Butting Out
janelaw
wondering about this. How do other families divide up parenting
decisions?
DH and I are each bio and step parents to our children. We
have no biological children of our own. We each were used to
making parenting decisions with our exes. Now we seem to have
evolved into a pattern where the decisions are his, mine, or
ours. Usually it works out fine, but sometimes it is a little
confusing.
As an example, we have different views on violence in tv/movie
content. His kids can see Scream 2, but mine can't even watch
EXTRA. Sometimes we have conflicts about whether one of the
kids can go somewhere or stay over a friend's house. In
general, I make these decisions for mine and he makes them for
his. Occasionally, one of us feels strongly about the other's
decision, and we discuss it. Of course, we both make
innumerable everyday decisions about all the kids.
What I am asking is how much you and your mate make separate
decisions for your biokids. Where do other steps "butt out?"
Wakanyeja Makah
>The "butt out" remark in the Braces Debate thread made me start
>wondering about this. How do other families divide up parenting
>decisions?
We really don't divide the decisions in our household. We work together as
a team and discuss various important decisions of course...but as far as
the day to day decisions or discipline or any of that the parent who is
there (with the children at the time) makes that call.
>DH and I are each bio and step parents to our children. We
>have no biological children of our own. We each were used to
>making parenting decisions with our exes. Now we seem to have
>evolved into a pattern where the decisions are his, mine, or
>ours. Usually it works out fine, but sometimes it is a little
>confusing.
My husband and I have three sons. None are biologically *ours* (*mine*
technically are 8 and 11 and *his* technically is 9) We don't make the
distinction and they are all *ours*. It works for us and I think the
approach is healthier for the kids.
>As an example, we have different views on violence in tv/movie
>content. His kids can see Scream 2, but mine can't even watch
>EXTRA.
He and I pre-screen movies before we make a decision on whether or not the
kids can see them if there is any doubt. We do have some difficulty with
the bio-mom on this. Example: We refused to let our 8 and 9 year old see
Titanic (...quite graphic and disturbing...especially the frozen bodies in
the water near the end of the movie...) and we explained to both of them
our reasons for not letting them see it. Our 11 year old handled it quite
well and it wasn't a problem. (NOTE: Yes, I know a great many people
brought young children to this film...there are a great many parents who
let their children see The Terminator and other unsuitable movies...it
isn't what we choose to do)
To make a long story short our 9 year old's bio-mom after hearing that we
thought it would be far too disturbing for him took him to see the film
(..where in the midst of the movie he was so upset he had to leave the
theater..) Did this dissuade her? No...she took him back twice more to
try and see the film. He had to leave each time (upset). When he came
back to our home this summer he commented on how we were right and how the
film had upset him and he would see it when he was older.
It still makes us angry to think that she subjected him to it three
times...why?
>What I am asking is how much you and your mate make separate
>decisions for your biokids. Where do other steps "butt out?"
After numerous personal attacks from the bio-mom the only area that I *step
out* of is telephone communications with her or receiving her nasty mail.
The mail (addressed to me) is send back unopened and refused and I no
longer accept her foul language or demeaning remarks on the phone. I hang
up.
W. Makah
Sian Lee Reid
<jan...@excite.com> wrote:
> The "butt out" remark in the Braces Debate thread made me start
> wondering about this. How do other families divide up parenting
> decisions?
>
> What I am asking is how much you and your mate make separate
> decisions for your biokids. Where do other steps "butt out?"
My partner has two children from a previous marriage, a boy (12) and a
girl (9). We also have a daughter together (almost 3). We have joint
custody of his two children, with physical custody about 40% of the time.
His son refuses to spend the court-ordered time at our house, and biomom
does not enforce it. We are unwilling to go to court over it. There's
the background...
Now for the answer: I tend to butt out of decisions that don't affect me
(although not always). For example, if dad and biomom are trying to
decide if it is appropriate for the nine year old to go to a birthday
party with a horror movie theme, and the child is AT biomom's and will BE
at biomom's for the next few days, then I won't even offer an opinion
unless I'm asked for one. On the other hand, if the child is at our
house, and going to this party will involve us having to drive her out and
pick her up, and put up with whatever kinds of screaming nightmares she
has after watching a full slate of horror movies all afternoon, then this
will affect me, and I'll let dad know if I think it is a good idea. I
certainly don't get the deciding vote though...
All things that involve a financial outlay on our side affect me. If
biomom wants to take the kids to Disneyworld for a month, that's her
decision. If biomom thinks we should pay for half of a school trip for one
of the kids to go to Disneyworld, then I get input (with my DH only, not
with biomom).
In general, things that happen in my house affect me, and I get a say.
Things that happen outside my house, and do not involve my DH being absent
when he would otherwise be home, do not. That's pretty much how things
get divvied up...
Vicki Robinson
>The "butt out" remark in the Braces Debate thread made me start
>wondering about this. How do other families divide up parenting
>decisions?
>
[snip]
>
>What I am asking is how much you and your mate make separate
>decisions for your biokids. Where do other steps "butt out?"
It's easier for us; my stepkids live outside of Ottawa, Ontario. It's
a 5-hour drive (6 hours to their house), so my husband usually drives
up every other weekend by himself to see them. Sometimes I go with
him, at times we take my kids as well. Since we stay in a hotel in
downtown Ottawa, the questions of going over to a friend's house or
staying overnight never arise.
My kids live with us, and I do most of the parental stuff. I have no
idea how the money breaks out; I work, my ex- pays his CS on time
every time, my husband pays his CS on time every time, and all of the
money goes into and comes out of the same family pool. I guess my
income and CS covers all of my kids' expenses, but I don't keep
separate accounts. My husband's income covers his CS and the costs of
his visits to Ottawa and, I'm sure, some of our household expenses.
Aside from the money, my ex and I make the major decisions for my
daughters (schooling, health care, things like that), since we have
joint custody.
My husband has the status of my husband, an adult member of the
household and their stepfather. He has the right to intervene when
they are doing something immoral, illegal or fattening, and I stand by
him. A few times when I disagreed with his stand, I spoke to him
privately about it and let him handle it. I do almost all of the
chauffeuring, soccer-game-attending, etc., but he will do it without
complaint when I can't or just to lend me a hand. I make the rules
for my kids, but I discuss them with my husband, and he backs me up.
The kids also know that when I'm not around, he has the power to say
yes or no to any request. (For reference, my kids are 11 and 14.) It
helps that my ex- respects my husband's position in our household;
they back up each other, too, when the kids try to play one against
the other. (It's more of a "In his house, it's his rules. Period."
kind of support, but it works.)
My kids are not, however, manipulative or sneaky about things. This
helps a LOT.
When my stepkids are here, my husband tends to step back and let me
handle all four kids. I'm not comfortable with this for two reasons.
First of all, he sees them seldom enough as it is, I think they need
him to be involved in discipline and decision-making as well as in
trips to the zoo. Second, I don't want to do all the work and always
be the heavy. When a dispute arises that involves his kids, I keep
silent and let him handle it.
We are lucky that we are not dealing with psychotic or vindictive
ex-spouses or problem children. None of us is perfect, and we have
the inevitable bumps in the road to deal with, but nothing that we
can't handle. The most important part of making it all work is that
we talk to each other and we each expect and allow that the bioparents
will do the lion's share of the parenting of his or her children. We
also expect that the kids will respect and obey the stepparent, we
back each other up (although we certainly don't always agree; if we
disagree, we discuss it *privately*), we are able to trust our
children to act mostly with good will and good intentions. (Mostly!)
Every family is different, however.
Vicki
--
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lilbl...@my-dejanews.com
wma...@hotmail.com wrote:
> To make a long story short our 9 year old's bio-mom after hearing that we
> thought it would be far too disturbing for him took him to see the film
> (..where in the midst of the movie he was so upset he had to leave the
> theater..) Did this dissuade her? No...she took him back twice more to
> try and see the film. He had to leave each time (upset). When he came
> back to our home this summer he commented on how we were right and how the
> film had upset him and he would see it when he was older.
This is horrifying to me...DH and I have always been Titanic buffs and watch
everything that comes out, so we were thrilled with the planning of the new
movie. But even *I*--at 27--was so upset I nearly had to leave the theatre!
Did this woman see it first? I mean, I view the nudity in it as "artsy"
rather than "sexual", but it doesn't mean I need my eight year old watching
it! And there's a scene where a guy is falling off the back (forgive me for
not always being sure of my nautical terms :-Þ ) and hits the propeller that
even made my husband flinch!
Actually, that Celine Dion song came on the radio the other day and my
stepson said, "Hey, Leslie! This is from Titanic!" I had a few pale moments
while I reassured myself that his mother would never have taken him to see
it; she must have the soundtrack. She didn't want us taking him to Star Wars
last year (although, admittedly, we did anyway and my stepson absolutely
loved them...I was exactly his age when I'd seen them the first time)!
lil
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janelaw
>
> janelaw <jan...@excite.com> writes
> >The "butt out" remark in the Braces Debate thread made me start
> >wondering about this. How do other families divide up parenting
> >decisions?
> >
> >have no biological children of our own. We each were used to
> >making parenting decisions with our exes. Now we seem to have
> >evolved into a pattern where the decisions are his, mine, or
> >ours. Usually it works out fine, but sometimes it is a little
> >confusing.
> >
> >content. His kids can see Scream 2, but mine can't even watch
> >kids can go somewhere or stay over a friend's house. In
> >general, I make these decisions for mine and he makes them for
> >his. Occasionally, one of us feels strongly about the other's
> >decision, and we discuss it. Of course, we both make
> >innumerable everyday decisions about all the kids.
>
> set of kids screaming bloody murder all the time. I mean, your kids are
> home and want to see Scream 2. You say no. Then dad's kids ask, and they
> get to go. Your kids react to this how, exactly? I know what my steps
> would do. I'd get your my version of Scream right here in the kitchen
>
It doesn't work out that way, though. Maybe it is because mine
is younger (11). She is used to me telling her that she can't
see violent movies, that she must go to bed at 8 p.m., that she
can't stay over a friend's house until I have met the parents,
etc. She may try to change my mind on these points; she may
even try to convince DH to help her; but she never objects to
there being two sets of rules.
> snip
> I just don't know how you say, in response to "Bill's kids get to go!"
> anything akin to, "Well, they're his kids and he makes the rules. You're
> my kids and I make the rules"
>
This is pretty close to what we say. "Bill makes the decisions
about Ty's movies, and I make the decisions about yours."
> I would think it leads to a somewhat divisive household
>
> Of course, I've hardly answered your question (as I'm not qualified to).
> But I'd be interested to know how your kids deal with the situation
>
> -k.
Our kids are all in their second decade. They do not seem to
have any problem with there being different rules. In fact, I
don't think I gave this much thought until the "butt out"
thread.
Our exes make rules at their houses. We make them at ours. My
working relationship with DH is not very different from my one
with BD. I am the primary rule maker; they are my advisors.
Each can overrule me if they feel strongly enough. They do this
rarely, and they are always right. I have similar authority
with ex's house and DH's children, where they are the primary
rule makers.
We do have conflict, usually when my rules indirectly affect
SKs. If we are allowing all the kids to go to a movie, then it
has to be relatively non-violent. There may be squawking, but
DH or I just do the parent thing: "Fine, if you can't find a
reasonable movie, then don't go." If the older kids all make
plans to see a Bruce Willis movie, then the 11 yo just can't
go.
There was a huge to-do when one of my SSs insisted on calling
things he didn't like, "gay." (South Park has a lot to answer
for.) To me, it is as offensive and bigoted as calling someone
a "nigger." It took some work on DH's part to convince SS that
this was a non-negotiable point.
In one way, this set up avoids conflict. Our kids usually don't
"choose a parent" to ask permission. The kids all know that if
the decision is questionable, DH or I will refer them to their
bioparent.
Dean Barker
>
> The "butt out" remark in the Braces Debate thread made me start
> wondering about this. How do other families divide up parenting
> decisions?
My wife's 2 kids are 12 & 9, and we have a 1 yo together.
All of our decisions in our household are joint decisions, if
we are divided on an issue then the one who objects will win out.
If my wife is flat-out against something, I will go with her
decision. If I am flat-out against something, she will go along
with my decision. It has worked great.
We have no control whatsoever of anything that goes on at dad's
house. They see movies we don't approve of, they are not encouraged
to do any homework nor to use politeness. It upsets us, but so
far we are living with it.
-Dean
P.S. Could somebody please tell me what DH stands for? I'm a baseball
fan so of course I think Designated Hitter? Double Header? No, I
don't think so.
lilbl...@my-dejanews.com
Dean Barker <de...@cray.com> wrote:
> P.S. Could somebody please tell me what DH stands for?
Sorry, Dean...it's dear husband (unless we're ticked off about something, it
which case it could be darned husband, damned husband, dead husband...you get
the picture!).
SoccerStepMom
>
> On Thu, 23 Jul 1998 13:09:50 -0700, janelaw <jan...@excite.com> wrote:
>
> >The "butt out" remark in the Braces Debate thread made me start
> >wondering about this. How do other families divide up parenting
> >decisions?
>
> a team and discuss various important decisions of course...but as far as
> the day to day decisions or discipline or any of that the parent who is
> there (with the children at the time) makes that call.
>
> >have no biological children of our own. We each were used to
> >making parenting decisions with our exes. Now we seem to have
> >evolved into a pattern where the decisions are his, mine, or
> >ours. Usually it works out fine, but sometimes it is a little
> >confusing.
>
> technically are 8 and 11 and *his* technically is 9) We don't make the
> distinction and they are all *ours*. It works for us and I think the
> approach is healthier for the kids.
>
> >content. His kids can see Scream 2, but mine can't even watch
> >EXTRA.
>
> kids can see them if there is any doubt. We do have some difficulty with
> the bio-mom on this. Example: We refused to let our 8 and 9 year old see
> Titanic (...quite graphic and disturbing...especially the frozen bodies in
> the water near the end of the movie...) and we explained to both of them
> our reasons for not letting them see it. Our 11 year old handled it quite
> well and it wasn't a problem. (NOTE: Yes, I know a great many people
> brought young children to this film...there are a great many parents who
> let their children see The Terminator and other unsuitable movies...it
> isn't what we choose to do)
Gosh, I disagree with the choice of Terminator as an example of a movie
unsuitable for all young children. Our boys (my stepsons) are very
different in their reaction to movie violence: younger son (now 8)
takes it in stride, kind of as though it were a video game and always
has. Older son (now 11) is visibly concerned and avoids such movies. So
younger son owns and watches the Terminator movies, Mortal Kombat, etc,
with no problem, while older son just does something else. Both boys
are pretty good about stopping/leaving movies that are too upsetting.
For example, given younger son's appetite, we let him watch Scream, and
he stopped the tape after the first killing and never mentioned it
again. I respect this.
We absolutely forbid them from seeing movies with lots of sex, or
graphic bad language (the F word all over the place), and themes of real
tragedy like the Titanic are also too mature. But made-up violence
doesn't bother us.
That's just us. SSM
>
> To make a long story short our 9 year old's bio-mom after hearing that we
> thought it would be far too disturbing for him took him to see the film
> (..where in the midst of the movie he was so upset he had to leave the
> theater..) Did this dissuade her? No...she took him back twice more to
> try and see the film. He had to leave each time (upset). When he came
> back to our home this summer he commented on how we were right and how the
> film had upset him and he would see it when he was older.
>
> It still makes us angry to think that she subjected him to it three
> times...why?
>
> >What I am asking is how much you and your mate make separate
> >decisions for your biokids. Where do other steps "butt out?"
>
Vicki Robinson
>
>We absolutely forbid them from seeing movies with lots of sex, or
>graphic bad language (the F word all over the place), and themes of real
>tragedy like the Titanic are also too mature. But made-up violence
>doesn't bother us.
>
This is kind of hilarious; I never screen on the basis of language,
figuring that they've heard it all on the bus. (SOME movies would be
bounced for language, but they usually have so many other things wrong
with them that they would be offlimits anyway.) Sex also doesn't make
my forbidden list unless it's exploitative or coerced. Violence is an
absolute prohibition if it's graphic (no matter what part it plays in
the plot) and a likely prohibition if it's gratuitous.
:-) SSM, you know me pretty well, so you won't take this as
criticism, but I want everyone else to know that I'm not telling
anyone they're wrong. It's just funny how different our points of
view can be!
SoccerStepMom
>
> In a previous article, SoccerStepMom <soccer...@hotmail.com> said:
>
> >
> >We absolutely forbid them from seeing movies with lots of sex, or
> >graphic bad language (the F word all over the place), and themes of real
> >tragedy like the Titanic are also too mature. But made-up violence
> >doesn't bother us.
> >
>
> This is kind of hilarious; I never screen on the basis of language,
> figuring that they've heard it all on the bus. (SOME movies would be
> bounced for language, but they usually have so many other things wrong
> with them that they would be offlimits anyway.) Sex also doesn't make
> my forbidden list unless it's exploitative or coerced. Violence is an
> absolute prohibition if it's graphic (no matter what part it plays in
> the plot) and a likely prohibition if it's gratuitous.
>
> :-) SSM, you know me pretty well, so you won't take this as
> criticism, but I want everyone else to know that I'm not telling
> anyone they're wrong. It's just funny how different our points of
> view can be!
>
> Vicki
Always looking to learn, especially since most of my views are simply
reflections of my husbnad's amazing parental instincts... How come?
Remembering that mine are a little younger than yours....
PS, subject is very topical, as I am inside escaping the blistering heat
with younger SS, and we are watching Batman and Robin, which older SS
decided was too intense for him. He is outside in the yard helping his
Dad whack weeds. SSM
Vicki Robinson
>
>Always looking to learn, especially since most of my views are simply
>reflections of my husbnad's amazing parental instincts... How come?
>Remembering that mine are a little younger than yours....
>
>PS, subject is very topical, as I am inside escaping the blistering heat
>with younger SS, and we are watching Batman and Robin, which older SS
>decided was too intense for him. He is outside in the yard helping his
>Dad whack weeds. SSM
Well, it is somewhat based on what my kids will tolerate, as in your
case, but only in the sense that no one *has* to watch anything that
makes her uncomfortable. I'm afraid that I'm really too conservative,
but I'd rather go that way than the other.
In general, I allow PG and PG13 movies, and R movies only after I've
watched them, or at least read a review. I don't worry about sex in
movies, assuming we are talking about loving, not-too-exlicit sex.
I have spent a lot of time talking to my kids about sex being a normal
and healthy part of *adult* life. They will, someday, have sex lives
of their own and I want them to have a good attitude about it, to
allow themselves to enjoy and be a full participant, at the same time
not holding themselves cheaply or allowing themselves to be exploited.
TV and movies are potent learning tools; millions of dollars of
advertising money would not be spent if that weren't true.
I also don't worry about language, since I *know* that they've heard
it all before. A school bus is a learning environment too! They
don't use that language, and we don't either. (Of course, movies like
"Wiseguys" with Joe Pesci are out out out, for language as well as
violence.)
I am chiefly worried about violence. I don't want my kids to become
used to it, ever. I don't want them desensitized to brutal images,
even fake, make-believe images like those in Terminator. Violence
that occurs offscreen is sometimes all right, if the plot demands it;
after all, violence is also a part of life, and they need to be aware
that it happens.
It's really very individual, a judgement call every time. I have very
few absolute prohibitions (except for movies like "Scarface," for
which there is no excuse; I can't imagine an audience gaining
*anything* from that movie!) and a lot of it is based on what I think
they'll learn from each experience. My 14 yo is beginning to give me
a little grief about the prohibition on R movies now, although she
doesn't gripe too much. My chief concern about R movies right now (in
ref to the 14 yo) is that she wants them for overnights with her
friends, and I won't let her bring them unless I have called the other
moms to make sure that it's ok with them.
Add this to my own simple feeling that slasher movies don't edify in any
way, and that I don't want my kids "entertained" by the slaughter of
teenagers (purely personal preference) and that lets out a lot of the
R movies.
In any case, you'll never hear a word from me about what other people
let their kids watch. (Well, no that's not true either. Some films
simply are NOT for children on any level, but we don't need to go
there.) It depends on your own tolerance for different images, your
values and intimate knowledge of your children. I contact the other
moms if my child is going to show a movie to her friends that I think
might be objectionable in *any* way, and ask that they do the same.
Otherwise, I don't think it's life and death, just a matter of values
and aesthetics.
Vicki
AndrewZ+Ange
wrote:
>We have no control whatsoever of anything that goes on at dad's
>house. They see movies we don't approve of, they are not encouraged
>to do any homework nor to use politeness. It upsets us, but so
>far we are living with it.
>
God do I know that feeling!
My ex knows how I feel about too much Nintendo/Playstaytion, computer
games, and anything above "G" rated films, games and audio tapes. How
do I feel, well moderation is the key with the games and anything
above "G" rating is OUT! Whats funny is he agreed with most of it when
we were together. My fiance and I are strict when it comes to these
issues with my 5yo barr a some movies with think are genuine family
movies.
Although whats funny is we haven't really pulled him up on playing too
much Nintendo or watching too much tv or unsuitable movies. He will
play like for 10 minutes switch it off and go play with his toys,
flick through a book, watch tv, or come join in our conversations go
outside etc etc ... Yet at his dads whatever time of day i call him he
will be on the playstation our Amiga barr the few times he actually
takes him away from home. But then dads girlfriend bought him a
Gameboy for xmas and here started to take that up there with him until
they realised that batteries cost money :)
I have talked about these things with ex but it goes in one ear and
out the other. My fiance has even mentioned to ex in passing and the
same happens. Last week 5yo was fitted for glasses for Astigmatism
and ex still doesn't get the plot!
We don't like him having chewing gum cause he chews the flavour out
and then swallows the chewing gum. Yet our 5yo will greet us at the
door after spending the weekend with dad, with a full pack of gum in
his hand .
As for the politeness well he ain't too bad. He does come back hyped
up and abit rough and takes him a couple of days at the most to settle
back into our way of doing things.
Like yourselves it upsets us but for now we are living with it.
Ange
Vicki Robinson
>
>God do I know that feeling!
>
>My ex knows how I feel about too much Nintendo/Playstaytion, computer
>games, and anything above "G" rated films, games and audio tapes. How
>
[snip]
>Although whats funny is we haven't really pulled him up on playing too
>much Nintendo or watching too much tv or unsuitable movies. He will
>play like for 10 minutes switch it off and go play with his toys,
>flick through a book, watch tv, or come join in our conversations go
>outside etc etc ...
>
[snip]
>I have talked about these things with ex but it goes in one ear and
>out the other. My fiance has even mentioned to ex in passing and the
>same happens. Last week 5yo was fitted for glasses for Astigmatism
>and ex still doesn't get the plot!
>
It sounds as though your ex has definite ideas about who makes the
rules at his house, and isn't interested in letting you influence his
choices. I do understand how you feel about these issues (I'm
conservative about this stuff too), but I think you do need to realize
that his home is *his* home, and he's the one who makes the rules.
Unless he's putting your son's health and welfare at risk, you really
have to kind of "butt out." (Don't get me wrong, I think it's really
best if both parents can agree on similar rule sets between their
homes, but that's unrealistic in most cases.)
And, by the way, your son's astigmatism has nothing to do with his
video-game-playing habits; it's a flaw in the structure of his eye,
and it is not influenced by reading or watching TV.
>We don't like him having chewing gum cause he chews the flavour out
>and then swallows the chewing gum. Yet our 5yo will greet us at the
>door after spending the weekend with dad, with a full pack of gum in
>his hand .
>
>As for the politeness well he ain't too bad. He does come back hyped
>up and abit rough and takes him a couple of days at the most to settle
>back into our way of doing things.
>
>Like yourselves it upsets us but for now we are living with it.
>
I really do understand how you feel about this, but I'm wondering if
you'd benefit from stepping back and trying to fit this stuff into a
larger framework. You're concerned about the amount of time your son
spends playing videogames. His dad gives him gum, which you would
prefer that he not have, because, like most 5 year-olds, he swallows
it when the flavor runs out. But is he well taken care of, otherwise?
Does he have clean clothes, regular, reasonably nutritious meals? A
set bedtime and a safe and comfortable place to sleep? Does he have a
father and FSM who love him and help him feel smart and acceptable,
with lots of love and appropriate discipline and rewards? If he has
these good things with his dad and his FSM and you have a cordial
relationship with both of them, then you're ahead of the game, and the
videogames and gum won't make a big difference in the long run.
Your son can easily understand that there are two sets of rules in his
parents' two homes, and move between them without trauma if they are
consistent and lovingly applied. I think you may be spending a lot of
energy and worry on things that you cannot (either practically or
morally) affect, and things that will, in the end, not be large
influences in your son's life, and that's energy that you could be
using for something more productive for you and your family. Your ex
has his household, and he will make his own rules. If you push him,
he may decide to retaliate by allowing your son to do other things as
well that you don't approve of, but that he sees as essentially
harmless.
It sounds as if you and your ex have a generally decent relationship
and it certainly sounds (from other posts) that your son is
well-adjusted and comfortable with all four adults in his life. This
is a good thing, and rare enough. Take a deep breath and pick your
battles. Make sure that the prize is worth the fight.
Merrie
to questionable material - bad language, sex & violence - but if I
condone it by allowing them to watch it.
Two things that help me make a determination are 1) they don't emulate
the bad behavior watched (got one still working on being able to watch
Simpson's) and 2) they can understand what they are watching.
Violence is easier to understand at an earlier age then sex, especially
in Hollywood's usual morally laced frameworks of good vs evil. Even
little kids understand what Wily Coyote is trying to do to the Road
Runner but a vivid french kiss would seem unexplainably gross!
Merrie
lilbl...@my-dejanews.com
Merrie <mbrin...@pon.net> wrote:
> For myself it isn't a matter of whether or not they have been exposed
> to questionable material - bad language, sex & violence - but if I
> condone it by allowing them to watch it.
Sigh...we have the exact opposite problem. My stepson's eight and DH and I
are trying to encourage him to watch more "age appropriate" shows. Now we'd
like him to enjoy what he's watching (DH and I still love Bugs Bunny and
Disney cartoons), but we're hoping that we can convince him that there are
lots of equally enjoyable shows for children more his age. It's working,
too, 'cause we've got him fascinated by Bill Nye the Science Guy!
But if we leave him to pick out his own video, he'll pick Barney, The Brave
Little Toaster or The Land Before Time!
mattbeckwith
> All of our decisions in our household are joint decisions, if
> we are divided on an issue then the one who objects will win out.
> If my wife is flat-out against something, I will go with her
> decision. If I am flat-out against something, she will go along
> with my decision. It has worked great.
>
> We have no control whatsoever of anything that goes on at dad's
> house. They see movies we don't approve of, they are not encouraged
> to do any homework nor to use politeness. It upsets us, but so
> far we are living with it.
This post really struck me because this is precisely the way it works
around
our house--including the last paragraph!
My wife tends to defer to me when there's a tie, though, unless she
feels
strongly about something.
Your newsreader at home or on the road; always at Talkway.
http://www.talkway.com/ Surf Usenet!
Vicki Robinson
>
>But if we leave him to pick out his own video, he'll pick Barney, The Brave
>Little Toaster or The Land Before Time!
>
Hmmmm.... in both The Brave Little Toaster and The Land Before Time,
small and vulnerable characters proceed, in the face of their fears,
to seek out security and defeat the forces that try to keep them down.
If I'm remembering right, your stepson has overcome and is overcoming
some major challenges in his development, things that are not
age-appropriate for him to be struggling with right now. I think that
TBLT and TLBT might be speaking to him in special and personal ways.
You might want to just let him watch those things, and talk with him
about what he likes about them.
peg boucher murphy
Vicki Robinson <vjr...@canoe.xcski.com> wrote:
>In a previous article, SoccerStepMom <soccer...@hotmail.com> said:
>>graphic bad language (the F word all over the place), and themes of real
>>tragedy like the Titanic are also too mature. But made-up violence
>>doesn't bother us.
>
>This is kind of hilarious; I never screen on the basis of language,
same in our house. :)
>Sex also doesn't make
>my forbidden list unless it's exploitative or coerced.
absolutely. :) (wow, finding out that vicky and i agree about things
like this feels really good -- most parents i know are far more likely
to agree with ssm. enough so that i rarely discuss it with other parents!)
>Violence is an
>absolute prohibition if it's graphic (no matter what part it plays in
>the plot) and a likely prohibition if it's gratuitous.
hmmm. this i have slightly reversed. graphic violences is an absolute
prohibition if it is gratuitous. violence in general is something that
i screen on -- i think seeing it minimizes the shock and horror of real
violence (never mind glorifying being violent "for the right reasons"!).
but we have watched movies as a family with very explicit and graphic
violence where that was necessary to the story and the impact of the story.
many of these are either historical or important parables dealing with
ethical/moral situations that are important to us.
examples: "swing kids"
"roots"
"europa europa"
"schindler's list"
(we still intend to see several others that i would put on the same list)\
during the latter three, we stopped periodically to talk about history
and historical issues. all have led to long and interesting discussions
about ethics and morality, and our kids have been seen/heard applying them
to other films/television shows/books/situations in their lives. and in
some cases, this has continued to happen years later.
>:-) SSM, you know me pretty well, so you won't take this as
>criticism, but I want everyone else to know that I'm not telling
>anyone they're wrong. It's just funny how different our points of
>view can be!
ditto!
peg
lilbl...@my-dejanews.com
vjr...@canoe.xcski.com (Vicki Robinson) wrote:
> I think that
> TBLT and TLBT might be speaking to him in special and personal ways.
> You might want to just let him watch those things, and talk with him
> about what he likes about them.
Oops...Vicki, I think I worded my post strangely. I wasn't criticizing his
interest in these movies. I actually don't think I've seen The Brave Little
Toaster, but I think The Land Before Time is a great little movie and I
definitely understand his interest in it...we actually discuss it all the
time when we're trying to help him understand something. We have all four
(five?) of them and they've made just about every point possible so we can
use them to refer back to when real life starts to resemble "art"! We're
more than happy to have him watch these movies and many others that he likes
(except that we *are* trying to wean him off the very young ones, like
Barney)...we're also hoping that we can interest him in moving forward and
trying other videos that he never noticed before. But we certainly don't
want him to stop watching his favorites.
He seems to really love the science videos we get. As well as the Bill Nye
the Science Guy, who I mentioned before, he loves children's science
documentaries on dinosaurs and whales and rainforests and stuff. I even
started renting the Wynton Marsalis (I have *no* idea if I spelled his name
right!) videos that introduce children to the world of instrumental
music...everything from classical to jazz. He likes those too. We noticed
his interest in classical music years ago. When Rob moved in with me, the
closest thing I had to a children's recording was David Bowie narrating Peter
and the Wolf. He was about three or four and was sitting on the couch,
"conducting". It was pretty funny! We've taken him to see different Peter
and the Wolf productions...now I want to take him to The Nutcracker this
Christmas.
My post was merely meant to marvel at the difference between my eight year
old and other people's. The most mature movies he ever showed any interest
in were my tapes of James and the Giant Peach and Nightmare Before Christmas
(I'm a clay animation fiend!)...and even though he's seen Nightmare a dozen
times, he still has to close his eyes for the beginning! He's never shown
any interest in "adult" movies and the idea of having to censor his viewing
habits seems kind of...well...way down the line from here!
janelaw
>
> <snip> graphic violences is an absolute
> prohibition if it is gratuitous. violence in general is something that
> i screen on -- i think seeing it minimizes the shock and horror of real
> violence (never mind glorifying being violent "for the right reasons"!).
>
> but we have watched movies as a family with very explicit and graphic
> violence where that was necessary to the story and the impact of the story.
> many of these are either historical or important parables dealing with
> ethical/moral situations that are important to us.
> examples: "swing kids"
> "roots"
> "europa europa"
> "schindler's list"
> (we still intend to see several others that i would put on the same list)\
>
> during the latter three, we stopped periodically to talk about history
> and historical issues. all have led to long and interesting discussions
> about ethics and morality, and our kids have been seen/heard applying them
> to other films/television shows/books/situations in their lives. and in
> some cases, this has continued to happen years later.
>
>
Thanks for all the input. Just today, I was called upon to
explain precisely why my daughter (who is now 11) cannot see the
movie all her friends are seeing tomorrow. It is the current
teen slasher, Bizarre Behavior. I really wished I could say
yes, but according to the review I read, the movie starts with a
football player murdering his girlfriend while she performs oral
sex on him. I guess her friends' parents don't read the
reviews.
Anyway, I think I pretty much fall into the same category as
Vicki.
Also, I draw a distinction between human and non-human
violence. She can see the Jurassic Park, Deep Impact, Godzilla
kind of movie. I don't mind action/adventure movies like ID4
and Star Wars. I told her she could see BaseketBall, which
can't have any redeeming merit whatsoever, can it?
OTOH, DH feels that the amount of time his kids spend in a movie
is minimal. They learn their values at home. His kids can read
or watch anything they want.
Incidentally, I never give the sex in movies a thought. It only
bothers me if it is violent, which I already exclude. So I
brought my daughter to see Soul Food, a movie about a family
dealing with variety of different situations. For some reason,
the couples kept having sex standing up. I wasn't sure what to
say afterwards. She seemed to take it in stride.