I Am Lucky
HVAC
I really feel lucky to be alive and a Pats fan these days.
To see a talent like Tom Brady every week is awesome.
To see a true freak like Randy Moss face/palm a defender,
high-step away from the tackle, and up-shift to the next speed
for a touchdown is amazing.
Moss was supposed to be a bad apple, but he has proven to be
about the best TEAM player the Patriots have.
These are 2 first round Hall of Fame players for sure.
--
"When one person suffers from a delusion, it is called insanity. When many
people suffer from a delusion, it is called Religion."
Ian White
> I really feel lucky to be alive and a Pats fan these days.
>
> To see a talent like Tom Brady every week is awesome.
>
> To see a true freak like Randy Moss face/palm a defender,
> high-step away from the tackle, and up-shift to the next speed
> for a touchdown is amazing.
>
> Moss was supposed to be a bad apple, but he has proven to be
> about the best TEAM player the Patriots have.
>
> These are 2 first round Hall of Fame players for sure.
I'd have to agree, you certainly support a *very* talented team that we
somehow held to 0 TDs earlier this season. Look at how they've lit up
the scoreboard in every other game, and against quality opponents too.
--
Ian
Glenn Greenstein
in. He spent to many unproductive years in Oakland and Min.
HVAC
"Glenn Greenstein" <lex...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:7bf63d13-2fec-474c...@u20g2000vbq.googlegroups.com...
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Take a look at where he stands in all time receiving stats.
Ron
HUH?
You better have a look at his stats!
http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/M/MossRa00.htm
MZ
I would have agreed with you, but I believe he's 2nd in all-time
receiving TDs and will probably be top 5 in receiving yards before all
is said and done. First ballot HOF, no way, but I think he has a shot.
People think Cris Carter will make it, and both Moss and TO should top
most of his stats before they retire...
Ron
Here you can use Michael Irvin as a measuring stick.
http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/I/IrviMi00.htm
It's still baffling to me that you thought RM was "unproductive" in
Minn.
And, he was sharing the field with Chris Carter for 4 of his 7 yrs
there.
Glenn Greenstein
> "Glenn Greenstein" <lexa...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
It doesn't matter. A few years does not make you a HOFer, it is the
body of your work. HOFers don't dog it because the team sucks.
Glenn Greenstein
Glenn Greenstein
Look, if he was such a great talent, why did Min trade him to Oakland
and Oakland trade him to NE.
Basically there were issues on the field and off and those two lame
seasons in Oakland are enough to knock him out.
That is my opinion. You don't get to be a HOFer by being a part time
player.
Glenn Greenstein
Cater will get in because he was a consummate pro. TO, I don't know.
He has produced everywhere except the Bills this year. Seeing this is
near the end of his career, the voters may give him a pass. Moss is a
great talent, don't get me wrong, I just think you have to be making
an effort 100% of the time to get a bust. Someone want to show me how
he was trying to win in Oakland?
MZ
I had no idea that they required you to be productive in all your years.
If that's true, it seems they've made a few mistakes.
Ron
Yeah, he had OFF field issues, that has nothing to do with what he did
on the field. If you are gonna say that one bad season, and one pretty
good season with the Raiders - who SUCKED btw - should keep him out of
the HOF, then I guess you also believe that Irvin doesn't belong in
the HOF.
Your argument is ridiculous.
Ron
Wow....2 whole yrs out of 12, and he still went over 1,000 yds one of
those years and had 8 TDs. And the Raiders SUCKED!
Are you kidding me?
Nunya Bidnits
You mean like Al Davis made the Hall of Fame RB Marcus Allen a part time
player?
MartyB in KC
Glenn Greenstein
Irvin always had great numbers and are you telling me Moss didn't quit
on Oakland?
Glenn Greenstein
Allen never quit on his team.
Glenn Greenstein
He quit on Oakland. That IMO does not get you in. Name a player in the
HOF that ever quit on his team?
Glenn Greenstein
WHo knows what goes on in the minds of the voters. Most of them from
my understanding are Journalists.
Ron
Irvin always had great numbers? You obviously didn't look at the link
I provided.
How do you get over a 1000 yds playing for a team that went 4 -12 by
quiting? He supposedly "took plays off" during those 2 yrs, but he
still put up decent numbers his first yr there. You can't base an
entire career on 2 yrs. He was great in Minn, and he is great in NE.
Ron
Well, we will just have to agree to disagree. I guarantee you he will
be in HOF.
MZ
Casual fans (who don't know what they're actually looking at when they
watch football) still to this day insist that Moss takes plays off.
Even some journalists (who don't know what they're actually looking at
when they watch footbal) make the same claims.
Nunya Bidnits
That's not how HOF players are selected. They are selected on production.
Moss had a decline in production with the Raiders. So did Allen. So what. As
has already been pointed out, it's the sum total of their body of work. And
contrary to popular belief, players aren't inducted into the HOF as a member
of one team or another. They are inducted as themselves. So you could also
blame both situations on Al Davis, who nobody sympathizes with, but that's
not a factor either. The stats and the records speak for themselves and Moss
has the numbers.
MartyB in KC
Ron
Al Davis was a total asshole to MA during those yrs that he made him
sit on the bench, and pretty much only allowed him to play on 3rd
downs.
Whatever, it just extended his career...lol
Glenn Greenstein
All you have to do is look at what your team gave up to get Moss.
Oakland practically gave him away for nothing. Al Davis is a lot of
things but he isn't so dumb to sell off a HOFer for bupkis. It was
thought at that time that Moss was not a desirable player.
steven_nospam at Yahoo! Canada
> > > He quit on Oakland. That IMO does not get you in. Name a player in the
> > > HOF that ever quit on his team?
Eric Dickerson. In 1985 he missed two games during a contract dispute,
and again in 1990, the Colts (upset by contract demands) placed him on
the inactive list and he was there for seven weeks before returning to
play. Now there was no doubt that Dickerson would be in the HOF for
his ten year career with the Rams and Colts. But if the player's off-
field antics or "quitting" on the team whether it is before or at the
end of a game affected their eligibility, you could make a case for a
number of the players already inducted. Hell, LT with the Giants was
doing cocaine and hiring prostitutes and they let him in. OJ killed
his wife and they didn't take his jersey down in Canton. It's still
prominently displayed in a trophy case in the main area.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> All you have to do is look at what your team gave up to get Moss.
> Oakland practically gave him away for nothing. Al Davis is a lot of
> things but he isn't so dumb to sell off a HOFer for bupkis. It was
> thought at that time that Moss was not a desirable player.- Hide quoted text -
Moss has been very controversial, getting in trouble with the law, and
making stupid comments. His "lack of effort" was in Oakland where he
admitted being depressed that the team was always losing, and that he
did not get along with the coach. Funny thing was it looks like it was
mutual, because his coach even came out in May 2007 after he was
traded and said that Randy's best playing days were behind him and
that he questioned his work ethic.
Oddly enough, he caught a record 23 TD passes that year (2007) after
being traded, had 98 catches for almost 1500 yards, and had another
1000 yard season in 2008. He has gone to six Pro-Bowls and was an All-
Pro 4 times so far.
Randy is the type of guy that always wants to win. He has to be on
teams that have a chance to win, or he becomes disenchanted,
disinterested. That's unfortunate, but if you think that Belichick
would put anyone on the field that was not giving 100%, you must not
know him that well. And if you think that little blip in Oakland will
keep him out of the HOF one day, then wow...just wow...
Glenn Greenstein
The drug charges in the NFL are pretty common place and if Moss did
drugs or even roids, I would say he still deservse in because most
players do them. If you think differently about that you're being
naive, and do you think if OJ killed someone before he was inducted
that they still would have inducted him?
Nunya Bidnits
> Al Davis was a total asshole to MA during those yrs that he made him
> sit on the bench, and pretty much only allowed him to play on 3rd
> downs.
>
> Whatever, it just extended his career...lol
In Kansas City, we love Al Davis!
Nunya Bidnits
> The drug charges in the NFL are pretty common place and if Moss did
> drugs or even roids, I would say he still deservse in because most
> players do them. If you think differently about that you're being
> naive, and do you think if OJ killed someone before he was inducted
> that they still would have inducted him?
If player can be inducted, a player can be deducted.
Now here's the really stupid part... Pete Rose. Not the NFL, but the same
question, at what level of misbehavior vs performance do you deny a player
his historical place!
Give the man a break already!
Ron
Well, my team is the Dolphins, so...............
Ron
Yeah, no shit. Pet Rose needs to be inducted big time.
I wonder if Bonds will get in on his first ballot?
I think he's a fucking joke, and IMO Henry Aaron is the real Home Run
King.
Glenn Greenstein
september.invalid> wrote:
I agree on Pete Rose, he deserves to get in but I think we will need a
new commissioner before that ever happens. I don't know what it is
with Selig.
I did hear he was now considering rescinding the ban. If all these
roid pumping jocks get in like say McGuire, there should be a huge out
cry for Rose.
As far as a player being tossed out of the HOF, I doubt that will ever
happen no matter what he does after they induct him. OJ also was never
convicted so I guess that is there excuse.
Glenn Greenstein
How do we know he didn't do Roids either? I think 90% of Pro's have
used some sort of performance enhancing drug at one time or another.
Glenn Greenstein
Sorry about Ron, but I hope you at least got my point.
Neil X
>
> Sorry about Ron, but I hope you at least got my point.
Your point is that you don't think Randy Moss will get into the Hall
of Fame. You're Wrong, You Know. He'll be a first ballot inductee.
Neil X.
steven_nospam at Yahoo! Canada
> drugs or even roids, I would say he still deservse in because most
> players do them. If you think differently about that you're being
> naive, and do you think if OJ killed someone before he was inducted
I think you missed my point.
What I was saying is that there are far worse things that could (or
should) keep a person out of the HOF in a career spanning more than
ten years rather than one season where the player appeared to "not
make an effort". No one making the HOF nominees can know what happened
that season.Was he going through depression? Was he dealing with an
undisclosed injury? Did he have family troubles? Was there a coach
that disliked him and put him into situations that prevented his
progess?
And you are correct, I think OJ would not be in the HOF now if he had
committed murder AFTER his career but BEFORE the induction, even
though it does not take away what he did on the field in his time as a
player. But after the person is in, if something like that happens, I
would submit that he should become simply a footnote in the HOF
archives and not be on display as a heroic icon.
Ray O'Hara
"Glenn Greenstein" <lex...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:0746bf25-ced9-4efc...@r3g2000vbi.googlegroups.com...
On Nov 9, 4:10 pm, "HVAC" <harlowcampb...@gmail.com> wrote:
> "Glenn Greenstein" <lexa...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>
> news:7bf63d13-2fec-474c...@u20g2000vbq.googlegroups.com...
> On Nov 9, 2:22 pm, "HVAC" <harlowcampb...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> > I really feel lucky to be alive and a Pats fan these days.
>
> > To see a talent like Tom Brady every week is awesome.
>
> > To see a true freak like Randy Moss face/palm a defender,
> > high-step away from the tackle, and up-shift to the next speed
> > for a touchdown is amazing.
>
> > Moss was supposed to be a bad apple, but he has proven to be
> > about the best TEAM player the Patriots have.
>
> > These are 2 first round Hall of Fame players for sure.
>
> > --
> > "When one person suffers from a delusion, it is called insanity. When
> > many
> > people suffer from a delusion, it is called Religion."
>
> Brady will be a HOFer most likely, but there is no way Moss makes it
> in. He spent to many unproductive years in Oakland and Min.
>
> Take a look at where he stands in all time receiving stats.
It doesn't matter. A few years does not make you a HOFer, it is the
body of your work. HOFers don't dog it because the team sucks.
======================================================================
Getting into any HoF is also a popularity contest that requires the
candidate to have been at least civil to the voters.
Moss has never been accomodating and they will remember that come voting
time.
The NFL HoF is the worst in this respect from what I've read.
steven_nospam at Yahoo! Canada
> candidate to have been at least civil to the voters.
> Moss has never been accomodating and they will remember that come voting
> time.
Now see THAT I can believe. It may take several years for him to be
nominated, and another several to get the required amount of votes,
because a lot depends on your popularity. Of course, pressure from
fans and broadcasters that believe a player deserves to be in the HOF
can influence that somewhat.
to welker @cumshot.com AD
"Neil X" <nei...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:af50db9f-575b-4f37...@f10g2000vbl.googlegroups.com...
Randy won't get in...... the only way he will get in is I he rams the
building with his car.
Hammer
>
> - Show quoted text -
It's Glenn against everyone else. Glenn, do you really believe he
won't get in the HOF, or do you just enjoy fighting with the Pats
fans?
Nobody can predict the future, but on the merits he gets in for sure.
Probably not first ballot but he eventually gets in.
Glenn Greenstein
Actually I wouldn't even had commented if the ass wipe HVAC didn't x
post this in the Jets NG so take your i enjoy arguing with Pats fan BS
and stick it. I don't even look at this sewer you call a ng any
longer.
MuahMan
Watch Out! Nothing worse than a pissed off Jew wanting to kick your
ass. LOL
Ritchie
Hasn't worked in baseball with Pete Rose. Personally I believe he
should be allowed in Cooperstown, just banned for life from baseball.
extremeone
>
> Look, if he was such a great talent, why did Min trade him to Oakland
> and Oakland trade him to NE.
> Basically there were issues on the field and off and those two lame
> seasons in Oakland are enough to knock him out.
> That is my opinion. You don't get to be a HOFer by being a part time
> player.
he has the 2nd most TD receptions in NFL history in his tenth season
with 140. Jerry Rice totaled 197 in a 19 year carrer. Do the math you
halfwitted turd