trade talks
Ken Marino
cathing and a little help in the pitching dep't seems to be the consensus
for needs. We always seem to do a pretty good job on players 10-14 or 15,
with the possible exception of back-up catching.
S/B 954RR
"Ken Marino" <kph...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:-oOdncco-YTqiYjU...@earthlink.com...
As long as Lowrie improves and Ellsbury can prove he's nothing more than
another Podsednik then catcher is the only place I can see them improving.
For the record I'm not in a rush to get rid of Tek unless a guy like Russell
or McCann are in the works. A lot of catchers suck with the bat and I'd be
happy with Tek sucking back there over someone like Laird sucking back
there. Laird... Worst suggestion this off-season. The guy is the fourth
best catcher on the team and someone wants to trade for him? Wait until he
is in the indy league and sign him for peanuts.
gazer220
> "Ken Marino" <kpha...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
It's amazing how little quality catching is available. I guess young
players would rather avoid the wear-and-tear of catching and go for a
more profitable position--pitcher, SS, OF, etc. I agree about Laird--
he's no overall upgrade over Tek.
BTT
SOX ARE FINE IN '09!!
Pearly Soames
>
> It's amazing how little quality catching is available. I guess young
> players would rather avoid the wear-and-tear of catching and go for a
> more profitable position--pitcher, SS, OF, etc. I agree about Laird--
> he's no overall upgrade over Tek.
>
Catchers who can hit have always stood out. It's just not a big
offensive position, historically.
--
"If I had a nickel for every cigarette your mom smoked, I'd be dead."
Dano
> gazer220 wrote:
>
>>
>> It's amazing how little quality catching is available. I guess young
>> players would rather avoid the wear-and-tear of catching and go for a
>> more profitable position--pitcher, SS, OF, etc. I agree about Laird--
>> he's no overall upgrade over Tek.
>>
>
> Catchers who can hit have always stood out. It's just not a big
> offensive position, historically.
I agree completely. Which is why those that are so distressed by Tek's
failings in that area astonish me. I'm all for improving the team if they
can, but this guy has been a major contributor. He had a very bad offensive
year to be sure. Papi, whose soul job is as a hitter, did as well. I don't
hear a great groundswell calling on Theo to "dump" him.
OceanView
news:gf4fen$faa$1...@registered.motzarella.org:
I think most of use who are distressed by his offense understand that a
catching isn't supposed to be the thunder of the lineup. But, two
things: One, his numbers are below what I'd consider to be acceptable for
a catcher. Two, he *has* been an above average offense guy in his career
for a catcher, but has fallen off sharply and dramtically, likely to
continue or further plummet.
--
-------
Before you criticize someone, you should walk a mile in their shoes. That
way, when you criticize them, you're a mile away and you have their
shoes.
Dano
"Soul" job. Heh...
Dano
> "Dano" <janea...@yahoo.com> wrote in
> news:gf4fen$faa$1...@registered.motzarella.org:
>
>> Pearly Soames wrote:
>>> gazer220 wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>> It's amazing how little quality catching is available. I guess
>>>> young players would rather avoid the wear-and-tear of catching and
>>>> go for a more profitable position--pitcher, SS, OF, etc. I agree
>>>> about Laird-- he's no overall upgrade over Tek.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Catchers who can hit have always stood out. It's just not a big
>>> offensive position, historically.
>>
>> I agree completely. Which is why those that are so distressed by
>> Tek's failings in that area astonish me. I'm all for improving the
>> team if they can, but this guy has been a major contributor. He had
>> a very bad offensive year to be sure. Papi, whose soul job is as a
>> hitter, did as well. I don't hear a great groundswell calling on
>> Theo to "dump" him.
>>
>>
>
> I think most of use who are distressed by his offense understand that
> a catching isn't supposed to be the thunder of the lineup. But, two
> things: One, his numbers are below what I'd consider to be acceptable
> for a catcher. Two, he *has* been an above average offense guy in
> his career for a catcher, but has fallen off sharply and dramtically,
> likely to continue or further plummet.
Well...OK...find someone "better"...hopefully one that won't hurt you while
doing half of his job...i.e. when he's wearing that mask. Do you think his
defense is lacking? I believe you can cover for his offensive deficiencies
easier than covering the defensive inadequacies of others.
ray o'hara
ortiz was inhured and will heal and he still had a decent year.
tek can no longer get it done.
he's old, it happens, people think that because he used to do
something he still can.
funny thing aboutage, it robs atheletic skills
Dano
Papi is 33. He has never seemed to be an athetic type. I love the guy, but
he is very one dimensional. He came here with a history of knee problems,
which has a lot to do with him DH'ing, yet he has shown no interest in
getting himself trimmed down in order to lessen the strain on those knees.
Power has nothing to do with weight and probably not even that much from
strength. It's more about bat speed. See Youk and Pedroia. I am concerned
about him going forward at his advancing age with his weight. See Maurice
Vaughn.
Tek is 36. Has always kept himself in great shape. There appears to be no
physical reason for his struggles last year. He filed for divorce in
August. After a pretty good start, he had a very rough time. Outside
issues can affect performance...like it or not. That's life. Sometimes a
real bad year...as well as great seasons. Almost every player has a bad
year. The timing of this one really sucked for Tek. I'm not counting on
him to be an offensive force again. His best years were very respectable,
but not spectacular as a hitter. I would not be surprised to see him bounce
back to a .250 AVG and .350 OBP which would be more than fine. I also would
like to see his workload cut by around 20-30% and a much more promising
replacement brought in to be readied.
OceanView
news:gf4ln6$vcf$1...@registered.motzarella.org:
There's a the problem. He can't throw anybody out any more. This was his
saving grace, but they run like crazy on him now. Finding someone better
is less importnt than finding someone younger with potential. This day is
coming, whether it's this year (as I belive) or next, or at the very
least the next. If you want bargaining power, don't wait until you're
desperate and everybody knows it.
Dano
I'm honestly not sure if the throwing out of baserunners is all on Tek. The
team philosophy does not seem overly concerned about that aspect of the game
is my impression. Anyway, I think we all should know that runners steal at
least as often on the pitcher as the catcher. This team worries more about
getting the hitter out than stopping the runners.
Wayback1918
> OceanView wrote:
> > "Dano" <janeandd...@yahoo.com> wrote in
> >news:gf4ln6$vcf$1...@registered.motzarella.org:
>
> >> OceanView wrote:
> >>> "Dano" <janeandd...@yahoo.com> wrote in
>
> - Show quoted text -
I apologize in advance because I know these charts never look good
when they are posted but there are some interesting numbers about
catchers.
The list is AL catchers with over 200 innings behind the plate.
The first number IC/SBA is Innings Caught divided by stolen base
attempts. The lower the number the more often teams attempt to steal
against that catcher.
The second number is percent caught stealing hopefully self
explanatory.
Name IC/SBA %CS
Jorge Posada, NYY 5.7 17%
Kevin Cash, Bos 6.9 30%
Toby Hall, CWS 7.3 17%
Ramon Hernandez, Bal 8.4 20%
Guillermo Quiroz, Bal 9.1 23%
Jarrod Saltalamacchia, Tex 9.5 18%
A.J. Pierzynski, CWS 9.7 18%
Jose Molina, NYY 9.8 35%
Mike Napoli, LAA 9.9 18%
Gerald Laird, Tex 10.2 28%
Jeff Mathis, LAA 10.3 26%
Kenji Johjima, Sea 11.3 33%
Ivan Rodriguez, Det/NYY 12.1 33%
Rod Barajas, Tor 12.3 34%
Victor Martinez, Cle 12.8 37%
John Buck, KC 13.4 17%
Brandon Inge, Det 13.4 30%
Dioner Navarro, TB 13.9 38%
Kurt Suzuki, Oak 14.0 37%
Jason Varitek, Bos 14.5 22%
Joe Mauer, Min 15.0 36%
Gregg Zaun, Tor 15.3 26%
Kelly Shoppach, Cle 18.6 21%
There’s a pretty good correlation between CS% and attempts. Most of
the poorer throwing catchers, percentage wise, are also the guys
mangers run most against.
Now some undisputable brilliant analysis……..
People don’t ‘run wild’ on Varitek.…..but they probably should.
Kevin Cash’s 30% CS rate has to be considered excellent considering
who his battery mate is….but its still not enough to stop mangers from
trying to run on the knuckleball.
Jose Molina is a little confusing. He is a good thrower but teams are
trying him anyway. I know almost know one runs on Pettite and I think
Mussina has good reputation as well.
For you Saltalamacchia fans, the league has already figured out you
can run against him and he doesn’t seem to be able to stop them.
The Cleveland catchers show up better than expected but the Indians
had a lot of LH pitchers. The White Sox had a lot of southpaws too
but it seems Hall and Pierzynski are so bad it didn’t matter.
niceguy
Crisp +. Wouldn't mind Crisp. It's how demanding "+" would be?
Dano
Try a top pitching prospect like Bowden or Buchholz. I don't know enough
about him really to say if that would be worth it myself.