The chase is on.........
Wayback1918
It is not a suprirse but Jason Bay rejected a contract offer from the
Red Sox worth close to $60MM over four years, according to Jon Heyman
of SI.com.
O'Neil's Faggy Prostate - Libs are stupid. :)
I did that once. . .
;)
Wayback1918
It's all supply and demand........
Dano
When is he said to have done that? Back during the season?
Wayback1918
The article doesn't say specifically but it is implied that it was
very recent.
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2009/baseball/mlb/11/19/bay.redsox/index.html?eref=sircrc
Smithee
The worst part is that if the Sox had made that same offer last pre-
season, Bay would have signed it. The Sox cost themselves either a
player, a lot of money, or both.
Dano
Thanks for the link. Yeah it would appear this is their opening offer.
Pretty fair starting point. What concerns me more is talk of 180M for
Holliday from Boras. I don't see that much difference between the two
players. That price tag is quite far (unrealistic too...I hope) from the
Sox offer.
Dano
I would not make THAT assumption at all. On what can you possibly be basing
that on?
PETER SHORTS
> Wayback1918 wrote:
> > On Nov 19, 12:47 pm, "Dano" <janeandd...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> >> Wayback1918 wrote:
> >>> It is not a suprirse but Jason Bay rejected a contract offer from
> >>> the Red Sox worth close to $60MM over four years, according to Jon
> >>> Heyman of SI.com.
>
> >> When is he said to have done that? Back during the season?
>
> > The article doesn't say specifically but it is implied that it was
> > very recent.
>
>
> Thanks for the link. Yeah it would appear this is their opening offer.
> Pretty fair starting point. What concerns me more is talk of 180M for
> Holliday from Boras. I don't see that much difference between the two
> players. That price tag is quite far (unrealistic too...I hope) from the
> Sox offer.
holliday is younger and plays much better defense.
S/B 954RR
"PETER SHORTS" <peter...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:d63afaab-25e1-4e43...@v25g2000yqk.googlegroups.com...
Holliday is still no stud and doesn't bring the HR capability Bay does.
O'Neil's Faggy Prostate - Libs are stupid. :)
> "PETER SHORTS" <petersh...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>
> - Show quoted text -
I would prefer AGon (the 1B) over either.
But, Bay should be their main free agent target.
Ray O'Hara
"Dano" <janea...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:he41su$8cd$1...@news.eternal-september.org...
I think it is a good assumption.
the Sox once again procrastenated, gambling the player would have a weak
year and got burned.
Gary
From what I heard, it's not a new offer, but one offered around the
all-star game break. There hasn't been any new offer since even the
Sox realize that Bay was going to test the free agent waters.
Dano
"Ray O'Hara" <raymon...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:he4jh6$u8c$1...@news.eternal-september.org...
Nope. Bay is exercising his option and putting his services up to bid. No
way around it. The Sox are reluctant to bid against themselves. The market
is determined by what the bids are. How else can that be arrived at. They
really can't win with some fans. The same people cursing and whining for
the lousy three million bucks they must pay Tek...and the 14 mil per year
that Drew gets, will scream bloody murder when the end of that NEXT big deal
comes. What will you say in 5 or 6 years if Bay is hitting .200 with 18R's
and 70 RBI's while paying him 20M?
What do YOU think would have gotten him to forego free agency?
Dano
"Gary" <golfe...@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:o6obg51vm8tq023bd...@4ax.com...
It's simply an opening bid. Did anyone really expect he waited this long to
accept WHATEVER that bid was? No one here has ever negotiated
anything...that's obvious.
McDuck
I think Bay wanted to test FA. I see no good reason for Bay to have
signed early, from his financial perspective, that is.
nice guy
I felt Dewie Evans was overpaid when the Sox gave him a $1M contract.
Smithee
From talk prior to the season. All the talk was that the Sox were
talking three-years at maybe $12 million per, and that Bay's people
countered with 4-5 years at $15 million per. Assuming that was
correct (and it came from multiple sources, but it *is* the Boston
sports media), it's logica to assume that a 4 year, $15 million offer
would have gotten it done.
PETER SHORTS
> "Gary" <golfera...@comcast.net> wrote in message
>
> news:o6obg51vm8tq023bd...@4ax.com...> On Thu, 19 Nov 2009 09:14:11 -0800 (PST), Wayback1918
>
> > >It is not a suprirse but Jason Bay rejected a contract offer from the
> > >Red Sox worth close to $60MM over four years, according to Jon Heyman
> > >of SI.com.
>
> > From what I heard, it's not a new offer, but one offered around the
> > all-star game break. There hasn't been any new offer since even the
> > Sox realize that Bay was going to test the free agent waters.
>
> ------------------------------------------------------
> It's simply an opening bid. Did anyone really expect he waited this long to
> accept WHATEVER that bid was? No one here has ever negotiated
> anything...that's obvious.
yeah, you really showed off your negotiation knowledge in the topic
about bay winning the silver slugger.
Dano
Talk is cheap. You could also substitute the word 'gossip' for 'talk'.
There is no logic that I can see whatsover in making such an assumption.
These are private negotiations...VERY important ones...both to the team AND
the player. He decided to take the risk that he would a. stay healthy and
b. have a very productive year. He won his bet on both counts. Why on
earth would he now...after taking such a serious risk...pass on driving up
his market price by seeing what offers he will get now?
He will most definitely get much more than this preliminary bid. No matter
what they had offered, he would have been foolish to take that. The Red Sox
are well aware of that. Now it's simply a matter of waiting for other
offers and to decide if he still makes sense for them to bid. This is a
business. I thought we were all well aware of that by now. Why would or
should Bay take a great deal less on what may be the biggest financial gain
of his life? As for the team...why would they bid against themselves and
make some stupid offer that will simply cost them millions more than they
should pay?
Mortimer
> "Ray O'Hara" <raymond-oh...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>
> news:he4jh6$u8c$1...@news.eternal-september.org...
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > "Dano" <janeandd...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
I truly believe if we offered Jason roughly 5 years/ $85-90 million,
he would of took the deal. It would also include no-trade protection
for the first 2-3 years. It is a deal that would be similar to Torii
Hunter's deal, and virtually the same type of monetary deal in
principle.
Dano
First of all...that's a shit load of dough. Honestly...I don't know if he
is worth that. I certainly am not convinced that anyone will offer that.
But really...I have no idea if he would have taken it or not. This will
probably be the one time in the guy's whole career that he will have this
kind of opportunity. He and his agent may have grinned and leaked that out
and still waited it out.
Secondly...this is about more than HIS deal specifically. What do you
suppose every other guy will be looking for after giving Bay that long a
term...something they are most reluctant to do with a player of his age?
Victor has one year on his deal. He will be looking for a comparable type
of deal...one that would also contain the same kind of length and trade
protection. There are payroll precedents they must be careful about too.
Lastly..."would of took the deal"? I try not to be a grammar Nazi...but
really? :)
S/B 954RR
"Mortimer" <ectha...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:f46d308c-fa7f-463a...@o9g2000vbj.googlegroups.com...
I see Theo's dilemma, if they are concerned about his D that's a lot of long
term cash because they need someone for '10. Maybe he should just take his
chances with a weaker order in '10 so he has more cash available for '11.
Then again Bay could probably DH after next year with Papi's money coming
off the books.
Gnork
"Could of took the deal"?" ~^~
But where would he have "tooken" it to?
Ray O'Hara
"Mortimer" <ectha...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:f46d308c-fa7f-463a...@o9g2000vbj.googlegroups.com...
============================================================================
I think four at $60 mil would have gotten him signed last spring.
now he'll end up in pinstripes.
Ray O'Hara
"Gnork" <gn...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:19cf9471-38c9-4c5c...@s21g2000prm.googlegroups.com...
========================================================
The would've,should've,could've goofed into would of is a standard mistake.
somebody released a statement to the news recently with it, but as it was
written one can't tell if the quoter or the quoteee screwed it up.
Ray O'Hara
we've seen the Sox play this game before. it always backfires and gives the
Yankees the opening to swoop in.
They are going to dump Matsui and Damon is old. Bay will be an upgrade for
them and they've shown they will spend what it takes.
Dano
"S/B 954RR" <jtib...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:7mogt4F...@mid.individual.net...
That would be fine...except he is not looking for DH money.
Dano
"Ray O'Hara" <raymon...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:he788o$lqp$1...@news.eternal-september.org...
"buying" championships...though it's been proven that's no guarantee of
anything. The other half of the time seems to be spent bemoaning the fact
the Red Sox DON'T do things like the Yanks...while completely ignoring the
fact that the Red Sox are not close to having the kind of revenue to support
that kind of payroll.
S/B 954RR
"O'Neil's Faggy Prostate - Libs are stupid. :)" <oneilsp...@aol.com>
wrote in message
news:b5673fc3-7597-4c77...@k17g2000yqh.googlegroups.com...
I agree but I'm really starting to think Theo thinks HRs are overrated and
he won't be willing to pay a lot for them.
Mortimer
> First of all...that's a shit load of dough. Honestly...I don't know if he
> is worth that. I certainly am not convinced that anyone will offer that.
> But really...I have no idea if he would have taken it or not. This will
> probably be the one time in the guy's whole career that he will have this
> kind of opportunity. He and his agent may have grinned and leaked that out
> and still waited it out.
>
> Secondly...this is about more than HIS deal specifically. What do you
> suppose every other guy will be looking for after giving Bay that long a
> term...something they are most reluctant to do with a player of his age?
> Victor has one year on his deal. He will be looking for a comparable type
> of deal...one that would also contain the same kind of length and trade
> protection. There are payroll precedents they must be careful about too.
>
> Lastly..."would of took the deal"? I try not to be a grammar Nazi...but
Torii Hunter was given that deal at 34 years of age. Bay is currently
31 years of age. But, Hunter plays gold-glove calibre defense every
season, while Bay plays average defense at best. I dont see Bay as
someone who wants to try to cash in with the highest possible offer,
he took a pay cut with the Pirates before he came to Beantown (that's
how I saw it, he could of went somewhere else instead of staying 2-3
extra years in Pittsburgh).
Mortimer
> I think four at $60 mil would have gotten him signed last spring.
> now he'll end up in pinstripes.
I dont think he'll be in pinstripes. For some reason, I'm more
inclined to think IF the Halo's decline Vlady Guerrero's $16m option
for next season, they'll be in the Jason Bay sweepstakes. They could
move Abreu to DH, and put Bay in the outfield, and switch it around
during the season.
Dano
============================================
The Angels have openly expressed interest in Bay. They have also made clear
their lack of it in Holliday. Probably in part because of their distaste
for dealing with Boras. They only have so much to spend however. I doubt
they can afford all three of Bay, Lackey and Figgins. I would have interest
in any of those guys.
I just have this funny feeling that Theo is going to make a strong run at
Holliday.
BTT
> "Mortimer" <ecthaki...@gmail.com> wrote in message
Not sure he's a good fit, but we need a bat, especially if (as I
suspect), it won't be J-Bay's.
BTT
Wayback1918
I would think Holliday would be an excellent fit.
He should hit for a higher average than Bay.....similar on base
skills.....and probably a like amount of extra base hits (fewer of the
HR type though)
Both are decent base runners who seem to run better than the average
slugger types.
Bay is suspect in the field but Holliday is an excellent left-
fielder....(although that's kinda like being the prettiest girl in
Bangor Maine....its all relative).
The biggest hurdle is that Holliday will probably cost more than Bay.
Tristan daCunha
Why do youse think Pitt. let him go?
Another cuppa kawfee like Pedroia and Pil;lsbury.
Watxch and wait......youse dreamers!
Dano
"BTT" <BTTalb...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:f5c2353a-7989-4985...@j4g2000yqe.googlegroups.com...
-------------------------------------------------------------
I think Theo feels Bay has not learned to play left field that well in
Fenway, is a fairly weak fielder best suited as an eventual DH. Yet he
wants a long term all around player's contract. Holliday will cost more for
longer, but could grow into a very good Fenway LF'er and is younger which
justifies a longer deal. Just my attempt at reading Theo's mind.
PETER SHORTS
they've already said that they can't afford both Lackey and Figgins,
so if they keep even one of those guys it would rule out Bay as well.
Gnork
They can change their minds. The money is available.