Why are all Divorce Support groups for PAR-UH-NTZ???
Beverly
I've been looking for some support while going through a painful
divorce and the web and "real" life are full, FULL, of groups catering
to MOMS and DADS, but NO ONE wants to hear it if you don't have KIDZ.
I'm sick to death of it.
It's ridiculous. Parents without Partners, etc. I mean, really. What
about the rest of us???? Is it not supposed to be hard if you don't
have to deal with childrun? Even all the self-help how-to-do-your-own
divorce pages seem to focus on all the details of the child burdened,
but so little out there for childfree. Sigh.
(I'm usually a "lurker" here, but felt the need to write this time.
Thanks.)
--Beverly
AlmightyBob
"Beverly" <bev...@lmri.ucsb.edu> wrote in message
news:57ad3068.04041...@posting.google.com...
> I'm just ranting a bit here, but...
>
> I've been looking for some support while going through a painful
> divorce and the web and "real" life are full, FULL, of groups catering
> to MOMS and DADS, but NO ONE wants to hear it if you don't have KIDZ.
> I'm sick to death of it.
>
> It's ridiculous. Parents without Partners, etc. I mean, really. What
> about the rest of us???? Is it not supposed to be hard if you don't
> have to deal with childrun? Even all the self-help how-to-do-your-own
> divorce pages seem to focus on all the details of the child burdened,
> but so little out there for childfree. Sigh.
I usually lurk, too, but since I'm going through the same process I
thought I'd write. Since I don't know the specifics of your situation,
I won't try to offer advice, but I've definitely noticed how hard it is
to find useful information out there that doesn't constantly go on and
on about chyld support and custody and what divorce does to childrun and
such. There is information out there, but one has to wade through so
much crap to find it. And I've found so far that the whole process is
really overwhelming, even without childrun. I've found some decent
sites and books offering advice on the financial side, but not so much
on the emotional/psychological side.
As Sklenge said up-thread, please continue to "rant", and I'd be happy
to share any tips/info with you that I have.
-- AlmightyBob
MyToysDammit
Probably the same reason it took a lot of agitating from CF widow/ers to get
a couple of support boards to carry forums for us, both younger and older.
There's some 'feeling' that marriage isn't really a 'marriage' unless you
have kids, so CF divorce or widowhood are somehow 'easier' and not as in
need of support.
I also found the same child-centric focus when looking for estate management
information, etc.
I can't compare divorce and being widowed, since I've never been through a
divorce, but the whole thing seems to be related to the x-tian fundy
perception that marriage means breeding. Even if you do find 'childless'
support it is usually oriented toward those who are 'empty nesters' as
opposed to those who are CF, or towards those devastated because they didn't
breed first.
My sympathies on your divorce. I can't offer any constructive advice beyond
stating that if something isn't out there, maybe it is time to make it out
there. We were able to get support forums going for both CF/CL and those in
non-traditional relationships. I'm sure you could do it for divorce as well.
'kat
J. Peter Mugaas
>I'm just ranting a bit here, but...
>
>I've been looking for some support while going through a painful
>divorce and the web and "real" life are full, FULL, of groups catering
>to MOMS and DADS, but NO ONE wants to hear it if you don't have KIDZ.
>I'm sick to death of it.
>
I don't know what to tell you because I don't know much. I could be
far off the mark.
It seems to me that the big thing besides grieving is deciding who
gets what assets and who's responsible for what debts. Many times,
couples can come to some agreement about that stuff and should. If
there's no agreement, a decision is made by a judge and the process
can be long and drawn out. If you and your spouse make an agreement,
the courts will usually uphold it.
Note that I am not a lawyer and many states have laws describing how
property is divided. Those differ considerably (you have title,
community, and equitable - see:
http://www.familylawyerservice.com/property.htm).
Here's something that might help with property division.
http://www.divorceinfo.com/propdiv.htm
http://www.divorcelawinfo.com/Pages/prop%20and%20debt%20div.html
http://www.equalityinmarriage.org/wdcredit.html
http://www.legalzoom.com/law_library/divorce/property.html
http://www.nolo.com/lawcenter/ency/article.cfm/ObjectID/C75906FE-22D5-485C-BF77170850E16820/catID/101C121B-3FFB-42F9-B60C2CC50B6921C6
In general, you should also make sure that all marital debts are paid.
If you and your husband agree that he is going to pay X, if he does
not do so, the creditor is going to knock on your door. Speaking of
creditors, you should get a copy of your credit report so you know
where you stand and you may some rights. A lot of times, a wife might
be paying bills under the husband's name and at divorce, winds up with
no credit rating (which is nearly as bad as poor credit rating).
For what it's worth, I am sorry.
HTH.
Support the anti-Spam amendment - Join at http://www.cauce.org/
J. Peter Mugaas E-Mail: oma0...@mail.wvnet.edu
http://www.wvnet.edu/~oma00215/
Virginia
say:
Because, of course, marriage is only valid if you have children to
fuck up when you split. The first question I would usually be asked
is if I had any chiiiiiiiillldren.
I stayed away from support groups. Painting them with a broad brush,
they seem to be just general bitch sessions and nothing gets
accomplished. YMMV. I found it more therapeutic doing that with
friends!
Good luck to you.
va :)
Kristy
<dar_b_...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> On 16 Apr 2004 14:16:39 -0700, bev...@lmri.ucsb.edu (Beverly)
> wrote:
>
> >I've been looking for some support while going through a painful
> >divorce and the web and "real" life are full, FULL, of groups catering
> >to MOMS and DADS, but NO ONE wants to hear it if you don't have KIDZ.
> >I'm sick to death of it.
> >
> >It's ridiculous. Parents without Partners, etc. I mean, really. What
> >about the rest of us???? Is it not supposed to be hard if you don't
> >have to deal with childrun? Even all the self-help how-to-do-your-own
> >divorce pages seem to focus on all the details of the child burdened,
> >but so little out there for childfree. Sigh.
>
> I can't offer anything but empathy. Every time someone new finds
> out I just got divorced, what's the second thing they say (after
> "sorry to hear that")? "At least you didn't have any kids."
>
> Argh.
For what it's worth, I often think "at least they didn't have any kids"
(though I have the good grace not to actually say it aloud) when I hear
of a CF/CL couple divorcing. Not because I think the marriage is less
valid, or that it makes the emotional pain of divorce any easier, but
because (a) you don't have to shelve/bury your own pain to support your
sproggen, and (b) custody issues aren't among the myriad of things that
have to be worked out.
I'm sorry for anyone who has to go through it.
-Kristy
--
"Life's tough, and it's especially tough when you're stupid."
- Damon Runyon
Marci
> For what it's worth, I often think "at least they didn't have any kids"
> (though I have the good grace not to actually say it aloud) when I hear
> of a CF/CL couple divorcing. Not because I think the marriage is less
> valid, or that it makes the emotional pain of divorce any easier, but
> because (a) you don't have to shelve/bury your own pain to support your
> sproggen, and (b) custody issues aren't among the myriad of things that
> have to be worked out.
I'm pretty much with you there. I was SO thankful that I had a brain,
at least on the kids part if not the marriage part. No kids meant that
all ties could be neatly severed instead of having to drag around a
living reminder of places I should have never been.
- Marci
Veronique
This basically supports the truism, no matter how fucked up your life
is, if you had kids it would only be worse. I have a friend with three
kids who would do ANYTHING to never speak to her ex again, but they
have shared custody so he's been a millstone around her neck for
twelve years (and will be for another three, until the youngest is
18.)
Divorce sucks. At least when you're CF, when you work out the
emotional stuff, you don't have to keep having it shoved in your face
the way you would had you reproduced.
V.
--
Veronique Chez Sheep
Anna
> "Beverly" <bev...@lmri.ucsb.edu> wrote in message
> news:57ad3068.04041...@posting.google.com...
> > I'm just ranting a bit here, but...
> >
> > I've been looking for some support while going through a painful
> > divorce and the web and "real" life are full, FULL, of groups catering
> > to MOMS and DADS, but NO ONE wants to hear it if you don't have KIDZ.
> > I'm sick to death of it.
I'm living in a place where women get nervous if they haven't popped a
couple out by age 20. I'm 32 and considered a menopausal freak. With
regard to divorce and kids, I'm the product of a divorce that took 10
years. Right now, one of my jobs is to mediate divorces for low
income litigants. Basically the whole county qualifies. Based on my
experiences in my own life and in other dissolution cases, NO ONE is
thinking of the children when it comes time to try to settle
dissolution issues. So, to put such an emphasis on them in support
groups is purely gross behavior.
Kids are only important when you can screw the other side, get a dig
in, etc. It's spiteful, hurtful conduct that is guaranteed to screw up
the kids. It's like having the children keeps a parent interacting on
that level. Of course, all screwing over of one's spouse is all done
in the name of the kids. Kind of like the inquisition being done in
the name of Christ. Hmmmm. I bet Parents without Partners just
doesn't want anyone to see that parents are really forty year olds
with the mind of a toddler.
> Probably the same reason it took a lot of agitating from CF widow/ers to get
> a couple of support boards to carry forums for us, both younger and older.
>
> There's some 'feeling' that marriage isn't really a 'marriage' unless you
> have kids
Oh so true. And so wrong. I had a former boss, note the word "former",
who was raging on me about my billable hours--i.e. I should have more
and so on. I told her, the proud possessor of two little demons (the
kind that would come into my office and try to tear the place up
because it was "theirs", "Mommy owned it")that I found it difficult to
stay until 7pm every night because I had a family to go home to.
She looked completely blank/confused until I said that my husband
counted as much as her ex-football hero and children. And she was a
discrimination lawyer like me. I didn't mean to take the rant off
track--just that families without children suffer just as much during
a time of stress. Just that there are fewer resources. Can't imagine
what she would have said if I told her that I had three furbabies to
tend to as well.
> I can't compare divorce and being widowed, since I've never been through a
> divorce, but the whole thing seems to be related to the x-tian fundy
> perception that marriage means breeding. Even if you do find 'childless'
> support it is usually oriented toward those who are 'empty nesters' as
> opposed to those who are CF, or towards those devastated because they didn't
> breed first.
> 'kat
Beverly, sorry to pull your topic off-kilter. But I just did a
mediation and I'm a little cranky. I hope that you eventually emerge
from this process with some good feelings--like independence,
confidence, strength. As a pretty-much lurker, I must say that the
folks here have a range of experience and are unusually insightful.
Maybe this group could work?
Good luck,
Anna