Random readings
BillyG1993
Reading some of the posts here, and since there are some therapists here too, I
am reminded of an episode I read in a book a long time ago. The book is called
"My Father's Guru: A Journey Through Spirituality and Disillusion" by Jeffrey
Moussaieff Masson.
In the book, the "guru" is only referred to as PB, but is actually Paul
Brunton. PB lived with the wealthy Moussaieff family as their guru for a
number of years. Jeffrey describes an incident when he was a child, where PB
has everyone close their eyes in order to demonstrate that he could move a
coffee table via the power of his mind. Well, being a child, Jeffrey sneaked a
peek, and saw PB picking up the table with his hands and moving it. The
adults, who had their eyes closed, were impressed even more with PB.
Paul Brunton wrote a number of seminal works on spirituality. Among them: "A
Search in Secret India" "The Wisdom of the Overself" "The Quest for The
Overself" "The Hidden Teachings Beyond Yoga" Very good stuff IMO so I was
perplexed that he would resort to cheap carnival trickery to further his cause.
But then, could it be Jeffrey trying to libel him?
Jeffrey Masson is an interesting character himself. A scholar, he earned a PhD
in Sanskrit from Harvard (PB had picked him to be his heir and suggested to him
to study Sanskrit), and also became a trained psychoanalyst.
Wrote/co-wrote/edited books such as "The Oceanic Feeling: The Origins of
Religious Sentiment in India" "The Dhvanyaloka of Anandavardhana with the
Locana of Abhinavagupta" (what the hell is that!) Then he became the guardian
of Sigmund Freud's archives (wrote/edited "The Complete Letters of Sigmund
Freud to Wilhelm Fliess 1887-1904). Then he debunked Freud and psychoanalysis
in a very public manner ("Final Analysis: The Making and Unmaking of a
Psychoanalyst" "The Assault on Truth: Freud's Suppression of the Seduction
Theory" "Against Therapy: Emotional Tyranny and the Myth of Psychological
Healing"). Was sued by the Freud Archives. He is/was married to Catherine
McKinnon, noted feminist legal scholar. His latest works are two books on the
emotions of animals "Dogs Never Lie about Love: Reflections on the Emotional
World of Dogs" and "When Elephants Weep: The Emotional Lives of Animals" He
has his own website http://www.jeffreymasson.com/ where you can find more
detail. It is worth a trip.
These two characters have some SY guru-like traits in them.
Hey, I'm not insulting anyone or their profession here (my own is bad enough),
I just like to read a lot on things unrelated to my getting ahead in my career,
and I thought it was an interesting combination of Gurus, psychoanalysts,
emotions of animals (we do have some animal lovers here, Solo, Violet, Dan).
If Bradley and his Bunny can hop here, let me add some stuff I read.
Love to all,
Billy
PS. I was driving on the highway the other day, when a red Porsche convertible
came screaming past me. I looked at the license plate, and it said "PURE ID"
Hrdtired
Hey, Billy, I've got that Masson gooroo book on my shelf as well -- I thought
it was utterly fascinating and well worth a look.
Another really great book about the biggest con-gooroo of them all is The
Golden Guru by James S. Gordon, about Rajneesh. Gordon is a psychotherapist if
I remember correctly and he spent some time at Rajneesh's ashram in Poona,
India. He underwent some of the therapies as well as asked a lot of questions,
so it's an interesting mix of investigative reporting and real-life experience.
-- The Tired Heart
Satdesh
Billy,
I also have the Jeff Masson book. Fascinating. I was getting ready to hurl
when he was talking about drinking Papa RD's dirty footbath water. Yuck.
Sincerely,
Satdesh
Dorothy Drennen
I really liked "Golden Guru." I think the author captures the tension between
[corrupt -- not trustworthy -- perhaps evil] and [charismatic -- you could drown in
the depths of those eyes -- powerful shakti]. In one scene, knowing full well that
Rajneesh was certainly *not* someone to admire/venerate/look up to, the author is
*still* drawn in by the pure power of the man - and eloquently discusses how it
feels to hold those two feelings at one time.
Maha...@my-dejanews.com
In article <199806260355...@ladder01.news.aol.com>,
billy...@aol.com (BillyG1993) wrote:
>
> He is/was married to Catherine McKinnon, noted feminist legal scholar
*** Isn't she the one who said that every act of sex is an act of rape? Also,
that a woman has been sexually harrassed if she *thinks* it happened, that no
objective evidence is necessary? Correct me if I'm wrong . . .
> Hey, I'm not insulting anyone or their profession here (my own is bad enough),
*** My guess is you're a lawyer? Quick, let's adapt a few lawyer jokes:
Q: What do you have when you've got GM buried up to her neck in sand?
A: Not enough sand.
Q: How can you tell when GM is lying?
A: Her lips move.
> Love to all,
> Billy
Love, -MahaLinga
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BillyG1993
MahaLinga wrote:
>billy...@aol.com (BillyG1993) wrote:
>>
>> He is/was married to Catherine McKinnon, noted
>>feminist legal scholar
>
>*** Isn't she the one who said that every act of sex is
>an act of rape? Also, that a woman has been sexually
>harassed if she *thinks* it happened, that no objective
>evidence is necessary? Correct me if I'm wrong . . .
You are right. I can't elaborate on the subject because I haven't read her
writings in depth.
>
>> Hey, I'm not insulting anyone or their profession here (my own is bad
enough),
>
>*** My guess is you're a lawyer? (snip)
Sorry, incorrect, mine is worse yet. (Oy, I'm not a thief or a prostitute.)
I really think that being a therapist (a real one and not a SY operative) is a
very noble profession, because if all the people in the world were balanced (is
that the right word?) to begin with, there would be no negativities, no crimes,
no animosity of any kind, no wars, no need for locks and keys. In other words,
we would all be living in a utopia, where no one would be wanting and every act
would be uplifting. I thought I had found this utopia in SY.
(You therapists out there, please correct me if I have the wrong understanding
of your profession, as I have never been in therapy and don't know what it is,
but my center leader kept pushing me to go to therapy whenever I told
him/her/it I wanted to leave SY.)
Regards,
Billy
Shawdan
In article <199806270254...@ladder03.news.aol.com>,
billy...@aol.com (BillyG1993) writes:
>(You therapists out there, please correct me if I have the wrong
>understanding
>of your profession, as I have never been in therapy and don't know what it
>is,
>but my center leader kept pushing me to go to therapy whenever I told
>him/her/it I wanted to leave SY.)
>
>Regards,
>Billy
>
>
Yes, therapy is designed to control people, and fulfill the agenda of the guru
that is controlling the therapist. It is especially designed to stop people
from thinking for themselves, and to shame them into seeing their unhappiness
as their own fault for not being devoted enough to the therapist's guru.
Kidding.
Seriously, there are so many kinds of therapy and therapists. Many different
theoretical and technical varieties, and MANY therapists with little or no
training, but lots of entrepeneurial enterprise and the ability to influence
others. Be an educated consumer is my advice.
***************
Sha...@aol.com (Daniel Shaw)
http://members.aol.com/shawdan/page1.htm
"It has been my experience that folks with no vices have few virtues." --
Abraham Lincoln
"As I would not be a slave, so I would not be a master." -- Abraham Lincoln
Maha...@my-dejanews.com
In article <199806270839...@ladder01.news.aol.com>,
sha...@aol.com (Shawdan) wrote:
>
> Seriously, there are so many kinds of therapy and therapists. Many different
> theoretical and technical varieties, and MANY therapists with little or no
> training, but lots of entrepeneurial enterprise and the ability to influence
> others. Be an educated consumer is my advice.
Do you know anything about NLP (Neurolinguistic Programming)? What's the
general theory behind it, etc. How does it compare to other therapies, in your
opinion.
The reason I ask is . . .
I found a website on using NLP methods to achieve enlightenment. German
author is Wolfgang Bernard. Looks fascinating but (potentially?) cultish. If
I can oversimplify, he says the thoughts in our minds are just
representations of the world, like a map is a representation of the territory
it describes. We spend our time perceiving our thoughts about the world, not
perceiving the world directly. He uses his own flavor of NLP to quiet the
mind to reach a thought- free state, free from attachment and aversion. The
last thought to be quieted is the "core belief" as he calls it; the
unconscious thought that we are separate, separate from each other, and from
God. This is my paraphrase, I can only understand it through the framework
that SY taught me.
Anyhow, it resonates with what is true (for me) about the SY teachings.
Any feedback or advice, from Dan or anyone else? Thanks.
Love, -MahaLinga
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Guruve
>(You therapists out there, please correct me if I have the wrong
>understanding
>of your profession, as I have never been in therapy and don't know what it
>is,
>but my center leader kept pushing me to go to therapy whenever I told
>him/her/it I wanted to leave SY.)
>
>Regards,
>Billy
>
>
You should have listened to Him/Her.
With love and understanding,
Guruve
Satdesh
On 6/26/98, Billy writes regarding the Jeff Masson book:
>I don't have the book and was recounting the incident from memory, so please
>correct any errors or omissions on my part.
Billy, I should probably correct the possibility of a false interpretation on
my part. Masson did not say anything unkind about Papa Ram Das and (especially
since I respect this saint myself) I would not want to leave the impression
that the book casts him in a dim light. Masson does appear to have a high
regard for Papa RD. Masson and his father went to visit PRD at the latter's
ashram as I recall. Masson's father indicated to Jeff that PRD was a saint.
When they arrived they were informed that they would be honored with the prasad
of the guru's footbath water [I think it was the effluent from the ceremony
where the guru's feet are ritually bathed]. At that point Masson (jr) got very
nervous and agitated at the prospect of having to do such a disgusting thing.
His disgust with this traditional practice did not reflect on his regard for
Papa RD however.
In a pre-scientific society where people don't understand the infectious origin
of (many) diseases and the presence of infectious agents (bacteria, fungi,
parasites, etc) on dirty feet, the idea of drinking such liquid would not seem
unpleasant in the least. I think it would be difficult for a person armed with
modern knowledge of such matters to truly be able to enter into the spirit of
such a ceremony. [In addition, this ceremony to me carries the psychological
equivalent of kissing the guru's feet. You're drinking the water that has been
poured over the guru's dirty feet.] Again, possibly ok in the case of a saintly
man like PRD and if your not bothered by the septic nature of the whole affair.
I have an old book with a drawing of an English pilgrim to the Vatican bending
down to kiss the pope's foot (it was Pope Leo XIII who died in the early 20th
century). These extreme obsequious gestures are inappropriate to modern
spiritual practice, IMO. The modern popes have cut a lot of this stuff out.
The current pope, for instance, refuses to be carried aloft in the sedia
gestatoria (even though many catholics requested that he retain this
"traditional" practice).
Back to Masson's book - it burst another of my bubbles. Paul Bruton's book
"Search in Secret India" was one of the first books on eastern spirituality
that I read almost 30 years ago. The book had a spellbinding effect on me. A
few years after I read that book I read some of the early works of Frank Jones.
He referred often to Ramana and the name and photo seemed vaguely reminiscent.
I then read the 'Search' again and enjoyed it all the more. I do hope PB was
not embellishing his account with fictional material. The vivid and somewhat
eerie account of his meeting with Hazrat Babajan still stands out in my mind
(but I always wished they would provide better photos of Babajan and the other
saints depicted in the book. In all the copies I have seen the photos are very
blurry.]
Sincerely,
Satdesh
Annielori9
>Do you know anything about NLP (Neurolinguistic Programming)?
Interesting you should bring this up. When I went to GSP many years ago, I was
asked by a couple that taught NPL to take some books on the subject to the
swamis. I glanced through the books and they seemed quite simplistic. I don't
think they were by the German author you mentioned.
All of which means that Siddha Yoga has no doubt incorporated some of the
techniques from NPL into courses etc.
AL
Shawdan
In article <199806271723...@ladder03.news.aol.com>,
annie...@aol.com (Annielori9) writes:
>All of which means that Siddha Yoga has no doubt incorporated some of the
>techniques from NPL into courses etc.
>
>
Some big NLP teachers are SY devotees. Anthony Robbins of informercial fame is
a big NLP guy. Werner Erhard used a lot of NLP stuff. I took a course in it
at the So. Falls. ashram. Not impressed - I thought it was basically one more
presentation of manipulative techniques for acting and looking like you have
total control over everyone and everything - a kind of pretentiously
psychological sales technique to get other people to buy what you're selling.
Not for me.
RTuttle419
I don't know about the German you mentioned but there is a man in Princeton, NJ
by the name of Dr. Les Fehmi who does a process called "Open Focus" and it can
help one to achieve that zen-like state of equal vision of all things. Good
guy, not culty at all. Has a website.