an overweight model for my life drawing class
dcb
I know what you mean, about feeling the traitor. I often feel as if
I've crossed to the 'other' side by losing weight. After all, I was
fine as a size 16, I didn't need to be a size 8 to be worthwhile. And
by wanting to be a size 8, was I really just buying into the media
hype and the pressure to be thin?
These types of thoughts really did cause a stall for me at about 160,
when I just kept thinking that I was fine, I didn't need to lose
anymore, that I needed to be accepted the way I was.
But then, I figured, if I'm an okay person at 160, wouldn't I also be
an okay person at 150 or 145? If I'm critical of thin people because
of their weight, aren't I being just as judgemental as they have been
of me because of my weight?
It's tough because we do get the "Fat is a Feminist Issue" (actual
book by Susan Orbach). Almost makes one feel like a betrayer to want
to be healthy!
Good luck with this.
Best, Diane
asdww FAQ: http://www.didian.com/asdww/
185/148/145
On Tue, 6 Feb 2001 20:59:10 -0700, "Carol Schmidt"
<ajc...@mindspring.com> wrote:
<snip>
>A small part of me wants to cling to my fat to spite them all, to flaunt it
>in their faces, hey, I am a valuable human being no matter what I weigh at
>any particular time, I'll show you how talented and wise and experienced I
>am and blow your image that fat people are all stupid and dirty and lazy.
>
>I feel a bit of a traitor for being on a weight loss program to join the
>idiots in their "normalcy." But I have to reassure myself that I am in this
>for my health, it does not matter a whit what anyone else thinks of me, not
>all thin people are mean nasty bigots who hate all fat people (though in my
>life it has often felt that way).
--
"You despise me, don't you, Rick?"
"If I gave you any thought, I probably would."
and...@interport.net
first, i think it's important to keep art, on the one hand, and
society's perceptions (and individuals' perceptions) of fat people, on
the other hand, as two distinct and completely seperate things.
rubens glorified fat women; keene painted everyone exageratedly tall
and skinny. botero sculpts everyone fat specifically as a social
statement. wimpy was fat but jughead was thin. DAVID has hands and
feet prominently exagerated out of proportion so michealangelo could
show off his skill at sculpting fine detail. was there a stated
purpose in having a fat model, and are you getting a series of models
with different special attributes? or is it anyone who wants $15 and
shows up to strip?
but on the psychological end, if what you describe is applicable to
people's perceptions in general, then we're in pretty big trouble as a
country -- 1/4 of us are pretty soon going to be seeing the other 3/4
as freaks, and when the oppressed minority becomes the dehumanized
majority, we all know what happens. i can remember the slogans from
the 60s we're going to have to paraphrase... never trust anyone under
150; would you shoot your waiter?
---andy gee
248/<stewards inquiry -- somewhere between 195 and "196 1/2">/185
--
we are atlas and we should shrug
Sent via Deja.com
http://www.deja.com/
Stephen Rees
beauty, and in some societies ccorpulence is considered prestigious as
it indicates wealth. Currently we are bomarded with images of skinny
people - especially anorexic young women - as ideals that we are
supposed to covet/aspire to. Usually in the interests of selling us
something.
We are beginning to understand that people who can afford to eat well
and who have little need to exert themselves on a daily basis will not,
generally speaking, be very healthy. And in most advanced western
societies that means most of us. During, and immediately after, World
War II, when food rationing was imposed in Britain , the population was
generally healthier than it is now. People did not starve, though they
missed out on a lot things they would have liked to eat, and since
there was very little petrol for private motoring they were more likely
to walk or cycle. No one would advocate a return to rationing, but we
do know that if people were more careful about limiting their calorie
intake, and especially reducing the amount of fat they eat, then the
present scourges of late onset diabetes and heart disease could be
drastically reduced at very little cost - quite unlike most health care
approaches to disease such as surgery or drug therapy.
That being said, there are some people who are clinically obese yet are
very fit indeed. These people are, unfortunately, the exception rather
than the rule and they are all very active physically.
While I think it would be a very much nicer world if we could accept
all of humanity in its wonderful diversity, this seems to me unlikely
to change as a result of the harangues of the politically correct. But
such acceptance should not also inhibit organisations like Weight
Watchers building a business on the well founded observation that many
of the populace would be much healthier if they lost 10% of their
bodyweight. The fact that that also enhances their social acceptance
and self esteem cannot be denied.
And since I cannot leave any discussion without saying "on the other
hand" - people are now coming up to me and saying "Don't lose any more
weight, will you." So thin acceptance may not be all that some claim.
Most of us have a pretty reasonable idea of what constitutes a healthy
body weight - and it is not an absolute stanard like the BMI. Perhaps
these students at the art class are not yet skilful enough to render a
3 dimensional object as a 2 dimensional image accurately? Or maybe they
tend to caricature as a genuine artistic point of view?
In article <95qgrr$jqb$1...@slb2.atl.mindspring.net>,
"Carol Schmidt" <ajc...@mindspring.com> wrote:
> As much as I am aware of how society hates fat and oppresses fat
people, I
> am continually shocked with new examples.
>
> In my Life Drawing I class tonight, we had a male model who was about
6'2",
> probably about 230 pounds, very large bones, but not in great shape.
He had
> a definite pot belly and his breasts were somewhat fatty for a male.
Still,
> this was a young, healthy, good-looking kid. (He was probably 18--at
58
> anyone younger is a kid to me.)
>
> I drew him looking as he actually was, at least in my eyes. So many
in the
> class made him look obese, they made that pot belly look like he was
nine
> months pregnant, they made his breasts look like 44DDD, they made his
arms
> and legs look all round, no hint of the musculature and bone
structure which
> could still be seen.
>
> He had huge bones, I couldn't help noticing how big his pelvic bones
were
> and how thick his leg bones were and how big his feet and hands and
jaw
> bones were. (All of you women thinking dirty thoughts, knock it off,
this
> was an art class!)
>
> But few in the class showed this, they made him grotesque, they
couldn't
> handle drawing him as just a slightly overweight guy. It made me
aware once
> more of how fat is despised in this society, it can't even be drawn
> accurately in a class where we're attempting to see people as they
actually
> are.
>
> When we were doing our own modeling for each other (clothed) the
first week,
> nobody would let me look at their drawings of me, which indicated to
me that
> they had made me look very fat and were somehow ashamed of it, as if I
> didn't know I was fat and would be shocked by their drawings.
>
> Now I think they might very well have made me into the obese,
grotesque
> monster they made this young man into, all because he was overweight.
>
> Makes me want to send off a check to the National Association for the
> Advancement of Fat Acceptance.
>
> A small part of me wants to cling to my fat to spite them all, to
flaunt it
> in their faces, hey, I am a valuable human being no matter what I
weigh at
> any particular time, I'll show you how talented and wise and
experienced I
> am and blow your image that fat people are all stupid and dirty and
lazy.
>
> I feel a bit of a traitor for being on a weight loss program to join
the
> idiots in their "normalcy." But I have to reassure myself that I am
in this
> for my health, it does not matter a whit what anyone else thinks of
me, not
> all thin people are mean nasty bigots who hate all fat people (though
in my
> life it has often felt that way).
>
> Just an evening's thoughts.
> --
> Carol Schmidt, Phoenix, AZ, USA
> 366 start on April 18, 2000
> 312.5 now, 53.5 pounds lost
> blew through my 10-pound Valentine's Day minigoal
> 309.9 next minigoal
> 299.9 minigoal for April 18, 2001
> 166 goal for the year 2007
>
>
--
Stephen Rees (srees at iprimus dot ca)
Richmond BC, Canada
204.8/162.4/164
I do not read my-deja email.
ab1...@my-deja.com
dcb...@yahoo.com wrote:
> I know what you mean, about feeling the traitor. I often feel as if
> I've crossed to the 'other' side by losing weight. After all, I was
> fine as a size 16, I didn't need to be a size 8 to be worthwhile. And
> by wanting to be a size 8, was I really just buying into the media
> hype and the pressure to be thin?
This same sentiment has been expressed many times by the
actress/comedian Janeane Garofalo. She was apparently asked to lose 26
pounds for the movie "Reality Bites," but she lost only 12: "I fought
every step, because I thought it was important that I make my movie
debut as a person with some heft -- as a normal-looking
person....I'm trying to be one of the few people in my job who
don't make teenage girls feel bad about themselves." (quote from
http://www.movieclub.com/spotlight/garofalo/garofalo.html)
Anyway, some of you may find her interviews (many available at
http://www.homunculus.com/icons/garofalojaneane/GarofaloInfo.html) worth
reading--she often discusses the weight and beauty barriers she has
encountered in Hollywood.
--
Andrea
161/157 (today, down 2.2!)/145 first goal
Anukaisa Alanen
of normal weight at the time (as I'm now, thanks to WW :-) and rather
toned. I found a bit strange, that some people always drew (or
painted or sculpted) the model as overweight or as really skinny. I
suspect that many of them didn't know how to depict normal, strong,
healthy young woman because they mainly see skinny ones in pictures,
whereas in the mirror, they possibly see a fatter image. When drawing,
you don't necessarily observe the model too much, but you depict one
of the familiar images that you have stored in your brain. Although,
the art classes with live model should be about observing, too, not
just creating.
The good ones depicted the model in various ways, but when they
exaggerated the figure into either direction, it was for a reason and
it also looked good. I especially loved when they exaggerated my
muscles although I quite enjoyed the Rubenesque ones as well. The
skinny versions made me feel a bit uncomfortable.
It was really interesting work and it taught me more about
self-acceptance. I still feel uncomfortable on a beach wearing a
swimsuit, though.
Cheers,
Anukaisa
Life-time member in two weeks!
--
tra...@uta.fi -Itse henkilökohtaisesti kyllä.
Sophie
Diane wrote:
> > I know what you mean, about feeling the traitor. I often feel as if
> > I've crossed to the 'other' side by losing weight. After all, I was
> > fine as a size 16, I didn't need to be a size 8 to be worthwhile. And
> > by wanting to be a size 8, was I really just buying into the media
> > hype and the pressure to be thin?
> This same sentiment has been expressed many times by the
> actress/comedian Janeane Garofalo.
I love Janeane Garofalo, especially in *The Truth about Cats and Dogs*,
where she has a great character. Shame about the dorky English guy though
... I've seen that movie about 5 times and it still makes me laugh...
Sophie
209/184/140
Julia Stambor
But it isn´t really surprising, considering the fact that we ourselves,
too, sometimes tend to view ourselves as much bigger than we really
are. I weighed around 62 kgs all through school, and I believed I would
have to be at most 59 kgs to look good at all. When I left for law
school, I proceeded to gain 30 kilos (66 pounds). When I saw the first
photographs of myself at that weight, the realization hit me that I had
believed I looked like that at 30 kgs less, too! I did then proceed to
dig out old photographs of myself at school and realized for the first
time that the person on them was slim!Which means that I don´t really
know what it feels like to be slim even though I objectively was once!
Actually, the problem is also expressed in how we divide people into
categories. A person is either slim or fat. There isn´t a real category
for your average-weight, somewhat curvy, but healthy, person (see how
many words I need to describe what I mean there?).
Maybe we should invent one??? Some German scientists have been using
the expression "Wohlfühlgewicht" (Feel-good-weight) to describe what a
person should weigh. Any ideas?
Julia
92/87/79/65 kgs
doe
Thanks, Doe
Julia Stambor wrote:
--
Doe
182/173.5/155 ...thinking positive thoughts!
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