Jets contact Casserly
Mark Vita
job within the organization. Interesting. Perhaps Parcells has finally
come to grips with his own obvious deficiencies as a personnel man.
-- Mark
Glenn Greenstein
problems.With the exception of Eric Green and Rick Terry who else was a bust
Mark Vita <vi...@softreal.com> wrote in message
news:3884AC44...@softreal.com...
Mike & Susan Romano
MikeR
tebu...@my-deja.com
Rick Mirer!
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.
Mark Vita
> Glenn Greenstein wrote:
>
> > I just can't get over all the Pats fans always pointing out BP personnel
> > problems.With the exception of Eric Green and Rick Terry who else was a bust
Mike & Susan Romano wrote:
> Rick Mirer comes to mind.
Not to mention Steve Atwater and Scott Zolak.
Or James "In"-Farrior (relative to where he was picked).
Add to this the fact that Parcells went into this past season without an adequate
backup quarterback, despite many decent candidates being available on the market.
This was a horrendous personnel blunder by Parcells.
Tom Tupa and Curtis Martin were good pickups talent-wise, but Parcells overpaid
for these guys tremendously. Martin at $6M/year is way overpaid, even if you
ignore the draft picks he cost the team. Tupa is making 3 or 4 times as much as a
punter should make. No wonder the Jets have such a horrid cap situation.
Also, you must remember the long list of brain-damaged personnel moves Parcells
made while with the Patriots (Marion Butts, Scott Secules, etc.)
Bringing in a real GM/personnel man would be a big upgrade for the Jets.
-- Mark
Ben Ford
was one of the best TEs in football. How could he be a bust?
In article <Dv2h4.2675$eX.5...@newsread1.prod.itd.earthlink.net>,
"Glenn Greenstein" <lex...@earthlink.net> wrote:
> I just can't get over all the Pats fans always pointing out BP
personnel
> problems.With the exception of Eric Green and Rick Terry who else was
a bust
> Mark Vita <vi...@softreal.com> wrote in message
> news:3884AC44...@softreal.com...
> > WEEI is reporting that the Jets have contacted Charlie Casserly
about a
> > job within the organization. Interesting. Perhaps Parcells has
finally
> > come to grips with his own obvious deficiencies as a personnel man.
> >
> > -- Mark
> >
> >
> >
>
>
Gravity Sucks
--
Please remove the obvious munge to reply by mail.
"Mike & Susan Romano" <wild...@winco.net> wrote in message
news:3884BB89...@winco.net...
> Rick Mirer comes to mind.
> MikeR
Robert Jensen
Mark Vita wrote in message <3884AC44...@softreal.com>...
>WEEI is reporting that the Jets have contacted Charlie Casserly about a
>job within the organization. Interesting. Perhaps Parcells has finally
>come to grips with his own obvious deficiencies as a personnel man.
>
>-- Mark
>
Nothing will be announced one way or th other until Kraft accepts
Tagliabue's deal. I'm still predicting a 2nd and a 4th round pick this year
and hope Peter King was right when he said you can bet the mortgage on
Parcells returning if Belichick winds up in NE. In the meantime have you
heard the one about Steve Grogan returning to coach the Pats?
Bob Jensen
Glenn Greenstein
started were brought in to backup. So if there is such a thing as a bust
backup, I guess they qualify. Farrior hasn't lived up to expectation but I
wouldn't classify him as a bust. He only has 2 seasons under his belt due to
injury. As far as the guys that he got for the Pats, I really don't count
that. We all made mistakes during our learning proccess.
My turn now.
Dwight Stone ( still a dagerous returner, kickers were kicking away from
him)
Tom Tupa ( The best in the NFL and deserves to be paid that way ,almost beat
the Pats as QB )
Ryan Young ( great late round pick he will replace Elliot soon )
Randy Thomas ( will be a OG corner stone for years )
Jason Fergason ( Very good DT )
Dedrick Ward ( excellent deep threat, had no one to throw him the ball this
season)
Johnson the RB ( has the injury bug but if he shakes it will be a stellar
3rd down back)
Bryan Cox ( best LB pick up ever made IMO, better than Bryce Pop or Kevin
Green )
Roman Phifer ( excellent side line to side line LB )
Coleman ( had a break out year let's hope it keeps going)
is that enough I could go on .news:3884C7D8...@softreal.com...
> >
> > Glenn Greenstein wrote:
> >
> > > I just can't get over all the Pats fans always pointing out BP
personnel
> > > problems.With the exception of Eric Green and Rick Terry who else was
a bust
>
>
>
Stan Pietrowicz
Mark Vita wrote:
> WEEI is reporting that the Jets have contacted Charlie Casserly about a
> job within the organization. Interesting. Perhaps Parcells has finally
> come to grips with his own obvious deficiencies as a personnel man.
>
> -- Mark
If I remember correctly, you live somewhere down south. WEEI reported no
such thing.
I know you like to make up things, but now your a LIAR!
Ann
for talent. I agree he did horrendously over pay these guys, but the Pats
OL is horrendously overpaid and what have they done this year?
-Ann
--
"You will make all kinds of mistakes: but as long as you are generous and
true and also fierce you cannot hurt the world or even seriously distress
her. She was made to be wooed and won by youth."
-Sir Winston Churchill
Gravity Sucks
"Glenn Greenstein" <lex...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:md4h4.2994$eX.6...@newsread1.prod.itd.earthlink.net...
<snip>
As far as the guys that he got for the Pats, I really don't count
> that. We all made mistakes during our learning proccess.
Learning process?!When Parcells came to the Patriots he already had a
Superbowl ring and a very nice career with the Giants. "Learning process" my
ass! It was just one in a long string of instances where Tuna's ego trumped
his judgement and he didn't rely on those who knew better.
Rick Rockett
> I just can't get over all the Pats fans always pointing out BP personnel
> problems.With the exception of Eric Green and Rick Terry who else was a
bust
But Greenstain, you have no problem with Jets fans pointing out all Pats
problems. Let me guess, Pats fans started it. Right?
You are a moron Greenstain..............
Mark Vita
> Mark Vita wrote:
>
> > WEEI is reporting that the Jets have contacted Charlie Casserly about a
> > job within the organization. Interesting. Perhaps Parcells has finally
> > come to grips with his own obvious deficiencies as a personnel man.
>
> If I remember correctly, you live somewhere down south.
Yes. And this is relevant because...? FYI, I am a Boston-area native.
You appear to be unaware of the existence of Internet-based broadcasting.
FYI, anyone in the country (or world for that matter) can listen to WEEI live
via RealAudio over the Internet. Works very well for transplanted sports fans
such as myself.
> WEEI reported no
> such thing.
Yes, they most certainly did. Just because you apparently didn't hear it
doesn't mean that it wasn't reported.
ESPN is reporting the same story, which can be found at the following link:
http://espn.go.com/nfl/news/2000/0118/298407.html
Quoting from the ESPN article:
Meanwhile, The Star-Ledger of New Jersey reported that Parcells recently
contacted former Washington general manager Charley Casserly to see if
he is interested in joining the organization. Casserly was fired last
year
after Daniel Snyder bought the Redskins.
> I know you like to make up things, but now your a LIAR!
Geez, Stan, don't cry, for chrissakes... I know it is a difficult thing to
admit that your idol is imperfect, but get a grip!
And no, I am not a liar. I humbly await your apology for this uncalled-for
accusation...
-- Mark
Mark Vita
> Not to get pissy or rude or anything like that, but at least Parcells pays
> for talent.
No, I would say Parcells *overpays* for talent. He also pays for lots of
no-talent (e.g., the aforementioned Atwater, Green, Mirer, etc).
I think this is one of Parcells' major failings: he's clueless about the salary
cap, and doesn't appear to have any concept of what a reasonable salary is for
a player with a given skill/experience level. His lack of experience in the
personnel area really bit the Jets on the ass this year.
> I agree he did horrendously over pay these guys, but the Pats
> OL is horrendously overpaid and what have they done this year?
No question about it. One of Bobby Grier's major mistakes was the excessive
contracts given to Max Lane and Todd Rucci. But the subject at hand was Bill
Parcells...
See, right there is a difference between Pats fans and Jets fans. Pats fans
are very open about acknowledging mistakes and making honest criticisms of
their team. Jets fans, on the other hand, seem constitutionally incapable of
criticizing the great football god Parcells.
-- Mark
J D Sal45
>There is so much smoke being sent out by the Jets anything is possible.
>Nothing will be announced one way or th other until Kraft accepts
>Tagliabue's deal. I'm still predicting a 2nd and a 4th round pick this year
>and hope Peter King was right when he said you can bet the mortgage on
>Parcells returning if Belichick winds up in NE. In the meantime have you
>heard the one about Steve Grogan returning to coach the Pats?
>Bob Jensen
>
>
It won't be a second and fourth this year since the Pats don't have a fourth
this year. J D Sal.
buster55
in their column.
Mark Vita wrote in message <3884DCC8...@softreal.com>...
Don Guido
> WEEI is reporting that the Jets have contacted Charlie Casserly about
a
> job within the organization. Interesting. Perhaps Parcells has
finally
> come to grips with his own obvious deficiencies as a personnel man.
>
There's another rather obvious conclusion that can be drawn. Parcells
might be seriously contemplating a return to the sidelines. This would
be a way to facilitate this move by lightening the burden of
responsibility that holding both positions (GM/HC) would impose. I'm
inclined to believe that his intention to retire is genuine. There is a
good possibility that he would be willing to undertake another season as
HC, without the added pressure of having to be the fulltime caretaker of
the franchise.
--
Don Guido
"One never needs their humor as much as when they argue with a fool."
Chinese Proverb
Kenny
on Lucas being on the team. And who other than Krafty's boys Grier and
Carroll said he wasn't good enough to play in the NFL?
"Brad Casemore" <bra...@home.com> wrote in message
news:Zk8h4.5179$rY2.2...@news1.rdc1.on.wave.home.com...
> "Glenn Greenstein" <lex...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
> news:md4h4.2994$eX.6...@newsread1.prod.itd.earthlink.net...
> > I'll give you Atwater, Rick Mier and Zolack who was cut before the
season
> > started were brought in to backup. So if there is such a thing as a bust
> > backup, I guess they qualify.
>
> I'd say they definitely qualify. Until the Jets were able to bring Lucas
up
> to speed at mid season, they were totally bereft of a competent
quarterback
> after the untimely injury to Testaverde.
>
>
>
Sullman
>In the meantime have you
>heard the one about Steve Grogan returning to coach the Pats?
>Bob Jensen
>
People here have wondered that for a while, but supposedly Grogan has no
interest, he runs his own sporting goods store. Many people think he'd have
made a great QB coach for Bledsore, but aall in all, it seems coaching isn't
in his blood.
And we'd all love to see Hoggie come back and coach the O-line.
Steve
Mark Vita
Don Guido <auto...@NShushmail.com> wrote in message
news:s8a3bb3...@corp.supernews.com...
> There's another rather obvious conclusion that can be drawn. Parcells
> might be seriously contemplating a return to the sidelines. This would
> be a way to facilitate this move by lightening the burden of
> responsibility that holding both positions (GM/HC) would impose.
Wait a minute... you mean, he wants to just be the head coach, and not the
GM? Er, isn't this exactly the deal that he had in New England a few years
back? You know, when the Patriots went to the Super Bowl? Which was
quickly followed by Parcells having a hissy fit of epic proportions and
breaking his contract?
If this turns out to be the rationale for bringing in Casserly, it will just
confirm the fact that Bob Kraft was right three years ago. The organization
is better off if you have two different men, one running the front office
and one doing the on-the-field coaching. Amazing, now Parcells may be on
the verge of coming to the same obvious conclusion. It's a shame the
stubborn bastard had to piss away three good coaching years with the Jets
before finally becoming enlightened.
-- Mark
Stan Pietrowicz
> Mark Vita wrote:
>
> > WEEI is reporting that the Jets have contacted Charlie Casserly about a
> > job within the organization. Interesting. Perhaps Parcells has finally
> > come to grips with his own obvious deficiencies as a personnel man.
>
> If I remember correctly, you live somewhere down south.
Yes. And this is relevant because...? FYI, I am a Boston-area native.
You appear to be unaware of the existence of Internet-based
broadcasting.
FYI, anyone in the country (or world for that matter) can listen to WEEI
live via RealAudio over the Internet. Works very well for transplanted
sports fans such as myself.
> WEEI reported no such thing.
Yes, they most certainly did. Just because you apparently didn't hear
it doesn't mean that it wasn't reported.
ESPN is reporting the same story, which can be found at the following
link:
http://espn.go.com/nfl/news/2000/0118/298407.html
Quoting from the ESPN article:
Meanwhile, The Star-Ledger of New Jersey reported that Parcells
recently contacted former Washington general manager Charley Casserly to
see if he is interested in joining the organization. Casserly was fired
last year after Daniel Snyder bought the Redskins.
> I know you like to make up things, but now your a LIAR!
Geez, Stan, don't cry, for chrissakes... I know it is a difficult thing
to admit that your idol is imperfect, but get a grip!
And no, I am not a liar. I humbly await your apology for this
uncalled-for accusation...
-- Mark
::::I humbly apologize that I called you a LIAR.I know you have a strong
anti-Parcells bias and coupling this with a severe reading deficiency
which accounts for your refusal to properly read and completely ignore
evidence to the contrary in a number of posts I countered you in.
FYI, WEEI has since downplayed, and more likely, rescinded it. Your ESPN
link does not mention the CC contact. But the Star Ledger of NJ, quoted
this source."It could mean he's interested in Charley," one NFL
executive said yesterday. "It could be he's looking for suggestions on
who could run the football operation. I'm reading that he just doesn't
want to be burdened with this thing, and I don't mean just the
coaching."
>From this you inferred "Perhaps Parcells has finally come to grips with
his own obvious deficiency as a personnel man." No matter what is said
or reported you have your own pathetic agenda.
You may be interested to know that the man you despise has been offered
the complete control of the NY Jets. Why don't you send Woody Johnson
all the Tuna Bashing vitriolic that you compiled? But, then again, in
your warped universe, since Parcells doesn't know how to build a winning
team, you could just hope that Parcells stays and you can continue your
anti-Parcellian fantasies. Even when the Jets win the AFCE.
Mark Vita
Stan Pietrowicz <pie...@banet.net> wrote in message
news:388521B2...@banet.net...
> ::::I humbly apologize that I called you a LIAR.
Why, thank you. Apology accepted.
> Your ESPN
> link does not mention the CC contact.
Apparently ESPN revised and/or moved the article that I previously linked.
However, the text that I excerpted was an exact, verbatim quote from the
ESPN article.
A better source is the Star Ledger's own website. The article is entitled
"The plot thickens as Parcells contacts Casserly" by Dave Hutchinson and
Paul Needell, and can be found at the following location:
http://www.nj.com/jets/stories/0118jets.html
Some interesting excerpts from this article:
"If Bill Parcells resists an offer from owner-in-waiting Robert Wood Johnson
IV to return to the sidelines, it's possible he'll sever ties with the Jets
and help Johnson hire someone from outside to run the organization."
"The Star-Ledger has learned that Parcells recently contacted former
Washington Redskins general manager Charley Casserly to see if he would be
interested in joining the organization."
"The two most attractive scenarios the Jets can offer Casserly are: Parcells
turns over the team to Casserly now. Or Casserly comes aboard and Parcells
returns for one more season -- for more than $5 million -- with Casserly
taking over as general manager in 2001. Either way, Casserly gets to pick
his own coach."
> From this you inferred "Perhaps Parcells has finally come to grips with
> his own obvious deficiency as a personnel man."
Yep. Why else would Parcells bring in another personnel man? He is
admitting that he needs help and cannot handle the job by himself. Why do
you think he would bring Casserly in? To mow his lawn? Casserly is a GM.
He accomplished more personnel-wise with the Ricky Williams deal than
Parcells ever did in his entire career.
-- Mark
Don Guido
"Mark Vita" <mv...@bellsouth.net> wrote in message
news:oW8h4.4738$FS5....@news3.mia...
Are you so readily determined to be disingenuous and obtuse? Your
bitterness and resentment are seemingly unbounded. You might be well
advised to seek professional assistance.
Best regards,
Mark Vita
Don Guido <auto...@NShushmail.com> wrote in message
No. I am just readily determined to enlighten Jets fans to the fact that
Kraft was right and Parcells was wrong back in '96. No more, no less.
Looks like now Parcells himself is helping make the case for me.
Don't you appreciate the incredible irony of Parcells setting up a similar
organization in New York as Kraft had established in New England?
> bitterness and resentment are seemingly unbounded.
Nope, no hard feelings. Just calling 'em as I see 'em.
>You might be well
> advised to seek professional assistance.
Heh... Actually, it looks to me like Parcells is the one seeking
professional assistance (i.e. Casserly)... :-)
-- Mark
j...@home.com
>
> Rick Mirer comes to mind.
Actually, didn't the Jets want Matt Hasselbeck (sp?) instead of Mirer?
>
> Glenn Greenstein wrote:
>
> > I just can't get over all the Pats fans always pointing out BP personnel
> > problems.With the exception of Eric Green and Rick Terry who else was a bust
> > Mark Vita <vi...@softreal.com> wrote in message
> > news:3884AC44...@softreal.com...
> > > WEEI is reporting that the Jets have contacted Charlie Casserly about a
> > > job within the organization. Interesting. Perhaps Parcells has finally
> > > come to grips with his own obvious deficiencies as a personnel man.
> > >
> > > -- Mark
> > >
> > >
> > >
Brad Casemore
Glenn Greenstein
Gravity Sucks <gravit...@I.HATE.SPAM.mindspring.com> wrote in message
news:862l4l$a5i$1...@nntp9.atl.mindspring.net...
>
> "Glenn Greenstein" <lex...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
> news:md4h4.2994$eX.6...@newsread1.prod.itd.earthlink.net...
> As far as the guys that he got for the Pats, I really don't count
> > that. We all made mistakes during our learning proccess.
>
> Learning process?!When Parcells came to the Patriots he already had a
> Superbowl ring and a very nice career with the Giants. "Learning process"
my
> ass! It was just one in a long string of instances where Tuna's ego
trumped
> his judgement and he didn't rely on those who knew better.
BP never called the shots with the Giants on personnel. George Young had the
last word. BP was learning how to do it with the Pats. As you can see by
were he brought your team he still knew how to coach
>
>
Glenn Greenstein
I just set up a new PIII in my home. I didn't have you blocked on this one.
Thanks for reminding me what an asshole you are. Don't bother responding, I
won't see it
Rick Rockett <rock...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:l35h4.3180$eX.6...@newsread1.prod.itd.earthlink.net...> news:Dv2h4.2675$eX.5...@newsread1.prod.itd.earthlink.net...
> > I just can't get over all the Pats fans always pointing out BP personnel
> > problems.With the exception of Eric Green and Rick Terry who else was a
> bust
>
======
> Hi Rick,
> I just set up a new PIII in my home. I didn't have you blocked on this
one.
> Thanks for reminding me what an asshole you are. Don't bother responding,
I
> won't see it
Oh yes will Greenstain. You can't filter out the truth.
Oh, shove the PIII up your ass, It will do you more good up there!!
Glenn Greenstein
====== <Green...@losers.com> wrote in message
news:v4bh4.5104$eX.1...@newsread1.prod.itd.earthlink.net...
RR
> If you think I scrolled down to read what you wrote think again
That's funny stuff Glenn.
Glenn Greenstein
just blocked this one
RR <rock...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:C1kh4.141$H4....@newsread2.prod.itd.earthlink.net...
RRR
> It must be nice to have no life Rick. Keep changing the name and address I
OK Greenstain, have it your way. Oh, by the way, I have a great life.
A small part of it includes playing you like a puppet!!
Stan Pietrowicz
Glenn Greenstein wrote:
> Gravity Sucks <gravit...@I.HATE.SPAM.mindspring.com> wrote in message
> news:862l4l$a5i$1...@nntp9.atl.mindspring.net...
> >
> > "Glenn Greenstein" <lex...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
> > news:md4h4.2994$eX.6...@newsread1.prod.itd.earthlink.net...
> > <snip>
> > As far as the guys that he got for the Pats, I really don't count
> > > that. We all made mistakes during our learning proccess.
> >
> > Learning process?!When Parcells came to the Patriots he already had a
> > Superbowl ring and a very nice career with the Giants. "Learning process"
> my
> > ass! It was just one in a long string of instances where Tuna's ego
> trumped
> > his judgement and he didn't rely on those who knew better.
>
> BP never called the shots with the Giants on personnel. George Young had the
> last word. BP was learning how to do it with the Pats. As you can see by
> were he brought your team he still knew how to coach
According to Will McDonough, who is co-authoring a book with the Tuna, probably
dealing with the decade of the '90s,Bill Parcells chose his draft choices(I
don't know when this started; probably after the 1st SB). George Young had the
final say if he disagreed, but he never had to overturn a Tuna pick.
Stan Pietrowicz
Mark Vita wrote:
> Ann wrote:
>
> > Not to get pissy or rude or anything like that, but at least Parcells pays
> > for talent.
>
> No, I would say Parcells *overpays* for talent. He also pays for lots of
> no-talent (e.g., the aforementioned Atwater, Green, Mirer, etc).
>
> I think this is one of Parcells' major failings: he's clueless about the salary
> cap, and doesn't appear to have any concept of what a reasonable salary is for
> a player with a given skill/experience level. His lack of experience in the
> personnel area really bit the Jets on the ass this year.
Overpayed for players: Martin app $5m, Tupa app.$1.5m, Mawae app.$2.5m: ANYONE
ELSE? All are playing at a very high level and have contributed to
the success of the team. In contrast, the Pats paid Law $7m -his performance
this year, did not warrant that money. Ted Johnson was paid $5m- his injury
made this a huge question mark. McGinest was paid $5m: he took the money
last year even though his injury affected his play.This year, he showed
improvement, but he is playing below what he is being paid. I won't discuss
Lane and Rucci and Slade and yes, Bledsoe's Blowout year at $8.5m. lol.
>
>
> > I agree he did horrendously over pay these guys, but the Pats
> > OL is horrendously overpaid and what have they done this year?
>
> No question about it. One of Bobby Grier's major mistakes was the excessive
> contracts given to Max Lane and Todd Rucci. But the subject at hand was Bill
> Parcells...
>
> See, right there is a difference between Pats fans and Jets fans. Pats fans
> are very open about acknowledging mistakes and making honest criticisms of
> their team. Jets fans, on the other hand, seem constitutionally incapable of
> criticizing the great football god Parcells.
>
> -- Mark
Pat fans are miffed that the draft choices thay were awarded for Parcells'
ransom and the #1 and #3 they got for 'damaged goods' Martin did not bring
them the dynasty they thought they would inherit, nor assign the Jets to the
junkheap of the AFCE. In '98, the Pats had the following draft picks: two #1s;
two #2s; two #3s. And THEY BLEW IT! After all, Pat fans knew Parcells
didn't know how to draft and certainly knew Parcells was a lousy judge of talent.
What they refuse to acknowledge is that their dreams and fantasies have
been replaced by their worst nightmare. Parcells got his revenge and
vindication. If not for the injury to Testaverde and the W/L record of
the team, you wouldn't be in this ng.
You are asking Jet fans to throw out all the contemporary evidence and what
was obtained from hindsight from the 12-4 Jets, into the same sinkhole Pat fans
have found themselves this year.Narrative appeals is not going to work. Fans
will use counter-factuals based on the two teams performances, not on your whims.
Brad Casemore
"Kenny" <ke...@NOSPAMseductive.com> wrote in message
news:3A7C61B3D63FAC27.BE75A337...@lp.airnews.net...
> Well, if you want to criticize tuna's judgement, who is the one who
insisted
> on Lucas being on the team. And who other than Krafty's boys Grier and
> Carroll said he wasn't good enough to play in the NFL?
>
>
> "Brad Casemore" <bra...@home.com> wrote in message
> news:Zk8h4.5179$rY2.2...@news1.rdc1.on.wave.home.com...
> > "Glenn Greenstein" <lex...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
> > news:md4h4.2994$eX.6...@newsread1.prod.itd.earthlink.net...
Andrew Brecher
computer? My imac has no problem fitting the last message entirely.
(Time for mac vs pc wars! Why not, we've had everything else here)
Glenn Greenstein wrote:
>
> If you think I scrolled down to read what you wrote think again
> ====== <Green...@losers.com> wrote in message
> news:v4bh4.5104$eX.1...@newsread1.prod.itd.earthlink.net...
> >
> > Glenn Greenstein <lex...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
Mark Vita
>
> > I think this is one of Parcells' major failings: he's clueless about the
salary
> > cap, and doesn't appear to have any concept of what a reasonable salary
is for
> > a player with a given skill/experience level. His lack of experience in
the
> > personnel area really bit the Jets on the ass this year.
>
> Overpayed for players: Martin app $5m, Tupa app.$1.5m,
Martin's annualized salary is not $5M/year, it's $6M/year, plus the two
draft picks that were surrendered by the Jets. This was an outrageous
overpayment for a second-tier running back like Martin.
Tupa's salary this year was $1.7M. This is crazy money to pay to a punter,
even a good one like Tupa. The Pats paid $400K for their punter.
You see, one of Parcells' other problems is that since he is too lazy and
ill-informed to actually go out and evaluate free agent talent, he tends to
bring in players he knows by association from his previous teams, and then
sign them to lavish contracts that far exceed their value. He did it with
the Patriots, bringing in a long succession of overpaid ex-Giants. And he
is showing exactly the same pattern with the Jets.
> All are playing at a very high level and have contributed to
> the success of the team.
In the business of the NFL, it isn't sufficient to justify a player's salary
in isolation, based on airheaded platitudes such as "he plays at a high
level" or "contributes to the success of the team". You must evaluate the
player's salary and value to the team in the context of the team's salary
cap. Parcells shows no sign of being able to do this. Martin and Tupa may
be decent players, but their excessive contracts are huge factors in why the
Jets salary cap is such a mess after three years of mismanagment by
Parcells.
>n contrast, the Pats paid Law $7m -his performance
> this year, did not warrant that money.
I notice you were very careful to say "this year". This is because you know
full well that over his career, Ty Law has shown that he is one of the
premiere cornerbacks in the NFL. Don't believe it? Ask Keyshawn Johnson
what he thinks.
>Ted Johnson was paid $5m- his injury
> made this a huge question mark.
No, his injury was not a risk factor at all. A torn biceps is not a
long-term, lingering injury.
And as you must know if you watch any football at all, Ted Johnson is
clearly one of the best middle linebackers in the game. He's much better
than anyone the Jets have at the position. Look how much the Pats defense
stiffened up the last few games of the year once Johnson returned to the
lineup. He's the core of the defense. Despite him only playing a few games
at less than full strength, he was a big factor in the Pats defense
finishing the year ranked 8th overall in the league. By the way, the Jets
defense finished something like 27th.
>McGinest was paid $5m: he took the money
> last year even though his injury affected his play.
Wait a minute: are you actually implying that McGinest should have returned
his salary for last year due to the fact that he was injured? Stan, let me
ask you a question: do you believe this to be customary practice in the NFL?
Almost every time you open your mouth, you reveal more and more of your
astonishing ignorance of how the business of football works.
> > See, right there is a difference between Pats fans and Jets fans. Pats
fans
> > are very open about acknowledging mistakes and making honest criticisms
of
> > their team. Jets fans, on the other hand, seem constitutionally
incapable of
> > criticizing the great football god Parcells.
>
> Pat fans are miffed that the draft choices thay were awarded for
Parcells'
> ransom and the #1 and #3 they got ... <blah blah blah>
> <further idiotic ramblings deleted>
Well, Stan, I see that your only response to my last point was to avoid it,
immediately going into a yet another boneheaded, rambling diatribe about the
Patriots. We are not talking about the Patriots. We are talking about
Parcells. And I noticed that you once again went through an entire posting
without acknowledging a single criticism or negative fact about Parcells.
Thank you for making my point for me.
Don't you see how your slavish and misguided idol-worship of Parcells has
completely stripped you of any objectivity? I am willing to acknowledge and
discuss both Parcells' obvious strengths (coaching, motivation) and
weaknesses (personnel moves, personal integrity). I am also willing to
perform this same honest analysis of my own team. Why aren't you?
Let me put it to you directly, Stan. Even Jets fans who thought Parcells
had a pretty good year personnel-wise in 1998 must admit that this past year
was an absolute disaster by Parcells from a personnel standpoint. From his
failure to sign a backup quarterback, to his boneheaded signings of
washed-up bums like Eric Green, Steve Atwater, Rick Mirer and Scott Zolak,
this past season was unquestionably a miserable failure by Parcells using
any objective measure. If Bobby Grier had had this kind of year in New
England, he would have been fired in a heartbeat (in fact, he may still be
fired despite having a much better year than Parcells did.)
OK, Stan, the gauntlet has been thrown down. Admit it: Parcells did some
Bad Things this year. Come on, you can do it!!! It's the first step along
your long road to recovery....
-- Mark
Lance Kass
<kay_sa...@systemone.com> wrote in message
news:867mcg$gkq$1...@nnrp1.deja.com...
> x-no-archive: yes
>
> > Martin's annualized salary is not $5M/year, it's $6M/year, plus the
>
> Curtis Martin signed a five year, $27M contract with the Jets in 1998.
> The *club* holds an option on a sixth year, at $8.68M. Thus, the Jets'
> committed obligation to Martin averages $5.4M/year over the five-year
> period. Martin's cap value (assuming no restructuring, which is
> rumored to have occurred or occur this off-season) does not reach $6.0
> million until 2001. To date, the cap values of Martin's contract with
> the Jets have been $4.3M in 1998, $4.1M in 1999, and it will be $5.0M
> in 2000.
>
> > a second-tier running back like Martin.
>
> Since Curtis Martin joined the Jets in 1998, no NFL running back has
> outrushed him. Not Marshall Faulk, not Emmitt Smith, not Terrell
> Davis, not Eddie George, not Ricky Watters, not Jamal Anderson, not
> Corey Dillon. No one.
>
> > Tupa's salary this year was $1.7M. This is crazy money to pay to a
> punter,
> > even a good one like Tupa. The Pats paid $400K for their punter.
>
> Every team pays players what that team thinks the players are worth.
> The Jets "underpay" one of the better offense lines in the league,
> since many of its players are at minimums. The Dolphins and
> Patriots "overpay" for middling quarterback play. The Bills
> severely "overpay" their 2nd-string QB, as do the Vikings, but the
> Vikings "underpay" their starting QB. The concept of "overpaying" for
> players based on cap exposure/"management" is probably the single
> greatest cause of misinformed speculation by football fans.
>
> > And as you must know if you watch any football at all, Ted Johnson is
> > clearly one of the best middle linebackers in the game. He's much
> better
> > than anyone the Jets have at the position.
>
> Ridiculous. Ted Johnson's career and numbers mirror Jets MLB Marvin
> Jones' so closely it is almost eerie. Both players have been injury-
> prone, Johnson averaging about 12 games/season, Jones averaging about
> 11, and thus the best way to examine performance is on a per-game
> basis. According to the CNN/SI database, both players average around 7
> tackles per game, the currency of the linebacker. Sack numbers are
> similiar, stops for loss numbers are similiar, etc. The only real
> difference in play is reputionally, where Johnson has a reputation as a
> top shelf run-stopper (and his career solo tackle numbers of 5.0/game
> to Jones' 4.8/game may support this), while Jones' reputation is that
> of a more complete player (whose greater number of passes defensed may
> support this). Simply put, both of these players are top level players
> in the NFL, and to call one or the other "much better" than the other
> reveals nothing but a lacking in observational skills or a willful
> attempt to deceive.
>
> This "all Patriots players are awesome/all Jets players suck" attitude
> is an anachronism that died among all but the most extremist Patriot
> fans in 1997.
>
>
> Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
> Before you buy.
jo...@thrak.bosco.net
> Since Curtis Martin joined the Jets in 1998, no NFL running back has
> outrushed him. Not Marshall Faulk, not Emmitt Smith, not Terrell
> Davis, not Eddie George, not Ricky Watters, not Jamal Anderson, not
> Corey Dillon. No one.
Conveniently leaving out the fact that the 3 best backs (Barry, Terrell
and Jamal) didn't play this year.
John (who happens to like Curtis)
Lance Kass
This is just one of those arguments I never agree with. John Elway didn't
play this year, Vinny Testaverde played a partial game, Joe Montana didn't
play nor did Joe Namath. Jim Brown didn't play, Freeman and Earl didn't play
either. There really is no reason to bring these names up either.
Just wondering at what point does someone get credit. What if Jamal did play
this year and Martin had a better year than him? What if Jamal comes back
next year and Martin has a better year than him next year do we reclassify
this year then? What if Barry does come back and gets injured, or Davis and
Jamal get hurt again, what then?
The points Kay made were all valid. Leaving out Jamal, Barry and Terrell
were legitimate. If they are not here why should we use them in the
comparison (only for historical references). Maybe when Martin's career is
over we can then compare his whole career to those of J,B,and T.
*Do you think Basketball teams who win titles now will think less of it
because Jordan's Bulls weren't playing?
I know I jumped back and forth and all over the place, but this is just one
of those arguments that I think detract from someone's accomplishments.
Another Jump here:
Jacksonville is probably tired of hearing well who did you beat? So what you
were 14-2, but did you beat anyone above 500. Fine next time maybe Jax
should lose one game against Baltimore, so their other win against Baltimore
would have been against a 9-7 team. Had they lost to the Jets the Jets would
of been 9-7 and in the playoffs. Had they lost to Carolina the Panthers
would have been 9-7 and in the playoffs. Its unfortunate that they played a
weaker schedule but they finished 14-2. Ask Miami if they still believe Jax
only a playoff team because they played a weak schedule. (Weak schedules
which I have gone into before is another thing left for another post)
Final Jump
My brother had a problem with Jordan being named over Babe as the top
athlete of the century, and frankly I agreed with him. Not that homers are
the only thing to go off of, but how much better was Babe Ruth compared to
the next player. Check his other stats as well. Also this man could have
been a top pitcher as well. Did anyone see Jordan play baseball. Yes Jordan
was a great basketball player which elevated his team but how much better
was he then the next guy. Not trying to say he wasn't a great player,
because I have no problem with him in the top 5 just believe Ruth was that
much better in his game compared to the next guy in his game.
OK the rambling stopped.
See what you did John.
<jo...@thrak.bosco.net> wrote in message
news:867pa1$lor$1...@bob.news.rcn.net...
jo...@thrak.bosco.net
> If they don't play what makes them the best backs?
> The points Kay made were all valid. Leaving out Jamal, Barry and Terrell
> were legitimate. If they are not here why should we use them in the
> comparison (only for historical references). Maybe when Martin's career is
> over we can then compare his whole career to those of J,B,and T.
How can comparing Curtis's 2 years of stats to Jamal's & Terrell's 1 be
legit? All he is saying that Curtis took 2 years to out rush what Terrell
and Jamal (who both out rushed him the year they did play) did in one,
and thats pretty meaningless. Maybe you need to re-read Kay's post?
He basically said that in 98 & 99 Curtis outrushed what Terrell and
Jamal did in 98, I bet there are many backs that can say that.
Combined Terrell rushed for 2219 yards, well 2008 of them were last year,
Jamal's 2 year combined is 1905 (59 of which were this year).
No it's not a fair comparison, unless of course you are a Jet fan
trying to make a point.
John
Stan Pietrowicz
obsessed Tuna-Basher. It's about Parcells. Also, how much do you know about
how football business works? He knows. He is an expert judge of the duties
of the following: GM,
Capologist, Personnel Director,Psychologist ,Free Agent Negotiator.
kay_sa...@systemone.com wrote:
> x-no-archive: yes
>
> > Martin's annualized salary is not $5M/year, it's $6M/year, plus the
>
> Curtis Martin signed a five year, $27M contract with the Jets in 1998.
> The *club* holds an option on a sixth year, at $8.68M. Thus, the Jets'
> committed obligation to Martin averages $5.4M/year over the five-year
> period. Martin's cap value (assuming no restructuring, which is
> rumored to have occurred or occur this off-season) does not reach $6.0
> million until 2001. To date, the cap values of Martin's contract with
> the Jets have been $4.3M in 1998, $4.1M in 1999, and it will be $5.0M
> in 2000.
>
> > a second-tier running back like Martin.
>
> Since Curtis Martin joined the Jets in 1998, no NFL running back has
> outrushed him. Not Marshall Faulk, not Emmitt Smith, not Terrell
> Davis, not Eddie George, not Ricky Watters, not Jamal Anderson, not
> Corey Dillon. No one.
>
> > Tupa's salary this year was $1.7M. This is crazy money to pay to a
> punter,
> > even a good one like Tupa. The Pats paid $400K for their punter.
>
> Every team pays players what that team thinks the players are worth.
> The Jets "underpay" one of the better offense lines in the league,
> since many of its players are at minimums. The Dolphins and
> Patriots "overpay" for middling quarterback play. The Bills
> severely "overpay" their 2nd-string QB, as do the Vikings, but the
> Vikings "underpay" their starting QB. The concept of "overpaying" for
> players based on cap exposure/"management" is probably the single
> greatest cause of misinformed speculation by football fans.
>
> > And as you must know if you watch any football at all, Ted Johnson is
> > clearly one of the best middle linebackers in the game. He's much
> better
> > than anyone the Jets have at the position.
>
JMG
Definitely a 1st level RB.
- John
<jo...@thrak.bosco.net> wrote in message
news:867pa1$lor$1...@bob.news.rcn.net...
> kay_sa...@systemone.com wrote:
> > Since Curtis Martin joined the Jets in 1998, no NFL running back has
> > outrushed him. Not Marshall Faulk, not Emmitt Smith, not Terrell
> > Davis, not Eddie George, not Ricky Watters, not Jamal Anderson, not
> > Corey Dillon. No one.
>
Lance Kass
<jo...@thrak.bosco.net> wrote in message
news:867tj1$1c6$1...@bob.news.rcn.net...
> Lance Kass <lk...@mindspring.com> wrote:
> > If they don't play what makes them the best backs?
>
> > The points Kay made were all valid. Leaving out Jamal, Barry and Terrell
> > were legitimate. If they are not here why should we use them in the
> > comparison (only for historical references). Maybe when Martin's career
is
> > over we can then compare his whole career to those of J,B,and T.
>
> How can comparing Curtis's 2 years of stats to Jamal's & Terrell's 1 be
> legit? All he is saying that Curtis took 2 years to out rush what Terrell
> and Jamal (who both out rushed him the year they did play) did in one,
> and thats pretty meaningless. Maybe you need to re-read Kay's post?
> He basically said that in 98 & 99 Curtis outrushed what Terrell and
> Jamal did in 98, I bet there are many backs that can say that.
> Combined Terrell rushed for 2219 yards, well 2008 of them were last year,
> Jamal's 2 year combined is 1905 (59 of which were this year).
> No it's not a fair comparison, unless of course you are a Jet fan
> trying to make a point.
>
> John
Robert Edwards is the second coming to GOD, and Bo Jackson is GOD.
(Sarcastic)
*Is Robert Edwards the right name, because ESPN doesn't even list his name
in the NFL Players.
Ok, my point is Curtis is a top-tier back, based on who is in the league
now. Maybe Kay should of left Jamal and Terrell's names off totally
(Jamals/Martin stats for 5 years below). So, who was better than Martin the
last two years, which is when the Jets had him? Is Jamal better than Curtis
because Jamal had a career year last year and may or may not been able to do
it again? Is Terrell better than him for the past two years (career wise
right now Terrell yes, but I do feel better having a healthy Curtis than not
knowing what may be with Terrell next year). So, What does Curtis have to do
to prove he is a top-tier back? He gets little respect (among the
voiceterous (sp)). He has showed he can do it year in year out. If all it
is, is stats. Then Ray Lucas is a better QB this year then Drew Bledsoe and
Dan Marino. I am not dismissing stats, but stats do play a part. How do you
compare someone who doesn't play in that year with someone who does (I say
you shouldn't have to)?
Here are stats for Martin and Jamal for the past five years. Notice that
Martin missed one game last year (not that he would have ran for 500 plus
yards). So what makes Jamal Anderson a top-tier back? He has five years in
the pros with one exceptional year.
Martin
Yr G YDS AVG
95 16 1487 4
96 16 1152 3.6
97 13 1160 4.2
98 15 1287 3.5
99 16 1464 4.0
Anderson
95 16 161 4.1
96 16 1055 4.5
97 16 1002 3.5
98 16 1849 4.5
99 2 59 3.1
Oh and you tell me to go re-read Kay post, but why, you only responded to a
snipett, so I responded to your snipett (I was probably wrong for even
replying to your snipett, since I believe Kay did a fine job and I am just
hurting his argument). When I read Kay's post the first time I thought he
did a great job, so I didn't need to go back. Now that I did, it appears his
facts are straight to me. No one has outrushed Curtis in the time he has
been with the Jets. He also included Eddie George, Emmitt Smith, Ricky
Watters, and Marshall Faulk. None of these guys are slouches themselves.
Mark Vita
> Curtis Martin signed a five year, $27M contract with the Jets in 1998.
> The *club* holds an option on a sixth year, at $8.68M.
Yes, so doing the math, the total value of his contract is $36M over six
years, which annualizes to an average of $6M/year, exactly as I said. This
is a perfectly valid and conventional manner of expressing the value of his
contract, and is consistent with the way his annual salary is reported in
news outlets such as ESPN and the Associated Press. And it will hold up
exactly as stated unless you expect the Jets to decline his option, and for
Martin to accept considerably less than what his is already making.
>Since Curtis Martin joined the Jets in 1998, no NFL running back has
>outrushed him. Not Marshall Faulk, not Emmitt Smith, not Terrell
>Davis, not Eddie George, not Ricky Watters, not Jamal Anderson, not
>Corey Dillon. No one.
Your comparison is extremely suspect, to say the least, since your list
contains some obvious cannon fodder like the over-the-hill Smith and the
overrated Watters. As well as the fact that three of the top backs in the
game, Terrell Davis, Jamahl Anderson, and Barry Sanders, happened not to
play at all this year for various reasons. If they had, Martin's stats
would have once again placed him in what I would consider to be the second
tier, just like in previous years.
As for this year, Martin was significantly out-produced in every single
rushing statistic by a rookie running back, Edgerrin James. James had more
rushing yards, better yards-per-carry, more rushing touchdowns, more
receiving yards, better receiving average, and more receiving touchdowns.
As for Marshall Faulk, he had a much better season than Martin both last
year and this year. This season, he rushed for slightly less yardage, but
had a much better 5.5 average YPC, and he absolutely blew Martin away with
over 2400 all-purpose yards. Hence Faulk's well-deserved selection as this
year's Offensive Player of the Year.
Stephen Davis also had a better rushing year than Martin, with about the
same number of rushing yards, a better YPC average, and over three times as
many touchdowns.
In actuality, Martin's supposedly "great" season this year was really no
better statistically than his last year with the Patriots in 1997. Martin
had a better yards-per-carry and the same number of touchdowns in 1997
despite playing in three fewer games.
Let me ask you this: do you truly believe that Curtis Martin deserves to be
placed in the same category as the great franchise back such as Terrell
Davis and Barry Sanders?
> > Tupa's salary this year was $1.7M. This is crazy money to pay to a
> punter,
> > even a good one like Tupa. The Pats paid $400K for their punter.
>
> Every team pays players what that team thinks the players are worth.
Uh, yeah, I guess that would make sense, wouldn't it? :-) The question
is, what makes the Jets think Tupa is worth $1.7M? Sure, all teams
underpay for some positions and overpay for others. But paying four times
the market rate for a punter is lunacy. Parcells' insane desire to stick
it to Kraft clearly played a role in this absurd contract signing.
> Ridiculous. Ted Johnson's career and numbers mirror Jets MLB Marvin
> Jones' so closely it is almost eerie.
<further data on Marvin Jones excised>
Sure, I'll grant you that Jones is a pretty good linebacker. I happen to
think Johnson is the better overall player, but you certainly have the
right to your opinion. And I'll grant that Johnson is perhaps not "much"
better than Jones, but perhaps just "better". :-)
In any event, the salient point that I was trying to refute was Stan's
absurd contention that $5M was an inappropriate salary for a top-shelf
linebacker like Johnson.
> This "all Patriots players are awesome/all Jets players suck"
I don't believe this to be true, nor have I ever said anything of the
kind. I do believe that the Patriots have better overall talent in the
aggregate sense, have fewer overpaid players, and have done a better job
managing the salary cap than the Jets.
-- Mark
Xtina
Mark Vita wrote:
>
> Stan Pietrowicz <pie...@banet.net> wrote in message
> news:38867972...@banet.net...
> You see, one of Parcells' other problems is that since he is too lazy and
> ill-informed to actually go out and evaluate free agent talent, he tends to
> bring in players he knows by association from his previous teams,
It is what is known as going with a "known quantity". There is
a lot more to player makeup besides athletic talent, which
contributes to success on the field. And which can't be judged
simply from evalauting free agent talent.
> And as you must know if you watch any football at all, Ted Johnson is
> clearly one of the best middle linebackers in the game. He's much better
> than anyone the Jets have at the position. Look how much the Pats defense
> stiffened up the last few games of the year once Johnson returned to the
> lineup. He's the core of the defense. Despite him only playing a few games
> at less than full strength, he was a big factor in the Pats defense
> finishing the year ranked 8th overall in the league. By the way, the Jets
> defense finished something like 27th.
>
And yet, BB is considered a defensive guru, genius, etc.
hazmat
Mark Vita
Xtina <haz...@NOTfnol.net> wrote in message
news:3887AF2F...@NOTfnol.net...
> > finishing the year ranked 8th overall in the league. By the way, the
Jets
> > defense finished something like 27th.
>
Not by me, he isn't.
-- Mark
Stan Pietrowicz
Tupa's salary this year was $1.7M. This is crazy money to pay to a
punter, even a good one like Tupa. The Pats paid $400K for their
punter.
::::Boston Globe, 12/26/99
Lee Johnson-punter Salary & bonus for '99- $1.1million BOOM!
MarkVita wrote:
And as you must know if you watch any football at all, Ted Johnson is
clearly one of the best middle linebackers in the game. He's much
better than anyone the Jets have at the position.
Kay Sahagian wrote:
Ridiculous. Ted Johnson's career and numbers mirror Jets MLB Marvin
Jones' so closely it is almost eerie. Both players have been injury-
prone, Johnson averaging about 12 games/season, Jones averaging about
11, and thus the best way to examine performance is on a per-game
basis. According to the CNN/SI database, both players average around 7
tackles per game, the currency of the linebacker. Sack numbers are
similiar, stops for loss numbers are similiar, etc. The only real
difference in play is reputionally, where Johnson has a reputation as a
top shelf run-stopper (and his career solo tackle numbers of 5.0/game to
Jones' 4.8/game may support this), while Jones' reputation is that of a
more complete player (whose greater number of passes defensed may
support this). Simply put, both of these players are top level players
in the NFL, and to call one or the other "much better" than the other
reveals nothing but a lacking in observational skills or a willful
attempt to deceive.
:::::Boston Globe, 12/26/99
Ted Johnson-LB Salary and bonus for '99- $5.48 million for five
games(?).
('98 figure for Jets)
M. Jones-LB salary & bonus for '98- $2.0 million
BOOM! BOOM! BOOM!
The BOOM's reflect the destruction of MarkVita's projected whimsical
fantasies.
::::In response to a more knowledgeable Pat fan, I used the phrase ' a
second-tier WR ' in referring to Terry Glenn.
Note what the delusional copy-cat wrote: a second-tier running back like
Martin.BOOM!
MarkVita wrote:
You see, one of Parcells' other problems is that since he is too lazy
and ill-informed to actually go out and evaluate free agent talent, he
tends to bring in players he knows by association from his previous
teams, and then sign them to lavish contracts that far exceed their
value. He did it with the Patriots, bringing in a long succession of
overpaid ex-Giants. And he is showing exactly the same pattern with the
Jets.
:::: This Tuna-Basher is no longer playing with a full deck! He's a
better GM than Parcells; He's a better free agent negotiator, capologist
and draft evaluator than any one in the Jet organization. And he works
harder and is more informed than Parcells.
Parcells has been judging and developing talent as a head coach for
nearly 20 years The deluded one says Parcells is too lazy and
ill-informed. Enough already!
BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! BOOM!
Stan Pietrowicz
Stan Pietrowicz wrote:
> Don Guido <auto...@NShushmail.com> wrote in message
> news:s8a3bb3...@corp.supernews.com...
> > There's another rather obvious conclusion that can be drawn. Parcells
> > might be seriously contemplating a return to the sidelines. This would
> > be a way to facilitate this move by lightening the burden of
> > responsibility that holding both positions (GM/HC) would impose.
>
> Wait a minute... you mean, he wants to just be the head coach, and not
> the GM? Er, isn't this exactly the deal that he had in New England a
> few years back? You know, when the Patriots went to the Super Bowl?
> Which was quickly followed by Parcells having a hissy fit of epic
> proportions and breaking his contract?
>
> If this turns out to be the rationale for bringing in Casserly, it will
> just confirm the fact that Bob Kraft was right three years ago. The
> organization is better off if you have two different men, one running
> the front office and one doing the on-the-field coaching. Amazing, now
> Parcells may be on the verge of coming to the same obvious conclusion.
> It's a shame the stubborn bastard had to piss away three good coaching
> years with the Jets before finally becoming enlightened.
>
> -- Mark
>
Another projected whimsical fantasy(BOOM) blown up before the snow hits the
ground. Casserly does Houston. Kraft is still waiting for Belichick. He can
be had at the right price: a#2 in '00, a#3  in '01. When Belichick goes
in, he pushes Grier out and the Parcells disciple applies Parcells'
techniques in the draft. BOOM! BOOM! BOOM!
Xtina
Mark Vita wrote:
>
> kay_sa...@systemone.com wrote:
>
> >
>
> >Since Curtis Martin joined the Jets in 1998, no NFL running back has
> >outrushed him. Not Marshall Faulk, not Emmitt Smith, not Terrell
> >Davis, not Eddie George, not Ricky Watters, not Jamal Anderson, not
> >Corey Dillon. No one.
>
> Your comparison is extremely suspect, to say the least, since your list
> contains some obvious cannon fodder like the over-the-hill Smith and the
> overrated Watters. As well as the fact that three of the top backs in the
> game, Terrell Davis, Jamahl Anderson, and Barry Sanders, happened not to
> play at all this year for various reasons. If they had, Martin's stats
> would have once again placed him in what I would consider to be the second
> tier, just like in previous years.
But they didn't, so it doesn't. Ever hear the saying a bird in
the hand is worth two in the bush? It doesn't matter how good
Anderson, Davis, et al, if they're not playing. Heck, they're
worth as much to the coach and team as I am. A "second-tier"
Martin
produced alot more for his team than a "first tier",
non-playing Anderson did for his.
hazmat
Mark Vita
Stan "BOOM BOOM" Pietrowicz <pie...@banet.net> wrote in message
news:3887C266...@banet.net...
>Casserly does Houston.
As expected. I don't think anyone expected Casserly to actually go to the
Jets. He obviously had more attractive opportunities elsewhere. Trying to
clean up Parcells' mess in NY would have been a real chore. Who needs that?
The interesting thing about the whole Casserly thing was not whether
Casserly would actually end up going to the Jets. The interesting part was
Parcells' tacit admission that he needs professional help in the
GM/personnel area.
> Kraft is still waiting for Belichick. He can
> be had at the right price: a#2 in '00, a#3  in '01.
Hey, no #1 pick? What happened? I thought you Jets fans were guaranteed to
get the same deal the Pats got for Parcells. I see you are already lowering
your expectations.
> When Belichick goes
> in, he pushes Grier out and the Parcells disciple applies Parcells'
> techniques in the draft.
The only way Belichick could apply Parcells' draft techniques would be if he
hired Charley Armey. That way, Armey could make Belichick's picks for him,
the same way he did for Parcells.
-- Mark
Mark Vita
> ::::Boston Globe, 12/26/99
> Lee Johnson-punter Salary & bonus for '99- $1.1million
Actually, I rechecked my sources, and the figure I found for Johnson was
actually $800K. The $400K figure was what the Patriots paid in base salary
to Terry Allen (i.e. about 1/15th of what the Jets paid to Martin).
None of this, of course, changes the fact that $1.7M is wacky cash for Tupa.
> :::::Boston Globe, 12/26/99
> Ted Johnson-LB Salary and bonus for '99- $5.48 million for five
> games(?).
This was not in dispute, was it? But there you go again, implying that
somehow Johnson should be paid less due to the fact was he was unexpectedly
injured. This just ain't the way it works, Stan. If it was, there'd be a
major player revolt.
By the way, how much did Vinny Testaverde get paid for sitting around with
his thumb up his ass all year? He should pay it all back!
> The BOOM's reflect the destruction of MarkVita's projected whimsical
> fantasies.
You keep using that word, "whimsical". I do not think it means what you
think it means. Perhaps you should look it up.
> ::::In response to a more knowledgeable Pat fan, I used the phrase ' a
> second-tier WR ' in referring to Terry Glenn.
> Note what the delusional copy-cat wrote: a second-tier running back like
> Martin.BOOM!
Sorry, Stan. I was unaware that you had previously secured the exclusive
rights to the phrase "second-tier". I hope you won't mind if I use it
again. Here goes: Stanley, you have a second-tier intellect.
By the way, it's a pity you didn't also patent that whole idiotic "BOOM!
BOOM!" thing you seem so fond of lately. You'd be worth a fortune!
> :::: This Tuna-Basher is no longer playing with a full deck!
<some idiotic blather deleted to spare the reader>
> nearly 20 years The deluded one says Parcells is too lazy and
> ill-informed. Enough already!
Well, Stan, I see that you have made it through yet another post and still
have not acknowledged a single negative fact about your idol, Bill Parcells.
In case you missed it before, let me repose my challenge: Even Jets fans who
thought Parcells
had a pretty good year personnel-wise in 1998 must admit that this past year
was an absolute disaster by Parcells from a personnel standpoint. From his
failure to sign a backup quarterback, to his boneheaded signings of
washed-up bums like Eric Green, Steve Atwater, Rick Mirer and Scott Zolak,
this past season was unquestionably a miserable failure by Parcells using
any objective measure. If Bobby Grier had had this kind of year in New
England, he would have been fired in a heartbeat (in fact, he may still be
fired despite having a much better year than Parcells did.)
OK, Stan. It's now up to you. Admit that Parcells screwed up this year.
Eric Green?!?!? Come on, you can say it. You'll feel better afterward, I
promise.
-- Mark
Mark Vita
Xtina <haz...@NOTfnol.net> wrote in message
> But they didn't, so it doesn't. Ever hear the saying a bird in
> the hand is worth two in the bush?
Ever hear the saying that paying Barry Sanders money to a player who is not
nearly as as good as Barry Sanders is a foolhardy waste of cash?
The gist of the discussion was whether Curtis Martin is as high a quality
running back as Davis, Sanders, etc. Trying to prove this using the fact
that his numbers over two seasons exceed the other players' single season
numbers is an intellectually bankrupt argument.
-- Mark
Stan Pietrowicz
> ::::Boston Globe, 12/26/99
> Lee Johnson-punter Salary & bonus for '99- $1.1million
Actually, I rechecked my sources, and the figure I found for Johnson was
actually $800K. The $400K figure was what the Patriots paid in base
salary
to Terry Allen (i.e. about 1/15th of what the Jets paid to Martin).
None of this, of course, changes the fact that $1.7M is wacky cash for
Tupa.
> :::::Boston Globe, 12/26/99
> Ted Johnson-LB Salary and bonus for '99- $5.48 million for five
> games(?).
This was not in dispute, was it? But there you go again, implying that
somehow Johnson should be paid less due to the fact was he was
unexpectedly
injured. This just ain't the way it works, Stan. If it was, there'd be
a
major player revolt.
:Reading Comprehension:Comparison Made- You didn't recognise it.
:Ted Johnson $5.48m for 5 games(?)
:M. Jones $2.0m for 16 games
: Same Value-Who Overpaid!
Gout...@webtv.net
wearing Superbowl rings.Woody won't make that mistake as long as bill
isBoss let Superbowl Ring start coming In.JeTSjetsjetsjets!!!!!!
Stan Pietrowicz
news:38867972...@banet.net...
(snipped)
>n contrast, the Pats paid Law $7m -his performance this year, did not
warrant that money.
I notice you were very careful to say "this year". This is because you
know full well that over his career, Ty Law has shown that he is one of
the premiere cornerbacks in the NFL. Don't believe it? Ask Keyshawn
Johnson what he thinks.
:OOPS! Ty Law's salary and bonus amounted to $14.6 million for 14 games
and who :gave up a lot of TDs. This money exceeded the total salary of
every Jet non-performer.
:Over $1.0m a game! R. Kraft knows how to run a football team.
Mark Vita
Stan "BOOM BOOM" Pietrowicz <pie...@banet.net> wrote in message
news:3889DFD3...@banet.net...
>
> :OOPS! Ty Law's salary and bonus amounted to $14.6 million for 14 games
> and who :gave up a lot of TDs. This money exceeded the total salary of
> every Jet non-performer.
Yeah, that's because Law's talent exceeds that of every Jet, performer or
otherwise.
-- Mark