Hipmoos Buy the Farm
Hooty Sapperticker
HS
Dan B.
news:3CB65F21...@thedoghousemail.com:
> Hipmama.com shut down their discussion boards! Damn. I enjoyed them.
HAHAH. Reading the "Explanation and Thanks" message right now. I love the
doublespeak reinventing failure as "ending an experimental phase."
The message confirms what people have said here, and sometimes to their
faces over on HipMoo: They're a bunch of crude, rude, nasty, disgusting
bitches that suck up resources without gratitude, respect, or
consideration for anyone else. And now they've gone and burned down their
own clubhouse.
--Dan
Dan B. - arcad...@sbcglobal.net
--
We go undiscovered 'cause people are careless
One way or another they'll never forget us
Robert Myers
"Dan B." <arcad...@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
news:Xns91EDDF...@130.133.1.4...
> Hooty Sapperticker <howdy...@thedoghousemail.com> wrote in
> news:3CB65F21...@thedoghousemail.com:
>
> > Hipmama.com shut down their discussion boards! Damn. I enjoyed them.
>
> HAHAH. Reading the "Explanation and Thanks" message right now. I love the
> doublespeak reinventing failure as "ending an experimental phase."
You want doublespeak and redefining? Go read the racism faq.
Dan B.
news:ZVtt8.42761$ud6.1...@typhoon.austin.rr.com:
> You want doublespeak and redefining? Go read the racism faq.
On Hipmoo, or somewhere else? All of Hipmoo's past forums were deleted.
Robert Myers
> "Robert Myers" <rpmy...@NOSPAMhotmail.com> wrote in
> news:ZVtt8.42761$ud6.1...@typhoon.austin.rr.com:
>
> > You want doublespeak and redefining? Go read the racism faq.
>
> On Hipmoo, or somewhere else? All of Hipmoo's past forums were deleted.
On hipmoo. You can get there from the front page, first thing under "New
Features"
Dan B.
> "Robert Myers" <rpmy...@NOSPAMhotmail.com> wrote in
> news:ZVtt8.42761$ud6.1...@typhoon.austin.rr.com:
>
>> You want doublespeak and redefining? Go read the racism faq.
>
> On Hipmoo, or somewhere else? All of Hipmoo's past forums were deleted.
>
Sorry to follow myself, but I found it:
http://www.hipmama.com/features/antiracfaq.html
You're right about the doublespeak and redefining. My goodness. I haven't
seen anything like this since college, especially the "more oppressed
than thou" passages.
Oh, and does anyone have the recipe for baking a Cake of Oppression
handy?
-Dan
jhp
Hooty Sapperticker <howdy...@thedoghousemail.com> wrote:
>Hipmama.com shut down their discussion boards! Damn. I enjoyed them.
Oh, but how about that shutdown message!
:Thus ends this phase of the experiment:
:
:When the well becomes too poisoned to drink from, it must be shut down.
:It is with deep sadness and peace in our hearts that we believe this
:phase of a great experiment must finally come to an end.
:
:Without any paid technical or administrative staff, we maintained a
:discussion board that could reliably hold up to 100,000 messages in an
:active database, with up to 4,000 registered users and countless
:unregistered viewers of the content. We managed not only to maintain it
:but to keep it running smoothly, without more than occasional technical
:down time or crashes. We responded to hundreds of technical email
:questions every day.
Now whose fault is that? If you didn't decide it was necessary to spend
time answering "if i can get PG how com u cant turn on my coputr?"
questions, you might be able to spend that time running the damned
board.
:Beyond that, what very few other sites have ever attempted-- we offered
:moderated public discussions that reflected a political and social
:philosophy outside the mainstream.
Say WHAT? There is nothing more mainstream than shitting out children,
and you need only read _Time_ magazine to see that.
:This was a grand idea, an amazing
:effort, something to strive for, and something that has in the end
:proved too big to maintain in a respectful, effective way.
Bureaucracies are like spandex: the bigger the contents, the tighter the
control.
:It has become clear to us that the board requires a level of support
:that nobody can handle; the mods burn out, the community isn't willing
:to take responsibility for itself and demands administrative
:interventions, then resents whatever we try to do. The community has
:expectations that are not in line with our philosophy, our reasons for
:doing the project, and the resources we have available.
What did you expect from a bunch of goddamned entitlement moos!? I
mean!
:The heart of our organization has always been the moderator team. We
:depended on the moderators for empathetic, ethical activism and
:organizing.
That'll teach you.
:Here are words we've heard used by mods within the last 48
:hours -- expressing why they are leaving, why they are frustrated:
:
:*poisoned atmosphere * backstabbing
You're running a site for children who refuse to grow up yet have
children of their own. Bueller?
:* unproductive criticism * burn-out
:* frenzy * mean-spiritedness * soul & time sucking
Spend much time with your own brats lately?
:* being eaten alive*
:* dehumanizing bitter criticism in the name of "love" and "progress" *
:* confusion over the user agreement * anger over racism in the community
:* * this is the first time the boards ever made me cry * heartbreaking *
:* sadness * peace* hope *
Awww. That sounds so... forced. (I was going to say "sweet" but
decided against.
:There is a difference between active resistance and sabotage. We do not
:accept that what is happening here-- the whisper campaigns, the
:harassment, the extraordinarily mean spirited debates, the demands put
:upon the administration-- are valid or necessary. We have tried to find
:a fair solution, and our efforts failed. We are closing the discussion
:board.
Alas. No, really.
:We can't look our babies in the eyes any more and say "one more minute,
:honey, just give me one more minute" so we can read a discussion board
What does it say that you could EVER do this, that some fictional
construct was more important than your all-fired child? Well, maybe
this is hipm00 we're talking about here.
:and deal with all the issues we're encountering. No matter what we do,
:it's never good enough. We're all vulnerable humans here, typically with
:minority/alternative views on one thing or another.
So are we all. But again, what did you expect from your clientele --
people with no identities of their own save how many and how old their
kidz are?
:We came here to support each other, to nurture the *mama* in each of us.
And then the hellions that never grew up took over?
:The boards were created to facilitate community. This was the reason we
:started the boards and continued to keep them running long after the
:experiment failed. As it is currently functioning, the boards are taking
:us away from our editorial tasks, our ideals, and our real life
:communities.
But what about your CHILDREN? THINK OF THE CHILDREN! MOOOOOOOO!
:We do not know what will take the place of these boards. We do know it
:will be designed for the silent, marginalized voices that these boards
:were meant for.
How about a big, SIZE="+5" banner that says "NO ONE OWES YOU ANYTHING"?
I think that distills the whole problem into one little sentence -- not
just on the boards, but in your editorial tasks, in your ideals, AND in
your real life communities.
:We know that many thousands of people are using the site and getting
:something from it. We feel that we are working for those people, for the
:ideal, for the women who have found resources and support here. We just
:can't justify the work when the community no longer supports the
:process, when so many people are creating drama for drama's sake.
What what WHAT? What kind of world have you been living in? THIS IS
YOUR CLIENTELE. Drama for drama's sake is the story of their LIVES.
Perhaps were you not delirious from the oxytocin you might observe that
by and large your breeder contingent have no business having children
when they lack the maturity to impart to them!
:This message board has been a great source of comfort and learning,
:growth and love. We do not discount that. We are grateful to each and
:every one of you who contributed to this community in positive ways.
:It's been an amazing, at times transcendent, experience. We are so
:thankful to have been part of it. But we need to tend our own gardens
:now. Play with our children. Walk outside and see the sun. We are human
:beings who have worked long and hard. And now we need a rest.
:
:The site isn't disapearing.
Damn!
:Hip Mama isn't over.
Double-damn!
:We are shutting down
:the database because it isn't sustainable.
You're shutting down the database because all the competent DBA's are
as CF as Einstein.
:We have all kinds of ideas
:about what to do to replace the discussion boards, and we are moving
:forward with those creative thoughts.
:
:We strongly encourage people to let us know if they create new
:communities, because we want to promote them, and continue to help
:people connect with each other. Remember: Hip Mama is not dead, and its
:name should not be used without permission from us.
How very "hip" of you to cop a phrase from the 1970s and demand that no
one use it without your permission. How utterly breederlike to steal
from the commons and refuse to give back to it.
:If you want to make
:something like Hip Mama's old boards, choose a name that reflects your
:unique perspective and goals.
So as long as they misspell the name creatively, they can go ahead
with it? Excellent! I'll have HyppeMammagh.com up within a fortnight.
Were you perchance expecting some other sort of creativity?
:We will be back with new projects and new ideas. We hope that they will
:live up to what this site has been at its best and most radiant.
:
:We are leaving this forum up for awhile so people can express their
:anger or grief, and connect with each other, find email addresses, leave
:forwarding messages. But we won't be answering questions or responding.
:We realize this is a loss, and we want people to have a little time to
:process that loss, but we are moving forward with the new projects that
:will replace the discussion board and need to reserve our time for our
:families.
Sorry it didn't work, hon. Maybe it'll prevent a few more trainwrecks
from 18-going-on-6 year old girls waving around the only fashion accessory
that drops out from between their legs. (Ben-wa balls aren't nearly so
fashionable.)
:We offer our sincere, deepest thanks to all of the people who have, over
:the years, given their time and energy to the site, and to the community
:members who have made positive contributions.
:
:With love,
:Bee, Suess, and Shaolin
Did your children ever say you could speak for them? How about the rest
of your herd? Is it "Shut up and suck on that udder, boy"?
>HS
-jhp, playing a harp on the hill
--
Job security is the root of all evil.
Sylvan Korvus
> "Dan B." <arcad...@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
> >
> >
> > On Hipmoo, or somewhere else? All of Hipmoo's past forums were deleted.
>
> On hipmoo. You can get there from the front page, first thing under "New
> Features"
OMG I *tried* to read that with an open mind, weigh each point
carefully & reasonably... but by 1/3rd of the way down it just got
way too absurd.
-Sylvan, Person WithOut Colour.
--
Vegan in Vancouver http://www.korvus.com/vancouvervegan
"There is no place of permanence in the Universe, no golden
existence, no finish line. We live on the edge of chaos, with
all the turbulence that implies..." - Linda Nagata, "Vast"
Jason G
>Hipmama.com shut down their discussion boards! Damn. I enjoyed them.
So have they shown up on fuckedmoron.com yet?
--
Jason G
"Hanging one scoundrel, it appears, does not deter the next.
Well, what of it? The first one is at least disposed of. "
--H.L. Mencken
Robert Myers
"Grim" <miss.c...@fetusfelcher.com> wrote in message
news:Xns91EDE5C8810...@130.133.1.4...
> Whoa. Snowball is on its last legs, big time.
>
Nothing in Fucked Company recently (unless someone has a subscription and
can check rumors?)
> Grim
Hooty Sapperticker
- had an unplanned daughter with her husband or boyfriend or whatever
- found tons of kiddie porn on his computer
- found more Lolitas on his hard drive after he PROMISED to stop looking
at them
- felt sorry for herself because he was only turned on by prepubescent
girls and not HER postnatal body type
- claimed he was a "wonderful man" who would never follow through on his
urges, EVER! Or at least she doesn’t think he has yet.
- didn't see the point of taking her daughter and leaving because "he's
a WONDERFUL man and I want him in her life"
- thought that maybe he could be cured of his pedophilia
- became furious and stormed out when, gently and empathetically, people
suggested that for legal, moral and practical reasons she consider
leaving him. They were being JUDGEMENTAL!!
A Hipmoo classic!
HS
Jbkred
>From: jrgusenet@REMOVE_ooo_THIS_xxx_PART_yahoo.com (Jason G)
>Date: Fri, Apr 12, 2002 00:59 EDT
>Message-id: <a95p7...@enews1.newsguy.com>
The Hip Moo forums are shutting down? Oh what a tragedy? Where will my
wanna-breed friend find the support to bitch about me, her non-supportive,
selfish bitch, CF former friend?
Golightly Grrl
Mike Healy
"Lorz" <lo...@pacifier.com> wrote in message
news:3CB68935...@pacifier.com...
> x-no-archive: yes
> *"Where else is a 42 year old queer sex-positive kinky femme married to a
> transgendered butch who is hoping to adopt her 13 year old foster daughter
and
> trying to develop a relationship with her adult stepdaughter and
granddaughter
> and work through the realities of being part of a
> multi-racial-cultural-religious-class blended family going to find any
REAL
> support?!? Certainly not here in rural Delaware!"
>
Please, please, please tell me that this blurb isn't based on reality.
Mike
Robert Myers
"Mike Healy" <mapma...@interaccess.com> wrote in message
news:oMAt8.3868$sj6.193182@news20...
I saw that message too. I was wondering who here posted it.
meowka
A tasty little excerpt from the article that speaks of our newsgroup:
"This is, as a fellow parent said, their conversation tends to sound
EXACTLY like the rhetoric of hate groups, complete with elaborate
pseudo-intellectual rationalizations, the cultivation of a faux victim
stance, and the use of derogatory, dehumanizing terms for the hated
group."
Click on "Features" then "First Person" and the article is (en)titled
"Child (And Compassion) Free"
Robert Myers
"meowka" <bria...@bellsouth.net> wrote in message
news:43e903d0.0204...@posting.google.com...
> Here's a sweet little article about us, you guys! Us!
> A tasty little excerpt from the article that speaks of our newsgroup:
>
> "This is, as a fellow parent said, their conversation tends to sound
> EXACTLY like the rhetoric of hate groups, complete with elaborate
> pseudo-intellectual rationalizations, the cultivation of a faux victim
> stance, and the use of derogatory, dehumanizing terms for the hated
> group."
>
Hmmm. Is there any way this passage doesn't apply to the posts on HipMoo?
Sounds exactly like the cult of the chyuld to me
MDinzey
>transgendered butch who is hoping to adopt her 13 year old foster daughter
>and
>trying to develop a relationship with her adult stepdaughter and
>granddaughter
>and work through the realities of being part of a
>multi-racial-cultural-religious-class blended family going to find any REAL
>support?!? Certainly not here in rural Delaware!"
>
>
>
>
No, Sounds like the "People's Republic of Park Slope"...
Matt
"Beg forgiveness, not permission"- An old(er) Aviator, USN, Ret.
Patrick M Geahan
> Here's a sweet little article about us, you guys! Us!
> A tasty little excerpt from the article that speaks of our newsgroup:
> "This is, as a fellow parent said, their conversation tends to sound
> EXACTLY like the rhetoric of hate groups, complete with elaborate
> pseudo-intellectual rationalizations, the cultivation of a faux victim
> stance, and the use of derogatory, dehumanizing terms for the hated
> group."
When I first starting reading this group, and heard of HipMaMa, I strolled
over there for a look.
One of the articles read(slightly paraphrase):
"There are people who hate children and hurt children! So anyone who
doesn't have children is as bad as a Nazi!"
It was kinda funny to read this on a site that supposedly devotes itself
to tolerance and understanding.
--
-------Patrick M Geahan---...@chartermi.net---ICQ:3784715------
Quote of the Week:"In heaven, the cooks are French, the mechanics are
German, and the police are British. In hell, the cooks are British,
the mechanics are French, and the police are German." - Anonymous
kaylar
> Hipmama.com shut down their discussion boards! Damn. I enjoyed them.
>
> HS
I was there at their forums just yesterday, trying to get an idea what
the cows think of the two deaf women (Deaf womyn? Deaf wimmin?) who
wanted to guarantee their child would be born minus a sense. Never
found any posts about that case, but I read enough to acquire a great
deal of contempt for them anyway. Their posts read like they're
robots, with programs telling them how to "think" about race,
'oppression', and "isms". Pathetic.
IleneB
Oh, no. Where on earth can we go now for material?
Guess their mods noticed that a bunch of welfare-snorting, food-stamp
cashing, dumpster-diving chickies who have kids with one loser after
another while getting their PhD in Wimmen's Stydies don't make a
community of contributors.
Oh, dear, Lorz will now have these people running all over Portland
without a community to control them.
Ilene B
Ryenna
a WONDERFUL man and I want him in her life" >>
As what? I'm sure you all can come up with the obvious.
-Ry
--
"Treat me good, I'll treat you better -
treat me bad, I'll treat you worse"
- Blue Blaze Irregular motto
Nina Paley
> You're shutting down the database because all the competent DBA's are
> as CF as Einstein.
Albert Einstein wasn't CF.
--N.
jhp
He wasnt!? D'oh.
>--N.
It's a fair cop, but society's to blame.
-jhp, um, Alan Turing? damn... where's my short list.
mytoysdammit
"Hooty Sapperticker" <howdy...@thedoghousemail.com> wrote in message
news:3CB65F21...@thedoghousemail.com...
> Hipmama.com shut down their discussion boards! Damn. I enjoyed them.
>
> HS
Hip-moos was one of my fave reading sites for those days when you need to be
reminded that your life absolutely doesn't suck as much as you think it
might.
They had a race riot over there (imagine setting up a section on a public
board on which only white women who'd had children could post? They sure
had the opposite) that started a couple of weeks ago.
They plain don't have a Unix admin who could pull her head out of her
overstretched twat for long enough to learn some of the technicalities of
running a board that size. They had HUGE money problems. It's
HAAAAARRRRRDDDD to chip in to keep a cyber-community alive when you are
spending your public aid and student grant checks on "the baybee". Even
harder to do so when you are spending the same on ISP fees, DVDs, dope,
booze, carry out food, etc.
It's kind of a pity, really--I got many a snide giggle out of reading that
board. Plus, whatever on earth are these cows going to do now that there
isn't a centralized location to brag about how filthy one's house is, how
perverted one's "baby-daddy" is, etc. Somewhere out there tonight will be
one poor distraught teen-moo who, without any source of information on how
to scam welfare, scam childsupport, bullshit Child Protective Services, scam
free babysitting, might actually have to get off her lazy "liberated" ass
and go out and seek gainful employment while accepting responsibility for
her actions.
Pity that poor moo. With the loss of the precious resource that was
"hipmama", that moo is going to have to actually do gainful work.
....sigh....
Kat
Sol Taibi
this document is used solely for educational purposes
this document is not used for monetary profit in any way ...
this document is reproduced in its entirety
document contributors are acknowledged
this anti-copyright notice is reproduced with this document
Up yours, hipmoo!
xintarr
Sapperticker]
Hey, there's always girlmom.com, full of head-explode-y, damn-your-life-sucks
pleasure.
Xintarr
--------------------------------
"There's nothing more likely to stop an inheritance than a thingy-shaped
turnip."
~Lord Edmund Blackadder
xintarr
>was my saving grace," "I don't know what I am going to do without
>hipmoo," "I cannot deal with losing the hipmoo boards," and "Hipmoo
>was the only thing that keeps me sane while Breedaleigh wakes up every
>half hour at night." Sounds to me like these "womyn" have a very
>precarious grip on reality.
>
>Call me morbid, but I hear the sounds of faucets being turned on.
>Texas Baths, anyone?
>
>--bethster
I think one of them made a "joking" comment that was something like "What am I
supposed to do now? Play with my baby?"
Yeah, great. Wish you were MY mom.
NOT! (Speaking of "Remember when..." hehe)
Aynthem
mytoysdammit wrote in message ...
>They plain don't have a Unix admin who could pull her head out of her
>overstretched twat for long enough to learn some of the technicalities of
>running a board that size. They had HUGE money problems. It's
>HAAAAARRRRRDDDD to chip in to keep a cyber-community alive when you are
>spending your public aid and student grant checks on "the baybee". Even
>harder to do so when you are spending the same on ISP fees, DVDs, dope,
>booze, carry out food, etc.
It's absolutely amazing to me that Turtle seems to be quite capable of
running both the Rants page and the Brats discussion board single-handedly
without the whining that was the main feature of that hippomoo farewell
message. Perhaps it's because he's dealing with adults and not whining,
spoiled rotten entitlement brats with brats of their own? Or is because he
himself is a rational, responsible adult who has rules and sticks to them?
Melody, DTC charter member
Aynthem
bethster wrote in message ...
>As someone who left this particular group in a huff in the aftermath
>of September 11, I can say that when I returned to the group, I was
>welcomed with open arms, and all ill will was pretty much forgotten.
>I was not the recipient of attacks upon my character for feeling like
>I needed to leave, nor was I judged when I decided that I really
>wanted to return.
>
>This group has its share of acrimony, sure. I can also say that I
>respect each and every poster on this group, even if I conflicted with
>them in the past. And these conflicts do not mean that I no longer
>speak with that particular person, and vice versa (the only time I use
>killfiles here is when those "blobbi" posts somehow show up). We can
>fight, and we do. When all is said and done, though, intelligent and
>rational discourse eventually takes the place of the angry posts and
>we all move on.
>
>Now, back to reading the "anti-racism" FAQ at hipmoo (*mind boggle*)
Bethster, I agree with what you're saying. My politics don't exactly jive
with those of many posters here, but I don't feel that is a barrier to real
communication. Everyone here respects everyone else here as an individual
(with the exception of a very, very small handful of personal one-on-one
conflicts that are pretty much inevitable in any large community) and
everyone here understands that as adults with different life experiences but
one thing in common, we'll all have different viewpoints on issues and
different beliefs. That's the sheer beauty of a truly adult community -- we
don't all have to think in lockstep in order to be validated and comfortable
in our skins. The conflicts that do arise are taken in stride and don't
disrupt the greater purpose and continuing existence of this place.
The major thing I've noticed whenever lurking on parenting boards, or
anyplace where mainly female parents contribute, is that a great majority of
mothers/moothers crave and actually NEED the approval of their peers in
order to function. It's almost as if each female in the motherhood
community is simultaneously playing the role of both child and mother, both
craving the approval of the authority figures (moderators or other mothers)
and acting as the disciplinarians (mothers) when a peer dares to step out of
line and disagree with the authority or majority line.
I was just lurking at the hippomoo boards a day before they were taken down,
and what struck me was the strident, this is the right and only way to think
tone that permeated the entire board structure. The whole thing was
designed to, once again, validate the self defined "oppressed", and the
whole thing became a game of one-upwombanship on just how me was more
oppressed than thee. Tell an entire community of people that they don't
have to be responsible for their actions or decisions, preach to them how
they're victims over and over again, hold their hands and tell them that
somebody else will always take care of them and make everything all better,
and then become bitter and give up because you can't handle the monster you
created? Feh.
Hipmamas are a bunch of cowardly, stubbornly, willfully ignorant brats who
hide behind the clock of misunderstood victimhood and who refuse to grow up
and take responsibility for their lives, no matter how old they may be. And
now, finally, in one small way, they reaped the crop they sowed.
And that anti-racism FAQ reads like it was written for a term paper in
Post-Modern American Sociology at a college like Antioch or Oberlin or
Berkley. Ick.
Melody, proud to be a Childfree Adult
Susie Que
has recently gotten a "redesign" to make it look ever so urban-edgzy and
kewl. And who are the anointed Queen Bees--why, it's Bee Lavender and
her crowd! Sound familiar? RIIGHT. The original hipmoos!
So what makes a bunch of 20- and 30-something moos ditch their own site
to hang out with a bunch of 14-year-old mothers? Another "m" word,
rhymes with "funny."
Before the "redesign," girlmom.com disclosed that it gets money from the
National Science Foundation--yup, a taxpayer-supported U.S. agency...and
what's real funny is that this fact, which was on the site in December,
is now nowhere to be found. Wonder why. Actually, I don't, really.
jhp
Turtle can't wrangle technology or scale a web site for shit. Notice how
rants from over 200 ago just roll right off? And how the discussion
board drags ass and requires gratuituous Javascript to run because
he's a lazy-ass Notes programmer and Notes makes an awfully poor hammer
for public nails? Any one of us with a clue, a week, a server, and a
high-bandwidth connection could build a better, more usable, faster
system without all the crap.
Yet having rules and sticking to them will keep a system alive despite
structural issues, enemies from without or within, and wide differences
of opinion. As soon the rules go mushy, or exceptions are made, the
whole thing falls. See also the US Constitution.
Also keep in mind that Turtle doesn't have to draw traffic to keep the
paychecks coming. The moocows do. So as has come to be expected in the
professional world, crocodile tears must be shed at closing so as to
conserve some traffic from the hypersensitive heifers.
>Melody, DTC charter member
-jhp, on a public web site "Javascript" is a euphemism for "laziness"
Bill Bradley
> You know, I find all of this soooo interesting. Are there any examples,
> anywhere, of a CF community imploding under the weight of its own
> infighting? I've been part of several and can't think of a single one,
> especially one as massive as HipMoo.
Try childfree.org [yes, the domain name resolves to a ferret page]
Much in-fighting and sniping before it disappeared.
Bill
Scorpio Chick
> And they say *we're* hateful...
Lakeshore Woman, I posted almost this exact same message over on
Turtle's board. I see more spite and nastiness on the moo and
breederboards than I ever see on the CF ones, and yet they all seem to
hold themselves up as being so perfect and righteous because of their
bodily functions? Uh-huh, sure.
I guess Denial ain't just a river in Egypt...
- ScorpioChick
IleneB
<ayn...@softhome.net> wrote:
> And that anti-racism FAQ reads like it was written for a term paper in
> Post-Modern American Sociology at a college like Antioch or Oberlin or
> Berkley. Ick.
You mean it wasn't?
Ilene B
tigger
Abbie F.
>Susie Que wrote:
>
>> Before the "redesign," girlmom.com disclosed that it gets money from the
>> National Science Foundation--yup, a taxpayer-supported U.S. agency...
> WHEN did NSF become a tooth fairy for teen moos?
Then they should also fund a site to study the benefits of the childfree
lifestyle. I'll bet we live longer due to less stressful conditions, happier
outlooks, and a tendency toward above-average intelligence which leads to wiser
choices all around. If we could just get the statistics to back that up, the
surgeon general could issue a recommendation that people who don't breed tend
to suffer fewer of the health problems so common in breeders. (For starters, we
get to keep all of our own calcium and vitamins!)
In this month's issue of Musc!e & Fitness Hers, it is noted that pregnancy
causes a woman's skin to stretch 400% and her fat cells to grow to 125% of
their original size (from a book review of "Outsm@rting the Fem@le F@t Cell."
Now *that*'s a subject worthy of further study. :-)
Many winners of their reader contest had to fight to rebuild their bodies after
having kids. This is apparently such a heroic act that it warrants special
mention due to the incredible toll childbearing must take on even these
presumably fit women. It's puzzling that they'd do that to themselves in the
first place, knowing they might never see their prized muscles again.
- Abbie CF ++ TK ++++ TPI +++ A ++
"I'd love to have a Mustang again. But I've got kids..." - Wistful former
sports car owner, admiring an immaculate childfree vehicle. ;>
Noelle
news:20020413003324...@mb-fi.aol.com...
> Many winners of their reader contest had to fight to rebuild their bodies
after
> having kids. This is apparently such a heroic act that it warrants special
> mention due to the incredible toll childbearing must take on even these
> presumably fit women. It's puzzling that they'd do that to themselves in
the
> first place, knowing they might never see their prized muscles again.
I don't seem to be showing up, don't know when or if I'll ever start showing
up again...my ISP's been heaving and balking all week.
However...this whole idea that you can't ever regain muscle tone after
childbirth is...well, not always true. I realize that every woman has
different body mass and metabolism and all that, but I just started
exercising again, using a workout DVD by fitness expert Joyce Vedral and her
daughter Marthe. Marthe is about my age, I think--late 20s to early 30s,
looks like--and the DVD was filmed one year after she had given birth by
C-section. They showed a "before" picture. She looked awful: flabby, puffy,
poochy stomach seamed and scarred. In the DVD, she looks incredible. She's
not musclebound or skinny, she just looks well-toned and healthy.
The difference between her and the women who whine about how hard it is to
get your figure back after childbirth? She did something about it.
--
We draw our own designs, but fortune has to make that frame
--Rush
Noelle
From http://www.fred.net/turtle/kids/kidrants :
*************
"Outside the mainstream?" Don't even TRY to tell a CFer what "outside the
mainstream" means. We live it every goddamn day. And while we are quite
proud of it, we don't act like we're the only non-mainstream idea on the
web. The operators of hipmoo.com should get around more.
*************
Right on...My posts seem to be appearing once again, much to my relief.
Terrie Strike
>On Fri, 12 Apr 2002 13:25:04 -0500, Lakeshore Woman
><lakesh...@netscape.net> wrote:
>
>>Cake of Oppression
>
>:: snip recipe ::
>
>Would that be a +2 Cake of Oppression?
>
*snork* Owww. Liquid up nose. Gee, would that go along with my +3 gloves of
strength?
-Terrie
Jason G
>On Fri, 12 Apr 2002 13:25:04 -0500, Lakeshore Woman
><lakesh...@netscape.net> wrote:
>
>>Cake of Oppression
>
>:: snip recipe ::
>
>Would that be a +2 Cake of Oppression?
>
Goes well with the +3 Port of Loquacity.
--
Jason G
"Hanging one scoundrel, it appears, does not deter the next.
Well, what of it? The first one is at least disposed of. "
--H.L. Mencken
Jacqueline Rochelle
he was gay, yes?
"jhp" <x+47t...@getoffthe.net> wrote in message
news:a978a9$5r9$1...@dildo.inside.antigates.com...
Sol Taibi
> > Hipmama.com shut down their discussion boards! Damn. I enjoyed them.
>
> doublespeak reinventing failure as "ending an experimental phase."
>
> The message confirms what people have said here, and sometimes to their
> faces over on HipMoo: They're a bunch of crude, rude, nasty, disgusting
> bitches that suck up resources without gratitude, respect, or
> consideration for anyone else. And now they've gone and burned down their
> own clubhouse.
>
I wonder if they bothered to keep archives?
Anyone here work for Google? Yipe!
Sol Taibi
> "Robert Myers" <rpmy...@NOSPAMhotmail.com> wrote:
> > "Dan B." <arcad...@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
> > >
> > > > You want doublespeak and redefining? Go read the racism faq.
> > >
> > > On Hipmoo, or somewhere else? All of Hipmoo's past forums were deleted.
> >
> > On hipmoo. You can get there from the front page, first thing under "New
> > Features"
>
> OMG I *tried* to read that with an open mind, weigh each point
> carefully & reasonably... but by 1/3rd of the way down it just got
> way too absurd.
>
The message seems to be that *everbody* regardless of color
should act like a stereotypical welfare queen.
Somebody is actually paying good money to keep this site up,
even if the constituency isn't capable of supporting a message
group.
Somebody is *subsidizing* this site. They sure aren't making a
living selling tee shirts that have "breeder" printed on them.
Jen in Austin
solomo...@computer.org (Sol Taibi) scribbled:
>I wonder if they bothered to keep archives?
>
>Anyone here work for Google? Yipe!
I have one thing to say:
I really like Google's site, search, etc. But they royally fucked up
the Deja Usenet archives.
Sometimes new *isn't* better.
Jen
--
"I have wasted time, and now time doth waste me" - Shakespeare
mytoysdammit
"tigger" <wm...@insidevc.com> wrote in message
news:d1334534.02041...@posting.google.com...
> Probably got busted en masse for Food Stamp Fraud.
Dunno about that, but one of 'em got turned in to CPS by a friend of mine.
Posting on "living in filth" with a description of her living
quarters/situation in great and gross detail. My friend happened to own a
property nearby and after much research was able to narrow the info down to
who exactly "filth-moo" must be...
Kat
Jbkred
>From: "mytoysdammit" <spammenot.com>
>Date: Sat, Apr 13, 2002 16:55 EDT
>Message-id: <a9a5sn$496$1...@slb2.atl.mindspring.net>
Ooh, I want more details on this.
Golightly Grrl
mytoysdammit
"Jbkred" <jbk...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20020413181007...@mb-fa.aol.com...
I don't have the original postings and there are no archives for this site
(google?). Basically, one woman posted repeatedly about conditions in her
home including gross details on roaches, stench, the child eating "things"
off the floor, moldy clothing, piles of soiled diapers "tossed wherever they
landed", etc., and happened to mention some "outside details" involving
trash and worse on the lot. My "pen-pal" lived in the same town and owns a
few rental properties in the same general area. (CA-Oakland 'burbs). I
jokingly sent her the link saying something the effect of "gee, aren't you
glad you don't own THIS property?"
She responded telling me that no, she didn't own this property but had a
pretty good idea as to who did as it was a small (6 unit?) section 8
apartment building in the middle of the same block on which she owned an 8
flat corner building that she was trying to get certified for some senior
type of housing thing.
The kicker was the moo posting about repeated HUD visits ordering her to
clean the place up and my penpal having heard the absentee landlord bitching
about the same issue. It was pretty easy from there for her to find out
exactly who the tenant was. From reading some details about conditions there
and how this "hipmama" was raising her infant and toddler, she decided to
turn the person into CPS in CA.
I initially felt the landlord was at fault also with this issue but it turns
out that under HUD housing laws landlords have a process they have to follow
to deal with "bad" tenants.
Kat
Aynthem
mytoysdammit wrote in message ...
>
Gee, I guess she wasn't being "supportive" of moo's alternative lifestyle,
was she?
I feel dirty just reading your description, and I'm not exactly a fastidious
housekeeper myself.
Melody
nokomis
> Here's a sweet little article about us, you guys! Us!
> A tasty little excerpt from the article that speaks of our newsgroup:
>
> "This is, as a fellow parent said, their conversation tends to sound
> EXACTLY like the rhetoric of hate groups, complete with elaborate
> pseudo-intellectual rationalizations, the cultivation of a faux victim
> stance, and the use of derogatory, dehumanizing terms for the hated
> group."
Mommeee! Mommee! Lookit all of those big words!
-valerie (the snarky one)
nok...@tdl.com
nokomis
>
> "jhp" <x+47t...@getoffthe.net> wrote in message
> news:a978a9$5r9$1...@dildo.inside.antigates.com...
>> >> You're shutting down the database because all the competent DBA's are
>> >> as CF as Einstein.
>
>> >Albert Einstein wasn't CF.
>>
>> He wasnt!? D'oh.
> Yes, but from all accounts he *should* have been! Turing was childfree but
> he was gay, yes?
Are we allowed to count historical figures that never married(*) as One
Of Us?
-valerie (the other one)
nok...@tdl.com
(*) And never managed to get an illegitimate sprog pinned on 'em.
sfw
> You know, I find all of this soooo interesting. Are there any examples,
> anywhere, of a CF community imploding under the weight of its own
> infighting?
First, I feel really sorry for them. SO not my kind of community, but
it mattered to them. Sad.
Second - yeah, I was a regular on a cf (web) message board that blew
apart. The founder was stressy, the mod-thing got WAY out of hand,
there was massive infighting, and people slipped away, or left in a
huff, until it was down to almost nothing. Then, it got locked up as a
private forum, and no one ever saw it again.
I still miss some people that I lost track of there.
Sarah
nokomis
> However...this whole idea that you can't ever regain muscle tone after
> childbirth is...well, not always true. I realize that every woman has
> different body mass and metabolism and all that, but I just started
> exercising again, using a workout DVD by fitness expert Joyce Vedral and her
> daughter Marthe. Marthe is about my age, I think--late 20s to early 30s,
> looks like--and the DVD was filmed one year after she had given birth by
> C-section. They showed a "before" picture. She looked awful: flabby, puffy,
> poochy stomach seamed and scarred. In the DVD, she looks incredible. She's
> not musclebound or skinny, she just looks well-toned and healthy.
Yabbut, working out with the frequency of the average "fitness expert"(*)
ain't gonna do shit about the fact that her breasts are permanently
saggy, her feet are bigger and her pelvic bone is considerably wider.
I just remembered one of the determining factors in deciding never to
sprog was the set of line drawings in "Our Bodies, Ourselves"
illustrating a cross-section of a breast through "all the stages of a
woman's(**) life". Right up until the "pregnancy" picture was just
fine. Droop-o-rama after! Permanent! Yuck!(***)
Pregnancy. Just don't do it.
-valerie (the other one)
nok...@tdl.com
(*) Which no mortal should have to do.
(**) "=mother", of course.
(***) Yes I *am* that vain. And no, I don't want to hear another round
of "well I never got knocked up, but my breasts are..." stuff. We were
talking about *me*. Not you.(****)
(****) I'm not being unsympathetic. I'm just tired of having any
comment I make regarding happiness with my body as-is to be
turned into yet another round of bash-anyone-with-the-gall-to-be-thin-
or-anyone-who-thinks-thin-people-are-attractive. Mmmkay? (*****)
(*****) How's that for a pre-emptive strike? :)
Noelle
news:a9d9h...@enews1.newsguy.com...
> Yabbut, working out with the frequency of the average "fitness expert"(*
> ain't gonna do shit about the fact that her breasts are permanently
> saggy, her feet are bigger and her pelvic bone is considerably wider.
Gee, we must have seen a different DVD. Her breasts looked pretty perky to
me. Of course, breasts have no muscles of their own, so it's the muscles
surrounding them that have to be exercised. Any body part that's not taken
care of is going to sag, preggo or nulliparous.
> I just remembered one of the determining factors in deciding never to
> sprog was the set of line drawings in "Our Bodies, Ourselves"
> illustrating a cross-section of a breast through "all the stages of a
> woman's(**) life". Right up until the "pregnancy" picture was just
> fine. Droop-o-rama after! Permanent! Yuck!(***)
Yeah, I had a discussion with a friend several years ago, long before either
of us got married, in which I said that I had no desire to find out if I'd
be one of those women whose bodies never recovered. She accused me of being
selfish. I said I wasn't being selfish, I was thinking of Shawn, because he
liked me the way I was.
> Pregnancy. Just don't do it.
Now, that needs to be on a bumper sticker. :)
> (****) I'm not being unsympathetic. I'm just tired of having any
> comment I make regarding happiness with my body as-is to be
> turned into yet another round of bash-anyone-with-the-gall-to-be-thin-
> or-anyone-who-thinks-thin-people-are-attractive. Mmmkay? (*****)
Ehh, I definitely wasn't headed down that road. I'm glad you're happy with
your body. Me, I'm not, and that's why I've started exercising again. Chacon
a son gout, of course. Time was, I weighed 130 lbs*, and I got pretty tired
of the "You make me sick!" chorus. I started wearing loose clothes in
self-defense.
*stretched out over 5'8", that's fairly skinny. I have photographic proof!
Jason G
>(****) I'm not being unsympathetic. I'm just tired of having any
>comment I make regarding happiness with my body as-is
Hey, no quarrel here. I like your breasts the way they are too.
Patrick M Geahan
> I really like Google's site, search, etc. But they royally fucked up
> the Deja Usenet archives.
How so? Personally, I've found it easier to use since the purhcase.
--
-------Patrick M Geahan---...@chartermi.net---ICQ:3784715------
Quote of the Week:"In heaven, the cooks are French, the mechanics are
German, and the police are British. In hell, the cooks are British,
the mechanics are French, and the police are German." - Anonymous
Terrie Strike
>"nokomis" <nok...@tdl.com> wrote in message
>news:a9d9h...@enews1.newsguy.com...
>> comment I make regarding happiness with my body as-is to be
>> turned into yet another round of bash-anyone-with-the-gall-to-be-thin-
>> or-anyone-who-thinks-thin-people-are-attractive. Mmmkay? (*****)
>
>Ehh, I definitely wasn't headed down that road. I'm glad you're happy with
>your body. Me, I'm not, and that's why I've started exercising again. Chacon
>a son gout, of course. Time was, I weighed 130 lbs*, and I got pretty tired
>of the "You make me sick!" chorus. I started wearing loose clothes in
>self-defense.
>
>*stretched out over 5'8", that's fairly skinny. I have photographic proof!
>
I know that trick! I've been doing it so long that if I wear something tighter
than normal, people think I've lost weight. And try to feed me lard. (I'm
5'6", 112 lbs). Being this thin has done nothing more than leave me with a
burning hatred for people who go on and on about how "Our girls are being
damaged by the emphasis on being thin". I was in junior high the first time I
was accused of being anoriexic. It's followed me though my life. I have no
problem with the "Be happy with your natural appearance" stance, but the "Thin
is evil and unnatural" refrain always made me feel like they were trying to
punish me for something out of my control, like they thought I was thin to
spite them.
-Terrie
Kent
: Second - yeah, I was a regular on a cf (web) message board that blew
: apart. The founder was stressy, the mod-thing got WAY out of hand,
: there was massive infighting, and people slipped away, or left in a
: huff, until it was down to almost nothing. Then, it got locked up as a
: private forum, and no one ever saw it again.
Unfortunately, this tends to happen on 'most ANY online forum after a
while...somehow, here at ascf, we have just the right spirit of anarchy to
keep us going, I suppose?
Kent
Jen in Austin
M Geahan<pmge...@chartermi.net> scribbled:
>Jen in Austin <use...@robandjen.net> wrote:
>> I really like Google's site, search, etc. But they royally fucked up
>> the Deja Usenet archives.
>
>How so? Personally, I've found it easier to use since the purhcase.
Deja's interface would give you a list of newsgroups that an email
address had posted to, you'd click on the newsgroup name, and you'd get
the author's posts in that group. Google pretends to do this, but it's
incomplete as hell.
Deja's interface was less clunky than Google's as well. It gave you
more information in less space.
Even if you use the "&filter=0" parameter Google is incomplete.
Jen
--
All Scottish food is based on a dare.
sfw
>
> sfw did tell us:
>
> : Second - yeah, I was a regular on a cf (web) message board that blew
> : apart.
> Unfortunately, this tends to happen on 'most ANY online forum after a
> while...somehow, here at ascf, we have just the right spirit of anarchy to
> keep us going, I suppose?
Newsgroups seem to me to be more stable than web spaces.
Actually, mailing lists also seem to me to be more stable than web
spaces.
I wonder if it is in the nature of the medium - newsgroups and mailing
lists require more initiative to participate in, so people who bother
are more committed? Web spaces are too easily trolled, and often
populated by new-ish users who are more vulnerable to trolls? Or
something else entirely, perhaps.
Sarah
Eddie McCreary
Sarah> Kent wrote:
>> sfw did tell us:
>>
>> : Second - yeah, I was a regular on a cf (web) message board
>> that blew : apart.
>> Unfortunately, this tends to happen on 'most ANY online forum
>> after a while...somehow, here at ascf, we have just the right
>> spirit of anarchy to keep us going, I suppose?
Sarah> Newsgroups seem to me to be more stable than web spaces.
Sarah> Actually, mailing lists also seem to me to be more stable
Sarah> than web spaces.
Sarah> I wonder if it is in the nature of the medium - newsgroups
Sarah> and mailing lists require more initiative to participate
Sarah> in, so people who bother are more committed? Web spaces
Sarah> are too easily trolled, and often populated by new-ish
Sarah> users who are more vulnerable to trolls? Or something else
Sarah> entirely, perhaps.
Well, websites by their very nature requires central management, where
as newsgroups are distributed. Once they are setup no special work is
required to maintain them. Excepting of course for moderated groups.
Newsgroups have fallen apart before, usually due to outside trolling
or apathy of it's memebers. There actually used to be discussion on
alt.sex.* a decade ago.
--
Eddie McCreary Outside of a dog, a book is a man's best
mailto:beo...@heorot.org friend. Inside of a dog, it's too dark
http://www.heorot.org to read. -Groucho Marx
Noelle
news:a9eh5g$132c$1...@wiscnews.wiscnet.net...
(trimmed for brevity)
> I know that trick! I've been doing it so long that if I wear something
tighter
> than normal, people think I've lost weight. And try to feed me lard. (I'm
> 5'6", 112 lbs). Being this thin has done nothing more than leave me with a
> burning hatred for people who go on and on about how "Our girls are being
> damaged by the emphasis on being thin". I was in junior high the first
time I
> was accused of being anoriexic. It's followed me though my life. I have no
> problem with the "Be happy with your natural appearance" stance, but the
"Thin
> is evil and unnatural" refrain always made me feel like they were trying
to
> punish me for something out of my control, like they thought I was thin to
> spite them.
I guess that's why I don't bear thin people any ill will or even envy. I've
been there and know what it feels like to be on the receiving end of
comments that would be considered hateful in tone if they were leveled at a
woman with a few pounds to lose. At the first job I ever had (nurse's aide
at a retirement home), one of the other aides asked me quite abruptly if I
was anorexic. After seeing me sit down and eat lunch, she decided (on her
own) that I must be bulimic, and nothing I could say could persuade her
otherwise.
I've been down to 115 before, and that really was too skinny (I lost a lot
of weight following bronchitis). The absolute most I've ever weighed was
182, and that's a bit embarrassing to admit. I took off 20 lbs. in the first
year after giving up meat, and making no other changes in my lifestyle.
I think some people really do damage themselves to be thin. And I think that
some people really are that thin naturally, and if they're happy then more
power to them. One of my best friends is 6'1", weighs 140 lbs, and he eats
all the wrong things: lots of red meat, cholestereol, saturated fats, no
veggies, no exercise, but still maintains that physique. When I was in high
school and eating maybe one meal a day (and running around all day long), I
weighed 130. After I graduated, and started eating more and moving around
less, I gained 20 lbs, almost all of which went to my chest. So I had a
dilemma: either I could be skinny, or I could have cleavage. Shawn, dear
man, says he loves me either way. :)
Jason G
>So I had a
>dilemma: either I could be skinny, or I could have cleavage. Shawn, dear
>man, says he loves me either way. :)
Wise man. He must have The Book. :-)
Empress
high the first time I
> was accused of being anoriexic. It's followed me though my life. I
have no
> problem with the "Be happy with your natural appearance" stance, but
the "Thin
> is evil and unnatural" refrain always made me feel like they were
trying to
> punish me for something out of my control, like they thought I was
thin to
> spite them.
Terrie- I'm with you here. I'm very tall and very thin (no stats needed,
because I haven't weighed myself in several years). I have been accused
of having eating disorders by doctors, and when I say, no I'm just thin,
it's followed by an hour-long Q&A to try to get to the root of my denial
and my underlying issues with food. When I get my lunch at work, often
fried chicken, fries, shake, and some form of chocolate, people have
said, in my presence, "Well, she's just going to throw it up anyway." I
have been singled out in a psychology course as being the body type that
causes eating disorders in others, and strangers constantly ask me how
tall I am, how much I weigh, and do I eat.
Depending on my mood, I usually respond with, "I have no issues with
food, but you obviously do. Have you seen a doctor about your own eating
disorder?" or "I've never puked up my meals before, but I could try it
now, on your shoes" or "F-ck off, lardass"*.
I'm constantly pissed off by the notion that we should accept all body
types as beautiful, as long as the person's healthy, except, of course,
if the person is thin, in which case they have been sent by the Devil
and the fashion magazines to make normal women insecure. I am normal,
this is how I am built. Yes, I can eat like a pig and not gain an ounce,
but the price I pay is having to be constantly defending my appearance.
And it sucks.
*I don't habitually refer to anyone of any weight as a lardass, but if
you bring my body into question, I have the right to bring yours up.
Terrie Strike
>"Terrie Strike" <str...@stu.beloit.edunospam> wrote I was in junior
>high the first time I
>> was accused of being anoriexic. It's followed me though my life. I
>have no
>> problem with the "Be happy with your natural appearance" stance, but
>the "Thin
>> is evil and unnatural" refrain always made me feel like they were
>trying to
>> punish me for something out of my control, like they thought I was
>thin to
>> spite them.
>
>Terrie- I'm with you here. I'm very tall and very thin (no stats needed,
>because I haven't weighed myself in several years). I have been accused
>of having eating disorders by doctors, and when I say, no I'm just thin,
>it's followed by an hour-long Q&A to try to get to the root of my denial
>and my underlying issues with food. When I get my lunch at work, often
>fried chicken, fries, shake, and some form of chocolate, people have
>said, in my presence, "Well, she's just going to throw it up anyway." I
>have been singled out in a psychology course as being the body type that
>causes eating disorders in others, and strangers constantly ask me how
>tall I am, how much I weigh, and do I eat.
Thankfully, my doctors have never commented on my weight beyond a single
"You'd be considered anorexicly thin, but according to your charts, this is
normal for you" -- I've been thin since I was a little kid. Most friends don't
comment much on it (which is one reason why they're friends). It's "friends"
-- people who think they're my friend who I just want to go away -- who cause
problems. One such "friend", who has struggled with eating disorders in the
past, once said that they sight of me in a slinky dress made her want to puke.
I just rolled my eyes and explained that while I couldn't do anything about my
appearence making her uncomfrotable, she could do a lot about her comments
making me uncomfortable. Today, I'm not nearly so polite. I'd just say "Don't
blame your insecurities on my genes. You want to throw up your lunch, fine.
Just don't expect me to care."
The worst, though, is people who, uninvited, put their hands around my upper
arm or waist to see how tiny they are. My response for that one is "Before you
comment on how you wish you were as thin as me, would you like to see the
bruises my elbow left in my ribs?" This one's also good for general bitching
about people wishin they were built like me.
-Terrie
nokomis
> "nokomis" <nok...@tdl.com> wrote in message
> news:a9d9h...@enews1.newsguy.com...
>
> > Yabbut, working out with the frequency of the average "fitness expert"(*
> > ain't gonna do shit about the fact that her breasts are permanently
> > saggy, her feet are bigger and her pelvic bone is considerably wider.
>
> Gee, we must have seen a different DVD. Her breasts looked pretty perky to
> me. Of course, breasts have no muscles of their own, so it's the muscles
> surrounding them that have to be exercised. Any body part that's not taken
> care of is going to sag, preggo or nulliparous.
I have no recollection of watching any fitness DVDs. (How do you know
"perkiness" isn't a wonderbra? Or is this one of those nude aerobics
thingies?)
"Permanently saggy" has to do with pregnancy/lactation-induced changes
in the breast tissue (milk producing cells multiply and grow, then get
left behind, "deflated" after lactation ceases). Has nothing to do
with taking care of 'em.
> > (****) I'm not being unsympathetic. I'm just tired of having any
> > comment I make regarding happiness with my body as-is to be
> > turned into yet another round of bash-anyone-with-the-gall-to-be-thin-
> > or-anyone-who-thinks-thin-people-are-attractive. Mmmkay? (*****)
>
> Ehh, I definitely wasn't headed down that road.
<looks around nervously>, I have encountered online some people who go
utterly ballistic if anyone mentions weighing even an ounce less than
they do. I'm being defensive lest I be, um, enlightened that my
inability to gain weight means that I am an insensitive snob.
Abbie F.
>
>The difference between her and the women who whine about how hard it is to
>get your figure back after childbirth? She did something about it.
Still... there's this indefinable "something" that goes AWOL once a woman
sprogs; it's the light in her eyes, now dulled by sleepless nights; the
beauteous glow of inner peace, shredded by endless caterwauling - and all of
that seems to dull the complexion and make the skin less elastic. Of course,
that's all just based on my biased observations. ;> Not a chance I ever plan
on taking. It's hard enough staying toned up without the Sisyphean task of
battling post-sprog deterioration.
Someone I know was a boy-magnet in school. She sprogged twice, gained 80
pounds, and stress whittled her back down again. Though she's still pretty,
it's in a different way. She's got somewhat of a "meaner" look now; you get the
impression that any minute she might blow a fuse and yell at you. That, to me,
isn't an attractive feature.
- Abbie CF ++ TK ++++ TPI +++ A ++
"I'd love to have a Mustang again. But I've got kids..." - Wistful former
sports car owner, admiring an immaculate childfree vehicle. ;>
Abbie F.
>Being this thin has done nothing more than leave me with a
>burning hatred for people who go on and on about how "Our girls are being
>damaged by the emphasis on being thin".
I disagree with that idea too. I think the media uses what's generally
considered attractive in a generic, blandly-acceptable way to draw attention to
whatever's being sold. It's not an intentional conspiracy to undermine anyone.
If people are disturbed by gorgeous models, there's nothing stopping them from
either working at self-acceptance, knowing that those heavenly creatures
actually only represent a tiny minority of the general public, or if they're so
irretrievably unhappy with themselves that mere pictures offend their
sensibilities, doing something about it.
Everyone has at least one amazing, admirable feature they can play up, but very
few people are completely made up of amazing features. So most of us just have
to accept the fact that we're regular folks, because that's reality. The
purpose of these magazines isn't to make anyone feel better or worse about
herself; that's a personal decision one makes when confronted with an image.
If magazines were truly in the flattery business, they could just grab up some
old coot with green teeth and gobs of dandruff for the cover shot. We'd ALL
feel foxy after seeing that! And it would make the green-toothed flaky-headed
crowd happy, but it wouldn't provide the element of escape, fabulousness and
fantasy that many publications wish to project. The idea is to bring the
reader into a glamorous - if somewhat unrealistic - world; not shove reality
back at them (that's boring).
When I was thin, I got lectured nonstop. Everyone thought it was their
business to comment on how much they thought I should weigh. No matter that I
might LIKE being thin. They wanted to force me into what they considered
acceptable, in other words, a weight closer to their own. After a lazy winter,
it's interesting that the sniping's died down just a little bit. It's a crazy
world we live in.
Abbie F.
>Yes, I can eat like a pig and not gain an ounce,
>but the price I pay is having to be constantly defending my appearance.
>And it sucks.
How cool! Jeez, I have to work out like a dog to experience the same hatred
from people that you can elicit naturally. :-) (Just kidding!)
Jason G
>thingies?)
I actually saw a "nude gymnastics" DVD once. It was very, very bad
gymnastics, and the editing was so atrocious as to even make the nudity
uninteresting.
Noelle
news:a9imp...@enews4.newsguy.com...
> nok...@tdl.com (nokomis) made obeisance before Us and spake thusly:
> > Or is this one of those nude aerobics
> >thingies?)
>
> I actually saw a "nude gymnastics" DVD once. It was very, very bad
> gymnastics, and the editing was so atrocious as to even make the nudity
> uninteresting.
Uh? I'm still missing posts. If this was re: the exercise DVD I was talking
about, no nudity. Legit stuff.
Rabbit
> Q:<looks around nervously>, I have encountered online some people who go
> Q:utterly ballistic if anyone mentions weighing even an ounce less than
> Q:they do. I'm being defensive lest I be, um, enlightened that my
> Q:inability to gain weight means that I am an insensitive snob.
> Q:
> Unless I'm at end stage terminal cancer, I'll probably never not
> be overweight. I don't begrudge anyone who's slim, slender, or
> even skinny. That's the way of the world.
>
> Now eyelashes, that's another thing. If you got 'em and they're
> long and luxurious, I hate you.
Heh. I was at a friend's house the other night, and another friend gave her
some magic liquid that supposedly, when rubbed on your fingernails, makes
them grow faster. (Yeah, okay...)
Damn it, my fingernails grow *too* fast. I'm forever cutting them, because I
can't stand them long when I'm typing or writing with a pen. I need to trim
them at least once a week. You can imagine how well that went over.
Rabbit
(Whose hair grows too fast, too)
Terrie Strike
>
>Rabbit
>(Whose hair grows too fast, too)
My hair grows fast enough that I gave up on short hair. It went from above my
ears to past my waist in les than three years. I can't keep it short because I
can't afford to have it cut every two weeks. Damn annoying stuff.
-Terrie
Beth Cole
>
> Rabbit
> (Whose hair grows too fast, too)
Same here.
My hairdresser bemoans how slowly her hair grows whenever she's trimming
mine. I roll my eyes and tell her that she's welcome to hair so thick
that I can't get a brush through it and that requires I have help
washing my hair if I am going to get down to the scalp.
Yeah, it is nice & thick & grows fast. It's also got a mind of its own,
which is why it spends most of the time French braided or in a bun.
Beth
--
"Humankind cannot stand very much reality." ---T. S. Eliot
my home page: http://www.IsleOfSky.net
Sulpicia
"Beth Cole" <eac...@amber.emporia.edu> wrote in message
news:3CBDB6BF...@amber.emporia.edu...
> Rabbit wrote:
> >
> > Rabbit
> > (Whose hair grows too fast, too)
>
> Same here.
>
> My hairdresser bemoans how slowly her hair grows whenever she's trimming
> mine. I roll my eyes and tell her that she's welcome to hair so thick
> that I can't get a brush through it and that requires I have help
> washing my hair if I am going to get down to the scalp.
>
> Yeah, it is nice & thick & grows fast. It's also got a mind of its own,
> which is why it spends most of the time French braided or in a bun.
>
My hair is VERY thick, and grows very quickly. But I can't stand long hair,
so I'm off getting it cut quite frequently.
--
Sulpicia
Noelle
news:MPG.17275c9d5...@news.earthlink.net...
> From the trenches, on 16 Apr 2002 17:18:17 -0700, *nokomis*
> dispatched this missive...
>
> Q:<looks around nervously>, I have encountered online some people who go
> Q:utterly ballistic if anyone mentions weighing even an ounce less than
> Q:they do. I'm being defensive lest I be, um, enlightened that my
> Q:inability to gain weight means that I am an insensitive snob.
> Q:
> Unless I'm at end stage terminal cancer, I'll probably never not
> be overweight. I don't begrudge anyone who's slim, slender, or
> even skinny. That's the way of the world.
Exactly how I feel, having been on both sides of the issue. As long as said
thin people don't come off with the attitude of "everyone hates me because
they wish they were me" then I won't give them attitude in return. Um, no, I
don't wish I were you (generic). I've *been* like you, and now I'm 25 lbs.
overweight. And I'm working on that. :)
My mom used to tell me that it was useless to try to compare myself to
others, because there would always be someone better off, and always someone
who was worse off. Sometimes I even manage to remember her advice. :)
> Now eyelashes, that's another thing. If you got 'em and they're
> long and luxurious, I hate you.
Hee hee! When my twin nephews were babies, one of them had gorgeous curly
hair and long, long eyelashes. All the women of the family were envious and
said that they'd been wasted on a boy.
I'll admit to one physical feature that I'm envious of: my friend Jennifer's
hair. It's thick and naturally wavy, and looks fantastic when she just gets
out of the shower and shakes it dry. And it's naturally the color that I dye
mine. However, she's envious of mine because mine grows longer than hers
does.
Beth Cole
>
> On Beth Cole previously wrote:
> >
> > Yeah, it is nice & thick & grows fast. It's also got a mind of its own,
> > which is why it spends most of the time French braided or in a bun.
>
> SHIT to it because it's doubled in thickness?
Nope. I just have cost myself a section of my hearing, because of how I
hold the hair dryer and how long I have to spend drying.
>
> Hell, I've got one of those ionic hair dryers that makes it tamer than it
> used to be -- but I STILL cannot get the jumbo thick-hair barette to stay
> closed on those days!
>
> Pretty much the only thing I can do is put it in a bun and use several of
> those little grabber clips (what ARE those things called?) to hold it
> around the edges.
>
I've discovered something called HairSticks, carved pieces of wood that
when stuck in at the correct angle will hold my hair in a fairly tidy
bun without poking me six ways from Sunday. I'm still looking for their
web page (it seems to have disappeared).
REP
<eac...@amber.emporia.edu> wrote:
> The Lady Nea wrote:
> >
> > On Beth Cole previously wrote:
> > >
> > > Yeah, it is nice & thick & grows fast. It's also got a mind of its own,
> > > which is why it spends most of the time French braided or in a bun.
> >
> > Do you have the same problem as me on hair-washing-day, where you can't to
> > SHIT to it because it's doubled in thickness?
>
> Nope. I just have cost myself a section of my hearing, because of how I
> hold the hair dryer and how long I have to spend drying.
I wash mine at night since it takes 6 hours to dry and I hate blow dryers.
I use a heavy duty conditioner and then a leave-in spray-on conditioner.
Mine's not very curly, just very thick and somewhat long, so it works for
me.
> I've discovered something called HairSticks, carved pieces of wood that
> when stuck in at the correct angle will hold my hair in a fairly tidy
> bun without poking me six ways from Sunday. I'm still looking for their
> web page (it seems to have disappeared).
In hot weather when caught without hair restraining devices I've been
reduced to pencils, straightened-out jumbo paperclips, chopsticks, twigs,
twist ties.... I'd cut it, but the one time I had short hair, it was too
much work! At least with it long, it doesn't stick up in clumps or
anything.