Since there is no working Gallbladder NG, I thought Id post this here...
If I have no Gallbladder, wouldnt taking Alli (diet drug) help getting rid of some of the fat that my body can no longer digest, so I can have a regular diet again?
In article <oKqdncKJhLvdwBXbnZ2dnUVZ_gudn...@comcast.com>,
"preesi" <pre...@comcast.net> wrote: > Since there is no working Gallbladder NG, I thought Id post this > here...
> If I have no Gallbladder, wouldnt taking Alli (diet drug) help getting > rid of some of the fat that my body can no longer digest, so I can have > a regular diet again?
> Anyone know?
You still have the same amount of bile flow into your intestines as you did before your gallbladder was removed. You still digest fats just as you did before. There are no special diets required after gallbladder surgery - you should be able to eat a regular diet now.
At any rate, a fat blocker (orlistat) like Alli would only exacerbate any problems you're having digesting fats. Nasty stuff. Definitely likely to provide you with a real "party in your pants"
preesi wrote: > Since there is no working Gallbladder NG, I thought Id post this > here...
> If I have no Gallbladder, wouldnt taking Alli (diet drug) help getting > rid of some of the fat that my body can no longer digest, so I can > have a regular diet again?
> Anyone know?
Haven't you seen the commercials. Just google Alli. I believe Alli works by blocking the absortion of fat into the small intestines, and that is why the big warning that you may have to wear diapers :-) .
Howard McCollister wrote: > In article <oKqdncKJhLvdwBXbnZ2dnUVZ_gudn...@comcast.com>, > "preesi" <pre...@comcast.net> wrote:
>> Since there is no working Gallbladder NG, I thought Id post this >> here...
>> If I have no Gallbladder, wouldnt taking Alli (diet drug) help >> getting rid of some of the fat that my body can no longer digest, so >> I can have a regular diet again?
>> Anyone know?
> You still have the same amount of bile flow into your intestines as > you did before your gallbladder was removed. You still digest fats > just as you did before. There are no special diets required after > gallbladder surgery - you should be able to eat a regular diet now.
Thats NOT true! OMG! BEFORE surgery your gallbladder STORES alot of BILE to release during meals. When you have no gallbladder to store it for meals, it trickles down in one small stream, not in a HUGE jolt! You therefore have REDUCED fat digestion and MOST post op gallbladder patients have to reduce fats (in spite of the LIES theyve been told that you can go back to a regular diet!) Most patients gain weight because of this.
> At any rate, a fat blocker (orlistat) like Alli would only exacerbate > any problems you're having digesting fats. Nasty stuff. Definitely > likely to provide you with a real "party in your pants"
Actually it might pick up the slack and rid my body of the fat that my body NOW cannot get rid of. Fat that is part of a REGULAR diet.
Pete wrote: > preesi wrote: >> Since there is no working Gallbladder NG, I thought Id post this >> here...
>> If I have no Gallbladder, wouldnt taking Alli (diet drug) help >> getting rid of some of the fat that my body can no longer digest, so >> I can have a regular diet again?
>> Anyone know?
> Haven't you seen the commercials. Just google Alli. I believe Alli > works by blocking the absortion of fat into the small intestines, and > that is why the big warning that you may have to wear diapers :-) .
preesi wrote: > Howard McCollister wrote: >> In article <oKqdncKJhLvdwBXbnZ2dnUVZ_gudn...@comcast.com>, >> "preesi" <pre...@comcast.net> wrote:
>>> Since there is no working Gallbladder NG, I thought Id post this >>> here...
>>> If I have no Gallbladder, wouldnt taking Alli (diet drug) help >>> getting rid of some of the fat that my body can no longer digest, so >>> I can have a regular diet again?
>>> Anyone know?
>> You still have the same amount of bile flow into your intestines as >> you did before your gallbladder was removed. You still digest fats >> just as you did before. There are no special diets required after >> gallbladder surgery - you should be able to eat a regular diet now.
> Thats NOT true! OMG! BEFORE surgery your gallbladder STORES alot of > BILE to release during meals. > When you have no gallbladder to store it for meals, it trickles down > in one small stream, not in a HUGE jolt! > You therefore have REDUCED fat digestion and MOST post op gallbladder > patients have to reduce fats (in spite of the LIES theyve been told > that you can go back to a regular diet!) Most patients gain weight > because of this.
>> At any rate, a fat blocker (orlistat) like Alli would only exacerbate >> any problems you're having digesting fats. Nasty stuff. Definitely >> likely to provide you with a real "party in your pants"
> Actually it might pick up the slack and rid my body of the fat that my > body NOW cannot get rid of. > Fat that is part of a REGULAR diet.
Hear, hear, Vanny (not you Preesi)...who are you going to put your money on. Howard has plonked me, but I think I may have to put my money on him - lol ...Pete
"preesi" <pre...@comcast.net> wrote: > Howard McCollister wrote: > > In article <oKqdncKJhLvdwBXbnZ2dnUVZ_gudn...@comcast.com>, > > "preesi" <pre...@comcast.net> wrote:
> >> Since there is no working Gallbladder NG, I thought Id post this > >> here...
> >> If I have no Gallbladder, wouldnt taking Alli (diet drug) help > >> getting rid of some of the fat that my body can no longer digest, so > >> I can have a regular diet again?
> >> Anyone know?
> > You still have the same amount of bile flow into your intestines as > > you did before your gallbladder was removed. You still digest fats > > just as you did before. There are no special diets required after > > gallbladder surgery - you should be able to eat a regular diet now.
> Thats NOT true! OMG! BEFORE surgery your gallbladder STORES alot of BILE > to release during meals. > When you have no gallbladder to store it for meals, it trickles down in > one small stream, not in a HUGE jolt! > You therefore have REDUCED fat digestion and MOST post op gallbladder > patients have to reduce fats (in spite of the LIES theyve been told that > you can go back to a regular diet!) Most patients gain weight because of > this.
> > At any rate, a fat blocker (orlistat) like Alli would only exacerbate > > any problems you're having digesting fats. Nasty stuff. Definitely > > likely to provide you with a real "party in your pants"
> Actually it might pick up the slack and rid my body of the fat that my > body NOW cannot get rid of. > Fat that is part of a REGULAR diet.
Well, good luck...I don't think *I* can help you. Perhaps there's somebody else here that will tell you what you want to hear.
preesi wrote: > Pete wrote: >> preesi wrote: >>> Since there is no working Gallbladder NG, I thought Id post this >>> here...
>>> If I have no Gallbladder, wouldnt taking Alli (diet drug) help >>> getting rid of some of the fat that my body can no longer digest, so >>> I can have a regular diet again?
>>> Anyone know?
>> Haven't you seen the commercials. Just google Alli. I believe Alli >> works by blocking the absortion of fat into the small intestines, and >> that is why the big warning that you may have to wear diapers :-) .
> That wasnt an answer Pete!
I know...I was going to write that I didn't understand what you were saying, and I still don't. So I thought I would just write and tell you how Alli works, and you will excrete the fat that is not digested.
> Pete wrote: >> preesi wrote: >>> Since there is no working Gallbladder NG, I thought Id post this >>> here...
>>> If I have no Gallbladder, wouldnt taking Alli (diet drug) help >>> getting rid of some of the fat that my body can no longer digest, so >>> I can have a regular diet again?
>>> Anyone know? >> Haven't you seen the commercials. Just google Alli. I believe Alli >> works by blocking the absortion of fat into the small intestines, and >> that is why the big warning that you may have to wear diapers :-) .
> That wasnt an answer Pete!
I'm curious. Why do you think a product that *blocks* the absorption of fat is going to help? Seems it'd make more sense, since bile helps break down fats (emulsifies them), that this is the last thing you'd want.
You still will have bile to emulsify fats, just not as much. Some people can have a normal diet after gallbladder removal with no problems, some have big problems with fats and must continue a low-fat diet (at least when there's no bathroom handy), and some (like my Mom) are somewhere in the middle.
I'm going to have to go with Howard and Pete on this one. Alli doesn't sound like a good idea to me.
Well, I think that this particular one is a no-contest. My money is on Howard every time.
A dysfunctional gall bladder will not be churning out buckets of bile as a certain person thinks. The gall bladder is only small and in the case of a (partially) blocked/badly inflammed gall bladder the storage area will be even smaller. To my mind, there will be a more normal/increased bile excretion and thus better gut function (in comparison to that with the sick gall bladder function) after a gall bladder operation. That is the whole point of being operated on.
I remember having some very frustrating 'conversations' with this individual last year and will not enter into dialogue again. It is just too confusing and time wasting. I just reiterate that GERD and gall bladder symptoms are two separate issues. If the problem is that a doctor cannot diagnose a patient correctly then it is time to move on and find another - there are enough doctors out there. A big issue is also adequate and effective communication with the doctor. I prepare for every appointment by writing down in bullet point form my current symptoms, issues and any questions, and I tick each off as we have discussed them.
Here are some of my musings, which should, as always, be checked with your doctors. The recommended dietary fat intake is 60 g maximum per day. Most Westerners have a fat intake that way exceeds this. The liver produces the bile and the gall bladder is a temporary storage area. If the gallbladder was stuffed up with sludge or stones or was inflammed it certainly was not working properly and there (to my mind) will probably be, in such instances, more bile excreted into the duodenum after a gallbladder operation than before.
As for putting on weight after a gallbladder operation. If the individual was not looking after themselves prior to the operation and stays on the same abnormal, unhealthy diet it is highly likely that they are going to keep on putting on weight especially if, after the gall bladder operation, fat absorption is better than prior to the operation. A disastrously high fat diet may cause steatorrhoea in addition to a dysfunctional gut and stressed/dysfunctional gall bladder and liver, cutting the dietary fat intake down and substituting more healthy unsaturated vegetable oils for the less healthy saturated animal fats will help sort the gut out.
My thesis is that most people make themselves unhealthy. 80-90 % of cancers are avoidable and over 50 % of heart disease. The major issues are smoking and a bad lifestyle choices, e.g., sedentary lifestyle, bad diet, recreational drugs, overmedication, self-treatment of self-inflicted disease through dubious sources, unnecessary supplementation/overdosing on vitamins (can lead to cancer in some cases), etc.
A regular diet should be a healthy diet with at least 5 helpings of fruit and vegetables each day and at least 3 different colours on one's plate at each meal (words of wisdom from a nutritional expert who was also the second-chef-in-command of a convalescent clinic I was in), and not one filled with sweets, soda, fast food and microwave meals. It is easy to check whether or not your diet is healthy after eliminating the latter because you should not have any wild cravings (unless you are pregnant or have other gut issues). If you have sweet cravings then carrots or fruit will supply all the sugar you need.
I suggest that everyone works out how much fat they are eating each day and how much it exceeds the recommended maximum and cuts out the excess to achieve a healthy diet and thus, eventually with a modicum of sport and other lifestyle changes, a healthy gut and body.
I cook with olive oil and drizzle linseed oil on my mash potatoes, etc., and I also have walnut oil and sesame seed to drizzle over salads and chinese food, respectfully. Linseed oil must also be kept in the fridge and used up quickley, as it also contains very valuable omega 3 fatty acids. I try and limit my intake of unsaturated fats - biscuits, cake, margarine and do not eat any fast food at all - I have tried it just makes me ill due to my Crohn's problems. I have also eliminated any artificial colourants, preservatives and the like from my diet.
Well, that is my tuppence worth and I hope that it closes this series of posts.
> preesi wrote: >> Howard McCollister wrote: >>> In article <oKqdncKJhLvdwBXbnZ2dnUVZ_gudn...@comcast.com>, >>> "preesi" <pre...@comcast.net> wrote:
>>>> Since there is no working Gallbladder NG, I thought Id post this >>>> here...
>>>> If I have no Gallbladder, wouldnt taking Alli (diet drug) help >>>> getting rid of some of the fat that my body can no longer digest, so >>>> I can have a regular diet again?
>>>> Anyone know?
>>> You still have the same amount of bile flow into your intestines as >>> you did before your gallbladder was removed. You still digest fats >>> just as you did before. There are no special diets required after >>> gallbladder surgery - you should be able to eat a regular diet now.
>> Thats NOT true! OMG! BEFORE surgery your gallbladder STORES alot of >> BILE to release during meals. >> When you have no gallbladder to store it for meals, it trickles down >> in one small stream, not in a HUGE jolt! >> You therefore have REDUCED fat digestion and MOST post op gallbladder >> patients have to reduce fats (in spite of the LIES theyve been told >> that you can go back to a regular diet!) Most patients gain weight >> because of this.
>>> At any rate, a fat blocker (orlistat) like Alli would only exacerbate >>> any problems you're having digesting fats. Nasty stuff. Definitely >>> likely to provide you with a real "party in your pants"
>> Actually it might pick up the slack and rid my body of the fat that my >> body NOW cannot get rid of. >> Fat that is part of a REGULAR diet.
> Hear, hear, Vanny (not you Preesi)...who are you going to put your money > on. Howard has plonked me, but I think I may have to put my money on him - > lol ...Pete
> Well, I think that this particular one is a no-contest. My money is on > Howard every time.
> A dysfunctional gall bladder will not be churning out buckets of bile as a > certain person thinks. The gall bladder is only small and in the case of a > (partially) blocked/badly inflammed gall bladder the storage area will be > even smaller. To my mind, there will be a more normal/increased bile > excretion and thus better gut function (in comparison to that with the sick > gall bladder function) after a gall bladder operation. That is the whole > point of being operated on.
> Well, that is my tuppence worth and I hope that it closes this series of > posts.
> Vanny
Good point, Vanny, one I missed on a reply post, and probably the situation I'm in, if I eat too much fat I have the same issues a percentage of folks without their gallbladder find themselves in (too much fat = need bathroom fast). Thusly, during these times I think my gallbladder is probably not functioning at all.
Oddly though, although I had this problem for some months around the most dangerous time of year - Thanksgiving/Christmas holidays - going to a low fat diet has "fixed" the problem to the extent that I can now sometimes have an order of fries or other fatty food with no ill effects. But! If I eat higher fat for more than a few days, my gallbladder does start complaining (pains).
I'm actually greatly surprised that I've been able to control my symptoms (for now) by diet alone. This makes me a little unsure as to whether my particular problems are gallbladder, GERD, or more likely a combination of both.
jmc <NOnewsgroupsS...@NOjodiBODY.HOMEus> wrote: > Suddenly, without warning, Vanny exclaimed (7/3/2007 6:49 PM): > > A dysfunctional gall bladder will not be churning out buckets of bile as a > > certain person thinks. The gall bladder is only small and in the case of a > > (partially) blocked/badly inflammed gall bladder the storage area will be > > even smaller. To my mind, there will be a more normal/increased bile > > excretion and thus better gut function (in comparison to that with the sick > > gall bladder function) after a gall bladder operation. That is the whole > > point of being operated on.
> > Well, that is my tuppence worth and I hope that it closes this series of > > posts.
> > Vanny
> Good point, Vanny, one I missed on a reply post, and probably the > situation I'm in, if I eat too much fat I have the same issues a > percentage of folks without their gallbladder find themselves in (too > much fat = need bathroom fast). Thusly, during these times I think my > gallbladder is probably not functioning at all.
jmc wrote: > Suddenly, without warning, preesi exclaimed (7/3/2007 12:57 PM): >> Pete wrote: >>> preesi wrote: >>>> Since there is no working Gallbladder NG, I thought Id post this >>>> here...
>>>> If I have no Gallbladder, wouldnt taking Alli (diet drug) help >>>> getting rid of some of the fat that my body can no longer digest, >>>> so I can have a regular diet again?
>>>> Anyone know? >>> Haven't you seen the commercials. Just google Alli. I believe Alli >>> works by blocking the absortion of fat into the small intestines, >>> and that is why the big warning that you may have to wear diapers >>> :-) .
>> That wasnt an answer Pete!
> I'm curious. Why do you think a product that *blocks* the absorption > of fat is going to help? Seems it'd make more sense, since bile helps > break down fats (emulsifies them), that this is the last thing you'd > want. > You still will have bile to emulsify fats, just not as much. Some > people can have a normal diet after gallbladder removal with no > problems, some have big problems with fats and must continue a low-fat > diet (at least when there's no bathroom handy), and some (like my Mom) > are somewhere in the middle.
> I'm going to have to go with Howard and Pete on this one. Alli > doesn't sound like a good idea to me.
> jmc
Actually more ppl then not have problems eating a NORMAL diet after gallbladder removal. Thats the LIE the Drs tell you. So lets see if I can explain WHY Alli might be good maintainance medicine for post op gallbladder surgery better for you. In a person with a healthy Gallbladder, the gallbladder stores a big amount of bile to help deal with fats. When you eat a regular SQUARE* meal it squirts this bile on the food to digest it. The big amount digests most if not all of the fat in that meal. When your gallbladder isnt working or is absent, bile just trickles out of the liver in a small stream (CONSTANTLY) so when you eat a regular SQUARE* meal a lot less bile is able to digest the fat cause there isnt that big squirt coming at the food from the gallbladder. Its like trying to paint a room with a pint of paint, its spread too thin. Understand? I cannot eat alot of carbs, I do better on a lower carb diet and am satiated and tend not to overeat on a diet with lots of veg, lean meats and moderate fats. But with no gallbladder I cant eat that way anymore. So if I were to take Alli and eat like a normal person it will get rid of the extra fat. It will block the extra fat that my body cannot digest without a gallbladder. Understand now? BTW I GOT gallbladder problems via a lowfat diet in which I lost 55 pounds and was 5 pounds away from goal, the misdiagnosis of GERD made me gain alot back having to eat carbs again. Now its hard to have a nice salad with real olive oil...
This cant be too hard to understand, can it? Its not rocket science!
*SQUARE meal= A Few slices of Turkey or Potroast w/ a lil gravy, a half cup mashed taters w/a pat butter and some gravy, 1 cup mixed lightly buttered veg, milk on side.
> Actually more ppl then not have problems eating a NORMAL diet after > gallbladder removal. > Thats the LIE the Drs tell you. > So lets see if I can explain WHY Alli might be good maintainance > medicine for post op gallbladder surgery better for you. > In a person with a healthy Gallbladder, the gallbladder stores a big > amount of bile to help deal with fats. > When you eat a regular SQUARE* meal it squirts this bile on the food to > digest it. The big amount digests most if not all of the fat in that > meal. > When your gallbladder isnt working or is absent, bile just trickles out > of the liver in a small stream (CONSTANTLY) so when you eat a regular > SQUARE* meal a lot less bile is able to digest the fat cause there isnt > that big squirt coming at the food from the gallbladder. > Its like trying to paint a room with a pint of paint, its spread too > thin. > Understand? > I cannot eat alot of carbs, I do better on a lower carb diet and am > satiated and tend not to overeat on a diet with lots of veg, lean meats > and moderate fats. But with no gallbladder I cant eat that way anymore. > So if I were to take Alli and eat like a normal person it will get rid > of the extra fat. It will block the extra fat that my body cannot digest > without a gallbladder. > Understand now? > BTW I GOT gallbladder problems via a lowfat diet in which I lost 55 > pounds and was 5 pounds away from goal, the misdiagnosis of GERD made me > gain alot back having to eat carbs again. Now its hard to have a nice > salad with real olive oil...
> This cant be too hard to understand, can it? Its not rocket science!
> *SQUARE meal= A Few slices of Turkey or Potroast w/ a lil gravy, a half > cup mashed taters w/a pat butter and some gravy, 1 cup mixed lightly > buttered veg, milk on side.
Yawn! Thank you for sharing. Isn't it about time for you to leave again?
Suddenly, without warning, preesi exclaimed (7/5/2007 12:51 AM):
> Actually more ppl then not have problems eating a NORMAL diet after > gallbladder removal.
I've talked to - and know - lots of people who have had their gallbladders removed. MOST, though not all, report being able to return to a healthy diet. If your normal diet was full of fats, of course you can't return to a normal diet.
> Thats the LIE the Drs tell you.
It's not doctors telling me this, it's patients. Real-life people who have had their gallbladder removed, sometimes recently, sometimes years ago.
> So if I were to take Alli and eat like a normal person it will get rid > of the extra fat. It will block the extra fat that my body cannot digest > without a gallbladder. > Understand now?
No. Read the webpage. Alli DOES NOT block fats. It blocks your ABSORPTION of fat. But since you're bloody well convinced it'll work for you, go ahead and try it. And suffer the consequences: know that you were warned.
> BTW I GOT gallbladder problems via a lowfat diet in which I lost 55 > pounds and was 5 pounds away from goal, the misdiagnosis of GERD made me > gain alot back having to eat carbs again. Now its hard to have a nice > salad with real olive oil...
Actually, I remember reading somewhere that a low-carb diet can cause gallstones. I did low-carb for a couple of years, it was during that time I started having problems. One person's empirical evidence, YMMV.
Since when does a GERD diet have you eating lots of carbs? The one I know of has you eating mostly fresh fruits and veggies.
> This cant be too hard to understand, can it? Its not rocket science!
So then why don't you? <flame suit on>
> *SQUARE meal= A Few slices of Turkey or Potroast w/ a lil gravy, a half > cup mashed taters w/a pat butter and some gravy, 1 cup mixed lightly > buttered veg, milk on side.
Get rid of all that butter and replace it with olive oil. And lowfat milk. All that saturated fat is very bad for you, whether or not you have GERD or gallbladder issues.
My last word on the subject. It's a waste of time arguing with someone who's as close minded as you are.
|
