Who or what are we ?
duck
"Prof. Ignorantius" <7riv...@talknet.de> wrote in message
news:39D35C7F...@talknet.de...
> Hi,
> anyone out there of the regulars or the professionals
> who studied anthropology, human origins, ethnology or
> race and ethnicity ?
> Within me there is this notion of the Cro -Magnon man.
> From youth on. It is said to be one of our possible
> ancestors, who lived in Europe and is distinct from the
> neandertalian homo. At one time in the past the culture of
> either one was so different from the other that they branched,
> leaving one branch to end and the other to be our ancestors.
> At least what they seem to be gathering from the fossil remains.
>
> Within human evolution there seem to have been other
> curiosities such as homo sapiens with a really big brain
> size, more than today. While all the fact finding is still going
> on, I sometimes get the idea that in any case the abnormalities
> that we produce may be far from irrelevant. huh, I wanted to say
> something, but it slipped away, while writing !!
>
> Now that may mean, it愀 too late to invite a professional
> anthropologist to correct my messy revelations. Nobody to fill
> in, I guess. Have to wear my hat one more day!
>
> Any suggestions ??
> --
>
>
> M. Christophe
When you look at the diverse manifestations of man and their different
natures it does seem impossible that we could all have stemmed from the same
root.
Some dark black, some Asians, some Chinese, some white, some very, very
white, some native American some Aborigine etc etc etc.
I often wonder if we weren't visited by spaceships way back in time and a
few sample species from different planets were planted on the earth in
different areas to see what would happen.
As for schizophrenia it is in a way like dwarves, albinos, "special"
children and things like that. A freak of nature, but we do have to ask
ourselves.......
A freak of nature for what purpose?
And an even more important question.......
Is that purpose divine?
Michelle
Andrew Melka
SZ)
The story begins around 1492 AD with the first outbreak of syphilis
in Europe. As the date suggests and legend has long claimed, syphilis
may have returned to Europe with Colombus and his sailors. At first
syphilis was a quickly fatal disease, and thus exerted selective
pressure on European populations. Put crudely, if you screwed around
circa 1500, your genes didn't get passed to the next generation.
Instead it was the people who didn't screw around (probably didn't even
want to) who had children. After a couple generations of this what do
you have? Answer, Puritans. Now not only were the screwers around
becoming a minority, they were also an oppressed minority. The result
was that there was pressure on those red hot genes once again. Alot of
immoral people were sent to the poorhouse or the army, and one way or
another managed to die without offspring.
Around 1750 this quantitative trend changed into its opposite and
became a qualitative difference, as Hegel would say. Feathers are good
insulation, more feathers are better insulation, and then one day you
jump out of the tree and discover that feathers are also useful for
flying. Not being quite so socially gregarious and not quite so
sensually vivacious had the unintended consequence of decentering
experience. The thought of the period gradually began to envision the
removal of the self from the associative center of experience, and then
attitudes of thought became attitudes of being for a small segment of
the population.
There is a problem at this point. During the 19th and 20th
centuries it has been observed that non-western peoples, within a short
period of time and without interbreeding, responded to contact with
European derived people by developing the same 1% incidence of SZ.
Supposedly SZ was unknown to these non-western peoples before, and this
fact is what has tempted some to think SZ may be caused by a virus. SZ
clearly has a genetic component as family studies have shown, and I have
presented a possible evolutionary pathway. All that is required is to
change the bias that what evolved was a SZ receiver in the brain that
responded to the enviroment in an abnormal way.
Instead what if it was a SZ transmiter that evolved in brains of
people who probably were not even ill. These transmiters worked by
changing the enviroment in such a way that it began to engender SZ in
suceptible people. The suceptibility was an underlying feature common
to all races and populations of modern homo sapiens. So I think, "
What do I know about changes in the European enviroment between 1600 and
1800." The obvious answer is economic and industrial growth, the growth
of cities and trade in particular. You are probably thinking, " What
about Rococo style, that can drive you crazy." Maybe I have been too
much influenced by Louis A. Sass book <Madness and Modernism>. It's
possible that the ways of relating within families are the relevant
enviromental change.
Peter Melka
Newton's Cat
reference to the 'Dal Race'. Apparently after the discovery of Cro-
Magnon man the anthropologists looked around Europe to see if there
were any remnants of these "first modern Europeans" (35,000 bc) still
living, quietly, perhaps, in remote corners of our continent.
They found them - in Sweden, and "in small family groups around the
Western Coasts of Europe and North Africa." These people had there
own "family cultures and beliefs". They were called the 'Dal Race'
because they were most numerous in the region of Dalcaria in Sweden.
I can find absolutely no reference to them on the Net. Nor have Swedish
people I have contacted heard of them.
Newton's Cat
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.
Lou
Newton's Cat <newto...@my-deja.com> wrote:
> In one of the older editions of Encyclopaedia Britannica there is a
> reference to the 'Dal Race'. Apparently after the discovery of Cro-
> Magnon man the anthropologists looked around Europe to see if there
> were any remnants of these "first modern Europeans" (35,000 bc) still
> living, quietly, perhaps, in remote corners of our continent.
--
Study the Vikings, history goes back as far as myth and said to be the father
of many European nations, long ships went just about everywhere.
Crazy Lou
http://www.grizzadam.com/nam/homepage.html
http://www.grizzadam.com/nam/images/skepticsaward.wav
Frank
Good to see you are still spreading your romantic thoughts on schizophrenia.
Sometimes I wish I thought more like you do. You have a far more romantic
view of schizophrenia than I do. But then you probably already know that.
I see freaks of nature as just that. Simple genetic or environmental
aberrations. Some have a positive effect on the host, most do not. I see
schizophrenia as a freak of nature that has a profound negative effect on
its host. It distorts or changes one's perception of one's environment and,
therefore, makes one less capable of dealing with their environment. I am
hopeful that in many generations it will become extinct as it seems to have
no evolutionary advantage or that it will mutate into a form that is
beneficial to its host. I'd like to be around to see that.
Take care,
Frank.
"duck" <quack...@ntlworld.com> wrote in message
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damo...@webtv.net
skulls like space men. But.apparently it was only a small grouping and
they lived ike the other "cavemen".
Damo
http://www.netword.com/Damodara's.Passage
Frank
"Prof. Ignorantius" <7riv...@talknet.de> wrote in message news:39D44AC3...@talknet.de...
Frank wrote:Hi Michelle,Good to see you are still spreading your romantic thoughts on schizophrenia.
Sometimes I wish I thought more like you do. You have a far more romantic
view of schizophrenia than I do. But then you probably already know that.
I see freaks of nature as just that. Simple genetic or environmental
aberrations. Some have a positive effect on the host, most do not. I see
schizophrenia as a freak of nature that has a profound negative effect on
its host. It distorts or changes one's perception of one's environment and,
therefore, makes one less capable of dealing with their environment. I am
hopeful that in many generations it will become extinct as it seems to have
no evolutionary advantage or that it will mutate into a form that is
beneficial to its host. I'd like to be around to see that.Take care,
Frank."duck" <quack...@ntlworld.com> wrote in message
news:qBKA5.993$993....@news6-win.server.ntlworld.com...
>
> "Prof. Ignorantius" <7riv...@talknet.de> wrote in message
> news:39D35C7F...@talknet.de...
> > Hi,
> > anyone out there of the regulars or the professionals
> > who studied anthropology, human origins, ethnology or
+++ snip snip +++>Hi, Frank,
I´m grieving,maybe you see things just a little bit like the
"normaloes" do? They say to themselves, the world
is just like we see it. And no room for maneuvers.
I mean, ok, some folks out there are just superior, I know.
But where are we going ? Being one of 6 Billion, high
on the superiority rate is one thing. But then we know
some natural resources of the great earth are just dying,
fading away. So, sometimes, being a part of say 2-3 %
of a great multitude, gives me "pasture" rather than
dismay.It only seems to me that some aspects of this
schizophrenia experience are too worthy to let
them just fade out. And yes, Ducky is a pearl, 8-).--
M. Christophe
blessed am I to dwell in this beautiful temple.
(Rainbows)
Nobody suicide any more !
(memorial of the unnamed regular)
duck
"Frank" <fran...@netcom.ca> wrote in message
news:Xc9B5.13222$YG5....@tor-nn1.netcom.ca...
Hi Christophe,
I've noted in the past many times the difference between Michelle's
experience with sz and mine. She has experienced beautiful highs and
wondrous visual hallucinations that have been amazing. I am a paranoid sz
who has experienced only paranoia, and pulse-racing, adrenaline-pumping
fear, anxiety and self-doubt. There is nothing good about my experience
with sz and as far as I'm concerned nothing good about sz in general. Some
people may have a much more pleasant experience with sz than I have but I
would argue that it still makes them less able to cope with their
environment and, therefore, less likely to thrive and excel in that
environment. You can't handle your world very well if what you experience
is not the real world.
Take care,
Frank.
I can very much see your point Frank and although I personally do try and
make the best of it, what would I give never to have got it. I was never
able to have children as I was VERY heavily medicated when younger and the
doctor made it quite clear that in order to have children I would have to
give up my medication. This was out of the question. If I hadn't developed
sz then I am quite sure I would have had kids.
Then there is the work situation, I have been in and out of jobs all my life
and suffered tremendously from being an "outcast" and "different" at places
where I have worked. Work situations have often upset me much more than I
think they would do someone without sz and the number of evenings I have
spent in tears at some of the cruel things that have happened. If I hadn't
developed sz I think I could have been quite a high flyer and would
certainly be on a LOT more money than I am now.
Things are much better as regards the "outcast" situation. I am much, much
better these days at the "nice weather for the time of year" kind of chat
and generally getting along with my work mates to the extent where they
don't think I am a freak. I still have a lot of trouble though and often
get upset about things and take days off.
Although I might make a big deal of the "romantic" side as you put it, there
have been times of such utter, utter nightmares and fears and torments.
A positive thing I can say, which I am sure you will agree with me about, is
that sz has made me a better person in the sense of being more aware and
more considerate of others. I note you Frank are very kind and very helpful
here (you don't post as much as you used to) always giving support and
encouragement - now were you the same before you developed sz? Or do you
feel that you are "more" like this due to the sz?
It has also made me truly, truly grateful for friends and family (and my
boss) who stand by me and forgive me for some of the crazy things I do. It
has made me less proud and more humble about relationships and made me
appreciate the love that people give me. I used to take all this kind of
thing for granted.
And I don't know if you will agree with me on this one Frank, but I find it
has given me "depth". I never really thought about God, the Universe,
dreams, intuition and things like that but I find these things really
important now.
Yes I agree, I could have had kids, could have had a high powered job, heaps
of money but come on Frank, I can't turn back the clock and have to try
somehow to see something positive and make the best of things.
***
On a different note - did you ever try that Assam tea? And how's the
kitten?
Love
Michelle
X
Frank
For sure we've got to try to see the "positive" side of our respective
predicaments and make the best of the life we have. I, despite my sz, live
a pretty happy, contented life. I think you do very well in this regard as
well. If only I didn't have to work I think I would be truly happy. I'm
very much looking forward to retirement. I just have this fear that my wife
and I will save like mad for retirement all our lives and die before we get
old enough to reach it. For that reason we're trying to live for today as
well as plan for retirement at the same time.
I'm glad you agree that you wish you never had sz. Sometimes reading your
posts I thought you were almost glad to have developed it. As I said in my
previous post I think your experience has, at times, been more positive than
mine. My delusions and hallucinations always have a very negative tone.
Yours are sometimes very positive and beautiful. For that I'm a bit
jealous.
I'm very sorry about the not being able to have kids thing. I'm lucky in
that I (the male in my relationship) have sz, not my wife and, therefore, we
can still have kids if we decide to. However, she is currently on
anti-depressant medication (Effexor) and should go off of that before we try
to have kids. Time will tell if she can do without the medication or not.
Personally I'm a little ambivalent about the whole kids issue. On the one
hand they would certainly be a joy but on the other it's a HUGE
responsibility and it changes your life forever (in some ways positively, in
some ways not). There's pros and cons to both sides I think. Still if you
want kids It's a real shame to not be able to have them. I'm sorry.
I'm always a little scared when I post a difference of opinion to you that
you might take it the wrong way. I'm glad in this case that you didn't.
You're right I've been posting less in the past 6 months or so but lately
(the last week or two) I've been tuning in more frequently. I think as the
cold weather starts to come back I'll have more time for the ng. It's great
to see that you are still here, spreading your joy and making your opinions
known.
Oh yea and in answer to your question: I think I've always been a kind and
considerate person but you're definitely right, having sz has made me more
compassionate and more concerned about the plight and misfortune of others.
Well look at that!! There is a positive aspect after all. Thanks for
making me realize that.
The point you make about "if I didn't have sz I think I would have been a
high flyer and have a lot more money" really strikes home with me. It is my
lost potential and lessened fulfillment in life that bothers me more than
anything else. Sure, I'm doing pretty OK but I've seen countless friends
and colleagues move on to bigger and better jobs/positions while I struggle
to keep my head above water. I worked with many of them before I got sz and
I know, at that time, I had just as much potential and ability as any of
them. But for my sz I think I would be on my way as well. The hardest one
to take is a good friend who recently got promoted to Vice President and
part owner at the same company I work at. We went to school together so we
should be on the same career development timeline but due to my sz I have
fallen far behind. Sorry for complaining. I should be happy for what I do
have. I just get down about it sometimes.
Glad to hear that you are doing better in the work environment than in the
past. I too am beginning to come out of my shell. The other day my boss
commented that since my illness I have at least kept my good personality
although I am a lot quieter around work than I used to be. I felt like
saying "If you had been convinced that there was a conspiracy against you at
work and that he (my boss) was the ring leader you would probably be more
quiet as well." Of course today I know that those thoughts were just
delusions and not real but it takes a long time to get out of that mindset
and see people in a different "real" light.
Take care,
Frank.
"duck" <quack...@ntlworld.com> wrote in message
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