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Mad as hell

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Ju...@nospam.com

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Jul 30, 1998, 3:00:00 AM7/30/98
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I just opened our bank statement, and I'm mad as hell. First a little
background...

DH and I have a joint account, the ATM card can also be used as a visa
credit card. This works out well, and is real convenient. Six months
ago DH gave his 19 year old daughter the number so she could buy an
airline ticket allowing her to travel to a college admissions
interview. (She attends college in a different state from the one we
live in, which is why DH gave her the credit card number rather than
simply buying her the ticket.)

So far, so good, I had no problem with that. I have, however, had a
real problem with what came afterwards. She bought the ticket, but
never actually attended the alleged interview. We were annoyed, but
said, OK use the ticket next time you come visit. She agreed to this
plan.

April rolled around, and we got the bank statement for March. It
included the plane fare, plus $250 worth of clothes from JCrew. DH
called her to explain - she said she "thought he'd given her
permission to buy a new outfit for the interview". Against my better
judgement DH let this pass, but emphasized she was not to use the card
again.

In June we got another surprise from the bank statement. This time it
was $200 at JCrew, along with $50 from LL bean and $75 from the travel
agent who had issued the plane ticket she'd bought earlier. At this
point I'm furious, and suggested DH do something about his "dishonest,
distrustful, thieving liar of a daughter". OK that may have been a
little harsh, but, given the circumstances I felt I had the right to
be mad.

DH traveled out of state to spend the fathers day weekend with the 19
year old and her younger siblings (who are marvelous, by the way).
During this trip, he discovered that SD had used the ticket he'd
bought for the college interview to pay for a weekend away with her
boyfriend. He also discovered that she was on academic probation, as
her GPA had fallen below 2.0 for the whole semester. (She has had a
job for 3 months of the 2 years she's been in college, so too much
work wasn't the reason for her failure.) To me, this proves the whole
"admission interview", was a scam, to extort more money out of us. DH
isn't so sure, but, he was pissed and told her that if she abused his
credit card again, that was the last time he'd give her *anything*.

So, I opened the bank statement, and there it is: on June 29 she spent
$198 at JCrew. To me this is just about the last straw, we send her a
check every month to help with living expenses - yet the little #$%!!
feels she can steal from us with impunity. I called the bank, and
reported the card as "lost", so at least she won't be able to rip us
off in that manner again. I also had words with DH, he agreed that
the money she's spent can come out of the money he would have sent her
for August and September, ie, she's not getting a check for either of
those months. That's a good start, but, I'll believe it when I see
it.

There are a couple of issues here. One is I'm real concerned about
the path SD is taking. Aside from stealing with us, and being on the
verge of flunking out of college, she's a chronic liar and has also
had a couple of brushes with the law. The first issue is how do we,
assuming we actually can, get her back on the straight and narrow
path?

I don't think she actually sees anything especially wrong with her
behavior. Truthfully she's acting exactly like her mom - her mom has
burnt many bridges over the years - with us, with countless friends,
with colleagues, and even with family members, for exactly the same
kind of behavior. Another trait of her moms that she's copying is to
run away from her problems, or sweep them under the rug, rather than
dealing with them head on. I should also mention that SD is the one
whose closest to her mom, post-divorce she never lived with, or spent
much, time with us. Her younger siblings have both lived here at
various times (one is considering coming back for the next academic
year), and when not living here, have visited at least twice weekly.

The other issue is my feelings about oldest SD. We've had a fairly
superficial relationship anyway, we can have pleasant conversations,
and go out together, but it's never been any deeper than that. At
this point I'm pissed off by the lies, the dishonesty, the
manipulation, frankly I don't want to deal with her at all. I think,
what's the point? My experience is she's going to lie, anyway, then
scream and yell, or stalk off when confronted on it.

If you've read this far, thanks, if you have any ideas, even greater
thanks.

Kriggs125

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Jul 30, 1998, 3:00:00 AM7/30/98
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Taking the credit card away is a good idea. second, she needs a job, most
people work while going to school. third, if she wants to still go to school,
she can come home to live. and go to school. If your paying her tution, then
you have the say of what other "extra" expenditurs that is "awarded" to her

TYounger

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Jul 30, 1998, 3:00:00 AM7/30/98
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In article <35c3d019...@nntp.best.com>, Ju...@nospam.com says...

Wow, I guess some people need a reality check pretty badly.

I'm 19 years old as well. That's about where the similarities end. I
have a full-time job working in technical support, and if I ever want to
go to school, I'm going to have to do that as well as work, and pay my
own way, etc. I haven't bought myself any new clothes in about two
months, and when I did, it was 2 t-shirts from wal-mart. My jeans have
holes in them, not because I'm not careful, but from wear. I don't eat
out often. I don't have my hair or nails done professionally, in fact, I
don't even buy expensive shampoo. And I sure as hell haven't bought
anything from J. Crew or LL Bean. I never EVER stole anything from my
parents, I respect them too much for that. I never took advantage of
them. I borrowed money once since I've been on my own, and it was paid
back within a month, and I even offered interest. My SO has a 2-year old
son, who I am responsible for quite a bit on the weekends.

Now, some people have it a little easier than I do, and some have it much
much harder, but that is NO excuse for deviant behavior such as you have
explained. A lot of my friends are living more "typical" 19-year old
lives than I am, but that doesn't mean they do things like are stated
below. Most have full-time jobs, and/or go to school (most of my friends
it's an "and" with) and support their own "wants" (clothes that are not
necessary, etc) While a lot of the time the parents take care of the
"needs" at this age still. HOWEVER! I think if she has so much time and
money on her hands, (done so deviantly no doubt) perhaps before you even
*consider* giving her any more money for *anything* you ought to make her
propose a budget - including exact prices of everything she absolutely
*has* to have. Make her show you reports from college professors, weekly
specially-written ones even. If she can't keep straight, maybe you
shouldn't give her money at all...if she needs the things so badly she
certainly won't be opposed to you buying what she needs instead of giving
her the money for it.

Sorry about the long rant, and flame me if you must, but this kinda of
behavior is less than I expect from my SO's 2 year old. It completely
astounds me. And it scares me that people like your daughter are
considered rational enough to function as adults...

Again, sorry if I offended anyone, I'm prone to very strong opinions at
times :)

TYounger

Vicki Robinson

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Jul 30, 1998, 3:00:00 AM7/30/98
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In a previous article, bo...@mindspring.com (TYounger) said:

[Some wonderfully mature and responsible things; my kids should grow
up to be so adult at 19! But....]

>Make her show you reports from college professors, weekly
>specially-written ones even.

Erm. I *am* a college professor, and please please don't encourage
the parents of adults (and a 19 yo is an adult, even if she's
financially dependent on her parents) to require weekly progress
reports from professors. First of all, most of us have enough to do
without having to write notes that are more appropriate for 9 year
olds than 19 year olds; what if every parent of your 400-freshman
lecture section in Physics 106 wants weekly progress reports? Add to
that the privacy and confidentiality required of us by law, and you're
putting a prof in a bad position. I can inform the *student* if she's
in trouble, and I send every student in my classes a mid-quarter
evaluation, but I can't share them with the parents if the student is
over 18. The student, of course, can.

Sad to say, a 19 yo at college is not in the same boat as an
elementary or high school student, and the law doesn't care who's
paying. Parents don't have any right to that information once the
student is 18.

That doesn't mean that parents can't set their own requirements for
continued support, and indeed, I encourage it. The students in my
classes who work the hardest and do the best are generally the older
students with families and full-time jobs. They're in class *every*
day, they don't show up with hang-overs, they have their homework
done, their questions ready, and they trust me to know what I'm doing
in teaching them. The younger students often cut class, show up high
or drunk or hung-over, *never* do reading or homework (until the night
before the exam, and then they're outraged that I don't come into the
study center until midnight to work with them), and challenge my
teaching and selection of curricular materials at every turn.
("Exactly how am I going to use this particular piece of information
in my job, and, if I'm not going to directly apply it to my job, why
do I have to learn it?")

But this is my private rant. Never mind.

Vicki
--
Visit our wedding at http://www.rit.edu/~vjrnts/wedding.html and
sign our guest book! The alt.folklore.urban FAQ and archive can
be found at http://www.urbanlegends.com. Take a look, if you
have a week to spare.

TYounger

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Jul 30, 1998, 3:00:00 AM7/30/98
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[snip]
> Erm. I *am* a college professor, and please please don't encourage
> the parents of adults (and a 19 yo is an adult, even if she's
> financially dependent on her parents) to require weekly progress
> reports from professors. First of all, most of us have enough to do
> without having to write notes that are more appropriate for 9 year
> olds than 19 year olds;
[end snip]

Okay, as far as the legal part of the post, and the impractibility of it,
Vicki is absolutely right.

As far as it being more appropriate for a 9 year old than a 19 year old,
so is her behavior. Perhaps she should be treated accordingly.

Just a thought on the side, scary that someone so irresponsible to begin
with has the opportunity to do such adult things as voting, wherein an
irresponsible decision could effect us all. (And yes, a single vote can
bring down a democratic nation)

peg boucher murphy

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Jul 31, 1998, 3:00:00 AM7/31/98
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In article <199807302352...@ladder01.news.aol.com>,

Kriggs125 <krig...@aol.com> wrote:
>Taking the credit card away is a good idea.

absolutely! imho, the only credit/debit cards anyone should be able to
use are those that they are responsible enough to manage/support. which
means (for someone who's never had one before) that they have to get their
own.

>third, if she wants to still go to school,
>she can come home to live. and go to school. If your paying her tution, then
>you have the say of what other "extra" expenditurs that is "awarded" to her

this is an interesting idea/tack to take, even though it apparently means
that the sd in question would have to transfer to different school and move
in with family she has never lived with.
how would sm and bd like that? it might be more of a punishment for them
than for the irresponsible teen sd! and i suspect that crashing and burning
away from financial parental support will be a more powerful lesson than
doing so from the comfort of a parent's home, but i'm not sure.

if you are cutting money off anyway, this might be her last option or
something. what an interesting idea...

peg
-who isn't sure she'd want her kids to live with her as college students...


Dean Barker

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Jul 31, 1998, 3:00:00 AM7/31/98
to
Great post! You remind me of myself when I was 19, except I didn't
get involved with somebody with a kid (that came when I was 26 yo).
When I was in college I had to work to pay for everything and I got
real frustrated trying to compete with "children" who were getting
free rides from mommy and daddy. They had their tuition paid for, they
had their campus apartment paid for, and mom and dad would slip money
into their checking accounts every week for "spending money". They
acted like a bunch of spoiled brats and the irresponsibility flowed
over into vandalism and drunkenness. Good job, keep up the hard work,
it does pay off down the road.

-Dean

T CICCONE

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Jul 31, 1998, 3:00:00 AM7/31/98
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Ju...@nospam.com wrote in message <35c3d019...@nntp.best.com>...

>If you've read this far, thanks, if you have any ideas, even greater
>thanks.

Wow. I won't reiterate the great advice from the other posters regarding her
use of credit cards.
In terms of lying, your post really chilled me. We have the same problem
here with my stepson (who does live with us). Just as his biomother does, he
lies to cover almost anything and everything.
He has admitted to looking us straight in the eyes and lying, but only cops
to his lies when really pushed.
His older sister, who is 29 and married, is just as much in denial as he is,
and is seemingly incapable of confronting and dealing with reality, or
taking responsibility for her words and actions.
Unfortunately, there isn't a whole lot you can do -- your stepdaughter
doesn't live with you, never has, and only if she gets into therapy or
counselling of some sort can she begin to change her behavior. But she must
want to change second -- first, she has to admit to herself that she isn't
living an honest life!! That's the tough one.
My stepson's lying is, in my opinion, compulsive -- he has even admitted
that he learned to lie from his biomother -- she would help him come up with
stories to get out of difficult situations in school or with friends. As
time went on, he learned to lie to her, realizing that she was so
self-involved she wouldn't even check up on his stories.
I really feel for you in your situation -- as for me, I have given up on
stepson coming around to living a lifestyle of honesty and integrity. Maybe
I haven't given up forever, but I have definitely disengaged from trying to
get him to change. I have left this up to DH now, and I don't think he holds
out much hope either. We are both sad about the fact that it looks like my
stepson will have to learn life's lessons the stone-hard way. And your
stepdaughter probably will have to do the same. Sad, but at some point, as
stepparents, we must realize that we can only do so much to influence our st
epchildren in a positive way. If we really have had their best interests at
heart, and have really tried to be supportive, positive guides for them, and
they have in turn rejected our help --- well, it's time to step back and let
them learn the consequences of their choices. It doesn't mean I don't care
for him, or that I'd allow him to do anything that would be harmful, or that
I don't pay attention to him -- I just recognize his character and
personality traits for what they are. He rejects help, advice and guidance.
He's not a "bad" kid -- no drugs, smoking, drinking, nothing nefarious. He
just seems to be compelled to lie about the simplest little things, and is
more interested in spinning stories (which he always gets called out on),
than just taking what really IS the easy way and fessing up when he makes a
mistake. The rewards for honesty just don't seem to matter to him, and I
even wonder if he notices or cares that when he does the "right" thing, the
entire household is happier.....Take care....

Merrie

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Jul 31, 1998, 3:00:00 AM7/31/98
to
Stopping the credit card charging was a must. I hope your husband does
deduct he money owed from the next two months payments, or perhaps next
birthday, Christmas or whatever you can xerox the statements and write
"Happy Holiday! I know you got just what you wanted." Too petty?

I don't know what you can do to help her, but I think it rests more on
your husbands shoulders than yours (because of the lack of a
relationship there...)

However, I think a good place for the parents to start is to find out
what their teen thinks they (the parents) owe the teen.
Teens either have to be honest or sound ridiculas - sometimes it's both.

Best wishes - Merrie


I

janelaw

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Aug 1, 1998, 3:00:00 AM8/1/98
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Vicki Robinson wrote:
>
>
> .................The students in my

> classes who work the hardest and do the best are generally the older
> students with families and full-time jobs. They're in class *every*
> day, they don't show up with hang-overs, they have their homework
> done, their questions ready, and they trust me to know what I'm doing
> in teaching them. The younger students often cut class, show up high
> or drunk or hung-over, *never* do reading or homework (until the night
> before the exam, and then they're outraged that I don't come into the
> study center until midnight to work with them), and challenge my
> teaching and selection of curricular materials at every turn.
>

Julie,

Vicki's post made me think. Maybe you should not be subsidizing
SD's college at all right now. For some young people, college
is just high school without the parents. By the time they
realize that they are wasting their opportunity for an
education, they have a 2.0 GPA.

Maybe I just came from an unusually immature set, but a lot of
us acted as SD did at her age. Virtually all of us dropped out
sometime in the second or third year and went back to school
later in life. College was an entirely different experience
when we chose to go there because we wanted an education.

EveDalton

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Aug 3, 1998, 3:00:00 AM8/3/98
to
In response to 19 year old college student. You seem to be an exception to the
rule on young college students these days. This is not a matter of a budget,
this is about theft. A sd who keeps purchasing clothing with the credit card
number of her father is obviously showing no respect for him. She has shown
more than once, even knowing it is wrong, she can and will steal from her
family anyway. I say the parents report their card stolen, get a new number on
that account, and cut sd off financially for good. Just my opinion as a sm who
has a 15 year old sd who has years of the same behavior behind her(and more
likely ahead of her as well). This kind of behavior destroys families. Good
Luck, we all need it
Eve

MsJetson

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Aug 3, 1998, 3:00:00 AM8/3/98
to
>The students in my<BR>
>> classes who work the hardest and do the best are generally the older<BR>
>> students with families and full-time jobs. They're in class *every*<BR>
>> day, they don't show up with hang-overs, they have their homework<BR>
>> done, their questions ready, and they trust me to know what I'm doing<BR>
>> in teaching them. The younger students often cut class, show up high<BR>
>> or drunk or hung-over, *never* do reading or homework (until the night<BR>
>> before the exam, and then they're outraged that I don't come into the<BR>
>> study center until midnight to work with them), and challenge my<BR>
>> teaching and selection of curricular materials at every turn.<BR>
>> <BR>
><BR>
>Julie,<BR>
><BR>
>Vicki's post made me think. Maybe you should not be subsidizing<BR>
>SD's college at all right now. For some young people, college<BR>
>is just high school without the parents. By the time they<BR>
>realize that they are wasting their opportunity for an<BR>
>education, they have a 2.0 GPA.<BR>
><BR>
>Maybe I just came from an unusually immature set, but a lot of<BR>
>us acted as SD did at her age. Virtually all of us dropped out<BR>
>sometime in the second or third year and went back to school<BR>
>later in life. College was an entirely different experience<BR>
>when we chose to go there because we wanted an education.<BR>
></HTML>

***Great post! And completely accurate. If I were in the original posters
shoes, I would stop ALL support. Then when she has to find her own way, she
will start looking for jobs and realize she is not going to get paid enough to
support her JCrew habit, maybe THEN she will begin to realize the importance of
her college education.
I know at 19 the last thing I would've made a priority was college. I struggled
for a few years at low-paying jobs while living in efficiency apartments.
Hardly the fun I'd expected to have when I "grew up". Now at age 26 I can truly
appreciate an education. Even though I have 3 kids, 2 stepkids, and 2
businesses to run, I STILL go to college FT and have so far maintained a 4.0
:-). But it is only because I now WANT an education, and since I am paying for
it I am darn sure going to get my money's worth!
Why waste your money putting her through school when she obviously doesn't want
to be there, and is getting nothing out of it? Let her have a taste of the REAL
world.

lphillips

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Aug 3, 1998, 3:00:00 AM8/3/98
to
I think the key issue here is that she doesn't appreciate the amount of
money it takes to put someone through college. Kids come out of high school
so poorly prepared for the real world that college has become a necessity in
these times. Let her go out and find a job that will put her through
college. I know that my SS doesn't perform well enough in school to get into
a four year school and has sensibly opted for community college. Yet I have
made my stance that until we see some interest in doing well in school that
he will pay for his own education. Why should we spend our hard earned money
for him to make Cs and Ds in school? Plus, he wants to go to an out of state
community college and that will cost nearly as much per semester as a local
four year school.

Thank goodness I have the support of the SS grandparents on this issue.

LAP
MsJetson wrote in message
<199808031716...@ladder03.news.aol.com>...

PAMELA MCNEIL

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Aug 7, 1998, 3:00:00 AM8/7/98
to
Julie,

First of all, allow me to say that I am going to offer some advice because
you asked for it in your post. And, you should know that I am a very direct
person. So, here goes..

Wow. There is definitely a problem with your step-daughter and the credit
card, but I think there is a lot you can do about it. First of all, I'm
assuming that DH means divorced husband, and have responded accordingly. If
it means something else, then you will have to tailor my suggestions as you
see fit.

>DH and I have a joint account, the ATM card can also be used as a visa
>credit card. This works out well, and is real convenient. Six months
>ago DH gave his 19 year old daughter the number so she could buy an
>airline ticket allowing her to travel to a college admissions
>interview. (She attends college in a different state from the one we
>live in, which is why DH gave her the credit card number rather than
>simply buying her the ticket.) So far, so good, I had no problem with
that.

>She bought the ticket, but never actually attended the alleged interview.
We were >annoyed, but said, OK use the ticket next time you come visit. She
agreed to this
>plan.

First problem. There were absolutely no consequences to your
step-daughter's behavior. Unless there was clearly a good reason for her
not using the money for the airline ticket (for example: her interview got
rescheduled, canceled, or she decided the job wasn't for her) then it would
stand to reason that she should have, in my opinion, got a refund on the
ticket. Even if you and your DH have no money worries, it still shows a
sense of irresponsibility on her part to not have the VISA credited for the
amount of the ticket.


>
>April rolled around, and we got the bank statement for March. It
>included the plane fare, plus $250 worth of clothes from JCrew. DH
>called her to explain - she said she "thought he'd given her
>permission to buy a new outfit for the interview".

Either DH gave her permission or he didn't. If he didn't, what she did was
defraud you. She helped herself to something that wasn't hers, and without
permission. Even assuming (which I would be reluctant to believe) that DH
approved the expenditure, why wouldn't she have sent him the receipts, so he
could check it off when the statements comes (to ensure he isn't be
overcharged).

>Against my better judgment DH let this pass, but emphasized she was not to
use >the card again.

This is a tricky situation. Parents need to be united in such situations,
and in this one, clearly you have a difference of opinion with DH. For what
it's worth, I side with you. He is enabling her to remain a teenager and
preventing her growth. The last thing he is doing -- regardless of what he
thinks -- is helping her. All he is doing is attempting to avoid potential
conflict, which never works in the long-run.


>
>In June we got another surprise from the bank statement. This time it
>was $200 at JCrew, along with $50 from LL bean and $75 from the travel
>agent who had issued the plane ticket she'd bought earlier. At this
>point I'm furious, and suggested DH do something about his "dishonest,
>distrustful, thieving liar of a daughter". OK that may have been a
>little harsh, but, given the circumstances I felt I had the right to
>be mad.

Yes, of course you have a right to be mad. I'd be furious as well. I agree
that the language was harsh. It might have been accurate in this case, but
it certainly won't win him over to your side.

Now, you said earlier that this card was on a joint credit card. Could you
have canceled with the bank on your signature alone? If he is willing to
forgive (and forget) his daughter's deceit that's one thing, but you are in
a tough position of having to jointly pay for it. This is where I'm unsure
is DH is divorced husband. If that is the case, perhaps you are not at all
responsible for the credit card debt. If that is the case, it's your DH's
problem, and you can wash your hands of it. If it affects you, then that's
different.


>
>DH traveled out of state to spend the fathers day weekend with the 19
>year old and her younger siblings (who are marvelous, by the way).
>During this trip, he discovered that SD had used the ticket he'd
>bought for the college interview to pay for a weekend away with her
>boyfriend. He also discovered that she was on academic probation, as
>her GPA had fallen below 2.0 for the whole semester. (She has had a
>job for 3 months of the 2 years she's been in college, so too much
>work wasn't the reason for her failure.)

No, too much work wasn't the reason for her failure. Perhaps it was because
too many things have been so freely given to her?

To me, this proves the whole "admission interview", was a scam, to extort
more money out of us. DH isn't so sure, but, he was pissed and told her
that if she abused his credit card again, that was the last time he'd give
her *anything*.

Why did he wait even this long? How many times does a person need to use
someone's credit card in an authorized manner, before the cardholder decides
to put a stop to it.


>
>So, I opened the bank statement, and there it is: on June 29 she spent
>$198 at JCrew. To me this is just about the last straw, we send her a
>check every month to help with living expenses - yet the little #$%!!
>feels she can steal from us with impunity. I called the bank, and
>reported the card as "lost", so at least she won't be able to rip us
>off in that manner again.

Why didn't you just be honest and say you wanted to stop authorization on
the card?

I also had words with DH, he agreed that the money she's spent can come out
of the money he would have sent her for August and September, ie, she's not
getting a check for either of those months. That's a good start, but, I'll
believe it when I see it.

Yes, I'll believe it when you see it as well. Obviously, DH is a man who
avoids conflict at any costs. It is easier for him to pay the bill, sweep
the problem under the rug, and hopes that it goes away all by itself.
Problems are never solved that way. And, he is making it worse for his
daughter, not easier, in the long-run, as you know.


>
>There are a couple of issues here. One is I'm real concerned about
>the path SD is taking.

Okay, tough question for you: Are you concerned about the path she is
taking because you are concerned about *her* welfare, or yours? It's okay
if you're primarily worried about your welfare. It's not selfish. She is
an adult. I would not want to be looking at supporting a young adult who is
most certainly going to have trouble handling life on her own. This coming
from a 38-year old woman who has wealthy parents, and who worked her butt
off in college having received not a penny from them! And, I'm not angry
about it. I never saw it is their responsibility. I am still paying back
the loans. I'm sure if your daughter had to do this she would learn the
value of $200 at J. Crew really fast.

Aside from stealing with us, and being on the verge of flunking out of
college, she's a chronic liar and has also had a couple of brushes with the
law. The first issue is how do we, assuming we actually can, get her back
on the straight and narrow path?

Only one way: get united in a common front with DH. You two have to be in
agreement about how all decisions concerning SD will be made.


>
>I don't think she actually sees anything especially wrong with her
>behavior. Truthfully she's acting exactly like her mom - her mom has
>burnt many bridges over the years - with us, with countless friends,
>with colleagues, and even with family members, for exactly the same
>kind of behavior. Another trait of her moms that she's copying is to
>run away from her problems, or sweep them under the rug, rather than
>dealing with them head on.

I would recommend that you be careful not to project the anger you obviously
have toward her mother, onto her.

>The other issue is my feelings about oldest SD. We've had a fairly
>superficial relationship anyway, we can have pleasant conversations,
>and go out together, but it's never been any deeper than that. At
>this point I'm pissed off by the lies, the dishonesty, the
>manipulation, frankly I don't want to deal with her at all. I think,
>what's the point? My experience is she's going to lie, anyway, then
>scream and yell, or stalk off when confronted on it.

In the long-run, she is going to live her life the way she wants. However,
you have control with respect to the money. On academic probation? Then no
cash. Drug problems? Then no cash. Brushes with the law? Then no cash.
Just because she's making bad choices doesn't mean you have to finance it.

We are limited in affecting change in others, but we are totally able to
change ourselves. For you, I would suggest:
** uniting with DH and formalizing a common plan on how each situation
would be handled.
** Be firm and do not back down.
** Make sure you aren't taking some of the anger you have toward her
mother on her.

Good luck and God bless. It will get better, Julie!

Pamela

Jani

unread,
Aug 7, 1998, 3:00:00 AM8/7/98
to

PAMELA MCNEIL wrote in message <6qe2s9$7...@bgtnsc03.worldnet.att.net>...
<snipped to save everyone reading it twice>

Hi Julie
I promised myself I would lurk for a bit rather than posting - but (just a
couple of points (briefly - honest!))
I think Pamela is absolutely right in terms of the behaviour patterns you
should adopt - but it must be very hard to do if you're actually fond of SD
as a person. You don't mention (or perhaps I missed it, scanning quickly
through the thread) whether you feel maternal, older-sisterly or neutral
towards her. She might possibly feel left out of the family (especially if
her birth-mother isn't very maternal) because having lost the first mum, the
second one arrived at a point when she was too old to be "mummed" and
everybody's telling her to be grown-up, when she never got a chance to be a
kid. Defensiveness and self-interest is the obvious reaction to that
feelinng - plus a "sod you" attitude that makes her even more
self-interested and allows her to nick credit cards with no regard for the
consequences. (At 19, consequences don't exist!)
If it is any consolation at all, birth parents go through this as much as
steps. I taught secondary school for 17 years and believe me, adolescence is
hell for everyone. Birth or step, UK or US, they all do it to some extent.
It might help if you got a lot of feedback to reassure you that you're doing
the best you can - why should you feel guilty about doing your best for
the family?
I promised this would be short and it isn't. Apologies! I just hope it
helped in some small way
--
Jani

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