a nice little scene, that
> one),
Ah yes, Spike The Punching Bag. I know that there were some complaints
that Spike wasn't staked after his betrayal at the end of S4. Well he
was allowed to live, but here we see some of the re-percussions. Rather
than asking (or paying) for information, Buffy now beats him up for it.
It seems you find this a satifactory arrangement.
(Harmony) Watcher
"Elisi" <eli...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1149407102....@u72g2000cwu.googlegroups.com...
> Arbitrar Of Quality wrote:
> > A reminder: Please avoid spoilers for later episodes in these review
> > Remember what I was saying about this show having chutzpah? Well,
> > retconning (?) a new character right into the center of the show with
> > no actual explanation whatsoever, expecting your audience to accept
> > that you know what you're doing without reassurance... that's
> > chutzpah.
>
> I'm glad you think so! :)
>
> > This time she started grating
> > on me. There's only so much high-pitched squealing and ditziness one
> > can take, and building so much of an episode around her is not a good
> > idea.
>
> But - Harmony has minions!!!!
>
> Sorry. But it's a very funny episode that holds up very well. (I
> re-watched a few months ago, and it's a continual delight. And there
> can never be too much Harmony in my world! *g*)
>
<fiction>
it was all Xander's fault
</fiction>
that Harmony fell in with the wrong crowd.
<fiction>Once upon a time, Harmony, Willow and Xander were best pals in
kindergarten. And then Willow made one of Harmony's crayons all bendy with a
spell. The two got into a fight, and Harmony resorted to hair pulling while
Willow used magicks to smear crayons on Harmony's face. And Xander was
enjoying himself all the while watching.
</fiction>
:p
==Harmony Watcher==
vague disclaimer
> And I love Giles
> with his new car (though moving on from Wesley, I'm now having doubts about
> Giles's Englishness - what kind of Englishman buys a sports car with
> automatic transmission for his mid-life crisis? Jeremy Clarkson would not be
> impressed).
And Englishman much like Giles. Mid-life crisis rebellion *but easier*.
--
Wikipedia: like Usenet, moderated by trolls
anmc...@hotmail.com
> retconning (?) a new character right into the center of the show with
> no actual explanation whatsoever, expecting your audience to accept
> that you know what you're doing without reassurance... that's
> chutzpah.
Retconning? AOQ, Dawn has been in the show since day one. Don't you
remember "Prophecy Girl", with Dawn witnessing the Buffy-Master fight,
her horror in seeing her sister getting bitten? She was the one keeping
Buffy out of the water so Xander and Angel can come when they did.
And let's not forget the near-brush with death she had in "Innocence."
She was with Xander and Willow when they first met Angelus. While
Xander and Willow went into the library, Angelus told Dawn that he was
going to show her something. Fortunately, Jenny came in with a cross,
telling Dawn to come to her instead. Of course, it didn't save her from
being grabbed by Angelus, but he quickly switched hostages from Dawn to
Willow. This probably explains why she doesn't like Riley that much,
considering what Buffy's last boyfriend almost did to her.
A.Gerard
vague disclaimer
"Arbitrar Of Quality" <tsm...@wildmail.com> wrote:
> Unfortunately, the most central relationship of all, that between Buffy
> and Dawn, is pretty weak. The shared egocentric my-life-is-so-hard
> feelings are okay, but the actual chemistry between them isn't
> happening. Also a problem is the fact that I don't think our
> incessantly squabbling sisters ever have an argument or do a bit that
> isn't straight out of every family-based sitcom, ever. Anyone not
> see the end coming where they show a brief bit of appreciation for each
> other and then immediately go back to their old patterns?
So horror tropes aren't the only thing the shows riffs on...
vague disclaimer
Don Sample <dsa...@synapse.net> wrote:
> Someone remind me
> to come back to it, after another half dozen episodes or so.
Don't forget to come back to it after half dozen episodes or so.
What??
Mike Zeares
Arbitrar Of Quality wrote:
> A reminder: Please avoid spoilers for later episodes in these review
> threads.
>
>
> BUFFY THE VAMPIRE SLAYER
> Season Five, Episode 2: "Real Me"
> (or "Current mood: Annoyed Current music: I Die In Agony - 'Make
> It All Better'")
> Writer: David Fury
> Director: David Grossman
>
> Remember what I was saying about this show having chutzpah? Well,
> retconning (?) a new character right into the center of the show with
> no actual explanation whatsoever, expecting your audience to accept
> that you know what you're doing without reassurance... that's
> chutzpah.
You keep referring to a new character. I'm afraid I don't know what
you're talking about. On an unrelated note, it was nice to finally see
Dawn become more of an important character, after 4 seasons of being
mostly in the background.
(you're probably going to get tired of "Favorite Dawn Moments" posts
really quick. Sorry. We can't help ourselves. And it's sort of a
newsgroup tradition)
> Probably the place where I got most annoyed, though, was during the
> parts focusing on Harmony and her new vampire minions. Last year I
> praised "The Harsh Light Of Day" for doing so well with an annoying
> character without annoying the audience. This time she started grating
> on me. There's only so much high-pitched squealing and ditziness one
> can take, and building so much of an episode around her is not a good
> idea. Even the fact that the episode makes no secret about the fact
> that it's laughing at Harmony gets to the point where the humor seems
> like a self-congratulatory in-joke rather than, you know, funny. Which
> isn't to imply that there aren't any good Harm moments, just that
> there are too many Harm moments, of all kinds.
But, but... Harmony has *minions!!*
*falls down laughing*
You're going to get really sick of that in this thread too, I'm afraid.
Anyway, add me to the camp of "no such thing as too many Harm
moments." Again, sorry.
> With the addition of Trachtenberg, we now have eight regulars, the most
> in BTVS history so far. We're almost into _Firefly_ territory at
> this point.
Yeah. Only with less Mal-ness. And no whores.
> Lots of pop-culture references this week. Besides the non-verbal
> homage to _The Empire Strikes Back_ in the teaser and the cute
> reference to Hogwarts a little later, Buffy has a killer line towards
> the end: "aside from the fact that most magic shop owners in
> Sunnydale have the life expectancy of a Spinal Tap drummer..."
One of the best pop-culture refs of the series. Xander probably
supplied that film at one of the gang's vid-fests.
> This Is Really Stupid But I Laughed Anyway moment(s):
> - Xander seeing Dawn "as a woman," albeit one with a face full of
> ice cream. Hell, the whole Anya-playing-Life scene.
Emma's whole delivery of the games speech was awesome. "...and, ooh!
The Game of Life!"
> - Unicorn slayage
I loved Buffy's bemused expression after she dusted Mort with it.
> AOQ rating: Decent
Yeah, can't argue with that. It does its job with the Dawn and Harmony
storylines (Fury admits in the comentary that he hit the "real me"
theme a little too hard, with both of those characters stating the
episode title), but it's not really a classic, beyond a few really good
lines.
Unless you're a big Harmony/Mercedes fan. In which case -- gold! She
has freakin' MINIONS!.
-- Mike Zeares (*dies laughing*)
Mike Zeares
anmc...@hotmail.com wrote:
> Retconning? AOQ, Dawn has been in the show since day one. Don't you
> remember "Prophecy Girl", with Dawn witnessing the Buffy-Master fight,
> her horror in seeing her sister getting bitten? She was the one keeping
> Buffy out of the water so Xander and Angel can come when they did.
> And let's not forget the near-brush with death she had in "Innocence."
> She was with Xander and Willow when they first met Angelus. While
> Xander and Willow went into the library, Angelus told Dawn that he was
> going to show her something. Fortunately, Jenny came in with a cross,
> telling Dawn to come to her instead. Of course, it didn't save her from
> being grabbed by Angelus, but he quickly switched hostages from Dawn to
> Willow. This probably explains why she doesn't like Riley that much,
> considering what Buffy's last boyfriend almost did to her.
Ah, somebody else who read the comic books. You know, I have a lot of
comics, including some really good ones, but BtVS is almost the only
book (that I have in individual issues) that I reread on a semi-regular
basis. Even the early sucky issues.
-- Mike Zeares
Horace LaBadie
"Arbitrar Of Quality" <tsm...@wildmail.com> wrote:
> Remember what I was saying about this show having chutzpah? Well,
> retconning (?) a new character right into the center of the show with
> no actual explanation whatsoever, expecting your audience to accept
> that you know what you're doing without reassurance... that's
> chutzpah.
This is Joss' brilliant take on the time-honored soap opera (or serial
melodrama, if you prefer) staple of the Long Lost Relative. The LLR can
assume many forms from the bastard half-sibling ("Magnum, P.I." had a
lot of fun spoofing the tradition with Higgins' many half-brothers and
sister) to the distant cousin of the younger brother who went to sea and
was never heard from again but who has designs on the family
title/fortune to the character who returns from the dead (or appears to,
as in Jock Ewing seemingly returned to "Dallas"). Characters appearing
out of nowhere and walking in as though they belonged is one of the
cheesiest and weakest tricks in the book, and Joss just loves playing
with such things to prove that even the worst and most shopworn idea can
be done well.
There are no half measures with him.
HWL
Elisi
CYRUS: When are we gonna do it?
HARMONY: Eww! That's rude! I barely know you!
Has me laughing my head off every time. *happy sigh*
(Also of course: Fdhrr! Gbz Yrax!!!!)
On a different note, I had a look at Spring Summers' analysis of this
episode, and apart from pointing out all the parallels between Harmony
and Dawn ('A little idiot who's going to get us all killed' is a nice
way of describing Harmony who gets all her minions killed), she also
had this very interesting observation:
But hang on to your hats because we're going quickly around a curve
here: So is Buffy. Yes, Buffy. Buffy is also the figurative little
idiot in question.
Let's take a look at the discussion that leads to the little idiot
remark:
BUFFY: "I mean please. I would never have Harmony over even when
she was alive."
XANDER: "People slip, Buffy. Your mom did. She invited The Mas -
Dracula. In for coffee."
BUFFY: "Well, that was different. I mean she - he would - she
was lonely, and she didn't know he was a vampire. _The_ vampire.
Meanwhile, Dawn knew exactly what Harmony was and she rolled out the
welcome mat for her."
RILEY: "She's just a kid."
BUFFY: "You know - will everybody please stop saying that? I was
just a kid when I met my first vampire, but somehow, I still managed to
remember the rules."
RILEY: "You had to. It was your job."
BUFFY: "No it was common sense . . . we are doing nothing but
turning her into a little idiot who is going to get us all killed."
OK. Notice that Xander shows us some minor lingering Dracula-thrall
effects. And when Buffy is defending her mom, we can see in her
manner, and her words ("-he would-"), that she is remembering not
just her mother's vulnerability to vamp-charm, but her own. And
notice something else. The camera is on Buffy's right, and it closes
in on her head and shoulders as she ends the discussion by saying:
BUFFY: "She has to be more careful. I can't be there to protect
her 24 hours a day. I just can't."
And look. _There_. Right there, on her neck. There it is, clear as
daylight: What remains of the Dracula-inflicted puncture wounds, boldly
outlined by the whitish, bite-shaped scars Angel left behind.
Angel. _The_ vampire. The one she invited in even though she knew
exactly what he was. You remember - back when she managed to forget
the rules, and nearly got them all killed. She should have been more
careful. Her mother and Giles weren't there to protect her, 24 hours
a day. No wonder Buffy is freaking out about Dawn's behavior as
young teen!
Arbitrar Of Quality
>
> You keep referring to a new character. I'm afraid I don't know what
> you're talking about. On an unrelated note, it was nice to finally see
> Dawn become more of an important character, after 4 seasons of being
> mostly in the background.
>
> (you're probably going to get tired of "Favorite Dawn Moments" posts
> really quick. Sorry. We can't help ourselves. And it's sort of a
> newsgroup tradition)
[snip]
> But, but... Harmony has *minions!!*
>
> *falls down laughing*
>
> You're going to get really sick of that in this thread too, I'm afraid.
> Anyway, add me to the camp of "no such thing as too many Harm
> moments." Again, sorry.
Yeah, you guys have fun. I'll go watch "The Replacement" or something.
-AOQ
Opus the Penguin
> Mrs. Quality liked
> Dawn's voiceovers better than I did, overall - I think she's
> still more of a character with potential at this point.
What an interesting way of putting it.
--
Opus the Penguin
The best darn penguin in all of Usenet
vague disclaimer
"Mike Zeares" <mze...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> >
> > BUFFY THE VAMPIRE SLAYER
> > Season Five, Episode 2: "Real Me"
> > (or "Current mood: Annoyed Current music: I Die In Agony - 'Make
> > It All Better'")
> > Writer: David Fury
> > Director: David Grossman
> >
> > Remember what I was saying about this show having chutzpah? Well,
> > retconning (?) a new character right into the center of the show with
> > no actual explanation whatsoever, expecting your audience to accept
> > that you know what you're doing without reassurance... that's
> > chutzpah.
>
> You keep referring to a new character. I'm afraid I don't know what
> you're talking about. On an unrelated note, it was nice to finally see
> Dawn become more of an important character, after 4 seasons of being
> mostly in the background.
>
> (you're probably going to get tired of "Favorite Dawn Moments" posts
> really quick. Sorry. We can't help ourselves. And it's sort of a
> newsgroup tradition)
Is it too early to suggest goggle grouping for "Buffy the lost episodes"?
vague disclaimer
vague disclaimer <l64o...@dea.spamcon.org> wrote:
Having just done exactly that (except I used Google not goggle), there
is a whopping great S5 spoiler.
So don't. Yet.
Mel
(Harmony) Watcher wrote:
Yes. From "Something Blue." When they find out D'Hoffryn has Willow, she
tells Buffy and Xander that he is the one who turned her into a
vengeance demon.
Mel
Mel
Don Sample wrote:
> In article <e5tu4p$rqc$1...@nntp.aioe.org>, "Apteryx" <apt...@xtra.co.nz>
> wrote:
>
>
>>"Arbitrar Of Quality" <tsm...@wildmail.com> wrote in message
>>news:1149397185.5...@c74g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
>>
>>>A reminder: Please avoid spoilers for later episodes in these review
>>>threads.
>>>
>
>
>>>- The way Spike mocks Harm's plan, she says they'll need a new one
>>>and then ends up using the first one anyway
>>
>>I don't think she had one, or at least not that one. She just adopts the one
>>he mockingly suggested as an example of a dumb plan.
>
>
> And he should know. He used it in 'Lovers Walk.'
>
Not exactly. He didn't kidnap Willow and Xander to get to Buffy. He
wanted Willow to do a spell for him.
Mel
lili...@gmail.com
Xander to get Willow to do a spell for him. But he didn't kidnap them
with the intention of using them as leverage against Buffy. It just
worked out that way.
Kinda like how using a unicorn to stake a vamp might seem dumb, but
hey, it happened to be what was lying around.
Lore
Don Sample
"Elisi" <eli...@gmail.com> wrote:
> OK. Notice that Xander shows us some minor lingering Dracula-thrall
> effects. And when Buffy is defending her mom, we can see in her
> manner, and her words ("-he would-"), that she is remembering not
> just her mother's vulnerability to vamp-charm, but her own. And
> notice something else. The camera is on Buffy's right, and it closes
> in on her head and shoulders as she ends the discussion by saying:
>
> BUFFY: "She has to be more careful. I can't be there to protect
> her 24 hours a day. I just can't."
>
> And look. _There_. Right there, on her neck. There it is, clear as
> daylight: What remains of the Dracula-inflicted puncture wounds, boldly
> outlined by the whitish, bite-shaped scars Angel left behind.
>
> Angel. _The_ vampire. The one she invited in even though she knew
> exactly what he was. You remember - back when she managed to forget
> the rules, and nearly got them all killed. She should have been more
> careful. Her mother and Giles weren't there to protect her, 24 hours
> a day. No wonder Buffy is freaking out about Dawn's behavior as
> young teen!
Actually, she didn't know he was a vampire when she invited him in. She
didn't find out until the next evening, nearly 24 hours later.
John Briggs
> In article <dsample-F5D403...@news.giganews.com>,
> Don Sample <dsa...@synapse.net> wrote:
>
>> Someone remind me
>> to come back to it, after another half dozen episodes or so.
>
> Don't forget to come back to it after half dozen episodes or so.
>
> What??
Someone remind him, after another half dozen episodes or so, to come back
to it.
:-)
--
John Briggs
Elisi
> Actually, she didn't know he was a vampire when she invited him in. She
> didn't find out until the next evening, nearly 24 hours later.
I think she means metaphorically speaking. Spring Summers focusses a
lot on themes, ideas, analogies etc.
(And it was Darla who nearly killed them in that particular episode.)
But Jenny was killed because Buffy had let Angel into her life...
One Bit Shy
news:1149397185.5...@c74g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
> BUFFY THE VAMPIRE SLAYER
> Season Five, Episode 2: "Real Me"
> (or "Current mood: Annoyed Current music: I Die In Agony - 'Make
> It All Better'")
> Writer: David Fury
> Director: David Grossman
>
> Remember what I was saying about this show having chutzpah? Well,
> retconning (?) a new character right into the center of the show with
> no actual explanation whatsoever, expecting your audience to accept
> that you know what you're doing without reassurance... that's
> chutzpah.
I suppose. And I guess there must have been some controversey around it.
It's hard for me to react on those terms since the way I came into this
episode I was already quite familiar with Dawn. That being said, I still
question the viewpoint. Suddenly inserting a 14 year old sister certainly
takes courage. But the lack of reassurance part I don't get. There's one
very blatant moment in the episode when the crazy guy accosts Dawn.
"I know you. Curds and whey. I know what you are. You ... don't ...
belong ... here."
Along with other lesser hints of mystery, that serves as a pretty clear
message to the viewers, I think, that, yes, they know Dawn doesn't make
sense and, no, they're not just going to leave it that way - which is not to
say they won't have fun teasing in the meantime. That also establishes
mystery to her existence internal to the story. With all that has
transpired in BtVS to date, the mystery to me is why anyone wouldn't assume
that Dawn's mystery - including the lack of explanation - is part of the
story yet to unfold. One may or may not end up likeing that story, but
objecting to the level of explanation now strikes me more as demanding
instant gratification - which this series is not wont to provide.
Anyway, speaking more generally about the episode, the way I look at it is
as kind of the real season opener. And a season opener loosely along the
lines of the original one - Welcome to the Hellmouth. Much as Buffy was
introduced to her new world then, Dawn is introduced to her world now by
taking her and us through a quick inventory of the places and people in her
life. A look intended to illuminate the others as much as it is to
illuminate Dawn. Personally, I find the exercise delightful. I really
appreciate the fresh look - the fresh perspective - on our characters. I
especially like how it seeks to look at the heart of the them - again, much
as was done in Welcome to the Hellmouth
Everybody gets their moment in the sun. (Well, except for Spike of course.)
But I think the big secondary part of the story is the peek at Giles, who is
the first character we see transforming himself from the doldroms of S4.
Zen master Giles. (Which includes one of my favorite taking off the glasses
moments - this time ripped off in fury.) Sporty red converatble Giles.
Buffy: Giles, are you breaking up with your car?
Giles: Well, it did seduce me, all red and sporty!
Buffy: Little two-door tramp.
And capitalist running dog Giles discovering in the Magic Box an exciting
new interest to replace the high school library. Giles is showing an
enthusiasm for life we haven't seen in a long time. Which may also be
rubbing off on Buffy, who is shown very much enjoying his company. Laughing
easily. Being the smart aleck we remember from back in the beginning.
Which goes to another characteristic of the episode as a mood piece - which
happens to be happy, easy, safe. (Somewhat an oddity for this series in
itself.) Almost everybody (I'm not sure where Spike's head is at) is shown
to be in a pretty comfortable place. Not perfect, mind you. (Tara, for
example, still feels like an outsider.) It's not a Norman Rockwell
Thanksgiving dinner. But happy to be alive, and not unduly burdened by
stresses. The squabbling of sisters is actually kind of reassuring. That's
what sisters do and itself shows that things are well. The banality of the
bickering subjects and the juvenile manner employed is, I believe, kind of
the point. Underscoring the warmth and safety of their lives and thier
home - where the big deal is little sister using up all the milk.
Even Slayer business and the requisite Sunnydale moment of danger is
downgraded as much as one could conceive. In one word - Harmony. The cause
of the biggest guffaw and tears of laughter that I think we've seen from
Buffy to date. Of course that laughter turns serious in a hurry. (Good
scene. SMG is said to hate performing laughter, but I think she nails this
scene. Great transition out of the laughter.) And the danger is real -
Harmony or not. But, in the end, the message is that when it counts, big
sister will come through and save little sister. The bickering is of no
account. What could be a warmer and safer feeling than that?
So the season has opened. The stage has been set. And it's a happy,
peaceful one. Fuzzy bunny snuggles for everyone. (Except Anya. That would
be mean.) Just one thing. There's something horribly askew here. Who the
hell - what the hell - is Dawn?
One must always remember that this is Sunnydale. Welcome to the Hellmouth.
> "Real Me" gets into Dawn's head a lot, with her running MySpace
> entry giving an idea of what it's like to be a normal kid growing up
> alongside a Slayer, and how an outsider will perceive the Scoobie
> world. It's unclear to me how long she's known about her
> sister's otherworldly ways, and whether or not this episode is her
> first brush with death. The premise is okay and all, given that kids
> that age have a remarkable capacity for jadedness and
> self-centeredness, but kind of nondescript for me. Mrs. Quality liked
> Dawn's voiceovers better than I did, overall - I think she's
> still more of a character with potential at this point.
I like the voiceover myself - both as a device and as how performed. MT, I
think, gives a generally good performance in challenging circumstances.
This would be her first real episode - and, well, she's the star of it. She
has to provide a fairly nuanced baseline for her character here - and
there's a lot of risk in that. Mostly it comes through. The issues I think
are mainly writing ones where her age characteristics get a bit fuzzy.
She's 14, but acts more like 11 much of the time. That's not so bad, since
maturing is an erratic process for the best of us. But it does feel a tad
unsettled just how mature she really is.
There's also some nice physical work mixed in. The slightly awkward and
clumsy movement of her in contrast to Buffy is nice. And I really liked the
way she resisted when Buffy forcebly took her out of the Magic Box by her
arm.
> admire Willow and Tara as
> cool geeks,
One of the sweeter moments, I thought, was the thumb wrestling with Tara.
> And then he's one of the ones Dawn
> later overhears seemingly being so dismissive of her, and that whole
> scene works better as a result.
Riley called her a kid again, but I didn't think Xander said anything
dismissive. His point was that everybody slips up - including Joyce.
> Unfortunately, the most central relationship of all, that between Buffy
> and Dawn, is pretty weak. The shared egocentric my-life-is-so-hard
> feelings are okay, but the actual chemistry between them isn't
> happening.
I don't know what to say about that other than that's not how it came across
to me.
> Also a problem is the fact that I don't think our
> incessantly squabbling sisters ever have an argument or do a bit that
> isn't straight out of every family-based sitcom, ever. Anyone not
> see the end coming where they show a brief bit of appreciation for each
> other and then immediately go back to their old patterns?
The sitcom reference may be correct - I don't know. It's funny, but I
didn't think of television references at all. I just saw it as sibling
interaction. Seemed appropriate to me. But I'm an only child. I only ever
see that as an outside observer.
I enjoyed the breakfast scene. Not so much for the bowl and milk stealing,
but how they carried their fight through looks rather than words. This was
between them - not Mom.
> It makes
> Joyce look like something of a moron too, putting her ideas about how
> sisters should behave at a higher priority than the fact that Buffy is
> keeping everyone alive.
That's Buffy's job. Joyce's job is to be Mom. That's actually hammered
upon this episode, albeit a bit indirectly at times.
> Probably the place where I got most annoyed, though, was during the
> parts focusing on Harmony and her new vampire minions. Last year I
> praised "The Harsh Light Of Day" for doing so well with an annoying
> character without annoying the audience. This time she started grating
> on me. There's only so much high-pitched squealing and ditziness one
> can take, and building so much of an episode around her is not a good
> idea. Even the fact that the episode makes no secret about the fact
> that it's laughing at Harmony gets to the point where the humor seems
> like a self-congratulatory in-joke rather than, you know, funny. Which
> isn't to imply that there aren't any good Harm moments, just that
> there are too many Harm moments, of all kinds.
I think it's in the commentary for this episode (which is one of the dullest
commentaries of the series) that somebody says that the concept for Harmony
was as perpetual president of the prom committee. That's how she approached
being gang leader.
Harmony is probably not to everybody's taste - or as you suggest, one to
taste in small doses. I like her a lot myself and would be happy to have
more. She certainly is the butt of many jokes. But, then, so is Xander.
I've always found an appeal to her personality that somehow is more than
just its dumbness. The way I look at vampire Harmony is that her *real*
sire is Cordelia. That's who corrrupted her. And maybe why her personality
seems the least changed of the vampires we know.
> Are we meant to believe that Xander's doing construction again,
Yes.
> Lots of pop-culture references this week. Besides the non-verbal
> homage to _The Empire Strikes Back_ in the teaser and the cute
> reference to Hogwarts a little later, Buffy has a killer line towards
> the end: "aside from the fact that most magic shop owners in
> Sunnydale have the life expectancy of a Spinal Tap drummer..."
Or a Grateful Dead keyboardist. (Another one just died.)
> - The way Spike mocks Harm's plan, she says they'll need a new one
> and then ends up using the first one anyway
Um. Harm used Spike's plan. It was better than anything she could think
of.
> So...
>
> One-sentence summary: A few wrong steps, but pretty okay overall.
>
> AOQ rating: Decent
Good for me. Pretty close to Excellent - I think it's well constructed with
a lot of humor. But the plot is scant and, while I think the groundwork for
some good emotional tension was placed, the tension here isn't high enough
to push the rating up for my tastes.
OBS
KenM47
>"Arbitrar Of Quality" <tsm...@wildmail.com> wrote in message
>news:1149397185.5...@c74g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
>
Two very interesting reads from the both of you. I lean more toward
Good(+) on this one.
Ken (Brooklyn)
James Craine
Arbitrar Of Quality wrote:
> A reminder: Please avoid spoilers for later episodes in these review
> threads.
>
>
> BUFFY THE VAMPIRE SLAYER
> Season Five, Episode 2: "Real Me"
> (or "Current mood: Annoyed Current music: I Die In Agony - 'Make
> It All Better'")
> Writer: David Fury
> Director: David Grossman
>
> Probably the place where I got most annoyed, though, was during the
> parts focusing on Harmony and her new vampire minions. Last year I
> praised "The Harsh Light Of Day" for doing so well with an annoying
> character without annoying the audience. This time she started grating
> on me. There's only so much high-pitched squealing and ditziness one
> can take, and building so much of an episode around her is not a good
> idea. Even the fact that the episode makes no secret about the fact
> that it's laughing at Harmony gets to the point where the humor seems
> like a self-congratulatory in-joke rather than, you know, funny. Which
> isn't to imply that there aren't any good Harm moments, just that
> there are too many Harm moments, of all kinds.
Hu buu.... . Guvf qbrfa'g ybbx tbbq sbe bhe NlrBuDhrhr!
George W Harris
:> Actually, she didn't know he was a vampire when she invited him in. She
:> didn't find out until the next evening, nearly 24 hours later.
Are you talking about Buffy and Angel, or Joyce and Dracula?
--
Real men don't need macho posturing to bolster their egos.
George W. Harris For actual email address, replace each 'u' with an 'i'.
Elisi
George W Harris wrote:
> :Don Sample wrote:
> :> Actually, she didn't know he was a vampire when she invited him in. She
> :> didn't find out until the next evening, nearly 24 hours later.
>
> Are you talking about Buffy and Angel, or Joyce and Dracula?
Well I was talking about Buffy and Angel. And just realised that maybe
I misunderstood...
Don Sample
"One Bit Shy" <O...@nomail.sorry> wrote:
> The issues I think
> are mainly writing ones where her age characteristics get a bit fuzzy.
> She's 14, but acts more like 11 much of the time. That's not so bad, since
> maturing is an erratic process for the best of us. But it does feel a tad
> unsettled just how mature she really is.
Dawn was originally conceived as a younger girl, and the first drafts of
the early season 5 scripts were written before MT was cast. (SMG had
worked with her in the past, and recommended her for the job.) Some of
the younger aspects of the character didn't get fully taken out during
the rewrites.
Eric Hunter
> "Arbitrar Of Quality" <tsm...@wildmail.com> wrote in message
> news:1149397185.5...@c74g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
>
>> BUFFY THE VAMPIRE SLAYER
>> Season Five, Episode 2: "Real Me"
>>
>> retconning (?) a new character right into the center of the show with
>> no actual explanation whatsoever, expecting your audience to accept
>> that you know what you're doing without reassurance... that's
>> chutzpah.
>
> I suppose. And I guess there must have been some controversey around it.
> It's hard for me to react on those terms since the way I came into this
> episode I was already quite familiar with Dawn. That being said, I still
> question the viewpoint. Suddenly inserting a 14 year old sister certainly
> takes courage. But the lack of reassurance part I don't get.
TV convention is that when a new character is introduced,
an explanation is provided, like "Cousin Oliver Brady's
parents are in South America on business, So he'll be
living with us now that Cindy and Bobby have hit puberty."
There is no explanation here, no clue about how or why
the core cast all know her and treat her like a family
member.
> There's one very blatant moment in the episode when
> the crazy guy accosts Dawn.
>
> "I know you. Curds and whey. I know what you are.
> You ... don't ... belong ... here."
The guy is obviously deranged. His comment wasn't
meaningful.... was it?
Eric.
--
Don Sample
"Elisi" <eli...@gmail.com> wrote:
I was talking about Angel too. Buffy invites him into her house while
she still thinks he's just this annoying, mysterious guy who shows up
from time to time with news about the local vampires.
vague disclaimer
Eric Hunter <hunt...@comcast.net.invalid> wrote:
> >
> > "I know you. Curds and whey. I know what you are.
> > You ... don't ... belong ... here."
>
> The guy is obviously deranged. His comment wasn't
> meaningful.... was it?
>
> Eric.
Only if Little Miss Muffet had ever been mentioned before and who'd use
that in a modern TV show? As if.
Rowan Hawthorn
Don, after another half-dozen episodes or so, come back to this one...
;-)
--
Rowan Hawthorn
"Occasionally, I'm callous and strange." - Willow Rosenberg, "Buffy the
Vampire Slayer"
Rowan Hawthorn
> "Arbitrar Of Quality" <tsm...@wildmail.com> wrote in message
> news:1149397185.5...@c74g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
>> threads.
>>
>>
>> Season Five, Episode 2: "Real Me"
>> It All Better'")
>> Writer: David Fury
>> Director: David Grossman
>>
>>
>> and Dawn, is pretty weak. The shared egocentric my-life-is-so-hard
>> feelings are okay, but the actual chemistry between them isn't
>> incessantly squabbling sisters ever have an argument or do a bit that
>> isn't straight out of every family-based sitcom, ever. Anyone not
>> see the end coming where they show a brief bit of appreciation for each
>> Joyce look like something of a moron too, putting her ideas about how
>> sisters should behave at a higher priority than the fact that Buffy is
>> keeping everyone alive.
>
> annoying.
>
>> Probably the place where I got most annoyed, though, was during the
>> parts focusing on Harmony and her new vampire minions. Last year I
>> praised "The Harsh Light Of Day" for doing so well with an annoying
>> character without annoying the audience. This time she started grating
>> on me. There's only so much high-pitched squealing and ditziness one
>> can take, and building so much of an episode around her is not a good
>> idea. Even the fact that the episode makes no secret about the fact
>> that it's laughing at Harmony gets to the point where the humor seems
>> like a self-congratulatory in-joke rather than, you know, funny. Which
>> isn't to imply that there aren't any good Harm moments, just that
>> there are too many Harm moments, of all kinds.
>
Wearing the proper size shoe might help that...
Rowan Hawthorn
> Arbitrar Of Quality wrote:
>> A reminder: Please avoid spoilers for later episodes in these review
>> retconning (?) a new character right into the center of the show with
>> no actual explanation whatsoever, expecting your audience to accept
>> that you know what you're doing without reassurance... that's
>> chutzpah.
>
>
>> This time she started grating
>> on me. There's only so much high-pitched squealing and ditziness one
>> can take, and building so much of an episode around her is not a good
>> idea.
>
>
Where do you get those? I could use a few to help lug the band's
equipment around...
Rowan Hawthorn
But... the other is so much more *fun*...
Arbitrar Of Quality
Eric Hunter wrote:
> * One Bit Shy wrote, On 6/4/2006 4:20 PM:
> > "Arbitrar Of Quality" <tsm...@wildmail.com> wrote in message
> > news:1149397185.5...@c74g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
> >> Remember what I was saying about this show having chutzpah? Well,
> >> retconning (?) a new character right into the center of the show with
> >> no actual explanation whatsoever, expecting your audience to accept
> >> that you know what you're doing without reassurance... that's
> >> chutzpah.
> >
> > I suppose. And I guess there must have been some controversey around it.
> > It's hard for me to react on those terms since the way I came into this
> > episode I was already quite familiar with Dawn. That being said, I still
> > question the viewpoint. Suddenly inserting a 14 year old sister certainly
> > takes courage. But the lack of reassurance part I don't get.
>
> TV convention is that when a new character is introduced,
> an explanation is provided, like "Cousin Oliver Brady's
> parents are in South America on business, So he'll be
> living with us now that Cindy and Bobby have hit puberty."
> There is no explanation here, no clue about how or why
> the core cast all know her and treat her like a family
> member.
Yep. The only indication that the writers are even aware that Dawn is
an issue is Ranting Guy, and that's just a quick scene. Otherwise,
we're asked to accept a blatant change to the series' continuity
without an explanation. I don't have a problem with that, I'm just
sayng that the show has been showing a lot of chutzpah lately, the same
kind it showed by ending the season with something like "Restless."
It's become a series that demands a lot of audience participation.
-AOQ
George W Harris
:
He was too, but my point was that the situations
were nigh identical.
--
Never give a loaded gun to a woman in labor.
Mel
Hardly. Jenny was _sent_ by the gypsies to watch Angel, which means she
knew about him long before Buffy came along. Jenny was killed because
she kept secrets.
Mel
(Harmony) Watcher
<lili...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1149440471.8...@u72g2000cwu.googlegroups.com...
> Ah, but Spike at least had the excuse of being drunk while he used
> Xander to get Willow to do a spell for him. But he didn't kidnap them
> with the intention of using them as leverage against Buffy. It just
> worked out that way.
>
> Kinda like how using a unicorn to stake a vamp might seem dumb, but
> hey, it happened to be what was lying around.
>
>
made of 99.99% ceramic and 0.01% wood? :)
==Harmony Watcher==
jil...@hotmail.com
Mike Zeares wrote:
> anmc...@hotmail.com wrote:
>
> > Retconning? AOQ, Dawn has been in the show since day one. Don't you
> > remember "Prophecy Girl", with Dawn witnessing the Buffy-Master fight,
> > her horror in seeing her sister getting bitten? She was the one keeping
> > Buffy out of the water so Xander and Angel can come when they did.
> > And let's not forget the near-brush with death she had in "Innocence."
> > She was with Xander and Willow when they first met Angelus. While
> > Xander and Willow went into the library, Angelus told Dawn that he was
> > going to show her something. Fortunately, Jenny came in with a cross,
> > telling Dawn to come to her instead. Of course, it didn't save her from
> > being grabbed by Angelus, but he quickly switched hostages from Dawn to
> > Willow. This probably explains why she doesn't like Riley that much,
> > considering what Buffy's last boyfriend almost did to her.
>
> Ah, somebody else who read the comic books. You know, I have a lot of
> comics, including some really good ones, but BtVS is almost the only
> book (that I have in individual issues) that I reread on a semi-regular
> basis. Even the early sucky issues.
Just as a point on all issues... the comics are the comics, and I can't
treat them as canon. Oh dear, I'd better ROT-13 this one. AOQ, if you
care to you can come back to it after Dawn's been explained.
Sbe zr, gur jubyr cbvag bs gur Zbaxf' fcryy jnf gb vafreg Qnja nf
fzbbguyl nf cbffvoyr. Fb vg frrzf gung ab znwbe rirag va Ohssl'f yvsr
jbhyq punatr. Gurer vf ab ernfba sbe Qnja gb unir orra gurer ng gur
fpubby sbe rvgure rirag bs Ohssl orvat yrq gb gur Znfgre be Natryhf
pbzvat va gb gel naq fynhtugre Ohssl'f sevraqf. Fur jbhyq unir orra
jvgu ure zbgure, be ng gur onol-fvggre'f.
Paul Hyett
>
>Also, did you see that kick that Xander pulled (when he kicked Harm out
>the door)? Pretty impressive for one w/o special powers.
What I don't understand is why she didn't just burst straight back in
again.
>
>The crazy guy saying that to Dawn definitely hinted at *something*
>being off about the whole thing. I mean, without that I would have been
>really ticked off.
Joss Whedon loves to tease.
--
Paul 'Charts Fan' Hyett
mariposas rand mair fheal greykitten tomys des anges
Paul Hyett <p...@nojunkmailplease.co.uk> wrote:
> In alt.tv.buffy-v-slayer on Sun, 4 Jun 2006, MBangel10 (Melissa) wrote :
> >
> >Also, did you see that kick that Xander pulled (when he kicked Harm out
> >the door)? Pretty impressive for one w/o special powers.
>
> What I don't understand is why she didn't just burst straight back in
> again.
perhaps because harmony being harmony has decided the plan is spoiled
and now the prom committee has to come up with a new one
> >The crazy guy saying that to Dawn definitely hinted at *something*
> >being off about the whole thing. I mean, without that I would have been
> >really ticked off.
>
> Joss Whedon loves to tease.
ive gotta secret
go ahead guess what it is
want a hint?
arf meow arf - nsa fodder
ny dnrqn greebevfz ahpyrne obzo vena gnyvona ovt oebgure
if you meet buddha on the usenet killfile him
peachy ashie passion
> John Briggs wrote:
>
>> vague disclaimer wrote:
>>
>>> In article <dsample-F5D403...@news.giganews.com>,
>>> Don Sample <dsa...@synapse.net> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Someone remind me
>>>> to come back to it, after another half dozen episodes or so.
>>>
>>> Don't forget to come back to it after half dozen episodes or so.
>>>
>>> What??
>>
>>
>> Someone remind him, after another half dozen episodes or so, to come
>> back to it.
>>
>> :-)
>
>
> Don, after another half-dozen episodes or so, come back to this one...
>
> ;-)
>
An entire group of right smart asses!
Rowan Hawthorn
Well, you know they say there's one in every crowd; this crowd got
blessed with theirs and several other groups'...
vague disclaimer
You say that like it's a bad thing.
Eric Hunter
> In article <iaydnSfh0Y7o0x7Z...@comcast.com>,
> Eric Hunter <hunt...@comcast.net.invalid> wrote:
>
>>> "I know you. Curds and whey. I know what you are.
>>> You ... don't ... belong ... here."
>> The guy is obviously deranged. His comment wasn't
>> meaningful.... was it?
>
> before and who'd use that in a modern TV show? As if.
I was trying to recall my feelings as I first
watched Season 5. The end of BvD was a jaw-dropper,
and RM was disconcerting, because it wasn't
explaining where Dawn had come from. At the time
my reaction to Deranged Guy was, "Hmm, the Magic
Box is downtown, if the homeless odd-balls view
the corner as theirs.... but he's right, Dawn
doesn't belong there... hmmmmmm..."
Eric.
--
KenM47
Add to the oddity that Dawn did not immediately break down and tell
Tara about crazy guy (or tell anyone else).
Ken (Brooklyn)
lpad...@voicenet.com
AOQ:
It's damn near impossible to respond intelligently to this when you're
asking to leave out all spoilers!
Let me just say that I wasn't a regular viewer of BtVS until Season 6.
I watched very few episodes prior to that, although I did happen to
catch one very critical episode of Season 5 that you haven't gotten to
yet. After I started watching syndicated reruns to get caught up on the
Buffyverse, I realized that I'm not so much a Buffy fan as a Dawnie
fan, and own the DVDs of Seasons 5 through 7 but have no really burning
desire to own any of the earlier ones.
I'm still looking forward to your comments on that one Season 5 episode
and later ones. 'Nuff said!
Eric Hunter
> Eric Hunter wrote:
>> * One Bit Shy wrote, On 6/4/2006 4:20 PM:
>>> "Arbitrar Of Quality" <tsm...@wildmail.com> wrote in message
>>> news:1149397185.5...@c74g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
>
>>>> Remember what I was saying about this show having chutzpah? Well,
>>>> retconning (?) a new character right into the center of the show with
>>>> no actual explanation whatsoever, expecting your audience to accept
>>>> that you know what you're doing without reassurance... that's
>>>> chutzpah.
>>>
>>> I suppose. And I guess there must have been some controversey around it.
>>> It's hard for me to react on those terms since the way I came into this
>>> episode I was already quite familiar with Dawn. That being said, I still
>>> question the viewpoint. Suddenly inserting a 14 year old sister certainly
>>> takes courage. But the lack of reassurance part I don't get.
>>
>> TV convention is that when a new character is introduced,
>> an explanation is provided, like "Cousin Oliver Brady's
>> parents are in South America on business, So he'll be
>> living with us now that Cindy and Bobby have hit puberty."
>> There is no explanation here, no clue about how or why
>> the core cast all know her and treat her like a family
>> member.
>
> Yep. The only indication that the writers are even aware that Dawn is
> an issue is Ranting Guy, and that's just a quick scene.
Yup, and unless you are paying attention, you could
easily dismiss it as something to show that the
Magic Box is on the bad side of town (half a block
from the good side), and Buffy is being a bad sister
by having Dawn stand on the street.
> we're asked to accept a blatant change to the series' continuity
> without an explanation. I don't have a problem with that, I'm just
> sayng that the show has been showing a lot of chutzpah lately, the same
> kind it showed by ending the season with something like "Restless."
Yup. I trusted that we would get a better explanation
than Bobbie in the shower, say, 'What a dream I had!',
but RM was shocking for it not being there.
> It's become a series that demands a lot of audience participation.
You say that like it's a bad thing. ;-)
Eric.
--
Arbitrar Of Quality
> > It's become a series that demands a lot of audience participation.
>
> You say that like it's a bad thing. ;-)
Well, I was trying to say it as a staatement of fact, not inherently
either good or bad. Guess the tone of voice wasn't cear.
-AOQ
Eric Hunter
I didn't actually think you saw it as a bad thing;
I was just joking. The thing that I find so
compelling about Whedon's show is that they do
demand a lot from the audience, instead of dumbing
it down the level of Blue Collar TV.
Eric.
--
Don Sample
"Arbitrar Of Quality" <tsm...@wildmail.com> wrote:
> A reminder: Please avoid spoilers for later episodes in these review
> threads.
>
>
> BUFFY THE VAMPIRE SLAYER
> Season Five, Episode 2: "Real Me"
> (or "Current mood: Annoyed Current music: I Die In Agony - 'Make
> It All Better'")
> Writer: David Fury
> Director: David Grossman
Okay, now that you've see "No Place Like Home" I can comment on some of
this stuff that I couldn't before.
>
> Remember what I was saying about this show having chutzpah? Well,
> retconning (?) a new character right into the center of the show with
> no actual explanation whatsoever, expecting your audience to accept
> that you know what you're doing without reassurance... that's
> chutzpah.
We do get the explanation, eventually.
> Oh yeah, the characters we've been following for the last few years
> are also in "Real Me." Dawn isn't the only Summers who manages
> to think that she has the hardest life in the world and that no one
> could possibly understand how she feels. Her sister's closer to
> being right about it. And we see a little of that from Harmony and
> Willow too, actually; parallels and such. One of the better moments is
> Buffy venting about being saddled with Dawn, and Riley being the voice
> of reason, or at least the advocate for consistency in complaints.
> "Thank you, logic boy. Did I mention this is a rant? Sense really
> has no place in it."
Part of Buffy's rant is that Dawn has recently become even more annoying
than she remembered her being. I think that this is the difference
between her constructed memories, and the actual experience of having a
kid sister.
>
> What's more worrisome is that Dawn
> doesn't seem to have any of her own friends. I wonder if we'll go
> into that at all.
Every friend that Dawn has, is one more person that the Monks would have
to give detailed memories to. I think that everyone remembers Dawn as
being pretty much a loner, without many close friends. She may approach
Marcieness in how much her teachers and classmates noticed her.
>
> Said vampire and minions trigger some scenes in which Xander gets to
> mix schoolyard name-calling with common sense and even a very
> short-lived action-hero moment. This whole sequence, on both sides of
> the commercial break, manages the mix of humor (Anya, lamp-wielder of
> vengeance!) and tension that I think the rest of the episode was trying
> for. Given the sinister ending of RM, I have to wonder whether
> Dawn's invitation was really such an accident. But pure slip-up
> isn't so unrealistic either.
> and second, we once again get a mysterious ending, with Dawn's
> "boy, is she in for a surprise." Could perfectly well be an
> innocent little comment, but is delivered as if there's something
> else going on. In which case it might get explained, someday. The
> "you don't belong here" scene would likely tie into that too.
>
The "sinister ending" was just normal teenage angst coming out. Dawn
just goofed, as 14 year olds are wont to do from time to time.
Arbitrar Of Quality
Don Sample wrote:
> > What's more worrisome is that Dawn
> > doesn't seem to have any of her own friends. I wonder if we'll go
> > into that at all.
>
> Every friend that Dawn has, is one more person that the Monks would have
> to give detailed memories to. I think that everyone remembers Dawn as
> being pretty much a loner, without many close friends. She may approach
> Marcieness in how much her teachers and classmates noticed her.
You know, I've seen a few "Marcie" references, but didn't rememeber to
whom they referred until now. I kept thinking of the _Peanuts_
character.
-AOQ
mariposas rand mair fheal greykitten tomys des anges
"Arbitrar Of Quality" <tsm...@wildmail.com> wrote:
the girl who went invisible and cut cordelia
out of mind out of sight
season one
the penultimate episode
marcie is the one that put the finger on zarkawi in iraq
Don Sample
"Arbitrar Of Quality" <tsm...@wildmail.com> wrote:
The invisible girl, from "Out of Mind, Out of Sight."
Arbitrar Of Quality
Don Sample wrote:
> In article <1150085619.3...@i40g2000cwc.googlegroups.com>,
> "Arbitrar Of Quality" <tsm...@wildmail.com> wrote:
> > You know, I've seen a few "Marcie" references, but didn't rememeber to
> > whom they referred until now. I kept thinking of the _Peanuts_
> > character.
> The invisible girl, from "Out of Mind, Out of Sight."
Yeah, yeah, that was the "until now" part.
-AOQ
(Harmony) Watcher
"mariposas rand mair fheal greykitten tomys des anges"
<mair_...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:mair_fheal-F59CE...@sn-ip.vsrv-sjc.supernews.net...
> In article <1150085619.3...@i40g2000cwc.googlegroups.com>,
> "Arbitrar Of Quality" <tsm...@wildmail.com> wrote:
>
> > Don Sample wrote:
> >
> > > > What's more worrisome is that Dawn
> > > > doesn't seem to have any of her own friends. I wonder if we'll go
> > > > into that at all.
> > >
> > > Every friend that Dawn has, is one more person that the Monks would
have
> > > to give detailed memories to. I think that everyone remembers Dawn as
> > > being pretty much a loner, without many close friends. She may
approach
> > > Marcieness in how much her teachers and classmates noticed her.
> >
> > You know, I've seen a few "Marcie" references, but didn't rememeber to
> > whom they referred until now. I kept thinking of the _Peanuts_
> > character.
>
> the girl who went invisible and cut cordelia
>
> out of mind out of sight
> season one
> the penultimate episode
>
>
==Harmony Watcher==