1+1
Joyce
but it stops at the beginning of 3!
I thought I'd share his conclusion. I had a really hard time convincing my
teachers of this when I was 6. It somehow still feels logical, in a vague way.
-- please visit my webpage, it's at http://www.netmanor.com/mirrorsister
(without pop-ups, people!....bring a ball of wool -for not getting too
lost-and a magnifying glass -for finding the hidden links- and a pen, to sign
the guestbook)
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AllisonWonderland
Welcome to alt.solipsism. Haven't seen your name here before. How did
you find us?
> Why is 1+1 2? why not 3? I mean, there's line from 0-2, right? and that's 1+1,
> but it stops at the beginning of 3!
0___1=1
0___1___2=2
0___1___2___3=3
As is apparent, everything between 0 and 1 is a part or fraction of 1.
The Moody Blues have a line in "Dr. Livingston, I Presume" which says:
"School taught: One and one is two,
But by now the answer's not "just" two!"
> I thought I'd share his conclusion.
His?
> I had a really hard time convincing my teachers of this when I was 6.
Hardly anyone listens to six year olds...
> It somehow still feels logical, in a vague way.
I know the feeling!
6 1 8
7 5 3
2 9 4
The above box adds up to 15 no matter which of the eight (three
vertical, three horizontal, and two diagonal) ways you can add it.
Doesn't that make you want to go "Hmmmmm!" ?
Have a wonderscanned day...
--
Hang in there!
Regards and sincerest best wishes.
AllisonWonderland
CHECK OUT THE WEBPAGE AT:
http://www.livingston.net/allison/home.htm
Comments Welcome
Joyce
all...@livingston.net wrote:
> Dear Joyce,
> Welcome to alt.solipsism. Haven't seen your name here before.
That's because I didn't use this handle before
> How did you find us?
In a book about symbolististic artists in the 19th century
> 6 1 8
> 7 5 3
> 2 9 4
>
> The above box adds up to 15 no matter which of the eight (three
> vertical, three horizontal, and two diagonal) ways you can add it.
> Doesn't that make you want to go "Hmmmmm!" ?
hmmm
I'm glad you replied to this post, as off-topic as it might be :)
bye
Joycelyn Red/solipsiste/mirror sister
--== Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ ==--
---Share what you know. Learn what you don't.---
Eric M.
Joyce wrote:
> In article <3738D5...@livingston.net>,
> all...@livingston.net wrote:
> > Dear Joyce,
> > Welcome to alt.solipsism. Haven't seen your name here before.
>
> That's because I didn't use this handle before
Oh, so what you're saying is that you HAVE been here, albeit having used
a different handle? ;)
>
>
> > How did you find us?
>
> In a book about symbolististic artists in the 19th century
Wow, I didn't realize we had such prominent historic roots. :)
>
>
> > 6 1 8
> > 7 5 3
> > 2 9 4
> >
> > The above box adds up to 15 no matter which of the eight (three
> > vertical, three horizontal, and two diagonal) ways you can add it.
> > Doesn't that make you want to go "Hmmmmm!" ?
>
> hmmm
>
> I'm glad you replied to this post, as off-topic as it might be :)
Nothing's off-topic here. Everything relates to solipsism........:)
Eric (CiRE)
>
>
> bye
bye bye sweety pie......:)
AllisonWonderland
> > Dear Joyce, Welcome to alt.solipsism. Haven't seen your name here before.
> That's because I didn't use this handle before.
AllisonWonderland asked:
And what handle did you use?
AllisonWonderland continued:
> > How did you find us?
> In a book about symbolististic artists in the 19th century.
AllisonWonderland asked:
Symbolististic Artists? Would you care to expound and elucidate?
Joyce expostulated:
> I'm glad you replied to this post, as off-topic as it might be :) bye.
> Joycelyn Red/solipsiste/mirror sister
AllisonWonderland, following the admonition of Joycelyn
Red/solipsiste/mirror sister when she implores: "Share what you know.
Learn what you don't." (Joycelyn Red), then in another fit of "Let-Go
Defensive Mysticism", realizes that apparently Robert Greer is probably
not going to aquiesce to asking for a definition of the phrase "Let-Go
Defensive Mysticism", and so AllisonWonderland decides to just take it
on himself to expound un-bidden:
To understand the phrase "Let-Go Defensive Mysticism", one must
understand that the action/practice behind it is the basis for a
technique of existence that is in response to a very specific situation,
which has been an occasional topic of conversation in this NG, by dint
of it being the condition in which AllisonWonderland, has found, is
finding, and will continue to find himself, that is: Having been given
an imminent-death sentence due to a genetic dysfunction that is
destroying A/W's Liver (Primary Biliary Cirrhosis PBC).
There has been some conversation concerning the chemicals that are being
ingested by AllisonWonderland... Prednisone in particular... and the
reaction to the Prednisone is where the practice of "Let-Go Defensive
Mysticism" is most efficacious.
The Prednisone activates the Pituitary... The Pituitary, by it's
functions, activates the Adrenals... And as a quite separate, effect,
the pain of broken hip complications causes profound releases of
Endorphins...
With this combination of ACTH, Adrenalin and Endorphins running rampant,
the state of mind that AllisonWonderland experiences is much like
WhiteWaterKyaking in the River of Time!
A word of caution here: One might think that this kind of drug reaction
would be less than efficacious in facilitating the search for the nature
of the solipsitic existence, because it would artificially alter the
perception of existence by the mind perceiving the sensory information
of the exsitence in which it finds itself...
Having previously, in the unaltered state, already suspected that
existence is more psychological than physical, and then to have some of
the substances that the mystics of old were in quest of accessing when
they engaged in what today is called Alchemy,... (the Endocrine
Orchestra), in the form of Adrenalin, Endorphins and ACTH and the
harmonic/sympathetic response by the Thyroid, the Pancreas, the Liver,
and (blush) the Gonads, all serve to set the mental and physical
manifestation of AllisonWonderland into a "state" in which:
Any attempt to control it,
Results in loss of control.
And relinquishing any control of it,
Makes it go where he wants it to go!
(The "Let-Go" of the phrase "Let-Go Defensive Mysticism") and the
resultant Mystical experience as a result of "Letting-Go" as the ONLY
defense against the onslaught of the WhiteWaterRapids of the River of
Time...
So: What does all this mean? Of what use is this obliqueness? Why do
this?
The answers to all those kind of immediately obvious questions, results
in an infinite number of answers. For the reaction, to any situation in
the dream, has an infinite number of links to links to links (so to
Internetspeak), that lead the perceptions of the perceiver of the event
of existence to the conclusions concernign the factors in the dream and
ultimately the dream itself.
Such as: This weekend, from Friday morning at 9:00 a.m, till Saturday
night at 9:41 p.m., AllisonWonderland was in an automobile for twelve
hours, traveling from Onalaska, Texas to Houston, to SanMarcos, to
Houston, and back to Onalaska.
All this to have medical tests (In Houston) and attend the graduation of
a dear friend who received a Masters Degree in Social Work at SouthWest
Texas State Univerity (SWTSU) in San Marcos.
There was an after graduation reception (getting a Master's Degree is
not to be sneezed at!) and it was attended by her: Mother; Uncle;
Brother; Father's widow; FW's son; Room-mate; and a few friends, fellow
students and AllisonWonderland.
AllisonWonderland was in a position to observe the situation as one
would when lucid dreaming, aloof, yet aware of the inter-play of a
family that reacts to each-other the way that the members of this family
do...
Upon returning home and as is the situation, the eventuality of the
medication induced releases of Adrenalin on Sunday Morning along with a
coincident incident with the Sciatic pain caused Endorphin release, and
once again the "Let-Go" to keep from losing it, and while lying on the
floor in the immense pain and adrenalin induced psycho-strength "let-go"
to keep from a panic-driven control attempt... A/W watched six kittens
on the floor where he lay, turn into the family of "The Graduate", and
the play that the kitten were engaging in, out of the love they felt for
each-other and instinctual just wanting to "fuck-around" with
each-other, even if it results in some kind of fight... it matters
not... it is all part of the mystical perception... everything is a
symbol of whatever one can see it a symbol of... Everything means
something... Nothing means anything... and existence is what one
perceives it to be mixed with one's decisions regarding the way one
reacts to what one perceives...
When on is falling off of the Spire of Life, the splat on the Floor of
Death produces the next kind of consciousness of the Dreamer... The
worst that can happen is that it cuts to Black! But...
And because this particular pain/Prednison/ induced session of "Let-Go"
Defensive Mysticism is far from subsiding... there needs to be a
recognizing of the factor in the "Let-Go" that precludes any kind of
negativity concerning the validity of the concept... That is the
anathema of the "let-Go". This may smack of dictitorial prohibition of
negativity, and it probably is... but it is the only way to keep the
dream going, without crashing it about by trying to make it go where one
"thinks" it "should" go.
It seems at this time that the mental processes of the computer and AW,
are producing the state of existence where kittens become barometers of
familial relations! And for those who would exclaim: "That's Crazy!",
let it be known that there is that factor involved also... and that
factor is called: Hepatic Encephalopathy, a complication of PBC.
Yes, ladies and gentlemen, for the first time on any NG, we are going to
watch the progression of the mind of AllisonWonderland as it progresses
from an Oxygen/Hydrogen/Nitrogen based consciousness to a predominantly
Ammonia based consciousness...
Watch the progression while the events that reach from AllisonWonderland
to his horizon turn into the ultimate solution to the riddle of the
dream...
In the dream, we will all be Rich and Wealthy...
In the dream, we will all be Powerful and Strong,
In the dream, we will all be Famous and Reknowned,
In the dream, we'll all have Progeny.
In the dream, we will all know the Truth,
In the dream, we will all see the Beauty,
In the dream, we will all be worth Saving,
In the dream, we'll all be Free.
Or Crazy in the No-Game Game! (The Fool, 0&78)
"There's "Another clue for you all!" (Beatles)
Alas, and luckily, the dream fadeth... the emergency is gone... the cool
Summer evening has "earned its way today" (MoodyBlues), The cats are
serene, the cool breeze whispers secrets that are so profound that it
dare not do so too loud, and A/W is hard of hearing, and besides, spoken
words are beginning to lose their meaning as does their linking
together... What he hears is garble... Reading seems to be alright, but
what he hears reveals little in the way of understanding what the breeze
is saying.
And Joycelyn Red, you will have to excuse me for expropriating your post
to ramble like this, accept my thanks, and reply if you like...
Watch out for Eric... he puts the hustle on every female name that hits
the posters list! :)
To Eric: Get 'em Tiger! :)
Have a wonderscanned day and remember... splat is but a few dreams away!
:(
Heart Happy
>
>
> With this combination of ACTH, Adrenalin and Endorphins running rampant,
> the state of mind that AllisonWonderland experiences is much like
> WhiteWaterKyaking in the River of Time!
>
> Any attempt to control it,
> Results in loss of control.
> And relinquishing any control of it,
> Makes it go where he wants it to go!
>
> (The "Let-Go" of the phrase "Let-Go Defensive Mysticism") and the
> resultant Mystical experience as a result of "Letting-Go" as the ONLY
> defense against the onslaught of the WhiteWaterRapids of the River of
> Time...
>
********** and the cotton is high.
> Upon returning home and as is the situation, the eventuality of the
> medication induced releases of Adrenalin on Sunday Morning along with a
> coincident incident with the Sciatic pain caused Endorphin release, and
> once again the "Let-Go" to keep from losing it, and while lying on the
> floor in the immense pain and adrenalin induced psycho-strength "let-go"
> to keep from a panic-driven control attempt...
********* Is the pain in your hip James? No pain medication?
A/W watched six kittens
> on the floor where he lay, turn into the family of "The Graduate", and
> the play that the kitten were engaging in, out of the love they felt for
> each-other and instinctual just wanting to "fuck-around" with
> each-other, even if it results in some kind of fight... it matters
> not...
********* ain't that the truth! :-) It's pretty isn't it??
> When on is falling off of the Spire of Life, the splat on the Floor of
> Death produces the next kind of consciousness of the Dreamer... The
> worst that can happen is that it cuts to Black! But...
>
********* I've been there. :-) And as a matter of fact, I'm there right
now. :-)
Oh God James....
> And because this particular pain/Prednison/ induced session of "Let-Go"
> Defensive Mysticism is far from subsiding... there needs to be a
> recognizing of the factor in the "Let-Go" that precludes any kind of
> negativity concerning the validity of the concept... That is the
> anathema of the "let-Go". This may smack of dictitorial prohibition of
> negativity, and it probably is... but it is the only way to keep the
> dream going, without crashing it about by trying to make it go where one
> "thinks" it "should" go.
******** Yes, that's the deal isn't it? Because there really is no
*place* for
*it* to go. It's just all right here, right now. And that sums
everything up.
There is no *place* except *here*. Forever land.
>
> Yes, ladies and gentlemen, for the first time on any NG, we are going to
> watch the progression of the mind of AllisonWonderland as it progresses
> from an Oxygen/Hydrogen/Nitrogen based consciousness to a predominantly
> Ammonia based consciousness...
>
********** What about the drugs?? Aren't they supposed to take care of
that?
>
> In the dream, we will all be Rich and Wealthy...
> In the dream, we will all be Powerful and Strong,
> In the dream, we will all be Famous and Reknowned,
> In the dream, we'll all have Progeny.
> In the dream, we will all know the Truth,
> In the dream, we will all see the Beauty,
> In the dream, we will all be worth Saving,
> In the dream, we'll all be Free.
> Or Crazy in the No-Game Game! (The Fool, 0&78)
>
******* Forget the dream.
> Alas, and luckily, the dream fadeth... the emergency is gone... the cool
> Summer evening has "earned its way today" (MoodyBlues), The cats are
> serene, the cool breeze whispers secrets that are so profound that it
> dare not do so too loud, and A/W is hard of hearing, and besides, spoken
> words are beginning to lose their meaning as does their linking
> together... What he hears is garble... Reading seems to be alright, but
> what he hears reveals little in the way of understanding what the breeze
> is saying.
>
************ I'm right here with you James. Always will be.
--
Happy Days,
Judi
http://www.users.uniserve.com/~samuel/judi-1.htm
http://www3.ns.sympatico.ca/umbada/morea.htm
http://www.angelfire.com/co/COMMONSENSE/members.html
tiresias
What is the latest set of figures on your liver function and condition?
> Having been given
> an imminent-death sentence due to a genetic dysfunction that is
> destroying A/W's Liver (Primary Biliary Cirrhosis PBC).
I have had my liver biopsy result and have cirrhosis, an enlarged spleen and
damage continuing to occur due to the virus outpacing my immune system. I
am having to push to try and get the anti-viral substances that have a 1 in
4 (approx) chance of taking out the virus.
Been an interesting time on receiving a death sentence. Have felt lust for
life and mourned somewhat for my self. I like me and it grieves me to say
goodbye! Will be seeing the consultant next week for an informative
exchange of information and views.
>
> Yes, ladies and gentlemen, for the first time on any NG, we are going to
> watch the progression of the mind of AllisonWonderland as it progresses
> from an Oxygen/Hydrogen/Nitrogen based consciousness to a predominantly
> Ammonia based consciousness...
I'll be with you on that particular alchemical transformation.
>
> Watch the progression while the events that reach from AllisonWonderland
> to his horizon turn into the ultimate solution to the riddle of the
> dream...
To have a definite event horizon looming into proximity does bring previous
idle speculation as to the after-death state, if any, into the here and
hopefully not now. I have experienced many altered states and this has
always been whilst being a human. When I die I will see or not what I am or
am not. Putting aside sentiment and vanity I am an animal. The abattoir is
my eventual destination and my dream is likely to end with my last breath.
If my dream continues with a continuum of story then it will, but if not
then my mourning is not in vain.
Anyway I have no definite date of demise but my astrological calculations do
indicate either regeneration or death by early October 2001. The likely
options are:
(1) I get the anti-viral therapy; it is successful and I carry on with my
permanently damaged liver and some degree of regeneration.
(2) I get the anti-viral therapy and it is not successful and either:
(a) Carry on until I get liver cancer and die
(b) Carry on until I die from liver failure
(c) Be put on the liver transplant list when I get very ill and
either:
(i) Die of liver cancer - transplants not given generally
if patient has cancer
(ii) Die of liver failure whilst waiting for a donor
organ
(iii) Get a transplant which would give me 4 in 5 chance
of living five years.
(d) Not get put on the transplant list and wait for (2)(a)
or (2)(b) or
(i) Investigate the options and affordability of getting
a donor organ and transplant to order.
(3) I do not get the anti-viral therapy and then options 2(c) and 2(d)
are available plus:
(a) I get hold of the anti-virals myself and give it a go.
>
> In the dream, we will all be Rich and Wealthy...
That would give me more options to be sure!
Tiresias
AllisonWonderland
Before doing the ply/reply thing with "that little old termagent
goat-getter" Robert Greer's basically offensive post, AllisonWonderland
decided that he would like to preface the following with the observation
that something seems to have gone horribly and painfully awry in the
solipsistic event, for it seems that something has crawled up inside our
Dear Brother Greer and died, causing him to tap, tap, tap, these really
disturbed and putrid smelling posts, which like little pop-corn kid
farts have this noticably distasteful odor, reeking reminiscently of
sulphur-dioxide (rotten-eggs), in a concerted effort to see if he can't
piss someone off. And all the time, I thought it was the cats breaking
wind.
And so if Robert is going to act like a child, it is probably only
fitting that he be given some advice that a child would understand...
An example: When Bambi's mother told Bambi (and in this case, A/W is the
mother, RG is Bambi) "If you can't say something nice... don't say
anything at all!" :)
Another example: "Be nice to others and others will be nice to you!"
(Saint Bernadette, patron saint of Bankruptcy... why do you think they
call her Bernadette (Burn-a-debt))
Yet another example: "Hey you little cumsquirt... don't make me come
over there!" (Rambo to his nephew) :)
Anyway... it has been quite apparent that the tenor of RG's posts
recently do suggest a relatively narrow-minded, low communication
skilled, un-happy camper, who highly resented having been potty trained
at gunpoint, and who has decided that he will take out his
anal-retentive frustrations on those of us here in the <alt.solipsism>
NG, probably because he knows that there is nothing meaningful that
anyone can do about his assholedness except chuckle at his infantile
attempts to affect the mental climate around those whom he has the
temerity to assail. A practice that has so far yielded only a
not-unsubstantial amount of disdain for Robert and his blather.
But all of that not-with-standing, let us continue...
> So the reason you spewed
"Spewed"?
> umpteen
"Umpteen"?
> pages of dishonest
"Dishonest"?
> BS
"BS"?
Robert, Robert, Robert, how you do go on! :) Are these the kind words
that your mommie used when she pistol-whipped to get you to make a
ducky? Is that the problem?
Why do you want to be so offensive? Certainly this is irrational on your
part... No one here has been on your ass... (not to say that that isn't
going to change presently), but are you some kind of masochist? Do you
just want to elicit some kind of "contentious" response? If this is so,
then the advice to Louis, the Lizard from Frank, the Half Iguana in the
Budweiser (that's a beer... you'll be old enough to find out what beer
tastes like legally in just a mere ten years or so) commercial might
help when Frank says: "Let it go Louis, let it go!".
Don't you see that you have only been getting away with this because I
let you? Remember in a conflict like this, you are basically unable to
participate due to lack of speed... you have to be old enough to run in
a running battle... this is not a crawling battle, and those high-heeled
Black suede pumps aren't any help either, besides pumps will give you
water on the knee! :)
> as an "answer" to Mark Shuller's honest (and simple) question was... that you're
> running out of time to live?
Robert, Robert, Robert, how you do go on! It wouldn't be so bad if we
could all understand what it is that makes you want to be so
distastefully odorous in this offalic attitude that you have assumed.
But as it turns out, we who read this are kind of all like YOU... that
is, We don't know what YOU are talking about either!
You seem to have a pre-set interpretation that pops up whenever you read
something and what you have read gets that meaning put on it!
English isn't your SECOND language is it?
You might try just reading something to see what it says, rather than
reading something and deciding that it means what you say it means
rather than what it means. As it turns out, it looks like you just want
to argue, and you don't know how to do that very well yet... "You know
all the words, and can hum the tune, but you haven't quite learned the
song" (Incredible String Band). And there is no use disagreeing, for
that only propagates your image of just wanting to argue.
> If you don't have much time, try brevity.
Nope, am paid by the word... And besides, having unlimited internet
access negates any necessity for brevity. And another besides, typing
fast will do the same thing... :) And yet another besides, having or not
having much time has little to do with anything... One day you may
realize that... if the neighbors ever let you grow up instead of giving
you what you deserve.
> You might get some applause (besides your own) as you Exit Stage Left.
Applause? Did you hear any applause? Are you sure that what you mistook
for applause isn't just the left-over ear damage induced from listening
to the SpiceGirls too loud? Or was it your PeeWee Herman doll that you
connected to the deep discharge 24 volt RV battery that you stole from
your neighbor?
And please do remember the thing about Bambi... for it seems, by the
distasteful odor of your comments, that what you are attempting is to be
a T-G-G.
> Gosh, the ultimate natural high.
You wouldn't know an ultimate natural high if you saw one... but your
use of the substitute "Gosh" for the word "God" reveals much about you!
:)
Mommie wouldn't let you say real naughty words, so you substitute "darn"
and "gosh". (Go ahead, try to weasel your way out of that one!, And
don't try to act like you don't know what we mean!) You remind me of the
"mean widdo kid" who, running away from home walked around the block all
day because his mommie wouldn't let him cross the street.
> Makes we wonder why people both *(sic)* with "teachers" and "gurus"
Robert, you meant to write "bother", not "both"! So now, armed with
"this" little "Freudian slip" bit of information, and as Robert is so
good at doing, WE now have a chance to extrapolate much about Robert...
RG doesn't know how to spell "bother"... that means that he hasn't
gotten to 4th grade yet where that word will be taught him in about the
5th week. If he is in 4th grade, then he looks a little bit like Dennis
the Menace. Isn't it amazing how much can be squeezed from a single
little slip of a pinkie? :)
Anyway Robert... when you mean to write "bother" and all that comes out
is "both"... just reach up there on the little thingie that your Mummie
lets you use when you play with her computer, and punch the "e" and then
right next to it is an "r". Putting just those two letters on the end of
"both" will spell "bother", and then maybe what you write will start to
make some sense... You may even someday learn to spell as well as Dan
Quayle... Naaaa. I know Dan Quayle, and Robert... you are no Dan Quayle!
Anyway, without seeming to go on and on about YOUR INABILITY TO WRITE
VERY WELL such as when you wrote "both" instead of "bother" which
rendered the sentence in which you wrote "both" instead of "bother"
unintelligible as a coherent meaningful phrase, coupled with YOUR
INABILITY TO READ VERY WELL someone else's writing without
misinterpreting what was written... might it just be said that, in
reality, Robert that you are just coming off looking very dufus-ish-ly
insecure as far as having any kind of confidence and competence
concerning what is being discussed.
Your unreasonable and unwarranted anger and piss-off-ed-ness, your
imbecilic narrow-mind-ed-ness and Draconian authoritarianism, and your
less-than-pleasant inability to be acceptably intelligent with your
comments, render you an image which looks like a cartoon character
somewhere between Phoghorn Leghorn and Archie Bunker, dressed like a
cross between Diego Cool Rhodes in his cute little Harley T-Shirt, and
Dennis the Menace, carrying fully automatic Uzzi with a clip full of
various colored Legos!
Now this is not to say that this isn't quite humorous... it is! But
Robert.... What is wrong with this picture? Are you sure this is the
real you?
[TIME-OUT] At this point... in fairness to Robert, we might should take
a bit of a poll... so the question is: Is Robert just acting like an
asshole? Or is Robert not acting?
Cast your vote by writing either ACT or ASS in your post and send it to:
<alt.solipsism>, right here at Solipsism Central, The decisison of the
judges will be final and the results will become part of Robert's
Permanent Record. Let's hear from you all! [TIME-IN]
> obviously, the Death Ward at the local hospital is the place to go for wisdom.
Robert, Robert, Robert, how you do go on... And as mean spirited as you
appear to be, you sure don't look like Newt Gingrich!
As a matter of fact, there is no DeathWard necessary... in fact there is
no local hospital... But there is one in nearby (13 miles) Livingston.
But in all seriousness, if you had any concept of the reality of the
situation, you would see just how 'shit-for-brains" your comments are.
And think about this Robert, you wouldn't say something like what you
just wrote to someone like me to my face where we were in the same room.
Reason number 1: Because you know you wouldn't be allowed to get away
with it; And 2. if your verbal skills are as lacking in the same
insufficiency as your graphic and comprehension skill, you wouldn't be
able to muster enough vocabulary to get the point across... (a factor
which may explain how you have reach the ripe old age of 8 with out
pissing off the other little brats in your neighborhood which is why
they haven't beaten the shit out of you which would leave nothing to run
home and tell mama!... It comes under the heading of no knowing how to
talk good enough to get one's self in real trouble... but you may be in
real trouble when you learn to say "maaa-ma" and "daaa-da"
But safely in your mommie's closet where she keeps her computer, with
her bra on your head like a beanie with chinstraps, standing in her high
heeled shoes, it is easy to "spew", to use one of your mommie's terms,
this dreck that you somehow mistake for intelligent communication. in an
effort to maybe get some-one "mad"... Ohhhh funnnn! Why don't you grow
up Robert?
> Sure makes me embarrassed to tout the efficacy of psychedelics.
Was there before you were, were there longer than you were, did more of
that than you and your friends put together and was there since you
were. So just because you've done a whole half-bottle of Robitussin a
one time, once, don't think that you can talk to anyone about TEXMEX,
because you have yet to have been to ElChico! (TLBG),
And as a final aside... Might I comment on your total waste of using
mind altering substances. They would have been totally wasted because
you appear not to have much of anything on which they would have an
effect. Sorry about that... but one must tell it like it is!
> After all, they'll introduce almost *anyone* to Nirvana with just a few tries.
> But Prednisone - well, that works for *Allison*! Wooooh!
Notice that Robert said "almost" anyone? That's his weasel word to keep
himself out of the loop.
> Artificially? Nothing is truly "artificial"
It is if I say it is! :)
> if nothing is truly "real."
Not any more it isn't if I say it isn't!
> (This *is* alt.solipsism, remember!)
Bingo! Even a broken clock is right twice a day! :)
> And perception can't be altered by drugs:
They can if I say they can!
> drugs are within the hallucination that comprises "you";
Not unless I say so.
> they can't influence it,
They can if I say they can!
> they're just a part of it. They're archetypes.
Only if I say they are!
> And "the mind" cannot find itself "in an existence": your mind *is* your
> existence, so it can't be "in it".
It can if I say it can!
> However, if you *want* solipsistic sacraments, you'll do better with $20 for
> Spanish Eddy down the block than by breaking your leg or rotting inside.
And for $20 he does what for little Bobby... Let you fondle the
flashlight in his pocket? :) Wake up kid... that ain't no flashlight...
and it didn't taste like a banana either, did it Bobby?
> Really, you should try solipsism someday, just for a change of pace,
> Allison. Dying wouldn't worry you nearly so much if you were a solipsist.
Had I, by reading your many comments been impressed by your acuity, this
might be advice that would be worth considering... but by looking at
you, considering the source, reading your posts, and grokking the image
you present... If all the information that was available about solipsism
was what you offer, the suggestion would have to be rejected
instantaneously.
After all who would take any kind of instruction, or even want to have
any kind of intellectual intercourse with a relatively narrow-minded,
low communication skilled, un-happy camper, who highly resented having
been potty trained at gunpoint, who is dufusishly insecure, and looks
like a cartoon character of a cross somewhere between Phoghorn Leghorn
and Archie Bunker, dressed like a cross between Diego Cool Rhodes in a
"teenie" Harley T-Shirt, and Dennis the Menace, carrying a fully
automatic Uzzi with a clip full of multi-colored Legos, fondling Spanish
Eddy's banana with his petulant, pouty little puckered up mouth and
paying $20.00 for the privlege.
> By the way, will you be alive much longer? Just curious...
No.
> The crux of Allison's phony mysticism:
Let's leave my crux out of this! :) And as for phoniness... You wouldn't
know a real mysticism from a phony mysticism if if one came along to
help you with fondling Spanish Eddy's banana...
> that existence is partly physical and partly mental.
For you see, Robert has no way to comprehend the mental part since he
only has the physical part! About the mental part... he hasn't a clue...
and won't until the fifth grade when they will teach him the word "clue"
in the eighth week... He (it?) and his (its) father will learn how to
spell "clue" at the same time, since his daaa-da failed the fifth grade
for the 8th time... seems that he hasn't a clue as to how to spell
"clue"! :)
> >and then to have some of
> >the substances that the mystics of old were in quest of accessing when
> >they engaged in what today is called Alchemy,... (the Endocrine
> >Orchestra), in the form of Adrenalin, Endorphins and ACTH and the
> >harmonic/sympathetic response by the Thyroid, the Pancreas, the Liver,
> >and (blush) the Gonads, all serve to set the mental and physical
> >manifestation of AllisonWonderland into a "state" in which: <etc.>
>
> No, they wanted gold. Just gold.
Oh Robert, Robert, Robert! You have just lost all credibility! You think
you know so much, but we know "Brain Dead" when we see it, don't we? As
a matter of fact this was a keeper... This ruins any chance you ever had
to be taken seriously... This was like sitting bare-assed on the scanner
and having it come out looking like a head shot! Oops... this was
divine... Used in a scientific sense! :)
[TIME OUT] BTW Robby, I noticed that you didn't mention anything about
my challenge to you about the word "Divine" and its scientific sense!
What's wrong, Spanish Eddy ate your Huevos? [TIME IN]
> Alchemy was medieval precursor of Chemistry. That's all.
And Candy Barr has nuts! :) The following is excerpted from one of the
book that happens to be used by those who, unlike Robert, have some real
idea of what the order of thing are...
"Serious individuals found themselves accused of heresy, imprisoned, by
the Inquisitors, tortured, burned alive, It became impossible to engage
in "The Great Work" [TIME OUT] (and here I am not allowed to use the
real term in front of some one as unworthy as Robert) [TIME IN],
openly."
"To survive at all, one had to adopt a disguise, pretend that one's real
interest was alchemy or magic, both of which were premitted by the
priests, who did not understand the real significance of either."
"Alchemy was particularly safe as its STATED aim, the transmutation of
base metals into gold, posed no challenge whatever to the authority of
the priests. Therefore it was behind the mask of alchemy that many
serious individuals of "Great Work" [the real term again un-used to keep
Robert in his present un-worthy, unenlightened and gross state]
concealed their real aims, formulating the rules of their endeavor into
an elaborate secret code in which the transmutations of substances
within the body were expressed in terms of meercury, sulfur, salt, and
other elements."
"There were of course, numerous alchemists who took the whole science at
its face value, who believed that the "Great Work" referred to the
production of metallic gold, who impoverished and frequently poisoned
themselves in the quest for the great secret... and incidentally laid
the foundations for modern chemistry."
"But for the serious alchemist the transmutation involved the formation
of the AURUM NON VULGI, or the genesis of the homunculus, both of which
symbolized the creation of fully conscious, cosmically oriented man out
of the ego-centered puppet that goes by the name of man, but is really
only a pathetic caricature of what man could be."
"So well did the alchemists conceal their secrets that it took all the
intuitive genius of Carl Gustav Jung (perhapes the leading authority on
the subject) a large part of his life to unravel this mystery."
For those of you who would like to have specifics concerning this
reference, one only has to request it by E-Mail, but don't tell Robert
what it is... he has been scheduled to remain stupid till I lift the
knowledge embargo on him, which won't be any time soon if he doesn't
straighten up and stop being such a putz.
[TIME OUT] Robert... the very fact that this has been addressed is proof
that there is something "behind" alchemy. Your refusal to see this,
shows that you are not yet "with-it". Better hurry up... we can't wait
on you forever! :) [TIME IN]
> And they weren't searching for natural highs:
Wow, are you really that hung up on something so insignificant as
getting high? Are you sure you haven't fallen off your skate board
without your skid-lid once too often?
Oh... I get it... you aren't allowed to let mommie and daddy know you
turn on... and thus the old "forbidden fruit" thing has reared its ugly
head... Well, in your case... Maybe Carroll O'Conner's advice would be
well to be acted on by them... you know, "Get between your kid and drugs
anyway you can... if you ever want to get a toke of whatever it is that
he is huffing!" Lets see, you especially like the feeling that comes
from spray cans of gloss Red and high-heat flat Black in a plastic bag!
Right? BTW, there is a bank here that you might like... they send checks
that are 2'-0" X 6'-0", and you can sign them using the same spray can
that you huff from.
> they had those in profusion. They had excitement, fear, pain, love, and more
> kinds of mushrooms and herbs than you could recount in a week.
Serious as a cardiac arrest here Robert... Alchemy had nothing to do
with either Gold or Shrooms... Only the stupid assholes who didn't know
the difference thought like that... what do you think?
And the fact that you don't know that that is the case is an indication
that you, are a dilettante, a newbie neophyte, having all the acumen of
Merlin's apprentice as portrayed by MickyMouse in Fantasia.
> Psychologically, Prednisone is just bubble gum compared to the typical Wicce
> witches-brew.
Still, it is being taken, not to get high, but to do a number of things
as last chance strategies to retard an incurable terminal disease from
destroying the Liver of AllisonWonderand... It does this by 1. Taking
down the immune system which in my case is quite healthy and therefore
quite leathal. 2. To put a barrier between the anti-bodies that are
attacking the Liver and the Liver to cut down on the amount of
inflammation. And 3. To daily deplete the Adrenalin so that the immune
system has less energy with which to attack.
And knowing how you think and the mean-ness of your thought processes,
you are probably thinking that it serves me right for catching this
disease. Might it be said that this is not a disease that you catch by
fucking around with Robert's mother, it is a genetic, auto-immune
disorder... having no explanantion for its appearance. A/W just happens
to be a 1 in 500,000 victim of the nature of the human entity...
And so Robert... you may make all the references to solipsism that you
want... for those of us who know the difference... we can tell the
difference... and from the look of your posts, it is obvious that you
are totally clueless as far as knowing "ANYTHING" is concerned...
Actually all that can be gotten for sure from your posts is that the
electric company hasn't yet turned off the juice.
And with that AllisonWonderland reaches over to the "Solipsistic Event
Control Panel" and turns the knob labeled "Robert Greer, Appearance"
first to the setting labeled "Mortimer Snerd" and then to "OFF". And
placing his finger next to his nose, and quoting Judi of the Happy
Heart, he says "There, that ought to just about do it!" :)
And when Robert's mother came home found him in the computer closet
wearing her bra and shoes, looking like a wooden-headed puppet and
having shot him self in the foot with a Yellow Lego and having bled
mushroom juice tea all over her Black suede pumps... she gets out her
.357 magnum enema rig and the rest of the evening is spent with momma
and her little "darlink" (remember the Katzenjammer Kids?) doing all
kinds of things that they really should be wearing rubber gloves to do,
while daddy and the rest of the sopranos in his do-wop/hip-hop fusion
garage band watch and applaude, occasionally breaking into a chorus of
"You really got a hold on me!" (Beatles) when the occasion demands.
Well, Robert do have a wonderscanned and from now on... remember: When
you're dancing with your honey, and her nose is runny, don't think it's
funny, cause it snot! Divine (in a scientific sense, isn't it?)
"Step into my parlour said the spider to the fly" and remember "Youth
and Exuberance is no match for Age and Treachery!" :)
And Robert... look at the monkey in the mirror! :)
Allen Crider
AllisonWonderland wrote:
> > Psychologically, Prednisone is just bubble gum compared to the typical Wicce
> > witches-brew.
Yep... That was the line right there. He rants about substances like he is some
kind of DEA Fed cruising the net 'cause he got a grant to do Federal Internet
Outreach and Apprehension.
Wicca sucks. But that's beside the point. Mr. Bob is unable to describe any
experiences with sunstances or without. He is sometimes a useful point of
reference for scholarly works about solipsistic thought (and the movie reviews).
Other than that, I suppose he is simply a powerless weakling out looking for an excuse.
Heart Happy
This is what I have to say to Robert.
Robert, you may be smart, but without love, you have nothing.
And when you realize that Robert, drop us a note won't you?
Judi
--
CIRE
Bob Greer wrote:
> AllisonWonderland wrote in message <373F5E...@livingston.net>...
>
> >To understand the phrase "Let-Go Defensive Mysticism", one must
> >understand that the action/practice behind it is the basis for a
> >technique of existence that is in response to a very specific situation,
> >which has been an occasional topic of conversation in this NG, by dint
> >of it being the condition in which AllisonWonderland, has found, is
> >finding, and will continue to find himself, that is: Having been given
> >an imminent-death sentence due to a genetic dysfunction that is
> >destroying A/W's Liver (Primary Biliary Cirrhosis PBC).
> >
>
> So the reason you spewed umpteen pages of dishonest BS as an "answer" to
> Mark Shuller's honest (and simple) question was... that you're running out
> of time to live?
Bob, what's up with you?
What makes you feel the need to always be such a bete noire?
Are you just "testing" people to see what kind reaction you can get?
I've seen your likeable side--as seldom as you show it to others--so I know
you're not incapable of congeniality.
What is it?
Do you & James have some sort of long-standing feud that goes back to the early
days of alt.solipsism?
>
>
> If you don't have much time, try brevity.
It's ironic that someone with an appentence for periphrastic dialogue should
place emphasis on brevity. :)
>
>
> >There has been some conversation concerning the chemicals that are being
> >ingested by AllisonWonderland... Prednisone in particular... and the
> >reaction to the Prednisone is where the practice of "Let-Go Defensive
> >Mysticism" is most efficacious.
> >
> >The Prednisone activates the Pituitary... The Pituitary, by it's
> >functions, activates the Adrenals... And as a quite separate, effect,
> >the pain of broken hip complications causes profound releases of
> >Endorphins...
>
> >With this combination of ACTH, Adrenalin and Endorphins running rampant,
> >the state of mind that AllisonWonderland experiences is much like
> >WhiteWaterKyaking in the River of Time!
> >
>
> Gosh, the ultimate natural high.
>
> Makes we wonder why people both with "teachers" and "gurus" - obviously, the
> Death Ward at the local hospital is the place to go for wisdom.
You are a cruel bastard. What do you honestly feel you are proving with this? Do
you enjoy sticking a metaphorical knife into someone's side? I mean, it's bad
enough making light of someone's impending demise; it's downright iniquitous to
scorn someone while doing it. It's becoming obvious you're nothing but a
misanthropic bugbear always looking for a fight.....
>
>
> >A word of caution here: One might think that this kind of drug reaction
> >would be less than efficacious in facilitating the search for the nature
> >of the solipsitic existence, because it would artificially alter the
> >perception of existence by the mind perceiving the sensory information
> >of the exsitence in which it finds itself...
> >
>
> Artificially? Nothing is truly "artificial" if nothing is truly "real."
> (This *is* alt.solipsism, remember!)
>
>
> And perception can't be altered by drugs: drugs are within the hallucination
> that comprises "you"; they can't influence it, they're just a part of it.
> They're archetypes.
Just how do you define perception Bob? Certainly changes are taking place with
perception when influenced by drugs, and there's a simple demonstable way to
verify it.
Need I explain how?
>
>
>
> And "the mind" cannot find itself "in an existance": your mind *is* your
> existance, so it can't be "in it".
>
>
> However, if you *want* solipsistic sacraments, you'll do better with $20 for
> Spanish Eddy down the block than by breaking your leg or rotting inside.
>
>
> Really, you should try solipsism someday, just for a change of pace,
> Allison. Dying wouldn't worry you nearly so much if you thought
> solipsistically.
Eric
CIRE
My man!! Great post!! I see you still have A LOT of life in you. :)
But don't let what Bob says get you down--and don't take it personally. You know he's
just trying to push your buttons like he did with Rick?
He's obviously an equal-opportunity, nondiscrimatory pain in the ass.
But that's just Bob, isn't it? ;) To be honest....as seemingly ornery, inconsiderately
cruel and pugnacious as the guy is....I think he's actually got a soft spot for ya. :)
Take care,
Eric
Bob Greer
AllisonWonderland wrote in message <373F5E...@livingston.net>...
>To understand the phrase "Let-Go Defensive Mysticism", one must
>understand that the action/practice behind it is the basis for a
>technique of existence that is in response to a very specific situation,
>which has been an occasional topic of conversation in this NG, by dint
>of it being the condition in which AllisonWonderland, has found, is
>finding, and will continue to find himself, that is: Having been given
>an imminent-death sentence due to a genetic dysfunction that is
>destroying A/W's Liver (Primary Biliary Cirrhosis PBC).
>
So the reason you spewed umpteen pages of dishonest BS as an "answer" to
Mark Shuller's honest (and simple) question was... that you're running out
of time to live?
If you don't have much time, try brevity.
>There has been some conversation concerning the chemicals that are being
>ingested by AllisonWonderland... Prednisone in particular... and the
>reaction to the Prednisone is where the practice of "Let-Go Defensive
>Mysticism" is most efficacious.
>
>The Prednisone activates the Pituitary... The Pituitary, by it's
>functions, activates the Adrenals... And as a quite separate, effect,
>the pain of broken hip complications causes profound releases of
>Endorphins...
>With this combination of ACTH, Adrenalin and Endorphins running rampant,
>the state of mind that AllisonWonderland experiences is much like
>WhiteWaterKyaking in the River of Time!
>
Gosh, the ultimate natural high.
Makes we wonder why people both with "teachers" and "gurus" - obviously, the
Death Ward at the local hospital is the place to go for wisdom.
>A word of caution here: One might think that this kind of drug reaction
>would be less than efficacious in facilitating the search for the nature
>of the solipsitic existence, because it would artificially alter the
>perception of existence by the mind perceiving the sensory information
>of the exsitence in which it finds itself...
>
Artificially? Nothing is truly "artificial" if nothing is truly "real."
(This *is* alt.solipsism, remember!)
And perception can't be altered by drugs: drugs are within the hallucination
that comprises "you"; they can't influence it, they're just a part of it.
They're archetypes.
And "the mind" cannot find itself "in an existance": your mind *is* your
existance, so it can't be "in it".
However, if you *want* solipsistic sacraments, you'll do better with $20 for
Spanish Eddy down the block than by breaking your leg or rotting inside.
Really, you should try solipsism someday, just for a change of pace,
Allison. Dying wouldn't worry you nearly so much if you thought
solipsistically.
By the way, will you be alive much longer? Just curious...
- Bob Greer
---------------------------------------------
Neo: "Do you ever wonder if your life is real or if it's a dream?"
[?]: "All of the time... on mescaline!"
- from "The Matrix"
Neo: "I lived here for years, but it's not real. What does that mean?"
Trinity: "It means: the Matrix can't tell you who you are."
- from "The Matrix"
(These are just approximate quotes, as I didn't have a pencil and paper in
the movie theater. And (subjectively) "the Matrix" is "Maya" or "the
dream." - Bob)
---------------------------------------------
Bob Greer
AllisonWonderland wrote in message <373F5E...@livingston.net>...
>To understand the phrase "Let-Go Defensive Mysticism", one must
>understand that the action/practice behind it is the basis for a
>technique of existence that is in response to a very specific situation,
>which has been an occasional topic of conversation in this NG, by dint
>of it being the condition in which AllisonWonderland, has found, is
>finding, and will continue to find himself, that is: Having been given
>an imminent-death sentence due to a genetic dysfunction that is
>destroying A/W's Liver (Primary Biliary Cirrhosis PBC).
>
So the reason you spewed umpteen pages of dishonest BS as an "answer" to
Mark Shuller's honest (and simple) question was... that you're running out
of time to live?
If you don't have much time, try brevity.
You might get some applause (besides your own) as you Exit Stage Left.
>There has been some conversation concerning the chemicals that are being
>ingested by AllisonWonderland... Prednisone in particular... and the
>reaction to the Prednisone is where the practice of "Let-Go Defensive
>Mysticism" is most efficacious.
>
>The Prednisone activates the Pituitary... The Pituitary, by it's
>functions, activates the Adrenals... And as a quite separate, effect,
>the pain of broken hip complications causes profound releases of
>Endorphins...
>With this combination of ACTH, Adrenalin and Endorphins running rampant,
>the state of mind that AllisonWonderland experiences is much like
>WhiteWaterKyaking in the River of Time!
>
Gosh, the ultimate natural high.
Makes we wonder why people both with "teachers" and "gurus" - obviously, the
Death Ward at the local hospital is the place to go for wisdom.
Sure makes me embarrassed to tout the efficacy of psychedelics. After all,
they'll introduce almost *anyone* to Nirvana with just a few tries. But
Prednisone - well, that works for *Allison*! Wooooh!
>A word of caution here: One might think that this kind of drug reaction
>would be less than efficacious in facilitating the search for the nature
>of the solipsistic existence, because it would artificially alter the
>perception of existence by the mind perceiving the sensory information
>of the existence in which it finds itself...
>
Artificially? Nothing is truly "artificial" if nothing is truly "real."
(This *is* alt.solipsism, remember!)
And perception can't be altered by drugs: drugs are within the hallucination
that comprises "you"; they can't influence it, they're just a part of it.
They're archetypes.
And "the mind" cannot find itself "in an existence": your mind *is* your
existence, so it can't be "in it".
However, if you *want* solipsistic sacraments, you'll do better with $20 for
Spanish Eddy down the block than by breaking your leg or rotting inside.
Really, you should try solipsism someday, just for a change of pace,
Allison. Dying wouldn't worry you nearly so much if you were a solipsist.
By the way, will you be alive much longer? Just curious...
>Having previously, in the unaltered state, already suspected that
>existence is more psychological than physical,
The crux of Allison's phony mysticism: that existence is partly physical and
partly mental.
>and then to have some of
>the substances that the mystics of old were in quest of accessing when
>they engaged in what today is called Alchemy,... (the Endocrine
>Orchestra), in the form of Adrenalin, Endorphins and ACTH and the
>harmonic/sympathetic response by the Thyroid, the Pancreas, the Liver,
>and (blush) the Gonads, all serve to set the mental and physical
>manifestation of AllisonWonderland into a "state" in which: <etc.>
No, they wanted gold. Just gold.
Alchemy was medieval precursor of Chemistry. That's all.
And they weren't searching for natural highs: they had those in profusion.
They had excitement, fear, pain, love, and more kinds of mushrooms and herbs
than you could recount in a week.
Psychologically, prednisone is just bubble gum compared to the typical Wicce
witches-brew. ("Now let's see, does the recipe call for one thorn-apple, or
two? And now - the Liberty Caps! Simmer, and stir...")
AllisonWonderland
Hello again Allen! :) How have you been? I feel like I may have found
out how to get you to post more here more often... all I gotta do is rub
Robby and poof... you appear like a djinn!
> AllisonWonderland wrote:
> > > Psychologically, Prednisone is just bubble gum compared to the typical Wicce
> > > witches-brew.
Actually Allen, this was a bit of blurt by Robby.
> Yep... That was the line right there. He rants about substances like he is some
> kind of DEA Fed cruising the net 'cause he got a grant to do Federal Internet
> Outreach and Apprehension.
It used to be, back before doping became such a teeny-bopper type thing
(You know... the way Robby does it), that the only ones who even
mentioned it were either so new as to be over-whelmed by the experience
out of the newness of the endeavor, or were just so un-cool that they
had to talk a good game just to try to make everyone think that they
were some kind of "heavy"... I suspect that if it is even either one of
these that is afflicting Robby, that it is probably the latter.
> Wicca sucks.
Is that what he is into? If it is, he is simply too far back to worry
about. "Pointy shoes and Peaked hat, Magic spell, and thing like that!"?
(Buffy St.Marie). If this is true... and I have no reason to believe it
is not... then he is just plain dummmmm.
He probably think that Dow Nunder is the Austrailian StockMarket! :)
> But that's beside the point.
Like both of his ears! :)
> Mr. Bob is unable to describe any experiences with substances or without.
Why do you think they call him "Dope"? :)
> He is sometimes a useful point of reference for scholarly works, about solipsistic
> thought
But anyone with a scanner and an OCR program can do the same. Or even if
one has enough time in mommie's computer closet, and has accidentally
run across how to cut and paste, can also do the same... It is very
close to being like the infinite number of monkeys typing on an infinite
number of typewriters, usually turns out an infinite amount of garble,
but occasionally a line or two of Shel Silverstein (he wrote the Johnny
Cash song: "A Boy named Sue", which originally was written for Dolly
Partin and was titled: "A Girl named Robert!) appears...
Usually this kind of thing is an indication of some kind of
intelligence... but in Robby's case, it only proves that the electricity
is still on and Robby is still quivering from a facial attack by Spanish
Eddy and his pocket banana!
> (and the movie reviews).
Well, IMHO they haven't made a real movie since "The Attack of the Giant
Spiders" starring Barbara Hale, and Alan Hale, jr.!
StarWars and the other mediocre contemporary offerings are but buttered
puffery compared to some the real classics that Robby was too busy
waiting to be gestated to know about.
> Other than that, I suppose he is simply a powerless weakling out looking for an excuse.
Ouch... Now Allen! Just because Robby is a congenital asshole is no
reason to get tacky! :)
Anyway, as much as I like good conversation, it just seems to me that we
should go find some. I mean, how much more needs be said about little
Robby and his attempt to be repulsive?
Let's talk about something important... like the techniques that can be
used to create pleasant and enthralling conversation here at
<alt.solipsism>... 1st. I suggest that we find the switch to Robby
computer and turn that sucker off! That would be a start.
You know what is Black and Brown and would look really good on Robby? A
pack of Dobermans! :)
Anyway, do you think there is any chance of defusing this situation
before we get blamed for Robby taking is fully automatic UZZI with his
clip of multi colored Legos to school and wasting classmates from the
kindergarten ala' Columbine High School? Did you hear the Charlton
Heston is the new head of security there?
Anyway Allen, doesn't it seem a bit strange to you that in this
wonderful cyberland of the Internet... the worst thing that can happen
to some one is to be made fun of for being a schmuck.
In actuality, Robby doesn't seem like a bad sort... he probably just got
up on the wrong side of his padded cell. Given enough time... he may
even find a Shel Silverstein line or two himself...
Look in mirror Robert! :)
Bob Greer
Like, it would make a difference if you'd said "Private message - don't
read"? Jeez.
Tell you what, Allison: try to defend your post.
Better yet: improve your content in future posts.
Even better still: accurately criticize the content of my posts (as I have
criticized the content of yours).
Then I (and everyone who stops by here) might *actually* learn something
from you besides the same old, tiring story about your kidney.
- Bob Greer
--------------------------------
AllisonWonderland wrote in message <3741EF...@livingston.net>...
Bob Greer
CIRE wrote in message <37422B46...@netzero.net>...
>> >understand that the action/practice behind it is the basis for a
>> >technique of existence that is in response to a very specific situation,
>> >which has been an occasional topic of conversation in this NG, by dint
>> >of it being the condition in which AllisonWonderland, has found, is
>> >finding, and will continue to find himself, that is: Having been given
>> >an imminent-death sentence due to a genetic dysfunction that is
>> >destroying A/W's Liver (Primary Biliary Cirrhosis PBC).
>> >
>>
>> Mark Shuller's honest (and simple) question was... that you're running
out
>> of time to live?
>
>What makes you feel the need to always be such a bete noire?
>Are you just "testing" people to see what kind reaction you can get?
>I've seen your likeable side--as seldom as you show it to others--so I know
>you're not incapable of congeniality.
>What is it?
Accuracy first, congeniality second.
I have no incentive to "kiss ass" here. If someone is going to sidetrack
the topic, repeatedly, into his (or her) favorite brand of mind-fuck
occultism then he'd best get used to being challenged for it.
Frankly, I'm simply replying in kind: Allison insults our intelligence and
sincerity, so I'm acting as I should act - like an insulted person.
Additionally, this group is an international forum for the discussion of
solipsism - hopefully with the goal of refining and extending people's
appreciation of it. Allison (in particular, at present and often in the
past) apparently has a very different use for it in mind; one that is
incompatible with it's purpose. Basically, to repeatedly poop on the
warehouse floor so the Ravers will have to focus on him and spend so much
time cleaning that gook from their shoes that they'll give up and go home.
I notice, by the way, that you aren't actually defending what he was saying.
You're just objecting to my style. Are you a "style is more important than
content" kind of person, Cire?
>Do you & James have some sort of long-standing feud that goes back to the
early
>days of alt.solipsism?
>
I respond to sincerity with sincerity, humor with humor, accuracy with
accuracy, suggestions with etc..
And I respond to crap with anger that I have to sidestep it, and because it
discourages honest questions and contributions by solipsists who, like me,
want an
*honest* and *developing* forum but who, unlike me, are too polite to object
to the loss of their oasis.
The essential process of improving your understanding of solipsism, if your
essential philosophy is currently Realist, is to *remove* the errors (about
solipsism) that your Realism will supply whenever you try to think
in a solipsistic manner.
Removing errors is the key process, as I understand it. And, as a
solipsist, I consider Allison (and you, and myself) to be psychological
archetypes that are literally just ideas.
Objecting to Allison's BS is just part of my process of removing my false
ideas about solipsism. Why should I show "him" more courtesy than I show
myself in this regard?
>>
>>
>> If you don't have much time, try brevity.
>
>It's ironic that someone with an appentence for periphrastic dialogue
should
>place emphasis on brevity. :)
>
Oh, I'm pedantic. Redundancy is a good, good thing.
But then, I'm not bragging that the reason I'm long-winded is I'm dying
and have little time left to present the truth (while flinging buckets of
bullshit at the walls).
>>
>>
>> >There has been some conversation concerning the chemicals that are being
>> >ingested by AllisonWonderland... Prednisone in particular... and the
>> >reaction to the Prednisone is where the practice of "Let-Go Defensive
>> >Mysticism" is most efficacious.
>> >
>> >The Prednisone activates the Pituitary... The Pituitary, by it's
>> >functions, activates the Adrenals... And as a quite separate, effect,
>> >the pain of broken hip complications causes profound releases of
>> >Endorphins...
>>
>> >With this combination of ACTH, Adrenalin and Endorphins running rampant,
>> >the state of mind that AllisonWonderland experiences is much like
>> >WhiteWaterKyaking in the River of Time!
>> >
>>
>> Gosh, the ultimate natural high.
>>
>> Makes we wonder why people both with "teachers" and "gurus" - obviously,
the
>> Death Ward at the local hospital is the place to go for wisdom.
>
>You are a cruel bastard. What do you honestly feel you are proving with
this?
Allison's illness is his own business. If he wants to discuss it and get
some attention and commiseration, fine.
But he seems more inclined to break the topic, repeatedly, by forcing
everyone to sniff his soiled bandages.
Pity only goes so far.
>Do
>you enjoy sticking a metaphorical knife into someone's side? I mean, it's
bad
>enough making light of someone's impending demise; it's downright
iniquitous to
>scorn someone while doing it.
Someone's demise?
This is alt.solipsism: and you, he (and I) are figments of my imagination.
Life is change, and there is no death, only the illusion thereof.
If you're stressed that you're losing a friend, then that's quite human and
humane. But weeping because of death, per se, in anyone argues strongly
that you don't appreciate the advantages of solipsism.
If Allison et. al. wasn't sidetracking and misinforming you (and everyone
else) about solipsism then you, and he, would both be better off.
Is he dying? I couldn't really say; certainly it's what he is inclined to
talk about here. That's all I know about his condition. He might be a
healthy fellow, in fact. Who knows? The only *evidence* that he is sick is
that he whines about it and demands that everyone attend to it with
him. Some sick people (especially very old ones) do act that way. If this
is the case, he should switch his monologues to "alt.sick.dying-well" or
"alt.sick.dying-well.moderated." (Very few people post there, too, so he
should feel right at home.)
Really, your issue here seems to be *your* stress that derives from what
*he* says about *himself.* The worst thing I've done here, recently, is to
remind you of "the facts of the matter", i.e., that he (and you) are going
to die, and that most of the people in the world (including those who have
met you) could hardly care less. Some, in fact, will probably be *glad*
about it. (That's "Realism," Cire.) And, of course, that
neither Allison nor your mother nor any of the things you love and need are
actually "there for you" - as you will find when you finally hear your own
life choke out in your throat and you find you're all alone...
Really, now, death itself isn't a tragedy. Hell, consider the obvious
alternative: eternal old age... Do you recall the Greek myth about that?
A woman asked for, and received, eternal life, but not eternal youth. How
miserable (and horrid to look upon) she eventually became.
>It's becoming obvious you're nothing but a
>misanthropic bugbear always looking for a fight.....
>
Hey, I'm just plucking weeds from the communal garden. Making room for the
veggies to grown down and up.
Not my fault if you love weeds. But, if you really want them, why not start
your *own* little patch? Then let 'em flourish there.
How about:
alt.allison.wonderland.is.here.everyone.please.listen.to.me.Im.dying ?
That about says it all, and anyone who visits there will know exactly what's
going to be served up.
But solipsism is a fabulous philosophy that takes you "through the looking
glass"; and whining about your death at alt.solipsism is as
reasonable as spending all your time at a rave whining about a run in
your new stockings. Like, who cares! It's time to dance, honey child! And
if you *can't* or *won't* do so then stay quietly on the sidelines and nurse
your drink until the show's over.
Your life's just an illusion anyway... if your regret is that you'll soon be
ammonia and carbon bits then the problem isn't that you're dying (heck,
we're *all* doing that!), it's that you aren't a solipsist.
>>
>>
>> >A word of caution here: One might think that this kind of drug reaction
>> >would be less than efficacious in facilitating the search for the nature
>> >of the solipsistic existence, because it would artificially alter the
>> >perception of existence by the mind perceiving the sensory information
>> >of the existence in which it finds itself...
>> >
>>
>> Artificially? Nothing is truly "artificial" if nothing is truly "real."
>> (This *is* alt.solipsism, remember!)
>
>>
>>
>> And perception can't be altered by drugs: drugs are within the
hallucination
>> that comprises "you"; they can't influence it, they're just a part of it.
>> They're archetypes.
>
>Just how do you define perception Bob?
>Certainly changes are taking place with
>perception when influenced by drugs,
That's not so according to the solipsistic philosophy. You're objection
assumes causality and you've assumed (like Allison) that you are *within* a
world that will exist without you. You assume that there is a viewer and
something to be viewed, and that the viewer can somehow insert flaws into
it's view of the whatever-it-is that it's viewing.
All of those assumptions are Realist assumptions. There's not a solipsistic
mouse to be found anywhere in that house!
Furthermore, I think it's obvious my statements were overtly a-causal and
comprise a
refocus on solipsism. Trying to interpret my solipsistic statements with
Realist assumptions is stupid: Realism and solipsism are *incommensurable*.
You can't validly judge the truth or falsity of either sort of idea
according to the standards of the other.
> and there's a simple demonstable way to
>verify it.
>Need I explain how?
>
Oh, please do!
What we're going to get here, folks, is probably a repeat of Ben Johnson's
"proof" that the world is real: he kicked a rock and said "See! That
proves it's real!" I suspect that the demonstration here will be along the
lines of "Eat a drug or a poison - notice that you think differently now?
That proves the drug/poison *caused* changes in your thinking."
But actually, it proves nothing of that sort at all, of course. Your mind
is a flux of perceptions and ideas; the inclusion of a statistically rare
perception - called a "drug" - may be followed by the inclusion of other
statistically rare sequences of ideas and perceptions - called "tripping"
perhaps - but the fact of one
preceding the other does not prove that one caused the other. That's basic
to solipsism. Get that, and you've got a major principle of this particular
philosophy solidly in hand.
Of course, not that I've said this - who knows what we'll get? Let's wait
and see!
>>
>
>>
>>
>> And "the mind" cannot find itself "in an existence": your mind *is* your
>> existence, so it can't be "in it".
>
>>
>>
>> However, if you *want* solipsistic sacraments, you'll do better with $20
for
>> Spanish Eddy down the block than by breaking your leg or rotting inside.
>
>>
>>
>> Really, you should try solipsism someday, just for a change of pace,
>> Allison. Dying wouldn't worry you nearly so much if you thought
>> solipsistically.
You see: there *is* a kind purpose to this. (Several, in fact.) Potentially
kind, I mean: if
we're lucky, a little "tough love" at the start is all that will be
required. Perhaps he's actually dying and just freaking out about it; there
*are* ways to help him, in that case.
Or perhaps Allison hates solipsism (for whatever reason) and is using this
chance to repress it. (Historically speaking, that sort of thing happens
all the time.) And, frankly, this is quite likely, it seems. In which
case, I see no reason to alter my opinion of his behavior here.
And notice, Cire, that I did *not* object to *anything* in Allison's posts
(or
yours) that seemed (even potentially) solipsistic. It's not his experiences
that I'm objecting to; it's his deliberate misstatements about the
philosophy
and life-style of solipsism, and about the effective tools for enhancing
solipsism and synchronicity awareness.
As the Rev. Jesse Jackson liked to say when he was running for the
Presidential candidacy: "If not me, then who? If not now, then when?"
- Bob Greer
----------------------------------------------------
"In its origin, and in its greatest representatives, Mysticism appears in
history as the conception of men whose piety has been won after long
conflict, whose thoughts have been dissected by a very keen inner
scepticism, whose single-minded devotion to an abstraction has resulted from
a vast experience of the painful complications of life, and whose utter
empiricism is the outcome of a severe discipline, whereby they have learned
to distrust ideas. The technical philosophical mystics are the men who, in
general, began by being realists. They learned to doubt. They have doubted
through and through. Whenever they choose to appear as discursive thinkers,
they are keen and merciless dialecticians. Their reasoning as such is
negative. What they discover is that Realism is infected, so to speak, with
profound contradictions. Hereby they are led to a new view of what it is to
be."
- by Prof. Josiah Royce,
in "The World And The Individual"
(Lecture 2: "Realism and Mysticism in Thought")
copyright 1899 by The Macmillan Company
----------------------------------------------------
Bob Greer
Allen Crider wrote in message <3741FF99...@siriux.com>...
>
>
>AllisonWonderland wrote:
>
>> > Psychologically, Prednisone is just bubble gum compared to the typical
Wicce
>> > witches-brew.
>
some
>kind of DEA Fed cruising the net 'cause he got a grant to do Federal
Internet
>Outreach and Apprehension.
>
Really, is that how that do it? Interesting if so - but how would you know?
Insider info, perhaps?
Actually, the internet is a free speach forum. And even the DEA has
admitted (in print, in pamphlets displayed in schools and grocery stores,
etc.) that psychedelic drugs induce religious experiences. (Although they
phrased it carefully: "many psychedelic drug users report having religious
and mystical experiences while using these drugs."
In any case, the question "Are LSD and mescaline truly religious
sacraments?" has been answered conclusively "YES!" by many well-structured
scientific studies.
Maybe you want people to be afraid to speak their minds; or maybe you're
genuinely afraid of the subject (for whatever reason) yourself. But I'm not
at all worried about it. I've spoken like this for years, and know people
who've spoken even more openly (and for decades), and the US government
continues to respect our right to do so. That is (in part) why I'm proud to
be American.
>Wicca sucks.
Wicca is a midieval word. It means "a male witch" and you've probably
confused it with a modern women's cult that calls itself by that same name.
(The midieval word for female witches was "wicce" - but perhaps the soft
"-a" ending appealed to the modern women because so many women in this
region of the globe end their first names with that sound.
The witches were simply the remains of the Celtic/Gaulish religion after
Europe was conquered by the Roman Empire and the Church of Rome. From what
I've been able to find about the *actual* beliefs of that religion
(principally Druid-ism), it was quite solipsistic in parts, and quite
Hindu-like in other parts. (The latter is unsurprising since the Hindu
religion was imported into India by the Aryans who were, as far as I know at
present, a branch of the Gauls.)
After the Druid structure was destroyed by the Romans (who wrote terrific
lies about their religious practices, just as they lied about the early
Christians), the Gauls retained their focus on the use of psychedelic
sacraments for their religious practice. The Gauls who used psychedelics
for sacramental reasons, instead of purely for recreation, were classified
as "witches" by the Church of Rome. (The Church of Rome was the sectarian
half of the Roman Empire's government; it survived when the Empire collapsed
because it, unlike the civil sectarian structure, provided no services to
people but merely taxed and persecuted them to retain power over them. For
the Church of Rome theologians, the old question "Is it better to be loved
or feared?" had a simple answer: it's better to be feared. So they
maintained an Inquisition - called "The Holy Office" - to kill psychedelian
Gauls and only ended it in the 1800's, shortly before the US Civil War,
because the were forced to do so by sectarian govenments.)
Say, it's interesting that you say "Wicca sucks" - would you care to explain
that?
>But that's beside the point. Mr. Bob is unable to describe any
>experiences with sunstances or without.
>
Oh, I've given some examples. Although if you'd be willing to tell me more
about what it is you need vis-a-vis "experiences with instances" I'll be
quite glad to *try* to provide some.
Of course, any experience can be understood in both Realist and Solipsist
terms. So "experiences" are not either Realist or Solipsist. Only
*interpretations* can be of such a sort.
Frankly, I've deliberately avoided examples, as it were, because the most
impressive ones are also the most subtle and unintrusive ones. And I
really see nothing *conclusive* about a simple rendition of my
synchronicity. However, I could certainly give lots of examples of it, or
describe the afternoon I became enlightenend, etc.. No problem.
I just don't want to distract from the most important issue: clearly
discussing the philosophy itself, with it's implications and limitations.
The world is filled with people who occasionally think solipsistically - and
then forget or misinterpret it afterwards because those ideas just don't fit
with what they were taught to be the truth by their teachers.
>. He is sometimes a useful point of
>reference for scholarly works about solipsistic thought (and the movie
reviews).
Really? Which of those scholarly works about solipsism did you find useful,
Allen?
By the way, my occasional "lectures" about solipsism are, in simple fact, as
(or more) scholarly than anything you'll find in your library. If you
appreciated those other works then I hope you also took the time to
appreciate mine.
(But people so often devalue what they receive for free, particularly from
someone who they consider on their own social level. Sigh.)
Sadly, some of the best solipsistic movies were cut (when they were
transferred to videotape) by people who apparently either did not
understand, or who despised, solipsism. So a lot of really fine solipsistic
movie-craft is now unavailable. Two examples: "The Labrynth" (which was
changed into a Muppet's movie by the cutters), and "Being There" (with Peter
Sellers. Watch sometime, if you see the original movie feature, the
television sets. They are all synchronistic with whatever the gardener,
Chauncy, is thinking at the moment. And he's one solipsistic fellow, I'll
say!)
>Other than that, I suppose he is simply a powerless weakling out looking
for an excuse.
Hey, I *like* that!
But really, if you want some examples of "solipsism" in action then be
specific about what you want, and I'll try to give you some examples from my
life, and a few related to me by others.
Best wishes,
Bob
Bob Greer
You continue to amaze me!
Now: can you read a book in the looking glass?
- Bob Greer
Bob Greer
Wicce
>> > witches-brew.
>
some
>kind of DEA Fed cruising the net 'cause he got a grant to do Federal
Internet
>Outreach and Apprehension.
>
Really, is that how that do it? Interesting if so - but how would you know?
Insider info, perhaps?
Actually, the internet is a free speech forum. And even the DEA has
admitted (in print, in pamphlets displayed in schools and grocery stores,
etc.) that psychedelic drugs induce religious experiences. (Although they
phrased it carefully: "many psychedelic drug users report having religious
and mystical experiences while using these drugs."
In any case, the question "Are LSD and mescaline truly religious
sacraments?" has been answered conclusively "YES!" by many well-structured
scientific studies.
Maybe you want people to be afraid to speak their minds; or maybe you're
genuinely afraid of the subject (for whatever reason) yourself. But I'm not
at all worried about it. I've spoken like this for years, and know people
who've spoken even more openly (and for decades), and the US government
continues to respect our right to do so. That is (in part) why I'm proud to
be American.
>Wicca sucks.
Wicca is a medieval word. It means "male witches" and you've probably
confused it with a modern women's cult that calls itself by that same name.
(The medieval word for female witches was "wicce" - but perhaps the soft
"-a" ending appealed to the modern women because so many women in this
region of the globe end their first names with that sound. So they call
themselves "male witches" (wicca) and mispronounce it by saying it as it
appears in modern English. Actually, the "wicc" part of both words is more
correctly pronounces "witch" - big surprise there, eh?
The witches were simply the remains of the Celtic and Gaulish religion after
Europe was conquered by the Roman Empire and the Church of Rome. From what
I've been able to find about the *actual* beliefs of that religion
(principally Druid-ism), it was quite solipsistic in parts, and quite
Hindu-like in other parts. (The latter is unsurprising since the Hindu
religion was imported into India by the Aryans who were, as far as I know at
present, a branch of the Gauls.)
After the Druid structure was destroyed by the Romans (who wrote terrific
lies about their religious practices, just as they lied about the early
Christians), the Gauls retained their focus on the use of psychedelic
sacraments for their religious practice. The Gauls who used psychedelics
for sacramental reasons, instead of purely for recreation, were classified
as "witches" by the Church of Rome. (The Church of Rome was the sectarian
half of the Roman Empire's government; it survived when the Empire collapsed
because it, unlike the civil sectarian structure, provided no services to
people but merely taxed and persecuted them to retain power over them. For
the Church of Rome theologians, the old question "Is it better to be loved
or feared?" had a simple answer: it's better to be feared. So they
maintained an Inquisition - called "The Holy Office" - to kill psychedelian
Gauls and only ended it in the 1800's, shortly before the US Civil War,
because the were forced to do so by sectarian governments.)
The Celts and Gauls used powerful psychedelic sacraments at all their major
religious festivals, as much as they could handle at once (and then some
more). Their major religious events, overseen incidentally by their Druid
class, were essentially month-long psychedelic-and-sex orgies. (These were
timed, by their calendars, to follow planting or harvest, when they had
plenty of free time.) If you'd like to see a brief overview of their
party-hearty attitude then start here:
http://www.globalideasbank.org/crespec/CS-178.HTML
Say, it's interesting that you say "Wicca sucks" - would you care to explain
that? I've heard that before, but never from someone so literate; now I can
learn the ideas *behind* that assertion.
>But that's beside the point. Mr. Bob is unable to describe any
>experiences with sunstances or without.
>
Oh, I've given some examples. Although if you'd be willing to tell me more
about what it is you need vis-a-vis "experiences with instances" I'll be
quite glad to *try* to provide some. Perhaps other people here will too!
(It's too bad you kept your curiosity in check for so long! How much fun
you might have had with the people who already came and left!)
Of course, any experience can be understood in both Realist and Solipsist
terms. So "experiences" are not either Realist or Solipsist. Only
*interpretations* can be of such a sort.
Frankly, I've deliberately avoided examples, as it were, because the most
impressive ones are also the most subtle and unintrusive ones. And I
really see nothing *conclusive* about a simple rendition of my
synchronicity. However, I could certainly give lots of examples of it, or
describe the afternoon I became enlightened, etc.. No problem.
I just don't want to distract from the most important issue: clearly
discussing the philosophy itself, with it's implications and limitations.
The world is filled with people who occasionally think solipsistically - and
then forget or misinterpret it afterwards because those ideas just don't fit
with what they were taught to be the truth by their teachers.
Although, on reflection, I think *did* post a few descriptions of my own
sacrament use, in this group... late last year, I think. If you're really
curious then why not (for a starter) use Deja News to get a list of my posts
to alt.solipsism from there. Some of the early ones, on this account, refer
to sacraments.
I stopped posting such things because other people seemed afraid to reply in
kind. ("The Net Police! The Net Police!" Yeah, sure. Uh huh. The Easter
Bunny's got a badge now.)
Remember: Freedom of Speech isn't a freedom unless you *use* it!
(And nobody's going to haul you out of bed some night because of anything
non-revolutionary and non-violent that you've posted. Face it: you can
*say* anything - Internet posts aren't proof of *anything* but your ability
to type.)
>. He is sometimes a useful point of
>reference for scholarly works about solipsistic thought (and the movie
reviews).
Really? Which of those scholarly works about solipsism did you find useful,
Allen?
By the way, my occasional "lectures" about solipsism are, in simple fact, as
(or more) scholarly than anything you'll find in your library. If you
appreciated those other works then I hope you also took the time to
appreciate mine.
(But people so often devalue what they receive for free, particularly from
someone who they consider on their own social level. Sigh.)
Sadly, some of the best solipsistic movies were cut (when they were
transferred to videotape) by people who apparently either did not
understand, or who despised, solipsism. So a lot of really fine solipsistic
movie-craft is now unavailable. Two examples: "The Labyrinth" (which was
changed into a Muppet's movie by the cutters), and "Being There" (with Peter
Sellers. Watch sometime, if you see the original movie feature, the
television sets. They are all synchronistic with whatever the gardener,
Chauncy, is thinking at the moment. And he's one solipsistic fellow, I'll
say!)
>Other than that, I suppose he is simply a powerless weakling out looking
for an excuse.
Hey, I *like* that!
But really, if you want some examples of "solipsism" in action then be
specific about what you want, and I'll try to give you some examples from my
life, and a few related to me by others.
Best wishes,
Bob
PS
I see now, while spell-checking, that you probably meant "substances" when
you wrote "sunstances" - I thought you were trying to write "instances" so
that's how I answered you.
"Substances" is entirely too vague - that's anything chemical I suppose.
Granite, water, wood-chips, solar flares. If you want to know about "drugs"
then *ask* about that. But drugs, overall, aren't the issue. Speed, for
example, will win you a mammoth case of paranoid schizophrenia if you use
enough all at once. And we can see, from Allison's posts, what too much
Prednisone will do to your brain. I don't see the *relevance* of either
"substances" or "drugs" to solipsism.
However, if you're wondering about psychedelic sacraments, hey, then raise
that topic! I'm always glad to discuss The True Host with someone who is
sincere about the subject! (As long as the focus stays on solipsism as a
philosophy... <a wide Cheshire Cat grin>)
And of course, you need to keep this in mind: the "chemical state" of your
brain does not justify or invalidate any belief system you might have then.
Every idea must be judged on it's own merits; otherwise, you fall afoul of
several major logical fallacies and, philosophically speaking, "crap out."
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
--
"This time Alice waited patiently until it chose to speak again. In a minute
or two the Caterpillar took the hookah out of its mouth and yawned once or
twice, and shook itself. Then it got down off the mushroom, and crawled away
in the grass, merely remarking as it went, `One side will make you grow
taller, and the other side will make you grow shorter.'
`One side of what? The other side of what?' thought Alice to herself.
`Of the mushroom,' said the Caterpillar, just as if she had asked it aloud;
and in another moment it was out of sight.
Alice remained looking thoughtfully at the mushroom for a minute, trying to
make out which were the two sides of it; and as it was perfectly round, she
found this a very difficult question. However, at last she stretched her
arms round it as far as they would go, and broke off a bit of the edge with
each hand.
`And now which is which?' she said to herself, and nibbled a little of the
right-hand bit to try the effect: the next moment she felt a violent blow
underneath her chin: it had struck her foot!
She was a good deal frightened by this very sudden change, but she felt that
there was no time to be lost, as she was shrinking rapidly; so she set to
work at once to eat some of the other bit. Her chin was pressed so closely
against her foot, that there was hardly room to open her mouth; but she did
it at last, and managed to swallow a morsel of the left-hand bit.
`Come, my head's free at last!' said Alice in a tone of delight..."
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
--
Valerie
wrought on alt.solipsism !
I must say it's very funny to read. But it sounds more like children
quibbling...
Well anyway I'm happy to see you're all alive and kicking !
cheers
Val
AllisonWonderland
> Well, you can count to two, Allison!
my breath till you finally get to where you can too, a guy could pass
out from that! :)
> You continue to amaze me!
Spanish Eddy doesn't choke you with his pocket banana before then, you
may do something to amaze me, such as learning how to start at least
"acting" like a regular likable person such as Rick, or Eric, or
Allen... but again, I'm not going to hold my breath till you do, a guy
could pass out from that! :)
> Now: can you read a book in the looking glass?
Not while you're using it to look at the monkey, Booby! :)
Anyway Booby, it has become quite tiresomeo sparring with you because
you present so little challenge, but someone has to do the dirty work.
Your rancid and boring take on things which you so foolishly believe to
be so valuable fails to measure up to even the title "Bullshit". It
lacks scope, depth, width, content and clarity.
Maybe if you could overcome your Attention Deficit Disorder, that you
wouldn't have to settle for brevity in others while waxing superfluous
youself.
I know that stringing more than just a couple of monosyllables together
is a real effort for you, but stick with it... you may even start to
have some success before the next decade is over when you finally
graduate elementary school...
I realize that dreaming in Black&White, whilst all around you the dreams
of others proliferate in luxurious spectral profusion, must be real
drag...
But the good news is: That you insist that because you don't see the
colors that they don't exist. Why is this good news? Because it just
assails me with gales of ecstatic cosmic laughter and joy... Life is a
drag for you!!! <GRINNNNNNNNN>... It shows in the "attitude" that you
have toward it, and to add to the absurdity, you continue to insist that
it makes you happy!!!! Well, Booby, I'm just tickled Gray for you! :)
And Booby, have you noticed that you have yet to address the issue of
the scientific use of the word Divine? It makes us wonder if: You are
just chickenshit?; or are you: Hoping it will go away if you ignore it
long enough?
The only way that you are going to get out of this one, Booby is by
finding a way to put words to the concession that you have already made
in your heart that prompted you to decide to try to ignore the issue (is
there anyone here who thinks Robby wouldn't be pushing it with all his
(miniscule) might, if he thought that he was possibly right?).
Here is what is really happening... You are suffering from an almost
incurable and close to terminal case of "Oral-Podia" (that's the having
of the propensity to stick one's foot in one's mouth!). :) Anyway, all I
can tell you is that the next time that you decide to demonstrate your
famous, patented "Greerian Oral-Podia Position", to us all, that you:
Take off the sneakers that you used to step in all that mystical
"bull-shit" that you claim you found in your warehouse before inserting
your podia into your orality... :) And don't forget to brush your teeth.
And Booby! Have you noticed that instead of addressing issues that have
arisen between us by replying to me directly, that instead, you reply to
me with only little snide asides, such as the ones in the post to which
this post is a reply?
And Booby! Have you noticed that you only take real umbrage with me by
"sniping", while you are discussing your little, attenuated, nicely
boxed, plastic, B&W, limited, Reader's Digest, condensed version of
solipsism with OTHERS in the group and never with me?
And Booby! Have you noticed that you seem to be admitting to and
demonstrating the losing of your cool quite a bit lately? You seem to be
quite even tempered, (always pissed) about something? What's wrong??? Is
someone starting to get "de mean widdo kid's" goat? :) Well, this comes
under the well known title of: "Can dish is out, but can't take it when
it gets dished back?"
Well my little Boobala, you are going to get an "F" for (e)Ffort, but it
isn't because you aren't trying... because you are close to being VERY
trying! But close only counts in horseshoes and handgrenades, luckily
you seem to the type that would settle for "close but no cigar", rather
than take the time and effort to really see what one could do with one's
potential.
Not long ago I received a post from a long time friend who had been
lurking at <alt.solipsism> and had seen some of your posts, and took the
time to share them with me. The post from that friend included these
paragraphs:
"Bob (Greer) never actually won an argument or made a valid personal
contribution. He was just there for the argueing and (he) wore people
down with his voluminous attrition. By being abrasive and evasive and
attacking points that weren't being made he caused a multilateral
disengagement (which he took as victory !)"
"Reading The Dictionary of Philosophy is like reading Bob's manifesto.
The guy has been reading the final word on 'How to argue'."
"In amongst the definitions of standard philosophies are the exeptions
and
contentions and the differing ways to argue and contradict these ideas."
"Bob has been copying it all from there. Even his latin phrases come
from the
section headed 'fallacies'. There is literally a huge list of ways to
win an
arguement. Simply look up your opponent's key phrase and see which
fallacies
apply."
And so now Booby, what are we to conclude? That: You get your solipsism
from a The Reader's Digest Dictionary of Philosophy?
Like I said... you may know all the words, and you might even be able to
hum the tune... but my widdo biddy Booby buddy, it is obvious as the
bullshit mushing out around that sneaker that is lodged so firmly
between your pouty little orisbiscular orisis that: You still "Haven't
yet learned THE SONG!"
Anyway (yawn)... I have taken much too much time and care composing this
post... And have decided that I am going to have to go do something as a
change of pace... something that will excite and uplift me rather than
bore me to tears such as dealing with Booby does...
Everyone has to believe in something... I believe I'm going to go lie
down and take a nap!
And so Booby, have a wonderscanned day...
And Judi of the Happy Heart... do me a favor and womp Booby with the
Bundt Pan a couple of times just for good measure!
Thanks... he needed that! :)
Bob Greer
Valerie wrote in message <3742BF...@teva.fr>...
>Oh My ! I've been away for a few weeks and it seems like havoc has been
>wrought on alt.solipsism !
>I must say it's very funny to read. But it sounds more like children
>quibbling...
>
Oh, it's no biggy.
I called Blunderland's phony-solipsism BS again, so now they're raising a
lot of dust to hide what I said. <chuckle>
However, it all engraved permanently now in cyberspace; anyone searching for
info about solipsism will find more good info with a simple word search!
And that, really, is the point.
>Well anyway I'm happy to see you're all alive and kicking !
>
Yeah, "but they're all ganging up on me mommy!"
HA!
>cheers
>Val
Best,
Bob Greer
Bob Greer
Say, Al, how much do they pay you to muck up this group?
I'm just curious - are you getting the standard wage... or do you work on a
bonus system? (Penny a word perhaps?)
My only regret about "firing you up" is that you always avoid the real topic
afterwards - your claims about solipsism.
Well, perhaps your reasoning is just too subtle for me, eh? Everyone but
ol' Bob knows you're right <chuckle>. Poor ol' Bob!
Well, I gotta go - I'm writing a 3D terrain mapping program with a head's-up
control panel, in Java and VRML. Sadly, the best of the VRML browsers is
buggy, so I'm helping their tech rep to debug the sections of their software
that I'll need to use for my program. (They're putting these corrections
into the next release of their browser.)
So if you'd like to debate about solipsism sometime, in the usual academic
style (i.e., not with a lot of whining about your kidney problems etc.),
I'll kick your ass at it.
Bon voyage,
Bob Greer
PS Don't believe everything you're told about me - I *do* lie
occasionally. One of my favorite ways of testing people is to let them test
me; they show me their covert intentions once they think they're "on top."
<smirk>
Hmm... maybe I should rejoin MENSA. It's so hard to get a good debate going
in the "real world." Nah, that can wait until I complete my Master's
Degree.
AllisonWonderland wrote in message <374342...@livingston.net>...
Heart Happy
>
> And Judi of the Happy Heart... do me a favor and womp Booby with the
> Bundt Pan a couple of times just for good measure!
>
After he had journeyed,
And his feet were sore,
And he was tired.
He came upon an orange grove,
And he rested.
And he lay in the cool.
And while he rested,
He took to himself an orange and tasted it,
And it was good.
And he felt the earth to his spine,
And he asked.
And he saw the tree above him,
And the stars,
And the veins in the leaf,
And the light,
And the balance,
And he saw magnificent perfection,
Whereon he thought of himself in balance,
And he knew who he was.
Just open your eyes and realize,
The way it's always been.
Just open your mind and you will find,
The way it's always been.
Just open your heart,
And that's a start.
And he thought of those he angered,
For he was not a violent man.
And he thought of those he hurt,
For he was not a cruel man.
And he thought of those he frightened,
For he was not an evil man.
And he understood,
He understood himself.
Upon this he saw that when he was of anger,
Or knew hurt,
Or felt fear,
It was because he was not understanding.
And he learned compassion.
And with his eye of compassion,
He saw his enemies like unto himself.
And he learned love.
And then, he was answered.
Just open your eyes and realize,
The way it's always been.
Just open your mind and you will find,
The way it's always been.
Just open your heart,
And that's a start.
Allen Crider
Bob Greer wrote:
>
> Allen Crider wrote in message <3741FF99...@siriux.com>...
> >
> >
> >AllisonWonderland wrote:
> >
> >> > Psychologically, Prednisone is just bubble gum compared to the typical
> Wicce
> >> > witches-brew.
> >
> >Yep... That was the line right there. He rants about substances like he is
> some
> >kind of DEA Fed cruising the net 'cause he got a grant to do Federal
> Internet
> >Outreach and Apprehension.
> >
>
> Really, is that how that do it? Interesting if so - but how would you know?
> Insider info, perhaps?
Maybe. At the very least, it is a picture.
> Maybe you want people to be afraid to speak their minds; or maybe you're
> genuinely afraid of the subject (for whatever reason) yourself.
I'm just doing my practice. I read your response to Allison's post, and I really
think you are an ass with the attitude. It is easily duplicated.
> But I'm not
> at all worried about it. I've spoken like this for years, and know people
> who've spoken even more openly (and for decades), and the US government
> continues to respect our right to do so. That is (in part) why I'm proud to
> be American.
The point is you haven't spoken of experiencial insights from substances. The
book knowledge about what psychedelics do is useless in the context of
solipsism. They merely become objects, passive facts. Like anything else... the
back of a cereal box, for instance.
Do you have a peyote song? Have you ever experienced a lengthy state of samadhi
after taking adam? Is letting go to illusion while having a magic mushroom
experience useful to the practice of letting go of the ego?
By the way, nationalism sucks. It is an outgrowth of simian colony behavior.
> >Wicca sucks.
> Oh, I've given some examples. Although if you'd be willing to tell me more
> about what it is you need vis-a-vis "experiences with instances" I'll be
> quite glad to *try* to provide some.
How about: Drugs and lucid dreaming? And, is the practice of lucid dreaming a
way out of the solipsistic dream experience itself?
> Frankly, I've deliberately avoided examples, as it were, because the most
> impressive ones are also the most subtle and unintrusive ones. And I
> really see nothing *conclusive* about a simple rendition of my
> synchronicity. However, I could certainly give lots of examples of it, or
> describe the afternoon I became enlightenend, etc.. No problem.
I think that would be interesting.
> >. He is sometimes a useful point of
> >reference for scholarly works about solipsistic thought (and the movie
> reviews).
>
> Really? Which of those scholarly works about solipsism did you find useful,
> Allen?
I don't remember which, because I honestly don't study solipsism. I only
remember the impression I felt reading a piece you paraphrased.
> >Other than that, I suppose he is simply a powerless weakling out looking
> for an excuse.
>
> Hey, I *like* that!
It works great. It sometimes is much easier to be mean, isn't it?
Allen Crider
AllisonWonderland wrote:
>
> Dear Allen Crider,
> Hello again Allen! :) How have you been? I feel like I may have found
> out how to get you to post more here more often... all I gotta do is rub
> Robby and poof... you appear like a djinn!
My ears stand up when I sniff conflict on this here internet, James. :-)
I see you've been very busy with getting all your stuff at home together and in line.
Did that gold-leaf table project you mentioned some time ago work out? Did you
wreck any of the gold foil trying to put it on? (I have an idea for a project,
but don't feel like wasting a lot of money figuring out how to lay on gold leaf).
>
> > AllisonWonderland wrote:
> > > > Psychologically, Prednisone is just bubble gum compared to the typical Wicce
> > > > witches-brew.
> Actually Allen, this was a bit of blurt by Robby.
>
> > Yep... That was the line right there. He rants about substances like he is some
> > kind of DEA Fed cruising the net 'cause he got a grant to do Federal Internet
> > Outreach and Apprehension.
> It used to be, back before doping became such a teeny-bopper type thing
> (You know... the way Robby does it), that the only ones who even
> mentioned it were either so new as to be over-whelmed by the experience
> out of the newness of the endeavor, or were just so un-cool that they
> had to talk a good game just to try to make everyone think that they
> were some kind of "heavy"... I suspect that if it is even either one of
> these that is afflicting Robby, that it is probably the latter.
>
> > Wicca sucks.
> Is that what he is into? If it is, he is simply too far back to worry
> about. "Pointy shoes and Peaked hat, Magic spell, and thing like that!"?
> (Buffy St.Marie). If this is true... and I have no reason to believe it
> is not... then he is just plain dummmmm.
> He probably think that Dow Nunder is the Austrailian StockMarket! :)
>
> > But that's beside the point.
> Like both of his ears! :)
>
> > Mr. Bob is unable to describe any experiences with substances or without.
> Why do you think they call him "Dope"? :)
>
> > He is sometimes a useful point of reference for scholarly works, about solipsistic
> > thought
> But anyone with a scanner and an OCR program can do the same. Or even if
> one has enough time in mommie's computer closet, and has accidentally
> run across how to cut and paste, can also do the same...
And I am to this day ragging on those 'Treyabots over that method!
> > Other than that, I suppose he is simply a powerless weakling out looking for an excuse.
> Ouch... Now Allen! Just because Robby is a congenital asshole is no
> reason to get tacky! :)
I think the 'powerless weakling' one is a fine line. Guaranteed to hit home,
because we all have felt that sometimes during our lifetime.
> Anyway, as much as I like good conversation, it just seems to me that we
> should go find some. I mean, how much more needs be said about little
> Robby and his attempt to be repulsive?
>
> Let's talk about something important... like the techniques that can be
> used to create pleasant and enthralling conversation here at
> <alt.solipsism>... 1st. I suggest that we find the switch to Robby
> computer and turn that sucker off! That would be a start.
>
> You know what is Black and Brown and would look really good on Robby? A
> pack of Dobermans! :)
>
> Anyway, do you think there is any chance of defusing this situation
> before we get blamed for Robby taking is fully automatic UZZI with his
> clip of multi colored Legos to school and wasting classmates from the
> kindergarten ala' Columbine High School? Did you hear the Charlton
> Heston is the new head of security there?
>
> Anyway Allen, doesn't it seem a bit strange to you that in this
> wonderful cyberland of the Internet... the worst thing that can happen
> to some one is to be made fun of for being a schmuck.
I wonder if somebody can blush from this kind of embarrassment?
>
> In actuality, Robby doesn't seem like a bad sort... he probably just got
> up on the wrong side of his padded cell. Given enough time... he may
> even find a Shel Silverstein line or two himself...
>
> Look in mirror Robert! :)
Allen
CIRE
Heart Happy wrote:
> AllisonWonderland wrote:
> >
> > And Judi of the Happy Heart... do me a favor and womp Booby with the
> > Bundt Pan a couple of times just for good measure!
> >
:) Very nice Judi..........
Eric
CIRE
Bob Greer wrote:
> >What is it?
>
> Accuracy first, congeniality second.
Proficient dialogue entails accuracy, to be sure. But effective discourse also
demands composure & maturity of habitude. The second you gave into your
inhibitions to engage the opponent with impuissant tactics of puerile
belittlement & flitting pettifogging, you lost your credibility my friend.
>
>
> I have no incentive to "kiss ass" here.
How old are you Bob? This sounds like something a rebellious immature deviant
would say. Do you honestly fail to discern the differnence between "kissing ass"
and behaving like an intelligent, mature adult?
> If someone is going to sidetrack
> the topic, repeatedly, into his (or her) favorite brand of mind-fuck
> occultism then he'd best get used to being challenged for it.
I could easily challenge YOUR occultism on the same grounds. But challenging you
would be challenging everyone else here who subscribes to a solipsitic way of
thinking, so I'll leave it at that........
>
>
> Frankly, I'm simply replying in kind: Allison insults our intelligence and
> sincerity, so I'm acting as I should act - like an insulted person.
Call it what you like. But anyone who get's insulted so easily must feel that
his personal philosophy is standing on precarious ground. If you felt an
indubitable certitude with regard to your own solipsistic ideals, would the
conveyance of another's "insult" you so badly?
>
>
> Additionally, this group is an international forum for the discussion of
> solipsism - hopefully with the goal of refining and extending people's
> appreciation of it. Allison (in particular, at present and often in the
> past) apparently has a very different use for it in mind; one that is
> incompatible with it's purpose. Basically, to repeatedly poop on the
> warehouse floor so the Ravers will have to focus on him and spend so much
> time cleaning that gook from their shoes that they'll give up and go home.
And what is this "purpose"? Incompatible with what? I notice you say plainly
that James' use of solipsism is incompatible with an "as yet" unidentified
purpose, but you do not say that his solpsism IS incompatible, on which it
seemed your intitial ill humor was based.
>
>
> I notice, by the way, that you aren't actually defending what he was saying.
> You're just objecting to my style. Are you a "style is more important than
> content" kind of person, Cire?
I don't completely agree with either one of your "contents". My philosophy is
much more pragmatic & open-minded. :)
>
> And I respond to crap with anger that I have to sidestep it, and because it
> discourages honest questions and contributions by solipsists who, like me,
> want an
> *honest* and *developing* forum but who, unlike me, are too polite to object
> to the loss of their oasis.
I assume you're referring to the oasis of solipsism? Rather than fighting to
prevent the loss of "their" oasis, it seems to me you've taken to a desperate
verbal-bludgeoning strategy to keep this oasis as your very own....with no other
participation.
>
>
> The essential process of improving your understanding of solipsism, if your
> essential philosophy is currently Realist, is to *remove* the errors (about
> solipsism) that your Realism will supply whenever you try to think
> in a solipsistic manner.
Well...thanks for the gesture, but I'm not looking to be proselytized.
>
>
> Removing errors is the key process, as I understand it. And, as a
> solipsist, I consider Allison (and you, and myself) to be psychological
> archetypes that are literally just ideas.
Yes, and I believe you're absolutely correct...in part: our existence IS
psychological, but it's necessarily based upon material dynamics. Without
materialism, there can be no psychology. If you feel certain that "mind" is not
incumbent on a basal material brain, then be my guest and go have a lobotomy and
see if you walk away unscathed........
Eric
>
CIRE
Valerie wrote:
> Oh My ! I've been away for a few weeks and it seems like havoc has been
> wrought on alt.solipsism !
> I must say it's very funny to read. But it sounds more like children
> quibbling...
Doesn't it? I agree though, it is rather humorously entertaining. :)
Eric
>
>
> Well anyway I'm happy to see you're all alive and kicking !
Cum on back now, ya heer? :)
Eric
AllisonWonderland
> Blunderland's on a roll now!
> Say Al, how much do they pay you to muck up this group?
How much does WHO pay?, You mean you know the guys who pay to do stuff
like that? Is this the those guys that Allen was talking about when he
said that YOU were a kind of DEA Fed, cruising the net having a grant to
do Federal Internet Outreach and Apprehension?
> I'm just curious - are you getting the standard wage... or do you work on a
> bonus system? (Penny a word perhaps?)
Not on the Internet. When I write for pay, it is usually contractual.
And a penny a word is more what they pay novices and amateurs such as
yourself...
Sorry that I can't reveal what I make from writing instruction for
people on how to handle assholes such as yourself who can't get their
Cornucopia of Knowledge out of their rectal cavity, but if I told you
how much I make, you'd die of chlorophyl overdose from the "Green with
Envy" syndrome! :)
> My only regret about "firing you up" is that you always avoid the real topic
> afterwards - your claims about solipsism.
"We haven't yet begun to fight!" (John Paul Jones) Still I'm kicking
your ass all over the place. Look at the monkey in the mirror, Booby!
> Well, perhaps your reasoning is just too subtle for me.
Obviously, but in my infinite knowledge, I will take pity on you and
compensate for your inadequacies, not enough to do you any good
understand, but just enough to keep you in a position where your
shit-covered-sneaker can slip right in between your pursed labia when
ever I remind you that you don't want to discuss the scientific sense of
the word "Divine". :)
> Everyone but Bob knows you're right.
That seems to be the consensus of opinion... By George, I think you
finally got it! Like I said before, "Bingo, Even a broken clock is right
twice a day!" :)
> Well, I gotta go,
Well, don't go in the litterbox, because one of the kittens will
inevitably try to cover up a little turd such as your self.
> So if you'd like to debate about solipsism sometime, in the usual academic style
Is THAT what you THINK you are doing? Engaging in Academic Style Debate?
Hahahahahahahaha!
Oh, oh, oh... Laughter is so good for what ails ya!
Sometime you are a real riot Booby! Not often, but sometimes!
I just love it when someone comes around acting like you do... I love
watching my kittens play in the morning too... Of the two, you and the
kittens... The kittens are actually the more intellectual. They at least
know instinctually what they are doing... You obviously haven't a clue
as to what to do next and so you have to lamely use for authority what
was probably the toughest thing in life for you to accept which was the
inability to gain admission to the Aristocracy of the Intelligensia.
Hahahahahahaha, Ohhhhhhh Booby, what a delusion you living!
> (i.e., not with a lot of whining about your kidney problems),
I don't have any kidney problems! :) I believe that you meant Liver, but
you didn't know how to spell it. You knew it was one of those organ
"things" in there, didn't you, but you just didn't know which one it was
or how to spell it... Yow, Boobie... are you ever academic! :) Does that
mean you get your Nikes at Academy?
> I'll kick your ass at it.
Maybe if I squatted down reeeeaal low, you might TRY to kick my ass, but
remember this, cumsquirt, you are going to have to somehow dislodge your
poopy Nike from the upper end of your digestive tract before you can
even think about kicking ANYONE'S ass. And even then you might think
about bringing along a lunch, a dinner and maybe a candy bar, because
for a lightweight soprano such as yourself, this is going to be an all
day and all night job! :)
> PS Don't believe everything you're told about me - I *do* lie occasionally.
Like if all the girls at Vassar were laid end to end, "I wouldn't doubt
it in the least!" What surprises me though is the sheer amount of
conceit that you exhibit when you think that you know the difference!
> One of my favorite ways of testing people
Isn't this called "Trolling"?
> is to let them test me;
I have tested you... The little needle didn't EVEN move! You need
replacing, because there is nothing more useless than a dead hearing-aid
battery!
> they show me their covert intentions once they think they're "on top."
(you put the quote marks in the wrong place!) Wow, are you academic! :)
As for: " showing you my covert intentions, "once" I'm on top".... Just
let me say this:
There was never a time in this solipsistic event that I wasn't on top in
the situation between you and me... You know this deep in your heart,
for you wrote "I'll" (the contraction of I and will) kick your ass."
Unwittingly (what would one expect from a witless person?) you have
admitted that this is an event that has yet to take place...
So having admitted that you haven't yet kicked my ass, let me say this
to you...
I have been kicking your little candy ass all over the place ever since
I started on you.
I am going to continue to kick your candy ass all over the place for as
long as it takes.
And then I'm going to continue kick your ass whenever I feel like it
after that...
And all I have to fear is that you "will" one day get "real academic",
and get yourself a sandwiches and a TV dinner, and a BabyRuth and offer
to kick my ass if I will squat down reeeeal low so you'll be able to
reach.
"Quakin, I tell ya, quakin!" (Heart Happy) :)
If you want to rationalize your complete inability to viably sustain
your position by saying that you "let" me test you, all I can say is
that you are sucking on your shit-smeared-sneaker again... You let me
because you were powerless to stop me, that's why you let me test you.
Bobie? Why do you do this to your self?
You are basically no fun at all, "you fell right over!" (FST)...
I just beat on you and beat on you and beat on you some more and you
just keep giving me openings... Where's the referee to stop this
thrashing that that you are taking? Isn't there anyone who likes you
might throw a towel into the ring to stop the carnage?
> Hmm... maybe I should rejoin MENSA.
Right! You can do that right after they to lower the IQ limit to
something approaching room temperature, and you finally get your brain
transplant from Francis the Mule! :)
> It's so hard to get a good debate going in the "real world."
Especially for someone with no more communication skills than you
exhibit! :)
> Nah, that can wait until I complete my Master's Degree.
In Baiting? :) So far you have only proved to be a mediocre baiter! And
again, I'm not going to hold my breath till you get a Master's
(hahahahahaha) degree. a guy could DIE from that!
[And now here follows the entire post of AllisonWonderland that Booby
had to ignore because he was too thick to be very quick. There are some
salient comments by THE OFFICIAL SOLIPSIST OF <ALT.SOLIPSISM> at the end
of this post.]
Booby... I notice that you still don't want to discuss the scientific
sense of the word "Divine". Well, I won't forget it... and each time I
kick your ass, which is anytime I thik about it, I'm going to remind you
of it by causing your shit-covered-sneaker to irresistably force its way
into your upper bunghole! Just to fuck with you... <GRIN>
In fact, I think I am going to make a sig out of your stupid comment
just to keep everybody appraised that we have in our midst, a fake,
phoney, swishy little wimp-assed putz that mistakes his daydreams for
revelations and can't seem to understand why no one wants to be nice to
him...
And Booby, THE OFFICIAL SOLIPSIST AT <ALT.SOLIPSISM> told me to remind
you that "I'm AllisonWonderland, and you're not!" :)
Have a wonderscanned day Booby, and don't feel bad, you never had a
chance in the world in the first place! :)
Oh, Mama Greer? I think Booby is a bit depressed at his second
ratedness... [but Mama Greer wassn't there to help her poor little
boobela, because she was upstream, giving unsullied head to the
fishermen in the hip-waders that they used to keep from getting their
shit smeared sneakers wet!]
And about TLBG... my advice is: LISTEN TO HIM... He, unlike yourself,
make really good sense! :)
Valerie
> >wrought on alt.solipsism !
> >I must say it's very funny to read. But it sounds more like children
> >quibbling...
> >
>
>
> I called Blunderland's phony-solipsism BS again, so now they're raising a
> lot of dust to hide what I said. <chuckle>
Well at least you still chuckle
>
> >Well anyway I'm happy to see you're all alive and kicking !
>
> Yeah, "but they're all ganging up on me mommy!"
>
> HA!
>
Poor Bob !
I'm sure you love it though... <g>
Val
Valerie
>
> Valerie wrote:
>
> > Oh My ! I've been away for a few weeks and it seems like havoc has been
> > wrought on alt.solipsism !
> > I must say it's very funny to read. But it sounds more like children
> > quibbling...
>
What wouldn't we do for humour...
Life would be so dull !
> >
> > Well anyway I'm happy to see you're all alive and kicking !
>
> Cum on back now, ya heer? :)
>
Not sure to get what you mean there...
I went on a fabulous travel to New Caledonia, changed job and rearranged
the terms of my reality... So I've been busy with myself mainly.
Life is such a wonderful thing. Just wanted to share my joy.
Val
Heart Happy
>
> Heart Happy wrote:
>
> > AllisonWonderland wrote:
> > >
> > > Bundt Pan a couple of times just for good measure!
> > >
************
Thanks, I try to be nice, at least at first. :-)
Kind of like a warning. :-) Like a shot over the bow. :-)
But I'm enjoying watching you guys kick his ass. :-)
James is pretty good at it isn't he??
James is not one to stand for any shit that's for sure!
Heart Happy
>
> CIRE wrote:
> >
> > Valerie wrote:
> >
> > > Oh My ! I've been away for a few weeks and it seems like havoc has been
> > > wrought on alt.solipsism !
> > > I must say it's very funny to read. But it sounds more like children
> > > quibbling...
> >
> > Doesn't it? I agree though, it is rather humorously entertaining. :)
>
> What wouldn't we do for humour...
> Life would be so dull !
> > >
> > > Well anyway I'm happy to see you're all alive and kicking !
> >
> > Cum on back now, ya heer? :)
> >
> Not sure to get what you mean there...
******* I think he was thinking *beer*. :-)
> I went on a fabulous travel to New Caledonia, changed job and rearranged
> the terms of my reality... So I've been busy with myself mainly.
> Life is such a wonderful thing. Just wanted to share my joy.
>
> Val
--
Heart Happy
>
> Valerie wrote:
>
> > Oh My ! I've been away for a few weeks and it seems like havoc has been
> > wrought on alt.solipsism !
> > I must say it's very funny to read. But it sounds more like children
> > quibbling...
>
> Doesn't it? I agree though, it is rather humorously entertaining. :)
>
>
*********
The only one acting like a child is Robert.
And he's getting a lesson in growing up.
> >
> > Well anyway I'm happy to see you're all alive and kicking !
>
> Cum on back now, ya heer? :)
>
> Eric
CIRE
Heart Happy wrote:
> CIRE wrote:
> >
> > Heart Happy wrote:
> >
> > > AllisonWonderland wrote:
> > > >
> > > > And Judi of the Happy Heart... do me a favor and womp Booby with the
> > > > Bundt Pan a couple of times just for good measure!
> > > >
It's a thoughtful peace gesture...
>
> Kind of like a warning. :-) Like a shot over the bow. :-)
Hehe. I bet you have one of those double-barrel shotguns on your lap. :)
>
> But I'm enjoying watching you guys kick his ass. :-)
Well, I've sat back for the most part & let James duke it out with Bob. He's
managing pretty well on his own, don't you think? :)
>
> James is pretty good at it isn't he??
Man, he is! He gives Bob the left hook, then a swift right...quickly followed
by a side kick right into the solar plexus! Next comes the body slam! :)
> James is not one to stand for any shit that's for sure!
He be kickin' some ass!
Eric
CIRE
Valerie wrote:
>
> > Doesn't it? I agree though, it is rather humorously entertaining. :)
>
> What wouldn't we do for humour...
> Life would be so dull !
Bob could use a healthy dose of real humor for a change; those parenthetic
chuckles just don't cut it.....
>
> > >
> > > Well anyway I'm happy to see you're all alive and kicking !
> >
> > Cum on back now, ya heer? :)
> >
> Not sure to get what you mean there...
Oh, I didn't mean anything by that....don't take offence.
Well..I take that back. Your appearances are so few & far between, perhaps my
suspicions temporarily got ahead of me again....
>
> I went on a fabulous travel to New Caledonia, changed job and rearranged
> the terms of my reality
Yes, I remember you mentioned you were quiting your job & leaving for a trip.
How did everything go?
> ... So I've been busy with myself mainly.
Isn't everyone? :)
>
> Life is such a wonderful thing. Just wanted to share my joy.
It's nice to see an uplifting spirit around here for a change. :)
Eric
CIRE
Heart Happy wrote:
>
> > > Cum on back now, ya heer? :)
> > >
> > Not sure to get what you mean there...
>
> ******* I think he was thinking *beer*. :-)
or maybe "greer"? ;)
Eric
Valerie
>
> Bob Greer wrote:
> >
> > Allen Crider wrote in message <3741FF99...@siriux.com>...
> > >
> > >
> > >AllisonWonderland wrote:
> > >
snip
> > But I'm not
> > at all worried about it. I've spoken like this for years, and know people
> > who've spoken even more openly (and for decades), and the US government
> > continues to respect our right to do so. That is (in part) why I'm proud to
> > be American.
>
> By the way, nationalism sucks. It is an outgrowth of simian colony behavior.
I totally agree. Actual 'letting go' (don't know if this is the
appropriate expression in English) implies letting go of cultural,
religious, political, national, parental etc 'encoding' that prevent of
being aware and just plainly being who we are.
Val
Valerie
>
> Valerie wrote:
> >
> > CIRE wrote:
> > >
> > > Valerie wrote:
> > >
> > > > Oh My ! I've been away for a few weeks and it seems like havoc has been
> > > > wrought on alt.solipsism !
> > > > I must say it's very funny to read. But it sounds more like children
> > > > quibbling...
> > >
> >
> > What wouldn't we do for humour...
> > Life would be so dull !
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > Not sure to get what you mean there...
>
> ******* I think he was thinking *beer*. :-)
Doesn't make much sense to me either... Seems I'm missing some kind of
subtlety here...
> > Val
>
Valerie
>
> Valerie wrote:
>
> >
> > > Doesn't it? I agree though, it is rather humorously entertaining. :)
> >
> > What wouldn't we do for humour...
> > Life would be so dull !
>
> chuckles just don't cut it.....
>
I was mostly commenting the quibbling... and I know Bob is not deprived
of humour.
> >
> > > >
> > > > Well anyway I'm happy to see you're all alive and kicking !
> > >
> > > Cum on back now, ya heer? :)
> > >
> > Not sure to get what you mean there...
>
> Oh, I didn't mean anything by that....don't take offence.
> Well..I take that back. Your appearances are so few & far between, perhaps my
> suspicions temporarily got ahead of me again....
>
It takes a great lot (I mean GREAT) to take offence. I always give
people the benefit of the doubt.
Suspicions ? Like what ? That I'm a fake persona or something like that
?
Actually I find this idea rather funny.
As for my rare appearances, it's just pragmatic circumstances which
cause this as I hardly had the opportunity to have access to a connected
computer in the last couple of months.
This explanation might clear off your 'suspicions' although if you want
to maintain them, I don't mind.
> >
> > I went on a fabulous travel to New Caledonia, changed job and rearranged
> > the terms of my reality
>
> Yes, I remember you mentioned you were quiting your job & leaving for a trip.
> How did everything go?
Greatly. It's a beautiful country. Nature is very strong there.
I've the most enthralling experiences there. What will remain in my
memory is the ever changing diversity of the sky. I had the opportunity
to watch the sun rise at 6am on a deserted kilometers long beach. The
sky had this pinkish colour to the west and this transparent
yellow/white brightness to the East that is almost indescribable. With
all kind of rippling reflection on the sea. Meditation there was
something I've never experienced anywhere else.
And nights ! God I've never seen the milky way like that ! The sky is
not black but a very deep dark blue lit up every which way by stars with
this distinct cluster crossing the sky sideways which we call the milky
way and the stars which where above the horizon reflecting in the sea. I
was enchanted.
Well I could go on and on like that. ..
>
> > ... So I've been busy with myself mainly.
>
> Isn't everyone? :)
>
Of course, not. Just look around you. Some people are mostly busy with
passing judgment over others. They 're too engrossed in a process of
projection to even know who they are.
> >
> > Life is such a wonderful thing. Just wanted to share my joy.
>
> It's nice to see an uplifting spirit around here for a change. :)
>
Thank you. Joy has become an essential part of my life.
> Eric
CIRE
Valerie wrote:
> Heart Happy wrote:
> >
> > Valerie wrote:
> > >
> > > CIRE wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Valerie wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > Oh My ! I've been away for a few weeks and it seems like havoc has been
> > > > > wrought on alt.solipsism !
> > > > > I must say it's very funny to read. But it sounds more like children
> > > > > quibbling...
> > > >
> > > > Doesn't it? I agree though, it is rather humorously entertaining. :)
> > >
> > > What wouldn't we do for humour...
> > > Life would be so dull !
> > > > >
> > > > > Well anyway I'm happy to see you're all alive and kicking !
> > > >
> > > > Cum on back now, ya heer? :)
> > > >
> > > Not sure to get what you mean there...
> >
> > ******* I think he was thinking *beer*. :-)
>
> Doesn't make much sense to me either... Seems I'm missing some kind of
> subtlety here...
Val, do me a favor? Set my mind to rest by proving to me you're more than just
another fake alias?
Eric
Valerie
>
> CIRE wrote:
> >
> > Valerie wrote:
> >
> > > Oh My ! I've been away for a few weeks and it seems like havoc has been
> > > wrought on alt.solipsism !
> > > I must say it's very funny to read. But it sounds more like children
> > > quibbling...
> >
> > Doesn't it? I agree though, it is rather humorously entertaining. :)
> >
> >
> *********
> The only one acting like a child is Robert.
> And he's getting a lesson in growing up.
In some sense, I agree. But honestly you don't help people growing up by
consistently whacking them on their heads, especially if they don't want
to grow up. I don't see how you can make any progress with agressivity
or insults (this goes for whichever party involved).
Bob might be acting like a child, but it gets people acting like
parents...just pay attention to your comment and how it's phrased. So
basically they're getting baited if you see what I mean. Where's the
adult relationship ? Where's the growing ? Where's the sharing ?
Sometimes silence is much more efficient.
Additionnally, in all this, I haven't seen much acceptation of the
Other.
Cheers
Val
>
> > >
> > > Well anyway I'm happy to see you're all alive and kicking !
> >
> > Cum on back now, ya heer? :)
> >
Valerie
>
> Heart Happy wrote:
>
> >
> > > >
> >
> > ******* I think he was thinking *beer*. :-)
>
>
> Eric
Well at least that deserves a leer....
Val
Valerie
>
> Valerie wrote:
>
> > Heart Happy wrote:
> > >
> > > Valerie wrote:
> > > >
> > > > CIRE wrote:
> > > > >
>
> > > > >
> > > > > Cum on back now, ya heer? :)
> > > > >
> > > > Not sure to get what you mean there...
> > >
> > > ******* I think he was thinking *beer*. :-)
> >
> > subtlety here...
>
> Val, do me a favor? Set my mind to rest by proving to me you're more than just
> another fake alias?
>
> Eric
I am entirely at your service Eric. Tell what would soothe your soul in
this respect ?
Val
Heart Happy
> > ************
> > Thanks, I try to be nice, at least at first. :-)
>
> It's a thoughtful peace gesture...
>
******** Well, he hasn't really said anything to me. :-)
A friend of mine was down over the week end and I was telling him about
my grandmother and how I was raised. And he was telling me how these zen
masters
know their limits, and will not fuck with some of these grandmothers!
:-)
Talk about masters!! They come in all sorts of disguises. :-)
> > Kind of like a warning. :-) Like a shot over the bow. :-)
>
> Hehe. I bet you have one of those double-barrel shotguns on your lap. :)
>
> >
> > But I'm enjoying watching you guys kick his ass. :-)
>
> Well, I've sat back for the most part & let James duke it out with Bob. He's
> managing pretty well on his own, don't you think? :)
>
> >
> > James is pretty good at it isn't he??
>
> Man, he is! He gives Bob the left hook, then a swift right...quickly followed
> by a side kick right into the solar plexus! Next comes the body slam! :)
>
> > James is not one to stand for any shit that's for sure!
>
> He be kickin' some ass!
>
CIRE
Valerie wrote:
>
> > > What wouldn't we do for humour...
> > > Life would be so dull !
> >
> > Bob could use a healthy dose of real humor for a change; those parenthetic
> > chuckles just don't cut it.....
> >
>
> I was mostly commenting the quibbling... and I know Bob is not deprived
> of humour.
No, I don't sincerely think so either.......
>
>
> >
> > Oh, I didn't mean anything by that....don't take offence.
> > Well..I take that back. Your appearances are so few & far between, perhaps my
> > suspicions temporarily got ahead of me again....
> >
>
> It takes a great lot (I mean GREAT) to take offence. I always give
> people the benefit of the doubt.
> Suspicions ? Like what ? That I'm a fake persona or something like that
> ?
How did you know?
>
> Actually I find this idea rather funny.
Why?
>
> As for my rare appearances, it's just pragmatic circumstances which
> cause this as I hardly had the opportunity to have access to a connected
> computer in the last couple of months.
> This explanation might clear off your 'suspicions' although if you want
> to maintain them, I don't mind.
It's not a matter of 'wanting' to maintain them. I want to believe that you are
real.
So, disabuse me? :)
>
>
> > >
> > > I went on a fabulous travel to New Caledonia, changed job and rearranged
> > > the terms of my reality
> >
> > Yes, I remember you mentioned you were quiting your job & leaving for a trip.
> > How did everything go?
>
> Greatly. It's a beautiful country. Nature is very strong there.
> I've the most enthralling experiences there. What will remain in my
> memory is the ever changing diversity of the sky. I had the opportunity
> to watch the sun rise at 6am on a deserted kilometers long beach. The
> sky had this pinkish colour to the west and this transparent
> yellow/white brightness to the East that is almost indescribable.
I know exactly the beauty you describe. I experienced this same incandescent
brilliance of sunsets in Alaska & Hawaii. Just like you say...indescribable!
> With
> all kind of rippling reflection on the sea. Meditation there was
> something I've never experienced anywhere else.
I bet Rick is in envy right about now. :)
>
> And nights ! God I've never seen the milky way like that ! The sky is
> not black but a very deep dark blue lit up every which way by stars with
> this distinct cluster crossing the sky sideways which we call the milky
> way and the stars which where above the horizon reflecting in the sea. I
> was enchanted.
Isn't it spectacular? A person really has to see this firsthand to appreciate it.
Think of all the city dwellers who have never set sight on a night sky unobscured
by city lights & urban haze? After seeing such an awesome spectacle, I honestly
cannot fathom how someone could deny the material reality of this unimagineably
prodigious universe.
>
>
> Well I could go on and on like that. ..
> >
> > > ... So I've been busy with myself mainly.
> >
> > Isn't everyone? :)
> >
> Of course, not. Just look around you. Some people are mostly busy with
> passing judgment over others. They 're too engrossed in a process of
> projection to even know who they are.
You aren't singling me out, are you?
>
> > >
> > > Life is such a wonderful thing. Just wanted to share my joy.
> >
> > It's nice to see an uplifting spirit around here for a change. :)
> >
>
> Thank you. Joy has become an essential part of my life.
Hold onto to that feeling. It's a precious thing..........
Eric
AllisonWonderland
> My ears stand up when I sniff conflict on this here internet, James. :-)
have the "right stuff" to engage in any serious conflict...
I have it on good authority that Booby was out at his local news-stand
last night looking for some kind of Dictionary of Internet Defense
publication that would tell him how to fix his broken nose...
Seems that during all the ass kicking that he has been taking lately,
that he got the fractured proboscus, along with having his petulant
little pouty lips cut...
It seems that he had no luck because of this shit smeared sneaker that
had been in his mouth has been kicked half way down his esophagus and
all he could muster in the way of an inquiry was a muffled "Mnmphi
dobbbety do be do be do..." which the Asian clerk interpreted as "Mumfi
Dup Edo Edo", which in Bangkok means "I'll take it in the ass for
twenty-five cents and I extend credit!". Well, needless to say, it
wasn't long before he was doing a land slide business! Best job he ever
had! :)
> I see you've been very busy with getting all your stuff at home together and in line.
Seriously Allen, I have been very busy here. By the time I am finished,
(which ever finish comes first), things will be sufficiently in order
that those who will be in charge of handling my post life affairs won't
have to go through a bunch of rigamarole to resolve the situation.
> Did that gold-leaf table project you mentioned some time ago work out?
In actuality there are twin tables, and along with two other gilding
projects (a doe skull, with one eye of Red crystal and the other of
Green crystal, mounted on the top of a beautiful wooden staff, And the
other project is a six inch long turtle shell that I'm gilding as a gift
for the friend who just received a Master's Degree.)
> Did you wreck any of the gold foil trying to put it on?
No. BTW, the term is Gold Leaf... which is much finer, thinner, and so
much more fragile than foil. You can handle foil, Leaf just disappears
into the skin if you touch it!
> (I have an idea for a project, but don't feel like wasting a lot of money figuring out
> how to lay on gold leaf).
Well, what if it didn't waste a lot money to do it? It is quite simple,
though one would never know how to do it without some kind of idea of
what to do.
There are two methods...
One for surface Gilding an object.
And the other which is done on the INSIDE of a window, to be viewed from
the outside of the window.
The first: Surface Gilding involves but three elements:
1. A fine camel hair brush, called a "Quill", obtainable from your local
art store or sign supply, costing between $6.00 to $15.00.
2. A can of Gold Size, which is a spar varnish based paint that is
lightly tinted Yellow, also available at your local art store or sign
shop, costing between $3.00 to $6.00.
3. A packet of Patent Gold Leaf which is about 4" X 4" and has about 20
leaves of 1/100th of an inch thick Gold packaged between leaves of
tissue paper of which the packet is made, also available at your local
art store or sign shop, costing between $30.00 - $35.00.
The instructions on how to do it are printed on the can of Gold Size,
but in general what is done is:
Clean the object to surface gilded.
Paint it with an evenly applied coat of the Gold Size. Let it dry (it
never REALLY dries... but it will always be slightly tacky).
When the object passes the following test, it is ready for gilding.
The TEST: After applying the Gold Size and letting it dry for 4-5 hours,
using the back of the first knuckle of the middle finger of the right
hand (or which ever finger you usually use!) make a very soft, gentle
glancing touch/pet of the Gold Size covered surface.
The reason for using the back of the knuckle is that there is less skin
oil there than on the tip of the finger.
The touch should produce a bit of a squeak... (you know, like a dinner
plate, right after it is washed), When this is the case, then the
surface is ready to gild. If it doesn't seem squeeky it is not yet dry
enough. But once it has been determined that the surface is sufficiently
dry, it is now ready for gilding.
Setting the object in an easily accessible position, one has but to tear
out one of the tissue pages on which is the Gold Leaf.
Merely touch the Gold to the Size covered area and viola' the Gold will
stick to the object. Continue to do this till the entire desired area is
covered with Gold.
Let this sit overnight.
In the morning, gently blow on the object to remove any loose Gold.
The next step is to, using a virgin cotton ball, gently... verrrrrry
gently begin to rub the Gold covered object... It will begin to polish
and smooth and all the seams will disappear and the object comes out
looking as if it is solid Gold.
Once the polishing is done (and don't overwork it), A coat of sprayed on
clear material (Verathane, Lacquer, ClearCoat, etc.) can be applied to
protect the Golden surface.
And that is all there is to surface gilding.
The other method is for doing work on the inside of a glass to be viewed
from the other side of the glass.
Instead of using a spar varnish based Gold Size, this is done with hot
water and gelatin capsules.
Into a quart container of HOT water dissolve a dozen Gelatin Capsules.
Wash the area to be gilded first with soap an water, then with Ammonia,
then with Vinegar, then with a cloth that has Salt on it, and lastly
with a rinse of distilled water. This is to make sure that there are no
oils or foreign material present.
Then using a NEW brush, coat the entire area with the gelatin capsule
and water solution and let dry. Don't do the above test... for that will
disturb the gelatin coating on the window. When there is no more wet
look to the coat of gelatin size, wait another 15 minutes and one is
ready to apply the Gold.
Put the pattern of the work on the other side of the glass and carefully
lay the Gold to where it covers the entire area.
Wait another 15 minutes and then gently.. verrrry gently, polish the
Gold with a virgin cotten ball.
When that is done... place the pattern on the back of the Gold and
transfer the lines to be followed to define the area. This outline is
then carefully filled in with SparVarnish.
This is then let to dry over night.
Once the SparVarnish is completely dry, the entire window can be cleaned
with HOT water and a virgin cotton ball, which will remove all the Gold
that is not protected by the SparVarnish, leaving only those areas
desired covered with Gold.
Once this is done, one can paint the back of the letter with a Black
enamel making sure that the color overlaps the edge of the gold by what
ever thickness of outline around the Gold is desired.
Once the color is dry, another coat of SparVarnish can be applied making
sure that the SparVarnish overlaps the edge of the color by 1/8th
inch... This seals the edge and keeps moisture out of the area.
That's it! The more you do it better you get at it and there is nothing
that is more startling beautiful than some familiar object that looks as
if it were made of Gold.
I have a set of spurs and a matching bit (remnants of my father's days
when as a child he helped my grandfather with is teamster business...
This was back when the Teamsters drove actual horses instead of just
horsePOWER. I am going to polish up al the leather and gild the metal
parts. This should make a very nice wall plaque and I'll leave it to my
sister to leave to her daughters (my neices).
> And I am to this day ragging on those 'Treyabots over that method!
Ah yes... the Treyabots... Do you suppose that Booby might be interested
in the Treyabots? He seems to have that kind of mentality! :) Just not a
lot of it.
> I think the 'powerless weakling' one is a fine line. Guaranteed to hit home,
> because we all have felt that sometimes during our lifetime.
It is an obviously fine phrase!
> I wonder if somebody can blush from this kind of embarrassment?
Probably, but there is no assurance that Booby has any idea of
"embarrassment", I don't think he has the snap to differentiate between
being embarrassed and the way he normally is.
Anyway, he seems to be being given the "Bum's Rush" for which he is
imminently qualified by almost everyone here. Strangely he seems to
"like" getting the shit kicked out of himself... probably reminds him of
his life when he was young. If it hadn't been for the other assholes
messing with him, he would have had no outside stimulii at all!
Well Allen, if you have any question concerning gilding, just let me
know and I'll assist in any way I can. It is great fun to do and the
results are startling.
Have a wonderscanned day and....
CIRE
Valerie wrote:
> CIRE wrote:
> >
> > Valerie wrote:
> >
> > > Heart Happy wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Valerie wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > CIRE wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Valerie wrote:
> >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Cum on back now, ya heer? :)
> > > > > >
> > > > > Not sure to get what you mean there...
> > > >
> > > > ******* I think he was thinking *beer*. :-)
> > >
> > > Doesn't make much sense to me either... Seems I'm missing some kind of
> > > subtlety here...
> >
> > Val, do me a favor? Set my mind to rest by proving to me you're more than just
> > another fake alias?
> >
> > Eric
>
> I am entirely at your service Eric.
Wow! I like that thought. :) (just kidding)
> Tell what would soothe your soul in
> this respect ?
O.K. hmmm, let's see. How about posting a pic of yourself to the group? Or.. if
you'd rather not do it in a forum for all eyes to see, send one to my e-mail? As an
incentive, I'll post one of me if you like? :) Hey, Allen has posted a baby pic of
himself to the group. :)
Eric
P.S. Let me guess...you don't have a scanner? ;)
CIRE
Heart Happy wrote:
> CIRE wrote:
> > > ************
> > > Thanks, I try to be nice, at least at first. :-)
> >
> > It's a thoughtful peace gesture...
> >
>
> ******** Well, he hasn't really said anything to me. :-)
> A friend of mine was down over the week end and I was telling him about
> my grandmother and how I was raised. And he was telling me how these zen
> masters
> know their limits, and will not fuck with some of these grandmothers!
> :-)
> Talk about masters!! They come in all sorts of disguises. :-)
>
Hehe!! And remember, you're a grandmother now too! :)
Eric
Heart Happy
>
> Heart Happy wrote:
> >
> > CIRE wrote:
> > >
> > >
> > > > Oh My ! I've been away for a few weeks and it seems like havoc has been
> > > > wrought on alt.solipsism !
> > > > I must say it's very funny to read. But it sounds more like children
> > > > quibbling...
> > >
> > > Doesn't it? I agree though, it is rather humorously entertaining. :)
> > >
> > > Eric
> > >
> > *********
> > The only one acting like a child is Robert.
> > And he's getting a lesson in growing up.
>
> In some sense, I agree. But honestly you don't help people growing up by
> consistently whacking them on their heads, especially if they don't want
> to grow up. I don't see how you can make any progress with agressivity
> or insults (this goes for whichever party involved).
> Bob might be acting like a child, but it gets people acting like
> parents...just pay attention to your comment and how it's phrased. So
> basically they're getting baited if you see what I mean. Where's the
> adult relationship ? Where's the growing ? Where's the sharing ?
> Sometimes silence is much more efficient.
> Additionnally, in all this, I haven't seen much acceptation of the
> Other.
>
*********
Jesus said turn the other cheek, I say kick the shit out of them
so they'll respect your enlightenment! :-)
So as long as Robert wants to put his wanger up on the block, James
has a nice sharp cleaver perfect for the job! :-)
> Cheers
> Val
> >
> > > >
> > > > Well anyway I'm happy to see you're all alive and kicking !
> > >
> > > Cum on back now, ya heer? :)
> > >
Heart Happy
>
> Heart Happy wrote:
>
> > CIRE wrote:
*********
Yes I certainly am. And I just remembered something. My grandmother was
fairly a quiet and reserved person, but every now and then she would
make her
piece known. My first husband was dealing me a fit when we were getting
divorced
and he came over and grandma was there and she was well up into her 70's
at the time,
a small woman, and she chased him up the stairs hitting him over the
head repeatedly with her umbrella just giving him what for!! :-) Really
funny.
CIRE
Heart Happy wrote:
LOL!! Man, a guy's gotta to something pretty bad to incur the ire of a nice old
lady. :)
Do you take after your grandmother Judi? :)
Eric
CIRE
tiresias wrote:
> Bob,
> you appear to have received some response from James and others to the
> overtly aggressive and insulting nature of your criticism of James's view of
> solipsism. You appear to have the classic flaw of the self-proclaimed
> rationalist which is that of being primarily emotional and thinking that
> your responses are intellectually reasonable.
> You have exhibited male-rivalry and attacked whom you perceive as the leader
> of the pack when he appealed to be more vulnerable.
> This is simply primitive animal testosterone-led instinctual behaviour.
> James has responded by beating his chest and attacking you in order to
> maintain the position of dominant male. Those who accept his position have
> backed him up and joined in the attack on you, the potential usurper and
> young-pretender.
> You are somewhat on the defensive now as clearly shown by your exhibiting
> how clever you are by describing your technical work, mensa membership and a
> masters degree.
> As you are merely a manifestation of my bored mind I can even feel some
> compassion for your trivial situation and that of your attackers.
> If I thought you had any self-awareness I would consider you to be an
> arrogant, rather stupid, vicious, inexperienced, pompous individual who may
> not have had a shag for quite some time. But as you are merely an imaginary
> name that appears on a two-dimensional screen I can be magnanimous.
> I hope you die horribly.
As James often says, "Yow!!" :)
Tiresias, I'd never witnessed such an effluent display of ardent emotions from
you in all your posts to this NG before now. And your words are spoken so
eloquently.
But don't you think your closing sentence is a bit malicious? Do you really wish
that on someone?
Eric
tiresias
you appear to have received some response from James and others to the
overtly aggressive and insulting nature of your criticism of James's view of
solipsism. You appear to have the classic flaw of the self-proclaimed
rationalist which is that of being primarily emotional and thinking that
your responses are intellectually reasonable.
You have exhibited male-rivalry and attacked whom you perceive as the leader
This is simply primitive animal testosterone-led instinctual behaviour.
James has responded by beating his chest and attacking you in order to
maintain the position of dominant male. Those who accept his position have
backed him up and joined in the attack on you, the potential usurper and
young-pretender.
You are somewhat on the defensive now as clearly shown by your exhibiting
how clever you are by describing your technical work, mensa membership and a
masters degree.
As you are merely a manifestation of my bored mind I can even feel some
compassion for your trivial situation and that of your attackers.
If I thought you had any self-awareness I would consider you to be an
arrogant, rather stupid, vicious, inexperienced, pompous individual who may
not have had a shag for quite some time. But as you are merely an imaginary
name that appears on a two-dimensional screen I can be magnanimous.
I hope you die horribly.
Love,
Tiresias
Valerie
>
> Valerie wrote:
>
> > >
> > > Val, do me a favor? Set my mind to rest by proving to me you're more than just
> > > another fake alias?
> > >
> > > Eric
> >
> > I am entirely at your service Eric.
>
> Wow! I like that thought. :) (just kidding)
>
I thought you would.
> > Tell what would soothe your soul in
> > this respect ?
>
> O.K. hmmm, let's see. How about posting a pic of yourself to the group? Or.. if
> you'd rather not do it in a forum for all eyes to see, send one to my e-mail? As an
> incentive, I'll post one of me if you like? :) Hey, Allen has posted a baby pic of
> himself to the group. :)
>
> Eric
>
> P.S. Let me guess...you don't have a scanner? ;)
I can send a picture indeed. And no I don't have a scanner at hand
though I could find one somewhere in the building. I have some pictures
on Zip disk as well but eh guess what ? I don't have a zip reader at
hand either.
Give me some time and eventually you'll see me.
I don't need a n incentive but if you'd like to post one, I'd be happy
to see your face (hopefully not wax mask... Remember ?)
But tell me, how can a picture alleviate your suspicions ? It's just
proof that the person in the picture exists, but it won't proove it's
me, will it ?
Val
Valerie
>
> Valerie wrote:
> >
> > Heart Happy wrote:
> > >
> > > CIRE wrote:
> > > >
I hadn't realized that what I said sounded so christian...
Val
Valerie
>
> Valerie wrote:
>
> >
> > > > What wouldn't we do for humour...
> > > > Life would be so dull !
> > >
> > > Bob could use a healthy dose of real humor for a change; those parenthetic
> > > chuckles just don't cut it.....
> > >
> >
> > I was mostly commenting the quibbling... and I know Bob is not deprived
> > of humour.
>
> No, I don't sincerely think so either.......
>
> > > Oh, I didn't mean anything by that....don't take offence.
> > > Well..I take that back. Your appearances are so few & far between, perhaps my
> > > suspicions temporarily got ahead of me again....
> > >
> >
> > It takes a great lot (I mean GREAT) to take offence. I always give
> > people the benefit of the doubt.
> > Suspicions ? Like what ? That I'm a fake persona or something like that
> > ?
>
> How did you know?
Cause it's your favorite game around here and I remember lengthy
discussions between you and Allison about Tiresias identity etc.
Seems like the internet is the appropriate scenery for a little
paranoia... <smile>
>
> >
> > Actually I find this idea rather funny.
>
> Why?
Oh we can consider we're all fakes at some point or other. The amount of
energy devoted to searching who is real is quite ludicrous in my
opinion. Is not the fact that what I say is interesting or not
interesting more important than knowing who wrote it ? Since the essence
of the medium we use shunts us from real human contact.
> >
> > As for my rare appearances, it's just pragmatic circumstances which
> > cause this as I hardly had the opportunity to have access to a connected
> > computer in the last couple of months.
> > This explanation might clear off your 'suspicions' although if you want
> > to maintain them, I don't mind.
>
> It's not a matter of 'wanting' to maintain them. I want to believe that you are
> real.
Good. I'm pleased that you choose this path.
> So, disabuse me? :)
You already made your choice.
>
> > > > I went on a fabulous travel to New Caledonia, changed job and rearranged
> > > > the terms of my reality
> > >
> > > Yes, I remember you mentioned you were quiting your job & leaving for a trip.
> > > How did everything go?
> >
> > Greatly. It's a beautiful country. Nature is very strong there.
> > I've the most enthralling experiences there. What will remain in my
> > memory is the ever changing diversity of the sky. I had the opportunity
> > to watch the sun rise at 6am on a deserted kilometers long beach. The
> > sky had this pinkish colour to the west and this transparent
> > yellow/white brightness to the East that is almost indescribable.
>
> I know exactly the beauty you describe. I experienced this same incandescent
> brilliance of sunsets in Alaska & Hawaii. Just like you say...indescribable!
>
> > With
> > all kind of rippling reflection on the sea. Meditation there was
> > something I've never experienced anywhere else.
>
> I bet Rick is in envy right about now. :)
Really ?
>
> >
> > And nights ! God I've never seen the milky way like that ! The sky is
> > not black but a very deep dark blue lit up every which way by stars with
> > this distinct cluster crossing the sky sideways which we call the milky
> > way and the stars which where above the horizon reflecting in the sea. I
> > was enchanted.
>
> Isn't it spectacular? A person really has to see this firsthand to appreciate it.
> Think of all the city dwellers who have never set sight on a night sky unobscured
> by city lights & urban haze? After seeing such an awesome spectacle, I honestly
> cannot fathom how someone could deny the material reality of this unimagineably
> prodigious universe.
Indeed. The most important that you get to feel it from the inside. MY
heart just went out to the universe and I got feedback.
It's very difficult to explain the variety and subtlety of this inner
feeling about energy as a life force we're all part of.
>
> >
> >
> > Well I could go on and on like that. ..
> > >
> > > > ... So I've been busy with myself mainly.
> > >
> > > Isn't everyone? :)
> > >
> > Of course, not. Just look around you. Some people are mostly busy with
> > passing judgment over others. They 're too engrossed in a process of
> > projection to even know who they are.
>
> You aren't singling me out, are you?
I don't pretend to know who you are. You're a nice encounter though as
are most of the people posting here which is why I keep coming back.
>
Val
Heart Happy
>
> Heart Happy wrote:
>
> > CIRE wrote:
> > >
> > > Heart Happy wrote:
> > >
> > > > CIRE wrote:
No, she is in a class by herself. :-) And you know my ex that just died
is the one
that she did that too. And when I was with him that last week or so
before he
died, we talked about Grandma and he laughed remembering how she had
done that.
She was a beauty, you couldn't help but love her. When I was a teenager
she would
always slip me money as I'm going out the door and say "don't tell you
mother." :-)
Grandma lived with us and we shared a room together when I was growing
up.
She was a seamstress and taught me how to sew.
tiresias
comprehension of the basic lesson of life, the death contemplation.
>
> Tiresias, I'd never witnessed such an effluent display of ardent emotions
from
> you in all your posts to this NG before now. And your words are spoken so
> eloquently.
>
> But don't you think your closing sentence is a bit malicious? Do you
really wish
> that on someone?
Would I want to deny him that opportunity for personal growth - sorry I mean
decay.
Tiresias
CIRE
Heart Happy wrote:
>
>
> ************
> No, she is in a class by herself. :-) And you know my ex that just died
> is the one
> that she did that too. And when I was with him that last week or so
> before he
> died, we talked about Grandma and he laughed remembering how she had
> done that.
> She was a beauty, you couldn't help but love her. When I was a teenager
> she would
> always slip me money as I'm going out the door and say "don't tell you
> mother." :-)
Grandparents are wonderful in that way, aren't they? I remember when I was really
young, one day my grandpa open up one his dresser drawers and it was full of silver
dollars, half dollars, and quarters. :) He let me take the biggest handful I could
out of that drawer. :) I think I took him by surprise him at how much capacity my
little hands had for a five-year-old. :)
Eric
CIRE
Valerie wrote:
>
> > > > Val, do me a favor? Set my mind to rest by proving to me you're more than just
> > > > another fake alias?
> > > >
> > > > Eric
> > >
> > > I am entirely at your service Eric.
> >
> > Wow! I like that thought. :) (just kidding)
> >
> I thought you would.
I told you I was kidding? :)
Well, to be honest, the offer did temporarily evoke
a few exciting visualizations. :) But they were not lascivious, I can assure you. :)
>
>
> > > Tell what would soothe your soul in
> > > this respect ?
> >
> > O.K. hmmm, let's see. How about posting a pic of yourself to the group? Or.. if
> > you'd rather not do it in a forum for all eyes to see, send one to my e-mail? As an
> > incentive, I'll post one of me if you like? :) Hey, Allen has posted a baby pic of
> > himself to the group. :)
> >
> > Eric
> >
> > P.S. Let me guess...you don't have a scanner? ;)
>
> I can send a picture indeed.
That'd be great!
> And no I don't have a scanner at hand
> though I could find one somewhere in the building.
> I have some pictures
> on Zip disk as well but eh guess what ?
You don't have a zip drive? :)
> I don't have a zip reader at
> hand either.
I should've known; there's a catch to everything. :)
>
> Give me some time and eventually you'll see me.
That'd be nice, but don't go out of your way.
>
> I don't need a n incentive but if you'd like to post one, I'd be happy
> to see your face (hopefully not wax mask... Remember ?)
Wax mask? I'm not sure what you mean......
>
>
> But tell me, how can a picture alleviate your suspicions ? It's just
> proof that the person in the picture exists, but it won't proove it's
> me, will it ?
No, it won't necessarily. But I trust you.
Eric
CIRE
Valerie wrote:
>
> > > It takes a great lot (I mean GREAT) to take offence. I always give
> > > people the benefit of the doubt.
> > > Suspicions ? Like what ? That I'm a fake persona or something like that
> > > ?
> >
> > How did you know?
>
> Cause it's your favorite game around here
"My" favorite game? :)
> and I remember lengthy
> discussions between you and Allison about Tiresias identity etc.
> Seems like the internet is the appropriate scenery for a little
> paranoia... <smile>
It certainly is. :) And some people are good at instilling this..........
>
> >
> > >
> > > Actually I find this idea rather funny.
> >
> > Why?
>
> Oh we can consider we're all fakes at some point or other. The amount of
> energy devoted to searching who is real is quite ludicrous in my
> opinion.
Thanks a lot Val. You're the first to ever call me ludicrous. :)
But in all honesty, I'm not "devoted" to searching who is real & who is not. I usually
take at face value who a person says he/she is.
> Is not the fact that what I say is interesting or not
> interesting more important than knowing who wrote it ?
Not at all. If my sole interest were in what's interesting without regard to who wrote
it, I could view a movie or documentary or read a book. The fact is, a lot more is
gleaned from online discourse than just reading a bunch of words. There's a sense of
feeling connected with a real person, and that's the way it should be. And that's my
whole point. And it's not enough that "anyone" is writing it. You like to feel the
person with whom you are talking is who he/she says she is.
Eric
CIRE
tiresias wrote:
> > As James often says, "Yow!!" :)
> Look this individual has obviously had a really healthy life and has no
> comprehension of the basic lesson of life, the death contemplation.
> >
> > Tiresias, I'd never witnessed such an effluent display of ardent emotions
> from
> > you in all your posts to this NG before now. And your words are spoken so
> > eloquently.
> Why thank you.
You're most welcome......
>
>
> >
> > But don't you think your closing sentence is a bit malicious? Do you
> really wish
> > that on someone?
> I think it could be a learning experience in applied solipsism for him Eric.
> Would I want to deny him that opportunity for personal growth - sorry I mean
> decay.
I agree that Bob is in need of a "reality check" (pardon the un-solipsistic
expression).
And perhaps a few physical (or is that psycholgical?) travails would build good
character in him.
But to die a horrible death...he couldn't learn from his experiences now, could
he? ;)
Eric
tiresias
> I agree that Bob is in need of a "reality check" (pardon the
un-solipsistic
> expression).
> And perhaps a few physical (or is that psycholgical?) travails would build
good
> character in him.
>
> But to die a horrible death...he couldn't learn from his experiences now,
could
> he? ;)
Well, I would not have my internet reading made crass by some of Bob's
classic statements such as:
" So the reason you spewed umpteen pages of dishonest BS as an "answer" to
Mark Shuller's honest (and simple) question was... that you're running out
of time to live?
If you don't have much time, try brevity."
and:
"Gosh, the ultimate natural high.
Makes we wonder why people both with "teachers" and "gurus" - obviously, the
Death Ward at the local hospital is the place to go for wisdom.
Really, you should try solipsism someday, just for a change of pace,
Allison. Dying wouldn't worry you nearly so much if you thought
solipsistically.
By the way, will you be alive much longer? Just curious..."
No I hope the Greer identity dies horribly and the sooner the better.
Tiresias
AllisonWonderland
> No I hope the Greer identity dies horribly and the sooner the better.
> Tiresias
Ouch! :) Once again, all I can do is quote HH when she saith: "There!
That ought to just about do it!" :)
This little skirmish with Booby has furnished a little amusement, and
has been what I have been engaged in between doing the adrenalin
motivated things such as painting the house and etc.
Laughter being the great medicine that it is, let me just say that I
have been having chuckling fits about your posts, and they just don't
seem to want to stop. :) Keep this up, and we both may transcend the
"inconvenient" health issues that we seem to be experiencing.
BTW, do you have the referred Right shoulder pain that is indicative of
Liver problems?
I started having this buzzing little pain in the point of my Right
shoulder on Xmas Eve. I had been given the diagnosis that I had Liver
problems December 1, 1998. But there was no pain in the shoulder at that
time.
I took that as an indication that they were mistaken... (I remember your
comment was that it sounded like denial!).And the full weight of the
proposition hit me December 24th, when the Referred Right Shoulder Pain
began... Talk about a rude awakening!
After starting on medication (Prednisone, and URSO) it has gone away for
days at a time, but it is a recurring thing, though at times it is not
as noticable as it is at other times.
Well, things here in the Deep East Texas Pineywood Forest are being kept
down to a steady roar...
The spectre of an impending demise seems to, along with the meds and
improved diet, fresh fruit and vegetable juice and such, seems to be a
great motivator.
My mental attitude seems to be bouyant, though I have noticed lately
that my speech is beginning to slur and more and more the words that I
hear don't go together into coherent phrases, this is attributed to
encephalopathy. It has yet to begin to affect my reading and writing
skills. This seems to be fortuitous for there is much to read here, but
little conversation due to the solitary nature of my existence.
My physical condition is one of being strong and other than the pain
from the hip problem (which BTW is more and more manageable by my
slowing down and being a bit more careful), along with the Prednisone
(corticosteroid) which seems to be reducing the inflammation from the
Arthritis that has been such a bane for the last couple of decades, and
actually lessening the Arthritis problem.
And now if I can just avoid all the side effect that come from long term
use of high doses of steroids...
Well Tiresias, I hope you are doing well, and that things are going
alright for you. I sometimes wonder what, if anything, there is behind
all this that has made it turn out this way. At times it seems
exceedingly strange... but once in a while, there is this feeling that
what is happening is all right, all worked out, it just seems that this
is the way it is supposed to be. Letting go and giving into that feeling
seems to make it bearable.
And in the end, no one knows anything for sure.
"And in the end, the love you take is equal to the love you make!"
(Beatles)
Have a wonderscanned day and
Heart Happy
>
> clock basis, and the only payment that they expected and got was the
> leftover Morphine, which they stuck in their aprons, instead of
> discarding as they were "supposed to do!"
>
> What they did with is was never questioned.
******** That's exactly what we did with my ex's morphine and other
assorted drugs when he died. No one said a word, not even the hospice
nurses. :-) And the funny thing about it was the when I was taking
care of him those last couple weeks, I had some kind of pain in my
back or something, I forgot, but Warren says, here, take some of this -
it didn't say morphine on the bottle. So, I did, and I ended up getting
wasted and was no good the rest of the day. :-) The next day I said,
what the fuck was that you gave me? He laughed this smirky laugh
and said morphine. :-) Bastard!! :-)
>
> > If my dream continues with a continuum of story then it will, but if not
> > then my mourning is not in vain.
> And the capacity for delusion seems to diminish at the same rate that
> the hopelessness of the situation becomes more and more manifest. We
> begin to see the uselessness of mourning, and hopefully will face the
> finality with grace and dignity... Probably during sleep!
>
******* Yes, that would be the only way you could pull that one off! :-)
> > Anyway I have no definite date of demise but my astrological calculations do
> > indicate either regeneration or death by early October 2001.
> As good an indication as any... but be careful of superstition type
> things... They are extremely BAD LUCK! :) The MDeity that I am seeing
> said 6 weeks ago, that if AllisonWonderland were still alive on the
> first of June, 1999, to come in and see her!
>
******* What was it James that made them change their time frame??
First it was 2-10 years??? Or were they just yanking your chain?
If you remember they gave Warren a week at most and he ended up living
for
nearly a year, traveling around on vacation and going on cruises and
doing all sorts of stuff. Spending money mostly. :-) And none of it
on me. :-) But when he got too sick, then it was oh Judi, get your ass
down here and take care of me. :-)
AllisonWonderland
> I have had my liver biopsy result and have cirrhosis,
Cirrhosis is scarring... the scarring of various parts of the Liver are
what differentiates the different kinds of Liver Infections
(Hepatitises/Hepatitii?). I one has scarring of the biliary system, that
is one thing. Scarring of the Hepatic Parachyma is another thing...
Scarring of the sack within which the Hepatic Parachyma is contained is
another kind of cirrhosis. Which Virus/Hep do you have, it seems to me
that HepC was mentioned at one time.
> an enlarged spleen,
This is a side effect of theh Hepatitis caused Cirrhosis?
> and damage continuing to occur due to the virus outpacing my immune system.
And the contest between the virii and the I/S is the contention that is
threatening your health and indeed your very life. In the case of PBC,
as you know, the contest is between the I/S and the Liver! which the I/S
is treating like it would your virii!
> I am having to push to try and get the anti-viral substances that have a 1 in
> 4 (approx) chance of taking out the virus.
And these are? And who is the bottleneck that you have to push in order
to get the AVSs? Is this a bureaucracy thing?
> Been an interesting time on receiving a death sentence.
My perception was that while it wasn't particularly welcome, it was not
uninteresting!
> Have felt lust for life
"And the spirit bade Reignbough hurry with words like soon and end!"
> And mourned somewhat for my self.
Likewise, but that got tiresome really quick!
> I like me and it grieves me to say goodbye!
Yes.
> Will be seeing the consultant next week for an informative exchange of
> information and views.
I am particularly impressed by the number of and the attitude towards
those MDeities who are involved in
end-state-terminal-illnesses/diseases.
The ones among whom lurk the DoctorDeaths (Kavorkianites?).
At one time I was involved with the dying and death of the mother of a
dear friend... She was dying of Cancer and had to have Morphine for the
pain. When the situation became unbearable for those around her to
handle due to the horrors of and the sympathy with the pain and the
direness of the situation, there suddenly appeard a mysterious group of
practicing nurses that showed up and took total control of the situation
on a full time basis, providing care for the patient on a round the
clock basis, and the only payment that they expected and got was the
leftover Morphine, which they stuck in their aprons, instead of
discarding as they were "supposed to do!"
What they did with is was never questioned.
They performed a service that could not be afforded, costing only the
leftovers of something that had already been paid for. And the service
was excellent, And they were competent. And they were exactly what was
needed...
It only goes to show that when the cards are really on the table, and
all the bullshit of the bureaucracy, and the protocols of Draconian
thinking are breaking down in the face of the reality of the HORROR...
then things happen that are expiditious, and efficacious, and the only
cost is the winked at violations of protocols that are not enforced, for
what good purpose would it serve? What good would it do?
> > Yes, ladies and gentlemen, for the first time on any NG, we are going to
> > watch the progression of the mind of AllisonWonderland as it progresses
> > from an Oxygen/Hydrogen/Nitrogen based consciousness to a predominantly
> > Ammonia based consciousness...
> I'll be with you on that particular alchemical transformation.
And Tiresias, this too might not be all that desirable, but it too could
be very interesting, especially in the light of the propensity that we
seem to have to be curious about the nature and the working of mind and
the various ways in which it can be manipulated and/or altered.
> > Watch the progression while the events that reach from AllisonWonderland
> > to his horizon turn into the ultimate solution to the riddle of the
> > dream...
> To have a definite event horizon looming into proximity does bring previous
> idle speculation as to the after-death state, if any, into the here and
> hopefully not now. I have experienced many altered states and this has
> always been whilst being a human. When I die I will see or not what I am or
> am not.
Again, not something one wants to do lightly, but again, it certainly
isn't going to be uninteresting...
> Putting aside sentiment and vanity, I am an animal.
But a very strange and unusually complex animal... and capable of things
that are not very animal like when necessary.
> The abattoir
(which means? I tried to find this word, but possibly is is French and
all I have is English Dictionaries.)
> is my eventual destination and my dream is likely to end with my last breath.
There is some indication that the consciousness doesn't end abruptly
except in case of quick disintegration of the processes such as in
tremendous heat, or instantaneous cellular disintegration, but left to
itself, the physical form goes into a decline that is simultaneously
followed down by the consciousness that has been the perceiver of the
entire preceeding dream.
It was this factor that prompted Aldous Huxley (Brave New World, Of
Heaven and Hell, The Doors of Perception, etc.) to (and this was before
the use of LSD was banned by the imbicilic prohibition on mind altering
substances) have the doctor in attendance, or maybe it was his wife,
under the supervision of the doctor, to shoot AH up with 10cc of LSD!
> If my dream continues with a continuum of story then it will, but if not
> then my mourning is not in vain.
And the capacity for delusion seems to diminish at the same rate that
the hopelessness of the situation becomes more and more manifest. We
begin to see the uselessness of mourning, and hopefully will face the
finality with grace and dignity... Probably during sleep!
> Anyway I have no definite date of demise but my astrological calculations do
> indicate either regeneration or death by early October 2001.
As good an indication as any... but be careful of superstition type
things... They are extremely BAD LUCK! :) The MDeity that I am seeing
said 6 weeks ago, that if AllisonWonderland were still alive on the
first of June, 1999, to come in and see her!
> The likely options are:
> (1) I get the anti-viral therapy; it is successful and I carry on with my
> permanently damaged liver and some degree of regeneration.
> (2) I get the anti-viral therapy and it is not successful and either:
> (a) Carry on until I get liver cancer and die
> (b) Carry on until I die from liver failure
> (c) Be put on the liver transplant list when I get very ill and
> either:
> (i) Die of liver cancer - transplants not given generally
> if patient has cancer
> (ii) Die of liver failure whilst waiting for a donor
> organ
> (iii) Get a transplant which would give me 4 in 5 chance
> of living five years.
> (d) Not get put on the transplant list and wait for (2)(a) or (2)(b) or
> (i) Investigate the options and affordability of getting
> a donor organ and transplant to order.
> (3) I do not get the anti-viral therapy and then options 2(c) and 2(d)
> are available plus:
> (a) I get hold of the anti-virals myself and give it a go.
To (1): One really can get by on a lot less Liver than most of us have!
To (2): This is very unlikely, for your will is much stronger than your
won't.
To (2a): This has to be ruled out of the question. Don't allow this
option. "Never, Never, Never!" (W. Churchhill)
To (2b): This is the inevitible and probably most common... for until
they had all these tests and procedure, this process was known as
"natural causes"!
To (3) And is this a clandestine thing, a frowned upon, bootleg kind of
thing? Not that it makes a hell of a lot of difference!
> > In the dream, we will all be Rich and Wealthy...
> That would give me more options to be sure!
And would it really? Sometimes I wonder!
Well Tiresias, I put off answering this post of yours till the time
seemed right. This afternoon a friend of mine came by and left the
Johnny Depp movie called "Fear and Loathing in LasVegas", the story of
Hunter S Thompson's Acid Trip while covering the DEA convention in Vegas
for RollingStoneMagazine. I kind of figured that before watching that,
that writing to you might be a good thing to do as a prelude...
Anyway, the talking about this kind of thing (to the chagrin of BG) is
about raising the awareness of the problem, to stimulate interest and
maybe that will help translate into a solution for the problem that
might just be the "last-minute" "knight-in-shining-armour,
"life-saving-miracle-cure" that would permit us to with a sigh of
relief, exclaim as we wipe our brows... "Whew, that was a close one!"
Till then, I once again wish you the best, and implore you to let the
day wonderscan you as it does when one lets it!
Allen Crider
AllisonWonderland wrote:
>
> Allen Crider wrote:
> > My ears stand up when I sniff conflict on this here internet, James. :-)
> Conflict? There hasn't been much conflict yet! Seems that Booby doesn't
> have the "right stuff" to engage in any serious conflict...
>
> I have it on good authority that Booby was out at his local news-stand
> last night looking for some kind of Dictionary of Internet Defense
> publication that would tell him how to fix his broken nose...
Now that he is only lurking here, maybe he has pause to turn to the Reader's
Digest Philosophy Dictionary and look up 'ethics' :-)
> > I see you've been very busy with getting all your stuff at home together and in line.
> Seriously Allen, I have been very busy here. By the time I am finished,
> (which ever finish comes first), things will be sufficiently in order
> that those who will be in charge of handling my post life affairs won't
> have to go through a bunch of rigamarole to resolve the situation.
I have to admit... I eat, breathe and sleep Loose Ends. I think I would do the
same thing if I was in your situation. Not very many people get the
blessing/curse of advanced warning. I suppose that much of my loose ends
projects could be solved with 2 gallons of gas and a match out in the front yard.
> > (I have an idea for a project, but don't feel like wasting a lot of money figuring out
> > how to lay on gold leaf).
> Well, what if it didn't waste a lot money to do it? It is quite simple,
> though one would never know how to do it without some kind of idea of
> what to do.
[gilding info snipped]
It sounds easy. I will try it on one of my loose ends. Thanks for the lesson!
> There are two methods...
AllisonWonderland
> Now that he is only lurking here, maybe he has pause to turn to the Reader's
> Digest Philosophy Dictionary and look up 'ethics' :-)
> > > (I have an idea for a project, but don't feel like wasting a lot of money figuring
> > > out how to lay on gold leaf).
> [gilding info snipped]
> It sounds easy. I will try it on one of my loose ends. Thanks for the lesson!
You are, of course, most certainly welcome, Allen.
I haven't seen a post from Booby for some time now... Maybe the Sword of
Damocles has staunched his ardor to be such a putz!
BTW, I heard that he DOES, at least, practice safe sex... but for him
that means only that he is staying away from the animals that bite,
scratch and/or kick! :)
Have a wonderscanned day... and
AllisonWonderland
> I have to admit... I eat, breathe and sleep Loose Ends. I think I would do the
> same thing if I was in your situation. Not very many people get the blessing/curse of
> advanced warning.
will then see what we will see. I seem to have no intention of going
easily... Kicking, scratching, and screaming is more my style... but we
will see... :)
> I suppose that much of my loose ends projects could be solved with 2 gallons of gas and a
> match out in the front yard.
Or you could use the Owen Hart (Blue Blazer) Method... instead of 2
gallons of gas and a match in the front yard... he used a steel cable
and a match in Kansas City! :)
Have a wonderscanned day!
awetoss
>Bob Greer wrote:
>>What we're going to get here, folks, is probably a repeat of Ben Johnson's
>>"proof" that the world is real: he kicked a rock and said "See! That
>>proves it's real!" I suspect that the demonstration here will be along
the
>>lines of "Eat a drug or a poison - notice that you think differently now?
>>That proves the drug/poison *caused* changes in your thinking."
>>Of course, not that I've said this - who knows what we'll get? Let's wait
>>and see!
>Yes, and I believe you're absolutely correct...in part: our existence IS
>psychological, but it's necessarily based upon material dynamics. Without
>materialism, there can be no psychology. If you feel certain that "mind" is
not
>incumbent on a basal material brain, then be my guest and go have a lobotomy
and
>see if you walk away unscathed........
;oD
AllisonWonderland
> ;oD
AllisonWonderland responded:
Doh, Ray, Mi?
This is pretty cryptic Awetoss! What does it all mean? :)
tiresias
AllisonWonderland wrote
> tiresias wrote:
> > No I hope the Greer identity dies horribly and the sooner the better.
> AllisonWonderland commented:
> Ouch! :) Once again, all I can do is quote HH when she saith: "There!
> That ought to just about do it!" :)
It seems to have diminished the crudely ignorant postings of Greer.
>
> This little skirmish with Booby has furnished a little amusement, and
> has been what I have been engaged in between doing the adrenalin
> motivated things such as painting the house and etc.
I am in HepC liver cirrhosis lethargy, fancy coming over to England and
using some of that adrenalin on painting the peeling paintwork on my house?
>
> Laughter being the great medicine that it is, let me just say that I
> have been having chuckling fits about your posts, and they just don't
> seem to want to stop. :) Keep this up, and we both may transcend the
> "inconvenient" health issues that we seem to be experiencing.
Distraction is essential.
>
> BTW, do you have the referred Right shoulder pain that is indicative of
> Liver problems?
No, I have been having pain in my abdomen for years. Felt the right
shoulder pain straight after the liver biopsy but it passed.
>
> After starting on medication (Prednisone, and URSO) it has gone away for
> days at a time, but it is a recurring thing, though at times it is not
> as noticable as it is at other times.
I find that I get used to a fairly constant level of stimulation and pain,
it is when it peaks or ceases or when I feel it more because my attention is
drawn to it that it tends to distract me from other things.
>
> Well, things here in the Deep East Texas Pineywood Forest are being kept
> down to a steady roar...
>
> The spectre of an impending demise seems to, along with the meds and
> improved diet, fresh fruit and vegetable juice and such, seems to be a
> great motivator.
Could be the adrenalin contributing too James.
>
> My mental attitude seems to be bouyant, though I have noticed lately
> that my speech is beginning to slur and more and more the words that I
> hear don't go together into coherent phrases, this is attributed to
> encephalopathy. It has yet to begin to affect my reading and writing
> skills. This seems to be fortuitous for there is much to read here, but
> little conversation due to the solitary nature of my existence.
Could this be partly to do with the chemicals that you are taking?
>
> My physical condition is one of being strong and other than the pain
> from the hip problem (which BTW is more and more manageable by my
> slowing down and being a bit more careful), along with the Prednisone
> (corticosteroid) which seems to be reducing the inflammation from the
> Arthritis that has been such a bane for the last couple of decades, and
> actually lessening the Arthritis problem.
>
> And now if I can just avoid all the side effect that come from long term
> use of high doses of steroids...
What are those? I remember being told that puffiness or ballooning of the
face can occur.
>
> Well Tiresias, I hope you are doing well, and that things are going
> alright for you. I sometimes wonder what, if anything, there is behind
> all this that has made it turn out this way. At times it seems
> exceedingly strange... but once in a while, there is this feeling that
> what is happening is all right, all worked out, it just seems that this
> is the way it is supposed to be. Letting go and giving into that feeling
> seems to make it bearable.
I am still struggling to readjust my life and do not feel that this is at
all right. I have mellowed slightly but still fear the future and the
physical decline that appears to have taken a sudden dip into the depths. I
am realising that my efforts to force myself to continue employment are in
vain as I am not going to feel more vigorous and the fatigue and ill-health
can only progress.
>
> And in the end, no one knows anything for sure.
I think it is a safe-ish bet that our bodies will die and cease to function
but until it happens to me I cannot speak from personal experience!
>
> "And in the end, the love you take is equal to the love you make!"
> (Beatles)
"I'm gonna take it with me when I go" (Tom Waits)
>
> Hang in there!
I usually hang to the left.
Tiresias
tiresias
apologies for the tardiness of my reply but I have felt quite unwell
recently.
AllisonWonderland wrote
> tiresias wrote:
> > I have had my liver biopsy result and have cirrhosis,
> Cirrhosis is scarring... the scarring of various parts of the Liver are
> what differentiates the different kinds of Liver Infections
> (Hepatitises/Hepatitii?). I one has scarring of the biliary system, that
> is one thing. Scarring of the Hepatic Parachyma is another thing...
> Scarring of the sack within which the Hepatic Parachyma is contained is
> another kind of cirrhosis. Which Virus/Hep do you have, it seems to me
> that HepC was mentioned at one time.
That is correct I have the HepC virus nibbling away at my liver and this has
been for, I reckon, some 20 years when I probably contracted it on my one
occasion of injecting. It was amphetamine sulphate and the colleague with
whom I shared the needle in those days and nights of pre-awareness of AIDS
or HepC was another solipsist who liked to say "everything's a load of
visuals". I believe that he was eventually labelled as being psychotic by
the mental health system.
Around that time a fair old quantity of quality amphetamines was snorted in
combination with the usual hallucinogenics of LSD, cannabis resin and magic
mushrooms such as the psilocybin liberty caps and the fly agaric, amanita
muscaria.
I found that it was the prolonged usage of the amphetamines that
effectively removed my perception of duality to a large and enduring effect.
It has also, due to the shared needle, effectively removed a large portion
of my liver and replaced it with scar tissue. As the Fabulous Furry Freak
Brothers used to say, "Keed Spills"!
My liver biopsy report states:
"The liver shows extensive fibrosis amounting to established micronodular
cirrhosis. The portal tracts contain a heavy mononuclear inflammatory
infiltrate with some polymorphs present. Lymphoid aggregates associated
with damaged bile ducts are present. There is interface hepatitis and
marked periportal entrapment of hepatocytes. Elsewhere the parenchyma shows
florid ballooning of hepatocytes, mild spotty inflammation and a few
acidophil bodies."
There are more details given including grading and staging scores. The
complexity that reveals itself on observation is awesome.
>
> > an enlarged spleen,
> This is a side effect of theh Hepatitis caused Cirrhosis?
Yes, because the blood flow through my liver is impeded by the scar tissue
my portal vein is under pressure and some of the blood flow is trying to
find release and has found a path into my spleen which is therefore somewhat
enlarged. Portal hypertension is the term for it.
>
> > and damage continuing to occur due to the virus outpacing my immune
system.
> And the contest between the virii and the I/S is the contention that is
> threatening your health and indeed your very life. In the case of PBC,
> as you know, the contest is between the I/S and the Liver! which the I/S
> is treating like it would your virii!
We should do a swap, my weakened immune system for your over-active one.
>
> > I am having to push to try and get the anti-viral substances that have a
1 in
> > 4 (approx) chance of taking out the virus.
> And these are? And who is the bottleneck that you have to push in order
> to get the AVSs? Is this a bureaucracy thing?
Interferon and Ribivarin are the anti-virals. The bureaucracy is more
medical and due to my medical history which included a time in the loony bin
some 19 years ago due to not handling my amphetamine altered reality
elegantly. The drugs are contra-indicated in people with a history of
depression/mental illness and so I will have to see a trick-cyclist in order
to show that I am mentally and emotionally stable enough to embark on the
anti-virals. I'll just have to lie!
>
> > Been an interesting time on receiving a death sentence.
> My perception was that while it wasn't particularly welcome, it was not
> uninteresting!
Yes interesting in the Chinese usage of the word. I have had to deal with
the reality that as a solipsist I am facing the end of the "I" that I know
and love and to whom I am very attached, indeed the very attaching of my
mind to this "I"dea, this de"I"fication is the creat"I"on of "I"dentity.
>
> > Have felt lust for life
> "And the spirit bade Reignbough hurry with words like soon and end!"
Later and continue are much nicer words to savour.
>
> > And mourned somewhat for my self.
> Likewise, but that got tiresome really quick!
I am still somewhat stunned.
>
> > I like me and it grieves me to say goodbye!
> Yes.
>
> > Will be seeing the consultant next week for an informative exchange of
> > information and views.
> I am particularly impressed by the number of and the attitude towards
> those MDeities who are involved in
> end-state-terminal-illnesses/diseases.
When I was given the biopsy result I was basically told that drug therapy
was inappropriate and that I should go away until I was so ill that a
transplant was the only option. It was only when I said "What?!" and
challenged the MDeity that the reason was given somewhat reluctantly as due
to my having a medical history involving psychiatry some many years ago.
>
> The ones among whom lurk the DoctorDeaths (Kavorkianites?).
Kavorkianites? Where does this term come from?
>
> At one time I was involved with the dying and death of the mother of a
> dear friend... She was dying of Cancer and had to have Morphine for the
> pain.<SNIP>
> It only goes to show that when the cards are really on the table, and
> all the bullshit of the bureaucracy, and the protocols of Draconian
> thinking are breaking down in the face of the reality of the HORROR...
> then things happen that are expiditious, and efficacious, and the only
> cost is the winked at violations of protocols that are not enforced, for
> what good purpose would it serve? What good would it do?
I think I will have to get rid of the bullshit myself all the way to the
end.
>
> > > Yes, ladies and gentlemen, for the first time on any NG, we are going
to
> > > watch the progression of the mind of AllisonWonderland as it
progresses
> > > from an Oxygen/Hydrogen/Nitrogen based consciousness to a
predominantly
> > > Ammonia based consciousness...
> > I'll be with you on that particular alchemical transformation.
> And Tiresias, this too might not be all that desirable, but it too could
> be very interesting, especially in the light of the propensity that we
> seem to have to be curious about the nature and the working of mind and
> the various ways in which it can be manipulated and/or altered.
I think we are well experienced with voluntarily taken chemicals to handle
the ammonia poisoning in as lucid manner as possible.
>
> > > Watch the progression while the events that reach from
AllisonWonderland
> > > to his horizon turn into the ultimate solution to the riddle of the
> > > dream...
> > To have a definite event horizon looming into proximity does bring
previous
> > idle speculation as to the after-death state, if any, into the here and
> > hopefully not now. I have experienced many altered states and this has
> > always been whilst being a human. When I die I will see or not what I
am or
> > am not.
> Again, not something one wants to do lightly, but again, it certainly
> isn't going to be uninteresting...
It does seem to concentrate the thinking as well as it can be under the
chemical circumstances.
>
> > Putting aside sentiment and vanity, I am an animal.
> But a very strange and unusually complex animal... and capable of things
> that are not very animal like when necessary.
Well I am an animal so whatever I do is animalistic including typing these
words.
>
> > The abattoir
> (which means? I tried to find this word, but possibly is is French and
> all I have is English Dictionaries.)
The abattoir is where animals are killed and butchered.
>
> > is my eventual destination and my dream is likely to end with my last
breath.
> There is some indication that the consciousness doesn't end abruptly
> except in case of quick disintegration of the processes such as in
> tremendous heat, or instantaneous cellular disintegration, but left to
> itself, the physical form goes into a decline that is simultaneously
> followed down by the consciousness that has been the perceiver of the
> entire preceeding dream.
The consciousness which identifies with the temporal role will lose that
particular identity as I am attached to my existence which appears physical.
Whether the consciousness can or wishes to continue its existence through
the expression or continuum of my? "I" is out of my present knowledge. I
will either continue in some dreamt-up scenario of continuum of memory and
identity or I will be erased from the play.
How much "I" identify with the dreamer of myself will probably become
apparent one way or another.
>
> It was this factor that prompted Aldous Huxley (Brave New World, Of
> Heaven and Hell, The Doors of Perception, etc.) to (and this was before
> the use of LSD was banned by the imbicilic prohibition on mind altering
> substances) have the doctor in attendance, or maybe it was his wife,
> under the supervision of the doctor, to shoot AH up with 10cc of LSD!
Presumably the attendants did this and just took with them in their aprons
the LSD that was not needed! With 10cc available that would have been quite
substantial.
>
> > If my dream continues with a continuum of story then it will, but if not
> > then my mourning is not in vain.
> And the capacity for delusion seems to diminish at the same rate that
> the hopelessness of the situation becomes more and more manifest. We
> begin to see the uselessness of mourning, and hopefully will face the
> finality with grace and dignity... Probably during sleep!
More like with a spliff given the option.
>
> > Anyway I have no definite date of demise but my astrological
calculations do
> > indicate either regeneration or death by early October 2001.
> As good an indication as any... but be careful of superstition type
> things... They are extremely BAD LUCK! :) The MDeity that I am seeing
> said 6 weeks ago, that if AllisonWonderland were still alive on the
> first of June, 1999, to come in and see her!
Sounds like your MDeity was being a bit of a sarcastic bitch. I was hoping
before the biopsy that it could be regeneration but with cirrhosis that is
very, very improbable so I can only wait and see whether my projections are
accurate or hopefully not. It could be a transplant or perhaps my astrology
is not always correct, which is probable.
>
> > > In the dream, we will all be Rich and Wealthy...
> > That would give me more options to be sure!
> And would it really? Sometimes I wonder!
I could buy me a top grade liver and get the most up to date treatments if
money was not an issue.
>
> Well Tiresias, I put off answering this post of yours till the time
> seemed right. This afternoon a friend of mine came by and left the
> Johnny Depp movie called "Fear and Loathing in LasVegas", the story of
> Hunter S Thompson's Acid Trip while covering the DEA convention in Vegas
> for RollingStoneMagazine. I kind of figured that before watching that,
> that writing to you might be a good thing to do as a prelude...
Fear and Loathing in Cirrhosis. Read the book some 20 or so years ago, the
cartoons are superb. The film will be low-grade as it would be the usual
read the book whats this film done to it experience. How was it for you?
>
> Anyway, the talking about this kind of thing (to the chagrin of BG) is
> about raising the awareness of the problem, to stimulate interest and
> maybe that will help translate into a solution for the problem that
> might just be the "last-minute" "knight-in-shining-armour,
> "life-saving-miracle-cure" that would permit us to with a sigh of
> relief, exclaim as we wipe our brows... "Whew, that was a close one!"
The shortage of donor organs is a major problem. The donors presently have
to be brain dead but still alive and there are not enough of such
unfortunate bodies. The latest thing is live donor transplants wherein a
living donor donates a lobe of their liver to the recipient. As the liver
regenerates the donor regains their whole liver and the recipient similarly.
Another finding is that the liver can regenerate by using bone marrow cells.
Anyway one day I will wake up and realise with a familiar but almost
forgotten lurching recognition that all this had been but a dream!
>
> Till then, I once again wish you the best, and implore you to let the
> day wonderscan you as it does when one lets it!
Have you ever been wonderscanned, cause I have. Wasn't that from "Purple
Haze"? Going for my acupuncture later on today. Quite interesting. The
needles that were inserted on my spleen and liver just did not want to come
out at the last treatment, they liked it.
>
> --
> Hang in there!
By tooth and nail when required.
Tiresias