We *Really* Don't Want This Grandchild!
DanaPointe
SALEM, N.H. (AP) - A Maine couple upset that their 19-year-old daughter
was pregnant tied her up, loaded her in their car and began driving to
New York to force her to get an abortion, police said.
The daughter, Katelyn Kampf, escaped Friday at a shopping center and
called police, who arrested her parents, Nicholas Kampf, 54, and Lola,
53, of North Yarmouth, Maine. They were jailed on a kidnapping charge
and were being held on $100,000 bail each.
The parents were scheduled to be arraigned in Salem District Court. A
call to attorney Mark Sisti was not immediately returned.
"Her parents chased her out into the yard, grabbed and tied her hands
and feet together," Salem Police Officer Sean Marino wrote in a court
affidavit. "Katelyn states that her father then carried her to their
car and they headed toward New Hampshire."
Investigators said rope, duct tape, scissors and a .22-caliber rifle
were found in the Kampfs' Lexus and Nicholas Kampf had a loaded
.22-caliber magazine clip in his pants pocket.
The Kampfs were upset that their daughter was pregnant by a man who is
now in jail, police said, and before leaving Maine on Friday they had
an argument at the parents' home.
"Katelyn stated to me that upon her parents finding out that she was
pregnant, they told her she had no choice but to get an abortion,"
Marino wrote in his court affidavit.
Katelyn Kampf escaped from her parents in Salem after persuading them
to untie her so she could use a Kmart bathroom. After her father went
into the men's room, she used a cell phone to call for help, then ran
to a nearby Staples store, where police found "a hysterical female
hiding in the back of the store," according to the affidavit.
She got into Marino's cruiser while Sgt. Kristin Fili pulled over her
parents.
"They told us initially they did take her here against her will, but
they denied tying her up initially," Fili said. "Obviously what
happened was a crime. She was taken against her will."
Authorities in Maine said the parents apparently thought that, in light
of their daughter's stage of pregnancy and the different abortion laws
in each state, the abortion should be performed in New York. Fili said
she did not know how many weeks pregnant she was.
Maine law prohibits abortions once a fetus is able to live outside the
uterus unless the mother's life or health is at stake. The law does not
specify when that is, but it generally is 20 to 27 weeks, said Dr. Dora
Ann Mills, director of the Maine Center for Disease Control and
Prevention. New York law prohibits abortions after the 24th week of
pregnancy unless the woman's life is at stake.
Carmen
Holy crap! I wonder what they planned to do at the doctor's office?
Is that where the rifle was going to come in? To force him/her to do
the abortion at gunpoint? Damn. Katelyn isn't ever going to be able
to trust her parents again.
Carmen
yD
Maybe her dad will get put in the same cell as his daughter's
boyfriend. That'd be nice!
yD
>
> Carmen
-L.
DanaPointe wrote:
> Couple Accused of Kidnapping Daughter
>
> SALEM, N.H. (AP) - A Maine couple upset that their 19-year-old daughter
> was pregnant tied her up, loaded her in their car and began driving to
> New York to force her to get an abortion, police said.
>
> The daughter, Katelyn Kampf, escaped Friday at a shopping center and
> called police, who arrested her parents, Nicholas Kampf, 54, and Lola,
> 53, of North Yarmouth, Maine. They were jailed on a kidnapping charge
> and were being held on $100,000 bail each.
This is so stupid and so sad. So many loving families are waiting to
adopt. I wish more pregnant women in need would consider giving their
child the gift of a better life than they, themselves can give the
child.
-L.
Carmen
Huh? This woman didn't want an abortion. Her parents were trying to
get her one by force. This was a kidnapping.
BTW, as an adult adoptee, I can honestly say adoption isn't all it's
cracked up to be. People *are* still bought and sold in this country,
they just aren't all black. They come in all colors, and the human
traffic is called "closed adoption".
Carmen
Carmen
The parents are being held in New Hampshire, while the boyfriend is
back in a Maine jail. It is an interesting mental picture though. <G>
Carmen
scooter34
It is stupid and sad, but what I see as stupid and sad is that the girl
didn't utilize birth control and prevent this in the first place. My
guess is that Mom and Dad wanted her to abort because they didn't want
to raise the child.
scooter34
JonesieCat
"Carmen" <carm...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1158613402....@h48g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
Here's an old couple who won't be invited to Grandparents Day. And everybody
will feel sorry for them...
jc (Nah - they'll fall in love with their daughter's baby, she'll forgive
them and all will live happily ever after. It COULD happen. Couldn't it?)
(Don't answer that.)
A.
Hey, Carmen - that's oh so true. I'm an adoptee too. I know someone,
right now, who was a black market baby - he's 17, and just finding out
the story. I wonder if people think "black market babies" are, in
general,
black...I'll bet some do.
A.
b
sorry but i find that an odd thing to say
how do you know she didn't have the child on purpose? and she is living
w- her boyfriend's family..... so presumably they are supporting her
and the child
and how could they be "forced" into raising a child
there's no justification for bullying/coercing etc someone into killing
a child, let alone a child that they want..... and if they had
succeeded, even if not by force, how would that have impacted the
daughter's health, mental and otherwise?
it's not a choice i'd make personally (to have a child in this
situation) but i'm not one for staing that circumstances should
determine whether a child lives or dies.....
in this case the parents were wealthy and issues at hand were shame (nb
i'm not saying that poorer parents wouldn't be ashamed too but chances
are the boyfriend has an income difference)...... also the boyfriend's
father was in prison.... all embarassing to people who care how they
appear to others...... and, because of the ferocity of the parents'
attack, i can't help but wonder if there wasn't a fear of miscegenation
as well
b
Thank you for stating that......
Carmen
A. wrote:
> Carmen wrote:
> > -L. wrote:
> > > DanaPointe wrote:
> > > > Couple Accused of Kidnapping Daughter
> > > >
> > > > SALEM, N.H. (AP) - A Maine couple upset that their 19-year-old daughter
> > > > was pregnant tied her up, loaded her in their car and began driving to
> > > > New York to force her to get an abortion, police said.
> > > >
> > > > The daughter, Katelyn Kampf, escaped Friday at a shopping center and
> > > > called police, who arrested her parents, Nicholas Kampf, 54, and Lola,
> > > > 53, of North Yarmouth, Maine. They were jailed on a kidnapping charge
> > > > and were being held on $100,000 bail each.
> > >
> > > This is so stupid and so sad. So many loving families are waiting to
> > > adopt. I wish more pregnant women in need would consider giving their
> > > child the gift of a better life than they, themselves can give the
> > > child.
> >
> > Huh? This woman didn't want an abortion. Her parents were trying to
> > get her one by force. This was a kidnapping.
> >
> > BTW, as an adult adoptee, I can honestly say adoption isn't all it's
> > cracked up to be. People *are* still bought and sold in this country,
> > they just aren't all black. They come in all colors, and the human
> > traffic is called "closed adoption".
> >
> > Carmen
>
> Hey, Carmen - that's oh so true. I'm an adoptee too.
Then you know what I mean. Maybe someday (in our lifetimes?) all
adoptions will be open and all the records will be opened so we can get
that part of who we are back. <Brace for it A.>
> I know someone,
> right now, who was a black market baby - he's 17, and just finding out
> the story. I wonder if people think "black market babies" are, in
> general, black...I'll bet some do.
The term "black market" (designer knock-offs, drugs, booze) has gotten
so widely used I'd like to think even your average booger-eating moron
could extrapolate from what they already know to figure out that the
babies in question could be any race.
I feel for that 17-year-old. Lot of issues to work through
emotionally. Hopefully the adoptive parents won't make it worse by
stonewalling now. Sigh.
Carmen
>
> A.
nimue
that. I seem to remember a book called The Dark Side of Adoption. Maybe
you might find that helpful; I don't know.
> Carmen
--
nimue
"As an unwavering Republican, I have quite naturally burned more books
than I have read." Betty Bowers
English is our friend. We don't have to fight it.
Oprah
nimue
Oh, good lord. Is that it? That girl's parents are just disgusting if that
is true.
b
sorry if it isn't clear from my post.....
the income difference and miscegenation part is pure conjecture (on my
part)
the rest - facts gleaned from articles
they are disgusting just for the bullying/tying up part
and i hate to think why daddy had a gun and a magazine loaded w-
ammunition
they couldn't just disown her? she wasn't at home any more anyway.....
b
Ki...@webtv.net
>and, because of the ferocity of the parents'
>attack, i can't help but wonder if there wasn't a
>fear of miscegenation as well
That was my first thought, too -- "I bet the father is black." So does
it say how far along she is? They stated she couldn't have gotten an
abortion in Maine past 20-27 weeks so she must have been pretty far
along.
scooter34
> >> > This is so stupid and so sad. So many loving families are waiting to
> > adopt. I wish more pregnant women in need would consider giving their
> > child the gift of a better life than they, themselves can give the
> > child.
> > -L.
> It is stupid and sad, but what I see as stupid and sad is that the girl
> didn't utilize birth control and prevent this in the first place. My
> guess is that Mom and Dad wanted her to abort because they didn't want
> to raise the child.
> scooter34
b wrote:
>sorry but i find that an odd thing to say
>how do you know she didn't have the child on purpose? and she is living
>w- her boyfriend's family..... so presumably they are supporting her
>and the child. Where do and how could they be "forced" into raising a child
Where in the heck did you get that she's living with her boyfriend's
parents? They aren't mentioned at all in this article. And jumping
from there to "they're supporting her?" Wow. One of us missed a big
chunk of this article - of course, I will full well admit it could be
me, but I went back and re-read it after reading your response.
>there's no justification for bullying/coercing etc someone into killing
>a child, let alone a child that they want..... and if they had
>succeeded, even if not by force, how would that have impacted the
>daughter's health, mental and otherwise?
I agree. Where did I say otherwise?
>it's not a choice i'd make personally (to have a child in this
>situation) but i'm not one for staing that circumstances should
>determine whether a child lives or dies.....
>in this case the parents were wealthy and issues at hand were shame (nb
>im not saying that poorer parents wouldn't be ashamed too but chances
are the boyfriend has an income difference)...... also the boyfriend's
father was in prison.... all embarassing to people who care how they
appear to others...... and, because of the ferocity of the parents'
attack, i can't help but wonder if there wasn't a fear of miscegenation
as well
Now you're onto them being wealthy? What sources are you getting
information from? I see that later you admit that you "interpreted"
the interracial nature of the romance, and extrapolated the shame of
the parents.
Look, you ask how anyone can be forced into raising their children's
children. I can present you with the names of three couples I know who
are currently raising their grandchildren - all white, middle class
people (with white grandchildren, too, and no daddies in prison, so
there's none of that shame BS) who will tell you flat out that this is
not what they wanted, but they couldn't stand the idea of their
grandchild being lost to them. One close friend and her husband did
insist that their daughter place her second child up for adoption, and
Nancy still takes the boy's birthday off every year (he's eleven now)
and mourns the loss of that piece of her family. There's force at
gunpoint, but sometimes there's emotional blackmail, too.
I do not know many 19 year old's in 2006 who are capable of financially
and emotionally supporting an infant. That is no criticism of them. I
am in no way justifying what the parents did, and I hope they go to
jail. But rather than the Romeo and Juliet scenario you present
(star-crossed lovers, kept apart by racist parents and supported by his
loving family), what I see is:
- a 19-year old girl who probably doesn't make enough money to support
herself (going with the odds here);
- a father of indeterminate age who is in prison for an indeterminate
sentence, meaning he will certainly be absent for some of the pregancy
and possibly continuing up into some period of the child's life,
thereby able to offer little if any financial or emotional support;
- 2 parents who made it clear at gunpoint that they think this
pregnancy is a bad idea.
This does not sound like a great start to the fairytale to me.
scooter34
Bo Raxo
Ki...@webtv.net wrote:
> butter...@gmail.com (b) wrote:
>
> >and, because of the ferocity of the parents'
> >attack, i can't help but wonder if there wasn't a
> >fear of miscegenation as well
>
> That was my first thought, too -- "I bet the father is black."
I thought the same thing. The father being in jail seems like a
strange motivation to make them insistent on an abortion - but racism,
people kill for that reason all the time.
The other possibility that comes to mind is that she had been molested
by her father or both parents, and there was some "jealousy" over the
boyfriend.
Bo Raxo
-L.
Carmen wrote:
>
> Huh? This woman didn't want an abortion. Her parents were trying to
> get her one by force. This was a kidnapping.
I know that. All I am saying is that it's a shame she and her parents
weren't counseled.
>
> BTW, as an adult adoptee, I can honestly say adoption isn't all it's
> cracked up to be. People *are* still bought and sold in this country,
> they just aren't all black. They come in all colors, and the human
> traffic is called "closed adoption".
Closed adoption is rare anymore. It's usually only done in cases of
rape.
-L.
Carmen
You're welcome. I know adoption could be a much better alternative
than it is now. There isn't a week that goes by when I don't miss what
was taken from me, and my daughter, and her children, and so on...
Carmen
Carmen
Those figures include intra-family adoptions, which are "open" by their
very nature.
The results are all around you L, and to put it bluntly, there are many
adult adoptees who were robbed of their heritage in a transaction in
which we were nothing but chattel. To this very day the law often
views us as chattel of that long-ago transaction as far as gaining
access to information about who we are. It's a difficult thing to
convey to someone who has never not known their heritage just how much
it means. It's mine, it was never anyone else's right to give away,
yet they did it anyway.
Carmen
arche...@yahoo.com
Bo Raxo wrote:
> Ki...@webtv.net wrote:
> > butter...@gmail.com (b) wrote:
> >
> > >and, because of the ferocity of the parents'
> > >attack, i can't help but wonder if there wasn't a
> > >fear of miscegenation as well
> >
> > That was my first thought, too -- "I bet the father is black."
>
> I thought the same thing. The father being in jail seems like a
> strange motivation to make them insistent on an abortion - but racism,
> people kill for that reason all the time.
Bingo! According to today's Boston Globe, the boyfriend IS black.
http://makeashorterlink.com/?C2F923CCD
I found that Nick Kampf is president of a small realty/real estate
management company in Portland. From what I've seen of Yarmouth, it's a
nice town. And Boston College ain't cheap. I bet the Kampfs were pissed
about losing whatever social standing they might have had in the
community.
-L.
Carmen wrote:
>
> Those figures include intra-family adoptions, which are "open" by their
> very nature.
Have you adopted a child recently? I have. It's extremelty rare to
find a Birthmother who wants a closed adoption. We never encountered
one. My friends were seeking a closed adoption and had a very hard
time finding one. In the case of state adoptions (involuntary
surrenders of the child), some (but not all) records are sealed by the
courts when it's deemed in the best interest of the child. I am not
sure I agree with that, but until the laws are changed, that's how it
will be.
>
> The results are all around you L, and to put it bluntly, there are many
> adult adoptees who were robbed of their heritage in a transaction in
> which we were nothing but chattel.
I totally know that. But to say that is the *norm* in the US now is
not true. Open and semi-open adoption are by far the norm in cases
where a non-family member adopts the child, and the child is willingly
placed by the Birthfamily. The adoption community has recognized the
needs of the triad were not met under closed adoption rules. That's
not to say children are not still treated as chattel - that is still
certainly very true, and I have my own horror stories regarding that.
What needs to happen is a federal overhaul of adoption in this country.
I could get on a soapbox now, but I'll stop here. Suffice it to say I
think the adoption industry is criminal - something I did not know
going in.
>To this very day the law often
> views us as chattel of that long-ago transaction as far as gaining
> access to information about who we are. It's a difficult thing to
> convey to someone who has never not known their heritage just how much
> it means. It's mine, it was never anyone else's right to give away,
> yet they did it anyway.
I am sorry, and I agree that it's horrible and should never have
occurred. It has changed for many, though. Stories like yours are why
we chose a semi-open adoption. We know DS's Birthmom's name, we send
her cards, letters and photos through a third-party, and he has
freedom to contact her when he is 18, if he'd like. If he decides
sooner that he would like contact, we have the option of contacting her
to see if she's open to it. As it stands, she wants to meet him at age
18, if he is amenable. IMO, that's how it should be - his choice and
the records accessible.
I am sorry to hear of your sorrow regarding adoption. What happened to
you is unforgivable. It breaks my heart - truly.
-L.
James Dolan
danapointe <da...@presidency.com> wrote:
|Couple Accused of Kidnapping Daughter
|
|SALEM, N.H. (AP) - A Maine couple upset that their 19-year-old
|daughter was pregnant tied her up, loaded her in their car and began
|driving to New York to force her to get an abortion, police said.
are there any reliable statistics available on how common forced
abortion is in the usa? specifically, forced on an "underage" girl by
her parents. offhand i doubt that it's that uncommon. the girl/woman
in this case was not underage, which probably helped her in being
emotionally equipped to resist, to the point of making her situation
known to the outside world; it can be much more difficult for a
younger person.
i've occasionally tried browsing on the web for information on forced
abortions and was a bit surprised at how little information seemed to
be available. i just tried browsing again right now, and there seems
to be more information than there used to be, but i'm not prepared at
the moment to wade through it trying to separate legitimate
information from nonsense.
--
Carmen
-L. wrote:
> Carmen wrote:
> >
> > Those figures include intra-family adoptions, which are "open" by their
> > very nature.
>
> Have you adopted a child recently? I have. It's extremelty rare to
> find a Birthmother who wants a closed adoption. We never encountered
> one. My friends were seeking a closed adoption and had a very hard
> time finding one. In the case of state adoptions (involuntary
> surrenders of the child), some (but not all) records are sealed by the
> courts when it's deemed in the best interest of the child. I am not
> sure I agree with that, but until the laws are changed, that's how it
> will be.
Mine was a sibling group (four of us), involuntary surrender situation
to the state because our birth parents were neglectful. I was the
oldest, at 5 years old. Despite being able to remember my birth
parents, I haven't even got medical records. Hell, I don't even have
an amended birth certificate. One was never issued and doesn't seem to
exist in the state I was born in under my adoptive name. Thanks to the
f'in Patriot Act I now can't even get a passport because I only have an
adoption certificate (thanks Bush!).
> >
> > The results are all around you L, and to put it bluntly, there are many
> > adult adoptees who were robbed of their heritage in a transaction in
> > which we were nothing but chattel.
>
> I totally know that. But to say that is the *norm* in the US now is
> not true. Open and semi-open adoption are by far the norm in cases
> where a non-family member adopts the child, and the child is willingly
> placed by the Birthfamily. The adoption community has recognized the
> needs of the triad were not met under closed adoption rules. That's
> not to say children are not still treated as chattel - that is still
> certainly very true, and I have my own horror stories regarding that.
> What needs to happen is a federal overhaul of adoption in this country.
> I could get on a soapbox now, but I'll stop here. Suffice it to say I
> think the adoption industry is criminal - something I did not know
> going in.
It's unfortunate, but as long as there is significant money to be made
there will be problems.
> >To this very day the law often
> > views us as chattel of that long-ago transaction as far as gaining
> > access to information about who we are. It's a difficult thing to
> > convey to someone who has never not known their heritage just how much
> > it means. It's mine, it was never anyone else's right to give away,
> > yet they did it anyway.
>
> I am sorry, and I agree that it's horrible and should never have
> occurred. It has changed for many, though. Stories like yours are why
> we chose a semi-open adoption. We know DS's Birthmom's name, we send
> her cards, letters and photos through a third-party, and he has
> freedom to contact her when he is 18, if he'd like. If he decides
> sooner that he would like contact, we have the option of contacting her
> to see if she's open to it. As it stands, she wants to meet him at age
> 18, if he is amenable. IMO, that's how it should be - his choice and
> the records accessible.
Your son will never have to wonder where he came from, never have to
deal with that "left out" or "I don't fit in anywhere" feeling - all
while having a stable loving family. That's all good. :-)
Practical considerations like unforeseen health issues can be addressed
(God forbid he should need a bone marrow donation down the road) too.
That's a far better way to handle things.
> I am sorry to hear of your sorrow regarding adoption. What happened to
> you is unforgivable. It breaks my heart - truly.
It's not something to be sorry about really. The adoption wasn't
successful, and I became an emancipated minor as soon as possible. My
adoptive parents were...unsuitable. I didn't end up a high school
drop-out, nor did I end up a teenage pregnancy stat, I stayed away from
drugs and alcohol and crime. I got married at 20, we had a child 19
months later and celebrated our 19th wedding anniversary yesterday.
I've turned out just fine despite the rough start. It does make me
angry when I think about it, but it isn't as if I've allowed it to
poison my life or my parenting. Our daughter is turning out great.
:-)
Carmen
Carmen
They were bad, yes. My biological parents were bad. I lived through
it. Didn't go on any crime sprees and blame my crappy childhood. :-)
DH and I have a long and happy marriage under our belts and our
daughter is a successful happy person. I think that any bad patterns
were halted in this branch of the genetic tree, even if I never find
out where that piece fits in. There's comfort in that.
Carmen
DanaPointe
> the income difference and miscegenation part is pure conjecture (on my
> part)
Bingo:
Sheriff: Race a factor in kidnap case
SALEM, N.H. - A Maine couple accused of tying up their 19-year-old
daughter, throwing her in their car and driving her out of state to get
an abortion were upset because the baby's father is black, a Maine
sheriff said Tuesday.
Katelyn Kampf, who is white, told Cumberland County Sheriff Mark Dion
that her mother "was pretty irate at the fact that the child's father
was black, and she had made a number of disparaging remarks about
that," he said.
Katelyn Kampf escaped Friday at a Salem shopping center and called
police, who arrested her parents, Nicholas Kampf, 54, and Lola, 53,
both real estate developers from North Yarmouth, Maine.
The Kampfs were apparently taking their daughter to New York to try to
force her to get an abortion there, police said.
The parents were arraigned Monday on kidnapping charges. The judge set
bail at $100,000 each and ordered the Kampfs to have no contact with
their daughter.
If convicted of kidnapping, the Kampfs face 7 1/2 to 15 years in
prison. Dion said he expects to bring charges in Maine also, after
investigators consult with the district attorney Wednesday.
Defense attorney Mark Sisti said Tuesday that a sworn statement by
Salem police who interviewed both Katelyn Kampf and her parents said
nothing about the father's race.
"This whole race-card thing is ridiculous and objectionable," said
Sisti, who represented both of the Kampfs for their arraignment Monday,
but is now representing only Lola Kampf. "There wasn't any mention in
the sworn affidavit to the court about race being a factor in any way,
shape or form."
Sisti also maintained there was no evidence a kidnapping had taken
place in New Hampshire. The sworn affidavit said Katelyn described
talking cordially with her parents during the trip from Maine.
But Salem Police prosecutor Ryan McFarland said in court Monday the
Kampfs had their passports, rope, a rifle and ammunition in the car. He
argued they posed a danger if released and could flee the country.
Dion said Katelyn Kampf told him her parents got upset when she called
them Thursday night and told them she was pregnant. The Kampfs had met
her boyfriend before and been friendly, but the pregnancy apparently
"changed the dynamic," he said.
Katelyn Kampf said her mother "kept referring to the baby as a thing,
as 'It,' and there were other comments made," he said.
They invited Katelyn, who is living in Portland with her boyfriend's
mother, Peggy Johnson, to come to their house Friday morning. Dion
would not say whether the Kampfs were already prepared to abduct their
daughter when she arrived.
In a court affidavit, Salem Police Officer Sean Marino wrote that
Katelyn told him her parents "chased her out into the yard, grabbed and
tied her hands and feet together." Her father carried her to the car
and they headed to New Hampshire, he wrote.
Katelyn Kampf escaped from her parents in Salem after persuading them
to untie her so she could use a Kmart bathroom, police said. After her
father went into the men's room, she ran to a nearby Staples store and
used her father's cell phone, which she had swiped, to call 911, police
said.
The boyfriend, 22-year-old Reme Johnson, last week began serving a
6-month sentence for theft at the Androscoggin County Jail in Auburn,
Maine. He also has previous felony convictions for burglary and
receiving stolen property, the Portland Press Herald reported.
Authorities in Maine said the parents apparently thought that, in light
of their daughter's stage of pregnancy and the different abortion laws
in each state, the abortion should be performed in New York. It was
unclear how many weeks pregnant she was.
Kathy
> b wrote:
>
>>the income difference and miscegenation part is pure conjecture (on my
>>part)
>
>
> Bingo:
>
> Sheriff: Race a factor in kidnap case
>
> SALEM, N.H. - A Maine couple accused of tying up their 19-year-old
> daughter, throwing her in their car and driving her out of state to get
> an abortion were upset because the baby's father is black, a Maine
> sheriff said Tuesday.
>
> Katelyn Kampf, who is white, told Cumberland County Sheriff Mark Dion
> that her mother "was pretty irate at the fact that the child's father
> was black, and she had made a number of disparaging remarks about
> that," he said.
>
> Katelyn Kampf escaped Friday at a Salem shopping center and called
> police, who arrested her parents, Nicholas Kampf, 54, and Lola, 53,
> both real estate developers from North Yarmouth, Maine.
>
> The Kampfs were apparently taking their daughter to New York to try to
> force her to get an abortion there, police said.
They can't be very intelligent. Who would have performed an abortion on
this woman against her will???? Nobody.
Kathy
Laninna
Kathy wrote:
>
> They can't be very intelligent. Who would have performed an abortion on
> this woman against her will???? Nobody.
>
> Kathy
>
Carmen
Kathy wrote:
> DanaPointe wrote:
>
> > b wrote:
> >
> >>the income difference and miscegenation part is pure conjecture (on my
> >>part)
> >
> >
> > Bingo:
> >
> > Sheriff: Race a factor in kidnap case
> >
> > SALEM, N.H. - A Maine couple accused of tying up their 19-year-old
> > daughter, throwing her in their car and driving her out of state to get
> > an abortion were upset because the baby's father is black, a Maine
> > sheriff said Tuesday.
> >
> > Katelyn Kampf, who is white, told Cumberland County Sheriff Mark Dion
> > that her mother "was pretty irate at the fact that the child's father
> > was black, and she had made a number of disparaging remarks about
> > that," he said.
> >
> > Katelyn Kampf escaped Friday at a Salem shopping center and called
> > police, who arrested her parents, Nicholas Kampf, 54, and Lola, 53,
> > both real estate developers from North Yarmouth, Maine.
> >
> > The Kampfs were apparently taking their daughter to New York to try to
> > force her to get an abortion there, police said.
>
> They can't be very intelligent. Who would have performed an abortion on
> this woman against her will???? Nobody.
That might have been what the gun was for. Persuasion.
Carmen
-L.
Carmen wrote:
>
> Mine was a sibling group (four of us), involuntary surrender situation
> to the state because our birth parents were neglectful. I was the
> oldest, at 5 years old. Despite being able to remember my birth
> parents, I haven't even got medical records. Hell, I don't even have
> an amended birth certificate. One was never issued and doesn't seem to
> exist in the state I was born in under my adoptive name. Thanks to the
> f'in Patriot Act I now can't even get a passport because I only have an
> adoption certificate (thanks Bush!).
Oh jeez!
> It's unfortunate, but as long as there is significant money to be made
> there will be problems.
Agreed. What really pisses me off is that congress passed the adoption
tax credit supposedly to help lower-income families adopt. Instead the
agencies raised their prices to match. It's all so messed up.
> > I am sorry to hear of your sorrow regarding adoption. What happened to
> > you is unforgivable. It breaks my heart - truly.
>
> It's not something to be sorry about really. The adoption wasn't
> successful, and I became an emancipated minor as soon as possible. My
> adoptive parents were...unsuitable. I didn't end up a high school
> drop-out, nor did I end up a teenage pregnancy stat, I stayed away from
> drugs and alcohol and crime. I got married at 20, we had a child 19
> months later and celebrated our 19th wedding anniversary yesterday.
Wow - that's awesome! It still makes me sick that you cannot get
information you need on your family and heritage...like I said -
that's criminal.
> I've turned out just fine despite the rough start. It does make me
> angry when I think about it, but it isn't as if I've allowed it to
> poison my life or my parenting. Our daughter is turning out great.
> :-)
Glad to hear it. :)
-L.
-L.
DanaPointe wrote:
> Couple Accused of Kidnapping Daughter
http://www.lasvegassun.com/sunbin/stories/nat-gen/2006/sep/19/091907457.html
Today: September 19, 2006 at 10:5:17 PDT
Sheriff: Race a Factor in Kidnap Case
By KATHARINE WEBSTER
ASSOCIATED PRESS
SALEM, N.H. (AP) -
A Maine couple accused of tying up their 19-year-old daughter, throwing
her in their car and driving her out of state to get an abortion were
upset because the baby's father is black, a Maine sheriff said Tuesday.
Katelyn Kampf, who is white, told Cumberland County Sheriff Mark Dion
that her mother "was pretty irate at the fact that the child's father
was black, and she had made a number of disparaging remarks about
that," he said.
Katelyn Kampf escaped Friday at a Salem shopping center and called
police, who arrested her parents, Nicholas Kampf, 54, and Lola, 53,
both real estate developers from North Yarmouth, Maine.
The Kampfs were apparently taking their daughter to New York to try to
force her to get an abortion there, police said.
The parents were arraigned Monday on kidnapping charges. The judge set
to untie her so she could use a Kmart bathroom. After her father went
into the men's room, she used a cell phone she had swiped from her
father to call for help, then ran to a nearby Staples store, where
police found "a hysterical female hiding in the back of the store,"
according to the affidavit.
The boyfriend, 22-year-old Reme Johnson, last week began serving a
b
thx for posting this
i was (unfortunately) correct
nimue
How long were you with your biological family before your adoptive family
adopted you? I am sorry both were bad.
>I am sorry to
>> hear that. I seem to remember a book called The Dark Side of
>> Adoption. Maybe you might find that helpful; I don't know.
>
> They were bad, yes. My biological parents were bad. I lived through
> it. Didn't go on any crime sprees and blame my crappy childhood. :-)
> DH and I have a long and happy marriage under our belts and our
> daughter is a successful happy person. I think that any bad patterns
> were halted in this branch of the genetic tree, even if I never find
> out where that piece fits in. There's comfort in that.
Wait, now I am confused. That sounds like you don't know who your bio
family was. How did you know they were bad? Did you get enough answers in
your search to tell you? If it's not too painful, can you explain?
nimue
You are one smart cookie! Extra credit for you!
nimue
> b wrote:
>> the income difference and miscegenation part is pure conjecture (on
>> my part)
>
> Bingo:
>
> Sheriff: Race a factor in kidnap case
>
> SALEM, N.H. - A Maine couple accused of tying up their 19-year-old
> daughter, throwing her in their car and driving her out of state to
> get an abortion were upset because the baby's father is black, a Maine
> sheriff said Tuesday.
>
> Katelyn Kampf,
Kampf? Kampf? As in Mein Kampf? Oh, lord. I wonder if that is their real
name or if they chose it as some racist homage to their hero, Adolf.
>who is white, told Cumberland County Sheriff Mark Dion
> that her mother "was pretty irate at the fact that the child's father
> was black, and she had made a number of disparaging remarks about
> that," he said.
>
> Katelyn Kampf escaped Friday at a Salem shopping center and called
> police, who arrested her parents, Nicholas Kampf, 54, and Lola, 53,
> both real estate developers from North Yarmouth, Maine.
>
> The Kampfs were apparently taking their daughter to New York to try to
> force her to get an abortion there, police said.
>
> The parents were arraigned Monday on kidnapping charges. The judge set
> bail at $100,000 each and ordered the Kampfs to have no contact with
> their daughter.
>
> If convicted of kidnapping, the Kampfs face 7 1/2 to 15 years in
> prison.
They should get that time for what they did.
>Dion said he expects to bring charges in Maine also, after
> investigators consult with the district attorney Wednesday.
Good. Give them some more time.
>
> Defense attorney Mark Sisti said Tuesday that a sworn statement by
> Salem police who interviewed both Katelyn Kampf and her parents said
> nothing about the father's race.
>
> "This whole race-card thing is ridiculous and objectionable," said
> Sisti, who represented both of the Kampfs for their arraignment
> Monday, but is now representing only Lola Kampf. "There wasn't any
> mention in the sworn affidavit to the court about race being a factor
> in any way, shape or form."
>
> Sisti also maintained there was no evidence a kidnapping had taken
> place in New Hampshire. The sworn affidavit said Katelyn described
> talking cordially with her parents during the trip from Maine.
>
> But Salem Police prosecutor Ryan McFarland said in court Monday the
> Kampfs had their passports, rope, a rifle and ammunition in the car.
> He argued they posed a danger if released and could flee the country.
>
> Dion said Katelyn Kampf told him her parents got upset when she called
> them Thursday night and told them she was pregnant. The Kampfs had met
> her boyfriend before and been friendly, but the pregnancy apparently
> "changed the dynamic," he said.
>
> Katelyn Kampf said her mother "kept referring to the baby as a thing,
> as 'It,' and there were other comments made," he said.
Lovely. What a bitch.
>
> They invited Katelyn, who is living in Portland with her boyfriend's
> mother, Peggy Johnson, to come to their house Friday morning. Dion
> would not say whether the Kampfs were already prepared to abduct their
> daughter when she arrived.
>
> In a court affidavit, Salem Police Officer Sean Marino wrote that
> Katelyn told him her parents "chased her out into the yard, grabbed
> and tied her hands and feet together." Her father carried her to the
> car and they headed to New Hampshire, he wrote.
>
> Katelyn Kampf escaped from her parents in Salem after persuading them
> to untie her so she could use a Kmart bathroom, police said. After her
> father went into the men's room, she ran to a nearby Staples store and
> used her father's cell phone, which she had swiped, to call 911,
> police said.
>
> The boyfriend, 22-year-old Reme Johnson, last week began serving a
> 6-month sentence for theft at the Androscoggin County Jail in Auburn,
> Maine. He also has previous felony convictions for burglary and
> receiving stolen property, the Portland Press Herald reported.
God, I feel bad for this kid.
>
> Authorities in Maine said the parents apparently thought that, in
> light of their daughter's stage of pregnancy and the different
> abortion laws in each state, the abortion should be performed in New
> York. It was unclear how many weeks pregnant she was.
--
A.
You probably already know what I'm going to say. Of COURSE
they're stonewalling. He's been told so many alternate versions of
his story, to begin with. And they are simply refusing to talk to
him (or to each other) about any of it, right now. They inexplicably
took him to meet his bio-mom when he was about 3 and had no
clue what was going on (and has bad memories of that event), but
won't help him in contacting her now. She too has given him
outrageously
different versions of the story. There seem to be quite a few clues
that he went to the highest bidder - and the match between him and
his parents is not a good one.
I did get my records opened, etc., after a long struggle to get my
adoptive parents to agree to it. It's been an interesting trip.
A.
Carmen
I was about 4 or 5 years old when I was removed from my bio home.
>
> >I am sorry to
> >> hear that. I seem to remember a book called The Dark Side of
> >> Adoption. Maybe you might find that helpful; I don't know.
> >
> > They were bad, yes. My biological parents were bad. I lived through
> > it. Didn't go on any crime sprees and blame my crappy childhood. :-)
> > DH and I have a long and happy marriage under our belts and our
> > daughter is a successful happy person. I think that any bad patterns
> > were halted in this branch of the genetic tree, even if I never find
> > out where that piece fits in. There's comfort in that.
>
> Wait, now I am confused. That sounds like you don't know who your bio
> family was. How did you know they were bad? Did you get enough answers in
> your search to tell you? If it's not too painful, can you explain?
I was old enough to have memories of my bio family and home. There was
definitely alcohol abuse (one memory is of bio mom putting her hand
through a window and getting cut up while drunk as she was showing my
younger sister how to pound on the glass), there was fighting (physical
and verbal) and neglect. Basic needs not being met, sleeping on a bare
floor sort of thing. My adoptives told me they (bios) both went to
prison and lost custody. That's quite possible. If/when I find them
I'm prepped for just about any eventuality, from visiting a pauper's
grave to setting foot for the first time inside a prison on visiting
day to finding out they straightened out and settled down. Regardless
of what my origins were the alcoholism (from the bio family) and abuse
patterns (from bio and adoptive families) were not repeated in my
family. That's what I meant. Unconfused? :-)
Carmen
Kathy
And how would they have gotten her onto a plane? Tied up and gagged?
Kathy
Ki...@webtv.net
>>>They can't be very intelligent. Who would
>>>have performed an abortion on this woman
>>>against her will???? Nobody.
>>Well they could have taken her to China. :p~~
>And how would they have gotten her onto a
>plane? Tied up and gagged?
It being China they would have bound her feet! (I'm sure the above was
a joke, look at the emoticon.)
nimue
Yeah. Thanks. I am glad you stopped the cycle. Good luck in your search
for your bio family. I guess your adoptive family isn't being much help in
that -- or maybe you no longer have contact with them? Perhaps a private
investigator might help. I know my adopted neighbor found her bio mother
and I believe she used a private investigator, someone who specialized in
finding bio families.