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Fanzines and the Internet or Economy outside

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Arachnethe2

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Nov 6, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/6/98
to

JWinterCNA schrieb:

> So iimagine how much more expensive it is to keep Orion
> going, especially when the economy outside the US, Canada, and Western
Europe
> is not at its healthiest. That, too, makes an impact.
>

I know that the economy is in this part of world catastrophal ( to say
it
straight).
But what has this state to do with Startrek Zines in USA? If I may ask?

Arachnethe2

Fanzines and the Internet was Re: Economy Outside:


Probably the discussion about Randy's post is off topic now,
but I still owe the explanation for my somehow outrageous
reaction to J. Winters comment about the global economy and
its influence at the sale of Startrek Zines.

At first I want to say a little about myself, because I'm
posting seldom to asc and mostly I'm only looking here after
the K/S stories, whose appear on the ng server faster, than
on the ones of ascem. So I'm unknown here, means I should
introduce myself to you:

I'm Arachnethe2, English is not my native language, but
although I'm living in Germany and my nationality is German,
my native language is Czech. Simply because it was the first
and only language I have spoken for the first twenty years of
my live. And although I have left the former Czechoslovakia
nine years ago, I have never lost the contact to the now
Czech Republic. Because I have still my family there, my old
friends and myself, I'm visiting this country four times in a
year.

J., here I want to point out at the word 'outside' in your
quote: outside of Western Europe. Believe me I know the
situation outside of Western Europe. The people there are
poor, very poor, they are working hard, very hard and they
haven't any idea about existence of Startrek. And if they
have, then they are noticing it mostly only as this American
TV crap, which is nerving for them. They didn't grow up with
this series, they haven't whether the time nor are they in
the mood to try to see in it this all, what the series means
for you. They have different taste, different movies, series and
stories and they are happy with them. To say it simply,
Startrek is too much American for them. So they aren't
Startrek fans, they don't make any cons (or I have never heard
about them), and they don't buy any zines. They never did
that, and for a long time, they also never do.

Please, take it not as an offence, when I have to say, that
you have globalised a little too much. That this quote, which
you have dropped just in case and never insisted to say and
to think something bad with it, worked for me like a blame,
that the people there are poor, that they can't buy a
Startrek Zine from USA, which is ever for me a luxury -- like
caviar ordered for the breakfast. Again I repeat, I don't
want to blame you, this is no ones fault. I understand that
you have to pay your taxes, your food, clothes, your Doctor,
your flat... I'm doing it too.

Just..., this sentence was unhappy formulated.

Yours sincerely
Arachnethe2

JWinterCNA

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Nov 6, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/6/98
to
>Again I repeat, I don't
>want to blame you, this is no ones fault. I understand that
>you have to pay your taxes, your food, clothes, your Doctor,
>your flat... I'm doing it too.


Don't mention it. The point I was making was that some of the bigger markets
for zines have slacked off a bit since the Asian economies soured earlier this
year. For the most part, North America and Western Europe have whethered it
fairly well. In some of the other places where US zines find their way,
money's gotten a bit tight. Japan, Korea, and, if I'm not mistaken, Australia
are not in their best condition at the moment. Hence, as is the case in the US
or Germany, when you have a lot of inflation or unemployment or both, people
tend to spend less on extras, like zines.

No, I'm well aware that, ten years after, Eastern Europe is still regrouping
from all the political changes, and Russia is absolutely devastated. And,
while I'm confident this will change, I meant no disrespect. I know there are
places in the world where people would love to be able to spend extra on zines.
I was merely stating that the number of people who normally can or do has
shrunk in the past year for obvious reasons.

Where in Germany do you live?

J

Deborah Drake

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Nov 6, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/6/98
to
Ok - question for all about just what readers want to see in a zine...

Personally - I'd MUCH rather buy a no-frills zine with minimal or no artwork,
no color or plastic cover, a simple (but sturdy) binding, one plain typeface,
etc and spend a few bucks less than have all those extras and spend more.

Do others feel the same way?

Deb

Randy Landers

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Nov 7, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/7/98
to
Deborah Drake says

<<Personally - I'd MUCH rather buy a no-frills zine with minimal or no
artwork,
no color or plastic cover, a simple (but sturdy) binding, one plain
typeface,
etc and spend a few bucks less than have all those extras and spend
more.>>

Okay, going with no color cover, you've saved anywhere from 89 cents
off the price of the zine. No FastBack; GBC spiral only, you save 50
cents. Removing the artwork will save you maybe 20 pages or another 80
cents off the price of the zine.

So a "bare bones" zine will save you at the most $2.19 from the cost
of the zine.

<<Do others feel the same way? >>

Actually, our best selling fanzines at conventions are those with
color covers and FastBack bindings. Color covers sell. Artwork is a
plus.

We actually offered a barebones approach to our zines for a long time.
Plain black ink covers. Stapled instead of spiraled bound. Limited in
page count by the stapling to 100 pages. Cost of them was around $2.00
less, of course. Unfortunately, they didn't sell as well. Our
publisher at the time was Bill Hupe, and he dragged me kicking and
screaming into the age of color covers, perfect binding and spiral
binding, and more pages. And he was right. Sales went from 100 zines
to 500 zines. Of course today, 300 is outstanding, and only a few of
our titles reach that mark.

In fact, broken down by genre is my current standards:

TOS zines: 150 outstanding, 100 very good, 65 average, 35 fair, 15
poor.
TNG zines: 250 outstanding, 150 very good, 80 average, 40 fair, 20
poor.
DS9 zines: 100 outstanding, 75 very good, 50 average, 25 fair, 10
poor.
VOY zines: 300 outstanding, 225 very good, 150 average, 75 fair, 30
poor.

BTW, we also factor in a genre sales expectations into our price
structure. Because VOY zines sell so well, their cost is less per
issue (we use the avergae figure to determine the cost of the
contributors' copies). Because DS9 zines don't sell as well, their
prices are higher. And the above figures are based on previous sales,
rounded to the nearest 5. The only bogus figure is the VOY poor
number. We've never had a VOY zine sell less than 75 copies.

And BTW, earlier print runs get premium color covers. Folks who order
zines later find a second generation color cover, or even a black &
white cover instead (at a lower price, of course). So if you want the
best looking copy of the zine, you need to be one of the first 100
purchasers.

No zine editor is in this for the money. Too many have tried and
failed there. Heck, I'm not even interested in breaking even. I'd be
happy with a $600 loss per year. But this year, we're around $4000 in
the hole, and another zine publisher informed us that he was around
$8000 in the hole this year.

That doesn't bode well for fanzines.

Randy Landers
ORION PRESS
--------------------------------------------------------------------
For 13MB of quality Classic Trek fan fiction, go to:
http://www.mindspring.com/~randylanders/archives/oaindex.html
For 7MB of quality Next Gen fan fiction, go to:
http://www.mindspring.com/~lindamarcusky/eridani/index.html
For 1MB of quality Deep Space 9 fan fiction, go to:
http://www.fastcopyinc.com/orionpress/outpost/index.html
For 1MB of quality Voyager fan fiction, go to:
http://www.fastcopyinc.com/orionpress/deltaquadrant/index.html
For information on ORION PRESS and its fanzines, go to:
http://www.mindspring.com/~randylanders


Ruth Gifford

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Nov 7, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/7/98
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On Fri, 06 Nov 1998 22:55:23 -0800, Deborah Drake <ddr...@99main.com>
wrote:

>Ok - question for all about just what readers want to see in a zine...
>

>Personally - I'd MUCH rather buy a no-frills zine with minimal or no artwork,
>no color or plastic cover, a simple (but sturdy) binding, one plain typeface,
>etc and spend a few bucks less than have all those extras and spend more.

I can get that by printing stuff out of the archive (for my own personal
reading, mind you) or off the news groups and putting it in a binder. If I
wanted to be ambitious, I'd borrow the comb binder from work.

>Do others feel the same way?

Nope. I'd plunk down some decent money on a zine that had: a couple of
stories I *really* want to read, and a few other stories that look
interesting, a nice cover and some decent artwork inside. And of course,
I'd be more inclined to buy something that I *couldn't* get on the net.

Ruth


>
>Deb

--
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Helsos

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Nov 7, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/7/98
to
>>Personally - I'd MUCH rather buy a no-frills zine with minimal or no
>artwork,
>>no color or plastic cover, a simple (but sturdy) binding, one plain
>typeface,
>>etc and spend a few bucks less than have all those extras and spend more.

For me its the "extras" that make it worthwhile to buy a zine. I can get the
no frills by downloading, printing and stapling. I love the
illustrations...

I Cristal Martinez

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Nov 7, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/7/98
to
Excerpts from netnews.alt.startrek.creative: 6-Nov-98 Fanzines - what do
readers .. by Deborah Dr...@99main.com
> Ok - question for all about just what readers want to see in a zine...
>
> Personally - I'd MUCH rather buy a no-frills zine with minimal or no
artwork,
>
> no color or plastic cover, a simple (but sturdy) binding, one plain
typeface,
>
> etc and spend a few bucks less than have all those extras and spend more.
>
> Do others feel the same way?
>
> Deb


Well, having bought both before, I can say that I *like* having plastic
covers and color, but they aren't truly necessary--especially when
including them means having to raise the price accordingly.

Personally, my biggest criterion for fanzines is that they be
well-edited. I think the biggest 'zine turn-off for me is typos and/or
omissions that could easily have been caught and corrected if it weren't
for whatever limitations applied at the time (deadlines, equipment
failures, what have you). I like elegance in a 'zine, if that doesn't
sound too silly--what's there should be there on purpose, and if
illustrations, color, etc. have to be sacrificed for the sake of layout
and proofreading time, then it's not really a sacrifice IMO.

Cristal, now returning to lurk mode

Randy Landers

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Nov 7, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/7/98
to
DataLaur says
<<My worst problem - as I rarely get to cons, it's difficult to get to
see what's
available. Yes, sites like Orion have the teaser listed, but that
tells me
nothing about how well the author can write. And Orion doesn't do
slash, worse
luck, so that limits accessibility even more.>>

Admittedly, the teasers don't do much, but you can access the entire
story and determine just how competent any given author is. I will
give this some thought, though, as far as ads for novellas go.

No, we don't do slash. We don't do Star Wars either. Others are much
better at such things... :)

And $30 for Pulse of the Machine demonstrates how reasonable our zines
truly are in comparison with others available. (And the reprint
doesn't have their art? Was it an authorized copy? Where'd you buy it?

BTW, Ann Zewen will be at Farpoint next weekend with a bunch of zines.
Drop by and say hi to her!

--

Katisha

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Nov 8, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/8/98
to
In article <19981106150651...@ng85.aol.com>,
jwint...@aol.com (JWinterCNA) wrote:

> >Again I repeat, I don't
> >want to blame you, this is no ones fault. I understand that
> >you have to pay your taxes, your food, clothes, your Doctor,
> >your flat... I'm doing it too.
>
>
> Don't mention it. The point I was making was that some of the bigger markets
> for zines have slacked off a bit since the Asian economies soured earlier this
> year. For the most part, North America and Western Europe have whethered it
> fairly well. In some of the other places where US zines find their way,
> money's gotten a bit tight. Japan, Korea, and, if I'm not mistaken, Australia
> are not in their best condition at the moment. Hence, as is the case in the
> US or Germany, when you have a lot of inflation or unemployment or both,
> people tend to spend less on extras, like zines.

Just to be completely off-topic, you're not mistaken about Australia. The
government won their federal election by a landslide minority and, as a
booby prize, John Howard has declared he has a "mandate" to introduce what
he calls tax reform, thus making the people of Australia the only voters
in the world to protest wildly about their politicians *keeping* their
election promises. Congratulations Australia, you have been awarded a
GST, just in case the poor were too rich for the Government's taste. So
expect things to be even worse in Australia, and accept our regrets that
just about the only tradition we *haven't* adopted from America is that of
asassinating our politicians. Rant mode off. Sorry everyone.

I shall do three crits of stories in penance.

--
Katisha
Address: kat...@alphalink.dontspam.com.au - please remove the dontspam to email.

Here, siggy, siggy - Where'd that sig file go?

DataLaur

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Nov 8, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/8/98
to
Deb:

>> Personally - I'd MUCH rather buy a no-frills zine with minimal or no
artwork, no color or plastic cover, a simple (but sturdy) binding, one plain
typeface, etc and spend a few bucks less than have all those extras and spend
more.
>> Do others feel the same way?

I would rather spend a little extra to get the artwork. However, it's got to
be good and frankly, a lot of what I've seen out there isn't. If it's really
good, I'm willing to spend a lot extra. For example, I paid something like $30
to get the Data/Yar story Pulse of the Machine -- I saw a friend's copy and
was wowed. Unfortunately, a lot of the best artwork was left out of the
reprint and as I bought my copy by mail, I didn't know that until it was too
late. ::sigh::

More basic than that, if I see a story that has careless editing, I won't read
it unless it *really* hooks me. I certainly wouldn't buy a zine that didn't
edit well.

My worst problem - as I rarely get to cons, it's difficult to get to see what's
available. Yes, sites like Orion have the teaser listed, but that tells me
nothing about how well the author can write. And Orion doesn't do slash, worse
luck, so that limits accessibility even more.

As to increase sales to web buyers -- I think someone had the suggestion of
posting a bit of the story, so you'd have to buy the zine to get the rest of
it. I liked this idea. A couple paragraphs would give the reader a feel for
the author's style and ability.

laur


DataLaur

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Nov 8, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/8/98
to
Randy:

>And $30 for Pulse of the Machine demonstrates how reasonable our zines
>truly are in comparison with others available. (And the reprint
>doesn't have their art? Was it an authorized copy? Where'd you buy it?

AFAIK it's authorized. I bought it maybe 2 years ago, I think from Pariah
Press, which one of the artists runs. As for the illos, it states "this
edition contains...a selection of the original illustrations" on the table of
contents.

And yes, $30 was an awful lot -- your prices do seem reasonable to me. I
wouldn't have paid anywhere near as much had I known the artwork wasn't all
there. Having read my friend's first-run copy, I knew the writing was pretty
good, but what I really wanted was the artwork. What got left out seems to
have no rhyme or reason -- not just the adult pics, but also a gorgeous color
one of Data and a dragonet.

Randy, is there anyplace where people have rated fanzines -- voted for their
faves, etc? A "best of" list including multiple publishers?

laur

Randy Landers

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Nov 8, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/8/98
to
laur asks

<<Randy, is there anyplace where people have rated fanzines -- voted
for their
faves, etc? A "best of" list including multiple publishers?>>

Well, that's a good question. Presently, zine fandom has a number of
awards:

The Fan-Q Awards -- sponsored by Media*West Con
The Editors' Choice Awards -- sponsored by VidCon
The Z-Magnees Prizes -- sponsored by ORION PRESS

The Fan-Q Awards are announced on-line, as are our own Z-Magnees
Prizes.

You have to pay to vote for the Fan Q's (I think it's a dollar or
two), and there's a nominating procedure. Votes are mailed in, and we
used to take part, but we've basically been invited not to, so we
don't anymore. We won more than our share of them, to be honest, and
even though we don't acknowledge them, one of ours won some sort of
honorable mention last year.

The ECA folks require that editors select the best story they've
published (I'm sure you realize how unpolitic that would be) so we
don't do them. We won two of them before I realized that the editors
had to actually choose one story to put above another.

With the Z-Magnees Prizes, we have a write-in ballot, and that's that.
No money required, no convention association. Unfortunately, a lot of
folks think that the zines voted on must be published by ORION PRESS,
and that's NOT the case.

Zine fandom also once had:

The TrekStar Awards -- sponsored by INTERSTAT. We actually were
nominated repeatedly for these awards, but they became more or less a
K/S award since those were the zines that generally won.

The Surak Awards -- I can't remember who the sponsor was, nor do I
remember much about them, but this was another award.

Unfortunately, there's no such thing as
alt.startrek.creative.fanzines.reviews, and while I'm aware of a lot
of fanfiction listings out there, I'm not aware of a single "fanzine
ratings" website. It's a pity, too, because it would be invaluable for
folks wanting to peruse a "best of fanzines" or even a "best of the
net" type thing.

My concern is that the site, like all the awards (including our own),
would become more of a political statement rather than an indication
of quality. For example, Marty Siegrist won a best artist Z-Magnees
Prize, but I'm unaware of anything she did in the last year. But six
folks voted for her, and who are we to argue?

One would think that someone would create such a site, but then you
get into personal tastes thing that came up in this newsgroup not long
ago. If you created the LAUR ZINE AWARDS and then selected them
yourself, how objective would you be in selecting among three zines
when two of them are, say, Odo/Quark and you detest that sort of
thing?

I think a reviews page might be better. Pen's AN IDIOSYNCRATIC REVIEW
comes to mind as an excellent review zine. While I have disagreed with
a few of the reviews (usually involving criticisms our format --
single column, space between paras rather than content), the zine is
one I look forward to receiving.

Steven Walker's DATAZINE (aka FORUM) and UNIVERSAL TRANSLATOR were
known for publishing reviews in addition to ads from zines. As I
stated in one of the other threads, when UT ceased publication,
fanzine fandom took a direct hit. THE MONTHLY (and later THE NEW
MONTHLY), MEDIA MONITOR, GENERIC AD ZINE came up but are not as well
received as UT. I haven't seen an issue of MM or GAZ in years, and I
really should send in ads to them if they're still publishing...

Getting back to your idea, Laur, have you got something in mind?

PensNest

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Nov 8, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/8/98
to

>>Excerpts from netnews.alt.startrek.creative: 6-Nov-98 Fanzines - what do
>>readers .. by Deborah Dr...@99main.com

>>> Ok - question for all about just what readers want to see in a zine...
>>>

>>> Personally - I'd MUCH rather buy a no-frills zine with minimal or no
>>>artwork, no color or plastic cover, a simple (but sturdy) binding, one plain
>>>typeface, etc and spend a few bucks less than have all those extras and spend
>>>more.
>>>Do others feel the same way?

In theory a no-frills zine is fine - pure story, nothing else... but
somehow, no, I'd rather have something that is attractive. 'Attractive'
doesn't have to mean that it is resplendent with beautiful illustrations:
it can mean smart layout, nice typeface, etc - too much razzle dazzle and
showing off "look how many fonts my computer can do" is not what I have in
mind, but some showiness is nice for titles, I think. No artwork at all
is preferable to icky artwork, but good piccies are better than either. It
doesn't have to be stunning, cos most of us can't aspire to that. However,
I have several times been seduced by a Marty Siegrist illustration on a
cover.

Then again, if what's in the zine makes me laugh, I'll forgive a lot.

In article <sqF9i9a00...@andrew.cmu.edu>,


I Cristal Martinez <cris...@andrew.cmu.edu> wrote:

>>Personally, my biggest criterion for fanzines is that they be
>>well-edited. I think the biggest 'zine turn-off for me is typos and/or
>>omissions that could easily have been caught and corrected if it weren't
>>for whatever limitations applied at the time (deadlines, equipment
>>failures, what have you). I like elegance in a 'zine, if that doesn't
>>sound too silly--what's there should be there on purpose, and if
>>illustrations, color, etc. have to be sacrificed for the sake of layout
>>and proofreading time, then it's not really a sacrifice IMO.

Heartily seconded. I detest finding that I've paid for something nobody
has bothered to proofread, and I prefer to discover that the editor has
exercised some kind of selectivity in choosing the material. I know it can
be painful to say no to stuff, when it can be hard to acquire enough
material in the first place, but after paying out quite a bit for fresh
fanfic (particularly if transatlantic postage is included) I'd rather not
use it to line the cat's tray.

Pen

*An Idiosyncratic Review* - for the discerning zine reader
Issue #5 out now.

***D-Tales - the new Data anthology***
email pensnest at globalnet.co.uk

Nicole N Pellegrini

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Nov 9, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/9/98
to
Randy Landers (randyl...@mindspring.com) wrote:
: Steven Walker's DATAZINE (aka FORUM) and UNIVERSAL TRANSLATOR were

: known for publishing reviews in addition to ads from zines. As I
: stated in one of the other threads, when UT ceased publication,
: fanzine fandom took a direct hit. THE MONTHLY (and later THE NEW
: MONTHLY), MEDIA MONITOR, GENERIC AD ZINE came up but are not as well
: received as UT. I haven't seen an issue of MM or GAZ in years, and I
: really should send in ads to them if they're still publishing...

I know Media Monitor is history--I sent in a subsciption a short while
back only to receive the last ever issue and a refund on the rest. I
have not heard a peep about GAZ, did not see any new issues at Eclecticon
this weekend either. FYI, another adzine, I believe is going out of
business at the end of this year. As far as I know, the only multi-fandom
adzine still left is The New Monthly, and they are trying to do a lot to
improve/expand the publication. From talking to the editors, they WANT to
publish reviews, but no one is sending them in (well, I did, and they
published them in a recent issue.) The main problem that might be keeping
them from becoming more popular is the subscription price is a bit on the
steep side, if you want the quarterly complete listings and the smaller
monthly updates as well.

I'm starting to see more 'zine/on-line fiction review sites on the web,
but there's no real index to them out there. I think the tricky thing with
reviews is, I only feel comfortable putting out reviews of the stuff I
recommend--there's plenty I don't like, but I'd rather just try to point
people towards the good stuff than rag on the bad.

Going back to the original question of what people want in a zine, here's
my 2 cents. Quality fiction and editing is just a must. I don't care how
pretty the cover is--if there are sloppy typos and continuity errors all over
the place, I won't keep reading, and I probably won't buy any zines from
the same editor again. Yes, good artwork is nice but zines are
pretty expensive these days...I'd generally rather pay less and have no
artwork vs. pay a lot more, unless the artwork is very, very good. Bad illos
are just a waste of space.

I also personally really like the digest-size format for a zine. I buy
many a cheap, digest zine that catches my eye. For $4-6 I'll
grab something without debating whether I really want it or not vs. a $15-20
150-page zine. Even if it's not necessarily one of my main fandoms, I'll
consider it if it looksl ike an interesting story or is from an author I
like, and I've discovered some really great fiction in digest zines I
probably never would have run across in more expensive zines.

But maybe I'm just a cheap bastard ;-)

sockii


Randy Landers

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Nov 9, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/9/98
to
socki says

<<I also personally really like the digest-size format for a zine. I
buy
many a cheap, digest zine that catches my eye. For $4-6 I'll
grab something without debating whether I really want it or not vs. a
$15-20
150-page zine.>>

I've been considering a digest-format for a while, to be honest. I
came close to doing it with CHEKOV'S ENTERPRISE, and maybe I'll do it
with one of our winter releases.

Laura Taylor

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Nov 9, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/9/98
to
Deborah Drake wrote:
>
> Ok - question for all about just what readers want to see in a zine...
>
> Personally - I'd MUCH rather buy a no-frills zine with minimal or no artwork,
> no color or plastic cover, a simple (but sturdy) binding, one plain typeface,
> etc and spend a few bucks less than have all those extras and spend more.
>
> Do others feel the same way?

Sorry for being a bit slow in responding - I've been away from home,
with nothing but a dreadful PC to meet my computing needs (lawdamighty,
how in blazes do people *think* with those awful machines) and had to
bite my tongue until I could get back to my mechancial partner in
crime...

In short, I'm an avid supporter of artwork in 'zines and every 'zine I
have a direct hand in creating will feature artwork prominently
(mini-plug for Outpost 9, which has 24 illustrations by 6 artists). To
me, artwork is simply another form of fan fiction, one than utilizes the
visual - as opposed to verbal - medium to express a creative idea.

I think it could even be argued that art-as-fanfic is evolutionarily
closer to the original source than the stories; after all, Star Trek
was born in a visual medium and, even with the proliferation of pro
novels and fan fiction, it remains in our unconscious as a collection of
visual images. All someone has to do is say "Spock" or "DS9" and we can
all immediately picture that image in our minds, but ask us to describe
it and...but, then, that's what fan fiction is for, right? Yet the roots
of Trek in the visual media was reinforced with "Far Beyond the Stars" -
even though the underlying theme, as resurrected with the brief scene in
the asylum in "Shadows and Symbols," is Benny Russell's need to "write
the words," his inspiration for those very words came *from an
illustration*.

I agree wholeheartedly with everyone who says that no artwork is better
than bad artwork. When we begin to read a story, we can usually tell
after the first few paragraphs if it's going to be a stinker or not,
and, if so, can set it aside without any serious mental trauma. But a
poorly-drawn illustration can stay with us for days - perhaps even
longer if, like me, you have a vivid memory - simply because we can't
stop looking at a bad illustration in the middle. In fact, if you're
anywhere near as demented as me, you're probably drawn to stare at it
even more, studying every nuance like an obsessed scientist, all the
while thinking, "Ewwww..." A really bad illustration *can* be traumatic
in ways that a bad story cannot.

But, for me, artwork opens up a whole enw realm of fan creativity that
stories cannot always - if ever - accomplish. A superb illustration is a
story unto itself (hm...I now have an evil thought forming...). And,
IMO, the best stories are those that I can 'see,' those that summon
intense visual images within my own mind. As I said, Trek is an
inherently visual realm of creativity; it seems only natural that it is
best served with forms of cerative fiction that supplement the visual
imagery.

This summer, when I was at Shore Leave, I was strolling through the
dealer's room and thumbing through a stack of 'zines. Most of them were
slash 'zines - G/B, a bunch of K/S, some from other fandoms (Chips?
heaven help me <G>). I'm not a slash fan, so I didn't pay much
attention, until I came across this one cover...oh, *man*. It was for a
K/S 'zine (don't ask me what it was, all I saw was the cover art, which
blinded me for about 3 hours afterward). Words fail to do it justice,
but I'll try: Kirk and Spock, obviously, both shirtless, Spock is
standing behind Kirk. Spock has one arm wrapped around Kirk's upper
chest and is doing god-knows-what to his ear. Both their eyes are closed
in what I can only describe as bliss. Y'all, I don't read TOS, and I
don't read slash without a *really* good reason, but that one
illustration, in just one 2-second glance, told a story far better and
far more poignantly than anything I've come across in verbal format. And
it damn near converted me to K/S on the spot. Whoever drew that
illustration obviously put just as much loving tenderness and hard work
into his/her 'visual fiction' as I've put into any of my 'verbal;
fictions'. Using pictures rather than words, a story was told, and this
unwary viewer was moved to heart palpitations :-)

So, yes, I am a vocal and passionate supporter of artwork in 'zines.
Illustrations that accompany stories can enhance the inherent visual
content within the stories, but I also think they tell their own
stories. Whether it's verbal or visual, to me it's just another form of
storytelling.

Laura
--
=====

"Daddy, Gul Dukat has gotten stuck in Godzilla's butt. Can you get him
out for me?"

an unidentified 6-year-old
(for once, not named Drew Taylor)

EMSeifert

unread,
Nov 10, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/10/98
to
>I also personally really like the digest-size format for a zine. I

:-) That's the size I do my DS9 zines in.

Nicole N Pellegrini

unread,
Nov 10, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/10/98
to
Randy Landers (randyl...@mindspring.com) wrote:
: socki says
: <<I also personally really like the digest-size format for a zine. I
: buy

: many a cheap, digest zine that catches my eye. For $4-6 I'll
: grab something without debating whether I really want it or not vs. a
: $15-20
: 150-page zine.>>

: I've been considering a digest-format for a while, to be honest. I
: came close to doing it with CHEKOV'S ENTERPRISE, and maybe I'll do it
: with one of our winter releases.

As an editor/publisher as well, I did my first digest-sized zine this
fall--of a story that was archived on a website, to boot--and it's been
outselling most of my other zines, including ones that were all non-net
fiction! Granted it was in a fandom (Xena) that has a real scarcity of
zines out there at the moment, but especially at conventions it's an
easy sell at $5 to anyone who gets remotely interested when I describe
the story.

I'm definitely going to do more digest-sized zines in the future,
particularly when it comes to collections of net-stories or
stand-alone stories.

sockii
------
Sockii Press Online: http://www.seas.upenn.edu/~pellegri/sockii.html

PensNest

unread,
Nov 15, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/15/98
to
In article <723a9m$pd7$1...@camel21.mindspring.com>,
"Randy Landers" <randyl...@mindspring.com> wrote:


>>I think a reviews page might be better. Pen's AN IDIOSYNCRATIC REVIEW
>>comes to mind as an excellent review zine. While I have disagreed with
>>a few of the reviews (usually involving criticisms our format --
>>single column, space between paras rather than content), the zine is
>>one I look forward to receiving.

Why, thank you!


>>Steven Walker's DATAZINE (aka FORUM) and UNIVERSAL TRANSLATOR were
>>known for publishing reviews in addition to ads from zines. As I
>>stated in one of the other threads, when UT ceased publication,
>>fanzine fandom took a direct hit. THE MONTHLY (and later THE NEW
>>MONTHLY), MEDIA MONITOR, GENERIC AD ZINE came up but are not as well
>>received as UT. I haven't seen an issue of MM or GAZ in years, and I
>>really should send in ads to them if they're still publishing...

GAZ was still around at this year's MediaWest Con, though I don't know how
frequently they publish. I think Betsey Vera's fanfic page has email
addresses for GAZ and The New Monthly.

Pen
***An Idiosyncratic Review*** for the discerning zine reader

Biffan

unread,
Nov 15, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/15/98
to
>In article <723a9m$pd7$1...@camel21.mindspring.com>,
>"Randy Landers" <randyl...@mindspring.com> wrote:
>
>
>>>I think a reviews page might be better.

I know this conversation has been going on for a while, but I'd love to see a
web-page with zine reviews. In fact, (cringing here), I'd even consider HOSTING
such a site....if there's any reviewers who want to have reviews up. (I might
even reveiw a few myself, time permitting....)

Biffan

PensNest

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Nov 16, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/16/98
to
In article <19981115165033...@ng155.aol.com>,
bif...@aol.com (Biffan) wrote:

There are 'The Blue Reviews' which cover some at least of the stories which
appeared on ascem. I was reading a few only the other day, but I'm sorry
to say I can't find the address - perhaps someone can oblige?

I'm hoping to put An Idiosyncratic Review on a website in the new year. It
will have reviews and (probably) articles.

Pen
AIRHead

***An Idiosyncratic Review*** - for the discerning zine reader

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