never mind
astri
same old
-- astri
======================
to email send to astri
======================
at volcano dot org
======================
Emerging Butterfly
sorry didn't reply sooner. wanna say what's up?
astri
> On Sep 12, 9:03 pm, astri <as...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>> sorry
>>
>> same old
>
is in the other thread now
Emerging Butterfly
okay.
gathring
> sorry
>
>
>
> same old
regrets.
you matter.
we like you.
--
But a reality check here: this is not some great moral failing. It's
part of learning to be securely human in a confusing world. - Baba Yaga
EB
> x-no-archive: yes
>
> On Tue, 15 Sep 2009, Hannah wrote:
> > x-no-archive: yes
>
> > astri <as...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
> >> On Mon, 14 Sep 2009, Hannah wrote:
> >>> astri <as...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
> >>>> sorry
>
> >>>> same old
>
>
> >> was having horrible time
>
> > :( Better now?
>
> some
starting to repair in bits?
is it okay to keep talking about this stuff as it comes up on all
sides?
>
> >> see "hurts" thread
>
> > Long thread, hope I'll find the energy to look there soon enough.
> > Still, thanks for the hint.
>
> k
astri
> astri wrote:
>> sorry
>>
>>
>>
>> same old
>
> regrets.
>
> you matter.
>
> we like you.
:)
astri
> On Sep 15, 10:21 pm, astri <as...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>>
>>> :( Better now?
>>
>> some
>
> starting to repair in bits?
guess so
> is it okay to keep talking about this stuff as it comes up on all
> sides?
prolly
think we done wth it now tho
EB
> On Tue, 15 Sep 2009, EB wrote:
> > On Sep 15, 10:21 pm, astri <as...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>
> >>> :( Better now?
>
> >> some
>
> > starting to repair in bits?
>
> guess so
doubt?
>
> > is it okay to keep talking about this stuff as it comes up on all
> > sides?
>
> prolly
>
> think we done wth it now tho
does that mean we need to be done with it too?
astri
> On Sep 15, 11:57 pm, astri <as...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>> On Tue, 15 Sep 2009, EB wrote:
>>> On Sep 15, 10:21 pm, astri <as...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>>
>>>>> :( Better now?
>>
>>>> some
>>
>>> starting to repair in bits?
>>
>> guess so
>
> doubt?
dunno
>>> is it okay to keep talking about this stuff as it comes up on all
>>> sides?
>>
>> prolly
>>
>> think we done wth it now tho
>
> does that mean we need to be done with it too?
you don't have to be done with it
we just too tired to care about any of it right now
emerging butterfly
> On Tue, 15 Sep 2009, EB wrote:
>> On Sep 15, 11:57 pm, astri <as...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>>> On Tue, 15 Sep 2009, EB wrote:
>>>> On Sep 15, 10:21 pm, astri <as...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>>>
>>>>>> :( Better now?
>>>
>>>>> some
>>>
>>>> starting to repair in bits?
>>>
>>> guess so
>>
>> doubt?
>
> dunno
should we stop asking you questions?
>
>>>> is it okay to keep talking about this stuff as it comes up on all
>>>> sides?
>>>
>>> prolly
>>>
>>> think we done wth it now tho
>>
>> does that mean we need to be done with it too?
>
> you don't have to be done with it
> we just too tired to care about any of it right now
sounds like maybe you feel defeated and are just going indifferent for
the moment.
astri
> astri wrote:
>> On Tue, 15 Sep 2009, EB wrote:
>>> On Sep 15, 11:57 pm, astri <as...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>>>> On Tue, 15 Sep 2009, EB wrote:
>>>>> On Sep 15, 10:21 pm, astri <as...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>>> :( Better now?
>>>>
>>>>>> some
>>>>
>>>>> starting to repair in bits?
>>>>
>>>> guess so
>>>
>>> doubt?
>>
>> dunno
>
> should we stop asking you questions?
dunno
>>>>> is it okay to keep talking about this stuff as it comes up on all
>>>>> sides?
>>>>
>>>> prolly
>>>>
>>>> think we done wth it now tho
>>>
>>> does that mean we need to be done with it too?
>>
>> you don't have to be done with it
>> we just too tired to care about any of it right now
>
> sounds like maybe you feel defeated and are just going indifferent
> for the moment.
not sure if defeated is it
maybe
if so, is defeated by patterns
emerging butterfly
> On Wed, 16 Sep 2009, emerging butterfly wrote:
>> astri wrote:
>>> On Tue, 15 Sep 2009, EB wrote:
>>>> On Sep 15, 11:57 pm, astri <as...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>>>>> On Tue, 15 Sep 2009, EB wrote:
>>>>>> On Sep 15, 10:21 pm, astri <as...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> :( Better now?
>>>>>
>>>>>>> some
>>>>>
>>>>>> starting to repair in bits?
>>>>>
>>>>> guess so
>>>>
>>>> doubt?
>>>
>>> dunno
>>
>> should we stop asking you questions?
>
> dunno
you sound locked down.
kinda little?
>
>>>>>> is it okay to keep talking about this stuff as it comes up on all
>>>>>> sides?
>>>>>
>>>>> prolly
>>>>>
>>>>> think we done wth it now tho
>>>>
>>>> does that mean we need to be done with it too?
>>>
>>> you don't have to be done with it
>>> we just too tired to care about any of it right now
>>
>> sounds like maybe you feel defeated and are just going indifferent
>> for the moment.
>
> not sure if defeated is it
> maybe
> if so, is defeated by patterns
those of yourself or of others?
hope the recent hurt wasn't here.
astri
> you sound locked down.
prolly
> kinda little?
frequently
>> not sure if defeated is it
>> maybe
>> if so, is defeated by patterns
>
> those of yourself or of others?
repeated pattern we keep falling into
> hope the recent hurt wasn't here.
not more recent than the hullaballoo here
we talked about it
isn't any different
maybe is just numb
numb is easier
cometz
oh. now is answer to thing i just posted. sorry. think i should do
numb but instead doing erratic. hate it. adds to feeling crazy. adds
to feeling hopeless.
hope you come back from numb sooner than later. sending you a nice
cool drink with a lime on the side. or maybe just a soft pillow to
rest on. maybe we rest some too. saying hi, anyway.
betsy
EB
> On Wed, 16 Sep 2009, emerging butterfly wrote:
> > you sound locked down.
>
> prolly
>
> > kinda little?
>
> frequently
*nods*
hi to any littles there. don't have to lock down. can talk.
>
> >> not sure if defeated is it
> >> maybe
> >> if so, is defeated by patterns
>
> > those of yourself or of others?
>
> repeated pattern we keep falling into
those are very very hard to move forward from. well-ingrained in head,
those patterns. kept you safe before. may feel like keeps you safer
now. does in some ways, but also keeps you locked in same old stuff.
can start to undo little by little.
>
> > hope the recent hurt wasn't here.
>
> not more recent than the hullaballoo here
okay
> we talked about it
> isn't any different
hmm. sorry talking about it didn't seem to help.
hope something can help.
> maybe is just numb
> numb is easier
understand feeling that.
we're here.
EB
like that you've been active here recently, betsy. doesn't look
erratic you know how you feel inside. worry that you b*at yourself up
so much over simple expressions of life, over feelings, over anything.
i like you.
astri
> On Sep 16, 12:44 pm, astri <as...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>> On Wed, 16 Sep 2009, emerging butterfly wrote:
>>> you sound locked down.
>>
>> prolly
>>
>>> kinda little?
>>
>> frequently
>>
>>>> not sure if defeated is it
>>>> maybe
>>>> if so, is defeated by patterns
>>
>>> those of yourself or of others?
>>
>> repeated pattern we keep falling into
>>
>>> hope the recent hurt wasn't here.
>>
>> not more recent than the hullaballoo here
>> we talked about it
>> isn't any different
>> maybe is just numb
>> numb is easier
>
> numb but instead doing erratic. hate it. adds to feeling crazy. adds
> to feeling hopeless.
but is also nutz busy on top
> hope you come back from numb sooner than later. sending you a nice
> cool drink with a lime on the side. or maybe just a soft pillow to
> rest on. maybe we rest some too. saying hi, anyway.
ty
astri
> On Sep 16, 10:44 am, astri <as...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>> On Wed, 16 Sep 2009, emerging butterfly wrote:
>>> you sound locked down.
>>
>> prolly
>>
>>> kinda little?
>>
>> frequently
>
> *nods*
> hi to any littles there. don't have to lock down. can talk.
get littler and bigger
not switches
is other kids here too
keiki maybe only one who talks here
others too little
>>>> not sure if defeated is it
>>>> maybe
>>>> if so, is defeated by patterns
>>
>>> those of yourself or of others?
>>
>> repeated pattern we keep falling into
>
> those are very very hard to move forward from. well-ingrained in
> head, those patterns. kept you safe before. may feel like keeps you
> safer now. does in some ways, but also keeps you locked in same old
> stuff. can start to undo little by little.
maybe
>>> hope the recent hurt wasn't here.
>>
>> not more recent than the hullaballoo here
>
> okay
>
>> we talked about it
>> isn't any different
>
> hmm. sorry talking about it didn't seem to help.
> hope something can help.
meant not a different thing than that
>> maybe is just numb
>> numb is easier
>
> understand feeling that.
> we're here.
k
fuzzy
> On Wed, 16 Sep 2009, emerging butterfly wrote:
>>> not sure if defeated is it
>>> maybe
>>> if so, is defeated by patterns
>>
>> those of yourself or of others?
>
> repeated pattern we keep falling into
>
>> hope the recent hurt wasn't here.
>
> not more recent than the hullaballoo here
> we talked about it
> isn't any different
> maybe is just numb
> numb is easier
>
until numb falls apart
or body breaks from the effort and behaviors put in to maintaining numb
astri
> astri wrote:
>>
>> maybe is just numb
>> numb is easier
>>
> until numb falls apart
> or body breaks from the effort and behaviors put in to maintaining
> numb
:/
Emerging Butterfly
> On Wed, 16 Sep 2009, EB wrote:
> > On Sep 16, 10:44 am, astri <as...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
> >> On Wed, 16 Sep 2009, emerging butterfly wrote:
> >>> you sound locked down.
>
> >> prolly
>
> >>> kinda little?
>
> >> frequently
>
> > *nods*
> > hi to any littles there. don't have to lock down. can talk.
>
> get littler and bigger
> not switches
> is other kids here too
> keiki maybe only one who talks here
> others too little
can someone speak for them or translate a bit?
how little do you think they are? do you have sense of an age or some
ages associated? some preverbal maybe?
>
> >>>> not sure if defeated is it
> >>>> maybe
> >>>> if so, is defeated by patterns
>
> >>> those of yourself or of others?
>
> >> repeated pattern we keep falling into
>
> > those are very very hard to move forward from. well-ingrained in
> > head, those patterns. kept you safe before. may feel like keeps you
> > safer now. does in some ways, but also keeps you locked in same old
> > stuff. can start to undo little by little.
>
> maybe
you tell us we can start to undo little by little. bet you can if we
can.
>
> >>> hope the recent hurt wasn't here.
>
> >> not more recent than the hullaballoo here
>
> > okay
>
> >> we talked about it
> >> isn't any different
>
> > hmm. sorry talking about it didn't seem to help.
> > hope something can help.
>
> meant not a different thing than that
don't quite understand - can you say it another way?
astri
> On Sep 17, 1:14 am, astri <as...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>> On Wed, 16 Sep 2009, EB wrote:
>>> On Sep 16, 10:44 am, astri <as...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>>>> On Wed, 16 Sep 2009, emerging butterfly wrote:
>>>>> you sound locked down.
>>
>>>> prolly
>>
>>>>> kinda little?
>>
>>>> frequently
>>
>>> *nods*
>>> hi to any littles there. don't have to lock down. can talk.
>>
>> get littler and bigger
>> not switches
>> is other kids here too
>> keiki maybe only one who talks here
>> others too little
>
> can someone speak for them or translate a bit?
not can
dunno if keiki could or not
dunno if she'd want to
> how little do you think they are? do you have sense of an age or some
> ages associated? some preverbal maybe?
the little one is prolly under 2
dunno how old princess is
maybe somewhere around 3 to 5 or 6?
>>>> repeated pattern we keep falling into
>>
>>> those are very very hard to move forward from. well-ingrained in
>>> head, those patterns. kept you safe before. may feel like keeps you
>>> safer now. does in some ways, but also keeps you locked in same old
>>> stuff. can start to undo little by little.
>>
>> maybe
>
> you tell us we can start to undo little by little. bet you can if we
> can.
:/
>>>> we talked about it
>>>> isn't any different
>>
>>> hmm. sorry talking about it didn't seem to help.
>>> hope something can help.
>>
>> meant not a different thing than that
>
> don't quite understand - can you say it another way?
didn't mean didn't help
meant wasn't a different thing we were talking about
Emerging Butterfly
> On Sun, 20 Sep 2009, Emerging Butterfly wrote:
> > On Sep 17, 1:14 am, astri <as...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
> >> On Wed, 16 Sep 2009, EB wrote:
> >>> On Sep 16, 10:44 am, astri <as...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
> >>>> On Wed, 16 Sep 2009, emerging butterfly wrote:
> >>>>> you sound locked down.
>
> >>>> prolly
>
> >>>>> kinda little?
>
> >>>> frequently
>
> >>> *nods*
> >>> hi to any littles there. don't have to lock down. can talk.
>
> >> get littler and bigger
> >> not switches
> >> is other kids here too
> >> keiki maybe only one who talks here
> >> others too little
>
> > can someone speak for them or translate a bit?
>
> not can
> dunno if keiki could or not
> dunno if she'd want to
hmm. maybe ask?
>
> > how little do you think they are? do you have sense of an age or some
> > ages associated? some preverbal maybe?
>
> the little one is prolly under 2
*nods*
we have some of that inside.
lots of just looking around, sometimes rocking, sometimes putting
everything in mouth. lots of immobile in that one.
then one baby but happy one - she squeals.
> dunno how old princess is
> maybe somewhere around 3 to 5 or 6?
*nods*
and princess isn't very well-understood or liked maybe by the others?
>
> >>>> repeated pattern we keep falling into
>
> >>> those are very very hard to move forward from. well-ingrained in
> >>> head, those patterns. kept you safe before. may feel like keeps you
> >>> safer now. does in some ways, but also keeps you locked in same old
> >>> stuff. can start to undo little by little.
>
> >> maybe
>
> > you tell us we can start to undo little by little. bet you can if we
> > can.
>
> :/
bet you can.
>
> >>>> we talked about it
> >>>> isn't any different
>
> >>> hmm. sorry talking about it didn't seem to help.
> >>> hope something can help.
>
> >> meant not a different thing than that
>
> > don't quite understand - can you say it another way?
>
> didn't mean didn't help
> meant wasn't a different thing we were talking about
heh - we had to read it a few times and run it through our brain to
get this, but we finally do, we think.
you don't think doing anything different than what everyone's been
doing would help?
it's kinda something that just takes slogging through?
you ever felt this way on the group before? what finally made you feel
safe again?
astri
> On Sep 20, 12:28 pm, astri <as...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>> On Sun, 20 Sep 2009, Emerging Butterfly wrote:
>>> On Sep 17, 1:14 am, astri <as...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>>>> On Wed, 16 Sep 2009, EB wrote:
>>>>> On Sep 16, 10:44 am, astri <as...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>>>>>> On Wed, 16 Sep 2009, emerging butterfly wrote:
>>
>>> can someone speak for them or translate a bit?
>>
>> not can
>> dunno if keiki could or not
>> dunno if she'd want to
>
> hmm. maybe ask?
why should i?
>>> how little do you think they are? do you have sense of an age or
>>> some ages associated? some preverbal maybe?
>>
>> the little one is prolly under 2
>
> *nods*
> we have some of that inside.
> lots of just looking around, sometimes rocking, sometimes putting
> everything in mouth. lots of immobile in that one.
> then one baby but happy one - she squeals.
she's scared
>> dunno how old princess is
>> maybe somewhere around 3 to 5 or 6?
>
> *nods*
> and princess isn't very well-understood or liked maybe by the others?
something like that
>> didn't mean didn't help
>> meant wasn't a different thing we were talking about
>
> heh - we had to read it a few times and run it through our brain to
> get this, but we finally do, we think.
> you don't think doing anything different than what everyone's been
> doing would help?
> it's kinda something that just takes slogging through?
> you ever felt this way on the group before? what finally made you feel
> safe again?
think the communication is getting a bit jumbled. that isn't what we
meant either. heh. think is better just to give up trying to get that
one across.
Emerging Butterfly
> On Sun, 20 Sep 2009, Emerging Butterfly wrote:
> > On Sep 20, 12:28 pm, astri <as...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
> >> On Sun, 20 Sep 2009, Emerging Butterfly wrote:
> >>> On Sep 17, 1:14 am, astri <as...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
> >>>> On Wed, 16 Sep 2009, EB wrote:
> >>>>> On Sep 16, 10:44 am, astri <as...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
> >>>>>> On Wed, 16 Sep 2009, emerging butterfly wrote:
>
> >>> can someone speak for them or translate a bit?
>
> >> not can
> >> dunno if keiki could or not
> >> dunno if she'd want to
>
> > hmm. maybe ask?
>
> why should i?
why should you ask or why should she help?
answer to either is cuz it might help if everyone inside can be heard.
you're all important, not just the ones who can communicate themselves
in words.
>
> >>> how little do you think they are? do you have sense of an age or
> >>> some ages associated? some preverbal maybe?
>
> >> the little one is prolly under 2
>
> > *nods*
> > we have some of that inside.
> > lots of just looking around, sometimes rocking, sometimes putting
> > everything in mouth. lots of immobile in that one.
> > then one baby but happy one - she squeals.
>
> she's scared
ah. sad that there was fear for the body that young. :(
>
> >> dunno how old princess is
> >> maybe somewhere around 3 to 5 or 6?
>
> > *nods*
> > and princess isn't very well-understood or liked maybe by the others?
>
> something like that
okay.
>
> >> didn't mean didn't help
> >> meant wasn't a different thing we were talking about
>
> > heh - we had to read it a few times and run it through our brain to
> > get this, but we finally do, we think.
> > you don't think doing anything different than what everyone's been
> > doing would help?
> > it's kinda something that just takes slogging through?
> > you ever felt this way on the group before? what finally made you feel
> > safe again?
>
> think the communication is getting a bit jumbled. that isn't what we
> meant either. heh. think is better just to give up trying to get that
> one across.
heh. oops. sometimes we don't understand what you're saying as well as
we'd like to. makes us feel obtuse sometimes. :/
hope you won't quit trying with us altogether. want to understand but
it takes time and sometimes more than one wording.
astri
> On Sep 20, 7:39 pm, astri <as...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>> On Sun, 20 Sep 2009, Emerging Butterfly wrote:
>>> On Sep 20, 12:28 pm, astri <as...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>>>> On Sun, 20 Sep 2009, Emerging Butterfly wrote:
>>
>>>>> can someone speak for them or translate a bit?
>>
>>>> not can
>>>> dunno if keiki could or not
>>>> dunno if she'd want to
>>
>>> hmm. maybe ask?
>>
>> why should i?
>
> why should you ask or why should she help?
why should i ask
> answer to either is cuz it might help if everyone inside can be
> heard. you're all important, not just the ones who can communicate
> themselves in words.
they're not mine
i don't want them
i don't want to have to take care of them
emerging butterfly
> On Sun, 20 Sep 2009, Emerging Butterfly wrote:
>> On Sep 20, 7:39 pm, astri <as...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>>> On Sun, 20 Sep 2009, Emerging Butterfly wrote:
>>>> On Sep 20, 12:28 pm, astri <as...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>>>>> On Sun, 20 Sep 2009, Emerging Butterfly wrote:
>>>
>>>>>> can someone speak for them or translate a bit?
>>>
>>>>> not can
>>>>> dunno if keiki could or not
>>>>> dunno if she'd want to
>>>
>>>> hmm. maybe ask?
>>>
>>> why should i?
>>
>> why should you ask or why should she help?
>
> why should i ask
>
>> answer to either is cuz it might help if everyone inside can be
>> heard. you're all important, not just the ones who can communicate
>> themselves in words.
>
> they're not mine
> i don't want them
> i don't want to have to take care of them
i know you don't want to take care of em. for me, taking care of the
kids means acknowledging i didn't get taken care of as a kid an no one
can rescue me in that ultimate way now. involves a lot of grief. it's
also, frankly, a difficult job. they cry. they scream. they need
boundaries from me. they need attention. they need and say all this
stuff. and some of me gets in trouble for communicating with others of
me. sometimes, often, is so much easier to ignore em or just throw up hands.
trying to learn to take care of the ones inside me. is hard hard work.
i know you didn't ask for this, astri. know it's hard. know getting in
touch with them might mean feeling things, and know it may be too
dangerous just now.
even though you didn't ask for em, you have em. and their states affect
you, prolly more than they would affect you on the whole if you did
things to tend to them.
is agonizingly hard. get that.
hope someday maybe you'll reach out to em. don't think anyone else can
in the way that you can.
astri
i'm not their mommy
i'm not even grown up most of the time
emerging butterfly
but then do they get a mommy or are they left alone?
> i'm not even grown up most of the time
we struggle with that too. if michaela isn't even really a real
grown-up, how can she "parent" the others? i need some help to be an
adult myself and can be taken over by others fairly easily.
so maybe part of my job is to learn to be adult as well as learn to take
care of em. is hard not having a solid stable grown-up inside.
any grown-ups in you?
how old would you put yourself? i mean, the age that you actually feel,
not the age that you act.
astri
> astri wrote:
>>
>> i'm not their mommy
>
> but then do they get a mommy or are they left alone?
maybe t can be their mommy
not me
>> i'm not even grown up most of the time
>
> we struggle with that too. if michaela isn't even really a real
> grown-up, how can she "parent" the others? i need some help to be an
> adult myself and can be taken over by others fairly easily.
>
> so maybe part of my job is to learn to be adult as well as learn to
> take care of em. is hard not having a solid stable grown-up inside.
>
> any grown-ups in you?
think hf must be
we are sometimes
> how old would you put yourself? i mean, the age that you actually
> feel, not the age that you act.
range from about 8 or 9 to teenage much of the time, and sometimes
grownup
Emerging Butterfly
> On Sun, 20 Sep 2009, emerging butterfly wrote:
> > astri wrote:
>
> >> i'm not their mommy
>
> > but then do they get a mommy or are they left alone?
>
> maybe t can be their mommy
hmm. but she can't be full-time. maybe with time she can teach you to
do some of it? or you can internalize her kindness?
> not me
>
> >> i'm not even grown up most of the time
>
> > we struggle with that too. if michaela isn't even really a real
> > grown-up, how can she "parent" the others? i need some help to be an
> > adult myself and can be taken over by others fairly easily.
>
> > so maybe part of my job is to learn to be adult as well as learn to
> > take care of em. is hard not having a solid stable grown-up inside.
>
> > any grown-ups in you?
>
> think hf must be
> we are sometimes
yeah. do you know what brings that out, the grown-up?
>
> > how old would you put yourself? i mean, the age that you actually
> > feel, not the age that you act.
>
> range from about 8 or 9 to teenage much of the time, and sometimes
> grownup
hmm.
how old is the mirror?
astri
> On Sep 21, 10:33 am, astri <as...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>> On Sun, 20 Sep 2009, emerging butterfly wrote:
>>> astri wrote:
>>
>>>> i'm not their mommy
>>
>>> but then do they get a mommy or are they left alone?
>>
>> maybe t can be their mommy
>
> hmm. but she can't be full-time. maybe with time she can teach you to
> do some of it? or you can internalize her kindness?
:P
>>> any grown-ups in you?
>>
>> think hf must be
>> we are sometimes
>
> yeah. do you know what brings that out, the grown-up?
no
>>> how old would you put yourself? i mean, the age that you actually
>>> feel, not the age that you act.
>>
>> range from about 8 or 9 to teenage much of the time, and sometimes
>> grownup
>
> hmm.
> how old is the mirror?
dunno how to answer that
Emerging Butterfly
> On Mon, 21 Sep 2009, Emerging Butterfly wrote:
> > On Sep 21, 10:33 am, astri <as...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
> >> On Sun, 20 Sep 2009, emerging butterfly wrote:
> >>> astri wrote:
>
> >>>> i'm not their mommy
>
> >>> but then do they get a mommy or are they left alone?
>
> >> maybe t can be their mommy
>
> > hmm. but she can't be full-time. maybe with time she can teach you to
> > do some of it? or you can internalize her kindness?
>
> :P
heh. scared to think of doing that?
>
> >>> any grown-ups in you?
>
> >> think hf must be
> >> we are sometimes
>
> > yeah. do you know what brings that out, the grown-up?
>
> no
yeah. that makes it hard then to have predictability with it. and is
hard to think of doing internal parenting if you have no idea what
even makes you adult or younger.
and it's really not fair if you're sometimes as young as 8 or 9 to be
asked to be their mommy. sounds like you need someone yourself
sometimes. just hard.
>
> >>> how old would you put yourself? i mean, the age that you actually
> >>> feel, not the age that you act.
>
> >> range from about 8 or 9 to teenage much of the time, and sometimes
> >> grownup
>
> > hmm.
> > how old is the mirror?
>
> dunno how to answer that
yeah, thought that might be hard. might be a really good skill, but
not necessarily associated with one personality or one age?
astri
> On Sep 21, 11:17 am, astri <as...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>> On Mon, 21 Sep 2009, Emerging Butterfly wrote:
>>> On Sep 21, 10:33 am, astri <as...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>>>> On Sun, 20 Sep 2009, emerging butterfly wrote:
>>>>> astri wrote:
>>
>>>>>> i'm not their mommy
>>
>>>>> but then do they get a mommy or are they left alone?
>>
>>>> maybe t can be their mommy
>>
>>> hmm. but she can't be full-time. maybe with time she can teach you to
>>> do some of it? or you can internalize her kindness?
>>
>> :P
>
> heh. scared to think of doing that?
no
>>>>> any grown-ups in you?
>>
>>>> think hf must be
>>>> we are sometimes
>>
>>> yeah. do you know what brings that out, the grown-up?
>>
>> no
>
> yeah. that makes it hard then to have predictability with it. and is
> hard to think of doing internal parenting if you have no idea what
> even makes you adult or younger.
something about stress levels
> and it's really not fair if you're sometimes as young as 8 or 9 to be
> asked to be their mommy. sounds like you need someone yourself
> sometimes. just hard.
something like that
>>>>> how old would you put yourself? i mean, the age that you actually
>>>>> feel, not the age that you act.
>>
>>>> range from about 8 or 9 to teenage much of the time, and sometimes
>>>> grownup
>>
>>> hmm.
>>> how old is the mirror?
>>
>> dunno how to answer that
>
> yeah, thought that might be hard. might be a really good skill, but
> not necessarily associated with one personality or one age?
huh?
wolfie of confuzzled
m*m to our m*m. is maybe littles who need care inside but maybe they can
get nurturence other ways. dunno. I not gonna mommy to littles. don't
think c will. maybe is part of what herman does? is care for littles but
he definietly not a mommy
hmm.. and maybe we going little
emerging butterfly
>>
>> i'm not their mommy
>> i'm not even grown up most of the time
>>
> is almost a triggering thought. don't wanna be mommy. already had to be
> m*m to our m*m.
:( then of course even the word m*m would bring up ick feelings.
is maybe littles who need care inside but maybe they can
> get nurturence other ways.
yeah. i don't know. when mine go outside for nurturance....well, i think
it's best if they at least ask me first. sometimes they're too
vulnerable out there on their own.
dunno. I not gonna mommy to littles.
could you maybe help them get needs met and give them stuff relationally
that they crave?
don't
> think c will. maybe is part of what herman does?
seems like that.
is care for littles but
> he definietly not a mommy
heh -- he is something else! :)
i like him and what he does for the littles.
think people can tailor in their own ways how to care for insiders. do
tend to think it's important that i come to own me, all of me, and take
care of me. doesn't happen easily though at all or all at once.
>
> hmm.. and maybe we going little
hi
fuzzy
>
>>>
>>> i'm not their mommy
>>> i'm not even grown up most of the time
>>>
>> is almost a triggering thought. don't wanna be mommy. already had to
>> be m*m to our m*m.
>
> :( then of course even the word m*m would bring up ick feelings.
>
that from her too
> is maybe littles who need care inside but maybe they can
>> get nurturence other ways.
>
> yeah. i don't know. when mine go outside for nurturance....well, i think
> it's best if they at least ask me first. sometimes they're too
> vulnerable out there on their own.
>
k. that makes sense
think we got good strong walls to keep that hapepning.
>> dunno. I not gonna mommy to littles.
>
> could you maybe help them get needs met and give them stuff relationally
> that they crave?
>
dunno
>> don't
>> think c will. maybe is part of what herman does?
>
> seems like that.
>
i wonder... maybe herman goes away when the littles go away?
>> is care for littles but
>> he definietly not a mommy
>
> heh -- he is something else! :)
ja. something weird :P
> i like him and what he does for the littles.
> think people can tailor in their own ways how to care for insiders. do
> tend to think it's important that i come to own me, all of me, and take
> care of me. doesn't happen easily though at all or all at once.
>
k
>
>>
>> hmm.. and maybe we going little
>
> hi
>
hi
and we gots big head ahce. makes it hard to think
astri
> astri wrote:
>>
>> i'm not their mommy
>> i'm not even grown up most of the time
>>
> is almost a triggering thought. don't wanna be mommy. already had to
> be m*m to our m*m. is maybe littles who need care inside but maybe
> they can get nurturence other ways. dunno. I not gonna mommy to
> littles. don't think c will. maybe is part of what herman does? is
> care for littles but he definietly not a mommy
thnk we very much same
but we don't got someone like herman
> hmm.. and maybe we going little
k
fuzzy
> On Mon, 21 Sep 2009, wolfie of confuzzled wrote:
>> astri wrote:
>>>
>>> i'm not their mommy
>>> i'm not even grown up most of the time
>>>
>> is almost a triggering thought. don't wanna be mommy. already had to
>> be m*m to our m*m. is maybe littles who need care inside but maybe
>> they can get nurturence other ways. dunno. I not gonna mommy to
>> littles. don't think c will. maybe is part of what herman does? is
>> care for littles but he definietly not a mommy
>
> thnk we very much same
> but we don't got someone like herman
>
astri
but she's *nothing* like herman
gathring
> On Tue, 22 Sep 2009, fuzzy wrote:
>> astri wrote:
>>> On Mon, 21 Sep 2009, wolfie of confuzzled wrote:
>>>> astri wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> i'm not their mommy
>>>>> i'm not even grown up most of the time
>>>>>
>>>> is almost a triggering thought. don't wanna be mommy. already had
>>>> to be m*m to our m*m. is maybe littles who need care inside but
>>>> maybe they can get nurturence other ways. dunno. I not gonna mommy
>>>> to littles. don't think c will. maybe is part of what herman does?
>>>> is care for littles but he definietly not a mommy
>>>
>>> thnk we very much same
>>> but we don't got someone like herman
>>>
>> you got the mystic
>
> but she's *nothing* like herman
and yet in many ways she's a lot like herman
--
But a reality check here: this is not some great moral failing. It's
part of learning to be securely human in a confusing world. - Baba Yaga
Emerging Butterfly
> On Mon, 21 Sep 2009, wolfie of confuzzled wrote:
> > astri wrote:
>
> >> i'm not their mommy
> >> i'm not even grown up most of the time
>
> > is almost a triggering thought. don't wanna be mommy. already had to
> > be m*m to our m*m. is maybe littles who need care inside but maybe
> > they can get nurturence other ways. dunno. I not gonna mommy to
> > littles. don't think c will. maybe is part of what herman does? is
> > care for littles but he definietly not a mommy
>
> thnk we very much same
similar reasons for not wanting to parent the kids inside?
> but we don't got someone like herman
yeah -- you got anyone in there to help the others inside process?
astri
> astri wrote:
>> On Tue, 22 Sep 2009, fuzzy wrote:
>>>>
>>> you got the mystic
>>
>> but she's *nothing* like herman
>
> and yet in many ways she's a lot like herman
hmmmm
astri
> On Sep 22, 11:06 am, astri <as...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>> On Mon, 21 Sep 2009, wolfie of confuzzled wrote:
>>> astri wrote:
>>
>>>> i'm not their mommy
>>>> i'm not even grown up most of the time
>>
>>> is almost a triggering thought. don't wanna be mommy. already had
>>> to be m*m to our m*m. is maybe littles who need care inside but
>>> maybe they can get nurturence other ways. dunno. I not gonna mommy
>>> to littles. don't think c will. maybe is part of what herman does?
>>> is care for littles but he definietly not a mommy
>>
>> thnk we very much same
>
> similar reasons for not wanting to parent the kids inside?
sorta
>> but we don't got someone like herman
>
> yeah -- you got anyone in there to help the others inside process?
no
Shiyiya
> x-no-archive: yes
> On Tue, 29 Dec 2009, Hannah wrote:
>>
>> x-no-archive: yes
>>
>> Hi!
>>
>> astri <as...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>>> On Mon, 21 Sep 2009, Emerging Butterfly wrote:
>>>> On Sep 21, 10:33 am, astri <as...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>>>>> On Sun, 20 Sep 2009, emerging butterfly wrote:
>>>>>> astri wrote:
>>
>>>>>>> i'm not their mommy
>>
>>>>>> but then do they get a mommy or are they left alone?
>>
>>>>> maybe t can be their mommy
>>
>>>> hmm. but she can't be full-time. maybe with time she can teach you
>>>> to do some of it? or you can internalize her kindness?
>>
>>> :P
>>
>>
>> Now, the theory is that in the end, one could learn to do it oneself.
>> And that you could be a good m*m is proven by sir lala. Couldn't you
>> *adopt* the inside kid(s) or "acquire" them, just like the aa? And if
>> not now, perhaps eventually?
>
> and what if i'm not grown up most of the time? how come i got to do it?
> i don't like them.
>
is there anybody who is?
astri
hf is grown up
not that she pays any attention to anyone inside
Shiyiya
hm.
well, know that I was maybe more like older sister who took care for
Summer than a prnt. But, *wanted* to take care of her, because beautiful
and precious. Don't know that grudging "I don't like you" care would
even be a good thing. (not to cast aspersions on you for not liking
them. just thinking aloud.)
astri
think wanting makes a difference
Shiyiya
> On Mon, 28 Dec 2009, Shiyiya wrote:
>
>> well, know that I was maybe more like older sister who took care for
>> Summer than a prnt. But, *wanted* to take care of her, because
>> beautiful and precious. Don't know that grudging "I don't like you"
>> care would even be a good thing. (not to cast aspersions on you for
>> not liking them. just thinking aloud.)
>
> think wanting makes a difference
>
yeah
think the lack of someone wanting to take good care of them in the first
place is the problem
and repeating that not very helpful :P
astri
dunno?
> and repeating that not very helpful :P
:/
Shiyiya
> x-no-archive: yes
> On Tue, 29 Dec 2009, Hannah wrote:
>> x-no-archive: yes
>>
>> Hi!
>>
>> astri <as...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>>
>>>> astri <as...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>>>>> On Mon, 21 Sep 2009, Emerging Butterfly wrote:
>>>>>> On Sep 21, 10:33 am, astri <as...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>>>>>>> On Sun, 20 Sep 2009, emerging butterfly wrote:
>>>>>>>> astri wrote:
>>
>>>>>>>>> i'm not their mommy
>>
>>>>>>>> but then do they get a mommy or are they left alone?
>>
>>>>>>> maybe t can be their mommy
>>
>>>>>> hmm. but she can't be full-time. maybe with time she can teach
>>>>>> you to do some of it? or you can internalize her kindness?
>>
>>>>> :P
>>
>>>> kid(s)?
>>
>>>> Now, the theory is that in the end, one could learn to do it
>>>> oneself. And that you could be a good m*m is proven by sir lala.
>>>> Couldn't you *adopt* the inside kid(s) or "acquire" them, just like
>>>> the aa? And if not now, perhaps eventually?
>>
>>> and what if i'm not grown up most of the time? how come i got to do
>>> it?
>>
>
> hf didn't split off until he was about 5 or 6
> we were prolly more frequently grown up then
> but we can do the mommy stuff
> cuz we want to
> and c is there too
> think he steps in if we're just not there
> but if sir lala really needs us we're there
>
>>> i don't like them.
>>
>
> cuz don't wanna
>
could/would c care for them some?
astri
think he does