Anderson Hernandez is back
jonathan
Mr. Floyd
"jonathan" <jmer...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:2192294e-9d69-4aa6...@h30g2000vbr.googlegroups.com...
> It's like Omar just locks onto these guys . . .
No, he just locks into certain guyz.
Laurence Smith
> It's like Omar just locks onto these guys . . .
If it means the end of the Angel Berroa era I'm all for it.
At least AH can field.
--
Larry Smith
POPS
"Laurence Smith" <dr4s...@hvi.net> wrote in message
news:h5fo7p$k56$1...@news.eternal-september.org...
Berroa at SS, Hernandez at 2B...................
jonathan
Too bad he can't hit at all. Of course, neither can Berroa.
Noreen Smith
wrote:
I'm sensing a pattern here. A hispanic pattern.
Ruben
> It's like Omar just locks onto these guys . . .
They need a middle infielder...FWIW
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jonathan
> On Thu, 06 Aug 2009 13:46:44 -0700, jonathan wrote:
> > It's like Omar just locks onto these guys . . .
>
> They need a middle infielder...FWIW
>
Understood, but instead of going out and looking for someone in
somebody's system who might actually have upside, he goes and gets a
guy that he should already knows sucks. But of course, Hernandez is
part of what Omar considers 'depth', a group that includes Endy
Chavez, Angel Pagan, Argenis Reyes, Jeremy Reed, Ramon Martinez, etc.
None of these guys can hit, yet all of them have been Omar Minaya
solutions to 'depth' at some point in the last few years. For once,
I'd like to see him get someone for the bench who could actually hit
the baseball. Maybe then, when one of his starters goes down, you
have a chance to have someone get hot for a little while.
Phil
I agree. What we all want (and rarely admit because it's a bit silly on
some levels) is an All-Star level bench player, someone who is
routinely excellent in spite of not playing every day, and who makes
maybe $1M/year. Yeah, it sounds kind of silly when you put it like
that, but this is really what we're talking about; partly because we
may have some unrealistic expectations, and partly because we, as fans,
feel like we've been kind of short-changed over the years in this
regard with some real dead wood on our team, and that we're sort of
owed a miracle or two by management.
But we really ought to admit that such players are rare -- if they're
that good, they're more useful on the front lines, are paid
accordingly, and expect to play regularly. When we bemoan Omar's
acquisition of another cardboard cutout (or complain that the cardboard
cutout is another Lation), we probably are ignoring the fact that
finding a bench player who isn't a cardboard cutout is like finding the
Holy Grail: arguably nonexistent and yet still sought after by 29 other
GM's.
It's probably more realistic to demand top-notch players as our
starters and pray they don't spend all year on the DL, than it is to
expect consistent excellence on demand from our backups. The rest is a
crapshoot of aging ex-superstars, golden prospects with bones made of
glass and health insurance set in stone, and players on the rebound
from injury or other underperforming states. This is our menu. Compared
to some teams' versions that have consistently sucked, and I mean
all-sucking, all the time, the Mets bench has probably not been
terrible. The Tatises, Reeds and Pagans will occasionally hit a clutch
homer when they're not too busy hitting into DP's, if only to tease us
and add to our overall level of misery.
Laurence Smith
I agree with the above in every respect except one. I do think that
Pagan, if he can stay healthy (a big IF for him and any Met nowadays),
is capable of being an excellent 4th OFer and perhaps a regular.
I could see him putting up seasons with 10 HRs, .280+ BA, 20 sb's, good
defense. That's not outstanding but it is pretty darn good.
--
Larry Smith
Ruben
>> Understood, but instead of going out and looking for someone in
>> somebody's system who might actually have upside, he goes and gets a
>> guy that he should already knows sucks. But of course, Hernandez is
>> part of what Omar considers 'depth', a group that includes Endy
>> Chavez, Angel Pagan, Argenis Reyes, Jeremy Reed, Ramon Martinez, etc.
>> None of these guys can hit, yet all of them have been Omar Minaya
>> solutions to 'depth' at some point in the last few years. For once,
>> I'd like to see him get someone for the bench who could actually hit
>> the baseball. Maybe then, when one of his starters goes down, you
>> have a chance to have someone get hot for a little while.
>
> I agree. What we all want (and rarely admit because it's a bit silly on
> some levels) is an All-Star level bench player, someone who is
> routinely excellent in spite of not playing every day, and who makes
> maybe $1M/year. Yeah, it sounds kind of silly when you put it like
> that, but this is really what we're talking about; partly because we
> may have some unrealistic expectations, and partly because we, as fans,
> feel like we've been kind of short-changed over the years in this
> regard with some real dead wood on our team, and that we're sort of
> owed a miracle or two by management.
This is a role that in previous eras was filled my aging verterns like
Jonny Mize and Rusty Staub.
Ruben
Ruben
Here is the bench player your looking for Jon...and he is laying right
here in Brooklyn
James Creighton, Jr. (April 15, 1841 – October 18, 1862) was a pitcher
in baseball's earliest era. Among his many accomplishments, he was in all
likelihood the first professional ballplayer, threw the first fastball,
completed the first recorded triple play, and is considered by baseball
historians to be the game's first superstar. [1]
[edit] Early career
Before the formation of organized baseball leagues, a career in the sport
was a far different proposition than it is today. Amateur ballclubs would
form and spend much of the time playing intrasquad matches, holding
exhibitions with other clubs. Much of baseball prior to the Civil War was
centered in New York. In 1857, at the age of sixteen, Creighton helped to
form his first club, the Young America Base Ball Club. It lasted only
through the year, at which point Creighton and a friend, George Flanley,
founded the Niagara Club. [1]
[edit] Discovered by the Stars
Jim Creighton as an Excelsior
In 1859, Creighton and the Niagaras were losing a match to the
well-established Star Club when Creighton, who had to this point been used
primarily in the infield, came into the game as a relief pitcher and
proceeded to throw the ball unthinkably hard for the time; the Star
batsmen claimed that he used a snap of the wrist to deliver the
"speedball", as he called it.[1] (At the time, the rules of baseball
stated that a pitcher must deliver the ball underhanded, locked straight
at the elbow and the wrist.) Regardless of the legality of his pitch, the
Stars immediately snapped Creighton and Flanley up, and the two finished
the season with them.
The Stars were unable to keep Creighton, either, and before 1860 he joined
one of the highest-profile clubs in the game at the time, Excelsior of
Brooklyn, which considered themselves the champions of America. In 1860
and 1861, with Creighton fast becoming a national sensation, they backed
up that claim by going on the first national tour, down the eastern coast
of the United States. Creighton defeated the hometown teams wherever the
Excelsiors went, and gained such popularity that many youth teams in the
areas they played named themselves the Creightons in his honor. It was
during this 1860 tour that he pitched baseball's first recorded shutout.
[1]
Such was his dominance that after he held the famed Brooklyn Atlantics to
five runs, an extraordinarily low total for the era, the Brooklyn Eagle
dispatched a reporter to determine whether or not his pitch was legal; in
the end, it was determined he was throwing a "fair square pitch", rather
than a "jerk" or an "underhand throw." [1]
The year 1862 was business as usual for the 21-year-old Creighton, who had
become the game's greatest player as a hitter and a pitcher. During that
year, it is said that he was not put out a single time at the plate, and
only four times overall. (At the time, players out on the basepaths were
charged with the out, instead of the batter as today.) His pitching, which
had also spawned the first changeup (he called it his 'dew-drop'),
continued to be exceptional.
[edit] Death
Poster featuring the enshrouded image of Jim Creighton
However, in October 1862, in the midst of his greatest season, Creighton
died suddenly. Such was his fame at the time of his death, and such was
the grief of the baseball community, that a 12-foot marble obelisk, topped
with a large baseball, was erected at his gravesite. For the next several
years, the Excelsiors' programs had a portrait of their fallen star,
shrouded in black, featured prominently in the center.
There are several explanations for his death. The generally accepted
explanation, which has existed from the time of his death, is that he
fatally injured himself while playing baseball. At the time, players swung
massive bats almost entirely with their upper body; it is said that a
particularly hard swing from Creighton – some versions of the story have
it as a home run swing – caused an internal injury. Remarking to
teammate George Flanley that he had perhaps snapped a belt, he continued
playing but was in extreme pain hours later. A few days later, he died at
his parents' house.
In an 1887 issue of early sports newspaper The Sporting Life, a
letter-writer, who signed only as "Old Timer", sent in his account of the
event. Robert Smith (Baseball in America, Holt Rinehart Winston, 1961,
p.10,13) as well as the Findagrave website [1] reported it is a ruptured
bladder. SABR researcher John Thorn concluded ruptured inguinal hernia.
[2] Others speculate that it was some already-present injury or disease,
or that his appendix or spleen had burst after the game. Contemporary
writers were vague, only stating that he had suffered a "strain".
Regardless, baseball's first superstar was dead. Had he survived, he would
have been thirty when baseball's first professional league, the National
Association, was founded.
He was buried in Green-Wood Cemetery in Brooklyn. [2]
[edit]