<Warning! Pro-Coalition Propaganda Follows, Taliban Huggers may be Offended>
Aid worker: 'We were really scared' November 15, 2001 Posted: 4:22 AM EST (0922 GMT)
Freed German aid worker Georg Taubmann speaks with reporters outside the German Embassy in Islamabad.
ISLAMABAD, Pakistan -- Eight Western aid workers, locked in Afghan prisons and fearing for their lives, were freed by anti-Taliban fighters and spirited to safety aboard U.S. helicopters Thursday.
The aid workers -- four Germans, two Americans and two Australians -- were all safely at their respective embassies and were said to be in good health.
Alistair Adam, an Australian Embassy official, said the workers -- held for more than three months after being detained by the Taliban on charges of trying to convert Muslims to Christianity -- were tired and wanted to wash. "They're very elated to be free at last. They seem perfectly fine to me. They're rational, and they've coped very well with this situation."
Relief evident amid laughter The German workers were laughing and smiling as they stepped from cars outside the German Embassy in Islamabad. Their relief was evident as Georg Taubmann, head of the aid group in Afghanistan, told reporters how the Taliban had taken the eight with them on the retreat from Kabul.
The Taliban "wanted to take us to Kandahar, and we knew if you end up in Kandahar you would not survive there," Taubmann said, speaking through an interpreter. He said they had stopped Tuesday and their captors "put us all in a steel container. It was terribly cold and they wanted to lock the container and leave us there (until) morning, and we had no blankets..."
The next morning, he said, the detainees were taken to a jail in Ghazni, "which was a terrible place. It was the worst place. We have been in five prisons."
Taubmann said the eight were freed from the prison by anti-Taliban forces. "The Massood people came, and others from the alliance, and broke into the prison and just opened the doors ... We were really scared, and then the alliance people came in ... and we were free and we got out of prison and we walked through the city and the people came out of their houses and hugged us and greeted us, and they were all clapping ...
"I think this was one of the biggest days of my life," Taubmann said.
Bernard Barrett, a spokesman for the International Red Cross in Islamabad, said a local military commander in Ghazni, about 90 miles southwest of Kabul, contacted Red Cross officials in Afghanistan on Tuesday to discuss the detainees.
"(He) told them that he had rescued the eight SNI (Shelter Now International) people and asked for help to arrange for their transportation," Barrett said, explaining that the IRC facilitated communications between the governments of the detainees and the local military commander. SNI is a German relief agency that provided food and homes to the poor of Afghanistan.
'We're amazed how it worked'
Some of the freed workers are transported in this van to their embassies in Islamabad. The detainees are Australians Peter Bunch and Diana Thomas, Americans Dayna Curry and Heather Mercer, and the Germans -- Taubmann, Katrin Jelinek, Margrit Stebner and Silke Durrkopf. The American and Australian workers appeared healthy as they were driven to their embassies.
There has been no word on the fate of 16 Afghan Muslims who worked for the aid agency and were arrested at the same time as the Westerners.
The aid workers were taken out of Afghanistan around 4:40 p.m. ET (2:40 a.m. Thursday in Afghanistan) by three U.S. Special Operations helicopters.
"It was dramatic up to the last minute," Taubmann said. "We had almost given up that the Americans would find us. But then they did... We're amazed how it worked out so well."
"I'm thankful they're safe, and I'm pleased with our military for conducting this operation," U.S. President George W. Bush said from his ranch in Texas, where he is meeting with Russian President Vladimir Putin.
"I am really proud of our armed forces, and I am also thankful for the folks in Afghanistan who helped with this rescue," Bush said.
Neighbors, friends celebrate As the news of the rescue spread, relatives, friends and members of Antioch Community Church in Waco, Texas -- where the two American aid workers -- Curry, 30, and Mercer, 24, are members -- celebrated by cheering, hugging and crying.
Reached by telephone in Islamabad, Mercer's father, John Mercer, told CNN he "doesn't know it's true until" he sees his daughter.
John Mercer has been staying in Pakistan, along with Curry's mother, Nancy Cassell. The parents have not seen the aid workers since September 1 on a visit approved by the Taliban.
Deborah Oddy, Mercer's mother, had just returned to the United States from Pakistan on Monday.
"I heard reports on the news first and frankly couldn't believe it, but now I have it confirmed, it's wonderful news," she said in Lewiston, New York
When asked if her daughter would continue her religious mission work, Oddy said she probably wouldn't for the near future.
"From letters we've received from Heather, I think she just needs some down time," she said.
In Nashville, Tennessee, Curry's stepfather, Jim Cassell, said this was the most exciting day of his life.
"I'm so ecstatic, I don't have the words to say," he said. "The prayer has really brought her into this situation (the release), and got her out of the hands and clutches of the Taliban, those evil people over there."
A day earlier, Bush said the United States was using its full intelligence capacity to make sure the aid workers "stay out of harm's way" during the U.S.-led bombing campaign against the Taliban and Osama bin Laden's al Qaeda terror network.
> <Warning! Pro-Coalition Propaganda Follows, Taliban Huggers may be > Offended>
> Aid worker: 'We were really scared' > November 15, 2001 Posted: 4:22 AM EST (0922 GMT)
> Freed German aid worker Georg Taubmann speaks with reporters outside the > German Embassy in Islamabad.
> ISLAMABAD, Pakistan -- Eight Western aid workers, locked in Afghan > prisons and fearing for their lives, were freed by anti-Taliban fighters > and spirited to safety aboard U.S. helicopters Thursday.
> The aid workers -- four Germans, two Americans and two Australians -- > were all safely at their respective embassies and were said to be in > good health.
> Alistair Adam, an Australian Embassy official, said the workers -- held > for more than three months after being detained by the Taliban on > charges of trying to convert Muslims to Christianity -- were tired and > wanted to wash. "They're very elated to be free at last. They seem > perfectly fine to me. They're rational, and they've coped very well with > this situation."
> Relief evident amid laughter The German workers were laughing and > smiling as they stepped from cars outside the German Embassy in > Islamabad. Their relief was evident as Georg Taubmann, head of the aid > group in Afghanistan, told reporters how the Taliban had taken the eight > with them on the retreat from Kabul.
> The Taliban "wanted to take us to Kandahar, and we knew if you end up in > Kandahar you would not survive there," Taubmann said, speaking through > an interpreter. He said they had stopped Tuesday and their captors "put > us all in a steel container. It was terribly cold and they wanted to > lock the container and leave us there (until) morning, and we had no > blankets..."
> The next morning, he said, the detainees were taken to a jail in Ghazni, > "which was a terrible place. It was the worst place. We have been in > five prisons."
> Taubmann said the eight were freed from the prison by anti-Taliban > forces. "The Massood people came, and others from the alliance, and > broke into the prison and just opened the doors ... We were really > scared, and then the alliance people came in ... and we were free and we > got out of prison and we walked through the city and the people came out > of their houses and hugged us and greeted us, and they were all clapping > ...
> "I think this was one of the biggest days of my life," Taubmann said.
> Bernard Barrett, a spokesman for the International Red Cross in > Islamabad, said a local military commander in Ghazni, about 90 miles > southwest of Kabul, contacted Red Cross officials in Afghanistan on > Tuesday to discuss the detainees.
> "(He) told them that he had rescued the eight SNI (Shelter Now > International) people and asked for help to arrange for their > transportation," Barrett said, explaining that the IRC facilitated > communications between the governments of the detainees and the local > military commander. SNI is a German relief agency that provided food and > homes to the poor of Afghanistan.
> 'We're amazed how it worked'
> Some of the freed workers are transported in this van to their embassies > in Islamabad. The detainees are Australians Peter Bunch and Diana > Thomas, Americans Dayna Curry and Heather Mercer, and the Germans -- > Taubmann, Katrin Jelinek, Margrit Stebner and Silke Durrkopf. The > American and Australian workers appeared healthy as they were driven to > their embassies.
> There has been no word on the fate of 16 Afghan Muslims who worked for > the aid agency and were arrested at the same time as the Westerners.
> The aid workers were taken out of Afghanistan around 4:40 p.m. ET (2:40 > a.m. Thursday in Afghanistan) by three U.S. Special Operations > helicopters.
> "It was dramatic up to the last minute," Taubmann said. "We had almost > given up that the Americans would find us. But then they did... We're > amazed how it worked out so well."
> "I'm thankful they're safe, and I'm pleased with our military for > conducting this operation," U.S. President George W. Bush said from his > ranch in Texas, where he is meeting with Russian President Vladimir > Putin.
> "I am really proud of our armed forces, and I am also thankful for the > folks in Afghanistan who helped with this rescue," Bush said.
> Neighbors, friends celebrate As the news of the rescue spread, > relatives, friends and members of Antioch Community Church in Waco, > Texas -- where the two American aid workers -- Curry, 30, and Mercer, > 24, are members -- celebrated by cheering, hugging and crying.
> Reached by telephone in Islamabad, Mercer's father, John Mercer, told > CNN he "doesn't know it's true until" he sees his daughter.
> John Mercer has been staying in Pakistan, along with Curry's mother, > Nancy Cassell. The parents have not seen the aid workers since September > 1 on a visit approved by the Taliban.
> Deborah Oddy, Mercer's mother, had just returned to the United States > from Pakistan on Monday.
> "I heard reports on the news first and frankly couldn't believe it, but > now I have it confirmed, it's wonderful news," she said in Lewiston, New > York
> When asked if her daughter would continue her religious mission work, > Oddy said she probably wouldn't for the near future.
> "From letters we've received from Heather, I think she just needs some > down time," she said.
> In Nashville, Tennessee, Curry's stepfather, Jim Cassell, said this was > the most exciting day of his life.
> "I'm so ecstatic, I don't have the words to say," he said. "The prayer > has really brought her into this situation (the release), and got her > out of the hands and clutches of the Taliban, those evil people over > there."
> A day earlier, Bush said the United States was using its full > intelligence capacity to make sure the aid workers "stay out of harm's > way" during the U.S.-led bombing campaign against the Taliban and Osama > bin Laden's al Qaeda terror network.
In article <EsZI7.44539$S4.4016...@newsread1.prod.itd.earthlink.net>, NOSPAMnjv...@excite.com says...
>I'm so glad that they are alive. I would've thought for sure they would've >been tried and murdered.
To be fair, had they been tried, they would have been executed, not murdered. (Unless you feel any execution, ever, is murder, which I might be willing to agree with.)
> In article <EsZI7.44539$S4.4016...@newsread1.prod.itd.earthlink.net>, > NOSPAMnjv...@excite.com says...
> >I'm so glad that they are alive. I would've thought for sure they would've > >been tried and murdered.
> To be fair, had they been tried, they would have been executed, not > murdered. (Unless you feel any execution, ever, is murder, which I might be > willing to agree with.)
NJ Vike <NOSPAMnjv...@excite.com> wrote: > Now, another opinion on the matter.
> Should these individuals have been there preaching in the first place?
I'm not big on evangelism, so my general thought is no. I'm aware that some groups basically trade conversion for food and things like that, which I think is crap.
> To be fair, had they been tried, they would have been executed, not > murdered. (Unless you feel any execution, ever, is murder, which I might be > willing to agree with.)
You know I have a really weird view of that. IMO, a state execution is more of a murder than someone that say revenges the murder of his wife.
I don't believe in capital punishment in general anyway and I had a close friend that was murdered. Life in prison is better. It allows the falsely convicted some hope and I can't think of anything worse than rotting in a cell forever.
Not there are a bunch of unsual situations that make that cmplicated. So don't jump on me...I'm just a simple idealist :) -- Email: rgib...@ix.netcom.com Home Page: http://home.netcom.com/~rgibson/index.htm
> Now, another opinion on the matter. > Should these individuals have been there preaching in the first place?
They claim they weren't. However, the death penalty for espousing another religion is a bit harsh. -- Email: rgib...@ix.netcom.com Home Page: http://home.netcom.com/~rgibson/index.htm
> > Should these individuals have been there preaching in the first place?
> They claim they weren't. However, the death penalty for espousing > another religion is a bit harsh.
Actually, if they are Christians, then they should be there preaching. Jesus said to "go into all the world...", and frankly, He didn't say anything about being asked.
I don't mean to suggest that Christians are supposed to be pushy. To many are, and too many others ignore the Great Commission. There are many ways of fulfilling this commandment which do not require the Christian to be rude. But they are supposed to go everywhere.
> > > Should these individuals have been there preaching in the first place? > > They claim they weren't. However, the death penalty for espousing > > another religion is a bit harsh. > Actually, if they are Christians, then they should be there preaching. > Jesus said to "go into all the world...", and frankly, He didn't say > anything about being asked. > I don't mean to suggest that Christians are supposed to be pushy.
The early report had them as had doing nothing at all. But I just saw their interview and what got them arrested was giving a child a "Who is Jesus" book, so technically they did do something.
Actually in light of that, they should have known better, not that I think they should have been executed for that. -- Email: rgib...@ix.netcom.com Home Page: http://home.netcom.com/~rgibson/index.htm
> > > Should these individuals have been there preaching in the first place?
> > They claim they weren't. However, the death penalty for espousing > > another religion is a bit harsh.
> Actually, if they are Christians, then they should be there preaching. > Jesus said to "go into all the world...", and frankly, He didn't say > anything about being asked.
> I don't mean to suggest that Christians are supposed to be pushy. To > many are, and too many others ignore the Great Commission. There are > many ways of fulfilling this commandment which do not require the > Christian to be rude. But they are supposed to go everywhere.
> > > > Should these individuals have been there preaching in the first place?
> > > They claim they weren't. However, the death penalty for espousing > > > another religion is a bit harsh.
> > Actually, if they are Christians, then they should be there preaching. > > Jesus said to "go into all the world...", and frankly, He didn't say > > anything about being asked.
> > I don't mean to suggest that Christians are supposed to be pushy.
> The early report had them as had doing nothing at all. But I just saw > their interview and what got them arrested was giving a child a "Who is > Jesus" book, so technically they did do something.
> Actually in light of that, they should have known better, not that I > think they should have been executed for that.
I think they were following the Great Commission - they went into the world, and even in a country where it is considered a crime, they gave information when asked. As far as "knowing better", it may more have been a matter of knowing one who is far better and then trusting in the same.
> I think they were following the Great Commission - they went into the > world, and even in a country where it is considered a crime, they gave > information when asked. As far as "knowing better", it may more have > been a matter of knowing one who is far better and then trusting in the > same.
Seeing how their rescue was straight out of a Hollywood thriller it was nothing short of a miracle.
> > I think they were following the Great Commission - they went into the > > world, and even in a country where it is considered a crime, they gave > > information when asked. As far as "knowing better", it may more have > > been a matter of knowing one who is far better and then trusting in the > > same.
> Seeing how their rescue was straight out of a Hollywood thriller it was > nothing short of a miracle.
> Someone was watching over them...
One of the things that touched me was how the report in the Strib (yesterday) mentioned their obvious affection for the Afghanis. Greater love hath no man (or woman) than he (she) is willing to lay down his (or hers) life for a brother (or sister). I don't have the text available to my immediate memory (I could look it up, but I am lazy), but I think it definately applies here. These young women were being something more that merely obedient.
> > Seeing how their rescue was straight out of a Hollywood thriller it was > > nothing short of a miracle. > > Someone was watching over them... > One of the things that touched me was how the report in the Strib > (yesterday) mentioned their obvious affection for the Afghanis. Greater > love hath no man (or woman) than he (she) is willing to lay down his (or > hers) life for a brother (or sister). I don't have the text available > to my immediate memory (I could look it up, but I am lazy), but I think > it definately applies here. These young women were being something more > that merely obedient.
I agree and it is very admirable. However, I have to temper those thoughts with the necessity to take action against our enemies, unfortunately, at times.
>> To be fair, had they been tried, they would have been executed, not >> murdered. (Unless you feel any execution, ever, is murder, which I might be >> willing to agree with.)
>You know I have a really weird view of that. IMO, a state execution is >more of a murder than someone that say revenges the murder of his wife.
>I don't believe in capital punishment in general anyway and I had a >close friend that was murdered. Life in prison is better. It allows >the falsely convicted some hope and I can't think of anything worse than >rotting in a cell forever.
>Not there are a bunch of unsual situations that make that cmplicated. So >don't jump on me...I'm just a simple idealist :)
I'll agree with you. I'll just state that calling it murder, by the US, would be completely wrong and dishonest. (Also to be expected.)
> >I don't believe in capital punishment in general anyway and I had a > >close friend that was murdered. Life in prison is better. It allows > >the falsely convicted some hope and I can't think of anything worse than > >rotting in a cell forever. > >Not there are a bunch of unsual situations that make that cmplicated. So > >don't jump on me...I'm just a simple idealist :) > I'll agree with you. I'll just state that calling it murder, by the > US, would be completely wrong and dishonest. (Also to be expected.)
This is such a complicated issue, and I think the worst examples are with some types of the criminally insane. There are known genetic disorders that cause uncontrollable rage and violence. Medication often is ineffective. Often the person themselves hate what they are and I've seen a few of these cases where they refused an insanity defense and wanted to be out of their misery.
So in that case it might almost be a act of compassion to euthanize such an individual.
But I sure as heck wouldn't want to be the one to make the decision. I could never do jury duty where the death penalty was a possibility.
I can only hope that we evolve as a species to the point where we can find better solutions to these troubling problems.
