can't handle it.

[wolfie of confuzzled]

gonna spoiler for SI

spoilers should be poems
that rhyme
not a random
set of words
that have no sense
of time.
but why should spoilers be fun
when I'm coming
undone
the whole point
is that it stinks
don't you think?
so now
this spoiler
is complete.

I would feel better if I cut. I would. I don't get why it's such a big deal

and T says if I'm cutting it means we aren't ready to talk about stuff.
But that feels like a trick. And more pressure. So if I cut, the others
will be even madder at me, because t will think we aren't ready

and I tried emailing her but that didn't really help.

we have a bump/bruise on our forehead and if it wasn't in such an
obvious place I'd just mess with that

and astri is going to say it's a diversion but it's not.

they aren't going to back off this time. the nightmares are just getting
worse. and other things happening too. so I've been trying to tell t
some stuff, but I can't go as fast as some of them wnat. they don't get
it. we can't go that fast. we couldn't even write a certain word in our
email to t. so we can't go that fast but they are pushing and pushing.

maybe hurting the body is just my way of pushing back

and I sort of need to see it.

[disambiguation]

Hi.

I want to understand why you don;t want to go as fast.
it's ok that you don't. But maybe you could explain why you don;t so I understand?
what do you "need to see?"
Evidence that you are mad that you have to do this?

[jill]

In article <a20jq7...@mid.individual.net>,

wolfie of confuzzled <nospamsometi...@gmail.com> wrote:
>gonna spoiler for SI
>
>spoilers should be poems
>that rhyme
>not a random
>set of words
>that have no sense
>of time.
>but why should spoilers be fun
>when I'm coming
>undone
>the whole point
>is that it stinks
>don't you think?
>so now
>this spoiler
>is complete.
>
>I would feel better if I cut. I would. I don't get why it's such a big deal
>
>and T says if I'm cutting it means we aren't ready to talk about stuff.
>But that feels like a trick. And more pressure. So if I cut, the others
>will be even madder at me, because t will think we aren't ready

I don't agree with your t'pist. Cutting, imo, is a habitual response
to stress that has been learned. It might be other things as well, but
at a basic level it is this. So, if you feel like cutting but fight
the urge and try other things instead, that is learning to re-wire the
habit. If you are trying other things AND cutting, that can also be
re-wiring.

We both cut _and_ talked about stuff. We had agreements in place
inside and out that the damage couldn't be serious and that at least
one insider was in charge of making sure the body stayed safe, but
making 'superficial scratches' (the term the hosp put in the chart)
was clearly not endangering the body and it allowed us to both talk
AND let off internal pressure at the same time.

It might be that you personally need to find a new way of getting the
needs met that result in cutting. You might be doing what I describe,
cutting to release internal pressure and decrease anxiety. (and by you
I mean you personally, not you as a system) and it might be time for
you personally to take the risk of finding a new coping mechanism. It
is friggin unbelievably hard to do (probably like giving up nicotine
or the like in terms of intensity of addiction) but it can be done.

I haven't cut in years now... I think the last time was in the late
90s. Every so often a fleeting thought of it flits through my mind,
sort of like a memory or a 'hmm, what if...' sort of thing. Nothing
planned, nothing focused. But I have learned so many better ways to
reduce the anxiety or let out pressure that cutting is just not
necessary any more. I'm not even sure it would 'work' now...

>and I tried emailing her but that didn't really help.
>
>we have a bump/bruise on our forehead and if it wasn't in such an
>obvious place I'd just mess with that
>
>and astri is going to say it's a diversion but it's not.

Well, it might be, but it might also be a way to reduce
anxiety/tension. Facing the anxiety head on might be too much right
now, so you have to find a way to tone it down and let it out in
little bits. There are plenty of options, you have just chosen cutting
up until now as an option that works for you. Try finding other
options and use them as well as or instead of.

>they aren't going to back off this time. the nightmares are just getting
>worse. and other things happening too. so I've been trying to tell t
>some stuff, but I can't go as fast as some of them wnat. they don't get
>it. we can't go that fast. we couldn't even write a certain word in our
>email to t. so we can't go that fast but they are pushing and pushing.

Yep, sounds like more internal cooperation is definitely needed here!
People need to work TOGETHER on this. Or at the very least need to
figure out how to block some of you from being involved while others
do some work in t'py. We had an inside safe room. As needed insiders
could hang out in the room (locked, with guards) and be safe while
others did the hard work. Then, later on, we could have an inside
meeting and everyone could be brought up to speed.

Your t'pist should be helping you all develop this. If not, remind her
that it is necessary and get her working on it.

>maybe hurting the body is just my way of pushing back
>
>and I sort of need to see it.

Yes, and/or it is just venting. Like when you are really really
frustrated you STOMP or yell or whatever. Insiders need to stop
pushing and other insiders need to cooperate to let stuff happen at a
reasonable speed and not stay locked up. It's a balancing act.

Hmm, one idea might be to do something like 'we will tell t'pist x
today and then we will NOT think about x for two days after' or 'we
will tell t'pist about y and then we get to go for a nice long walk
and read a good book after the session' So you do the hard work and
get a reward for it.

Rainbow Colors (Jill)
--
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
The colors blend, the edges soften. Swirling and mixing
we are becoming white light.
ji...@tuells.org

[stella nona]

On May 22, 2:38 pm, j...@tuells.org (jill) wrote:
> In article <a20jq7Fqi...@mid.individual.net>,

>                         j...@tuells.org



did you ever try doing art to release feelings?
it helped us

[astri]

On Mon, 21 May 2012, wolfie of confuzzled wrote:

> gonna spoiler for SI
>
> spoilers should be poems
> that rhyme
> not a random
> set of words
> that have no sense
> of time.
> but why should spoilers be fun
> when I'm coming
> undone
> the whole point
> is that it stinks
> don't you think?
> so now
> this spoiler
> is complete.
>
> I would feel better if I cut. I would. I don't get why it's such a
> big deal

regret that you feel so bad

> and T says if I'm cutting it means we aren't ready to talk about
> stuff.

why?

how are you going to learn to deal with the feelings and the stuff if
you can't talk about it until after you know how to deal with the
feelings and the stuff?

> But that feels like a trick. And more pressure. So if I cut, the
> others will be even madder at me, because t will think we aren't
> ready

ick

think this is worth discussing with t

> and I tried emailing her but that didn't really help.

regret

> we have a bump/bruise on our forehead and if it wasn't in such an
> obvious place I'd just mess with that
>
> and astri is going to say it's a diversion but it's not.

i am?

what's it a diversion from?

> they aren't going to back off this time. the nightmares are just
> getting worse.

:(

> and other things happening too.

what other things?

> so I've been trying to tell t some stuff, but I can't go as fast as
> some of them wnat.

frustrating

> they don't get it. we can't go that fast. we couldn't even write a
> certain word in our email to t. so we can't go that fast but they
> are pushing and pushing.

do they really want you to go "fast?"

> maybe hurting the body is just my way of pushing back

that could be

> and I sort of need to see it.

what would it look like?

-- astri

======================
to email send to astri
======================
at volcano dot org
======================

[fuzzy of confuzzled]

wolfie got mixed up

t wasn't talking to wolfie about that. t was talking to others of us. t
was saying if we talking about so much stuff that wolfie feels like she
has to cut to cope, then we going to fast.

[wolfie of confuzzled]

Because we can't handle going fast. because if we go fast we will get
flooded. because we have to be able to function. because if we go fast
we aren't actually processing.

> what do you "need to see?"

I don't know how to explain it. I need to see hurt on the outside

> Evidence that you are mad that you have to do this?

no

[astri]

ah

that makes more sense

[wolfie of confuzzled]

well, we've gone more than a year without si before. I guess we were
using eating disorder stuff than. we've pretty broken the habitual
behavior aspect of it.

for me the thoughts are still habitual

>
> We both cut _and_ talked about stuff. We had agreements in place
> inside and out that the damage couldn't be serious and that at least
> one insider was in charge of making sure the body stayed safe, but
> making 'superficial scratches' (the term the hosp put in the chart)
> was clearly not endangering the body and it allowed us to both talk
> AND let off internal pressure at the same time.
>

the others don't want to do this. guess I've scared them too much with
my behaviors in the past :/

> It might be that you personally need to find a new way of getting the
> needs met that result in cutting. You might be doing what I describe,
> cutting to release internal pressure and decrease anxiety. (and by you
> I mean you personally, not you as a system) and it might be time for
> you personally to take the risk of finding a new coping mechanism. It
> is friggin unbelievably hard to do (probably like giving up nicotine
> or the like in terms of intensity of addiction) but it can be done.
>

well...maybe that is part of the point. because we've mostly broken the
habit and they don't want it coming back

> I haven't cut in years now... I think the last time was in the late
> 90s. Every so often a fleeting thought of it flits through my mind,
> sort of like a memory or a 'hmm, what if...' sort of thing. Nothing
> planned, nothing focused. But I have learned so many better ways to
> reduce the anxiety or let out pressure that cutting is just not
> necessary any more. I'm not even sure it would 'work' now...
>

yeah, I figure I'll always have the thoughts

>> and I tried emailing her but that didn't really help.
>>
>> we have a bump/bruise on our forehead and if it wasn't in such an
>> obvious place I'd just mess with that
>>
>> and astri is going to say it's a diversion but it's not.
>
> Well, it might be, but it might also be a way to reduce
> anxiety/tension. Facing the anxiety head on might be too much right
> now, so you have to find a way to tone it down and let it out in
> little bits. There are plenty of options, you have just chosen cutting
> up until now as an option that works for you. Try finding other
> options and use them as well as or instead of.
>

it's never the first thing i do anymore.I guess for me it is about
toning down the intensity.

>> they aren't going to back off this time. the nightmares are just getting
>> worse. and other things happening too. so I've been trying to tell t
>> some stuff, but I can't go as fast as some of them wnat. they don't get
>> it. we can't go that fast. we couldn't even write a certain word in our
>> email to t. so we can't go that fast but they are pushing and pushing.
>
> Yep, sounds like more internal cooperation is definitely needed here!
> People need to work TOGETHER on this. Or at the very least need to
> figure out how to block some of you from being involved while others
> do some work in t'py. We had an inside safe room. As needed insiders
> could hang out in the room (locked, with guards) and be safe while
> others did the hard work. Then, later on, we could have an inside
> meeting and everyone could be brought up to speed.
>

oh. I should have asked t about this

we saw her today but I didn't talk. But then I just emailed her a bunch
of questions. Maybe I will ask her about this

she told them they need to trust me. :O

> Your t'pist should be helping you all develop this. If not, remind her
> that it is necessary and get her working on it.
>

well, we've never talked about a safe room or anything like that. she's
been talking lots about us being will to accept each others reality.
something like that. And taking care of the little ones :P

>> maybe hurting the body is just my way of pushing back
>>
>> and I sort of need to see it.
>
> Yes, and/or it is just venting. Like when you are really really
> frustrated you STOMP or yell or whatever. Insiders need to stop
> pushing and other insiders need to cooperate to let stuff happen at a
> reasonable speed and not stay locked up. It's a balancing act.
>

that too but it helps me to see marks on the body

> Hmm, one idea might be to do something like 'we will tell t'pist x
> today and then we will NOT think about x for two days after' or 'we
> will tell t'pist about y and then we get to go for a nice long walk
> and read a good book after the session' So you do the hard work and
> get a reward for it.
>

we can try some of that

t says she can lock stuff up for us.

And I been telling her more what we can and can't talk about and she's
paying attention to that and saying the others should too

[wolfie of confuzzled]

On 5/23/2012 4:17 PM, astri wrote:

> On Mon, 21 May 2012, wolfie of confuzzled wrote:
>
>> gonna spoiler for SI
>>
>> spoilers should be poems
>> that rhyme
>> not a random
>> set of words
>> that have no sense
>> of time.
>> but why should spoilers be fun
>> when I'm coming
>> undone
>> the whole point
>> is that it stinks
>> don't you think?
>> so now
>> this spoiler
>> is complete.
>>
>> I would feel better if I cut. I would. I don't get why it's such a
>> big deal
>
> regret that you feel so bad
>

I was just whining

>> and T says if I'm cutting it means we aren't ready to talk about
>> stuff.
>
> why?
>
> how are you going to learn to deal with the feelings and the stuff if
> you can't talk about it until after you know how to deal with the
> feelings and the stuff?
>

fuzzy says I misunderstood.

>> But that feels like a trick. And more pressure. So if I cut, the
>> others will be even madder at me, because t will think we aren't
>> ready
>
> ick
>
> think this is worth discussing with t
>

k. I sent her an email and I asked about this.

>> and I tried emailing her but that didn't really help.
>
> regret
>

maybe I just wasn't trying?

>> we have a bump/bruise on our forehead and if it wasn't in such an
>> obvious place I'd just mess with that
>>
>> and astri is going to say it's a diversion but it's not.
>
> i am?
>

that's what you usually say

> what's it a diversion from?
>

I don't think it is

>> they aren't going to back off this time. the nightmares are just
>> getting worse.
>
> :(
>

oh well

>> and other things happening too.
>
> what other things?
>

umm... well... the all freaked out and seeing the dad everywhere or
expecting him to call or show up
and...maybe we saw something but we are not talking about that

>> so I've been trying to tell t some stuff, but I can't go as fast as
>> some of them wnat.
>
> frustrating
>

guess so

>> they don't get it. we can't go that fast. we couldn't even write a
>> certain word in our email to t. so we can't go that fast but they
>> are pushing and pushing.
>
> do they really want you to go "fast?"
>

maybe?

some of them definitely want to go faster than I am willing to go.

>> maybe hurting the body is just my way of pushing back
>
> that could be
>

it gets there attention

>> and I sort of need to see it.
>
> what would it look like?
>

ugly and painful
And fresh

[wolfie of confuzzled]

seems like she said it to me too, but maybe she didn't know it was me then?

[astri]

On Wed, 23 May 2012, wolfie of confuzzled wrote:
> On 5/23/2012 4:17 PM, astri wrote:
>> On Mon, 21 May 2012, wolfie of confuzzled wrote:
>>
>>> gonna spoiler for SI
>>>
>>> spoilers should be poems
>>> that rhyme
>>> not a random
>>> set of words
>>> that have no sense
>>> of time.
>>> but why should spoilers be fun
>>> when I'm coming
>>> undone
>>> the whole point
>>> is that it stinks
>>> don't you think?
>>> so now
>>> this spoiler
>>> is complete.
>>>
>>> I would feel better if I cut. I would. I don't get why it's such a
>>> big deal
>>
>> regret that you feel so bad
>>
> I was just whining

nah

>>> and T says if I'm cutting it means we aren't ready to talk about
>>> stuff.
>>
>> why?
>>
>> how are you going to learn to deal with the feelings and the stuff
>> if you can't talk about it until after you know how to deal with the
>> feelings and the stuff?
>>
> fuzzy says I misunderstood.

ya, saw that
what do you think about what fuzzy said t said?

>>> But that feels like a trick. And more pressure. So if I cut, the
>>> others will be even madder at me, because t will think we aren't
>>> ready
>>
>> ick
>>
>> think this is worth discussing with t
>>
> k. I sent her an email and I asked about this.

good

>>> and I tried emailing her but that didn't really help.
>>
>> regret
>>
> maybe I just wasn't trying?

always seems to me like you're trying

>>> we have a bump/bruise on our forehead and if it wasn't in such an
>>> obvious place I'd just mess with that
>>>
>>> and astri is going to say it's a diversion but it's not.
>>
>> i am?
>>
> that's what you usually say

oh
think i say that about habitual behaviors

>> what's it a diversion from?
>>
> I don't think it is

k

>>> they aren't going to back off this time. the nightmares are just
>>> getting worse.
>>
>> :(
>>
> oh well

regret

>>> and other things happening too.
>>
>> what other things?
>>
> umm... well... the all freaked out and seeing the dad everywhere or
> expecting him to call or show up

ick

> and...maybe we saw something but we are not talking about that

regret

>>> so I've been trying to tell t some stuff, but I can't go as fast as
>>> some of them wnat.
>>
>> frustrating
>>
> guess so
>
>>> they don't get it. we can't go that fast. we couldn't even write a
>>> certain word in our email to t. so we can't go that fast but they
>>> are pushing and pushing.
>>
>> do they really want you to go "fast?"
>>
> maybe?
>
> some of them definitely want to go faster than I am willing to go.

k

>>> maybe hurting the body is just my way of pushing back
>>
>> that could be
>>
> it gets there attention

maybe even talking about hurting the body without actually doing it
gets their attention, too?

>>> and I sort of need to see it.
>>
>> what would it look like?
>>
> ugly and painful
> And fresh

puts it outside

[jill]

In article <ccd5140e-8159-46f3...@d33g2000yqa.googlegroups.com>,
stella nona <stellanona...@gmail.com> wrote:

>On May 22, 2:38=A0pm, j...@tuells.org (jill) wrote:
>> In article <a20jq7Fqi...@mid.individual.net>,

>> wolfie of confuzzled =A0<nospamsometimesknownas...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> >gonna spoiler for SI
>>
>> >spoilers should be poems
>> >that rhyme
>> >not a random
>> >set of words
>> >that have no sense
>> >of time.
>> >but why should spoilers be fun
>> >when I'm coming
>> >undone
>> >the whole point
>> >is that it stinks
>> >don't you think?
>> >so now
>> >this spoiler
>> >is complete.
>>

>> >I would feel better if I cut. I would. I don't get why it's such a big d=

>did you ever try doing art to release feelings?
>it helped us

Art is one of those things that _I_ never tried but others did. It is
very powerful, but it doesn't work well for me because I can't stay in
my head while doing it (duh, that's sort of the point!) and if I can't
use words to discuss it, I sort of flounder around. I am getting
better now, but in the past others did the art t'py type stuff and it
worked well for them. I am left now with a good appreciation of art
and an interest in very realistic art so that is good :)

For the others inside art was very powerful and helpful if it could be
shared in some way. Just to do art to do art didn't seem to lead
anywhere. So they often showed the t'pist what they did or talked
about art with the t'pist. Unlike music, which could be useful to all
of us internally without needing to share it externally (or we could,
either worked).

Rainbow Colors (Jill)
--
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
The colors blend, the edges soften. Swirling and mixing
we are becoming white light.

ji...@tuells.org

[wolfie of confuzzled]

felt like it

>
>>>> and T says if I'm cutting it means we aren't ready to talk about
>>>> stuff.
>>>
>>> why?
>>>
>>> how are you going to learn to deal with the feelings and the stuff
>>> if you can't talk about it until after you know how to deal with the
>>> feelings and the stuff?
>>>
>> fuzzy says I misunderstood.
>
> ya, saw that
> what do you think about what fuzzy said t said?
>

I don't know. I guess if that's really what she meant that's kind of
cool? I don't know. it's weird.

>>>> But that feels like a trick. And more pressure. So if I cut, the
>>>> others will be even madder at me, because t will think we aren't
>>>> ready
>>>
>>> ick
>>>
>>> think this is worth discussing with t
>>>
>> k. I sent her an email and I asked about this.
>
> good
>

she replied and said she'd answer later. that was on wednesday

>>>> and I tried emailing her but that didn't really help.
>>>
>>> regret
>>>
>> maybe I just wasn't trying?
>
> always seems to me like you're trying
>

dunno

>>>> we have a bump/bruise on our forehead and if it wasn't in such an
>>>> obvious place I'd just mess with that
>>>>
>>>> and astri is going to say it's a diversion but it's not.
>>>
>>> i am?
>>>
>> that's what you usually say
>
> oh
> think i say that about habitual behaviors
>

I don't understand

>>> what's it a diversion from?
>>>
>> I don't think it is
>
> k
>
>>>> they aren't going to back off this time. the nightmares are just
>>>> getting worse.
>>>
>>> :(
>>>
>> oh well
>
> regret
>

we actually really slept last night and didn't have full on nightmares.
maybe some not nice dreams but that's it!

>>>> and other things happening too.
>>>
>>> what other things?
>>>
>> umm... well... the all freaked out and seeing the dad everywhere or
>> expecting him to call or show up

>
> ick
>

yeah. is maybe a little better the last few days?

<...>

>>>> so I've been trying to tell t some stuff, but I can't go as fast as
>>>> some of them wnat.
>>>
>>> frustrating
>>>
>> guess so
>>
>>>> they don't get it. we can't go that fast. we couldn't even write a
>>>> certain word in our email to t. so we can't go that fast but they
>>>> are pushing and pushing.
>>>
>>> do they really want you to go "fast?"
>>>
>> maybe?
>>
>> some of them definitely want to go faster than I am willing to go.
>
> k
>
>>>> maybe hurting the body is just my way of pushing back
>>>
>>> that could be
>>>
>> it gets there attention
>
> maybe even talking about hurting the body without actually doing it
> gets their attention, too?
>

yes

>>>> and I sort of need to see it.
>>>
>>> what would it look like?
>>>
>> ugly and painful
>> And fresh
>
> puts it outside
>

guess so

[Confuzzled]

s
p
o
i
l
e

r

1
1
4234

e


disgusting awful gross bad gross disgusting disgusting disgusting us
we are awful

vile gross

we are bad
wrong
our fault

disgustingg

[Michaela]

On May 26, 9:39 am, Confuzzled <nospamsometimesknownas...@gmail.com>
wrote:

looks like a memory came up here
we not think you're disgusting or awful or gross
think disgusting awful gross things happened
sorry you're struggling so much

[Confuzzled]

think we are
think we deserve to struggle

[Confuzzled]

sorry

was an awful dream. it's the one that always makes us self-destructive.
lately we've been able to not act on that but is way hard and we go into
overdrive doing chores and yard work. don't know how to cope with those
dreams

and we can't imagine ever telling t about them. And we got all depressed
thinking we'd never get better because we can't tell. was a mess.

ended up contacting an online hotline. talked to a lady. cried lots.
guess it maybe helped. after we were done we took a xanax and emailed t.

we didn't tell t details but we told her more then we've said. About
feelings and stuff. And we told her.. before there's never been a face.
this time there was. And it was the dad's face

we been doing yard work.exhausted now. And house a mess. we did yard but
not house. ick.

and t answered our email and now we feel like crying again. she said we
can get better even if we don't tell her details. she said...it's not us
that's bad. she says if we were bad like we think, than the dreams
wouldn't make us want to be dead. that we feel so bad because it's bad
stuff that happened to us... more or less that's what she said. we being
vague because we don't want to say too much here.

we feel sad and sick inside. And way needy.

we saw his face. it was the dad this time in the dream. the dad.

is like we want to crawl into a pile of blankies and never come out. we
all heavy and hurt and we still believe we bad but now we got all this
sad too

(we actually saying feelings in this post)

[Michaela]

On May 26, 9:16 pm, Confuzzled <nospamsometimesknownas...@gmail.com>
wrote:

glad you came back and said more.
(sorry we're so sporadic here. school n stuff has been busy.)

>
> was an awful dream.

yeah. deduced that!

it's the one that always makes us self-destructive.

ah. so you've had this one before.

> lately we've been able to not act on that

good!

>but is way hard

yeah

>and we go into
> overdrive doing chores and yard work. don't know how to cope with those
> dreams

yeah. they sound hard to cope with. sounds like you're also getting a
bit better at coming up with less harmful ways to cope.

>
> and we can't imagine ever telling t about them.

lots of stuff that you couldn't imagine telling her before, though,
that you have told.

>And we got all depressed
> thinking we'd never get better because we can't tell. was a mess.

sounds like a mess.

>
> ended up contacting an online hotline. talked to a lady. cried lots.

wow.
glad you found help. not sure we've heard about you using stuff like
hotlines before?

> guess it maybe helped. after we were done we took a xanax and emailed t.

good. so it helped you get to a point where you could take some next
steps to calm yourself and to talk with t. good!

>
> we didn't tell t details but we told her more then we've said.

yup. you're making progress lots with talking about this stuff.

> About
> feelings and stuff. And we told her.. before there's never been a face.
> this time there was. And it was the dad's face

ouch.

>
> we been doing yard work.exhausted now. And house a mess. we did yard but
> not house. ick.

ah.
overwhelming when house gets messy.

>
> and t answered our email and now we feel like crying again.

cuz she was kind?

>she said we
> can get better even if we don't tell her details.

what do you think of that?

>she said...it's not us
> that's bad. she says if we were bad like we think, than the dreams
> wouldn't make us want to be dead. that we feel so bad because it's bad
> stuff that happened to us... more or less that's what she said. we being
> vague because we don't want to say too much here.

okay. sounds like what she said was sensible.

>
> we feel sad and sick inside. And way needy.

okay to feel needy here.

>
> we saw his face. it was the dad this time in the dream. the dad.

wow. sorry to hear that this is coming up. sounds way scary. also
sounds like pieces are coming together more and more. not a pretty
picture that's coming up.

>
> is like we want to crawl into a pile of blankies and never come out.

we have felt like that lots today.

> we
> all heavy and hurt and we still believe we bad but now we got all this
> sad too

yeah. :(

>
> (we actually saying feelings in this post)- Hide quoted text -

good going!
anything you can do to self-soothe? find a nice soft blankie? pet or
play with motley? have a warm or cold drink to help orient you to now?
(We do that trick lots -- changing the sensation to warmer or cooler
and stuff to get a better sense of something in the now.)


>
> - Show quoted text -

[jill]

In article <a2do59...@mid.individual.net>,

Confuzzled <nospamsometi...@gmail.com> wrote:
>On 5/26/2012 12:44 PM, Confuzzled wrote:
>> On 5/26/2012 12:36 PM, Michaela wrote:
>>> On May 26, 9:39 am, Confuzzled<nospamsometimesknownas...@gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>> s
>>>> p
>>>> o
>>>> i
>>>> l
>>>> e
>>>>
>>>> r
>>>>
>>>> 1
>>>> 1
>>>> 4234
>>>>
>>>> e
>>>>
>>>> disgusting awful gross bad gross disgusting disgusting disgusting us
>>>> we are awful

Old tapes

>>>> vile gross
>>>>
>>>> we are bad
>>>> wrong
>>>> our fault

Definitely not true. You were a kid.

>>>> disgustingg
>>>
>>> looks like a memory came up here
>>> we not think you're disgusting or awful or gross
>>> think disgusting awful gross things happened
>>> sorry you're struggling so much
>>>
>> think we are
>> think we deserve to struggle

Pretty common reaction. Lots of people here have had that.
It's not true for them and it's not true for you.

>sorry
>
>was an awful dream. it's the one that always makes us self-destructive.
>lately we've been able to not act on that but is way hard and we go into
>overdrive doing chores and yard work. don't know how to cope with those
>dreams

Over time they get less and have less power as you work through them.
Journal, draw, music, talk to t'pist, inside work, patience.

>and we can't imagine ever telling t about them. And we got all depressed
>thinking we'd never get better because we can't tell. was a mess.

I didn't tell lots and I got better.

>ended up contacting an online hotline. talked to a lady. cried lots.
>guess it maybe helped. after we were done we took a xanax and emailed t.

Very good!!! Lots of very powerful steps. I hope you feel proud of
doing all these things cause that is what is going to help over time.

>we didn't tell t details but we told her more then we've said. About
>feelings and stuff. And we told her.. before there's never been a face.
>this time there was. And it was the dad's face

Remember, the important part of dreams is the feelings and reactions.
Focus on those. For example, you might want to get hung up on the
details (what I was wearing, where I was, temperature in room, etc)
but they might not be accurate. What was the biggest feeling that came
out of the dream? What was your reaction to the dream? Those are what
will be important in the long run. You are doing this just right!

>we been doing yard work.exhausted now. And house a mess. we did yard but
>not house. ick.

Well, you picked and did one. That is also just right. You only get 24
hours a day. In that time you decided to do yard work which is great.
Next time you can choose to do house work. *shrug*

>and t answered our email and now we feel like crying again. she said we
>can get better even if we don't tell her details. she said...it's not us
>that's bad. she says if we were bad like we think, than the dreams
>wouldn't make us want to be dead. that we feel so bad because it's bad
>stuff that happened to us... more or less that's what she said. we being
>vague because we don't want to say too much here.

I really like your t'pist! She is saying what my t'pist said :)

>we feel sad and sick inside. And way needy.

Yep, you feel this way. You aren't sick or needy, but you feel this
way. You are definitely making progress and healing.

>we saw his face. it was the dad this time in the dream. the dad.
>is like we want to crawl into a pile of blankies and never come out. we
>all heavy and hurt and we still believe we bad but now we got all this
>sad too
>
>(we actually saying feelings in this post)

Yes you are!! Very powerful and strong post! Lots of good work
happening.

[Ester of Confuzzled]

I hope school is going ok.

>>
>> was an awful dream.
>
> yeah. deduced that!
>
> it's the one that always makes us self-destructive.
>
> ah. so you've had this one before.
>

Not the exact same dream, but we've had that type of dream over and over.
<..>

>>
>> and we can't imagine ever telling t about them.
>
> lots of stuff that you couldn't imagine telling her before, though,
> that you have told.
>

I'm scared to tell her though. And the others may get mad. I decided
it's ok if they get mad at me, but I'm still scared. And I don't want T
to hate any of them.

>> And we got all depressed
>> thinking we'd never get better because we can't tell. was a mess.
>
> sounds like a mess.
>

If I went away maybe it would get better.

>>
>> ended up contacting an online hotline. talked to a lady. cried lots.
>
> wow.
> glad you found help. not sure we've heard about you using stuff like
> hotlines before?
>

It's something pretty new. It's an online hotline though. We don't like
phones.

>
>> guess it maybe helped. after we were done we took a xanax and emailed t.
>
> good. so it helped you get to a point where you could take some next
> steps to calm yourself and to talk with t. good!
>

I guess

>>
>> we didn't tell t details but we told her more then we've said.
>
> yup. you're making progress lots with talking about this stuff.
>

I don't know what to do. I'm really confused about whether we should be
telling T stuff.

>> About
>> feelings and stuff. And we told her.. before there's never been a face.
>> this time there was. And it was the dad's face
>
> ouch.
>

Well, it's been him in the dream before.

>>
>> we been doing yard work.exhausted now. And house a mess. we did yard but
>> not house. ick.
>
> ah.
> overwhelming when house gets messy.
>

Some of them hate it.

>>
>> and t answered our email and now we feel like crying again.
>
> cuz she was kind?
>

I don't know why they felt that way

>> she said we
>> can get better even if we don't tell her details.
>
> what do you think of that?
>

I think they felt kind of relived

Maybe she doesn't want to know stuff. Maybe we shouldn't tell her
anything. Why would she want to hear awful stuff like that?

>> she said...it's not us
>> that's bad. she says if we were bad like we think, than the dreams
>> wouldn't make us want to be dead. that we feel so bad because it's bad
>> stuff that happened to us... more or less that's what she said. we being
>> vague because we don't want to say too much here.
>
> okay. sounds like what she said was sensible.
>

She doesn't understand though. And I don't think I can tell.

>>
>> we feel sad and sick inside. And way needy.
>
> okay to feel needy here.
>

:( I don't think so. I'm sorry, I'm not trying to be disagreeable. I
just think we probably shouldn't say stuff. It's not fair to spread our
ick around.

>>
>> we saw his face. it was the dad this time in the dream. the dad.
>
> wow. sorry to hear that this is coming up. sounds way scary. also
> sounds like pieces are coming together more and more. not a pretty
> picture that's coming up.
>

Oh well. It was never that bad. It was never like the dreams. I mean,
maybe the Dad gave us some ideas, but he didn't do that stuff.

>>
>> is like we want to crawl into a pile of blankies and never come out.
>
> we have felt like that lots today.
>

That's too bad. Are you feeling better now?

>> we
>> all heavy and hurt and we still believe we bad but now we got all this
>> sad too
>
> yeah. :(
>
>>
>> (we actually saying feelings in this post)- Hide quoted text -
>
> good going!
> anything you can do to self-soothe? find a nice soft blankie? pet or
> play with motley? have a warm or cold drink to help orient you to now?
> (We do that trick lots -- changing the sensation to warmer or cooler
> and stuff to get a better sense of something in the now.)
>

I don't know. Maybe they can do some of that.

[astri]

get that

>>>>> and T says if I'm cutting it means we aren't ready to talk about
>>>>> stuff.
>>>>
>>>> why?
>>>>
>>>> how are you going to learn to deal with the feelings and the stuff
>>>> if you can't talk about it until after you know how to deal with
>>>> the feelings and the stuff?
>>>>
>>> fuzzy says I misunderstood.
>>
>> ya, saw that
>> what do you think about what fuzzy said t said?
>>
> I don't know. I guess if that's really what she meant that's kind of
> cool? I don't know. it's weird.

i think your t is cool

>>>>> But that feels like a trick. And more pressure. So if I cut, the
>>>>> others will be even madder at me, because t will think we aren't
>>>>> ready
>>>>
>>>> ick
>>>>
>>>> think this is worth discussing with t
>>>>
>>> k. I sent her an email and I asked about this.
>>
>> good
>>
> she replied and said she'd answer later. that was on wednesday

oops

>>>>> and I tried emailing her but that didn't really help.
>>>>
>>>> regret
>>>>
>>> maybe I just wasn't trying?
>>
>> always seems to me like you're trying
>>
> dunno

seems to me

>>>>> we have a bump/bruise on our forehead and if it wasn't in such an
>>>>> obvious place I'd just mess with that
>>>>>
>>>>> and astri is going to say it's a diversion but it's not.
>>>>
>>>> i am?
>>>>
>>> that's what you usually say
>>
>> oh
>> think i say that about habitual behaviors
>>
> I don't understand

if it's an easy strategy always used, it's likely to be a diversion?
like we used to use p*rging.

> we actually really slept last night and didn't have full on
> nightmares. maybe some not nice dreams but that's it!

this is very cool :)

>>>>> and other things happening too.
>>>>
>>>> what other things?
>>>>
>>> umm... well... the all freaked out and seeing the dad everywhere or
>>> expecting him to call or show up
>>
>> ick
>>
> yeah. is maybe a little better the last few days?

good

>>>>> maybe hurting the body is just my way of pushing back
>>>>
>>>> that could be
>>>>
>>> it gets there attention
>>
>> maybe even talking about hurting the body without actually doing it
>> gets their attention, too?
>>
> yes

good

>>>>> and I sort of need to see it.
>>>>
>>>> what would it look like?
>>>>
>>> ugly and painful
>>> And fresh
>>
>> puts it outside
>>
> guess so

k

[astri]

regret you were feeling so bad

[astri]

need a way to seal them off
put them in some box or something

> and we can't imagine ever telling t about them. And we got all
> depressed thinking we'd never get better because we can't tell. was
> a mess.

some months ago, you couldn't imagine some of you ever talking to t,
and yet yous have. you couldn't imagine saying some of the things
you've already said to t.

> ended up contacting an online hotline. talked to a lady. cried lots.
> guess it maybe helped. after we were done we took a xanax and
> emailed t.

think you did a pretty good job coping

> we didn't tell t details but we told her more then we've said. About
> feelings and stuff. And we told her.. before there's never been a
> face. this time there was. And it was the dad's face

regret

> we been doing yard work.exhausted now. And house a mess. we did yard
> but not house. ick.
>
> and t answered our email and now we feel like crying again. she said
> we can get better even if we don't tell her details. she said...it's
> not us that's bad. she says if we were bad like we think, than the
> dreams wouldn't make us want to be dead. that we feel so bad because
> it's bad stuff that happened to us... more or less that's what she
> said. we being vague because we don't want to say too much here.

yeah, it isn't you that's bad

> we feel sad and sick inside. And way needy.

remember those feelings
ick

> we saw his face. it was the dad this time in the dream. the dad.

:(

> is like we want to crawl into a pile of blankies and never come out.
> we all heavy and hurt and we still believe we bad but now we got all
> this sad too

have a blankie

> (we actually saying feelings in this post)

good job

[astri]

On Mon, 28 May 2012, Ester of Confuzzled wrote:
> On 5/26/2012 10:53 PM, Michaela wrote:
>> On May 26, 9:16 pm, Confuzzled<nospamsometimesknownas...@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>>>>> s
>>>>>> p
>>>>>> o
>>>>>> i
>>>>>> l
>>>>>> e
>>>
>>>>>> r
>>>
>>>>>> 1
>>>>>> 1
>>>>>> 4234
>>>
>>>>>> e
>>>

>>> was an awful dream.
>>
>> yeah. deduced that!
>>
>> it's the one that always makes us self-destructive.
>>
>> ah. so you've had this one before.
>>
> Not the exact same dream, but we've had that type of dream over and
> over.
<..>
>>>
>>> and we can't imagine ever telling t about them.
>>
>> lots of stuff that you couldn't imagine telling her before, though,
>> that you have told.
>>
> I'm scared to tell her though. And the others may get mad. I decided
> it's ok if they get mad at me, but I'm still scared. And I don't
> want T to hate any of them.

don't think she'll hate any of them

>>> And we got all depressed
>>> thinking we'd never get better because we can't tell. was a mess.
>>
>> sounds like a mess.
>>
> If I went away maybe it would get better.

doubt that

>>> ended up contacting an online hotline. talked to a lady. cried
>>> lots.
>>
>> wow.
>> glad you found help. not sure we've heard about you using stuff like
>> hotlines before?
>>
> It's something pretty new. It's an online hotline though. We don't
> like phones.

hadn't heard of online hotlines

>>> guess it maybe helped. after we were done we took a xanax and
>>> emailed t.
>>
>> good. so it helped you get to a point where you could take some next
>> steps to calm yourself and to talk with t. good!
>>
> I guess
>>>
>>> we didn't tell t details but we told her more then we've said.
>>
>> yup. you're making progress lots with talking about this stuff.
>>
> I don't know what to do. I'm really confused about whether we should
> be telling T stuff.

we've always had to tell t stuff in order to make progress

>>> About feelings and stuff. And we told her.. before there's never
>>> been a face. this time there was. And it was the dad's face
>>
>> ouch.
>>
> Well, it's been him in the dream before.

but they hadn't realized that?

>>> we been doing yard work.exhausted now. And house a mess. we did
>>> yard but not house. ick.
>>
>> ah.
>> overwhelming when house gets messy.
>>
> Some of them hate it.
>>>
>>> and t answered our email and now we feel like crying again.
>>
>> cuz she was kind?
>>
> I don't know why they felt that way
>
>>> she said we
>>> can get better even if we don't tell her details.
>>
>> what do you think of that?
>>
> I think they felt kind of relived
>
> Maybe she doesn't want to know stuff. Maybe we shouldn't tell her
> anything. Why would she want to hear awful stuff like that?

think she's willing to hear anything that you need to say in order to
get better. she's there to hear stuff like that because she wants to
help people.

>>> she said...it's not us that's bad. she says if we were bad like we
>>> think, than the dreams wouldn't make us want to be dead. that we
>>> feel so bad because it's bad stuff that happened to us... more or
>>> less that's what she said. we being vague because we don't want to
>>> say too much here.
>>
>> okay. sounds like what she said was sensible.
>>
> She doesn't understand though. And I don't think I can tell.

what doesn't she understand?

>>> we feel sad and sick inside. And way needy.
>>
>> okay to feel needy here.
>>
> :( I don't think so. I'm sorry, I'm not trying to be disagreeable. I
> just think we probably shouldn't say stuff. It's not fair to spread
> our ick around.

you don't spread any ick around by saying stuff

>>> we saw his face. it was the dad this time in the dream. the dad.
>>
>> wow. sorry to hear that this is coming up. sounds way scary. also
>> sounds like pieces are coming together more and more. not a pretty
>> picture that's coming up.
>>
> Oh well. It was never that bad. It was never like the dreams. I mean,
> maybe the Dad gave us some ideas, but he didn't do that stuff.

how did he give you the ideas?

>>> is like we want to crawl into a pile of blankies and never come
>>> out.
>>
>> we have felt like that lots today.
>>
> That's too bad. Are you feeling better now?
>
>>> we all heavy and hurt and we still believe we bad but now we got
>>> all this sad too
>>
>> yeah. :(
>>
>>> (we actually saying feelings in this post)
>>

>> good going!
>> anything you can do to self-soothe? find a nice soft blankie? pet or
>> play with motley? have a warm or cold drink to help orient you to
>> now? (We do that trick lots -- changing the sensation to warmer or
>> cooler and stuff to get a better sense of something in the now.)
>>
> I don't know. Maybe they can do some of that.

you don't self-soothe?

[Confuzzled]

On 5/29/2012 9:34 AM, astri wrote:
> On Sat, 26 May 2012, Confuzzled wrote:
>> On 5/26/2012 12:44 PM, Confuzzled wrote:
>>> On 5/26/2012 12:36 PM, Michaela wrote:
>>>> On May 26, 9:39 am, Confuzzled<nospamsometimesknownas...@gmail.com>

>> is like we want to crawl into a pile of blankies and never come out.
>> we all heavy and hurt and we still believe we bad but now we got all
>> this sad too
>
> have a blankie
>

ty

can we just hide here?
we told t stuff. stuff we never ever said
t talked to us about stuff too
we just wanna hide
want all the feelings to go way
but guess maybe we don't wanna be all alone.
t came and sat on the couch with us for a bit cuz she was showing us
something. that was nice
I guess t really does like us but i dont know why

>> (we actually saying feelings in this post)
>
> good job
>

don't wanna have feelings now
want them to go way

[Confuzzled]

we just tried to actually focus on posts but can't

last night we had the hardest t session ever
wolfie talked to t for a while
then ester did

we worn out
is more than that but don't got words
we feel brittle?
And sort of like we waiting, but don't know for what

wish we could read other people's posts and give good replies
wish we could reply to the thoughtful replies we get to our posts.

[wolfie of confuzzled]

On 5/28/2012 12:43 AM, Ester of Confuzzled wrote:
> On 5/26/2012 10:53 PM, Michaela wrote:
>> On May 26, 9:16 pm, Confuzzled<nospamsometimesknownas...@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>> On 5/26/2012 12:44 PM, Confuzzled wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>> On 5/26/2012 12:36 PM, Michaela wrote:
>>>>> On May 26, 9:39 am, Confuzzled<nospamsometimesknownas...@gmail.com>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>> s
>>>>>> p
>>>>>> o
>>>>>> i
>>>>>> l
>>>>>> e
>>>
>>>>>> r
>>>
>>>>>> 1
>>>>>> 1
>>>>>> 4234
>>>
>>>>>> e
>>>

ester if you don't drop things I will c*t and it will be all your fault
not mine.

stop talking. stop thinking. stopit. you have to stop.

[astri]

On Thu, 31 May 2012, Confuzzled wrote:
> On 5/29/2012 9:34 AM, astri wrote:
>> On Sat, 26 May 2012, Confuzzled wrote:
>
>>> is like we want to crawl into a pile of blankies and never come
>>> out. we all heavy and hurt and we still believe we bad but now we
>>> got all this sad too
>>
>> have a blankie
>>
> ty
>
> can we just hide here?

sure

> we told t stuff. stuff we never ever said

wow

> t talked to us about stuff too
> we just wanna hide
> want all the feelings to go way

understand

> but guess maybe we don't wanna be all alone.

is hard to

> t came and sat on the couch with us for a bit cuz she was showing us
> something. that was nice

:)

> I guess t really does like us but i dont know why

guess you're likeable

>>> (we actually saying feelings in this post)
>>
>> good job
>>
> don't wanna have feelings now
> want them to go way

understand

[astri]

On Thu, 31 May 2012, Confuzzled wrote:

> we just tried to actually focus on posts but can't
>
> last night we had the hardest t session ever
> wolfie talked to t for a while
> then ester did

wow

> we worn out

i bet

> is more than that but don't got words
> we feel brittle?
> And sort of like we waiting, but don't know for what

btdt

> wish we could read other people's posts and give good replies
> wish we could reply to the thoughtful replies we get to our posts.

eventually, you will be able to do that again

[gathring]

On 5/21/2012 9:42 PM, wolfie of confuzzled wrote:
> gonna spoiler for SI
>
> spoilers should be poems
> that rhyme
> not a random
> set of words
> that have no sense
> of time.
> but why should spoilers be fun
> when I'm coming
> undone
> the whole point
> is that it stinks
> don't you think?
> so now
> this spoiler
> is complete.
>
> I would feel better if I cut. I would. I don't get why it's such a big deal
>

> and T says if I'm cutting it means we aren't ready to talk about stuff.

> But that feels like a trick. And more pressure. So if I cut, the others
> will be even madder at me, because t will think we aren't ready
>

> and I tried emailing her but that didn't really help.
>

> we have a bump/bruise on our forehead and if it wasn't in such an
> obvious place I'd just mess with that
>
> and astri is going to say it's a diversion but it's not.
>

> they aren't going to back off this time. the nightmares are just getting

> worse. and other things happening too. so I've been trying to tell t
> some stuff, but I can't go as fast as some of them wnat. they don't get

> it. we can't go that fast. we couldn't even write a certain word in our
> email to t. so we can't go that fast but they are pushing and pushing.
>

> maybe hurting the body is just my way of pushing back
>

> and I sort of need to see it.

for us, when it was a need to see thing, we used markers. not the wash
off kind either. helped, but maybe not everytime or everyone.

[gathring]

On 5/22/2012 8:07 PM, stella nona wrote:

> On May 22, 2:38 pm, j...@tuells.org (jill) wrote:
>> In article<a20jq7Fqi...@mid.individual.net>,

>> wolfie of confuzzled<nospamsometimesknownas...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>> gonna spoiler for SI
>>
>>> spoilers should be poems
>>> that rhyme
>>> not a random
>>> set of words
>>> that have no sense
>>> of time.
>>> but why should spoilers be fun
>>> when I'm coming
>>> undone
>>> the whole point
>>> is that it stinks
>>> don't you think?
>>> so now
>>> this spoiler
>>> is complete.
>>
>>> I would feel better if I cut. I would. I don't get why it's such a big deal
>>
>>> and T says if I'm cutting it means we aren't ready to talk about stuff.
>>> But that feels like a trick. And more pressure. So if I cut, the others
>>> will be even madder at me, because t will think we aren't ready
>>

>>> and I tried emailing her but that didn't really help.
>>
>>> we have a bump/bruise on our forehead and if it wasn't in such an
>>> obvious place I'd just mess with that
>>
>>> and astri is going to say it's a diversion but it's not.
>>

>> Well, it might be, but it might also be a way to reduce
>> anxiety/tension. Facing the anxiety head on might be too much right
>> now, so you have to find a way to tone it down and let it out in
>> little bits. There are plenty of options, you have just chosen cutting
>> up until now as an option that works for you. Try finding other
>> options and use them as well as or instead of.
>>

>>> they aren't going to back off this time. the nightmares are just getting
>>> worse. and other things happening too. so I've been trying to tell t
>>> some stuff, but I can't go as fast as some of them wnat. they don't get
>>> it. we can't go that fast. we couldn't even write a certain word in our
>>> email to t. so we can't go that fast but they are pushing and pushing.
>>

>> Yep, sounds like more internal cooperation is definitely needed here!
>> People need to work TOGETHER on this. Or at the very least need to
>> figure out how to block some of you from being involved while others
>> do some work in t'py. We had an inside safe room. As needed insiders
>> could hang out in the room (locked, with guards) and be safe while
>> others did the hard work. Then, later on, we could have an inside
>> meeting and everyone could be brought up to speed.
>>
>> Your t'pist should be helping you all develop this. If not, remind her
>> that it is necessary and get her working on it.
>>

>>> maybe hurting the body is just my way of pushing back
>>
>>> and I sort of need to see it.
>>

>> Yes, and/or it is just venting. Like when you are really really
>> frustrated you STOMP or yell or whatever. Insiders need to stop
>> pushing and other insiders need to cooperate to let stuff happen at a
>> reasonable speed and not stay locked up. It's a balancing act.
>>
>> Hmm, one idea might be to do something like 'we will tell t'pist x
>> today and then we will NOT think about x for two days after' or 'we
>> will tell t'pist about y and then we get to go for a nice long walk
>> and read a good book after the session' So you do the hard work and
>> get a reward for it.
>>

>> Rainbow Colors (Jill)
>> --
>> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
>> The colors blend, the edges soften. Swirling and mixing
>> we are becoming white light.

>> j...@tuells.org

>
>
>
> did you ever try doing art to release feelings?
> it helped us

us too

[Ester of Confuzzled]

She's really nice. I guess she won't. She surprised me.

>>>> And we got all depressed
>>>> thinking we'd never get better because we can't tell. was a mess.
>>>
>>> sounds like a mess.
>>>
>> If I went away maybe it would get better.
>
> doubt that
>

They don't want me. They think it would be better.

>>>> ended up contacting an online hotline. talked to a lady. cried
>>>> lots.
>>>
>>> wow.
>>> glad you found help. not sure we've heard about you using stuff like
>>> hotlines before?
>>>
>> It's something pretty new. It's an online hotline though. We don't
>> like phones.
>
> hadn't heard of online hotlines
>

It's called rainn. www.rainn.org

>>>> guess it maybe helped. after we were done we took a xanax and
>>>> emailed t.
>>>
>>> good. so it helped you get to a point where you could take some next
>>> steps to calm yourself and to talk with t. good!
>>>
>> I guess
>>>>
>>>> we didn't tell t details but we told her more then we've said.
>>>
>>> yup. you're making progress lots with talking about this stuff.
>>>
>> I don't know what to do. I'm really confused about whether we should
>> be telling T stuff.
>
> we've always had to tell t stuff in order to make progress
>

I talked to her.

>>>> About feelings and stuff. And we told her.. before there's never
>>>> been a face. this time there was. And it was the dad's face
>>>
>>> ouch.
>>>
>> Well, it's been him in the dream before.
>
> but they hadn't realized that?
>

No

>>>> we been doing yard work.exhausted now. And house a mess. we did
>>>> yard but not house. ick.
>>>
>>> ah.
>>> overwhelming when house gets messy.
>>>
>> Some of them hate it.
>>>>
>>>> and t answered our email and now we feel like crying again.
>>>
>>> cuz she was kind?
>>>
>> I don't know why they felt that way
>>
>>>> she said we
>>>> can get better even if we don't tell her details.
>>>
>>> what do you think of that?
>>>
>> I think they felt kind of relived
>>
>> Maybe she doesn't want to know stuff. Maybe we shouldn't tell her
>> anything. Why would she want to hear awful stuff like that?
>
> think she's willing to hear anything that you need to say in order to
> get better. she's there to hear stuff like that because she wants to
> help people.
>

She said she was born to do this work.

>>>> she said...it's not us that's bad. she says if we were bad like we
>>>> think, than the dreams wouldn't make us want to be dead. that we
>>>> feel so bad because it's bad stuff that happened to us... more or
>>>> less that's what she said. we being vague because we don't want to
>>>> say too much here.
>>>
>>> okay. sounds like what she said was sensible.
>>>
>> She doesn't understand though. And I don't think I can tell.
>
> what doesn't she understand?
>

I'm afraid to say it here. But I think she figured some of it out.

>>>> we feel sad and sick inside. And way needy.
>>>
>>> okay to feel needy here.
>>>
>> :( I don't think so. I'm sorry, I'm not trying to be disagreeable. I
>> just think we probably shouldn't say stuff. It's not fair to spread
>> our ick around.
>
> you don't spread any ick around by saying stuff
>

I don't know.

>>>> we saw his face. it was the dad this time in the dream. the dad.
>>>
>>> wow. sorry to hear that this is coming up. sounds way scary. also
>>> sounds like pieces are coming together more and more. not a pretty
>>> picture that's coming up.
>>>
>> Oh well. It was never that bad. It was never like the dreams. I mean,
>> maybe the Dad gave us some ideas, but he didn't do that stuff.
>
> how did he give you the ideas?
>

He told us stuff. He told stories and things.

>>>> is like we want to crawl into a pile of blankies and never come
>>>> out.
>>>
>>> we have felt like that lots today.
>>>
>> That's too bad. Are you feeling better now?
>>
>>>> we all heavy and hurt and we still believe we bad but now we got
>>>> all this sad too
>>>
>>> yeah. :(
>>>
>>>> (we actually saying feelings in this post)
>>>
>>> good going!
>>> anything you can do to self-soothe? find a nice soft blankie? pet or
>>> play with motley? have a warm or cold drink to help orient you to
>>> now? (We do that trick lots -- changing the sensation to warmer or
>>> cooler and stuff to get a better sense of something in the now.)
>>>
>> I don't know. Maybe they can do some of that.
>
> you don't self-soothe?
>

That's what it's called? No, I don't do that.

[Ester of Confuzzled]

Hi Ashlyn

[astri]

ya, she's nice
you didn't expect her to like you?

>>>>> And we got all depressed thinking we'd never get better because
>>>>> we can't tell. was a mess.
>>>>
>>>> sounds like a mess.
>>>>
>>> If I went away maybe it would get better.
>>
>> doubt that
>>
> They don't want me. They think it would be better.

they don't want to deal with what you have to deal with

>>>>> ended up contacting an online hotline. talked to a lady. cried
>>>>> lots.
>>>>
>>>> wow.
>>>> glad you found help. not sure we've heard about you using stuff
>>>> like hotlines before?
>>>>
>>> It's something pretty new. It's an online hotline though. We don't
>>> like phones.
>>
>> hadn't heard of online hotlines
>>
> It's called rainn. www.rainn.org

ah
heard of rainn
not really as a hotline, tho
was it helpful?

>>>>> guess it maybe helped. after we were done we took a xanax and
>>>>> emailed t.
>>>>
>>>> good. so it helped you get to a point where you could take some
>>>> next steps to calm yourself and to talk with t. good!
>>>>
>>> I guess
>>>>>
>>>>> we didn't tell t details but we told her more then we've said.
>>>>
>>>> yup. you're making progress lots with talking about this stuff.
>>>>
>>> I don't know what to do. I'm really confused about whether we
>>> should be telling T stuff.
>>
>> we've always had to tell t stuff in order to make progress
>>
> I talked to her.

good for you

>>>>> About feelings and stuff. And we told her.. before there's never
>>>>> been a face. this time there was. And it was the dad's face
>>>>
>>>> ouch.
>>>>
>>> Well, it's been him in the dream before.
>>
>> but they hadn't realized that?
>>
> No

but now they do

>>>>> we been doing yard work.exhausted now. And house a mess. we did
>>>>> yard but not house. ick.
>>>>
>>>> ah.
>>>> overwhelming when house gets messy.
>>>>
>>> Some of them hate it.
>>>>>
>>>>> and t answered our email and now we feel like crying again.
>>>>
>>>> cuz she was kind?
>>>>
>>> I don't know why they felt that way
>>>
>>>>> she said we
>>>>> can get better even if we don't tell her details.
>>>>
>>>> what do you think of that?
>>>>
>>> I think they felt kind of relived
>>>
>>> Maybe she doesn't want to know stuff. Maybe we shouldn't tell her
>>> anything. Why would she want to hear awful stuff like that?
>>
>> think she's willing to hear anything that you need to say in order
>> to get better. she's there to hear stuff like that because she
>> wants to help people.
>>
> She said she was born to do this work.

feels natural to her

>>>>> she said...it's not us that's bad. she says if we were bad like
>>>>> we think, than the dreams wouldn't make us want to be dead. that
>>>>> we feel so bad because it's bad stuff that happened to us...
>>>>> more or less that's what she said. we being vague because we
>>>>> don't want to say too much here.
>>>>
>>>> okay. sounds like what she said was sensible.
>>>>
>>> She doesn't understand though. And I don't think I can tell.
>>
>> what doesn't she understand?
>>
> I'm afraid to say it here. But I think she figured some of it out.

ok

>>>>> we feel sad and sick inside. And way needy.
>>>>
>>>> okay to feel needy here.
>>>>
>>> :( I don't think so. I'm sorry, I'm not trying to be disagreeable.
>>> I just think we probably shouldn't say stuff. It's not fair to
>>> spread our ick around.
>>
>> you don't spread any ick around by saying stuff
>>
> I don't know.

i do

>>>>> we saw his face. it was the dad this time in the dream. the dad.
>>>>
>>>> wow. sorry to hear that this is coming up. sounds way scary. also
>>>> sounds like pieces are coming together more and more. not a pretty
>>>> picture that's coming up.
>>>>
>>> Oh well. It was never that bad. It was never like the dreams. I
>>> mean, maybe the Dad gave us some ideas, but he didn't do that
>>> stuff.
>>
>> how did he give you the ideas?
>>
> He told us stuff. He told stories and things.

ick stories?

>>>>> is like we want to crawl into a pile of blankies and never come
>>>>> out.
>>>>
>>>> we have felt like that lots today.
>>>>
>>> That's too bad. Are you feeling better now?
>>>
>>>>> we all heavy and hurt and we still believe we bad but now we got
>>>>> all this sad too
>>>>
>>>> yeah. :(
>>>>
>>>>> (we actually saying feelings in this post)
>>>>
>>>> good going!
>>>> anything you can do to self-soothe? find a nice soft blankie? pet or
>>>> play with motley? have a warm or cold drink to help orient you to
>>>> now? (We do that trick lots -- changing the sensation to warmer or
>>>> cooler and stuff to get a better sense of something in the now.)
>>>>
>>> I don't know. Maybe they can do some of that.
>>
>> you don't self-soothe?
>>
> That's what it's called? No, I don't do that.

do you ever do anything to help yourself feel better?

[ashlyn]

On Jun 8, 8:54 pm, Ester of Confuzzled
<nospamsometimesknownas...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi Ashlyn

Hi!

how are you?

[Ester of Confuzzled]

Well, I thought she'd be nice to me because she's nice, but I didn't
really think she'd be so nice.

And she knew stuff and talked about stuff that I didn't think she'd be
able to understand

>>>>>> And we got all depressed thinking we'd never get better because
>>>>>> we can't tell. was a mess.
>>>>>
>>>>> sounds like a mess.
>>>>>
>>>> If I went away maybe it would get better.
>>>
>>> doubt that
>>>
>> They don't want me. They think it would be better.
>
> they don't want to deal with what you have to deal with
>

I guess not. I don't blame them.

>>>>>> ended up contacting an online hotline. talked to a lady. cried
>>>>>> lots.
>>>>>
>>>>> wow.
>>>>> glad you found help. not sure we've heard about you using stuff
>>>>> like hotlines before?
>>>>>
>>>> It's something pretty new. It's an online hotline though. We don't
>>>> like phones.
>>>
>>> hadn't heard of online hotlines
>>>
>> It's called rainn. www.rainn.org
>
> ah
> heard of rainn
> not really as a hotline, tho
> was it helpful?
>

Yes, it was. It's a chat thing.

>>>>>> guess it maybe helped. after we were done we took a xanax and
>>>>>> emailed t.
>>>>>
>>>>> good. so it helped you get to a point where you could take some
>>>>> next steps to calm yourself and to talk with t. good!
>>>>>
>>>> I guess
>>>>>>
>>>>>> we didn't tell t details but we told her more then we've said.
>>>>>
>>>>> yup. you're making progress lots with talking about this stuff.
>>>>>
>>>> I don't know what to do. I'm really confused about whether we
>>>> should be telling T stuff.
>>>
>>> we've always had to tell t stuff in order to make progress
>>>
>> I talked to her.
>
> good for you
>

I guess. I don't know.
I'm really confused

>>>>>> About feelings and stuff. And we told her.. before there's never
>>>>>> been a face. this time there was. And it was the dad's face
>>>>>
>>>>> ouch.
>>>>>
>>>> Well, it's been him in the dream before.
>>>
>>> but they hadn't realized that?
>>>
>> No
>
> but now they do
>

Yes. But they are sort of forgetting.

>>>>>> we been doing yard work.exhausted now. And house a mess. we did
>>>>>> yard but not house. ick.
>>>>>
>>>>> ah.
>>>>> overwhelming when house gets messy.
>>>>>
>>>> Some of them hate it.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> and t answered our email and now we feel like crying again.
>>>>>
>>>>> cuz she was kind?
>>>>>
>>>> I don't know why they felt that way
>>>>
>>>>>> she said we
>>>>>> can get better even if we don't tell her details.
>>>>>
>>>>> what do you think of that?
>>>>>
>>>> I think they felt kind of relived
>>>>
>>>> Maybe she doesn't want to know stuff. Maybe we shouldn't tell her
>>>> anything. Why would she want to hear awful stuff like that?
>>>
>>> think she's willing to hear anything that you need to say in order
>>> to get better. she's there to hear stuff like that because she
>>> wants to help people.
>>>
>> She said she was born to do this work.
>
> feels natural to her
>

I guess so.

>>>>>> she said...it's not us that's bad. she says if we were bad like
>>>>>> we think, than the dreams wouldn't make us want to be dead. that
>>>>>> we feel so bad because it's bad stuff that happened to us... more
>>>>>> or less that's what she said. we being vague because we
>>>>>> don't want to say too much here.
>>>>>
>>>>> okay. sounds like what she said was sensible.
>>>>>
>>>> She doesn't understand though. And I don't think I can tell.
>>>
>>> what doesn't she understand?
>>>
>> I'm afraid to say it here. But I think she figured some of it out.
>
> ok

If I did end up talking about it, you guys would know it's just me and
not the others?

>
>>>>>> we feel sad and sick inside. And way needy.
>>>>>
>>>>> okay to feel needy here.
>>>>>
>>>> :( I don't think so. I'm sorry, I'm not trying to be disagreeable.
>>>> I just think we probably shouldn't say stuff. It's not fair to
>>>> spread our ick around.
>>>
>>> you don't spread any ick around by saying stuff
>>>
>> I don't know.
>
> i do
>

Okay.

>>>>>> we saw his face. it was the dad this time in the dream. the dad.
>>>>>
>>>>> wow. sorry to hear that this is coming up. sounds way scary. also
>>>>> sounds like pieces are coming together more and more. not a pretty
>>>>> picture that's coming up.
>>>>>
>>>> Oh well. It was never that bad. It was never like the dreams. I
>>>> mean, maybe the Dad gave us some ideas, but he didn't do that
>>>> stuff.
>>>
>>> how did he give you the ideas?
>>>
>> He told us stuff. He told stories and things.
>
> ick stories?
>

I guess so.
Sometimes he made it sound like it wasn't ick. Like he was just
explaining what women like and stuff.

>>>>>> is like we want to crawl into a pile of blankies and never come
>>>>>> out.
>>>>>
>>>>> we have felt like that lots today.
>>>>>
>>>> That's too bad. Are you feeling better now?
>>>>
>>>>>> we all heavy and hurt and we still believe we bad but now we got
>>>>>> all this sad too
>>>>>
>>>>> yeah. :(
>>>>>
>>>>>> (we actually saying feelings in this post)
>>>>>
>>>>> good going!
>>>>> anything you can do to self-soothe? find a nice soft blankie? pet or
>>>>> play with motley? have a warm or cold drink to help orient you to
>>>>> now? (We do that trick lots -- changing the sensation to warmer or
>>>>> cooler and stuff to get a better sense of something in the now.)
>>>>>
>>>> I don't know. Maybe they can do some of that.
>>>
>>> you don't self-soothe?
>>>
>> That's what it's called? No, I don't do that.
>
> do you ever do anything to help yourself feel better?
>

No

[Ester of Confuzzled]

On 6/8/2012 11:01 PM, ashlyn wrote:
> On Jun 8, 8:54 pm, Ester of Confuzzled
> <nospamsometimesknownas...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Hi Ashlyn
>
> Hi!
>

:) You're here

> how are you?
>

I guess I'm sad. How are you?

[astri]

On Sat, 9 Jun 2012, Ester of Confuzzled wrote:
> On 6/8/2012 10:32 PM, astri wrote:
>> On Fri, 8 Jun 2012, Ester of Confuzzled wrote:
>>> On 5/29/2012 9:56 AM, astri wrote:
>>>> On Mon, 28 May 2012, Ester of Confuzzled wrote:
>>>>> On 5/26/2012 10:53 PM, Michaela wrote:
>>>>>> On May 26, 9:16 pm,
>>>>>> Confuzzled<nospamsometimesknownas...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> s
>>>>>>>>>> p
>>>>>>>>>> o
>>>>>>>>>> i
>>>>>>>>>> l
>>>>>>>>>> e
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> r
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> 1
>>>>>>>>>> 1
>>>>>>>>>> 4234
>>>>>>>

>>>>>>> and we can't imagine ever telling t about them.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> lots of stuff that you couldn't imagine telling her before,
>>>>>> though, that you have told.
>>>>>>
>>>>> I'm scared to tell her though. And the others may get mad. I
>>>>> decided it's ok if they get mad at me, but I'm still scared. And
>>>>> I don't want T to hate any of them.
>>>>
>>>> don't think she'll hate any of them
>>>>
>>> She's really nice. I guess she won't. She surprised me.
>>
>> ya, she's nice
>> you didn't expect her to like you?
>>
> Well, I thought she'd be nice to me because she's nice, but I didn't
> really think she'd be so nice.
>
> And she knew stuff and talked about stuff that I didn't think she'd
> be able to understand

that's very cool

>>>>> If I went away maybe it would get better.
>>>>
>>>> doubt that
>>>>
>>> They don't want me. They think it would be better.
>>
>> they don't want to deal with what you have to deal with
>>
> I guess not. I don't blame them.

regret that you have that stuff to deal with

>>>> hadn't heard of online hotlines
>>>>
>>> It's called rainn. www.rainn.org
>>
>> ah
>> heard of rainn
>> not really as a hotline, tho
>> was it helpful?
>>
> Yes, it was. It's a chat thing.

k

>>>>>>> we didn't tell t details but we told her more then we've said.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> yup. you're making progress lots with talking about this stuff.
>>>>>>
>>>>> I don't know what to do. I'm really confused about whether we
>>>>> should be telling T stuff.
>>>>
>>>> we've always had to tell t stuff in order to make progress
>>>>
>>> I talked to her.
>>
>> good for you
>>
> I guess. I don't know.
> I'm really confused

it's confusing at the beginning

>>>>>>> About feelings and stuff. And we told her.. before there's
>>>>>>> never been a face. this time there was. And it was the dad's
>>>>>>> face
>>>>>>
>>>>>> ouch.
>>>>>>
>>>>> Well, it's been him in the dream before.
>>>>
>>>> but they hadn't realized that?
>>>>
>>> No
>>
>> but now they do
>>
> Yes. But they are sort of forgetting.

ah

>>>>> Maybe she doesn't want to know stuff. Maybe we shouldn't tell her
>>>>> anything. Why would she want to hear awful stuff like that?
>>>>
>>>> think she's willing to hear anything that you need to say in order
>>>> to get better. she's there to hear stuff like that because she
>>>> wants to help people.
>>>>
>>> She said she was born to do this work.
>>
>> feels natural to her
>>
> I guess so.

hard to understand, huh?

>>>>>>> she said...it's not us that's bad. she says if we were bad like
>>>>>>> we think, than the dreams wouldn't make us want to be dead.
>>>>>>> that we feel so bad because it's bad stuff that happened to
>>>>>>> us... more or less that's what she said. we being vague
>>>>>>> because we don't want to say too much here.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> okay. sounds like what she said was sensible.
>>>>>>
>>>>> She doesn't understand though. And I don't think I can tell.
>>>>
>>>> what doesn't she understand?
>>>>
>>> I'm afraid to say it here. But I think she figured some of it out.
>>
>> ok
>
> If I did end up talking about it, you guys would know it's just me
> and not the others?

most likely
especially if you sent it from your account

>>>>>>> we feel sad and sick inside. And way needy.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> okay to feel needy here.
>>>>>>
>>>>> :( I don't think so. I'm sorry, I'm not trying to be
>>>>> disagreeable. I just think we probably shouldn't say stuff.
>>>>> It's not fair to spread our ick around.
>>>>
>>>> you don't spread any ick around by saying stuff
>>>>
>>> I don't know.
>>
>> i do
>>
> Okay.
>
>>>>>>> we saw his face. it was the dad this time in the dream. the
>>>>>>> dad.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> wow. sorry to hear that this is coming up. sounds way scary.
>>>>>> also sounds like pieces are coming together more and more. not
>>>>>> a pretty picture that's coming up.
>>>>>>
>>>>> Oh well. It was never that bad. It was never like the dreams. I
>>>>> mean, maybe the Dad gave us some ideas, but he didn't do that
>>>>> stuff.
>>>>
>>>> how did he give you the ideas?
>>>>
>>> He told us stuff. He told stories and things.
>>
>> ick stories?
>>
> I guess so.
> Sometimes he made it sound like it wasn't ick. Like he was just
> explaining what women like and stuff.

that's ick for him to have explained

>>>>>>> (we actually saying feelings in this post)
>>>>>>
>>>>>> good going!
>>>>>> anything you can do to self-soothe? find a nice soft blankie?
>>>>>> pet or play with motley? have a warm or cold drink to help
>>>>>> orient you to now? (We do that trick lots -- changing the
>>>>>> sensation to warmer or cooler and stuff to get a better sense of
>>>>>> something in the now.)
>>>>>>
>>>>> I don't know. Maybe they can do some of that.
>>>>
>>>> you don't self-soothe?
>>>>
>>> That's what it's called? No, I don't do that.
>>
>> do you ever do anything to help yourself feel better?
>>
> No

do you ever want to?

[ashlyn]

On Jun 9, 11:42 am, Ester of Confuzzled

<nospamsometimesknownas...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On 6/8/2012 11:01 PM, ashlyn wrote:> On Jun 8, 8:54 pm, Ester of Confuzzled
> > <nospamsometimesknownas...@gmail.com>  wrote:
> >> Hi Ashlyn
>
> > Hi!
>
> :) You're here

yeah. i'm glad i clicked on this message. i just moved. :)

so i'm catching up. Michaela and them have been all busy with finals,
so i haven't been around as much. but i miss talking to you.

>
> > how are you?
>
> I guess I'm sad. How are you?

i'm tired!

and they have to study, i guess. :/

they finished the really difficult project, though, so that's good.

some of them have been feeling kinda fragile. i feel okay. i kinda
miss being here.

and there's stuff we can't say lots about here, but i wish we could,
cuz we want to talk about it.

and i'm scared i'm saying too much.

[astri]

On Sat, 9 Jun 2012, ashlyn wrote:

> i'm tired!
>
> and they have to study, i guess. :/
>
> they finished the really difficult project, though, so that's good.
>
> some of them have been feeling kinda fragile. i feel okay. i kinda
> miss being here.
>
> and there's stuff we can't say lots about here, but i wish we could,
> cuz we want to talk about it.
>
> and i'm scared i'm saying too much.

i don't think you said too much

[ashlyn]

On Jun 10, 10:30 pm, astri <as...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
> On Sat, 9 Jun 2012, ashlyn wrote:
> > i'm tired!
>
> > and they have to study, i guess. :/
>
> > they finished the really difficult project, though, so that's good.
>
> > some of them have been feeling kinda fragile. i feel okay. i kinda
> > miss being here.
>
> > and there's stuff we can't say lots about here, but i wish we could,
> > cuz we want to talk about it.
>
> > and i'm scared i'm saying too much.
>
> i don't think you said too much
>

thank you.

[astri]

On Mon, 11 Jun 2012, ashlyn wrote:
> On Jun 10, 10:30 pm, astri <as...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>> On Sat, 9 Jun 2012, ashlyn wrote:
>>> i'm tired!
>>
>>> and they have to study, i guess. :/
>>
>>> they finished the really difficult project, though, so that's good.
>>
>>> some of them have been feeling kinda fragile. i feel okay. i kinda
>>> miss being here.
>>
>>> and there's stuff we can't say lots about here, but i wish we could,
>>> cuz we want to talk about it.
>>
>>> and i'm scared i'm saying too much.
>>
>> i don't think you said too much
>
> thank you.

yw

[Confuzzled]

On 6/2/2012 4:26 PM, astri wrote:
> On Thu, 31 May 2012, Confuzzled wrote:
>
>> we just tried to actually focus on posts but can't
>>
>> last night we had the hardest t session ever
>> wolfie talked to t for a while
>> then ester did
>
> wow
>

ya
we still adjusting to that
we been more surface since then. know we going camping and won't have t
or email. need stuff to be calm for that

ester did email t last week and t answered

>> we worn out
>
> i bet
>
>> is more than that but don't got words
>> we feel brittle?
>> And sort of like we waiting, but don't know for what
>
> btdt
>

:P

>> wish we could read other people's posts and give good replies
>> wish we could reply to the thoughtful replies we get to our posts.
>
> eventually, you will be able to do that again
>

we here right now

[astri]

On Thu, 14 Jun 2012, Confuzzled wrote:
> On 6/2/2012 4:26 PM, astri wrote:
>> On Thu, 31 May 2012, Confuzzled wrote:
>>
>>> we just tried to actually focus on posts but can't
>>>
>>> last night we had the hardest t session ever
>>> wolfie talked to t for a while
>>> then ester did
>>
>> wow
>>
> ya
> we still adjusting to that

was a big deal

> we been more surface since then. know we going camping and won't have
> t or email. need stuff to be calm for that

of course

> ester did email t last week and t answered

another wow

>>> we worn out
>>
>> i bet
>>
>>> is more than that but don't got words
>>> we feel brittle?
>>> And sort of like we waiting, but don't know for what
>>
>> btdt
>>
> :P
>
>>> wish we could read other people's posts and give good replies
>>> wish we could reply to the thoughtful replies we get to our posts.
>>
>> eventually, you will be able to do that again
>>
> we here right now

hi

[disambiguation]

Yes.
If you make it clear who's writing.

> >
> >>>>>> we feel sad and sick inside. And way needy.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> okay to feel needy here.
> >>>>>
> >>>> :( I don't think so. I'm sorry, I'm not trying to be disagreeable.
> >>>> I just think we probably shouldn't say stuff. It's not fair to
> >>>> spread our ick around.
> >>>
> >>> you don't spread any ick around by saying stuff
> >>>
> >> I don't know.
> >
> > i do
> >
> Okay.
>
> >>>>>> we saw his face. it was the dad this time in the dream. the dad.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> wow. sorry to hear that this is coming up. sounds way scary. also
> >>>>> sounds like pieces are coming together more and more. not a pretty
> >>>>> picture that's coming up.
> >>>>>
> >>>> Oh well. It was never that bad. It was never like the dreams.

What was it like for real?

> >>>> I mean, maybe the Dad gave us some ideas, but he didn't do that
> >>>> stuff.
> >>>
> >>> how did he give you the ideas?
> >>>
> >> He told us stuff. He told stories and things.
> >
> > ick stories?
> >
> I guess so.
> Sometimes he made it sound like it wasn't ick. Like he was just
> explaining what women like and stuff.

How did you feel about that?

[Confuzzled]

On 6/10/2012 10:30 PM, astri wrote:
> On Sat, 9 Jun 2012, ashlyn wrote:
>
>> i'm tired!
>>
>> and they have to study, i guess. :/
>>
>> they finished the really difficult project, though, so that's good.
>>
>> some of them have been feeling kinda fragile. i feel okay. i kinda
>> miss being here.
>>
>> and there's stuff we can't say lots about here, but i wish we could,
>> cuz we want to talk about it.
>>
>> and i'm scared i'm saying too much.
>
> i don't think you said too much
>

hi ashlyn. we like to see you posting

[Confuzzled]

hi

how you?

(anyone can answer)

[astri]

On Sun, 24 Jun 2012, Confuzzled wrote:

> hi
>
> how you?
>
> (anyone can answer)

hi

we k
we on vacation
is pretty good

[Confuzzled]

On 6/24/2012 10:28 PM, astri wrote:
> On Sun, 24 Jun 2012, Confuzzled wrote:
>
>> hi
>>
>> how you?
>>
>> (anyone can answer)
>
> hi
>
> we k
> we on vacation
> is pretty good
>

:)

we tired but ok

now someone else can answer
how you?

[Starry-Eyed Pragmatist]

On Jun 30, 6:38 pm, Confuzzled <nospamsometimesknownas...@gmail.com>
wrote:

I'm fine, thanks. Getting over a cold and a big deadline at work, but
in a good mood anyway.

Take care,

Starry

[Confuzzled]

On 6/9/2012 2:22 PM, ashlyn wrote:
> On Jun 9, 11:42 am, Ester of Confuzzled
> <nospamsometimesknownas...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> On 6/8/2012 11:01 PM, ashlyn wrote:> On Jun 8, 8:54 pm, Ester of Confuzzled
>>> <nospamsometimesknownas...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> Hi Ashlyn
>>
>>> Hi!
>>
>> :) You're here
>
> yeah. i'm glad i clicked on this message. i just moved. :)
>

Do you like where you live?

> so i'm catching up. Michaela and them have been all busy with finals,
> so i haven't been around as much. but i miss talking to you.
>

I miss talking to you too. I'm glad you are here.

>>
>>> how are you?
>>
>> I guess I'm sad. How are you?
>
> i'm tired!
>
> and they have to study, i guess. :/
>

Oh.

> they finished the really difficult project, though, so that's good.
>

It sounds like they have been busy.

> some of them have been feeling kinda fragile. i feel okay. i kinda
> miss being here.
>

You should come more. Feeling fragile isn't good.

> and there's stuff we can't say lots about here, but i wish we could,
> cuz we want to talk about it.
>

How come you can't say it?

> and i'm scared i'm saying too much.
>

No way!
>

[Confuzzled]

I never thought I could.
I don't know.

[Ester of Confuzzled]

On 6/17/2012 9:17 PM, disambiguation wrote:
> On Saturday, June 9, 2012 2:38:28 PM UTC-4, Confuzzled wrote:
>> On 6/8/2012 10:32 PM, astri wrote:
>>> On Fri, 8 Jun 2012, Ester of Confuzzled wrote:
>>>> On 5/29/2012 9:56 AM, astri wrote:
>>>>> On Mon, 28 May 2012, Ester of Confuzzled wrote:
>>>>>> On 5/26/2012 10:53 PM, Michaela wrote:
>>>>>>> On May 26, 9:16 pm,
>>>>>>> Confuzzled<nospamsometimesknownas...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> s
>>>>>>>>>>> p
>>>>>>>>>>> o
>>>>>>>>>>> i
>>>>>>>>>>> l
>>>>>>>>>>> e
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> r
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> 1
>>>>>>>>>>> 1
>>>>>>>>>>> 4234
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> e
>>>>>>>>

<...>

That's a really big question. I don't know how to answer that. T says
the dad sexualized us. That might be a good way to describe it. It just
seemed like everything was about sex. Or could be. And I was his girl.
So he was going to teach me about stuff and how bad men were and he was
a man so sometimes he couldn't help being bad too.

I told T today how he was always talking about how girls used to have
chastity belts and sometimes he'd stay stuff like how he wanted us to
have one. T seemed to think that was a big deal.

>>>>>> I mean, maybe the Dad gave us some ideas, but he didn't do that
>>>>>> stuff.
>>>>>
>>>>> how did he give you the ideas?
>>>>>
>>>> He told us stuff. He told stories and things.
>>>
>>> ick stories?
>>>
>> I guess so.
>> Sometimes he made it sound like it wasn't ick. Like he was just
>> explaining what women like and stuff.
>
> How did you feel about that?

Well, I don't know. I guess I didn't like it much but it wasn't that big
a deal.

[ashlyn]

On Friday, July 6, 2012 7:07:36 PM UTC-7, Ester of Confuzzled wrote:
> On 6/9/2012 2:22 PM, ashlyn wrote:
> > On Jun 9, 11:42 am, Ester of Confuzzled
> > <nospamsometimesknownas...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >> On 6/8/2012 11:01 PM, ashlyn wrote:> On Jun 8, 8:54 pm, Ester of Confuzzled
> >>> <nospamsometimesknownas...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >>>> Hi Ashlyn
> >>
> >>> Hi!
> >>
> >> :) You're here
> >
> > yeah. i'm glad i clicked on this message. i just moved. :)
> >
> Do you like where you live?

yeah, i like it.
it's closer to school and work, so on breaks between classes, i can just go home if i want to cuz i'm close. i like that. :)
and we got someone who is cleaning it, and that really really helps.
and we moved the tv and stuff so it's not in the first room when we come in.
and we joined a fitness center nearby and it has a swimming pool, so we get to go swimming lots. :)
and it's so *quiet* compared to the apt in denver.

>
> > so i'm catching up. Michaela and them have been all busy with finals,
> > so i haven't been around as much. but i miss talking to you.
> >
> I miss talking to you too. I'm glad you are here.

thank you.
don't know if i'm totally me -- we're tired tonight. but i thought i'd try to talk. i'm not feeling many words, though.

> >>
> >>> how are you?
> >>
> >> I guess I'm sad. How are you?
> >
> > i'm tired!
> >
> > and they have to study, i guess. :/
> >
> Oh.
>
> > they finished the really difficult project, though, so that's good.
> >
> It sounds like they have been busy.
>

they really were.
now they're still in school full time, still, and they have busy times, but it doesn't feel like nearly as much as they had before.
i think their poetry teacher assigned way way more than most teachers do.

(No kidding! None of our current courses require a quarter the work that poetry did!!)

> > some of them have been feeling kinda fragile. i feel okay. i kinda
> > miss being here.
> >
> You should come more. Feeling fragile isn't good.

oh. hmm. maybe?

>
> > and there's stuff we can't say lots about here, but i wish we could,
> > cuz we want to talk about it.
> >
> How come you can't say it?

eh.....people who read here.
i wish there was a way to talk where people who i didn't want to read it wouldn't. cuz sometimes i need to talk, but i don't say much here cuz it's a forum that anyone can read.

>
> > and i'm scared i'm saying too much.
> >
> No way!

oh. okay!

(thank you)


> >

[astri]

what if you could?

[Confuzzled]

we can't make the thoughts go away

[Starry-Eyed Pragmatist]

On Friday, July 13, 2012 1:39:57 PM UTC-7, Confuzzled wrote:
> we can&#39;t make the thoughts go away

For some reason the phrase popped into my mind, "If they're gonna hang around, might as well give 'em some chores to do."

(I have no idea what that means.)

Take care,

Starry

[jill]

In article <c6fa4d67-4788-44bc...@googlegroups.com>,

Now you're thinking! Insiders take up space so they should help out. I
assume thoughts take up space as well *confused pondering* so they
can do work as well!! I bet they could help with the dusting :)

And if you do make them go away ask them to get the grocery shopping
done before they come back.

Rainbow Colors (Jill)
--
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
The colors blend, the edges soften. Swirling and mixing
we are becoming white light.
ji...@tuells.org