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Retarded sales weasels, but I repeat myself.
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Cipher
Feb 27, 2012, 5:55:59 PM2/27/12
to
Install demo on Wednesday.
Start getting 1-2 emails a day telling us how great the software is and
to let them know if we have issues.
Tell them on Thursday afternoon (via email) no, we don't want it [0].
Emails keep coming.
My email to the sales retard[1] asked the rhetorical question, "Was
there something about the email I send on the 24th saying, 'We have
decided against it' unclear? Do you really think emailing me daily is
helping?"
I got a (sort of?) apologetic email from sales moron[1] claiming it's
from an auto-sender.
I almost replied with, "Sure with your name and signature attached.
Let's go with that" but managed to restrain only because we actually do
buy from their parent company.
[0]The software's shit[2] and it's clear after four hours of working
with i. Pity, I hoped it would work to get all monitoring, patching and
updates under one server install.
[1] Duplicate word detected.
[2] Qryy XNPR
--
The word "urgent" is the moral of the story "The boy who cried wolf". As
a general rule I don't believe it until a manager comes to me almost in
tears. I like to catch them in a cup and drink them later.
-- Matt Holiab, in the Monastery
Start getting 1-2 emails a day telling us how great the software is and
to let them know if we have issues.
Tell them on Thursday afternoon (via email) no, we don't want it [0].
Emails keep coming.
My email to the sales retard[1] asked the rhetorical question, "Was
there something about the email I send on the 24th saying, 'We have
decided against it' unclear? Do you really think emailing me daily is
helping?"
I got a (sort of?) apologetic email from sales moron[1] claiming it's
from an auto-sender.
I almost replied with, "Sure with your name and signature attached.
Let's go with that" but managed to restrain only because we actually do
buy from their parent company.
[0]The software's shit[2] and it's clear after four hours of working
with i. Pity, I hoped it would work to get all monitoring, patching and
updates under one server install.
[1] Duplicate word detected.
[2] Qryy XNPR
--
The word "urgent" is the moral of the story "The boy who cried wolf". As
a general rule I don't believe it until a manager comes to me almost in
tears. I like to catch them in a cup and drink them later.
-- Matt Holiab, in the Monastery
he...@kharendaen.dyndns.org
Feb 28, 2012, 11:37:40 AM2/28/12
to
Cipher <nota...@hotmail.com> writes:
> Install demo on Wednesday.
> [...]
all outward appearances does what it says on the tin. Tried the demo
and it would indeed solve a minor one-off problem we were working.
Vendor webshite has no hint about pricing, just "email and ask". I did.
Got an answer in the multiple kibibucks. Uh, no thanks.
Got another email, basically demanding that I justify my "no".
In what bizarre alternate universe is that *ever* a useful sales tactic?
> Install demo on Wednesday.
> [...]
> Tell them on Thursday afternoon (via email) no, we don't want it [0].
> Emails keep coming.
Had one like that last week. The software is moderately nifty and to
> Emails keep coming.
all outward appearances does what it says on the tin. Tried the demo
and it would indeed solve a minor one-off problem we were working.
Vendor webshite has no hint about pricing, just "email and ask". I did.
Got an answer in the multiple kibibucks. Uh, no thanks.
Got another email, basically demanding that I justify my "no".
In what bizarre alternate universe is that *ever* a useful sales tactic?
Message has been deleted
Graham Reed
Feb 28, 2012, 3:04:48 PM2/28/12
to
he...@kharendaen.dyndns.org writes:
> In what bizarre alternate universe is that *ever* a useful sales tactic?
The same one where people actually ring the doorbell and say, "I saw
> In what bizarre alternate universe is that *ever* a useful sales tactic?
your 'No Soliciting' sign, but I'm sure you be interested in...".
I figure some people have "don't be rude" drilled into them so much that
they can't actually say "no" to someone's face.
I don't have that problem. I can slam the door in their face, too.
(And there's a by-election. One party left to ring my doorbell and I
don't have to go to the poll: I don't vote for anyone who ignores 'No
Soliciting' signs.)
--
"Look, dear, I got you a mild concussion."
-- Rich Franklin on his wife's 30th birthday
Kevin Goebel
Feb 29, 2012, 1:52:52 AM2/29/12
to
costs half a kibibuck. It's so good they don't advertise it. In fact, you
have to be referred to them by an existing customer."
Kevin Goebel
Kevin Goebel
Feb 29, 2012, 1:53:04 AM2/29/12
to
On Tue, 28 Feb 2012 15:04:48 -0500, Graham Reed <gr...@pobox.com> wrote:
>he...@kharendaen.dyndns.org writes:
>> In what bizarre alternate universe is that *ever* a useful sales tactic?
>The same one where people actually ring the doorbell and say, "I saw
>your 'No Soliciting' sign, but I'm sure you be interested in...".
>I figure some people have "don't be rude" drilled into them so much that
>they can't actually say "no" to someone's face.
>I don't have that problem. I can slam the door in their face, too.
>(And there's a by-election. One party left to ring my doorbell and I
>don't have to go to the poll: I don't vote for anyone who ignores 'No
>Soliciting' signs.)
I'm using the mailings version of that selection process. Cause any
>he...@kharendaen.dyndns.org writes:
>> In what bizarre alternate universe is that *ever* a useful sales tactic?
>The same one where people actually ring the doorbell and say, "I saw
>your 'No Soliciting' sign, but I'm sure you be interested in...".
>I figure some people have "don't be rude" drilled into them so much that
>they can't actually say "no" to someone's face.
>I don't have that problem. I can slam the door in their face, too.
>(And there's a by-election. One party left to ring my doorbell and I
>don't have to go to the poll: I don't vote for anyone who ignores 'No
>Soliciting' signs.)
political junk to be deposited in my mailbox and you are off the list. If
it's down to one non-offender for that office, they get my vote.
Kevin
LP
Feb 29, 2012, 6:06:32 AM2/29/12
to
On 2012-02-28, Graham Reed <gr...@pobox.com> wrote:
> he...@kharendaen.dyndns.org writes:
>> In what bizarre alternate universe is that *ever* a useful sales tactic?
>
> The same one where people actually ring the doorbell and say, "I saw
> your 'No Soliciting' sign, but I'm sure you be interested in...".
I once answered the door to a chap like that who wouldn't take no for
> he...@kharendaen.dyndns.org writes:
>> In what bizarre alternate universe is that *ever* a useful sales tactic?
>
> The same one where people actually ring the doorbell and say, "I saw
> your 'No Soliciting' sign, but I'm sure you be interested in...".
an answer. As he was trying to sell to me the second time, I calmly
reached out for an airhorn that happened to be on a table near by and
gave him a good long blast - said "no" and then shut the door calmly
in his stunned face.
It was a terribly satisfying experience for me, and I like to think it
gave him a good story to tell his colleagues.
-Paul
--
http://paulseward.com
Message has been deleted
David Scheidt
Feb 29, 2012, 10:21:58 AM2/29/12
to
he...@kharendaen.dyndns.org wrote:
:Got another email, basically demanding that I justify my "no".
:In what bizarre alternate universe is that *ever* a useful sales tactic?
Well, it depends on what exactly got said. It's quite possible it's
just moron sales weasel, but it might not be.
There's a pretty standard technique of telling potential customers
that tell you 'it's too expensive' that 'Just for you, we can make you
a special deal' which may, or may not, be an actual special deal.
Pricing non-commodity software is tricky. The marginal costs of a new
customer are low (near zero, aside from costs of sales, if you're
doing things right), so selling software that you'd charge most people
$10K for to someone for $1K can be worth it. On the other hand, if
your software is going to save someone $100K, selling them the stuff
for just $10K is dumb, they're likely to pay a lot more for it.
It's also nice to know what the customer doesn't like about it, which
can be surprising. And if the software is customizable, you can tell
them what you can do to fix it.
Or it could just be sales weasel stupidity. That's the way I'd bet.
--
sig 103
:Got another email, basically demanding that I justify my "no".
:In what bizarre alternate universe is that *ever* a useful sales tactic?
just moron sales weasel, but it might not be.
There's a pretty standard technique of telling potential customers
that tell you 'it's too expensive' that 'Just for you, we can make you
a special deal' which may, or may not, be an actual special deal.
Pricing non-commodity software is tricky. The marginal costs of a new
customer are low (near zero, aside from costs of sales, if you're
doing things right), so selling software that you'd charge most people
$10K for to someone for $1K can be worth it. On the other hand, if
your software is going to save someone $100K, selling them the stuff
for just $10K is dumb, they're likely to pay a lot more for it.
It's also nice to know what the customer doesn't like about it, which
can be surprising. And if the software is customizable, you can tell
them what you can do to fix it.
Or it could just be sales weasel stupidity. That's the way I'd bet.
--
sig 103
LP
Feb 29, 2012, 12:08:43 PM2/29/12
to
On 2012-02-29, Michel <ab...@rubberchicken.nl> wrote:
>
> According to the couple of guys who tried just that trick, getting
> cute at me claiming that technically they weren't selling anything.
I think door to door charity collectors have all been on a course
recently as they all come out with this:
Me: "Sorry, I don't give my bank details to strangers on the doorstep"
Them: "We could fill the forms out in your kitchen..."
They never used to. They used to just fuck off.
obRant: Shpxvat cvrpr bs fuvg UC Cebpheir CBR fjvgpurf.
Gur 8 cbeg barf pna bayl fhccyl rabhtu cbjre gb cbjre 4 JNCf, ohg qba'g
nccrne gb unir nal sbez bs pheerag yvzvgvat va gur cbjre fhccyl. Vs lbh
cyht va zber guna 4 JNCf gurl fgneg znxvat ohooyvat/penpxyvat abvfrf.
Gurve 24 naq 48 cbeg irefvbaf pna fhccyl n shyy cbjre ohqtrg, ohg fhssre
bppnfvbany CBR oebja bhgf ba enaqbz cbegf juvpu hcfrgf gur JNCf ab raq!
Fjvgpuvat cbjre bss naq qvfnoyvat gur cbeg ba gur fjvgpu gura gheavat
vg nyy onpx ba ntnva qbrfa'g nccrne gb or rabhtu gb svk gur ceboyrz,
fb V'z fcraqvat unys zl gvzr bhg ba fvgr culfvpnyyl hacyhttvat naq
ercyhttvat n fvtavsvpnag cbegvba bs bhe 600 JNCf, juvpu vf n fvzcyl
zneiryybhf hfr bs zl gvzr!
SSF - rira gur yvaxflf CBR fjvgpurf ner orggre guna guvf, naq jryy...
gurl'er *yvaxflf*
-Paul
--
http://paulseward.com
> On Tue, 28 Feb 2012 15:04:48 -0500, Graham Reed wrote:
>> he...@kharendaen.dyndns.org writes:
>>> In what bizarre alternate universe is that *ever* a useful sales tactic?
>>
>> The same one where people actually ring the doorbell and say, "I saw
>> your 'No Soliciting' sign, but I'm sure you be interested in...".
>
> "Jesus!"
>> he...@kharendaen.dyndns.org writes:
>>> In what bizarre alternate universe is that *ever* a useful sales tactic?
>>
>> The same one where people actually ring the doorbell and say, "I saw
>> your 'No Soliciting' sign, but I'm sure you be interested in...".
>
>
> According to the couple of guys who tried just that trick, getting
> cute at me claiming that technically they weren't selling anything.
I think door to door charity collectors have all been on a course
recently as they all come out with this:
Me: "Sorry, I don't give my bank details to strangers on the doorstep"
Them: "We could fill the forms out in your kitchen..."
They never used to. They used to just fuck off.
obRant: Shpxvat cvrpr bs fuvg UC Cebpheir CBR fjvgpurf.
Gur 8 cbeg barf pna bayl fhccyl rabhtu cbjre gb cbjre 4 JNCf, ohg qba'g
nccrne gb unir nal sbez bs pheerag yvzvgvat va gur cbjre fhccyl. Vs lbh
cyht va zber guna 4 JNCf gurl fgneg znxvat ohooyvat/penpxyvat abvfrf.
Gurve 24 naq 48 cbeg irefvbaf pna fhccyl n shyy cbjre ohqtrg, ohg fhssre
bppnfvbany CBR oebja bhgf ba enaqbz cbegf juvpu hcfrgf gur JNCf ab raq!
Fjvgpuvat cbjre bss naq qvfnoyvat gur cbeg ba gur fjvgpu gura gheavat
vg nyy onpx ba ntnva qbrfa'g nccrne gb or rabhtu gb svk gur ceboyrz,
fb V'z fcraqvat unys zl gvzr bhg ba fvgr culfvpnyyl hacyhttvat naq
ercyhttvat n fvtavsvpnag cbegvba bs bhe 600 JNCf, juvpu vf n fvzcyl
zneiryybhf hfr bs zl gvzr!
SSF - rira gur yvaxflf CBR fjvgpurf ner orggre guna guvf, naq jryy...
gurl'er *yvaxflf*
-Paul
--
http://paulseward.com
Brian Kantor
Feb 29, 2012, 12:53:08 PM2/29/12
to
In article <jilfqm$jgo$1...@reader1.panix.com>,
who was offended that we didn't want his pride and joy at his price.
That's a case where he NEEDS a salesweasel to isolate him from the
brutal realities of selling software.
- Brian
David Scheidt <dsch...@panix.com> wrote:
>he...@kharendaen.dyndns.org wrote:
>:Got another email, basically demanding that I justify my "no".
>:In what bizarre alternate universe is that *ever* a useful sales tactic?
>Well, it depends on what exactly got said. It's quite possible it's
>just moron sales weasel, but it might not be.
In one case, it was the author of the software I was declining to buy
>he...@kharendaen.dyndns.org wrote:
>:Got another email, basically demanding that I justify my "no".
>:In what bizarre alternate universe is that *ever* a useful sales tactic?
>Well, it depends on what exactly got said. It's quite possible it's
>just moron sales weasel, but it might not be.
who was offended that we didn't want his pride and joy at his price.
That's a case where he NEEDS a salesweasel to isolate him from the
brutal realities of selling software.
- Brian
Just zis Guy, you know?
Feb 29, 2012, 2:14:13 PM2/29/12
to
On Mon, 27 Feb 2012 17:55:59 -0500, Cipher <nota...@hotmail.com>
wrote:
<snip tale of woe>
I need a couple of deceased rodents for a job in a large IZjner shop.
I want to buy 4 licenses for 2 vCPUs. Can I get a price for this? No
chance. Every single quote that is generated by the festering pile of
rotting manure that is the quotation system of the chapeau rouge
references "sockets". We have, at last count, something around 20 of
those.
And because they want to sell you EURI rather than let you do what you
actually want to do, the pricing model is so completely fucked that a
one year subscription is actually more than a perpetual retail license
for BillOS.
Still, full marks to them for completely rewriting the meaning of
FOSS.
Guy
--
Guy Chapman, http://www.chapmancentral.co.uk
The usenet price promise: all opinions are guaranteed
to be worth at least what you paid for them.
wrote:
<snip tale of woe>
I need a couple of deceased rodents for a job in a large IZjner shop.
I want to buy 4 licenses for 2 vCPUs. Can I get a price for this? No
chance. Every single quote that is generated by the festering pile of
rotting manure that is the quotation system of the chapeau rouge
references "sockets". We have, at last count, something around 20 of
those.
And because they want to sell you EURI rather than let you do what you
actually want to do, the pricing model is so completely fucked that a
one year subscription is actually more than a perpetual retail license
for BillOS.
Still, full marks to them for completely rewriting the meaning of
FOSS.
Guy
--
Guy Chapman, http://www.chapmancentral.co.uk
The usenet price promise: all opinions are guaranteed
to be worth at least what you paid for them.
Peter Corlett
Feb 29, 2012, 4:15:41 PM2/29/12
to
Just zis Guy, you know? <usen...@chapmancentral.co.uk> wrote:
[...]
that could go over the counter of the nearest pub.
[...]
> And because they want to sell you EURI rather than let you do what you
> actually want to do, the pricing model is so completely fucked that a one
> year subscription is actually more than a perpetual retail license for
> BillOS.
Or you could just use Qrovna, leaving you with a rather large pile of cash
> actually want to do, the pricing model is so completely fucked that a one
> year subscription is actually more than a perpetual retail license for
> BillOS.
that could go over the counter of the nearest pub.
Paul
Feb 29, 2012, 5:45:26 PM2/29/12
to
Graham Reed <gr...@pobox.com> wrote in
news:87hayau...@7deadly.org:
> he...@kharendaen.dyndns.org writes:
>> In what bizarre alternate universe is that *ever* a useful sales
>> tactic?
>
> The same one where people actually ring the doorbell and say, "I
> saw your 'No Soliciting' sign, but I'm sure you be interested
> in...".
>
> I figure some people have "don't be rude" drilled into them so
> much that they can't actually say "no" to someone's face.
>
> I don't have that problem. I can slam the door in their face,
> too. (And there's a by-election. One party left to ring my
> doorbell and I don't have to go to the poll: I don't vote for
> anyone who ignores 'No Soliciting' signs.)
Obviously the "CAN-DOORKNOCKER" act exempts charities and
politicians...
--
Paul the Legacy Server
Full Recovery reached May 30, 2008
"People can be educated beyond their intelligence"
-- Marilyn vos Savant
news:87hayau...@7deadly.org:
> he...@kharendaen.dyndns.org writes:
>> In what bizarre alternate universe is that *ever* a useful sales
>> tactic?
>
> The same one where people actually ring the doorbell and say, "I
> saw your 'No Soliciting' sign, but I'm sure you be interested
> in...".
>
> I figure some people have "don't be rude" drilled into them so
> much that they can't actually say "no" to someone's face.
>
> I don't have that problem. I can slam the door in their face,
> too. (And there's a by-election. One party left to ring my
> doorbell and I don't have to go to the poll: I don't vote for
> anyone who ignores 'No Soliciting' signs.)
politicians...
--
Paul the Legacy Server
Full Recovery reached May 30, 2008
"People can be educated beyond their intelligence"
-- Marilyn vos Savant
Graham Reed
Feb 29, 2012, 3:42:51 PM2/29/12
to
Michel <ab...@rubberchicken.nl> writes:
> According to the couple of guys who tried just that trick, getting
> cute at me claiming that technically they weren't selling anything.
Well....
> According to the couple of guys who tried just that trick, getting
> cute at me claiming that technically they weren't selling anything.
Verb, solicit:
1. To persistently endeavor to obtain an object, or bring about an event.
5. To make a petition.
6. (archaic) To disturb or trouble; to harass.
> "Let's agree to disagree on that one. HAND."
And a free door in the face... gotta get an airhorn, like that idea.
--
"But it's just not fair!..."
-- John H
Message has been deleted
Message has been deleted
TimC
Mar 1, 2012, 12:21:21 AM3/1/12
to
On 2012-02-29, Peter Corlett (aka Bruce)
was almost, but not quite, entirely unlike tea:
You got any jobs going? I want to have your boss.
Hands up who here has ever actually gotten Dead Rodent to actually fix
a non trivial bug (or take less than 3 years to get a fix for trivial
bugs through the pipeline to the point where you can tasty-install it
before the rug is pulled out from underneath you?) Whereas I'm pretty
sure more than half of my bugs in the OGF are fixed in stable.
(IZJner themselves aren't much better when it comes to licensing. But
Benpyr. Woe is us.)
--
TimC
Five is a sufficiently close approximation to infinity.
-- Robert Firth
was almost, but not quite, entirely unlike tea:
Hands up who here has ever actually gotten Dead Rodent to actually fix
a non trivial bug (or take less than 3 years to get a fix for trivial
bugs through the pipeline to the point where you can tasty-install it
before the rug is pulled out from underneath you?) Whereas I'm pretty
sure more than half of my bugs in the OGF are fixed in stable.
(IZJner themselves aren't much better when it comes to licensing. But
Benpyr. Woe is us.)
--
TimC
Five is a sufficiently close approximation to infinity.
-- Robert Firth
Message has been deleted
Message has been deleted
mrob...@att.net
Mar 1, 2012, 5:44:35 AM3/1/12
to
Graham Reed <gr...@pobox.com> wrote:
> And a free door in the face... gotta get an airhorn, like that idea.
Hmm... They don't publish specs for the big ones, but an Airchime CS-2
> And a free door in the face... gotta get an airhorn, like that idea.
takes 13 SCFM at 100 PSIG (or 6.1 l/sec at 7 bar if you swing that way)
to make 132 db(A) at 39.97 inches (1 meter). A little looking around
suggests you'll need at least a 5 hp (3.7 kW) air compressor to drive
that. Oh, you also need to end up with 1/4 British Standard Parallel
Pipe threads.
Matt Roberds
Message has been deleted
LP
Mar 1, 2012, 8:19:24 AM3/1/12
to
On 2012-03-01, TimC <tcon...@rather.puzzling.no-spam-accepted-here.org> wrote:
>
> Hands up who here has ever actually gotten Dead Rodent to actually fix
> a non trivial bug (or take less than 3 years to get a fix for trivial
> bugs through the pipeline to the point where you can tasty-install it
> before the rug is pulled out from underneath you?)
Does pointing out to them that the compiler options they used when
>
> Hands up who here has ever actually gotten Dead Rodent to actually fix
> a non trivial bug (or take less than 3 years to get a fix for trivial
> bugs through the pipeline to the point where you can tasty-install it
> before the rug is pulled out from underneath you?)
packaging a daemon prevents other things (eg perl modules) from using
the library files that come with said daemon - despite the documentation
saying "don't build this bit with those flags" count?
That was only 6 months from us submitting the patch to the spec file
and them pushing the new rpms out.
It was so quick I almost fell off my chair.
-Paul
--
http://paulseward.com
Message has been deleted
Message has been deleted
Shmuel Metz
Mar 1, 2012, 12:00:48 AM3/1/12
to
In <hfk129-...@rubberchicken.nocrap>, on 02/29/2012
backup plan in case they day yes.
--
Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz <http://patriot.net/~shmuel> ISO position
Reply to domain Patriot dot net user shmuel+bspfh to contact me.
We don't care. We don't have to care, we're Congress.
(S877: The Shut up and Eat Your spam act of 2003)
at 02:06 PM, Michel <ab...@rubberchicken.nl> said:
>According to the couple of guys who tried just that trick, getting
>cute at me claiming that technically they weren't selling anything.
If they were MOTAS, you could try making a pass at them. Just have a
>According to the couple of guys who tried just that trick, getting
>cute at me claiming that technically they weren't selling anything.
backup plan in case they day yes.
--
Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz <http://patriot.net/~shmuel> ISO position
Reply to domain Patriot dot net user shmuel+bspfh to contact me.
We don't care. We don't have to care, we're Congress.
(S877: The Shut up and Eat Your spam act of 2003)
Shmuel Metz
Feb 29, 2012, 11:59:15 PM2/29/12
to
In <slrnjks1qn...@lemon.resnet.bris.ac.uk>, on 02/29/2012
permissible? A harmless[1] aerosol?
[1] Butyl Mercaptan comes to mind, but there are many others.
at 11:06 AM, LP <use...@lpbk.net> said:
>I once answered the door to a chap like that who wouldn't take no for
>an answer. As he was trying to sell to me the second time, I calmly
>reached out for an airhorn that happened to be on a table near by and
>gave him a good long blast - said "no" and then shut the door calmly
>in his stunned face.
What is the law on reasonable force for removing trespassers? Is Mace
>I once answered the door to a chap like that who wouldn't take no for
>an answer. As he was trying to sell to me the second time, I calmly
>reached out for an airhorn that happened to be on a table near by and
>gave him a good long blast - said "no" and then shut the door calmly
>in his stunned face.
permissible? A harmless[1] aerosol?
[1] Butyl Mercaptan comes to mind, but there are many others.
Lawns 'R' Us
Mar 1, 2012, 4:24:55 PM3/1/12
to
On 2012-03-01, Shmuel Metz <spam...@library.lspace.org.invalid> wrote:
> In <hfk129-...@rubberchicken.nocrap>, on 02/29/2012
> at 02:06 PM, Michel <ab...@rubberchicken.nl> said:
>
>>According to the couple of guys who tried just that trick, getting
>>cute at me claiming that technically they weren't selling anything.
>
> If they were MOTAS, you could try making a pass at them. Just have a
> backup plan in case they day yes.
"Great! I've been looking for somebody who's happy to go out with a
> In <hfk129-...@rubberchicken.nocrap>, on 02/29/2012
> at 02:06 PM, Michel <ab...@rubberchicken.nl> said:
>
>>According to the couple of guys who tried just that trick, getting
>>cute at me claiming that technically they weren't selling anything.
>
> If they were MOTAS, you could try making a pass at them. Just have a
> backup plan in case they day yes.
guy who has herpes!"
If they still say yes, "Oh, and I have HIV test results coming back
next week; don't worry, I'm SURE they'll be negative!"
Peter Corlett
Mar 1, 2012, 8:51:43 PM3/1/12
to
TimC <tcon...@rather.puzzling.no-spam-accepted-here.org> wrote:
[...]
hates people, although my boss is happy to buy me beer. That is because I'm
self-employed.
(And no, I don't need any subcontractors or employees at this time.)
> Hands up who here has ever actually gotten Dead Rodent to actually fix a
> non trivial bug (or take less than 3 years to get a fix for trivial bugs
> through the pipeline to the point where you can tasty-install it before
> the rug is pulled out from underneath you?) Whereas I'm pretty sure more
> than half of my bugs in the OGF are fixed in stable.
Not here, because I don't accept responsibility for Dead Rodent systems.
Whoever built it gets to fix it and/or keep the pieces.
[...]
> You got any jobs going? I want to have your boss.
My boss is a grumpy old bastard who hates computers almost as much as he
hates people, although my boss is happy to buy me beer. That is because I'm
self-employed.
(And no, I don't need any subcontractors or employees at this time.)
> Hands up who here has ever actually gotten Dead Rodent to actually fix a
> non trivial bug (or take less than 3 years to get a fix for trivial bugs
> through the pipeline to the point where you can tasty-install it before
> the rug is pulled out from underneath you?) Whereas I'm pretty sure more
> than half of my bugs in the OGF are fixed in stable.
Whoever built it gets to fix it and/or keep the pieces.
Peter Corlett
Mar 1, 2012, 9:01:24 PM3/1/12
to
Michel <ab...@rubberchicken.nl> wrote:
[...]
> On the other hand, using Qrovna you get vendors like HP saying: Qrovna?
> Yeah that doesn't work. We're not going to help, sucks to be you.
How, exactly, does this differ from vendor support of Dead Rat?
I just cut out the middleman and buy my hardware from a boxshifter who
doesn't even claim to support anything on their hardware. This is a real
timesaver since I can immediately get on with fixing any problems I
discover, without first having to waste hours on hold or faffing around
raising tickets with the vendor before being politely told to fuck off.
[...]
> On the other hand, using Qrovna you get vendors like HP saying: Qrovna?
> Yeah that doesn't work. We're not going to help, sucks to be you.
How, exactly, does this differ from vendor support of Dead Rat?
I just cut out the middleman and buy my hardware from a boxshifter who
doesn't even claim to support anything on their hardware. This is a real
timesaver since I can immediately get on with fixing any problems I
discover, without first having to waste hours on hold or faffing around
raising tickets with the vendor before being politely told to fuck off.
Peter H. Coffin
Mar 1, 2012, 11:03:33 PM3/1/12
to
On Thu, 01 Mar 2012 00:00:48 -0500, Shmuel Metz wrote:
> In <hfk129-...@rubberchicken.nocrap>, on 02/29/2012
> at 02:06 PM, Michel <ab...@rubberchicken.nl> said:
>
>>According to the couple of guys who tried just that trick, getting
>>cute at me claiming that technically they weren't selling anything.
>
> If they were MOTAS, you could try making a pass at them. Just have a
> backup plan in case they day yes.
Invite 'em in, let 'em natter on about Jeebus as long as they keep
> In <hfk129-...@rubberchicken.nocrap>, on 02/29/2012
> at 02:06 PM, Michel <ab...@rubberchicken.nl> said:
>
>>According to the couple of guys who tried just that trick, getting
>>cute at me claiming that technically they weren't selling anything.
>
> If they were MOTAS, you could try making a pass at them. Just have a
> backup plan in case they day yes.
mopping/drying dishes/chopping onions/etc.
--
A *huge* proportion of people cannot make *correct and accurate*
generalisations of principles. They have to learn everything as if
it's an unrelated piece of crap, BECAUSE THEY ARE STUPID! PEOPLE ARE
STUPID! -- Thorfinn in the Monastery
Just zis Guy, you know?
Mar 2, 2012, 3:02:07 PM3/2/12
to
On Wed, 29 Feb 2012 19:14:13 +0000, "Just zis Guy, you know?"
<usen...@chapmancentral.co.uk> wrote:
>Every single quote that is generated by the festering pile of
>rotting manure that is the quotation system of the chapeau rouge
>references "sockets". We have, at last count, something around 20 of
>those.
I mean 200, of course, which is why the deceased rodents get such an
<usen...@chapmancentral.co.uk> wrote:
>Every single quote that is generated by the festering pile of
>rotting manure that is the quotation system of the chapeau rouge
>references "sockets". We have, at last count, something around 20 of
>those.
immediate and forthright reaction from $CUSTOMER.
Message has been deleted
Wojciech Derechowski
Mar 3, 2012, 1:32:58 AM3/3/12
to
On 2012-03-03, AdB <ab...@leftmind.net> wrote:
> Roger Burton West posted thus:
>>"You're offering me eternal salvation in return for my time and money.
>>How is that not selling something? Or are you arguing that it's
>>available without the time and money, in which case why are you asking
>>for it?"
>>
>>One can keep them busy for half an hour this way. Beats working.
>
> There was a chap named Luther who got far more than half an hour's
> worth of argument out of that very premise.
And he was right about indulgence for money; something that the entertainment
industry has yet to grasp about file sharing. Come to think of it, he might
have been right about the IP licensing schemes where freedom from punishment
must be purchased with money.
WD
--
Who is Entscheidungs and what is his problem?
> Roger Burton West posted thus:
>>"You're offering me eternal salvation in return for my time and money.
>>How is that not selling something? Or are you arguing that it's
>>available without the time and money, in which case why are you asking
>>for it?"
>>
>>One can keep them busy for half an hour this way. Beats working.
>
> There was a chap named Luther who got far more than half an hour's
> worth of argument out of that very premise.
And he was right about indulgence for money; something that the entertainment
industry has yet to grasp about file sharing. Come to think of it, he might
have been right about the IP licensing schemes where freedom from punishment
must be purchased with money.
WD
--
Who is Entscheidungs and what is his problem?
Message has been deleted
Message has been deleted
Message has been deleted
SteveD
Mar 3, 2012, 6:04:41 PM3/3/12
to
On Tue, 28 Feb 2012 15:04:48 -0500, Graham Reed <gr...@pobox.com> wrote:
>he...@kharendaen.dyndns.org writes:
>> In what bizarre alternate universe is that *ever* a useful sales tactic?
>
>The same one where people actually ring the doorbell and say, "I saw
>your 'No Soliciting' sign, but I'm sure you be interested in...".
This is where I like to be politely obnoxious.
>he...@kharendaen.dyndns.org writes:
>> In what bizarre alternate universe is that *ever* a useful sales tactic?
>
>The same one where people actually ring the doorbell and say, "I saw
>your 'No Soliciting' sign, but I'm sure you be interested in...".
"Wow, you're pretty much a failure as a door-to-door salesperson, then,
aren't you? Ignoring signs, trespassing, and trying sales tactics that
were last effective sometime in the nineteen-forties? Who sold you THAT
particular white elephant approach? Would you like to buy a bridge?..."
-SteveD
SteveD
Mar 3, 2012, 6:06:36 PM3/3/12
to
On Sat, 3 Mar 2012 17:35:39 +0000 (UTC), Gary Barnes
<g...@adminspotting.org> wrote:
>"I hereby explicitly withdraw the implied right of access to [my address]
>for any employee, agent or any other person acting on behalf of E-on. Any
>such person entering onto my land will therefore be trespassing, and will be
>treated accordingly."
Next week, the same guy turns up, but they've slightly changed the company
name.
<g...@adminspotting.org> wrote:
>"I hereby explicitly withdraw the implied right of access to [my address]
>for any employee, agent or any other person acting on behalf of E-on. Any
>such person entering onto my land will therefore be trespassing, and will be
>treated accordingly."
Next week, the same guy turns up, but they've slightly changed the company
name.
Message has been deleted
Message has been deleted
Wojciech Derechowski
Mar 4, 2012, 4:06:18 PM3/4/12
to
On 2012-03-04, ab...@127.0.0.1 <ab...@127.0.0.1> wrote:
> In the land of rape'n'honey you get to instead pay for atsc tuner
> if you want 3 channels of content you don't want to watch and for
> basic++ cable package if you want occasionally watchable content.
Ah, sort of visual basic++ package?
> In the land of rape'n'honey you get to instead pay for atsc tuner
> if you want 3 channels of content you don't want to watch and for
> basic++ cable package if you want occasionally watchable content.
Ah, sort of visual basic++ package?
Garrett Wollman
Mar 4, 2012, 11:19:36 PM3/4/12
to
In article <6nP4r.19583$_63....@newsfe19.iad>, <ab...@127.0.0.1> wrote:
>In the land of rape'n'honey you get to instead pay for atsc tuner
>if you want 3 channels of content you don't want to watch
What about the other ten channels? (I just checked the listings for
>In the land of rape'n'honey you get to instead pay for atsc tuner
>if you want 3 channels of content you don't want to watch
Madison, and you have 13 OTA choices. Even in the smallest CONUS TV
market, Glendive, Montana, there are five choices. It's not 1979 any
more.)
-GAWollman
(with 31 OTA program streams, some of which are occasionally
watchable)
--
Garrett A. Wollman | What intellectual phenomenon can be older, or more oft
wol...@bimajority.org| repeated, than the story of a large research program
Opinions not shared by| that impaled itself upon a false central assumption
my employers. | accepted by all practitioners? - S.J. Gould, 1993
Message has been deleted
Graham Reed
Mar 5, 2012, 5:50:07 PM3/5/12
to
Lawns 'R' Us <nob...@nowhere.example.com> writes:
> If they still say yes, "Oh, and I have HIV test results coming back
> next week; don't worry, I'm SURE they'll be negative!"
And if they're a bug-chaser, then what?
> If they still say yes, "Oh, and I have HIV test results coming back
> next week; don't worry, I'm SURE they'll be negative!"
(And I really wish I was making that concept up. *sigh*)
--
"I'm killing for two now."
-- Dexter Morgan
Graham Reed
Mar 5, 2012, 5:45:56 PM3/5/12
to
ab...@leftmind.net (AdB) writes:
> Similarly for most air tools; 30 seconds of zenlike contemplation of the
> next cut alternating with a 5-second cut can be an indication that
> you've got a lot of tool and not much compressor. BTDTGTT.
Bah, it turns out that a universal motor in a table saw is worse than
originally anticipated, in pretty much the same way.
I had decided that induction machines was simply a personal bias, and
there was no need to spend nearly a grand on a saw I wouldn't actually
use all that much. The one with the universal machine would be fine[1],
and was nicely discounted for the first quarter of the year (2008).
So I'm cutting a bunch of planks to the same length, got everything set
up and just have to chuck the wood through when A Strange Noise starts
coming from the motor assembly. Kill the power, and notice a bit of
burning belt smell.
Taking a good look at the inside of the saw, the true downside[2] of a
universal motor appears. Induction motors turn slower than the blade
speed, so they have a Big Pulley, and the blade gets a Little Pully so
you get the right saw speed. Universal motors, though, turn
faster--much faster in this case--than blade speed, so the motor gets a
Tiny Pully and the blade gets a Big Pulley.
Except, Tiny Pully really looked like it was just the motor shaft. So
the belt couldn't be a V-belt, it was just a thin, flat belt. And that
wasn't enough torque, so they had to put two on it. But still, they're
making an awfully sharp turn around the motor shaft...
...where they get really, really hot...
...and start to slip, making a horrible scary noise.
So, new procedure. Get board. Measure board. Saw on. Cut board. Saw
off. Put cut board aside. Repeat until done or the UPS starts asking
WTF is going on with all that surge and sag.
[1] As soon as I thought, "It will be fine," I should have known. Fine,
in my family, is a euphamism for "total piece of crap but it was
cheap and it will work if you force it". Made famous by the "fine
car" would couldn't make a sharp left turn, only lane change to the
left.
[2] I'd figured the badness would be commutator whine and resulting
noise. Well, no, a well-made universal motor is reasonably quiet
these days. It's a bit louder than an induction machine, but not
enough to justify an extra $600 for the saw.
--
"...and 8 inches is really not that impressive."
-- Kari Byron, Mythbuster
> Similarly for most air tools; 30 seconds of zenlike contemplation of the
> next cut alternating with a 5-second cut can be an indication that
> you've got a lot of tool and not much compressor. BTDTGTT.
Bah, it turns out that a universal motor in a table saw is worse than
originally anticipated, in pretty much the same way.
I had decided that induction machines was simply a personal bias, and
there was no need to spend nearly a grand on a saw I wouldn't actually
use all that much. The one with the universal machine would be fine[1],
and was nicely discounted for the first quarter of the year (2008).
So I'm cutting a bunch of planks to the same length, got everything set
up and just have to chuck the wood through when A Strange Noise starts
coming from the motor assembly. Kill the power, and notice a bit of
burning belt smell.
Taking a good look at the inside of the saw, the true downside[2] of a
universal motor appears. Induction motors turn slower than the blade
speed, so they have a Big Pulley, and the blade gets a Little Pully so
you get the right saw speed. Universal motors, though, turn
faster--much faster in this case--than blade speed, so the motor gets a
Tiny Pully and the blade gets a Big Pulley.
Except, Tiny Pully really looked like it was just the motor shaft. So
the belt couldn't be a V-belt, it was just a thin, flat belt. And that
wasn't enough torque, so they had to put two on it. But still, they're
making an awfully sharp turn around the motor shaft...
...where they get really, really hot...
...and start to slip, making a horrible scary noise.
So, new procedure. Get board. Measure board. Saw on. Cut board. Saw
off. Put cut board aside. Repeat until done or the UPS starts asking
WTF is going on with all that surge and sag.
[1] As soon as I thought, "It will be fine," I should have known. Fine,
in my family, is a euphamism for "total piece of crap but it was
cheap and it will work if you force it". Made famous by the "fine
car" would couldn't make a sharp left turn, only lane change to the
left.
[2] I'd figured the badness would be commutator whine and resulting
noise. Well, no, a well-made universal motor is reasonably quiet
these days. It's a bit louder than an induction machine, but not
enough to justify an extra $600 for the saw.
--
"...and 8 inches is really not that impressive."
-- Kari Byron, Mythbuster
Graham Reed
Mar 5, 2012, 5:48:06 PM3/5/12
to
ab...@leftmind.net (AdB) writes:
> I suppose you _could_ tell them you're looking to ensure you don't have
> to go through another by-election for the same reason, and offer prostate
> *cough* examinations to the candidates.
If any of them were (a) attractive and (b) male, I'd ask if they were
here about the blow job. (I could ask anyway, but I know about getting
that particular bluff called.)
I did manage to answer the door to the Green Party representative while
wearing my "Bacon is a Vegetable" apron. (And pants... it might have
been the neighbours.)
--
"I thought we'd be dead by step two, so this is going great!"
-- Verne, in "Over the Hedge"
> I suppose you _could_ tell them you're looking to ensure you don't have
> to go through another by-election for the same reason, and offer prostate
> *cough* examinations to the candidates.
If any of them were (a) attractive and (b) male, I'd ask if they were
here about the blow job. (I could ask anyway, but I know about getting
that particular bluff called.)
I did manage to answer the door to the Green Party representative while
wearing my "Bacon is a Vegetable" apron. (And pants... it might have
been the neighbours.)
--
"I thought we'd be dead by step two, so this is going great!"
-- Verne, in "Over the Hedge"
Message has been deleted
Message has been deleted
LP
Mar 6, 2012, 6:57:23 AM3/6/12
to
On 2012-03-05, Graham Reed <gr...@pobox.com> wrote:
> Lawns 'R' Us <nob...@nowhere.example.com> writes:
>> If they still say yes, "Oh, and I have HIV test results coming back
>> next week; don't worry, I'm SURE they'll be negative!"
>
> And if they're a bug-chaser, then what?
>
> (And I really wish I was making that concept up. *sigh*)
So do I. I'd managed to forget about it until this week but that's the
> Lawns 'R' Us <nob...@nowhere.example.com> writes:
>> If they still say yes, "Oh, and I have HIV test results coming back
>> next week; don't worry, I'm SURE they'll be negative!"
>
> And if they're a bug-chaser, then what?
>
> (And I really wish I was making that concept up. *sigh*)
second time it's come up in conversation in 3 days.
I can understand most kinks but that one is not one I can get my head around
at all. Not even slightly.
-Paul
--
http://paulseward.com
SteveD
Mar 6, 2012, 9:13:07 AM3/6/12
to
On Sun, 4 Mar 2012 07:34:06 +0000 (UTC), Roger Burton West
<roger+a...@nospam.firedrake.org> wrote:
>A friend of mine once turned up at the pub and said "I've just been
>asked to put the company name and logo into template variables".
I can... _sorta_ see it being useful for synchronising company forms and
whatnot when marketing tweaks the logo colors every five years. But it
does come across as a little unsettling when examined closely.
-SteveD
<roger+a...@nospam.firedrake.org> wrote:
>A friend of mine once turned up at the pub and said "I've just been
>asked to put the company name and logo into template variables".
I can... _sorta_ see it being useful for synchronising company forms and
whatnot when marketing tweaks the logo colors every five years. But it
does come across as a little unsettling when examined closely.
-SteveD
Alan J Rosenthal
Mar 7, 2012, 9:56:09 PM3/7/12
to
Graham Reed <gr...@pobox.com> writes:
>I did manage to answer the door to the Green Party representative while
>wearing my "Bacon is a Vegetable" apron.
And the proper outfit for answering the door to a Reform Party representative
>I did manage to answer the door to the Green Party representative while
>wearing my "Bacon is a Vegetable" apron.
is something saying "_You_ are a vegetable"...
Peter Corlett
Mar 9, 2012, 4:39:47 AM3/9/12
to
responsibilities. Otherwise I'd have heard something about "Elginia, the new
name for Greece" on the news this morning.
mlooney
Mar 9, 2012, 10:22:13 AM3/9/12
to
Peter Corlett <ab...@mooli.org.uk> wrote:
>
> Nice try, but no. Changing one's name doesn't absolve one of legal
> responsibilities. Otherwise I'd have heard something about "Elginia, the new
> name for Greece" on the news this morning.
>
ITYM "The Former Hellenic Republic of Greece", to follow their own naming
>
> Nice try, but no. Changing one's name doesn't absolve one of legal
> responsibilities. Otherwise I'd have heard something about "Elginia, the new
> name for Greece" on the news this morning.
>
convention WRT other countries in the area.
--
I'm an aging, white, right of center, geeky, male, dyslexic, veteran,
bipolar, sociopath with Asperger syndrome and a touch of PTSD that mutters.
Most of my meds are to keep me from being a real sociopath.
And you are?
Wojciech Derechowski
Mar 9, 2012, 3:43:37 PM3/9/12
to
On 2012-03-09, Peter Corlett <ab...@mooli.org.uk> wrote:
> Nice try, but no. Changing one's name doesn't absolve one of legal
> responsibilities. Otherwise I'd have heard something about "Elginia, the new
> name for Greece" on the news this morning.
Yet fulfilling those responsibilities erodes one's inner Zorba. And they
> Nice try, but no. Changing one's name doesn't absolve one of legal
> responsibilities. Otherwise I'd have heard something about "Elginia, the new
> name for Greece" on the news this morning.
haven't lost their marbles, far from it, since they are well aware of
what will happen to the biggest EU economies which provided them both
with goods and the capital to pay for all that spending if they leave
the euro zone.
David Cameron Staples
Mar 9, 2012, 6:24:13 PM3/9/12
to
On Fri, 09 Mar 2012 20:43:37 +0000, Wojciech Derechowski wrote:
> Yet fulfilling those responsibilities erodes one's inner Zorba. And they
> haven't lost their marbles,
they know exactly where they are: in London.
> Yet fulfilling those responsibilities erodes one's inner Zorba. And they
> haven't lost their marbles,
Message has been deleted
Wojciech Derechowski
Mar 10, 2012, 3:02:11 PM3/10/12
to
On 2012-03-10, ab...@127.0.0.1 <ab...@127.0.0.1> wrote:
> Chinese shit, the money does not return to China, China runs out of
> money to give the biggest EU economies and the biggest EU economies
> run out of money. Everybody dies, oh the embarrasment.
Yeah, sure: everybody dies from lack of money. Anyway, in Europe it's
about PIGS, no shit or at least not the Chinese shit.
> On 2012-03-09, Wojciech Derechowski <wdd...@um5000.mystora.com> wrote:
>> Yet fulfilling those responsibilities erodes one's inner Zorba. And they
>> haven't lost their marbles, far from it, since they are well aware of
>> what will happen to the biggest EU economies which provided them both
>> with goods and the capital to pay for all that spending if they leave
>> the euro zone.
>
> Yeah. Biggest EU economies stop giving them money, they stop buying
>> Yet fulfilling those responsibilities erodes one's inner Zorba. And they
>> haven't lost their marbles, far from it, since they are well aware of
>> what will happen to the biggest EU economies which provided them both
>> with goods and the capital to pay for all that spending if they leave
>> the euro zone.
>
> Chinese shit, the money does not return to China, China runs out of
> money to give the biggest EU economies and the biggest EU economies
> run out of money. Everybody dies, oh the embarrasment.
Yeah, sure: everybody dies from lack of money. Anyway, in Europe it's
about PIGS, no shit or at least not the Chinese shit.
Joe Thompson
Mar 12, 2012, 7:54:58 PM3/12/12
to
On 2012-03-02, Peter Corlett <ab...@mooli.org.uk> wrote:
> Michel <ab...@rubberchicken.nl> wrote:
> [...]
>> On the other hand, using Qrovna you get vendors like HP saying: Qrovna?
>> Yeah that doesn't work. We're not going to help, sucks to be you.
>
> How, exactly, does this differ from vendor support of Dead Rat?
Actually a lot of vendors support a certain Fedora-associated distro on
their hardware -- VOZ and Qryy come immediately to mind. Qryy will even
ship you hardware with it preinstalled and handles the licensing and
support directly. (Which is actually a bit of a pain when you call up
the original distributor only to find out that *your* license is through
Qryy so you need to call *them* instead for support.)
The only vendor I ever saw with Qrovna preinstalled was RLX -- the
default config of their blade server prototype that I saw had it on the
blades. (I understand various places will, or at least used to, sell
you a workstation with it on, but nobody you'd consider a first- or
second-tier vendor.) -- Joe
--
Joe Thompson | Sysadmin - Scientificist
E-mail addresses in headers are valid. | http://www.orion-com.com/
"There is no way my emacs is ever getting a credit card!" -- Matthew Vernon
> Michel <ab...@rubberchicken.nl> wrote:
> [...]
>> On the other hand, using Qrovna you get vendors like HP saying: Qrovna?
>> Yeah that doesn't work. We're not going to help, sucks to be you.
>
> How, exactly, does this differ from vendor support of Dead Rat?
Actually a lot of vendors support a certain Fedora-associated distro on
their hardware -- VOZ and Qryy come immediately to mind. Qryy will even
ship you hardware with it preinstalled and handles the licensing and
support directly. (Which is actually a bit of a pain when you call up
the original distributor only to find out that *your* license is through
Qryy so you need to call *them* instead for support.)
The only vendor I ever saw with Qrovna preinstalled was RLX -- the
default config of their blade server prototype that I saw had it on the
blades. (I understand various places will, or at least used to, sell
you a workstation with it on, but nobody you'd consider a first- or
second-tier vendor.) -- Joe
--
Joe Thompson | Sysadmin - Scientificist
E-mail addresses in headers are valid. | http://www.orion-com.com/
"There is no way my emacs is ever getting a credit card!" -- Matthew Vernon
Zebee Johnstone
Mar 12, 2012, 8:39:01 PM3/12/12
to
In alt.sysadmin.recovery on Mon, 12 Mar 2012 23:54:58 +0000 (UTC)
They don't support it in their management though. As in if you don't
have a 'doze desktop you can't get a console or media or bloody well
anything remotely.
This is because it wants to install 3 DLLs on any box you connect
from.
Even the Windows guys hate the things.
Zebee
Joe Thompson <sp...@orion-com.com> wrote:
> On 2012-03-02, Peter Corlett <ab...@mooli.org.uk> wrote:
>> Michel <ab...@rubberchicken.nl> wrote:
>> [...]
>>> On the other hand, using Qrovna you get vendors like HP saying: Qrovna?
>>> Yeah that doesn't work. We're not going to help, sucks to be you.
>>
>> How, exactly, does this differ from vendor support of Dead Rat?
>
> Actually a lot of vendors support a certain Fedora-associated distro on
> their hardware -- VOZ and Qryy come immediately to mind. Qryy will even
> ship you hardware with it preinstalled and handles the licensing and
> support directly. (Which is actually a bit of a pain when you call up
> the original distributor only to find out that *your* license is through
> Qryy so you need to call *them* instead for support.)
OH yes they support it.
> On 2012-03-02, Peter Corlett <ab...@mooli.org.uk> wrote:
>> Michel <ab...@rubberchicken.nl> wrote:
>> [...]
>>> On the other hand, using Qrovna you get vendors like HP saying: Qrovna?
>>> Yeah that doesn't work. We're not going to help, sucks to be you.
>>
>> How, exactly, does this differ from vendor support of Dead Rat?
>
> Actually a lot of vendors support a certain Fedora-associated distro on
> their hardware -- VOZ and Qryy come immediately to mind. Qryy will even
> ship you hardware with it preinstalled and handles the licensing and
> support directly. (Which is actually a bit of a pain when you call up
> the original distributor only to find out that *your* license is through
> Qryy so you need to call *them* instead for support.)
They don't support it in their management though. As in if you don't
have a 'doze desktop you can't get a console or media or bloody well
anything remotely.
This is because it wants to install 3 DLLs on any box you connect
from.
Even the Windows guys hate the things.
Zebee
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