need advice please
JudyS
kw range. I'm really taken with the enphase inverters. They look perfect
except for the possibility of the grid going down for long periods.
Is there any economical way to add battery backup in case the grid drops
out? Is there another system that would be better suited for this
possibility?
m II
"JudyS" wrote in message news:il0bvp$ni$1...@speranza.aioe.org...
--
Co-gen circuits, typically, do not have facilities for a battery storage
system. An automatic disconnect and transfer system is also required for
this.
If you go decent batteries they will cost you more than the energy would
cost from the grid for the rest of your life.
mike
Ron Rosenfeld
>Is there any economical way to add battery backup in case the grid drops
>out?
>Is there another system that would be better suited for this
>possibility?
If your energy requirements are substantial, and the power outages infrequent, a fossil-fueled generator with a whole-house automatic transfer switch would probably be the best way to go.
If you want to go into this in more depth, then you'll need to provide a lot more information about energy usage, solar insolation, expected grid failure frequency and duration; how long a battery backup do you require? etc. And, if you have a power outage that exceeds those parameters, you'll need a fossil-fuel generator anyway (or go without).
Norman Peelman
The ratio of the number of brown/black outs to the number of
batteries/maintenance needed is severely lopsided. Batteries need
replacing and are very expensive.
--
Norman
Registered Linux user #461062
AMD64X2 6400+ Ubuntu 8.04 64bit
Randy
"JudyS" <no_e...@address.com> wrote in message
news:il0bvp$ni$1...@speranza.aioe.org...
Perhaps you might consider the Outback GFXor Zantrax XW grid intertie
inverters with a small battery bank to keep the power on when an outage
occurs.
My Outback FX2524T will run on two Wal-Mart RV deep cycles for $84.00 a
piece. As long as the sun shines, you will be able to use the solar you have
installed when the power is down. But after sundown, the batteries would
take care of lighting at best till the grid is restored. More battery
reserve does equal more cost and bother (I like to be bothered).
A nice compromise would be to add a built in generator that either the
Outback or Zantrax can control, might work for you, running only to recharge
the batteries as needed till sunrise.
Or as the other gentleman said a generator would work fine with your
Enphase, it would just run the whole time the grid is down while your solar
panels twiddle their thumbs in the sun (pick a quiet one please.)
Otherwise maybe just hooking a UPS up to your critical appliances might be
sufficient.
I have heard from others that had grid tie only systems purchased a battery
charger/ cheap inverter and battery for emergency use. Just size the battery
and inverter to your load and usage (with extra to spare).
Much of this depends on your load needs, reliability of the grid in your
locality and the amount of money in your purse.
I live in an Ice storm prone area so for me, lots of backup makes sense.
Hope this helps.
Randy
stevey
If your choice on Enhase is based on shady conditions then the premium
you pay
on a 4.5 KW (about $1300 over a conventional module and grid-tie
inverter plus the
cost of automatic transfer switch to disconnect your house from the
grid when it is
down ) is justified. Since Enphase implies AC grid connect.
Good Luck.
On Mar 6, 10:29 pm, "Randy" <randystol...@windstream.net> wrote:
> "JudyS" <no_em...@address.com> wrote in message
Randy
"Randy" <randys...@windstream.net> wrote in message
news:d2088$4d745130$d860088f$87...@ALLTEL.NET...
To get close to 4000 Watts a person would have to buy about 21 Enphase
inverters (perhaps 22.)
At Northern Arizona Wind and Sun they cost $227.50 a piece for a cost
without shipping: $4777.50
They list a Xantrex GT Series 4000 Watt Grid Tie Inverter for $2542.50
Yes you would need a combiner box and a few other details but I believe
the enphase would be more economical in a smaller system.
Hope this helps
Randy
Chris
Sorry to take so long to reply to your question. In regards to adding
a battery backup, you should check out my blog post on solar power for
homes:
http://thesolarpowerexpert.com/solar-power-for-homes/
I've got a flow chart/diagram of how to wire it all up. Your idea is a
good one and implementing a battery backup with a grid-tied inverter
is the best way to take financial advantage of recent net metering
laws. It's also handy for when the grid goes down, as you mentioned.
If you are handy with electronics (or know someone else who is) you
should check out the free charge controller:
http://www.freechargecontroller.org
In addition to functioning as a charge controller, it has plenty of
extra I/O to allow you to implement exactly what you want to do in
terms of an economical way to switch your home between battery power
and grid power.
Cheers!
Chris Troutner
http://www.thesolarpowerexpert.com
Randy
"Chris" <chris.t...@paccar.com> wrote in message
news:77141e6d-4be1-49ed...@y36g2000pra.googlegroups.com...
Hey Judy,
http://thesolarpowerexpert.com/solar-power-for-homes/
http://www.freechargecontroller.org
Cheers!
Chris Troutner
http://www.thesolarpowerexpert.com
Essentially The Outback GFX or Xantrax XW system.
All transfer switches built in with all UL and NEC required disconnects
during power outages for linemen safety. No fancy designs, just have a
standard electrician wire them up and you're good to go.
Both Zantrax and Outback have plenty of I/O.
I do believe plans may be free but to build can take time and money.
Sorry,am I wrong to be skeptical?
Or are we just disconnecting manually from the grid and having the Enphase
system run while trying to sell to the generator?
Perhaps I am missing something, it wouldn't be the first time.
Any way, if a problem crops up and your free charge controller overheats and
catches fire, was it UL listed or by some other testing company?
Your insurance company would like to know.
Any way The major companies go to extreme efforts to design and test
equipment so that linemen, consumers and all involved are kept absolutely
safe.
Its worth the money.
And truly, solar rarely saves you money till you have made it past R.O.I.
Companies that I have dealt with that can help you with any questions and
equipment that I would trust with my home are:
http://www.sunelec.com/ ....yes their prices are real and equipment first
rate.
http://www.solar-electric.com/ Good people, fast service, low shipping cost.
http://www.altestore.com/store/ Has everything, little pricier but good
store.
And wholesale solar, affordable solar, Infingy. There are other fine
retailers but these people have done well for me.
They all have information on the tried and true systems and their pluses and
minuses and are happy to talk with customers.
Randy (not an expert, just cautious)
Chris
is definitely an experimental set-up. That's why I said she should
only look into it if she's handy with electronics. I whole heartily
recommend the off-the-shelf components you recommend. The advantage of
the Free Charge Controller ( http://www.freechargecontroller.org ) is
that it's open source.
Also, just to clarify, the Free Charge Controller is just a charge
controller. It's not a grid-tied-inverter, so you don't have to worry
about UL rating or anti-islanding. However, it has the I/O to turn all
those things on and off. My original plan when designing it was to
have a central controller that could charge the batteries using MPPT
for maximum power transfer. Those batteries would then power a grid-
tied-inverter for selling power back to the grid. When the batteries
reached a pre-defined state of charge (SOC) then the controller would
disconnect the grid-tied-inverter from the batteries and the charging
cycle would continue.
Cheers!
Chris Troutner
http://www.thesolarpowerexpert.com
> Essentially The Outback GFX or Xantrax XW system.
> All transfer switches built in with all UL and NEC required disconnects
> during power outages for linemen safety. No fancy designs, just have a
> standard electrician wire them up and you're good to go.
> Both Zantrax and Outback have plenty of I/O.
> I do believe plans may be free but to build can take time and money.
> Sorry,am I wrong to be skeptical?
> Or are we just disconnecting manually from the grid and having the Enphase
> system run while trying to sell to the generator?
> Perhaps I am missing something, it wouldn't be the first time.
> Any way, if a problem crops up and your free charge controller overheats and
> catches fire, was it UL listed or by some other testing company?
> Your insurance company would like to know.
> Any way The major companies go to extreme efforts to design and test
> equipment so that linemen, consumers and all involved are kept absolutely
> safe.
> Its worth the money.
> And truly, solar rarely saves you money till you have made it past R.O.I.
> Companies that I have dealt with that can help you with any questions and
> equipment that I would trust with my home are:http://www.sunelec.com/....yes their prices are real and equipment first
> rate.http://www.solar-electric.com/Good people, fast service, low shipping cost.http://www.altestore.com/store/ Has everything, little pricier but good