EVIL BIOMOMS
Renee
like they do. I hate to generalize, but, damn it seems to be true.
It seems like once they separate from the father of their children,
they suddenly become nasty, vindictive, and remarkably inconsiderate
of their children.
And how funny is it how they interpret court orders? Everything is so
slanted towards them, yet still they expect even more. I am not
talking about child support money here, I am talking about extra time,
or whatever.
She always used to say "You'll never win, I am the MOTHER." I always
thought, "This is the 90's... good luck with that argument...."
Little did I know, she was right. The legal system in this state is
pathetic, and I'm sure it is indicative of the system in most states.
(tho' it's not what I was taught in law school)
A little background: My DH and I have had exactly 1/2 half physical
custody of my step-daughter since she was 6 months old. The only
counselor that she has been to arrived at the conclusion that instead
of her mother or her father, her strongest and closest bond is with
me. I love that little girl like my own (she is now 3), and when I
ask to keep her an extra hour so she can go see Thomas the Tank
Engine, Biomom says No.... yet, she expects both myself and DH to bend
over backwards to accomodate her schedule.
Sorry for ranting, just a little bitter tonight.... why is it that the
children always have to pay the price for the hurt feelings that the
grown-ups have. Grown-ups are supposed to be able to deal with those
issues.... 3 year old girls shouldn't have to.
Renee
Katy
old ( I have been in the picture since he was 7) bonding with me or even
with his dad, she calls him when he is here and bribes him with your friend
is here and wants to play, or do you want to go to the store with me, or
etc.. etc... always on our time.. she constantly dumps him when she wants
to party at nite , and then we think we will have him all weekend and then
first thing in the morning she calls and talks him into leaving... then she
brainwashes him with crud about his Dad and me.. so that it always takes a
day for him to warm up... She started this when I was reading him stories,
and taking him to the park.. heaven forbid I be nice to the little guy..
good luck <Katy
Renee wrote in message <35f1fca6...@news.ncia.net>...
SoccerStepMom
Wow. It sounds as though you are really in a tug-of-war with the biomom
over who is going to be this little girl's Mommy! And I have to say,
even though I am a stepmom myself, I kind of feel sorry for the biomom.
After all, you have evidently been in her little girl's life for as long
as the girl can remember, and the girl has probably spent as much time
with you as she has with her real Mom.
Unlike most step-parent situations, where the child is clear on who is
the "real" parent and has a special bond that no step-parent can touch,
this little girl probably feels equally strongly about both of you. I'm
curious - does she call you Mommy?
You describe your bond with her as stronger than her own mother's! How
would that make you feel if the child were your own biological
daughter? Wouldn't you kind of feel like another woman had come in and
stolen your baby? I don't know the circumstances that had you in her
ex-husband's life so close to the birth of their child, but there's
probably some rivalry there, too (just guessing).
Assuming that the biomom is a decent, loving mother, I suggest that you
and your hubby are luckier than most to have a true 50/50 split, and you
and he should work hard to make it fair. If you had less than 50/50 and
occasionally wanted extra time, I can see grousing that she won't give
in. But right now, my guess is she feels that any extra special time
you have will tip the balance of her child's affection toward you.
Until you resolve this tug-of-war, you will be fighting over stupid
things like an hour here and there.
Good luck. This is a tough one. SSM
PS, you say that "my husband and I have 1/2 physical custody". I know
what you mean here, as my husband has custody and I often say "we" have
custody. But the fact is, unless your order is very different from
most, *you* do not have any custodial rights over this child. Your
husband does. Important difference. He drops dead tomorrow and you are
out of the child's life forever unless the Mom permits it. Very painful
for me to face with respect to my own situation, but I think some
perspective you need as you deal with the "evil" Mom.
Rose
> <snip>
> But the fact is, unless your order is very different from
> most, *you* do not have any custodial rights over this child. Your
> husband does. Important difference. He drops dead tomorrow and you are
> out of the child's life forever unless the Mom permits it. Very painful
> for me to face with respect to my own situation, but I think some
> perspective you need as you deal with the "evil" Mom.
>
>
Actually, SSM, this is not always true. A lot of states are allowing
step-parents to have visitation rights, especially if they are like your
case, where you are a primary caregiver. Again, this varies from state to
state and she'd have to check her codes as would you. Another option is to
get power-of-attorney rights, which, technically all of step-moms should
have in order to do simple things like take the kids to the doctor, which
btw, we've never gotten around to doing, but my doc said he'd see the boys
without it anyway.
Rose
Lisa
rights, etc. Just curious: How many of us have arranged these things
legally? I am the parent who takes my SS to the doctor, the dentist,
back-to-school night, church, the rock-climbing wall, etc. etc. etc. I
do the teacher conferences, I schmooze his friends' parents, I decide
whether he will or will not get a hepatitis B vaccination . . .
I have no legal authority to do any of this.
We keep meaning to set up a POA. We haven't done so. And, one has EVER
asked me for it. I guess if you show up looking concerned and carrying
a kid's insurance card, you're in.
His dentist once decided that a tooth, in which we expected a small
filling, would have to be extracted. SS wanted to do it right then so
as not to have to dread it. I said, "I think I'm out of stepmother
territory; I have to call my husband." And I did, he agreed, and I
turned around and signed a release. Even THEN nobody asked whether I
had power of attorney of anything.
Once, on a trip to my parents' house (without my husband), SS developed
a dreadful rash --a penicillin allergy! Eeek! I scrambled him to the
emergency room. He was 7. We filled out a bunch of papers, saw a
million people, and nobody even wondered why he was calling me by my
first name. At the end of the visit they said to him for some reason,
"How many parents do you have at home?"
"Two," he said.
He didn't add ". . .out of three."
Anyway,
Does anybody ever get questioned about this kind of thing? Anybody ever
NOT been allowed to sign for something?
Lisa
lilblakdog
Lisa wrote in message <35F33E...@ncal.net>...
>Just curious: How many of us have arranged these things
>legally? I am the parent who takes my SS to the doctor, the dentist,
>back-to-school night, church, the rock-climbing wall, etc. etc. etc. I
>do the teacher conferences, I schmooze his friends' parents, I decide
>whether he will or will not get a hepatitis B vaccination . . .
Actually, Lisa, I was wondering the same thing. I handle everything for my
stepson while he's here and no one questions a thing. Of course, Canada has
a much smoother medical insurance program than the do in the States. So
long as I have his medical card, a doctor will see him.
Anything else, and I just tell them I'm his mother (and hope to God that he
doesn't call me "Leslie" while I'm filling out the required forms!). I've
always signed for library cards and sports waivers and stuff like that. DH
and I take him back and forth across the US/Canada border on a regular basis
(DH's brother lives in the States) and nobody's ever even considered that
he's not ours. Of course, DH's last name is Watson, mine is Watson and
stepson's in Pynn-Watson...not much to question, I suppose! I figure that
we all recognize that I'm his guardian when he's here and DH is at work, so
that's all we care about. I think that I'd have to do something pretty
extreme in order for biomom to question my authority. Should I have this
POA to cover my butt?
lil
BTW - this is totally off topic, but does anybody else get the urge to refer
to their husband in public as "DH"? Pugg mentioned spending too much time
on here and I'm starting to feel the same way!
Renee
<soccer...@hotmail.com> wrote:
*snip*
>
>Unlike most step-parent situations, where the child is clear on who is
>the "real" parent and has a special bond that no step-parent can touch,
>this little girl probably feels equally strongly about both of you. I'm
>curious - does she call you Mommy?
Actually, when my stepdaughter was about 18month old, and we were at
an exchange (that's how we refer to those wonderful pickup-dropoff
times), she looked at the biomom, then looked at me.... held up 2
fingers and said "One.... Two Mommies!" We, of course just let it go,
but biomom started in full force on the little one. For two weeks,
she would look at me and say "Just one mommy, just one Renee" all sad
like. That eventually turned into Mommy-Renee (which she still calls
me to this day) and she refers to biomom as "just-mommy" or "my
plain-mommy". Had biomom just let it go, she would have figured it
out on her own. I've always told her that I love her and I know she
loves me and I don't care what she calls me. She tells me that her
"plain mommy says you aren't my mommy-Renee, but can I call you that
anyway?" Of course she can :)
>
>You describe your bond with her as stronger than her own mother's! How
>would that make you feel if the child were your own biological
>daughter? Wouldn't you kind of feel like another woman had come in and
>stolen your baby? I don't know the circumstances that had you in her
>ex-husband's life so close to the birth of their child, but there's
>probably some rivalry there, too (just guessing).
Actually, I was lucky, biomom and my husband were never married. Her
claws are limited to issues related to the child. Thank god they were
never married. They had broken up, she moved across the country,
called up a month later and told him she was pregnant. He brought her
back and supported her throughout the pregnancy, etc. Hell yes there
is rivalry, she can't stand me. She, her parents and his parents all
told him to marry her.... he wouldn't. He and I were together 6
months and got married ;) But, it's been a long time now, and she has
since gotten engaged to another man. My only complaint is that she
does not think what is best for the child. She cannot let go of the
anger.
>
>Assuming that the biomom is a decent, loving mother, I suggest that you
>and your hubby are luckier than most to have a true 50/50 split, and you
>and he should work hard to make it fair. If you had less than 50/50 and
>occasionally wanted extra time, I can see grousing that she won't give
>in. But right now, my guess is she feels that any extra special time
>you have will tip the balance of her child's affection toward you.
We've had the 50/50 split until September 1, of this year. The new
schedule has just started where we have her on weekends during the
school year, and biomom will have weekends during the summer....
>Until you resolve this tug-of-war, you will be fighting over stupid
>things like an hour here and there.
>
>Good luck. This is a tough one. SSM
>
>PS, you say that "my husband and I have 1/2 physical custody". I know
>what you mean here, as my husband has custody and I often say "we" have
>custody. But the fact is, unless your order is very different from
>most, *you* do not have any custodial rights over this child. Your
>husband does. Important difference. He drops dead tomorrow and you are
>out of the child's life forever unless the Mom permits it. Very painful
>for me to face with respect to my own situation, but I think some
>perspective you need as you deal with the "evil" Mom.
>
Actually, I am a lawyer in the state where this particular battle is
being fought, tho', for obvious reasons I can't represent my husband.
And I am well aware of the legal status of my relationship to the
child.... sad, tho' it is.
She and her lawyer have tried to come after my income, so as to
include it in the child support calculations. I told them, fine, they
could do that so long as I would get a legal right to the child. Of
course they declined ;)
Thanks for your support, all of you. I've been lurking on this group
for a few months, I guess last night I just had to vent. I guess it's
true what they say, "Misery loves company" But it really does help me
to feel better knowing I am not the only one.
thanks again
Renee
Renee
about having biomom sign it, but all the lawyers told us that it only
needed to be signed by one parent. Of course, we have more than just
medical authorizations in ours..... the more to fight about should
something happen to DH and contact with my step-daughter is cut off.
DH often tells me that should something happen to him, just keep his
body in the garage as long as I can so that I can keep seeing my SD ;)
But no doctor has ever asked to see it, and I've taken her to her
regular doctor, emergency rooms, those "urgent care" places, etc.
I've enrolled her in school, even!
It seems to me that it would be a good thing for any step-parent to
have. I don't know that the bio-parent could come after the
step-parent legally, but I'd bet they could go after the medical care
provider. After all, children under 18 (16 some places) cannot
consent to medical care, and if there is no natural parent there to
consent......then who was there with the capacity to consent?
Renee
MFreund
Renee wrote:
> *snip*
>
> Actually, I am a lawyer in the state where this particular battle is
> being fought, tho', for obvious reasons I can't represent my husband.
> And I am well aware of the legal status of my relationship to the
> child.... sad, tho' it is.
>
> She and her lawyer have tried to come after my income, so as to
> include it in the child support calculations. I told them, fine, they
> could do that so long as I would get a legal right to the child. Of
> course they declined ;)
>
> Thanks for your support, all of you. I've been lurking on this group
> for a few months, I guess last night I just had to vent. I guess it's
> true what they say, "Misery loves company" But it really does help me
> to feel better knowing I am not the only one.
>
> thanks again
>
> Renee
Renee, I've been lurking in this group for some time, too :-) Couldn't pass
up this opportunity to say "No, you are definitely NOT alone!"
My situation is similar in many respects, but different. My husband has
exclusive custody of his two girls (now ages 5 and 7). This was prior to our
own marriage. They started out by calling me Aunt Marjorie (during the
courtship) and then, on their own accord (and I reiterate on their own),
prior to our wedding (which they were very much a part of) Mom. BM has
visitation (days only, no overnights) three times a week but has taken
advantage of this exactly 1.5 days since December of last year. It has been
well over three months since she even phoned.
On the flip side, my strapping 6' 1" teen (14 .... argh!) is also with us and
hasn't seen his biodad in over 5 years. Since our own divorce, his father
was minimally involved with my son and was the quintessential "Disneyland
dad". Fortunately for me, even though he did nothing in terms of child
support, etc., or consistent parenting, he rarely every interefered in my
parenting or decisions I made pertaining to my son. His reasoning was that I
"was an excellent mother". I suspect, however, applauding my skills was
easier than admitting that it was too much responsiblity for him :-)
Anyhow, five years ago Biodad up and moved to Egypt where he let his
visa/passport (and all those other goodies necessary for a non resident alien
to travel to the US) expire. It will be next to impossible for him to get
out of the country. I consider this a blessing in disguise.
My experience with my son is that since I never "dogged" his father to him,
my son was able to reach his own conclusions about his biodad. I know my son
wishes his biodad were different, but he now sees that his biodad was just a
father in name only. On the otherhand, my son absolutely ADORES his
stepfather and has been calling him DAD forever. Again, on his own accord.
My husband was "born to be a dad" and is excellent with my son. There have
been adjustments, but theirs is a strong bond. My husband is involved in
every aspect of his life.
As to the girls, I couldn't love them more if they were my own biological
daughters. Yes, I know they are not, but that doesn't change or ALTER the
bond that we have. What I hate is that feeling that I am NOT their biomom,
even though I wish I were. The thought of something happening to my husband
and my possibly losing the girls is VERY frightening. We have discussed
making provisions for just this kind of scenario, and since he has exclusive
custody we may able to make some kind of arrangement. I know that isn't going
to necessarily sit well with too many people, but oh well. Why lie about
they way we feel?
The hardest thing that I've had to deal with is the separation of logical,
spiritual and emotional issues I sometimes face. Logically, of course I am
not their *real* mother and yes, they do love her (what child doesn't still
long for their natural parent). Emotionally, that does hurt sometimes, but it
is getting better :-) Then of course, spiritually, I want to be forgiving of
Biomom. We all make mistakes and at some point in her life she is going to
have take a hard look at herself. I can't judge her. But then again, she
does have some serious issues that make us (my husband, especially) cringe at
the thought of letting her spend any time with them. We have NEVER, ever
denied her access to the girls. We plan things on her time now because she
doesn't take advantage of her visitation.
So, why this epistle or sorts? Just to encourage you and others in similar
situations. I know the one thing I've enjoyed about lurking in this group is
that after reading the posts, I realized that I wasn't the ONLY one out there
feeling like I had a wacko BM. When I look at these two little cherubs I
realize just how fortunate I am to have them in my life and what an honor and
priviledge it is to be their mom :-)
Chin up!
MFreund
I guess it doesn't hurt that the girls call me mom :-)
Lisa wrote:
> The previous messages mention powers of attorney, step-parent visitaion
> rights, etc. Just curious: How many of us have arranged these things
> legally? I am the parent who takes my SS to the doctor, the dentist,
> back-to-school night, church, the rock-climbing wall, etc. etc. etc. I
> do the teacher conferences, I schmooze his friends' parents, I decide
> whether he will or will not get a hepatitis B vaccination . . .
>
Rose
SoccerStepMom wrote:
> Rose wrote:
> >
>
>
> Fair enough. But if the biomom hates her guts and considers her a
> threat to her own relationship with the girl, what kind of access will
> she permit? Will the stepmom spend the rest of her life in court?
>
> This is a very real concern for me, as my husband's ex will never be
> able to accept me (because of her emotional condition). I am simply
> praying that nothing happens to my husband until the boys are old enough
> to decide for themselves who they will see. Or else I will just have to
> see them when they are with their grandmother (as my MIL and I get along
> great, and there is no way the biomom could keep them from her).
Actually, I would have the same problem, unless she needed a babysitter for
something. She hates me. Always has and I guess after 9 years, she always
will...sigh.
We'd all probably be in the same boat as an NCP who was denied visitation by
the CP.
>
>
> As far as day-to-day stuff, the power of attorney is an idea I learned
> of here and implemented, although no school or doctor has yet asked for
> it (and I sign things all the time).
>
> Cheers, SSM
Did it cost very much? We really need to do this. My oldest SS was here for a
month this summer, and even though my doc said he'd see him if necessary, I'd
still feel better if I had the right to take him. My husband would take him, I
know, but lots of times it's easier for me to get off of work and get there.
Rose
Rose
Lisa wrote:
We really need to do this. The kids have their mom's last name which,
obviously, is not ours, so it's hard to bring a kid somewhere where you're
signing one name and they're signing another. We provide insurance in their
name, so the doc's not a problem(though signing them on my insurance is...we
actually got denied once, but since I'm the administrator for the health
insurance at my company, I just changed plans...lol), the library card went
in our name so no questions were asked...but still, I feel like it's
something we should do, along with change their names, but she's balking on
that one, so off to court we'll have to go on that...sigh, it never ends,
does it..
Rose
Michael R. Martin
The school forms, the doctor forms, everything says stepmother. Who does
the school call when they have a problem -- me, of course. They don't even
ask about the father. Last year when my SS got suspended, I was the only
one at the conference with the vice principal before he could return to
school.
Cindy
sha...@mvp.net
hu...@mindless.com
http://mvp.net/~shadow/
St.John, Missouri 63114
A member of the "HTML Writers Guild"
A day's not complete without getting into a little "trouble".
kcd
really nice, encouraging post, mfreund. REALLY encouraging. i have an
"evil biomom" situation which totally shapes the whole step thang.
14 and 6' 1"? i bet that boy can EAT.
i was touched when you talked of your love for your sds. they are lucky girls.
kcd
--
I think it's going to be a long time until American society accepts fat
people. Dieting has been elevated into a religion, a new religion, and
only the thin are "good" and saved. The new messiah is any weight-loss
expert. And if you couple religious fervor and righteousness with desire
and pressure [to lose weight], you have a recipe for dismissive posturing.
- C. K. Grinnell
Lisa
particular. In seven years of bringing up my SS, I've never needed to
produce any proof of authority. I've never even fibbed about it.
I really just wondered whether I was the only custodial step-mom who has
had this much co-operation from the universe. It seems to work fine with
no legal authority. I have moral and social authority, and that seems
to do the trick.
As janelaw points out, agency law probably does cover it. But I never
signed anything as "SM for DH," which is what I do when I'm being his
agent.
I'm not at all a cavalier person about this kind of thing. For example,
my SS's older sister (half-sister, from his mother's previous marriage
--so this young woman is my DH's former step-daughter) recently had a
baby in sad circumstances. Long story (but a triumph of step-parenting
though I say it myself who shouldn't) omitted. She asked us to be the
child's godparents and legal guardians if she should be unable to take
care of him. We said yes and immediately formalized the agreement. She
has formally nominated us as guardians in the event of her death, and we
even had the father sign under penalty of perjury that he's the baby's
dad (in case we need to prove that for some reason).
Upshot: I have more legal right to the custody of my SS's nephew than I
do to SS himself.
There's really nothing I CAN do about that; not here. If DH dies I'll
just go on hoping for the best and trust that my SS will not be forced
out of his home. It will not be up to me.
I hope you won't be in court for anything that's not really important.
Does it matter what your kids' names are? Why change them? It makes
sense to me that they have their mom's name, since their mom & dad
aren't married. And if you're determined to call them something else
there's nothing to stop you.
Can a court in your area give you any more authority over your SKs than
you husband can? (You don't need a court order for a POA where you are,
do you?)
Rose wrote:
> We really need to do this. The kids have their mom's last name which,
> obviously, is not ours, so it's hard to bring a kid somewhere where you're
> signing one name and they're signing another.
<snip>
janelaw
I'm out of my depth here. I've always vaguely assumed this was
covered by the law of agency. BF and BM share legal custody. I
act as BF's agent, because he has given me the authority to do
so. It doesn't have to be written down.
On a more practical note, how are doctors, dentists, coaches,
etc. supposed to know, really? My daughter, my husband, and I
all have different last names. Even if you do have the same
last name, that doesn't mean you have legal custody. I suppose
they could ask for birth certificates, custody papers, divorce
decrees, etc. for every kid whose parent signs a form.
Rose
Lisa wrote:
Well, actually, oldest SS has requested it. Biomom has remarried and now they
have no-one's name so to speak. The youngest wrote it on a some paper at home one
day and got grounded for a *week*. This is what we deal with here. Oldest SS has
told me he's jealous of our son because he has dad's last name, so it really is a
pressing issue now. We kicked it around before, but never seriously, but I guess
it's serious now.
As far as POA, I wouldn't worry about it that much if they had the same last
name. I would just act like mom, like you guys do, but with the different last
names and them calling me by my first name, I feel like eventually I'll run into
a snag somewhere, know what I mean.
>
>
> Can a court in your area give you any more authority over your SKs than
> you husband can? (You don't need a court order for a POA where you are,
> do you?)
I don't know if I need a court order or not, that's what I need to find out. I'm
pretty sure a lawyer has to draw up the papers though. We don't even have copies
of the birth certificates and only got their SS #'s because I *had* to have it
for health insurance. She didn't want to give them...so, with our situation the
way it is and her wanting to balk over everything, I think I'd just feel better
with POA, so when she gets to raising cain over me taking them to the doctor(and
she will), I can say I have a legal right to do so.
Rose
>
>
Medtaz165
>visitation (days only, no overnights) three times a week but has taken
>advantage of this exactly 1.5 days since December of last year. It has been
>well over three months since she even phoned.
just curiouse is this considered abandonment?? have similar situation
janelaw
>
> BTW - this is totally off topic, but does anybody else get the urge to refer
> to their husband in public as "DH"? Pugg mentioned spending too much time
> on here and I'm starting to feel the same way!
Since I broke my leg and I can't do much else, I feel like I
spend all my waking time at the computer.
I think you and I may have a posting disorder, lil. ;-)
Cyberlimia. We seem to binge and purge, post like crazy for a
few days, then take a few days off. We really should start a
new news group called alt.support.posting-disorders.
MFreund
kcd wrote:
> really nice, encouraging post, mfreund. REALLY encouraging. i have an
> "evil biomom" situation which totally shapes the whole step thang.
>
> 14 and 6' 1"? i bet that boy can EAT.
He has brought new meaning to the word ... as do the girls :-) Milk lasts about a
day in this house between the kids and my sweet hubbie (who btw is 6' 4")!
Fortunately for me, the girls are still smaller than my 5' 8" frame and my neck
gets an equal work-out. Up to the boys, down for the girls :-)
>
>
> i was touched when you talked of your love for your sds. they are lucky girls.
>
> kcd
Today was back to school day. My youngest started kindergarden and my son started
high school. The oldest sister went into 2nd grade. It was delicious. We were
up at the crack of dawn with camera in tow. After a summer with all three of them
(thank God for grandma's pool and the beach!), I'm looking forward to the break.
Though the house is awfully quiet. Too quiet .....
MFreund
Medtaz165 wrote:
> >BM has
> >visitation (days only, no overnights) three times a week but has taken
> >advantage of this exactly 1.5 days since December of last year. It has been
> >well over three months since she even phoned.
>
> just curiouse is this considered abandonment?? have similar situation
Don't quote me on this, but If I'm not mistaken, a longer period of time has to
elapse before it would constitute abandonment legally. Emotionally, yes, but
there aren't any laws that govern the heart.
Thank goodness, all our kids have been just flourishing. At times, we just want
to cry tears of joy when we hear the peals of laughter coming from the girls
(they've been through some tough times). BM has gone up to eight months with no
communication whatsoever, then decides to phone This is really hard for us to
swallow since it does the girls no good. My very favorite is the time BM showed
up at church, after months of no interaction. That was extremely disruptive to
the girls, which BM can't seem to comprehend.
The hope we have is that as they are increasingly growing, both physically and
emotionally, they will be better equipped to handle her behavior, which is
erratic and irrational at best :-) All we can do is continue to love them and
protect them as best as we can.
Michael R. Martin
taken
>>advantage of this exactly 1.5 days since December of last year. It has
been
>>well over three months since she even phoned.
>just curiouse is this considered abandonment??
According to the state of Missouri, no. My SS bio-mom was gone for THREE
YEARS with no communications whatsoever and we were told that when she
decided to come back into his life there was nothing we could do. So,
either I called the wrong attorney or State law stinks.
Cindy
-
Mike Martin
Dean Barker
>
> Surely there are some bio-moms here who can explain to me why they act
> like they do. I hate to generalize, but, damn it seems to be true.
Yes you are generalizing and it is a big mistake in this case. Don't
confuse your particular situation with the world. This is an issue
that really strikes a nerve with me and has forced me to turn my
back on this newsgroup for many months at a time. There are times
when I have felt that step-dads (remember we're married to bio-moms)
were not welcome here.
> A little background: My DH and I have had exactly 1/2 half physical
> custody of my step-daughter since she was 6 months old.
My first response was this:
"6 months? You and your husband were married or living together when
the girl was 6 months? And you wonder why the mom is nasty or
vindictive when her husband leaves her with a baby and has a new
honey within 6 months of giving birth? I think her reaction would
be expected."
In a later post I read that your husband and bio-mom were never
married and she called him from across the country to tell him
that she was pregnant....so I calmed down a little bit.
I'd just like to say though, that your husband chose her and made
a HUGE mistake with her. They both knew the risks they were taking
and they did it anyway. So, the bottom line is, you are stuck with
her. I wish you luck.
BUT, please, please do not generalize and group all bio-moms together.
Some moms worked their tails off to help support the family and
live up to the vows they gave when they were married, only to be
shocked with news that husband had been fooling around and was now
moving out to be with the new honey, and oh by the way he wants to take
the kids out of their home for 50% of the time and have the kids
call the new honey "mom". And now bio-mom has rebounded, got back on
her feet remarried to a wonderful man and does her best to let the
children have a normal life with normal activities while at the same
time shipping them off to dad's house 50% of the time. It's not
all black and white.
-Dean
carol koponen
lilblakdog
Dean Barker wrote in message <35F56C...@cray.com>...
>BUT, please, please do not generalize and group all bio-moms together.
>Some moms worked their tails off to help support the family and
>live up to the vows they gave when they were married, only to be
>shocked with news that husband had been fooling around and was now
>moving out to be with the new honey, and oh by the way he wants to take
>the kids out of their home for 50% of the time and have the kids
>call the new honey "mom". And now bio-mom has rebounded, got back on
>her feet remarried to a wonderful man and does her best to let the
>children have a normal life with normal activities while at the same
>time shipping them off to dad's house 50% of the time. It's not
>all black and white.
Dean and I have discussed this before and I agree with him. That's not to
say that your case *isn't* black and white, Renee, just that even I (as the
"other woman") cringe when I see people posting about *all* biomoms being
evil.
I feed into this pretty well, I think. I have lots of rants about my
stepson's mother and this is a great place to do it, but I would never call
her or even think of her as evil. She has her shortcomings, yes, but she
loves her son dearly and she's been doing the very best that she can. Who
am I to fault her devotion to her son? It's maybe not how I would do
things, or how DH and I would like to see him raised, but we've left him to
her (not that we had a choice, but you know what I mean) and we both know
that she's working at 100% of what she's capable of.
My case is pretty similar to Renee's. But Dean's right--DH's ex had certain
expectations. DH was aware that she was trying to get pregnant. He went
into this with his eyes open. We're very lucky in that one bad relationship
became two fairly good ones; and that all parties involved realize that the
only mature way to handle the situation is to remain friendly and keep a
positive line of communication open. Not everyone is that lucky, but not
everyone *isn't* either and it's probably not a good idea to poison the
minds of steps.
lil
lilblakdog
Rose wrote in message <35F52A7C...@usa.net>...
>Lisa wrote:
>
>> I hope you won't be in court for anything that's not really important.
>> Does it matter what your kids' names are? Why change them? It makes
>> sense to me that they have their mom's name, since their mom & dad
>> aren't married. And if you're determined to call them something else
>> there's nothing to stop you.
>
>Well, actually, oldest SS has requested it. Biomom has remarried and now
they
>have no-one's name so to speak. The youngest wrote it on a some paper at
home one
>day and got grounded for a *week*. This is what we deal with here. Oldest
SS has
>told me he's jealous of our son because he has dad's last name, so it
really is a
>pressing issue now. We kicked it around before, but never seriously, but I
guess
>it's serious now.
Sigh...I wish my stepson would request it!
This is another silly little problem I have. DH swears that it doesn't
bother him (although I know for a fact he's lying!) and I know that it
shouldn't bother me, but it does.
My stepson's last name was orignally (mother's name)-(father's name).
However, then biomom got married and it was changed to (stepfather's
name)-(father's name), and he's registered at school under just his
stepfather's name. We try to ignore it and refer to him as (father's name)
on stuff here, but during the year he forgets what his real name is. I want
him to know his heritage...I guess names are kind of important to me. It's
upsetting when we buy him a postcard to send home and he just signs it with
stepdad's last name. Or when we go out as the (father's name) family and my
stepson has a backpack that has his stepfather's name on it.
Stupid, I know, but I wish that they'd be strong enough to insist that his
whole name be used, rather than going with the "Well, it makes it easier for
the school" excuse.
lil
lilblakdog
carol koponen wrote in message
<28386-35...@newsd-112.bryant.webtv.net>...
However, a gal I know is a SD. It is written in thecustody papers that
she is NOT allowed to sign for anything or have access to info (med,
schoo...).
Ouch!!! I would never have married DH if this was going to be the case! If
I'm going to be responsible for 50% of his child support (assuming that
everything is half mine, half DH's) and 50% of his
entertainment/guidance/upbringing during visitation and 50% *at least*
(generally 100%) of the cleanup after it, then I'm going to have access to
information that affects his life!
lil
lilblakdog
janelaw wrote in message <35F5354E...@excite.com>...
>I think you and I may have a posting disorder, lil. ;-)
>Cyberlimia. We seem to binge and purge, post like crazy for a
>few days, then take a few days off. We really should start a
>new news group called alt.support.posting-disorders.
LOL!
Cyberlimia, huh? Should I be pricing tooth caps?
lil
Renee
wrote:
>Yes you are generalizing and it is a big mistake in this case. Don't
>confuse your particular situation with the world.
I know generalizing is *always* a mistake ;) Really, tho', I'm sure
there are some bio-moms out there who are able to put their personal
feelings aside and the child first, where the child belongs.
Remember, grown ups can deal with hurt feelings, but a 3 year old
child can't be expected to deal with the intricacies of some of the
situations described in this newsgroup. A grown woman doesn't need to
look at her 3 year old and say "Your step-mother *stole* daddy from
me." or things like "Your daddy doesn't love you." It's disgusting.
In any event, I don't mean to generalize, but my particular experience
has been a nightmare.
>
>My first response was this:
>
>"6 months? You and your husband were married or living together when
>the girl was 6 months? And you wonder why the mom is nasty or
>vindictive when her husband leaves her with a baby and has a new
>honey within 6 months of giving birth? I think her reaction would
>be expected."
>
>In a later post I read that your husband and bio-mom were never
>married and she called him from across the country to tell him
>that she was pregnant....so I calmed down a little bit.
regardless of the circumstances of their particular breakup (or anyone
else's, really), there should come a time when the grown-ups can get
over it already. I mean years and years have already gone by...
enough is enough. I smiled and took her attitude for the first year,
because she kept saying that she "just needed time". Hah, there will
never be enough time for her to get over it.
>
>I'd just like to say though, that your husband chose her and made
>a HUGE mistake with her. They both knew the risks they were taking
>and they did it anyway. So, the bottom line is, you are stuck with
>her. I wish you luck.
Thank you for the wishes, I sure could use them ;) Sure, I would have
rather he had picked someone a little more mature, reasonable, sane or
whatever to have a child with, but ya know, the bottom line is, I love
my step-daughter just the way she is, and she wouldn't be who she is
if someone else had been her mother.
I have read a few posts on this and other groups from bio-moms,
usually situations where the bio-dad has little involvement, where
they post that they would love for the child to have a nurturing
fulfilling relationship with bio-dad, and get a few days off for
themselves in the bargain. I guess I just wish I was lucky enough to
have gotten one of those. Instead I got the bottom of the barrel.
Renee
nancy g.
> Renee wrote:
>> Surely there are some bio-moms here who can explain to me why they act
>> like they do. I hate to generalize, but, damn it seems to be true.
> Yes you are generalizing and it is a big mistake in this case. Don't
> confuse your particular situation with the world.
Thanks, Dean. I didn't reply to this post, but I wasn't real happy
when I read it, and I'm glad someone said something.
(snip)
> BUT, please, please do not generalize and group all bio-moms together.
(and snip again)
> Some moms worked their tails off to help support the family and
> live up to the vows they gave when they were married, only to be
> shocked with news that husband had been fooling around and was now
> moving out to be with the new honey, and oh by the way he wants to take
> the kids out of their home for 50% of the time and have the kids
> call the new honey "mom". And now bio-mom has rebounded, got back on
> her feet remarried to a wonderful man and does her best to let the
> children have a normal life with normal activities while at the same
> time shipping them off to dad's house 50% of the time.
And some of us here are wearing a multitude of hats, as we are *both*
bio-mom *and* step-mom. I'm sure I'm not the only one in this situation --
I had bio kids with my first husband, and now I have (well, will have)
step kids with my (soon-to-be) second (and FINAL!!) husband ... so does
that make me the Good Guy or the Bad Guy? (grin)
> It's not all black and white.
Sometimes I don't think ANY of it is any color but a big messy blob
of mixed-up muddy grey. Sigh.
nancy g
home again, pouting, 500 miles away from my S.O.
Vicki Robinson
>
>And some of us here are wearing a multitude of hats, as we are *both*
>bio-mom *and* step-mom. I'm sure I'm not the only one in this situation --
>I had bio kids with my first husband, and now I have (well, will have)
>step kids with my (soon-to-be) second (and FINAL!!) husband ... so does
>that make me the Good Guy or the Bad Guy? (grin)
>
I agree. I usually let the rants go, but I *do* wish that ranters would rant
about their own situation, and not paint a whole group of people with the
same brush. I was a second wife the first time, and now am a second wife
again; I was a stepmom before I was a biomom, and my kids giggle about the
fact that they have three half-sibs (37, 34 and 28) and two step-sisters (9
and 11)! I was a NCP stepmom, and now I am a NCP stepmom and a CP biomom. I
deal with my ex's SO and my husband's ex, and *her* SO. And we all do
remarkably well, amazingly enough.
I think everyone is related to everyone else sooner or later.
Vicki (And who is going to be the first to bring up six degrees of
separation?)
--
Vicki Robinson
<blink><a href="http://www.rit.edu/~vjrnts/binky.html">BINKY!</a></blink>
Visit my home page at <a href="http://www.rit.edu/~vjrnts"> Vicki's Home Page
</a> and sign my guest book. Millions have!
Dean Barker
> >confuse your particular situation with the world.
>
> there are some bio-moms out there who are able to put their personal
> feelings aside and the child first, where the child belongs.
> Remember, grown ups can deal with hurt feelings, but a 3 year old
> child can't be expected to deal with the intricacies of some of the
> situations described in this newsgroup. A grown woman doesn't need to
> look at her 3 year old and say "Your step-mother *stole* daddy from
> me." or things like "Your daddy doesn't love you." It's disgusting.
> In any event, I don't mean to generalize, but my particular experience
> has been a nightmare.
Oh come on! *Some* bio-moms put the needs of the child first? I think
you underestimate human-kind, I confidently state that *most* mothers
put the needs of their children ahead of their own feelings. It's
just that the few who don't get the most attention. You are right
about the comments though, no matter how hurt the woman is she should
not say those things to the child, no matter what the age. My SS
is 12, he still has not heard that his father was cheating on his
mother, he still has not figured out that his father moved out and
in with another woman (who is now his step-mom), he was only 6 at
the time. The questions he asks get more and more detailed all the
time, but the only way he will find out the "dirt" on his dad is
if he asks point blank "did dad cheat on you?", until then he will
not know.
>
> >
> >My first response was this:
> >
> >"6 months? You and your husband were married or living together when
> >the girl was 6 months? And you wonder why the mom is nasty or
> >vindictive when her husband leaves her with a baby and has a new
> >honey within 6 months of giving birth? I think her reaction would
> >be expected."
> >
> >In a later post I read that your husband and bio-mom were never
> >married and she called him from across the country to tell him
> >that she was pregnant....so I calmed down a little bit.
>
> regardless of the circumstances of their particular breakup (or anyone
> else's, really), there should come a time when the grown-ups can get
> over it already. I mean years and years have already gone by...
> enough is enough. I smiled and took her attitude for the first year,
> because she kept saying that she "just needed time". Hah, there will
> never be enough time for her to get over it.
I don't think that she has to get over it, it may bother her for
the rest of her life, but she should be mature enough to accept it
and be polite. If she is not doing that I guess the best that you can
do is accept her and be polite. It's difficult, I know, we are going
through it too. It is funny though, when somebody is trying to be
vindictive and they can't control themselves and yell and do mean
things, be polite to them, it drives them absoulutely crazy! They
hate it, they want you to stoop down to their level and not doing
it wins every time. Smile and be polite.
>
> >
> >I'd just like to say though, that your husband chose her and made
> >a HUGE mistake with her. They both knew the risks they were taking
> >and they did it anyway. So, the bottom line is, you are stuck with
> >her. I wish you luck.
>
> Thank you for the wishes, I sure could use them ;) Sure, I would have
> rather he had picked someone a little more mature, reasonable, sane or
> whatever to have a child with, but ya know, the bottom line is, I love
> my step-daughter just the way she is, and she wouldn't be who she is
> if someone else had been her mother.
You're welcome, and I mean it sincerely. If she had been more mature
he probably would have married her, which would have done you no good!
A person is only the sum of their past experiences, and without the
experiences and lessons he learned from his relationship with her he
wouldn't be the same man he is today, which is the man you love!
>
> I have read a few posts on this and other groups from bio-moms,
> usually situations where the bio-dad has little involvement, where
> they post that they would love for the child to have a nurturing
> fulfilling relationship with bio-dad, and get a few days off for
> themselves in the bargain. I guess I just wish I was lucky enough to
> have gotten one of those. Instead I got the bottom of the barrel.
Hang in there, you'll get through this. Things can only get better,
right!!
-Dean
Wakanyeja Makah
<snipped large part of dissertation>
> does her best to let the
>children have a normal life with normal activities while at the same
>time shipping them off to dad's house 50% of the time. It's not
>all black and white.
No Dean..it isn't all black and white...but your final sentence including
the wording "shipping them off " once again validates what I have been
saying...CP tend to view the children as though they are "personal
property" and "things" instead of living breathing children who need both
of their parents equally. As angry as I get with *our* ex ( my SS bio-mom)
I do understand that he needs her, just as he needs his father.
And Dean...I am a bio-mom too and my husband is a wonderful stepfather to
our (my) two sons. Their father abandoned them completely and by choice
(at ages 3 and 5). In much the same scenerio that you described before (so
I do feel that I can speak with some authority about the subject. No
amount of $$$$ he could ever produce would take the place of a father.
W. Makah
Rose
lilblakdog wrote:
>
>
> Sigh...I wish my stepson would request it!
>
> This is another silly little problem I have. DH swears that it doesn't
> bother him (although I know for a fact he's lying!) and I know that it
> shouldn't bother me, but it does.
It bothers them more than they'll admit.
>
>
> My stepson's last name was orignally (mother's name)-(father's name).
> However, then biomom got married and it was changed to (stepfather's
> name)-(father's name), and he's registered at school under just his
> stepfather's name. We try to ignore it and refer to him as (father's name)
> on stuff here, but during the year he forgets what his real name is. I want
> him to know his heritage...I guess names are kind of important to me. It's
> upsetting when we buy him a postcard to send home and he just signs it with
> stepdad's last name. Or when we go out as the (father's name) family and my
> stepson has a backpack that has his stepfather's name on it.
>
> Stupid, I know, but I wish that they'd be strong enough to insist that his
> whole name be used, rather than going with the "Well, it makes it easier for
> the school" excuse.
>
> lil
For school? If your SS's legal last name has both names in it, then shouldn't he
be using that name at school? If he got used to using it at school, then he'd
use it all the time, yes? And did she legally change it to the step-dads name?
Like on the birth certificate and all? Wouldn't she need your husband's
permission? This stuff is *so* confusing....
Rose
lilblakdog
Rose wrote in message <35F5C4F3...@usa.net>...
>For school? If your SS's legal last name has both names in it, then
shouldn't he
>be using that name at school? If he got used to using it at school, then
he'd
>use it all the time, yes?
This is my thinking. And because he doesn't use his full name at school, he
needs to be reminded that his last name isn't simply that of his stepfather.
>And did she legally change it to the step-dads name?
>Like on the birth certificate and all? Wouldn't she need your husband's
>permission?
In Canada (or at least BC) it doesn't get changed on his birth certificate.
He gets a name change certificate to go *with* the original birth
certificate.
At any rate, I don't believe that she asked for or needed DH's permission.
As far as I know (and it may just be because they weren't married) she is
able to name him anything she wants. DH has very little in the way of
rights.
I could be wrong on this--she could have gotten DH's permission--but I don't
think so. I'm pretty sure DH would have given his permission anyway...the
idea was to use both of their last names and when hers changed it would seem
justifiable to DH that his son's would change also. Of course, if he did,
he probably was still thinking that he would be raised with the hypenated
name...not just leaving it there as an honorary thing.
lil
Wakanyeja Makah
>>Surely there are some bio-moms here who can explain to me why they act
>>like they do. I hate to generalize, but, damn it seems to be true.
It certainly fits the profile in our house-hold as well. We also contend
with the Bio-mom from hell.
>>It seems like once they separate from the father of their children,
>>they suddenly become nasty, vindictive, and remarkably inconsiderate
>>of their children.
All of the above and more. Since there is a child involved it is suddenly
something that can be used for leverage. Especially when the bio-mom
realizes how much the father (and stepmom) love the child.
>>And how funny is it how they interpret court orders? Everything is so
>>slanted towards them, yet still they expect even more. I am not
>>talking about child support money here, I am talking about extra time,
>>or whatever.
Ours bitched about 5.5 hours of what she termed "unscheduled visitation"
when we were in Florida meeting his teachers and doctor and coach. This
year she held out on Christmas dates after we asked for ONE extra day (to
prevent him from flying back the day after the holiday and dealing with the
holiday traffic in the airport). Fortunately our attorney got a written
agreement for the middle of the week of Christmas until the middle of the
next week (exactly one week and I hope she chokes on it) Her primary
concern was that we were trying to get ONE EXTRA DAY of visitation that
wasn't court ordered. To my 9 y/o SS bio-mom he is little more than a
commodity, a source of income, and personal property. *sigh*
>>She always used to say "You'll never win, I am the MOTHER." I always
>>thought, "This is the 90's... good luck with that argument...."
Unfortunately...we have also seen the enormous amount of gender-bias which
exists in these '90's courts. That is why we belong to Fathers Rights
groups and lobby and write everyone but Santa Claus in an attempt to expose
the bullshit that passes for justice in family court.
>>Little did I know, she was right. The legal system in this state is
>>pathetic, and I'm sure it is indicative of the system in most states.
>>(tho' it's not what I was taught in law school)
You are a lawyer???? Well..if you have ever wanted to pursue a noble cause
(in life) you have certainly found one. The situation that exists is
intolerable. Perhaps you, as a lawyer, can help make a difference.
>>A little background: My DH and I have had exactly 1/2 half physical
>>custody of my step-daughter since she was 6 months old. The only
>>counselor that she has been to arrived at the conclusion that instead
>>of her mother or her father, her strongest and closest bond is with
>>me. I love that little girl like my own (she is now 3), and when I
>>ask to keep her an extra hour so she can go see Thomas the Tank
>>Engine, Biomom says No.... yet, she expects both myself and DH to bend
>>over backwards to accomodate her schedule.
Very thoughtful mother. Keeps her child's best interest close at hand
(er...wallet) doesn't she?
>>Sorry for ranting, just a little bitter tonight.... why is it that the
>>children always have to pay the price for the hurt feelings that the
>>grown-ups have. Grown-ups are supposed to be able to deal with those
>>issues.... 3 year old girls shouldn't have to.
And neither should 9 y/o boys or any child anywhere. Until the world is
aware of what NCP go through and the absolute lack of respect these
bio-parents who treat their child as though they are some grand prize to be
won and doled out in pathetically small bits...until there is the
acknowledgement that THIS is not improving our children's lot in life.
That this is NOT in their BEST INTEREST...well...it is going to remain the
status quo. Cui bono?
W. Makah
>>
>>Renee
>
janelaw
>
> lilblakdog wrote:
>
> > My stepson's last name was orignally (mother's name)-(father's name).
> > However, then biomom got married and it was changed to (stepfather's
> > name)-(father's name), and he's registered at school under just his
> > stepfather's name. We try to ignore it and refer to him as (father's name)
> > on stuff here, but during the year he forgets what his real name is. I want
> > him to know his heritage...I guess names are kind of important to me. It's
> > upsetting when we buy him a postcard to send home and he just signs it with
> > stepdad's last name. Or when we go out as the (father's name) family and my
> > stepson has a backpack that has his stepfather's name on it.
> >
> > Stupid, I know, but I wish that they'd be strong enough to insist that his
> > whole name be used, rather than going with the "Well, it makes it easier for
> > the school" excuse.
> >
> > lil
>
> be using that name at school? If he got used to using it at school, then he'd
> Like on the birth certificate and all? Wouldn't she need your husband's
>
> Rose
I don't think schools really care. If no one complains, how are
they supposed to know whether or not the parents were married,
what the divorce and custody decrees say, etc.? I'm certain
that if I had asked, my daughter's school would have changed her
names in their records when I got remarried.
From what I see, most people change names informally. That's
pretty much what people do when they get married. They just
start using a different name if they like. There isn't a court
order or anything. Of course, people do get court ordered name
changes all the time.
Rose
>
> >
> > For school? If your SS's legal last name has both names in it, then shouldn't he
> > be using that name at school? If he got used to using it at school, then he'd
> > use it all the time, yes? And did she legally change it to the step-dads name?
> > Like on the birth certificate and all? Wouldn't she need your husband's
> > permission? This stuff is *so* confusing....
> >
> > Rose
>
> I don't think schools really care. If no one complains, how are
> they supposed to know whether or not the parents were married,
> what the divorce and custody decrees say, etc.? I'm certain
> that if I had asked, my daughter's school would have changed her
> names in their records when I got remarried.
>
> From what I see, most people change names informally. That's
> pretty much what people do when they get married. They just
> start using a different name if they like. There isn't a court
> order or anything. Of course, people do get court ordered name
> changes all the time.
I always thought you had to show proof. I remember when I got married. In order to
change my name on my SS card I had to bring my drivers license and my marriage license
with me, but on the other hand, now that I think about it, when I registered my son in
school last year, I didn't have to show his birth certificate, so I guess I could've
registered him under anything I wanted. What's even more ridiculous is the fact that
when I signed him up for little league t-ball, I *did* have to bring his birth
certificate.
So, this brings up a whole new issue for me. When we get the boys' names changed, she
can still register them in school with her maiden name, if she wanted to. Well, I
guess we'll cross that bridge when we come to it. It'll be after Christmas before we
can do anything anyway. The cheapest lawyer said we start at $400 and go up if we have
to go to court, plus pay the fees to get the birth certificates changed, but I already
forsee another struggle....only this time I have a feeling it will be between oldest
SS and biomom....
Rose
Sian Lee Reid
"lilblakdog" <lilbl...@my-dejanews.com> wrote:
> In Canada (or at least BC) it doesn't get changed on his birth certificate.
> He gets a name change certificate to go *with* the original birth
> certificate.
That would be a BC thing, I think. Or maybe things are handled
differently with minors. I changed my name, in Ontario, as an adult. I
was NOT changing it because of marriage, I was changing my maiden name.
They issued me a new birth certificate.
>
> At any rate, I don't believe that she asked for or needed DH's permission.
> As far as I know (and it may just be because they weren't married) she is
> able to name him anything she wants. DH has very little in the way of
> rights.
Name usage in Canada is a funny thing. You can USE any name you like, you
just can't conduct legal transactions under a name that is not legally
yours. For instance, if your stepson needed a passport, the name on the
passport would have to be his full legal name. If he wanted to open a
bank account, or get a social insurance number, the name on his ID would
have to match the name they were issuing. Schools though? They pretty
much go by whatever the child's registering parent says their name is...
>
s.
nancy g.
> What's even more ridiculous is the fact that
> when I signed him up for little league t-ball,
> I *did* have to bring his birth certificate.
You'll find that happening over and over again, for almost
any kind of organized sports activity.
There's legitimate reasons for it, though. Most sports teams
are made up according to the age of the players, and when you
get to the older age groups where the kids (and their parents!)
take the sports way too seriously, they have to check the birth
certificates to make sure someone's not, for example, getting
a 16-year-old kid to play on a team that's supposed to be made up
of only 13- and 14-year-olds.
> Well, I guess we'll cross that bridge when we come to it.
> It'll be after Christmas before we can do anything anyway.
> The cheapest lawyer said we start at $400 and go up if we have
> to go to court, plus pay the fees to get the birth certificates
> changed
Since you're talking to lawyers about this already, you obviously know
what the procedure is in your state, but others reading this thread
should know that the same may not be true for them ... changing names
is an area where the law varies widely from one state to another, and
there are some states where it doesn't require any court proceedings
at all.
Good luck to you!
nancy g.
Pat Winstanley
>So, this brings up a whole new issue for me. When we get the boys' names
>changed, she
>guess we'll cross that bridge when we come to it. It'll be after Christmas
>before we
>can do anything anyway. The cheapest lawyer said we start at $400 and go up if
>we have
>already
>forsee another struggle....only this time I have a feeling it will be between
>oldest
>SS and biomom....
I've lost track a bit here, but why shouldn't the children's surnames be
the same as the mother's maiden surname? Why not that? Why should the
children's surnames be the father's birth surname? The children are the
children of BOTH parents!
--
Pat Winstanley
lilblakdog
Sian Lee Reid wrote in message ...
>That would be a BC thing, I think. Or maybe things are handled
>differently with minors. I changed my name, in Ontario, as an adult. I
>was NOT changing it because of marriage, I was changing my maiden name.
>They issued me a new birth certificate.
Actually, I checked with DH this morning, since I saw that this thread was
getting kind of long, and verified the info I posted yesterday. He says
that he did, in fact, give his permission. He said that it could have been
done without him, but biomom would have to prove that she tried every legal
means possible to find and contact him.
Each person *listed on the birth certificate* has to give their permission.
If she hadn't listed him, or listed him as "unknown", of course, things
would be different.
He does not, however, have to give them permission to actually *call* him
whatever they want (for school or sports purposes, etc).
And I was right about the name change certificate. Here in BC that's all
you get.
>Name usage in Canada is a funny thing. You can USE any name you like, you
>just can't conduct legal transactions under a name that is not legally
>yours.
When I got married, I was informed that my legal name was whatever the bank
considered me. Like the bank is an agent for the world, kind of thing.
When I got married--if I wanted to take my husband's name--I had to take my
birth certificate and marriage certificate to the bank. That's when I chose
whether my name would be (DH's name) or (my name)-(DH's name), etc. They
transfer my account into my new, chosen name. Then I can change all my
other identification--Social Insurance Number, BCID, BC Medical, etc.
That, however, does not change my legal name. I can have a passport issued
in my husband's name (since it lists your maiden name anyway) and I can sign
all contract with just my first and married names, but any time I want to go
back to my maiden name I just snap my fingers and it's my name again!
I discovered this because I wanted to move my maiden name to a second middle
name when I got married. They told me that wasn't necessary because it
would actually make my legal name (first name) (second name) (maiden name)
(maiden name), which was just silly!
How's that for the stupidest thing you've ever heard???
lil
Dean Barker
>
> On Tue, 08 Sep 1998 12:42:23 -0500, Dean Barker <de...@cray.com> wrote:
>
> <snipped large part of dissertation>
>
> > does her best to let the
> >children have a normal life with normal activities while at the same
> >time shipping them off to dad's house 50% of the time. It's not
> >all black and white.
>
> No Dean..it isn't all black and white...but your final sentence including
> the wording "shipping them off " once again validates what I have been
> saying...CP tend to view the children as though they are "personal
> property" and "things" instead of living breathing children who need both
> of their parents equally.
You snipped off the beginning of the situation I was describing and
then left my words out of context. In the situation I described
"shipping them off" fit into context. I was not describing our
situation exactly, I was demonstrating the differences in situations.
> As angry as I get with *our* ex ( my SS bio-mom)
> I do understand that he needs her, just as he needs his father.
>
> And Dean...I am a bio-mom too and my husband is a wonderful stepfather to
> our (my) two sons. Their father abandoned them completely and by choice
> (at ages 3 and 5). In much the same scenerio that you described before (so
> I do feel that I can speak with some authority about the subject. No
> amount of $$$$ he could ever produce would take the place of a father.
How can you be a mother and then say other mothers tend to view their
children as personal property and things? I take it you don't count
yourself among those other mothers? Wouldn't you also be an EVIL BIOMOM?
-Dean
Vicki Robinson
>
>I've lost track a bit here, but why shouldn't the children's surnames be
>the same as the mother's maiden surname? Why not that? Why should the
>children's surnames be the father's birth surname? The children are the
>children of BOTH parents!
>
That they are, of course, but I actually have a reason that my kids are
called by my ex's name (their father's name, that is) and not my name. I
never did take his name, and have carried my birth name all my life. When
the kids were born, there were witnesses to the fact that those were
indubitably my kids. It seems to me that there were field trips from the
local high schools coming through my birthing room! (An exaggeration, but
you get the idea.) However, the entire world has only my word that my
then-husband is the father of my kids. I'm the only one who knows for sure,
and I chose to honor that knowledge by giving them his name. I still feel
that that is valid. They're my kids too, and there are people who can swear
that they saw my kids being born to me. They dont' have to carry my name.
But I gave them their father's name because that's the only "proof" that
exists.
Whatever he is or isn't to me now, he is and always will be their dad.
Vicki
Jeanette Cameron
Dean Barker wrote:
Did I miss something here? Please reply if I did.
True not every biological mom or biological parent is evil, cruel, vindictive,
etc., but based on a lot of posts to this newsgroup, some biological mothers or
biological parents are. Everyone is not perfect, yet I don't think that should
be an excuse to intentionally treat someone bad or say bad things to or about
someome to cause hurt, harm, or conflict to that person. If 1 biological parent
is hurt or angry with the other biological parent, why can't that be between them
and not between the parent who is hurt or mad and the kids, the in-laws, the
stepparents...the world?
Not every situation posted applies to everyone that reads about that situation.
If a situation doesn't apply to me, I am not going to assume that person is lying
or say that situation doesn't exist.
It would be nice if all biological parents and stepparents could get along. The
truth is that we can't all get along (regardless of it being the stepparent not
wanting to get along with the biological parent or the biological parent not
wanting to get along with the stepparent).
I strongly feel that if both biological parents want to be involved in their
kids' life, then they should (assuming that the kids want to be involved with
both parents). If the parents can't get along, they should be able to get along
long enough to try to jointly raise their kids to the best of their ability.
VanEx
>
> Rose wrote:
>
> > What's even more ridiculous is the fact that
> > when I signed him up for little league t-ball,
> > I *did* have to bring his birth certificate.
>
> You'll find that happening over and over again, for almost
> any kind of organized sports activity.
>
> There's legitimate reasons for it, though. Most sports teams
> are made up according to the age of the players, and when you
> get to the older age groups where the kids (and their parents!)
> take the sports way too seriously, they have to check the birth
> certificates to make sure someone's not, for example, getting
> a 16-year-old kid to play on a team that's supposed to be made up
> of only 13- and 14-year-olds.
>
>
My fiance's ex did this. His son is 4 and she had him playing on a
t-ball team with 5 and 6 year olds (she has him in sports 12 months
non-stop). My fiance thought he looked a little small for the team.
She had signed him up without consulting his father (nothing new).
After doing some research - he found out that the age requirement was
5. He asked to see the player application and sure enough, she had lied
about his age. He was pissed for 2 reason - #1 his son was too small
and too young to be playing ball (dangerous). #2 He only got to see his
son for 2.5 hours one day a week and he had t-ball practice on that
day. He doesn't mind his son playing sports (though we both agree she's
pushing him too hard), but what little time he has with his son is very
precious. He brought this issue up to the township supervisor and in
court and they eventually ended up making my fiance sign a permission
slip for his son to play ball even though he didn't meet the age
requirement. I think the judge made him do it just to shut his ex wife
up. Sad! This woman is obsessed with her son and he's nothing but a
trophy for her. The more sports he plays, the more beauty pagents he's
in, the better he's dressed, the more he dislikes his father - the
happier she is.
I guess I'm trying to say that I think it's a good idea to require birth
certificates.
VanEx
>
> In article <35F66314...@usa.net>, Rose <Rose...@usa.net> writes
> >So, this brings up a whole new issue for me. When we get the boys' names
> >changed, she
> >can still register them in school with her maiden name, if she wanted to. Well,
> >I
> >guess we'll cross that bridge when we come to it. It'll be after Christmas
> >before we
> >can do anything anyway. The cheapest lawyer said we start at $400 and go up if
> >we have
> >to go to court, plus pay the fees to get the birth certificates changed, but I
> >already
> >forsee another struggle....only this time I have a feeling it will be between
> >oldest
> >SS and biomom....
>
> the same as the mother's maiden surname? Why not that? Why should the
> children's surnames be the father's birth surname? The children are the
> children of BOTH parents!
>
> Pat Winstanley
If the mother took the father's name when she married him, why wouldn't
the kids? Or are we talking about a mother who kept her maiden surname
when she married? I don't think that a mother should change her kids'
last name after a divorce just because she did. The mother and father
got divorced, not the father and children. Am I making sense?
Rose
Pat Winstanley wrote:
>
>
> I've lost track a bit here, but why shouldn't the children's surnames be
> the same as the mother's maiden surname? Why not that? Why should the
> children's surnames be the father's birth surname? The children are the
> children of BOTH parents!
>
> --
> Pat Winstanley
Here, Pat, let me catch you up. My oldest SS has requested that his name be changed.
Biomom has remarried and I think he's feeling like he belongs no where. He's always
been a daddy's boy anyway and as he gets older these things get more and more
important to him.
To fill in some other questions, biomom and dad were not married, they were young
when she got pregnant(19 and 17) and they didn't marry. They were having trouble
about a year after oldest SS was born, split up, reconciled for a short time, split
again, but by then it was too late. she was pregnant again. So, that explains the
name thing. My husband is not even listed as the father on the birth certificates.
He signed papers for the court stating he was the dad.
Hope that clears up some of the things i've kind of left hanging in the air. He's
ashamed of the fact that they were never married, so doesn't like it to be brought
up very often.
Rose
Rose
> Since you're talking to lawyers about this already, you obviously know
> what the procedure is in your state, but others reading this thread
> should know that the same may not be true for them ... changing names
> is an area where the law varies widely from one state to another, and
> there are some states where it doesn't require any court proceedings
> at all.
>
> Good luck to you!
>
> nancy g.
This is true Nancy, and I apologize for not making that clear. Tennessee
is the state that this is occuring in.
Rose
Lisa
> >Well, actually, oldest SS has requested it. Biomom has remarried and now
> they
> >have no-one's name so to speak.
and Lil wrote:
Sigh...I wish my stepson would request it!
>
> This is another silly little problem I have. DH swears that it doesn't
> bother him (although I know for a fact he's lying!) and I know that it
> shouldn't bother me, but it does.
>
> My stepson's last name was orignally (mother's name)-(father's name).
> However, then biomom got married and it was changed to (stepfather's
> name)-(father's name), and he's registered at school under just his
> stepfather's name. We try to ignore it and refer to him as (father's name)
> on stuff here, but during the year he forgets what his real name is. I want
> him to know his heritage...I guess names are kind of important to me. It's
> upsetting when we buy him a postcard to send home and he just signs it with
> stepdad's last name. Or when we go out as the (father's name) family and my
> stepson has a backpack that has his stepfather's name on it.
<snip>
You know, I think I tend to forget how hard it is to be a kid raised by
a stepmother. My SS's firends, when they were little and tactless, used
to say, "How come you don't live with your mom?" And, given our policy
of taking the high road, we will NEVER volunteer the real reason. As
peg boucher murphy
>Renee wrote:
>> Surely there are some bio-moms here who can explain to me why they act
>> like they do. I hate to generalize, but, damn it seems to be true.
>
from one of the bio-moms here, thanks, dean.
>BUT, please, please do not generalize and group all bio-moms together.
>Some moms worked their tails off to help support the family and
>live up to the vows they gave when they were married,
and helped put said hubby though grad school+ and was primary caregiver
for kids (and hubby's aging grandmother) and put their own dreams and
plans on hold because *someone* had to put the kids first while said
hubby was not at home more than 12 hours a day,
>only to be
>shocked with news that husband had been fooling around and was now
>moving out to be with the new honey, and oh by the way he
only wants to pay minimal child support, is moving 1,000 miles away
and thinks that biomom should move, too, so he can see his kids without
having to pay for transportation and refuses to pay any alimony and
wants joint legal custody but no day to day bothers/responsibilities,
and doesn't see why any of this should be upsetting...
>And now bio-mom has rebounded, got back on
>her feet remarried to a wonderful man and does her best to let the
>children have a normal life with normal activities while at the same
>time shipping them off to dad's house 50% of the time. It's not
>all black and white.
<snort>
it could be much worse than that. he could spend several years not
bothering to see them much, then remarry, have fits of guilt, suddenly
want to be a part of their lives (well, mostly by criticizing bio-mom's
parenting to kids, new wife, and in long haranguing phone calls to biomom
usually ending by threatening to go to court for custody, leaving kids in the
middle and very upset).
peg
-yeah, yeah, i know. i'm supposed to be all over it by now. i'm over
*him*, just not over his continued ruckus in my life.
Pat Winstanley
Got it now (I think ;-)). Thanks for the picture!
The bit I'm not sure of is where the SS mainly lives - with Mum or with
Dad? And has his mum taken the new husband's name so that SS now doesn't
have the same everyday surname as either bio parent?
--
Pat Winstanley
Wakanyeja Makah
>> How can you be a mother and then say other mothers tend to view their
>> children as personal property and things? I take it you don't count
>> yourself among those other mothers? Wouldn't you also be an EVIL BIOMOM?
>>
>> -Dean
Dean,
I can say this because SOME (certainly not ALL) bio-moms do tend to
view their children as personal property and *things* instead of realizing
that they are human beings with minds of their own and feelings and lives
of their own to live. To answer your question- NO, I do not group myself
in with the Evil Bio-moms because even though my ex does not see his sons
at all (once again...his decision...certainly not mine) I respect all three
of our children (bio and step) and I do not USE them as fodder in some
vengeful war. THAT, Dean, is the difference.
W. Makah
Neuminosum
am glad to finally get in on this. My hasband has full custody of his kids,
with the mother having daytime-only visits with them every other weekend. DH
and I have been together since before the kids were removed form the mother's
home 5.5 years ago (the kids were 2, 3 & 5 at that time).
I have put off having a child or "my own" for many reasons, first of which is
that I already have my hands full. Having a child means that I will have FOUR
children. I am not yet ready for that. Second, I never want to explain to a
toddler why he or she isn't leaving with the sibblings to visit a woman who was
found to have sexually abused her children and is mentally disturbed. This is
hard enough to explain to the three who are already here.
As far as seeing the kids when and if the father passes away before the
children are 18, we have written a will designating legal custody to a
blood-line family member who may designate me to continue day-to-day parenting
with the children as I always have. Because of the history of abuse, disorders,
and ongoing court orders protecting the children from interference by their
mother, we don't see the court ever being in a position to recommend that the
children actually live with their BM.
I have never been questioned about seeking medical care for the kids. When I
first came to know the kids (and the committment was established), I attended
appointments with the husband and kid(s). We have remained with some
practitioners, and we have moved on to others. I still, however, ask that the
parents of friends who come to play leave me a note to seek medical care in the
event of an emergency (only when the kdis spend full days or we are going to go
something which may cause injury - ice skating, rollerblading, etc.).
We've been fortunate in the names department. The kids' names have never
changed, though their mother's have and continue to do so. The court papers all
read as Ms. X, aka, aka, aka..... I figure that as long as the police can
identify her, who cares!
Thanks to all of you who contribute to the board.
M
janelaw
>
>
> And some of us here are wearing a multitude of hats, as we are *both*
> bio-mom *and* step-mom. I'm sure I'm not the only one in this situation --
> I had bio kids with my first husband, and now I have (well, will have)
> step kids with my (soon-to-be) second (and FINAL!!) husband ... so does
> that make me the Good Guy or the Bad Guy? (grin)
>
>
mean. We are all the same: good, bad, and indifferent.
nancy g.
> nancy g. wrote:
... and sometimes simultaneously!
(grin)
Dean Barker
of the issue. I guess I took offense to the original poster
who said something like (paraphrasing from memory) "whats
wrong with all these biomoms" and you didn't. But yet we
agree and you treat your children with the same respect as
I treat my child and step-children and my wife treats our
children.
-Dean
Rose
>
>
> Got it now (I think ;-)). Thanks for the picture!
> The bit I'm not sure of is where the SS mainly lives - with Mum or with
> Dad? And has his mum taken the new husband's name so that SS now doesn't
> have the same everyday surname as either bio parent?
>
> --
> Pat Winstanley
Lives with Mom(100 miles away) and yes, biomom took her husbands new name...
Rose
Sharyn
name to use my Dad's I had to go to court. And my sister who wanted her son
to have his Dad's name couldn't because her divorce wasn't finalized from
her first husband. They had been seprated for almost 3 years when she got
pregnant with her son. So her son, legally on his birth certificate, is
listed by her ex husband's name with him listed as the father. His real
father is nowhere listed on his birth certificate (although he does pay cs,
they split up last fall).
Sharyn
>
>>
>>
>> Sigh...I wish my stepson would request it!
>>
>> This is another silly little problem I have. DH swears that it doesn't
>> bother him (although I know for a fact he's lying!) and I know that it
>> shouldn't bother me, but it does.
>
>
>>
>>
>> However, then biomom got married and it was changed to (stepfather's
>> name)-(father's name), and he's registered at school under just his
>> stepfather's name. We try to ignore it and refer to him as (father's
name)
>> on stuff here, but during the year he forgets what his real name is. I
want
>> him to know his heritage...I guess names are kind of important to me.
It's
>> upsetting when we buy him a postcard to send home and he just signs it
with
>> stepdad's last name. Or when we go out as the (father's name) family and
my
>> stepson has a backpack that has his stepfather's name on it.
>>
his
>> whole name be used, rather than going with the "Well, it makes it easier
for
>> the school" excuse.
>>
>> lil
>
lilblakdog
Sharyn wrote in message <6tf2p6$m9k$1...@news-2.news.gte.net>...
>Could she just change it without going to court? I know when I changed my
>name to use my Dad's I had to go to court. And my sister who wanted her son
>to have his Dad's name couldn't because her divorce wasn't finalized from
>her first husband.
In BC, you need the approval of both parents (well, persons listed on the
birth certificate) to change a minor's last name. Of course, if you proved
that you'd done everything possible to track down a missing parent, that's
taken into consideration and their permission--or lack thereof--is waived.
Once you have that (and the following applies to adults now, as well), you
have to file a petition, along with the required fee, to the Department of
Vital Statistics in Victoria. You have to run two ads in a recognized
newspaper, saying that you are planning to change your name from Jane May
Doe to Jane Ann Doe (why, I have no idea). Then they file your petition and
send you your name change certificate. That, along with your birth
certificate, is all the identification you need to then change your name on
your driver's license and SIN, etc.
lil