AOQ Angel Review 1-21: "Blind Date"
Arbitrar Of Quality
episodes in these review threads
ANGEL
Season One, Episode 21: "Blind Date")
(or "Did John Grisham ghost-write this one, by any chance?")
Writer: Jeannine Renshaw
Director: Thomas J. Wright
"Blind Date" is like four different episodes wrapped up into one.
That in itself isn't a bad thing if they mesh, which I think they do.
Since the least interesting one is the one we see first, I didn't
think I was going to be a happy camper. That's because we start with
yet another gimmicky demon-thing, and one using one of the oldest
absurd devices in the book (blind person who succeeds through
heightening other senses. Fantasy Stock Plot #53). The aftermath of
the courtroom scene annoyed me too, because given the outcome of the
case with no buildup, I was wondering if Angel's brief visit was
supposed to be imagined or something. And Boreanaz's acting briefly
falters during the hokey "if they won't even put it behind bars"
part. But then, starting with the end of act one, things change. BD
turns out to not be about the blind woman - who's fully human, by
the way - at all (her actor doesn't even qualify for a "guest
star" billing). Things rather quickly take a few turns for the
interesting once Lindsey decides he wants out of the firm.
Show #2 emerges here. It's about a crisis of faith for a man who's
dulled his conscience, but can't totally ignore it. Happily, this is
the storyline that ends up dominating the episode. I quite liked
Angel's hostility towards Lindsey's change of heart early on;
that's probably my favorite scene. An impassioned speech about how
growing up poor shapes one's worldview gets met with "I'm sorry,
I nodded off. Did you get to the part where you're evil?" He's
convinced that he knows what redemption is about, and Mr. McDonald is
going to have to do better than this. "You're panicking right now.
You can't believe how bad you let things get. That's not change."
Someone (i.e. not me) might want to do an involved comparison between
how he treats this guy compared to Faith.
And then for a little while, as our heroes hunt for files, we move into
Episode #3, a "caper" show. That lasts just long enough to build
some suspense, and not so long that it stops being fun. You've got
the coordinated timings and synchronized watches between people
operating in different parts of the building. You've got Lindsey
randomly being delayed by Lilah in the hallway, and having to act
casual while still reaching the next location in time. You've got a
few minor Batman moments in the sewer. You've even got someone
showing up to be the distraction. Gunn's impromptu monologue is
something that I enjoyed a lot despite (or perhaps because of) how
obvious and dumb the jokes are. "Are you assaulting me - up in this
haven of justice?" "You all can cater to the demon, cater to the
dead man, but what about the black man?" Well, I was amused.
Show #4 in my classification scheme is the thing about the prophecy.
I'm pretty cold on the destiny and ancient scrolls and whatnot, both
in terms of content and the way they're introduced. They aren't
too relevant to this episode, but hopefully our crack staff will have
time to make that more interesting.
Very nice music during the pan over the W&H lobby as Lindsey makes his
return.
I think the reason I enjoyed BD so much is that I really didn't know
which way things were going to go, ever. This episode sets up so many
situations in which two outcomes seem about equally likely. On a
microcosm sense, let's look at the scene in which the mind-reading
demons conduct their search of the L.M.s. Lindsey has to face up to
them and look fearless. To a first-time viewer, there're different
possibilities. Will they discover him, or will their power turn out to
be fake? Does Lee's execution (what'll ATS do without its
designated punching-bag?) mean Lindsey's off the hook, or is it all a
show for his benefit? And in the latter event, is the goal to try to
make our would-be hero lower his guard, or is it an example designed to
teach him? Then he's called to stay behind; is it because they've
found him out, because they want to promote him, or even both at once?
And Lindsey's story continues with moments like that. The second
time he's given the you-can-go-far speech, it feels damn near 50/50
trying to figure out whether he'll side with W&H or with Angel. And
when he does the latter, and seems to really mean it, he goes back one
more time; will his bosses kill him, or is he still passing their test?
The response to the final temptation isn't telegraphed or obvious
even a moment before he slowly walks to the door... to close it.
Nicely done, show.
Holland sure likes to give the speeches, huh? This guy gets a lot of
screentime in large chunks, and his delivery and dialogue aren't
particularly entertaining. Although the characters aren't exactly
the same, I can't help but unfavorably compare him to Mayor Wilkins,
the reasoned voice of opportunism who takes a personal interest in his
protégés. I'd say the long Holland scenes are my biggest complaint
about "Blind Date," and the main source of its occasional pacing
problems. I'm hoping that his purpose was just to help move
Lindsey's story along. We'll see.
Cordelia's getting computer help from Willow again! It's like
we've come full circle. Or not. The light moments in BD aren't
actively hilarious, but they strike just enough irreverence to be well
matched with the more serious stuff. And the best example of a scene
that's a blast despite not being laugh-out-loud funny is that whole
phone conversation.
Fun wacky camera work during the Chameleon Angel fight at the end.
The last shot is what it should be, possibly setting the stage for the
finale next week. The series seems to be going somewhere for once.
And you know, between Rohm, Kane and Richards, it's like ATS actually
has a supporting cast now.
So...
One-sentence summary: Interesting in a quiet way.
AOQ rating: Good
[Season One so far:
1) "City Of" - Good
2) "Lonely Hearts" - Weak
3) "Into The Dark" - Good
4) "I Fall To Pieces" - Good
5) "Rm W/ A Vu" - Decent
6) "Sense And Sensitivity" - Weak
7) "The Bachelor Party" - Decent
8) "I Will Remember You" - Excellent
9) "Hero" - Good
10) "Parting Gifts" - Decent
11) "Somnambulist" - Good
12) "Expecting" - Bad
13) "She" - Good
14) "I've Got You Under My Skin" - Decent
15) "The Prodigal" - Decent
16) "The Ring" - Decent
17) "Eternity" - Decent
18) "Five By Five" - Excellent
19) "Sanctuary" - Excellent
20) "War Zone" - Decent
21) "Blind Date" - Good]
Slayah
Quality says...
BD
>turns out to not be about the blind woman - who's fully human, by
>the way -
And Angel killed her. I don't know why that sort of shocked me, but it did.
Great review! I liked this episode a lot, which ended up being a nice surprise,
but because like you say, it was mostly about show # 2...and Gunn's awesome
monologue in the lobby.
"Oh - Willow says 'Hey'"
--
One Bit Shy
news:e57nl...@drn.newsguy.com...
> In article <1148673487....@38g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>, Arbitrar
> Of
> Quality says...
>
> BD
>>turns out to not be about the blind woman - who's fully human, by
>>the way -
>
> And Angel killed her. I don't know why that sort of shocked me, but it
> did.
That slipped right past me. But in retrospect, the doctor in I Fall to
Pieces was human too. I guess Angel has moved into a realm of humans acting
like demons being fair game.
OBS
One Bit Shy
news:1148673487....@38g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
> ANGEL
> Season One, Episode 21: "Blind Date")
> (or "Did John Grisham ghost-write this one, by any chance?")
Why Grisham?
> So...
> One-sentence summary: Interesting in a quiet way.
> AOQ rating: Good
I think I'll mainly let your review stand as to the impression of the show -
and the rating.
I think I enjoyed the caper the most and the blind girl the least - though
she is kinda cute with that hint of freckles on her cheeks. The business
with the mind readers was pretty cool too. I'm not sure if you consider
that in the caper or Lindsey's crisis of faith.
What you refer to as the prophecy show matters to me a bit more. Not for
it's in show content, but for the promise of things to come. One of my
principal objections to Angel so far has been no sense of it going anywhere.
The one thing I really disliked was how simply saying the word, "children"
would induce the crisis of confidence. Feels cheap to me.
So I mainly enjoyed it and am happy to let this show be the fun it is.
However, to me, this show also made a kind of a promise towards the future
in the way it handled a number of elements. Something I see as a kind of a
test for what the series will live up to.
A) "The hokey 'if they won't even put it behind bars' part" as you put it
really isn't played very well. But that aside, this appears to again go to
Angel's frustration with not making a difference that I observed the prior
episode. Here he seems ready to force the issue with W&H more directly.
(An interesting juxtaposition to Lindsey's decision a couple of episodes ago
to deal with him through the legal system. They do seem to be frustrating
each other.) This is a relatively small thing - especially since the caper
may have gotten some of that out of Angel's system and we have new
complications to get in the way. But I'll still be disappointed in any
return to Angel, gentleman vampire detective. There's got to be more edge
than that.
B) The really big thing in this episode to me is the way that W&H handled
Lindsey's crisis of confidence. Indeed, it looks more like they pushed him
into it. I don't find it credible that if his various recent failings
*really* hurt them that he would be alive now, let alone in the office he
is. This leads to a few implications, I believe.
- The blind girl wasn't really important to any clients. That one seems
fairly obvious actually. For all her cool moves, she was just an assassin
that couldn't achieve much more than any hired killer with a gun. Getting
her off on the murder charge mattered so that she wouldn't talk. But now
that she's in the police's eye, she's probably a liability. So I assume W&H
wanted her dead all along.
- But, if they were happy to have her dead, what about the kids - the seers?
Seeing as how their existance was fed to Lindsey, I would assume that W&H
wanted them alive. Ooops. That suggests to me that the seers should be
trouble for Angel.
- The disks may be more problematic, I'm not sure. It may be that there's
nothing truly useful on them and that Lindsey copying things from them has
deluded himself as to their ability to protect him. That may be the best
scenario. Otherwise it looks already a bit off kilter. Why would Angel let
Lindsey keep them? Or has he made copies himself? Lindsey didn't act like
it.
- The scroll had to be there on purpose - meant for Angel to find. That
doesn't mean it might not be useful to him. W&H could be gambling some
here. But I think there has to be something terribly dangerous to Angel in
it.
- How will Lindsey show himself to Angel now? Attempt to disguise his new
job? That could be interesting, though awfully tricky, and not a typical
play for someone in an office like that. On the other hand, if Angel finds
out that Lindsey's a big cheese now, wouldn't he be able to figure out all
of the items above?
Just some thoughts.
OBS
mariposas rand mair fheal greykitten tomys des anges
> that she's in the police's eye, she's probably a liability. So I assume W&H
> wanted her dead all along.
or perhaps wolfram and hart are playing for the long term
and they can tolerate a few setbacks
successful businesses take losses from time to time
they dont fixate on every loss but on the net profit
lindsey cost them today
but over the years to come they might get far more out of him
than a singles day loss
arf meow arf - nsa fodder
ny dnrqn greebevfz ahpyrne obzo vena gnyvona ovt oebgure
if you meet buddha on the usenet killfile him
One Bit Shy
<mair_...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:mair_fheal-17E58...@sn-ip.vsrv-sjc.supernews.net...
>> her off on the murder charge mattered so that she wouldn't talk. But now
>> that she's in the police's eye, she's probably a liability. So I assume
>> W&H
>> wanted her dead all along.
>
> or perhaps wolfram and hart are playing for the long term
> and they can tolerate a few setbacks
>
> successful businesses take losses from time to time
> they dont fixate on every loss but on the net profit
>
> lindsey cost them today
> but over the years to come they might get far more out of him
> than a singles day loss
That might make for a good story tomorrow, but it would be a very
disappointing statement on what they did with this episode's story IMO.
They didn't have to set up Lindsey's crisis of faith in the fashion they did
if that's where they were going.
OBS
Arbitrar Of Quality
One Bit Shy wrote:
> "Arbitrar Of Quality" <tsm...@wildmail.com> wrote in message
> news:1148673487....@38g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
>
> > ANGEL
> > Season One, Episode 21: "Blind Date")
> > (or "Did John Grisham ghost-write this one, by any chance?")
>
> Why Grisham?
Corrupt law firm + morally conflicted lawyer organizes a caper to steal
files.
> - The scroll had to be there on purpose - meant for Angel to find. That
> doesn't mean it might not be useful to him. W&H could be gambling some
> here. But I think there has to be something terribly dangerous to Angel in
> it.
I don't really see where this conclusion comes from. Even if
everything else was planned out, which I'm not convinced of, how could
anyone have known which rooms Angel would swing past. (And I know the
scroll was calling to him or whatever, but that doesn't prove anything
either way.)
-AOQ
Apteryx
news:1148673487....@38g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
>episodes in these review threads
>Show #2 emerges here. It's about a crisis of faith for a man who's
>dulled his conscience, but can't totally ignore it. Happily, this is
>the storyline that ends up dominating the episode. I quite liked
>Angel's hostility towards Lindsey's change of heart early on;
>that's probably my favorite scene. An impassioned speech about how
>growing up poor shapes one's worldview gets met with "I'm sorry,
>I nodded off. Did you get to the part where you're evil?" He's
>convinced that he knows what redemption is about, and Mr. McDonald is
>going to have to do better than this. "You're panicking right now.
>You can't believe how bad you let things get. That's not change."
>Someone (i.e. not me) might want to do an involved comparison between
>how he treats this guy compared to Faith.
He's not totally unfair, because Lyndsey's redemption seems so fake. There
is the fact that it is blind children that supposedly cause him to jump
ship, and then there is that poverty story that seems to come straight from
the Depression - Lyndsey doesn't look that old. For me there was initial
doubt as to whether it seemed fake because Lyndsey was setting Angel up, or
because the writers just couldn't do a better job. But in the end this scene
was redeemed for me by the knowledge from the ending that Lyndsey's efforts
at redemption weren't so much fake as just half-arsed.
>One-sentence summary: Interesting in a quiet way.
>AOQ rating: Good
I don't think I would go any further than a good Decent, but it is one of
the better Faith-less episodes from the 2nd half of the season. For me, it's
the 60th best AtS episode, 11th best in Season 1.
--
Apteryx
Apteryx
news:127f31i...@news.supernews.com...
> "Arbitrar Of Quality" <tsm...@wildmail.com> wrote in message
> news:1148673487....@38g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
>
>> ANGEL
>> Season One, Episode 21: "Blind Date")
>> (or "Did John Grisham ghost-write this one, by any chance?")
>
> Why Grisham?
As opposed to Margaret Atwood?
--
Apteryx
Elisi
rolled into one! :)
I like W&H very much - as the only Big Bad we've seen so far it's a
very good change from BtVS. It's face is human and it can't be killed.
The problems are completely different from those on Buffy and showcase
the different styles of the shows rather well.
I adore Gunn here! :)
The blind woman freaks me out - I think it's the eyes.
I must confess to liking Holland a lot. True he doesn't have The
Mayor's charisma, but then he's a lawyer! His almost fatherly facade,
combined with the underlying ruthlessness works very well - especially
considering that he's a bit dull - like a boss you might have in RL.
Lastly a tidbit on info that you might not know - Christian Kane
originally auditioned for the role of Riley! And Joss liked him so much
that he gave him a job on AtS instead. And lucky for us that he did! :)
gree...@gmail.com
Arbitrar Of Quality wrote:
> (her actor doesn't even qualify for a "guest
> star" billing).
Jennifer Badger Martin, who is usually the stunt double for Cordelia
and Drusilla. I think she doubled Faith once too. Maybe as she was
already contracted to ME, she wasn't able to negotiate that guest star
billing.
> I quite liked
> Angel's hostility towards Lindsey's change of heart early on;
> that's probably my favorite scene.
You'd be amazed (or maybe not) at how many people thought Angel was
being hard on poor Lindsey here. Apparently being an evil SOB is okay
as long as the evil SOB is pretty. Who knew?
> Someone (i.e. not me) might want to do an involved comparison between
> how he treats this guy compared to Faith.
You'd have to start first with how Faith was compared to Lindsey.
> Gunn's impromptu monologue is
> something that I enjoyed a lot despite (or perhaps because of) how
> obvious and dumb the jokes are.
Not to prejudice you or anything, but it's Gunn's finest moment.
> They aren't
> too relevant to this episode, but hopefully our crack staff will have
> time to make that more interesting.
It could happen...
> AOQ rating: Good
And here, not kind enough. If ever an episode deserved an excellent, it
is "Blind Date".
Terry
kenm47
Slayah wrote:
> In article <1148673487....@38g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>, Arbitrar Of
> Quality says...
>
> BD
> >turns out to not be about the blind woman - who's fully human, by
> >the way -
>
> And Angel killed her. I don't know why that sort of shocked me, but it did.
>
Well, Buffy killed humans too. As here, in self defense.
Ken (Brooklyn)
mariposas rand mair fheal greykitten tomys des anges
"Arbitrar Of Quality" <tsm...@wildmail.com> wrote:
> One Bit Shy wrote:
> > "Arbitrar Of Quality" <tsm...@wildmail.com> wrote in message
> > news:1148673487....@38g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
> >
> > > ANGEL
> > > Season One, Episode 21: "Blind Date")
> > > (or "Did John Grisham ghost-write this one, by any chance?")
> >
> > Why Grisham?
>
> Corrupt law firm + morally conflicted lawyer organizes a caper to steal
> files.
what makes you think wolfram and hart are corrupt?
in their view they might be stelling characters
having to deal with a corrupted world
and half human demon hybrids like angel
they might be seeing themselves as bulwarks
against the true evil and horror
a world without shrimp fr instances
peachy ashie passion
> In article <1148707339.7...@y43g2000cwc.googlegroups.com>,
> "Arbitrar Of Quality" <tsm...@wildmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>>One Bit Shy wrote:
>>
>>>"Arbitrar Of Quality" <tsm...@wildmail.com> wrote in message
>>>news:1148673487....@38g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
>>>
>>>
>>>>ANGEL
>>>>Season One, Episode 21: "Blind Date")
>>>>(or "Did John Grisham ghost-write this one, by any chance?")
>>>
>>>Why Grisham?
>>
>>Corrupt law firm + morally conflicted lawyer organizes a caper to steal
>>files.
>
>
> what makes you think wolfram and hart are corrupt?
> in their view they might be stelling characters
> having to deal with a corrupted world
> and half human demon hybrids like angel
>
From dictionary.com
1. Marked by immorality and perversion; depraved.
2. Venal; dishonest: a corrupt mayor.
3. Containing errors or alterations, as a text: a corrupt translation.
4. Archaic. Tainted; putrid.
None of those talk about intentions.. in other words, how they see
themselves is not relevant to the definition. They are judged by their
actions.
One Bit Shy
>
> One Bit Shy wrote:
>> "Arbitrar Of Quality" <tsm...@wildmail.com> wrote in message
>> news:1148673487....@38g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
>>
>> > ANGEL
>> > Season One, Episode 21: "Blind Date")
>> > (or "Did John Grisham ghost-write this one, by any chance?")
>>
>> Why Grisham?
>
> Corrupt law firm + morally conflicted lawyer organizes a caper to steal
> files.
Of course. A man of slow wit I was that day.
>> - The scroll had to be there on purpose - meant for Angel to find. That
>> doesn't mean it might not be useful to him. W&H could be gambling some
>> here. But I think there has to be something terribly dangerous to Angel
>> in
>> it.
>
> I don't really see where this conclusion comes from. Even if
> everything else was planned out, which I'm not convinced of, how could
> anyone have known which rooms Angel would swing past. (And I know the
> scroll was calling to him or whatever, but that doesn't prove anything
> either way.)
I don't think I was sufficiently clear. It all comes down to my questioning
how serious the show is. The episode played to me like a constructed
test/rite of passage for Lindsey. Something W&H was doing to him as part of
his prep for greater things. Which I think would be fine. That would be a
very interesting and aggressive approach that I very much approve of. It
gives the episode hidden layers and sets up a bunch of misunderstandings for
characters all around and plants landmines for the future. That would be
cool.
But if it's really just the surface appearance of Lindsey happening to hear
some info that shakes his faith, causing trouble, an then being forgiven and
promoted, then my estimation of the show goes way down. There's no depth
left - what you see is what you get. And the setup for Lindsey's crisis,
instead of being planted, is just forced. The firm is weeding out its dead
weight and choosing those to move on. Lindsey's had a tough year and the
pressure's on. Blind girl's got important things to do... Let's choose
that moment to say the thing to send Lindsey running. Intentional or
accidental? Which makes for the more interesting plotting?
Getting to your question. If Lindsey was provoked into the crisis
intentionally, then the information given to him about the blind girl was
part of the plan. That information was sufficient to know something was
amiss, but not specific enough to act upon. The specific information was
stored in one place. (By this scenario - planted.) That's the same room
that the scroll is in. That's how they would know Angel would pass by it.
If this wasn't a set up by W&H, then that brings up a different issue
(beyond just not being as interesting). W&H knew Lindsey had betrayed them
*before* the confrontation with the blind girl. They knew their vault had
been breeched and what had been stolen.
Why didn't they pull the blind girl back? If they really wanted the seers
dead, why didn't they send a different assassin to intercept them somewhere
else? They basically sent her into a trap - knowingly.
OBS
mariposas rand mair fheal greykitten tomys des anges
we only see their actions through angels eyes
BTR1701
<mair_fheal-1434B...@sn-ip.vsrv-sjc.supernews.net>,
mariposas rand mair fheal greykitten tomys des anges
No, the story is quite obviously told through the omniscient point of
view. Angel never saw that meeting at Wolfram & Hart between Faith and
Mercer, McDonald and Morgan. But we the audience did.
The audience knows a lot of things that Angel doesn't.
Mel
Elisi wrote:
> This is one of my favourite episodes in Sesaon 1 - so much goodnesss
> rolled into one! :)
>
> I like W&H very much - as the only Big Bad we've seen so far it's a
> very good change from BtVS. It's face is human and it can't be killed.
> The problems are completely different from those on Buffy and showcase
> the different styles of the shows rather well.
>
> I adore Gunn here! :)
>
> The blind woman freaks me out - I think it's the eyes.
Watching this episode so close together with "Primeval" I saw a
startling resemblance between Vanessa and ComboBuffy. It was kind of weird.
Mel
Slayah
>
>"Slayah" <Sla...@hellmouth.com> wrote in message
>news:e57nl...@drn.newsguy.com...
>> In article <1148673487....@38g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>, Arbitrar
>> Of
>> Quality says...
>>
>> BD
>>>turns out to not be about the blind woman - who's fully human, by
>>>the way -
>>
>> And Angel killed her. I don't know why that sort of shocked me, but it
>> did.
>
>That slipped right past me.
It slipped right past me my first two viewings! I don't know why this third time
it struck me.
But in retrospect, the doctor in I Fall to
>Pieces was human too. I guess Angel has moved into a realm of humans acting
>like demons being fair game.
Wow the doctor, that's right -slipped by me 3 times. I guess his detachable body
parts made him seem like more of a demon to me.
--
Slayah
>Lastly a tidbit on info that you might not know - Christian Kane
>originally auditioned for the role of Riley! And Joss liked him so much
>that he gave him a job on AtS instead. And lucky for us that he did! :)
That is so cool! Thanks for the tidbit.
--
Slayah
says...
What humans did B kill, I don't remember. Generic bad guys?
--
KenM47
Killed, caused the death, failed to rescue:
The zookeeper in The Pack, the "Watcher" Gwendolyn Post in
Revelations, the coach in Go Fish (naq gur xavtugf yngre) .
Ken (Brooklyn)
Don Sample
wrote:
To this point:
- Dr. Weirick, the zookeeper in 'The Pack'
- Gwendolin Post in 'Revelations'
- Hans and Frans, the assassins in 'Homecoming'
- Coach Marin in 'Go Fish'
- and possibly the one eyed assassin in 'What's My Line' (Only
possibly, because he may not have been human, they never really
say.)
--
Quando omni flunkus moritati
Visit the Buffy Body Count at <http://homepage.mac.com/dsample/>
Arbitrar Of Quality
> Lastly a tidbit on info that you might not know - Christian Kane
> originally auditioned for the role of Riley! And Joss liked him so much
> that he gave him a job on AtS instead. And lucky for us that he did! :)
Yeah, stories like that are cool. I'm wondering wheter he'd have been
able to handle Riley better than Blucas... I tend to think it's the
writing for the character that's unweildy rather than the performance.
But Kane shows a lot of charisma on ATS, so who knows?
-AOQ
Arbitrar Of Quality
One Bit Shy wrote:
> "Arbitrar Of Quality" <tsm...@wildmail.com> wrote in message
> news:1148707339.7...@y43g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
> >
> > One Bit Shy wrote:
> >> "Arbitrar Of Quality" <tsm...@wildmail.com> wrote in message
> >> - The scroll had to be there on purpose - meant for Angel to find. That
> >> doesn't mean it might not be useful to him. W&H could be gambling some
> >> here. But I think there has to be something terribly dangerous to Angel
> >> in
> >> it.
> >
> > I don't really see where this conclusion comes from. Even if
> > everything else was planned out, which I'm not convinced of, how could
> > anyone have known which rooms Angel would swing past. (And I know the
> > scroll was calling to him or whatever, but that doesn't prove anything
> > either way.)
>
> I don't think I was sufficiently clear. It all comes down to my questioning
> how serious the show is. The episode played to me like a constructed
> test/rite of passage for Lindsey. Something W&H was doing to him as part of
> his prep for greater things. Which I think would be fine. That would be a
> very interesting and aggressive approach that I very much approve of. It
> gives the episode hidden layers and sets up a bunch of misunderstandings for
> characters all around and plants landmines for the future. That would be
> cool.
It'd be kinda cool, but I tend to be wary of characters who can stage
hugely elaborate events and predict extacly what'll happen too
accurately. That's always seemed like lazy writing.
> But if it's really just the surface appearance of Lindsey happening to hear
> some info that shakes his faith, causing trouble, an then being forgiven and
> promoted, then my estimation of the show goes way down. There's no depth
> left - what you see is what you get. And the setup for Lindsey's crisis,
> instead of being planted, is just forced. The firm is weeding out its dead
> weight and choosing those to move on. Lindsey's had a tough year and the
> pressure's on. Blind girl's got important things to do... Let's choose
> that moment to say the thing to send Lindsey running. Intentional or
> accidental? Which makes for the more interesting plotting?
I'd suggest that there's also the possibility of something in between,
in which it's not all premeditated, but W&H decide to ad-lib and see
where things go. The kids may or may not have originally been intended
as a last test in this scenario, but in any case, evaluating this guy
they've been grooming for Partnership takes priority over other ongoing
issues for them. A client or two is expendable.
-AOQ
George W Harris
<tsm...@wildmail.com> wrote:
:I'd suggest that there's also the possibility of something in between,
:in which it's not all premeditated, but W&H decide to ad-lib and see
:where things go. The kids may or may not have originally been intended
:as a last test in this scenario, but in any case, evaluating this guy
:they've been grooming for Partnership takes priority over other ongoing
:issues for them. A client or two is expendable.
I think this is the most likely scenario.
Also of note is the *nature* of Lindsey's conflict.
On the one hadn we have Lee, who is toying with
betraying Wolfram * Hart, but his betrayal is purely
avaricious. Lindsey, on the other hand, is suffering a
*moral* conflict, and Holland Manners believes (perhaps
from experience) that suffering through this type of crisis
will make Lindsey a much more valuable partner.
:-AOQ
--
Doesn't the fact that there are *exactly* 50 states seem a little suspicious?
George W. Harris For actual email address, replace each 'u' with an 'i'
One Bit Shy
Oh, it's a dangerous direction to go. That's what grabbed my attention. Do
it wrong and it would suck. But do it right and lots of possibilities open
up. That's why I called it a test. What is the writing up to? From what I
could see of the episode, enough pieces fit to make it plausible - depending
on follow-up.
Evidently, from the nature of comments I'm seeing, that's not the chosen
direction. Presumably the story pretty much as it appears on the surface
is. And my problem there is that the setup for Lindsey is just too damned
pat. Feels forced to me.
OBS
William George Ferguson
>Arbitrar Of Quality wrote:
>
>> (her actor doesn't even qualify for a "guest
>> star" billing).
>
>Jennifer Badger Martin, who is usually the stunt double for Cordelia
>and Drusilla. I think she doubled Faith once too. Maybe as she was
>already contracted to ME, she wasn't able to negotiate that guest star
>billing.
She doubled Faith more than once. Karen Shepard, who is a near legendary
martial arts stunt person and actress, did virtually all the hand to hand
fighting stunt work for Faith, but she wasn't rated for high falls, so
Jennifer Martin did the backwards fall into the truck at the end of
Graduation Day Pt.1.
>> I quite liked
>> Angel's hostility towards Lindsey's change of heart early on;
>> that's probably my favorite scene.
>
>You'd be amazed (or maybe not) at how many people thought Angel was
>being hard on poor Lindsey here. Apparently being an evil SOB is okay
>as long as the evil SOB is pretty. Who knew?
Well that isn't something they've ever done for anyone else <cough>Spike,
Faith</cough>
--
HERBERT
1996 - 1997
Beloved Mascot
Delightful Meal
He fed the Pack
A little
BTR1701
William George Ferguson <wmgf...@newsguy.com> wrote:
> On 27 May 2006 03:10:50 -0700, gree...@gmail.com wrote:
>
> >Arbitrar Of Quality wrote:
> >
> >> (her actor doesn't even qualify for a "guest
> >> star" billing).
> >
> >Jennifer Badger Martin, who is usually the stunt double for Cordelia
> >and Drusilla. I think she doubled Faith once too. Maybe as she was
> >already contracted to ME, she wasn't able to negotiate that guest star
> >billing.
>
> She doubled Faith more than once. Karen Shepard, who is a near legendary
> martial arts stunt person and actress, did virtually all the hand to hand
> fighting stunt work for Faith, but she wasn't rated for high falls, so
> Jennifer Martin did the backwards fall into the truck at the end of
> Graduation Day Pt.1.
How does one get rated for high falls without actually, you know,
falling from high places?
Daniel Damouth
> Elisi wrote:
>
>> Lastly a tidbit on info that you might not know - Christian Kane
>> originally auditioned for the role of Riley! And Joss liked him
>> so much that he gave him a job on AtS instead. And lucky for us
>> that he did! :)
>
> Yeah, stories like that are cool. I'm wondering wheter he'd have
> been able to handle Riley better than Blucas... I tend to think
> it's the writing for the character that's unweildy rather than the
> performance.
I agree. The writing defined the character Riley; the actor was cast
for the part, because they matched. (And, metaparenthetically, I
always find it charming to encounter another literate poster who (like
me) doesn't use a spell checker.)
> But Kane shows a lot of charisma on ATS, so who knows?
Both charming, but with a different kind of charisma, I think. Blucas
is great at projecting a charming sincerity. Kane is great at facile
irony.
-Dan Damouth
Don Sample
BTR1701 <btr...@ix.netcom.com> wrote:
Like many things, you take lessons. You do dozens of low falls, working
your way up to high falls. Most of this will be done far away from the
cameras. Karen Shepard is a fight specialist, who hadn't gone through
the training to do falls.