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"Death camps" may be hyperbole, but I too am concerned about how fragile
our democracy may be. Hopefully all it will take are our voices and
votes to get us back on track.
> "Death camps" may be hyperbole, but I too am concerned about how fragile
> our democracy may be. Hopefully all it will take are our voices and
> votes to get us back on track.
And by back on track you mean invading the next country? I hope not. Or
do you mean more reagonomics?
Anyways, soon the US will have to pay more for wars than it is able to
get credits. I wonder what happens then. Will Europe or China take over?
Should we start a pool for bets?
Karsten
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> Most people in the western (and Eastern) world are opposed
> to death camps. We say that had we been in Germany or Russia
> during the late thirties, and early forties, we'd have stood
> in opposition. Are there any parallels to what's going on in
> the USA at the moment? With the government centralizing
> power, and ignoring the will of the people?
This is fun! Are you saying the current US administration is made of
nazis or it builds death camps?
Karsten
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<\/>
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Reagonomics comes closest. I'm talking about government takeover of all
aspects of our lives. Also in thread, I did look up Wiemar Republic
with its hyper inflation.
Strangely, decades ago people were circulating the urban myth that
concentration camps were being set up in the US at several remote
locations. Large fenced-in areas with buildings, and no occupation
yet.
Hey, I'm in the USA. Where are you? Always nice to email
with people in other countries. I've heard Israel is
democracy. Is that where you area?
--
Christopher A. Young
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"Frank" <frankperi...@comcast.net>
wrote in message
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"Frank" <frankperi...@comcast.net>
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<book...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
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On Wed, 30 Dec 2009 15:51:02 -0500, Frank
Strangely, decades ago people were circulating the urban
What nation do you live in, that has a democracy?
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Christopher A. Young
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"Frank" <frankperi...@comcast.net>
wrote in message
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> Strangely, decades ago people were circulating the urban myth that
> concentration camps were being set up in the US at several remote
> locations. Large fenced-in areas with buildings, and no occupation
> yet.
If you want to go back six and a half decades:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manzanar
If you've ever been by Manzanar, it doesn't get much more remote in CA. Come
to think of it, the other nine camps were in those more remote locations.
Yes, FDR, a great Democrat and shining example to all.
Fortunately, I don't have to go to California to visit an internment camp;
there is one about eight miles down the road:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fort_Missoula_Internment_Camp
> Anyways, soon the US will have to pay more for wars than it is able to
> get credits. I wonder what happens then. Will Europe or China take over?
> Should we start a pool for bets?
Europe is history. When Mercedes ships their C model production to that
famous third world country, Alabama, you know there is a problem. I'd bet
on either India or China. Holding to the his cyclical theory,
Spengler's 'Der Untergang des Abendlandes' may return to the reading lists
sometime soon.
How about 1981? Or 2001?
Just because they ignore YOUR wishes, does NOT mean they are
"...ignoring the will of the people."
Dan
> I find it a bit refreshing that the "Tea parties" weren't kept limited
> to the "free speech zones" like all the protests that were held during
> the llast administration.
I'd find it more refreshing if the protests accomplished anything. I really
should track down the citation, but I recall Bush II saying something
like "They have a right to protest, and I have a right to ignore them."
Æthelred the Unready is more polite.
'Unready', btw, doesn't convey the 10th century pun on 'unræd'. The original
sense is also apropos.
>>> "Death camps" may be hyperbole, but I too am concerned about how
>>> fragile our democracy may be. Hopefully all it will take are our
>>> voices and votes to get us back on track.
>> And by back on track you mean invading the next country? I hope not. Or
>> do you mean more reagonomics?
> Reagonomics comes closest. I'm talking about government takeover of all
> aspects of our lives. Also in thread, I did look up Wiemar Republic
> with its hyper inflation.
Can someone just pinch me? Are you seriously saying that reagonomics was
good for the US in the long term?
I think it's obvious that a lack of regulation enabled the crisis. In
other words, with proper regulation, corporations, banks and so on would
have to act decent and longterm.
You think corporations like Shell, LukOil or Exxon needs less
regulation? Goldmann Sachs, Deutsche Bank or HSBC need less regulation?
BTW, wich aspects of your life did the government take over from you?
> I dunno. The USA has had an extermination order, in
> Missori. The US also "interned" a bunch of Japanese
> descendants during world war II.
For the most part, the US has had the luxury of being able to provide at
least a minimal degree of care to those that were interned. Were the
infrastructure crumbling, with food and medicine in short supply, providing
for the concentration camps would not be a priority.
http://www.sherpaguides.com/georgia/civil_war/sidebars/pow_camp_sumpter_andersonville.html
Camp Sumter at Andersonville, GA is an example of what happens to internees
when a nation is on the edge of destruction. If anything, the Union was
even more culpable for the deaths of prisoners.
He must mean those camps erected during the Bush years...
Dan
> This is fun! Are you saying the current US administration is made of
> nazis or it builds death camps?
No, the administration is not National Socialist. Were it, Michael Moore
would be filming 'Triumph des Hoffnung' with the men of the
Reichsarbeitsdienst performing a manual of arms with their shovels. Instead
of a shovel and a job, the unemployed get all the hope they can choke down.
Post WW-II, Bradbury wrote a couple novels about society being
separated into two camps, Faherheit 451 and Brave New World. In F451
he has a woman refugee from a Nazi death camp burn up with her
forbidden books. I use the handle "bookburn" about that sort of
thing. Another period novel, A Separate Peace, by Knowles, goes into
a young person's search for direction. Catcher in the Rye, too.
Post WW-I, the poet Yeats in the following poem seems to be addressing
how TSHTF, evidently referring in the title to something bad coming
this way now and how people are behaving. bookburn
THE SECOND COMING
Turning and turning in the widening gyre
The falcon cannot hear the falconer;
Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold;
Mere anarchy is loosed upon the world,
The blood-dimmed tide is loosed, and everywhere
The ceremony of innocence is drowned;
The best lack all conviction, while the worst
Are full of passionate intensity.
Surely some revelation is at hand;
Surely the Second Coming is at hand.
The Second Coming! Hardly are those words out
When a vast image out of Spiritus Mundi
Troubles my sight: a waste of desert sand;
A shape with lion body and the head of a man,
A gaze blank and pitiless as the sun,
Is moving its slow thighs, while all about it
Wind shadows of the indignant desert birds.
The darkness drops again but now I know
That twenty centuries of stony sleep
Were vexed to nightmare by a rocking cradle,
And what rough beast, its hour come round at last,
Slouches towards Bethlehem to be born?
>
--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
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"Frank" <frankperi...@comcast.net>
wrote in message
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--
Christopher A. Young
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"robert bowman" <bow...@montana.com> wrote in message
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"robert bowman" <bow...@montana.com> wrote in message
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Yes, just like all 49 other states and the US...
> The rest of USA is a constitutional republic.
AKA a Constitutional Democratic Republic, AKA a Democracy. Just like
many of the nations we hate...
Just because it is not a "Pure Democracy" does not mean it is not a
Democracy.
How many times does this have to be laid out before you semantic fools
get the message you know not of which you speak???
Dan
> I have heard a little about Andersonville. That was human
> suffering, taken to an extreme.
Agreed. And the worst part is it still happens all over the world. Each
minute about 160 people die. 25% of them of hunger. Another 40% because
of dirty water.
> suppose the USA combines a
> big recession, with an internment movement of, for example,
> survivalists, constitutionalists, and other anti admin
> people. The resulting suffering could be every bit as
> extreme.
Why are ,,constitutionalists'' anti administration?
Karsten
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<\/>
_/\_ ᅵ) Unless it has animated gifs from 1996, then it rocks!
Like the congress critters, you're ignoring the polls, Dan.
>I have heard a little about Andersonville. That was human
>suffering, taken to an extreme. suppose the USA combines a
>big recession, with an internment movement of, for example,
>survivalists, constitutionalists, and other anti admin
>people. The resulting suffering could be every bit as
>extreme.
How could the US do this? Im curious?
Those people make up a very large and heavily armed number of our
population.
Gunner
"I am for doing good to the poor, but I differ in opinion of the
means. I think the best way of doing good to the poor, is not
making them easy in poverty, but leading or driving them out of
it. In my youth I travelled much, and I observed in different
countries, that the more public provisions were made for the
poor the less they provided for themselves, and of course became
poorer. And, on the contrary, the less was done for them, the
more they did for themselves, and became richer." -- Benjamin
Franklin, /The Encouragement of Idleness/, 1766
From the time I get up and flush the low volume of water government
mandated toilet until I go to bed and turn off the soon to be government
mandated cfl's. Tell me what's not mandated by the government ;)
I'll be so damn glad when I'm healthy again, after that
wicked barf bug about how long ago was monday anyway. Oh, my
poor brain.
--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
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"Frank" <frankperi...@comcast.net>
wrote in message
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>> BTW, wich aspects of your life did the government take over from you?
> From the time I get up and flush the low volume of water government
> mandated toilet until I go to bed and turn off the soon to be government
> mandated cfl's. Tell me what's not mandated by the government ;)
You want the right to waste water and energy, because your impulse to do
so is more important than the rational decision to preserve ressources.
> Your kind of loonieness is what give us normal people who are
> survivalists a bad name when your paradigm is held up as the
> stereotype of what survivalism is really about.
Made me think about my problem with the label ,,survivalist'' again.
Maybe i'm wrong and in fact there are two or three moderated and
rational survivalists? Maybe people that are prepared to survive should
be named survivalists too?
Then i tossed that thought, it's just too preposterous, finding those
two or three is impossible ;).
However, this has nothing to do with Gunner the magnificient. He is a
different kind of tragedy.
> Well, heck, lets see. You shower under a mandated low flow
> shower head. Drive a car with a catalytic converter and all
> kinds of safety modules. You are required by law to wear
> your seat belt. You obey traffic signals, to get to the FDIC
> insured bank, which allows you to remove as much as $200 a
> day of your own money. You go to the grocery and buy FDA
> approved meats, and government approved canned and bottled
> goods. You call home, on your FCC approved cell phone,
> talking to your wife on her FCC approved telephone. After
> picking up your kid at the government run school, you stop
> by the news stand and buy a government approved news paper.
> You get home, and your wife is cooking your steak to 180F
> with a thermometer like they reccomend. The hell with that
> you like em rare. Your government approved dog, wearing its
> government approved ID tag (pet licensing and registration)
> sits at your feet, begging for a scrap of properly FDA
> approved, and completely cooked meat. After dinner, you fold
> your safety inspected paper napkin, drink some more FDA
> inspected and approved coffee.
You probably label me again as nazi communistic socialist, like always,
but i think there is a valid reason behind all of the mentioned things.
Except the news paper wich i believe not to be true.
Karsten
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() My homepage is http://www.tecneeq.de/ and your homepage sucksᅵ!
<\/>
_/\_ ᅵ) Unless it has animated gifs from 1996, then it rocks!
>>> Your kind of loonieness is what give us normal people who are
>>> survivalists a bad name when your paradigm is held up as the
>>> stereotype of what survivalism is really about.
>> Made me think about my problem with the label ,,survivalist'' again.
>> Maybe i'm wrong and in fact there are two or three moderated and
>> rational survivalists? Maybe people that are prepared to survive should
>> be named survivalists too?
>> Then i tossed that thought, it's just too preposterous, finding those
>> two or three is impossible ;).
> Frankly, I'd be content to give the title of "survivalist" to the
> loons and let them keep it. The only problem with that is that they
> aren't survivalists.
Why not? They surely need a label of their own, don't you think? How
about we name them survivalists and the rest are just prepared peeps.
That way we don't have to say idiot or moron so often when Gunner posts.
A simple ,,Yeah, you are a survivalist allright'' would suffice and look
totally innocent to Gunner and his kind :).
Another bonus, there would be no reason to change the perception of what
the public thinks about survivalists. Because this is what they think
indeed, survivalists are a bunch of idiots.
When i started in IT, a hacker was someone who wrote good and creative
code. Today it's someone who writes malware or breaks into systems. You
can't change what the word hacker means to the general public anyways.
So why bother?
> BTW. Happy news years.
The same to you and the whole lot.
For me, I like the low flush as it is kind to my septic and cfl's save
money. I think I have brains enough to decide for myself.
Stormin should be quiet about the farting as gov't may mandate something
about that too ;)
Washington DC - 4 minutes ago
Department of the Interior, working closely with the
Environmental Protection Agency have announced the
development of a new meaning for the letters RFID. These
will be the new Retro Flatulance Indicator Device.
Scientists working rapidly have developed the new device AP
/ UPI PHOTO RFID DEVICE HELD BY RESEARCH DOCTOR which will
be medically applied to all persons over the age of 50, or
who meet certain qualifications. Privacy advocates are
concerned the device may include GPS transmitter. Leading
Republicans question how we will pay for said device. The
fee schedule for carbon emissions has not yet been
established, but is under scrutiny.
--
Christopher A. Young
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"Frank" <frankperi...@comcast.net> wrote in message
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Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
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Which polls?
Dan
What is not "mandated" is what you can do for yourself. Once you
involve other people, you gain a thing called "responsibility." That is
why governments are instituted by men - to referee disputes between
people who each think they are doing nothing wrong while harming the other.
Next?
Dan
Hey Book, we haven't conversed in a while. I will just say this much.
If you do not think
that there aren't "camps" for the bad boys and bad girls- - I don't
know what else to say.
Do your research, you do it on other things. :-)
It is no myth and it is no story. <shaking my head> Do your own
homework on the subject and spend a little fuel to go and see it for
yourself
and just use common sense. It really is pretty simply.
Maybe one day we can all be as smart as you.<rolling my eyes>
Stop promulgating misinformation and distorting fact.
Democracy - the word and the concept was controversial and negative
in 1776. This rejection was amplified following the French revolution.
Collective opinion and action is only a start point.
The US governing structure is interlaced with democratic elections.
There is no democratic election in the country which gives
unrestrained power.
We elect people to represent our interests. Their decisions require
approval by other elected representatives whose decisions are
restricted by law and regulation and challenged by courts.
Ultimately, the constitutions of the states and central government,
the inherent Rights of individuals and the jury system, severely
constrains the democratic process.
Amidst these levels of jurisdiction and other checks and balances,
the use of a democratic process to elect does not constitute a democracy.
The US is a constitutional republic. That is how it was originally
described and that is how the National Archives describes it.
The above post is a demonstration as to why women should never have been
given the right to vote.
--
Christopher A. Young
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"Crossfire" <"Benton Harbor"@mcafee.mx> wrote in message
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The foundation of the US, is that the government is only
allowed to control what powers are given in the
Constitution. We citizens of the USA aren't required to
"prove" our water flow or enegy usage. The government is
required to prove that it has the constitutional power to
regulate things. However, the US Gov't has been ignoring its
own limits for the last couple decades.
--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
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"Crossfire" <"Benton Harbor"@mcafee.mx> wrote in message
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Christopher A. Young
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"Crossfire" <"Benton Harbor"@mcafee.mx> wrote in message
news:T371n.2453$Kq7...@newsfe04.iad...
Don't you have some cookies to bake?
--
Christopher A. Young
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"Crossfire" <"Benton Harbor"@mcafee.mx> wrote in message
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> You know, Karsten. Crossfire thinks you are both ignorant,
> and also a woman.
It's Karsten, not Kirsten. Of course, it might be a female miniature
schnauzer with an alias, but I'd bet on a male human.
--
Christopher A. Young
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"robert bowman" <bow...@montana.com> wrote in message
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> Most humans have rational thought process. This whatever
> appears to be a pure party line socialist. A drone, a worker
> bee, a good goose stepper.
Well said by a member of a religious group that, in the state they control,
use a beehive on the road markers. It's probably some sort of signal for
invading Chinese communists.
And, it's for Brazillian beehive owners, maybe. I'd have to
get back to you. But, I think it's not Chinese, otherwise it
would be a red circle or something.
--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
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"robert bowman" <bow...@montana.com> wrote in message
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Maybe there are camps for "Outward Bound" juveniles?
>On Dec 30 2009, 4:00�pm, "Stormin Mormon"
I just heard that in financial circles they have a way of describing
how to herd people into market directions they can then ambush by
selling short, long, etc.. Call the gullible small investors
"minnows" that join a "school" of, guess what, "fish." When the
harvest comes, the greedy victims jump headlong off market cliffs,
about like prehistoric critters did for hunters.
Obviously, no biologists were consulted for this decision...
But, apparently, the symbol IS representative!
Dan
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<book...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
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>>
> The symbol is fondly called Deseret, and reminds us of the
> beehive, where people choose to work together.
Only if you're sniffing ether, 2:3 to be exact....
--
Christopher A. Young
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"robert bowman" <bow...@montana.com> wrote in message
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> Ether mixed with gasoline, in that ratio?
Ether mixed with alma.