BW is Dissapointing!!
The Smith Family
I know that a lot of you guys out there are big fans of Beast Wars and
this is not meant to offend you. I just long for the days of Starscream,
Megatron and Optimus Prime. I mean have you played with the new toys?
They totally suck compared to the old ones. Optimus prime has gone from
a mack truck to a damn gorilla. Every transformer fan I know almost
wants to cry when they go into a store and see what Transformers have
become. I just wish that Hasbro would re-release all of the old
transformers. Maybe they could spice them up somehow if they wanted to.
Anything but robots transforming into animals. I mean, can we get any
more lame?
I don't mean to burst anyone's bubble but I just wish that the old
Transformers would come back.
- rob "the choda" smith
Playground Psychotic
The Smith Family wrote:
>
> I know that a lot of you guys out there are big fans of Beast Wars and
> this is not meant to offend you. I just long for the days of Starscream,
> Megatron and Optimus Prime. I mean have you played with the new toys?
> They totally suck compared to the old ones. Optimus prime has gone from
> a mack truck to a damn gorilla.
Just for a change... Ravecavy, OOMPALOOMPIZE!
(start the drums, you know the tune...)
Oompa-Loompa-Doopity-Doo,
I've got a brand new puzzle for you,
Oompa-Loompa-Doopity-Dee,
If you are wise you'll listen to me.
Why must we run this stuff into the ground?
You'd think there was no F-A-Q around!
Why won't you people save us some time?
Remember, Primal Is! Not! Prime!
(watch-the-show-and-you-will-see!)
Oompa-Loompa-Doopity-Dize,
Primal and Prime are two different guys.
Watch the show and you will know too,
Like the Oompa-Loompa-Doopity-Do!
...
(Doopity-doo.)
P_P
(Chocolate overload! Return to beast mode!)
thang duc nguyen
The Smith Family (smi...@gte.net) wrote:
> I know that a lot of you guys out there are big fans of Beast Wars and
> this is not meant to offend you. I just long for the days of Starscream,
> Megatron and Optimus Prime. I mean have you played with the new toys?
> They totally suck compared to the old ones. Optimus prime has gone from
> wants to cry when they go into a store and see what Transformers have
> become. I just wish that Hasbro would re-release all of the old
> transformers. Maybe they could spice them up somehow if they wanted to.
> Anything but robots transforming into animals. I mean, can we get any
> more lame?
Hi, I haven't seen the BW cartoons yet, but I have checked out the
BW figures and I was a bit disappointed also. I guess I was expecting
something more extreme than what I saw. Maybe they should just call
it Animal Wars :)
-Thang N.
Jesse Hughes
thang duc nguyen wrote:
>
> The Smith Family (smi...@gte.net) wrote:
> > I know that a lot of you guys out there are big fans of Beast Wars and
> > this is not meant to offend you. I just long for the days of Starscream,
> > Megatron and Optimus Prime. I mean have you played with the new toys?
> > They totally suck compared to the old ones.
>
> BW figures and I was a bit disappointed also. I guess I was expecting
> something more extreme than what I saw. Maybe they should just call
dissappointed when its arms move at the elbows. I'd rather have a very
limited range of movement. I do, however, have one negative comment. The
limbs pop off pretty readily, even though they pop back ON just as
easily. I learned something. Once you've taken Terrorsaur's gun out of
its hiding space, there's no getting it back in right ever again.
--
________
|________|
| |
| * * | Dentotape: the origional!
| |
| \____/ | - Jesse Hughes An...@ix.netcom.com
|________|
| |
| |
| |
_| |_
Nowlin Olatunji
The Smith Family (smi...@gte.net) wrote:
: I know that a lot of you guys out there are big fans of Beast Wars and
for re-viving the Transformers line AS WELL AS creating Machine Wars, the
'return' to mechanical forms that so many people are 'crying for'.
: this is not meant to offend you. I just long for the days of Starscream,
: Megatron and Optimus Prime.
Doesn't offend me, but just makes me wonder why people constantly whine about
something that they obviously know very little about...
> I mean have you played with the new toys?
Why, yes I have, they are VERY nice. I have the things all over the place.
I could never pose my G1 toys like this! Joints, articulation, weapons
that store on the robot, who wouldn't appreciate these changes?
: They totally suck compared to the old ones. Optimus prime has gone from
: a mack truck to a damn gorilla.
Eh? This is news to me, I wonder when Autobots and Decepticons got this
technology. Far as I know its MAXIMALS and PREDACONS who use this tech.
Also it's quite obvious (from the show) that Primal is NO Prime...
Megatron is also too big of a moron to be the true Megatron.
> Every transformer fan I know almost
: wants to cry when they go into a store and see what Transformers have
: become.
Hrm, you must not know many fans...
> I just wish that Hasbro would re-release all of the old
: transformers.
I just wish some people would get all the facts before whining...
* G1 will never return
* G2 was 'rushed' and improperly done (but DID come out with excellent toys
such as the Cyberjets!)
* BeastWars ARE Transformers and ARE WORTHY of the name
* 'G3'/MachineWars will be hitting the stores and the screens soon,
I personally think they are possible because of the success of Beast Wars.
* Even the 'old' chars that we know and love from G1 could make appearances
in G3, but with new forms, not their old ones.
> Maybe they could spice them up somehow if they wanted to.
Spice? Spice is for cooking.
: Anything but robots transforming into animals. I mean, can we get any
: more lame?
More lame?
* PowerRangers
* Whiners
:
: I don't mean to burst anyone's bubble but I just wish that the old
: Transformers would come back.
And I have to burst yours, they won't be back, G3 is your best bet.
Deal.
PS This isn't a personal attack, but is directed at all the people
who have shot down BW without even getting all the available info.
PPS Try checking Ben Yee's page at http://acweb.com/ben/beast.htm
your eyes WILL be opened.
:
: - rob "the choda" smith
Olatunji Nowlin
now...@ais.net
Andrius Schmid
Jesse Hughes wrote:
>I agree totally. Whenever I pose one of the Beast Wars toys, I get SO
> dissappointed when its arms move at the elbows. I'd rather have a very
> limited range of movement. I do, however, have one negative comment. The
> limbs pop off pretty readily, even though they pop back ON just as
> easily. I learned something. Once you've taken Terrorsaur's gun out of
> its hiding space, there's no getting it back in right ever again.
>
Actually, Terrosaur's gun does fit in well, if you fold it up and fiddle
for a moment. My terr's gun fit so well that it actually fell out, and
is now lost forever. Sniff...
--Andrius
|\ |\ /| /| **Please note my new
| \ | \ / | / | **address:
| \_______ | \______/ | _______/ |
| | | | | | --> Fl...@worldnet.att.net
| _______| | ______ | |_______ |
| |_______ | \ / | _______| |
| _______| | \ / | |_______ |
| |________ \ \/ / ________| |
\ \ \____/ / /
\ ___ \ / ___ /
|\ \ \||---____\ /____---||/ / /|
| \ \ \||||||/ \/ \||||||/ / / |
| \ \ \|||/ \|||/ / / |
| \ \ \/ \/ / / |
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----____\ \/ /____----
This signature does not come //
out well on every system. //
LMK if it's jarbled. //
Wonko the Sane
The Smith Family (smi...@gte.net) wrote:
Hippcron puts down the pile of grass he was chewing and yells
Hippocron...BWADLIZE!!!
> I know that a lot of you guys out there are big fans of Beast Wars and
> this is not meant to offend you. I just long for the days of Starscream,
> Megatron and Optimus Prime. I mean have you played with the new toys?
Yup...Love'em, Love'em, Love'em LOVE THEM!!!
> They totally suck compared to the old ones. Optimus prime has gone from
> a mack truck to a damn gorilla.
Errr...no, Optimus PrimAL is NOT Optimus PrimE...(geez...hasn't
THIS been said to DEATH already?)
> Every transformer fan I know almost
> wants to cry when they go into a store and see what Transformers have
> become.
Oh yeah, the third beast selling toy line, with great traits
(listed below in an excerpt from the "In Defense of Beast Wars" Essay), an
AWESOME show...oh yeah, I wanna cry. Especially when I see all those kids
in toy aisles nowadays BEGGING their parents for Beast Wars toys when last
year and the year prior they simply glanced at G2 and walked away in total
disinterest.
> I just wish that Hasbro would re-release all of the old
> transformers. Maybe they could spice them up somehow if they wanted to.
> Anything but robots transforming into animals. I mean, can we get any
> more lame?
Robots becoming animals are lame? So I assume you hate:
Dinobots, Predacons, (most) of the Cassette forces, Terrorcons,
Monsterbots, Monstercons, Seacons etc. etc.
Ah yes, and so it doesn't seem like I haven't given this thought:
[Excerpt form "In Defense of Beast Wars" essay begins here]:
THE TOYS
Other than the name criticism, many do not like the toys period. Some
complain about simple transformations in the little ones and doofy
looking modes (of course, most of the criticisms come
from people who have yet to play with one of the toys but I digress).
Here are the strong points of the toys as I see them:
1. Excellent packaging - The initial line had an impressive 'scaly'
coloring pattern with the large reptilian EYE staring straight at you
once the toy is taken off the card. Great detail has been paid
attention to with the artwork on the boxes. The use of 'rocky' molded
bubbles in the initial release of Beast Wars shows real attention to
detail as well. The new packaging is less detailed but the artwork
on the characters seems to be improving.
2. Average of 9 point articulation - Unlike most figures today, the
Beast Wars have incredible articulation. The lines I am using as
comparisons include G.I. Joe Extreme, Spawn, Star Wars,
Batman (all three series), Superman Man of Steel and Gargoyles. This is
not to say that I don't like these toy lines but posability is the
issue here. The 9 points (if you wonder) include, head rotation,
shoulder and elbow rotation, upper leg and knee joint mobility (remember,
there are two arms and two legs). This is cool for nice transformations
and cool posability. Another strong point here is that
the Beast Wars toys are made with ball joints or double swivel
joints (as opposed to virtually no joints) which allow for greater
posability and play.
3. Excellent transformations - The mini Beast Wars transform quickly
but that is not much of a bad thing if you think that there's only so
much time one wants to spend transforming the toys in the
middle of a 'battle' and it's great for kids! Also, the simple
transformations of the small Beast Wars is balanced out by the complex
transformations in the deluxe toys. The deluxe toys on average have
multi step transforms which average to about 5-7 steps. Other nice
features include the fact that all weapons are part of both transform
modes. For instance, Waspinator's missiles fit under his wings,
Tarantulus' missiles form the lower part of four of his spider legs,
Dinobot's tail becomes his spinning blade and sword and Rhinox's
tail becomes a sword and four other pieces become a spinning ball
and chain.
4. Good molding - The creature modes all have realistic molding.
Examples can be seen in the 'fluffy' Beast Wars such as the bat
Optimus Primal and Rattrap. The 'fluffy' Beast Wars have a fur
like pattern molded into them. The more reptilian BW's have scaly
patterns such as Iguanus. Details also include wires and tubes
(look at Razorbeast in robot mode) and good detailing (look at
most of the heads of the robot modes). For another great example,
look at Cheetor's 'bladder' gun with the 'intestines' of the cheetah
mode molded in.
These are (to me), the primary strong points of the Beast Wars toys.
As for their success, many 'classic' TF fans are saying "This concept
won't sell, it's not cars and planes." However, the truth of
the matter is that cars and planes weren't selling anymore, the first
couple years of Generation 2 proved it. Rather, it is the animals and
creatures that are selling. Beast Wars is proof of this. So far,
Beast Wars are selling well (and that's reports from many different
places and stores in the US including Target, WalMarts, Toys R Us
and Kay Bee).
To be fair, it should be said that there are areas where Beast Wars
is not selling very well. However, when balanced with the areas
I've personally heard of that are doing well, the line seems to be
selling overall.
The latest information from Kenner representatives at BotCon 1996
indicate that Beast Wars is the third best selling toy line for boys.
The other two are Star Wars and Power Rangers.
[End of Excerpt]
Hippcron now goes to smell a flower, returning to Beast mode...
**********************************************
*Name: Benson "Ironfire" Yee *
*a.k.a. Wonko the Sane *
*e-mail: ye...@is2.nyu.edu *
******************************************
*Transformers Beast Wars web page: *
*http://acweb.com/ben/beast.htm *
***************************************
"Aaawww do you need a hug?"
Cheetor, "Victory"
skyfi...@aol.com
do they show pictures in the previews magazine?
Ka Faraq Gatri
The Smith Family <smi...@gte.net> wrote:
>I know that a lot of you guys out there are big fans of Beast Wars and
>this is not meant to offend you. I just long for the days of Starscream,
>Megatron and Optimus Prime. I mean have you played with the new toys?
Yes, and most are a distinct improvement over the original line in
terms of poseability and playability. The originals were more like
statues that transformed. The first year toys do have the current
line(and every line following the originals for that matter) beat in
terms of realistic disguise forms, though.
>They totally suck compared to the old ones. Optimus prime has gone from
>a mack truck to a damn gorilla.
Optimus Primal isn't Optimus Prime. In the cartoon, he's a relatively
inexperienced ship's captain, not the leader of the Maximals. The
Megatron of BW isn't the original, either.
>Every transformer fan I know almost
>wants to cry when they go into a store and see what Transformers have
>become. I just wish that Hasbro would re-release all of the old
>transformers. Maybe they could spice them up somehow if they wanted to.
>Anything but robots transforming into animals. I mean, can we get any
>more lame?
It's really about the same concept as the pretenders when you think
about it. The organic portion was just moved onto the robot itself.
Beast Wars is meant to "spice up" the line. And the old toys were
re-released, and didn't sell. The Transformers could have been
revamped or scrapped. Personally I'm glad they chose the former. I was
sceptical of Beast wars when it came out, too. However the quality of
the toys (have you looked at any of the deluxe, mega or ultra beasts?)
and the cartoon won me over. I still prefer the vehicle and machine
TFs, but BW is cool, too. Keep an open mind and you might find
something to like as well.
>I don't mean to burst anyone's bubble but I just wish that the old
>Transformers would come back.
There is a new line of machine TFs due to be released next year. And
it probably would never have been considered if Beast Wars wasn't
doing well.
etrigan
(Lizard, in CubicleMaster(tm) mode)
In article <328573...@gte.net>, The Smith Family <smi...@gte.net> wrote:
>I know that a lot of you guys out there are big fans of Beast Wars and
>this is not meant to offend you. I just long for the days of Starscream,
>Megatron and Optimus Prime. I mean have you played with the new toys?
Yes. Have *you*?
>They totally suck compared to the old ones. Optimus prime has gone from
>a mack truck to a damn gorilla.
Er...that's Optimus *Primal*, who isn't Optimus Prime, and never was. Have you
read the BW FAQ?
> Every transformer fan I know almost
>wants to cry when they go into a store and see what Transformers have
>become.
What, the third-hottest action figure line? Yeah, I'd much rather see them
relegate to limbo then selling like the proverbial you-know-whats.
> I just wish that Hasbro would re-release all of the old
>transformers.
They did. They didn't sell.
> Maybe they could spice them up somehow if they wanted to.
>Anything but robots transforming into animals. I mean, can we get any
>more lame?
>
Yeah, I really hated Ravage, Laserbeak,the Seacons, the (original) Predacons,
Steeljaw, Gnaw...
>I don't mean to burst anyone's bubble but I just wish that the old
>Transformers would come back.
>
Hang around Kay-Bee in early 1997...
Mark Towe
In article <564tq4$4...@news.nyu.edu> Wonko the Sane wrote:
IN DEFENSE OF:
>The Smith Family (smi...@gte.net) wrote:
>
> Hippcron puts down the pile of grass he was chewing and yells
>Hippocron...BWADLIZE!!!
>
Enough of the BWADL already! Every toy has it's proponents and
critics. It's just part of the business....
>> I know that a lot of you guys out there are big fans of Beast
Wars
myself included
>> and this is not meant to offend you. I just long for the days of
Starscream,
>> Megatron and Optimus Prime. I mean have you played with the new
toys?
>
Yes, I have all of them except Cheetor and Tigatron, both of whom
I cannot find. Some of them are good, and some of them are bad.
>> They totally suck compared to the old ones. Optimus prime has
gone from
>> a mack truck to a damn gorilla.
>
> Errr...no, Optimus PrimAL is NOT Optimus
PrimE...(geez...hasn't
>THIS been said to DEATH already?)
>
Wonko, you are wrong. He was referring no doubt to the toy
Prime/Primals, therefor Optimus Prime is Optimus Primal. The
writers of the televison show have made it clear that they are
different, but they are the same in the toys. Primal's robot mode
is very good, but his gorilla mode is one of thw worst yet.
>> Every transformer fan I know almost
>> wants to cry when they go into a store and see what Transformers
have
>> become.
>
> Oh yeah, the third beast selling toy line, with great traits
>(listed below in an excerpt from the "In Defense of Beast Wars"
Essay), an
>AWESOME show...oh yeah, I wanna cry. Especially when I see all
those kids
>in toy aisles nowadays BEGGING their parents for Beast Wars toys
when last
>year and the year prior they simply glanced at G2 and walked away
in total
>disinterest.
>
As good as Beast Wars is selling, it is sad compared to the
original toy line. G1 was much more popular in it's prime than BW
will ever be. Kids beg their parents for ANY kind of toy they
want.
>> I just wish that Hasbro would re-release all of the old
>> transformers. Maybe they could spice them up somehow if they
wanted to.
>> Anything but robots transforming into animals. I mean, can we
get any
>> more lame?
Thank God for Machine Wars.
>
> Robots becoming animals are lame? So I assume you hate:
>
>Dinobots, Predacons, (most) of the Cassette forces, Terrorcons,
>Monsterbots, Monstercons, Seacons etc. etc.
>
Aah, but they became robotic type animals in G1. Beast Wars has
attempted to make them look like real animals, and, with few
exceptions, has failed.
> Ah yes, and so it doesn't seem like I haven't given this
thought:
>
I have been one of the proponents for Beast Wars, but the above
arguments presented by the Smith family are viable ones. I really
like Beast Wars, but lets not get carried away. Beast Wars the
toy/tv show will NEVR EVER NEVER EVER be what G1 was.
Jacob Hurtado
Mark Towe wrote:
> >
> I have been one of the proponents for Beast Wars, but the above
> arguments presented by the Smith family are viable ones. I really
> like Beast Wars, but lets not get carried away. Beast Wars the
> toy/tv show will NEVR EVER NEVER EVER be what G1 was.
That's what they said about Star Trek: The Next Generation. "It could
NEVER be as good as the original", people said. Now look at it. ST:TNG
is 10x better than the old series ever was in terms of story and depth
of character. I think that BW could surprise everybody in the same way.
Aaron Eiche
In article <328476...@psnw.com>, tenor...@psnw.com wrote:
> The Smith Family wrote:
> >
> > I know that a lot of you guys out there are big fans of Beast Wars and
> > this is not meant to offend you. I just long for the days of Starscream,
> > Megatron and Optimus Prime. I mean have you played with the new toys?
> > They totally suck compared to the old ones. Optimus prime has gone from
> > a mack truck to a damn gorilla.
>
> Just for a change... Ravecavy, OOMPALOOMPIZE!
> (start the drums, you know the tune...)
>
> Oompa-Loompa-Doopity-Doo,
> I've got a brand new puzzle for you,
Well, I like BW the Show, it's not too shabby, but I must Point out,
Primal is not supposed to be Prime( Thank god) and for those of us who are
missing our old favorites (can't wait) Guess who's gonna be on the Show???
Are you ready for this?
Okay...
STARSCREAM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAGGGGGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
so don't feel too down, the Toys are kinda lame, but some work okay.
BTW, That Ompa song was hilarious, I loved it :)
Eric Lee Cline
In article <5665o5$5...@news-e2d.gnn.com> mT...@gnn.com (Mark Towe) writes:
>
> In article <564tq4$4...@news.nyu.edu> Wonko the Sane wrote:
> IN DEFENSE OF:
> >The Smith Family (smi...@gte.net) wrote:
> >Hippocron...BWADLIZE!!!
> >
> Enough of the BWADL already! Every toy has it's proponents and
> critics. It's just part of the business....
This sounds dangerously like a "get a life" post.
> >> I know that a lot of you guys out there are big fans of Beast
> Wars
>
> myself included
Alllllllright, then
> Yes, I have all of them except Cheetor and Tigatron, both of whom
> I cannot find. Some of them are good, and some of them are bad.
Fine so far...
> > Errr...no, Optimus PrimAL is NOT Optimus
> PrimE...(geez...hasn't
> >THIS been said to DEATH already?)
> >
> Wonko, you are wrong. He was referring no doubt to the toy
> Prime/Primals, therefor Optimus Prime is Optimus Primal. The
> writers of the televison show have made it clear that they are
> different, but they are the same in the toys. Primal's robot mode
> is very good, but his gorilla mode is one of thw worst yet.
Primal... Prime... sounds like two different guys to me! And I sorta like his gorilla
mode... he's the next one I'm getting. The worst Beast Mode is the property of Dinobot
and Snapper...
> >> Every transformer fan I know almost
> >> wants to cry when they go into a store and see what Transformers
> have
> >> become.
> As good as Beast Wars is selling, it is sad compared to the
> original toy line. G1 was much more popular in it's prime than BW
> will ever be. Kids beg their parents for ANY kind of toy they
> want.
Why is it sad? BW isn't even in it's Prime(Rodimus or Optimus?) yet... you can't
prejudge future popularity based on a like/dislike of a certain toy. And, yes, kids
beg, but his point was that MORE kids beg for Beast Wars.
> > Robots becoming animals are lame? So I assume you hate:
> >
> >Dinobots, Predacons, (most) of the Cassette forces, Terrorcons,
> >Monsterbots, Monstercons, Seacons etc. etc.
> >
> Aah, but they became robotic type animals in G1. Beast Wars has
> attempted to make them look like real animals, and, with few
> exceptions, has failed.
Oh, hahahahahahahahahahaha! I get it! That was a joke! Have you looked hard at BW
toys? Lessee... Megatron: Good T. Rex. Rhinox: Good rhino Gator Megs: Decent Gator.
Tarantulus: Decent spider. Waspy: D**n good wasp. Insecticon: Great beetle. And
Tigatron is AWESOME, despite some back leg junk...
> > Ah yes, and so it doesn't seem like I haven't given this
> thought:
> >
> I have been one of the proponents for Beast Wars, but the above
> arguments presented by the Smith family are viable ones. I really
> like Beast Wars, but lets not get carried away. Beast Wars the
> toy/tv show will NEVR EVER NEVER EVER be what G1 was.
In your mind, perhaps, but to the youngsters who are BW's market, BW could become
bigger than G1 ever was. (A bit optimistic(pun unintended), but a reasonable
conclusion, nonetheless)
Eric Lee Cline, BW supporter(who loved the old show as well), who is pulling an all
nighter so he can finish a paper and watch BW at 6:00 AM! http://sac.uky.edu/~elclin0
s
s
s
s
s
s
s
s
s
s
s
s
s
s
ss
ssss
Bloody computer won't let me post, noooo....
Eric Lee Cline
Alllllllright, then
Fine so far...
s
s
s
Eric Lee Cline
In article <5665o5$5...@news-e2d.gnn.com> mT...@gnn.com (Mark Towe) writes:
> IN DEFENSE OF:
> >The Smith Family (smi...@gte.net) wrote:
> >Hippocron...BWADLIZE!!!
> Enough of the BWADL already! Every toy has it's proponents and
> critics. It's just part of the business....
This sounds dangerously like a "get a life" post.
> >> I know that a lot of you guys out there are big fans of Beast Wars
> myself included
Alllllllrighty, then
> Yes, I have all of them except Cheetor and Tigatron, both of whom
> I cannot find. Some of them are good, and some of them are bad.
Fine so far...
> > Errr...no, Optimus PrimAL is NOT Optimus
> PrimE...(geez...hasn't
> Wonko, you are wrong. He was referring no doubt to the toy
> Prime/Primals, therefor Optimus Prime is Optimus Primal. The
> writers of the televison show have made it clear that they are
> different, but they are the same in the toys. Primal's robot mode
> is very good, but his gorilla mode is one of thw worst yet.
Primal... Prime... sounds like two different guys to me! And I sorta like his gorilla
mode... he's the next one I'm getting. The worst Beast Mode is the property of Dinobot
and Snapper...
> As good as Beast Wars is selling, it is sad compared to the
> original toy line. G1 was much more popular in it's prime than BW
> will ever be. Kids beg their parents for ANY kind of toy they
> want.
Why is it sad? BW isn't even in it's Prime(Rodimus or Optimus?) yet... you can't
prejudge future popularity based on a like/dislike of a certain toy. And, yes, kids
beg, but his point was that MORE kids beg for Beast Wars.
> Aah, but they became robotic type animals in G1. Beast Wars has
Your point? <quizzical stare>
> attempted to make them look like real animals, and, with few
> exceptions, has failed.
Oh, hahahahahahahahahahaha! I get it! That was a joke! Have you looked hard at BW
toys? Lessee... Megatron: Good T. Rex. Rhinox: Good rhino Gator Megs: Decent Gator.
Tarantulus: Decent spider. Waspy: D**n good wasp. Insecticon: Great beetle. And
Tigatron is AWESOME, despite some back leg junk...
Robert A. Jung
Y'know, I don't mind that there are people who don't like BEAST WARS, or
that they think it's not the "real" Transformers (hey, I was there once).
What gets my goat are the people who are too =intolerant= of their fellow
fans who happen to enjoy the toys and/or the cartoons.
No, BEAST WARS toys are not the same as the original Transformers, but that
isn't a bad thing -- they're more poseable and more durable than the originals
(put Prowl and Tarantulas through a playability test, I dare ya B-), and
are DEFINITELY reviving interest in Transformers better than G2 ever did. And
while I do like the intelligent writing in the cartoon, I, too, am waiting for
the return of vehicles and devices and whatnot.
But hey, just because BEAST WARS isn't Nirvana, what is? It's a cool toy
line, it's got a great cartoon, and it's cookin' at the stores. Why crab,
other than to be a joik?
--R.J.
B-)
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"I write because I am personally amused by what I do, and if other people are
amused by it, then it's fine. If they're not, then that's also fine."
Send mail to rj...@netcom.com --Frank Zappa
Eric Lee Cline
Sorry bout the multi-posting of my last response. The computer I was using screwed up
badly.
Eric Lee Cline, apologetic BW supporter, http://sac.uky.edu/~elclin0
The Nixtr
QUOTING:
though the
toy quality in the BW has been consistantly decent, as opposed to the
original line, which started excellent, and went to crap very quickly.
RESPONSE: Series 5 wasn't very quickly.
--
The Nixtr
** Transformer fan **
Next they'll be fighting for POST-birth abortions!
World's Weirdest Site: http://www.acy.digex.net/~thenixtr
Neale Davidson
Series one: Ironhide, Ratchet...
Series three: Blaster, Top Spin, Twin Twist.
Series four continued the trend with many of the gestalt-figs.
By the time the movie came out, the line dropped completely...
--
-----------------------------------------------
|\/| Neale Davidson
\\// Scrolls of Virtue... Transformer Addict...
http://www.erols.com/nealed
-----------------------------------------------
Neale Davidson
> That's what they said about Star Trek: The Next Generation. "It could
> NEVER be as good as the original", people said. Now look at it. ST:TNG
> is 10x better than the old series ever was in terms of story and depth
> of character. I think that BW could surprise everybody in the same way.
A matter of opinion there, friend. >I< consider TNG to be weaker than
TOS, particularly in character strength.
I also consider the new Beast Wars show to be better writter, on
average, than the Transformers show from 84-87... (GADS!). There are
toys in both lines I could have done without, however... though the
toy quality in the BW has been consistantly decent, as opposed to the
original line, which started excellent, and went to crap very quickly.
Of course, the only way that The Transformers would ever be perfect is
if >I< were working on them! :)
Dalmatian
I take TFs as they come.
I feel very glad that TFs have the opportunity to come again, even
if it is in a different form.
I love the feel of buying them again at stores, the pushing aside
of little kids who are after them too is a fringe benefit. :)
Dalmatian
richardh
>> I know that a lot of you guys out there are big fans of Beast Wars and
>> this is not meant to offend you. I just long for the days of Starscream,
>> Megatron and Optimus Prime. I mean have you played with the new toys?
Amen Brother!
>
>
>
> Robots becoming animals are lame? So I assume you hate:
Nope. Robots becoming ORGANIC animals are lame. I'd like to see these Beasts
take on Ravage,Lazerbeak, buzsaw, Ramhorn,steeljaw or any other of the animal
CASSETTES, not to mention the belo mentioned groups.
>
>Dinobots, Predacons, (most) of the Cassette forces, Terrorcons,
>Monsterbots, Monstercons, Seacons etc. etc.
>
<Rant about the toys deleted since i don't buy toys anyway>
>
What I miss is the characters, music <god, the transformers had some
great background music> and the animation of the original series. Yes i
miss the cars ad planes and animals which looked like robots in disguise
instead of animals with robotic bits and so on. But i like Beast Wars as
a temporary replacement for the real thing. I will be glad to see machine
wars and I frevrentll hope that they will bring back at least some of the
old characters that we know and love. I also wish that hasbro would get
the rights to the Japanese eps of the Transformers and bring them to
Americaa.
Richard HUDSON
Having another pipe dream
William Maddex
I couldn't have said it better myself! The original Transformers was one of
kind.
The Smith Family <smi...@gte.net> wrote in article
<328573...@gte.net>...
> I know that a lot of you guys out there are big fans of Beast Wars and
> this is not meant to offend you. I just long for the days of Starscream,
> Megatron and Optimus Prime. I mean have you played with the new toys?
> They totally suck compared to the old ones. Optimus prime has gone from
> a mack truck to a damn gorilla. Every transformer fan I know almost
> wants to cry when they go into a store and see what Transformers have
> become. I just wish that Hasbro would re-release all of the old
> transformers. Maybe they could spice them up somehow if they wanted to.
> Anything but robots transforming into animals. I mean, can we get any
> more lame?
>
> I don't mean to burst anyone's bubble but I just wish that the old
> Transformers would come back.
>
Eric Lee Cline
> Nope. Robots becoming ORGANIC animals are lame. I'd like to see these Beasts
And why is it lame? Any lamer than super-complex alien robots transforming into
Earthly vehicles?
> take on Ravage,Lazerbeak, buzsaw, Ramhorn,steeljaw or any other of the animal
> CASSETTES, not to mention the belo mentioned groups.
I believe it was a given that any given cassette couldn't hold his own against many of
the larger tfs.
> <Rant about the toys deleted since i don't buy toys anyway>
Why not? Buy Tarantulus, I did. Es muy bueno.
> What I miss is the characters,
I miss classic characters too, but these guys have got personality!
music <god, the transformers had some
Hey! BW music kicks!
> great background music> and the animation of the original series.
Ahh, yes. Inconsistant coloring, voice swapping, size changing...
(Don't get me wrong, I love old series stuff too)
Yes i
> miss the cars ad planes and animals which looked like robots in disguise
> instead of animals with robotic bits and so on.
Wait. That's backwards. The robots were more like cars in disguise. It was when they
started working too hard on good robot appearances that the alternate modes began to
suffer. Think about it. Prime was a Tractor Trailer cab with arms, legs, and head.
Tarant is a Spider with arms, legs, and head.
But i like Beast Wars as
> a temporary replacement for the real thing.
It is the real thing. Didn't you see the words "Transformers" on the box. Until the
MW specials this winter, these are THE ONLY tfs on the market, and are just as "real"
as the old ones.
I will be glad to see machine
> wars and I frevrentll hope that they will bring back at least some of the
> old characters that we know and love.
They are. Didn't you see the picture of the blue-white Race Car with "Mirage" on the
spoiler?
Eric Lee Cline, BWADLer-in-spirit http://sac.uky.edu/~elclin0
Robert A. Jung
In article <3287EB...@ix.netcom.com> Tengu <te...@ix.netcom.com> writes:
> Is that in terns of "quality," really, or just "likeability?" Hell, I
>know Prowl and Bluestreak (for example) were *quite* a bit more fragile
>than most of the post-movie toys.
No kidding. Here's an easy experiment: put one of the first-year Autobot
cars (Jazz, Prowl, Bluestreak, etc.) in a bag. Put one of the G2 Cyberjets
in a bag. Put one of the $5 or $10 BEAST WARS toys in the bag.
Go on a flight. Preferably something for a few hours. Check in the bag and
let the Samsonite gorillas play with it. I'll all but guaranteed that your
G1 car will be plastic junk, while -- at *worst* -- you can just snap a few
parts back on the Cyberjet and the Beast Warrior, and they'll be good as new.
There are some tangible benefits to these new toys, folks.
>You could throw a brick at Fort Max
>(forgive me, Primus) and he'd still be grinning.
Yeah, but those toys were big and clunky. Blaster's toy never had the
grace or elegance as Soundwave's toy, for instance. And Hot Rod is the
closest that the later toys came to the compactness of the first-year cars.
That's why I like BEAST WARS, and am *really* looking forward to MACHINE
WARS. We'll finally get the best of both words -- poseability, durability,
and compactness. YEAH!
Drogn
> P_P
> (Chocolate overload! Return to beast mode!)
Catagorically impossible.
-Drogn, He of the Typo
--
\~~~~~~~~~~~~\ \~~\__/~~/ /~~~~~~~~~~~~/ "It's a bird!"
~~~\~~~~~~ \ ~o\/o~ / ~~~~~~/~~~ "It's a plane!"
~~~\~~~ ~~ \ / ~~ ~~~/~~~ "It's a flying Ardvark!"
~~~~~~~~~ || ~~~~~~~~~ Aardvarkus Aerialis/Winged Aardvark
Scott Mcallister - UPLG/F93
Nowlin Olatunji (now...@ais.net) wrote:
: * G1 will never return
Sigh, somewhere, along the way, I've come to want Astrotrain...
maybe _some_ of them can return... :)
: * G2 was 'rushed' and improperly done (but DID come out with excellent toys
: such as the Cyberjets!)
A lot of the G2 stuff led up to the development of the Beast Wars
line. The weapons being stored on the figure (G2 cars, and the too-cool
Laser Rods), the poseability (Cyberjets, which stand as tall as mini BWs).
There's an evolution here, and I like it. Machine Wars will probably
follow up on a lot of these features, which _should_ make the BW-haters
happy, and I can't see what's not to like.
Ever notice thst BW figure categories are the same as G1? There
are the minis (Bumblebee/Rattrap), the deluxes (Prowl/Dinobot), the megas
(Roadbuster/Scorponok), and the ultras/leaders (Prime/Primal). Even more
ironic is that with the exception of the minis, the prices of each are
roughly the same as ten years ago. TFs are much more affordable now.
Now, _that_ we should all like.
: > Maybe they could spice them up somehow if they wanted to.
: Spice? Spice is for cooking.
And the gimmicks were really not interesting to me. Talking
robots? Colour-changing? Cute, but how well does it transform?
: PS This isn't a personal attack, but is directed at all the people
: who have shot down BW without even getting all the available info.
Personally, I love the BW line. I was going to get just a few,
but now... well, I only need the repaints. :)
I hope Machine Wars goes just as well as Beast Wars has been
going, and then we'll all be happy... until someone proposes a group
split (a.t.t.beast-wars, anyone?).
Scott
Khoa Vuong
>
> Is that in terns of "quality," really, or just "likeability?" Hell, I
> know Prowl and Bluestreak (for example) were *quite* a bit more fragile
> (forgive me, Primus) and he'd still be grinning. Personally, I had the
> most fun in my 7th to 9th grade years playing with the post movie
> stuff. I'm constantly at a loss when people suggest that Transformers
> sucked after they were no longer Takara-bred products.
> Ah, well- to each his own. But I still think the Headmasters and kin
> have more play value and durability than the majority of the first two
> series toys. (And yes, I do know that is a *really* loaded statement.)
>
Actually, quality doesn;t mean durability, either.
Sure, they were fragile, but that's just because they had more complex
transformations back then (now that's quality!). I can remember that
part of the excitement of opening up a newly purchased TF was that I
could actually spent some time figuring out how it transformed. And now
we have the BW toys. Sad, just sad. They're nothing more than robots
within a animal shell. *That's* why they're durable, as if that was
important.
Am I the only one who doesn't throw bricks at my TF's? Anyways, if
breaking toys is a problem i suggest you get those nifty Tonka Mack
trucks. Oh, how I miss Optimus.
--
TOP COW! WITCHBLADE! and, um..the Transformers.
Images at Grifter's Gallery:
http://www.geocities.com/Tokyo/5200/index.html
Playground Psychotic
> > >
> > > I know that a lot of you guys out there are big fans of Beast Wars and
> > > this is not meant to offend you. I just long for the days of Starscream,
> > > Megatron and Optimus Prime. I mean have you played with the new toys?
> > > They totally suck compared to the old ones. Optimus prime has gone from
> > > a mack truck to a damn gorilla.
> >
> > (start the drums, you know the tune...)
> >
> > Oompa-Loompa-Doopity-Doo,
> > I've got a brand new puzzle for you,
>
> Well, I like BW the Show, it's not too shabby, but I must Point out,
> Primal is not supposed to be Prime( Thank god)
Which was the point of the song. Weren't you reading?
> and for those of us who are
> missing our old favorites (can't wait) Guess who's gonna be on the Show???
>
> Are you ready for this?
>
> Okay...
>
> STARSCREAM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
> AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAGGGGGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I believe that if you rode into the Amazon rain forest and
into a Yanomamo village, where the people have been
completely secluded from the rest of the world for over 300
years, and went into the hut of a 105-year-old man, and
whispered into his ear, "G1 character in Beast Wars," he
would instantly smile and say "Starscream!"
No point in the spoiler link on the BW page, Wonko. Everyone
and their respective dogs know who's going to be in
"Possesion" now.
>
> so don't feel too down, the Toys are kinda lame,
Are not! (Except maybe Armordillo. But I still like him.)
> BTW, That Ompa song was hilarious, I loved it :)
>
Thanks. I was feeling poetic.
--
/------\ /------\
/ \ / \
/ ________/ / ________/
/ (*)/ / (*)/
/ ______/ / ______/
/ | / |
/ | ____ / |
/ | _____/ | |\ / |
/ | _|_|_|_|_|_\/ |
\_/ |_|_|_|_|_|/\_/
Playground Psychotic
(Now to do one to the tune of "You're A Mean One, Mr.
Grinch").
Playground Psychotic
Robert Edward Powers
Neale Davidson (nea...@erols.com) wrote:
: Series one: Ironhide, Ratchet...
: Series three: Blaster, Top Spin, Twin Twist.
: Series four continued the trend with many of the gestalt-figs.
: By the time the movie came out, the line dropped completely...
Series (year) TWO was the one with Blaster and co. And it basically
was a continuation of the first year, with many recolored/partially
re-molded figures, like Thrust/Ramjet/Dirge, Hoist (Trailbreaker), Red
Alert (Sideswipe), etc. If you like the first-year series, I fail to see
how you could dis-like the second-years.
The THIRD year was the year of the movie characters, and by then,
things had changed noticabley. Personally, I still liked many of the
toys (and even more so for the fourth season). But if the first year is
your (sole) standard of quality, the third year is where the decline began.
--
Robert Powers of the Eternally-Changing .sig
repo...@artsci.wustl.edu ____________________________________________
| My life is changing in so many ways, I don't know who to trust |
| anymore... there's a shadow runnin' through my days... -- Neil Young|
|___ Seems I lost my way; there were oh so many roads... -- Bob Seger_|
MegaBee
Khoa Vuong <tc...@geocities.com> wrote:
: >
: > Is that in terns of "quality," really, or just "likeability?" Hell, I
: > know Prowl and Bluestreak (for example) were *quite* a bit more fragile
: > than most of the post-movie toys. You could throw a brick at Fort Max
: > (forgive me, Primus) and he'd still be grinning. Personally, I had the
: > most fun in my 7th to 9th grade years playing with the post movie
: > stuff. I'm constantly at a loss when people suggest that Transformers
: > sucked after they were no longer Takara-bred products.
: > Ah, well- to each his own. But I still think the Headmasters and kin
: > have more play value and durability than the majority of the first two
: > series toys. (And yes, I do know that is a *really* loaded statement.)
: >
: Actually, quality doesn;t mean durability, either.
: Sure, they were fragile, but that's just because they had more complex
: transformations back then (now that's quality!). I can remember that
: part of the excitement of opening up a newly purchased TF was that I
: could actually spent some time figuring out how it transformed. And now
: we have the BW toys. Sad, just sad. They're nothing more than robots
: within a animal shell. *That's* why they're durable, as if that was
: important.
T. Rex Megatron: durability and complexity of transformation (now that's
quality!). It is possible to have both.
: Am I the only one who doesn't throw bricks at my TF's? Anyways, if
: breaking toys is a problem i suggest you get those nifty Tonka Mack
: trucks. Oh, how I miss Optimus.
Tonka Mack trucks don't transform, dude, unless there's something you
aren't telling us.
----
H. Jameel al Khafiz
Physicist-At-Large
http://www.dhp.com/~spectre
Robert Edward Powers
Khoa Vuong (tc...@geocities.com) wrote:
: Actually, quality doesn;t mean durability, either.
: Sure, they were fragile, but that's just because they had more complex
: transformations back then (now that's quality!).
Chicken Lips, uhhh... ummm... uhhh... what was I gonna do? Oh yeah!
BWADLIZE! BaCAWWWWW!!
Oh ho HO!! I BEG to differ!
Have you transformed BW Megatron? This guy is as complex as almost any
first or second year TF, with the only possible exception being Omega
Supreme. You've got to pull and push and twist and turn and snap and
arrange all sort of things to get him into robot form. And when you're
done, you get a fully posable robot, whose head turns left and right, up
and down, whose arms bend from the shoulders (two ways) and the elbows,
and whose legs are jointed at the waist, knees, and ankles. He's
durable, to boot. No fragile snapping-off windshields on THIS guy.
And he's not the only one. It took me a lot of wrestling with Dinobot,
Rhinox, Wolfang, and Tigatron to get them transformed. These fellows are
COMPLEX, easily in a league with the G1 Autobot cars, and not nearly as
delicate. All other things being equal, doesn't durability put them over
the top?
Sure, the smaller ones have simple transformations, but they still have
as many steps as most of the G1 minis. Only Brawn was more complicated
than the Regular Beasts. And they're not terribly simple to get back
into beast mode.
As for the realism of the beast modes... sure, they're not perfect.
But which of the G1 cars was?? Even in the best of them, you still had
unrealistic lines cutting across hoods, through windows, etc. And
sometimes you could see parts, like the bottom of Sideswipe's feet on his
bumper. And look at Prowl's interior! I ain't NEVER seen a Datsun that
looked like that inside. And these were the cream of the crop when it
comes to realistic disguises. So, I'd say BW cuts it just about even
with G1 on the disguise factor.
I can remember that
: part of the excitement of opening up a newly purchased TF was that I
: could actually spent some time figuring out how it transformed.
Go get BW Megs. Go get Rhinox. The excitement, the magic, is back.
: within a animal shell. *That's* why they're durable, as if that was
: important.
You're right, durability isn't important. I hope Machine Wars is made
of thin glass. It'll look cool, and who cares if it shatters when a
seven-year-old tosses it across the room? Or when a 23-year-old makes a
slight mistake in transforming it...
His mission complete, Chicken Lips returns to beast mode and flounders
into the distance, leaving only singed Usenetcape and the smell of burnt
feathers behind him!
--
Robert Powers of the Highly-Compressible .sig
repo...@artsci.wustl.edu ____________________________________________
| About 10^-5 s after you cross the Schwarzschild radius, you crash |
| into a singularity. Crushed to zero volume, you are destroyed. |
|_________________________________-- Intro Astrophysics_______________|
Tengu
Khoa Vuong wrote:
>
> Actually, quality doesn;t mean durability, either.
Well, to me it certainly does. Quality for me is how well something is
made. Practical durability is a major aspect of quality. Otherwise,
we're talking technical features or aesthetics.
> Sure, they were fragile, but that's just because they had more complex
> transformations back then (now that's quality!).
BW Megatron-dino vs. Bumblebee. Hmmm. No contest. A cheap shot
perhaps, but the "complexity of transformations" argument is pretty thin
and just doesn't wash. It's a subjective issue to each specific toy and
transform.
> I can remember that
> part of the excitement of opening up a newly purchased TF was that I
> could actually spent some time figuring out how it transformed.
Again, the BW Megatron. I am what some individuals might marginalize as
a "techie." That purple bastard still took me longer to transform than
most of the old TFs ever did.
And the excitement is still there. Geez, a twelve-year-old plus toy
line? YAY!
> And now
> we have the BW toys. Sad, just sad. They're nothing more than robots
> within a animal shell. *That's* why they're durable, as if that was
> important.
Incorrect, and it's obvious that you probably don't own any BW toys.
Cheetor and Waspinator, to name two, do not *hide in shells*.
Comparatively, the BW toys are no less or more "shell hiders" than the
G1 Transformers. You must be thinking of those little transforming eggs
from the He-Man line.
> Am I the only one who doesn't throw bricks at my TF's? Anyways, if
> breaking toys is a problem i suggest you get those nifty Tonka Mack
> trucks. Oh, how I miss Optimus.
>
Wow, you actually took me seriously there. That was meant as a joking
example of the durability of the post-movie toys. Furthermore, my
original post (and that specific statement) had nothing to do with Beast
Wars toys (though I'm more than happy to defend them). Why the
connection with my post? Or is this just another case of "boo hoo, I
wish I was nine again and could by Sunstreaker at TRU?" Geez, Beast
Wars exists, deal with it. I wouldn't normally be so curt, but calling
BW "sad" and seemingly basing an argument around that and an unrelated
post is well... sad.
Tengu:<>
-who doesn't understand the "I miss G1 Transformer X,Y,
Z" argument. It's not like when Beast Wars came out all
the old
toys ceased to exist...
Wonko the Sane
> Enough of the BWADL already! Every toy has it's proponents and
> critics. It's just part of the business....
Truthfully, the BWADL battle cry is more of a poke of fun at the
show than anything else for me personally, sorry it offended you so.
[snip]
> Wonko, you are wrong. He was referring no doubt to the toy
> Prime/Primals, therefor Optimus Prime is Optimus Primal. The
> writers of the televison show have made it clear that they are
> different, but they are the same in the toys. Primal's robot mode
> is very good, but his gorilla mode is one of thw worst yet.
Perhaps, but if the original poster was attacking the toys, then I
will present this non-inflammatory, non-condescending, non-critical
defense:
Let's dive into the "storyline" of the toys for a moment. Our
best look into this world (besides tech specs) seems to be the small Beast
Wars "Mini comic" which basically just tells us Optimus Prime for some
unknown reason changed his name and became a bat (and later a gorilla).
It seems that the Transformers have taken their fight into more
"primitive" territory (or perhaps "natural" is a better word). If this is
the case, then animal forms suited to the local environment would be most
advantageous compared to being a mack truck or Datsun sports car would you
not agree? I know if I was a TF who had to choose between being a truck
driving around tree after tree and potentially getting stuck in a swamp
(even if for a few moments before transforming into robot mode and just
walking away), I would do so for optimum battle efficiency. Why not
choose a bat and just glide past the trees or become an ape and swing from
one to the other?
This is rather "loose" logic here, but no GREAT detail is given
about the "toy" world of the Beast Wars but it seems like in the
environment the Transformers have chosen to fight in now, beast modes make
sense.
[snip]
> As good as Beast Wars is selling, it is sad compared to the
> original toy line. G1 was much more popular in it's prime than BW
> will ever be. Kids beg their parents for ANY kind of toy they
> want.
Not true. As my original post said, Transformers has been largely
ignored by kids for quite some time. Remember when Generation 2 was first
launched and the CGI commercial for it was shown in theaters (with Home
Alone 2)? I was there and you know how kids reacted to that commercial?
"Transformers are coming back? That's stupid!" And I'm not just talking
one kid, I'm talking a room filled with roughly over a hundred kids and
parents and I heard no one clapping or saying "Yay!", the sales of
Generation 2 sort of reflect this unfortunate attitude.
Then on my own toy purchasing runs, I watched as kids ran past
TF's or looked at TF's and barely gave them a second thought as they
turned to Turtles, Batman, X-Men and many other lines. THAT, my friend,
was sad. So now when I see kids getting excited over TF's again, it
really is nice to see.
If BW's performance is not the same as G1's performance in 1984,
that's not great, but it's not bad either. BW is selling, pure and
simple. From it's sales, we have a new year of Beast Wars AND a more
"traditional" Machine Wars line as well. The best of both worlds and it
came from Beast Wars' "limited" success. Is that sad? I don't think so.
[snip]
> > Robots becoming animals are lame? So I assume you hate:
> >Dinobots, Predacons, (most) of the Cassette forces, Terrorcons,
> >Monsterbots, Monstercons, Seacons etc. etc.
> Aah, but they became robotic type animals in G1. Beast Wars has
> attempted to make them look like real animals, and, with few
> exceptions, has failed.
Let's take it back to basics. What are Transformers? "Robots in
Disguise", "More than meets the eye!", "More...much more than meets the
eye!", choose one. Now, originally, disguise was one of the big pushes of
the TF line, that's why so many people were impressed by TF's that became
vehicles and things that looked like the "real" objects (such as cars and
cassettes). That changed over time. Would you mistake say, Slag for a
real Tricerotops? Would you look at Divebomb and say "That's a real
bird."? No, the purpose of the "alternate" forms quickly lost their
"disguise" factor which to me, was disappointing.
I like the animal forms of BW NOT because they are ultra, mega
authentic representations of the "real" animals. I like the back story
behind them and the attempt at making them look at least "semi-real". We
could disagree on the toy quality 'til we're blue in the ol' noggin', but
my point is, Beast Wars TF's are meant to be "Robots in Disguise" to SOME
degree (at least in the toy line, the show's storyline can be argued
about), and to me that brings them closer to what my perception of the
original "essence" of the Transformers line was.
[snip]
> I have been one of the proponents for Beast Wars, but the above
> arguments presented by the Smith family are viable ones. I really
> like Beast Wars, but lets not get carried away. Beast Wars the
> toy/tv show will NEVR EVER NEVER EVER be what G1 was.
I agree. But you know what? I don't think BW was EVER EVER
intended to be what G1 was. Generation 2 was an attempt to revive the
"flavor" of G1 and look where that went.
Regarding the Smith Family comments, it sounded like they lacked
certain info about the line and the show, so I provided it. If that's
wrong of me, then so be it. It takes all kinds of opinions to make the
world interesting, BW seems to be a err..."Prime" example of that.
**********************************************
*Name: Benson "Ironfire" Yee *
*a.k.a. Wonko the Sane *
*e-mail: ye...@is2.nyu.edu *
******************************************
*Transformers Beast Wars web page: *
*http://acweb.com/ben/beast.htm *
***************************************
"Aaawww do you need a hug?"
Cheetor, "Victory"
Jacob Hurtado
Wonko the Sane wrote:
> Remember when Generation 2 was first
> launched and the CGI commercial for it was shown in theaters (with Home
> Alone 2)?
Did they really have a commercial in front of Home Alone 2? Odd since I
saw that movie in theaters(blech) and I didn't see it.
Chuck and Jody
So thats wat my folks saw....My mom called me up when HA2 came out and
said Guess What ... Your Transformers are getting another movie...
*shrugs*
And I thought she was crazy.
Wonko the Sane
Jacob Hurtado (Jac...@worldnet.att.net) wrote:
: Wonko the Sane wrote:
: > Remember when Generation 2 was first
: > launched and the CGI commercial for it was shown in theaters (with Home
: > Alone 2)?
: Did they really have a commercial in front of Home Alone 2? Odd since I
Opening day. It was also mentioned in an advertising magazine
(which is how I knew about it). I'm not sure if it was shown after the
first week or so.
Jonathan McDougall and/or Melissa Andrews
>
> Series (year) TWO was the one with Blaster and co. And it basically
> was a continuation of the first year, with many recolored/partially
> re-molded figures, like Thrust/Ramjet/Dirge, Hoist (Trailbreaker), Red
> Alert (Sideswipe), etc. If you like the first-year series, I fail to see
> how you could dis-like the second-years.
>
> The THIRD year was the year of the movie characters, and by then,
> things had changed noticabley. Personally, I still liked many of the
> toys (and even more so for the fourth season). But if the first year is
> your (sole) standard of quality, the third year is where the decline began.
I would disagree with that. I mean, yes the second season has some great
episodes (like the one with the hypnotic nightclub), it also had some
pretty dumb ones, like New Cybertron, the one with the great car race, the
one where they meet Aaron the alien, etc. Also, the art in the second
year was variable at best, with some rather terrible drawings of the TFs.
I also found that overall, the first year had a somewhat darker edge than
the second one. The second one I thought, had become more juvenile in an
attempt to appeal more to kids. A great series like "The Ultimate Doom"
would never have taken place in the second year.
Jon
Robert Edward Powers
Jonathan McDougall and/or Melissa Andrews (614...@ican.net) wrote:
: > was a continuation of the first year, with many recolored/partially
: > Alert (Sideswipe), etc. If you like the first-year series, I fail to see
: > how you could dis-like the second-years.
: I would disagree with that. I mean, yes the second season has some great
: episodes
Whoa, whoa whooooooaHhhhhhhold it right there kid!
Re-read what you quoted -- I was referring to the *toys* only. My
point was that the second YEAR toys were largely of the same style and
complexity of the first-YEAR ones.
And I disagree, the second SEASON of cartoons is great -- IMO, the best of
the three. It had range, complexity, a feeling of lots of things going
on. Yes, there were some silly episodes, but a lot of them were fun.
And the darker edge was much more present than in the 1rst season -- only
Ultimate Doom comes close, IMO. There was lots of extended character
development, and several great solo stories. I could go on, but it's
late, and I'm feeling too mellow to argue much...
--
Robert Powers of the Ever-Changing .sig
repo...@artsci.wustl.edu_______________
| SONG IN MY HEAD RIGHT NOW: |
| The Sports Theme, TF season two |
|_______________________________________|
Wonko the Sane
: Khoa Vuong <tc...@geocities.com> wrote:
[snip]
: : Actually, quality doesn;t mean durability, either.
: : Sure, they were fragile, but that's just because they had more complex
: : transformations back then (now that's quality!). I can remember that
: : part of the excitement of opening up a newly purchased TF was that I
: : we have the BW toys. Sad, just sad. They're nothing more than robots
: : within a animal shell. *That's* why they're durable, as if that was
: : important.
Hmmm...interesting approach, let's see:
G1 Jazz BW Dinobot
^^^^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^^
(From car to robot from memory) (From dino mode to robot from mem)
a. Fold out arms from underneath hood. a. Fold out arms from sides.
b. Slide back hood (attached to head) b. Fold legs down.
c. Flip head up. c. Twist legs flip feet out.
d. Extend "legs" out. d. Flip sides of dino up.
e. Fold robot upwards so it stands. e. Fold down dino head.
f. Place weapons in hands and back. f. Remove tail, split open and
attach appropriate weapons.
Hmmm...let's try again:
G1 Bumblebee (pick a color) BW Rattrap
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^^
(From car to robot from memory) (From rat mode to robot mode)
a. Pull out arms. a. Flip tail up, halves open up.
b. Flip open head. b. Move arms out.
c. Pull feet out. c. Remove weapon parts & assemble.
d. Flip up to stand d. Place weapon in hand.
Hmmmm...hey, let's try again! :)
G1 Optimus Prime BW Optimus Primal Gorilla
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
(From truck to 'bot from mem) (From Gorilla to robot)
a. Detach trailer. a. Straighten legs.
b. Open up trailer to form base. b. Fold out feet.
c. Attach trailer parts (missiles etc.) c. Flip "ape" hind feet.
d. Flip out cab's legs. d. Fold gorilla face down.
e. Flip 'feet'. e. Flip gorilla face.
f. Swing out arms. f. Move 'shoulders' up.
g. Flip up head. g. Attach weapons.
h. Attach appropriate fists and weapons.
Hmmmm...doesn't seem like BW are just 1,2,3 snap, crackle, pop
transformations to me. 'Course, to be perfectly honest, SO many TF's
exist, SOME are bound to be more complex than others (compare G1
Beachomber to G1 Prowl for instance). Your comment about 'animal shells'
is appropriate for SOME (not all) of the smaller BW figs (like Rattrap and
Razorbeast) but the Deluxes and Ultras are pretty complex themselves (I
think the Megas are pretty simple in comparison).
Durability is an issue with me as well. I don't toss heavy
objects at my toys but if it falls from a display, I want to know it won't
fall into ten separate pieces that I'll need glue to put back together.
Also, transformation should not break any parts of the toys but some of
the G1 stuff downright scares me. I freak whenever I disassemble my
Powermaster Decepticon jets. They always make a LOUD snapping noise and
I'm always afraid I've broken something.
I also don't like things I spend my hard earned money on breaking
in general. :)
**********************************************
*Name: Benson "Ironfire" Yee *
*a.k.a. Wonko the Sane *
*e-mail: ye...@is2.nyu.edu *
******************************************
*Transformers Beast Wars web page: *
*http://acweb.com/ben/beast.htm *
***************************************
"If Waspinator does not stop cuddling me like a stuffed
toy when he sleeps, I'll eat him as well!"
-Tarantulas "Victory"
BUBSY
Tengu <te...@ix.netcom.com> wrote:
>Neale Davidson wrote:
>>
>> Series one: Ironhide, Ratchet...
>> Series three: Blaster, Top Spin, Twin Twist.
>> Series four continued the trend with many of the gestalt-figs.
>> By the time the movie came out, the line dropped completely...
>>
> Is that in terns of "quality," really, or just "likeability?" Hell, I
>know Prowl and Bluestreak (for example) were *quite* a bit more fragile
>than most of the post-movie toys. You could throw a brick at Fort Max
>(forgive me, Primus) and he'd still be grinning. Personally, I had the
>most fun in my 7th to 9th grade years playing with the post movie
>stuff. I'm constantly at a loss when people suggest that Transformers
>sucked after they were no longer Takara-bred products.
> Ah, well- to each his own. But I still think the Headmasters and kin
>have more play value and durability than the majority of the first two
>series toys. (And yes, I do know that is a *really* loaded statement.)
> Tengu:<>
you know, when i was a little kid and i only had one TF toy to play
with (my headmaster optimus prime with the trailer that turned into
his body) and a couple battle beasts (gawd, you remember those?) and
the cool thing was that the little headmaster guy was about as big as
the battle beasts, and they could fight, until he jumped on BIG ASS
optimus and you could probably figure out what came next...
______________________________________________
BU...@ghgcorp.com | Stand out or Be Forgotten |
{http://www.ghgcorp.com/bubsy} |
----------------------------------------------
BUBSY
The Smith Family <smi...@gte.net> wrote:
>I know that a lot of you guys out there are big fans of Beast Wars and
>this is not meant to offend you. I just long for the days of Starscream,
>Megatron and Optimus Prime. I mean have you played with the new toys?
>They totally suck compared to the old ones. Optimus prime has gone from
>a mack truck to a damn gorilla. Every transformer fan I know almost
>wants to cry when they go into a store and see what Transformers have
>become. I just wish that Hasbro would re-release all of the old
>transformers. Maybe they could spice them up somehow if they wanted to.
>Anything but robots transforming into animals. I mean, can we get any
>more lame?
>I don't mean to burst anyone's bubble but I just wish that the old
>Transformers would come back.
>- rob "the choda" smith
aw, now lighten up- have your really -played- with the BW toys?
Optimus Primal & Megatron are REAL poseable, lot's LOTS of
accessories... pop out missiles, and all their stuff stows in the
body.. they're really good toys, actually. i was comparing them to my
cheapo few transformers i have left from when I was a kid, and the BW
figures really are a lot better, they're ACTION figures.
DeadPhrog
In article Smith Family <smi...@gte.net> wrote:
>I know that a lot of you guys out there are big fans of Beast Wars and
>this is not meant to offend you. I just long for the days of Starscream,
>Megatron and Optimus Prime. I mean have you played with the new toys?
>They totally suck compared to the old ones.
DeadPhrog nuetralize! (Hey, so I like Bots and Cons equal, that makes me
nuetral! :) )
Excuse me, the toys suck? I think not. You obviously haven''t PLAYED with
the toys. Do something for me, go and buy/rent/steal/borrow Ultra Megatron,
Dinbot, Wolffang, and Scorpinok (sp?.) Meggy, loads of kewl gimmicks, water
gun, missle launcher, KEWL transformatiom, Dino mode is sooooo kewl. Dinbot,
kewl modes and transformation, nice sword, spinning gimmick is kind of stupid,
buttttttt, Wolffang, soooo kewl! Looks like a Cybertronian worriar wearing
skins in bot mode, kewl gun, (which launches missles) awesome sheild. Scopry,
looks kewl, kewl transformation, kewl BEE!, kewl! These toys beat many of my
old TFs. (Blades... just kinda sits there. PM Op can't touch his toes.. :)
I wanna drop my AM Bumblebee off a cliff, and since I got him at GoodWill
accs.-less and his legs come off, he's the perfect victim! (BW Meggs has
chomped off his foot, only for Origonal Wheeljack (monkey-boy) to come
(knuckles dragging) over and pop BB's leg back on...)
>Optimus prime has gone from
>a mack truck to a damn gorilla. Every transformer fan I know almost
>wants to cry when they go into a store and see what Transformers have
>become.
I wanna cry when I hear heresy's like this! Face it, pal, BWs are TFs, and if
you don't like them quit whining and wait for MW, which seems to truley be G3,
repaints, non-posibility, and all.
>I just wish that Hasbro would re-release all of the old
>transformers.
Maybe with MW you'll get your wish...
>Maybe they could spice them up somehow if they wanted to.
LIke what? Turn them into animals.....
>Anything but robots transforming into animals. I mean, can we get any
>more lame?
Can you say Pretenders? Dinobots? Shall I continue? Apeface... there's
tons of G1's with animal modes.
>I don't mean to burst anyone's bubble but I just wish that the old
>Transformers would come back.
I don't mean to burst yours, but BWs are kewl. And there's always MW.
----====DeadPhrog====---- anachronism, President and founder of SHATTERED PERSPECTIVES GAMES, Offcial ZZT/MZX NL reporter || Fan of Robotech/Macross, Transformers, Dr. Who, Nowhere Man, Hitchhiker's Guide || Author of the fanfics in progress Robotech: Secrets of the Flower, and Transformers: Crash || "I think I'm dumb, maybe just happy..."-Nirvana || I'd give my right arm to be ambidexterous! || Looking for: eps of Macross 7 and the G1 TF Jetfire . || "Hah!" - ALF || "Oh great, I'm starti
ng to sound like Optimus Pinhead!" -Rattrap, Beast Wars Transformers.
DeadPhrog
In article <32a0f...@news.ghgcorp.com>, BU...@ghgcorp.com (BUBSY) wrote:
>you know, when i was a little kid and i only had one TF toy to play
>with (my headmaster optimus prime
I think you mean POWERMaster Optimus Prime. (I have it, I should know.)
>with the trailer that turned into
>his body) and a couple battle beasts (gawd, you remember those?) and
>the cool thing was that the little headmaster guy was about as big as
>the battle beasts, and they could fight, until he jumped on BIG ASS
>optimus and you could probably figure out what came next...
Broken legs? SPCA stormed your house? :)
The Iggy Guy
Zobovor
> First message here since 1996 lmao
Zob (we proably won't ever get a new Injector, though, because even after a quarter-century he's still objectively awful)
Irrellius Spamticon
Codigo Postal
With every year of beasts in the 90s, or Armada/Energon/Cybertron in the 2000s, the hope that G1 would ever return grew more and more remote, and that almost certainly provoked much of the antipathy towards the new additions to the brand.
Today, it seems almost quaint. G1 is bigger than ever and here to stay, and it means many of us can look back at those offshoots with more understanding and perhaps fondness.
Zobovor
> It's like hating your new stepdad, not so much on his own merits, but because his arrival means that your actual dad is almost certainly not going to come back.
Zob (G1 only lasted for seven years, and we've now gotten about 16 years of G1 revival toys)
Joseph Bardsley
(And, hopefully, increased tolerance of Beast Era-aberrations).
:)
JB
Gustavo Wombat
I really want a new one. I think they could have done something with the
Airazor/Terrorsaur mold, even if they had to give her hands. (Perhaps the
jaw assembly and tail could detach to form weapons that enclose the fists…)
Codigo Postal
> : Actually, quality doesn;t mean durability, either.
> : Sure, they were fragile, but that's just because they had more complex
> : transformations back then (now that's quality!).
> BWADLIZE! BaCAWWWWW!!
> Oh ho HO!! I BEG to differ!
> Have you transformed BW Megatron? This guy is as complex as almost any
> first or second year TF, with the only possible exception being Omega
> Supreme. You've got to pull and push and twist and turn and snap and
> arrange all sort of things to get him into robot form. And when you're
> done, you get a fully posable robot, whose head turns left and right, up
> and down, whose arms bend from the shoulders (two ways) and the elbows,
> and whose legs are jointed at the waist, knees, and ankles. He's
> durable, to boot. No fragile snapping-off windshields on THIS guy.
> And he's not the only one. It took me a lot of wrestling with Dinobot,
> Rhinox, Wolfang, and Tigatron to get them transformed. These fellows are
> COMPLEX, easily in a league with the G1 Autobot cars, and not nearly as
> delicate. All other things being equal, doesn't durability put them over
> the top?
Realistic beast modes. Robot modes that were poseable and playable. Intuitive, fun, and quick transformations. I picked up the reissue Cheetor and Rattrap, my first experience with the molds, and for my money, superior in most ways to the recent Kingdom releases. That they were once considered complex transformations, especially compared to some of the finicky modern releases..!
> Go get BW Megs. Go get Rhinox. The excitement, the magic, is back.
Kingdom Rhinox...perhaps less so.
Zackary Sullivan
> ng to sound like Optimus Pinhead!" -Rattrap, Beast Wars Transformers.
Zobovor
> Actually robots transforming into animals is some of the coolest shit ever loser
Zob (prepare for my devastating rebuttal in 2050!)
