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The Attack In Libya, How The U.S. Should Respond......the Libyans have to explain why the army spent seven hours waiting before it intervened.
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MattB
Sep 15, 2012, 10:17:13 PM9/15/12
to
The Attack In Libya, How The U.S. Should Respond
http://www.npr.org/2012/09/13/161091766/the-attack-in-libya-how-the-u-s-should-respond
This is TALK OF THE NATION. I'm Neal Conan at NPR West in Culver City,
California. Another attack on a U.S. embassy, this time protesters in
Yemen broke through the main gate and burned the American flag. They
chanted death to America. In Libya, more than 50 Marines arrived to
take over security at the U.S. Embassy in security with FBI evidence
teams also reportedly on the way and U.S. warships over the horizon.
President Obama said yesterday that the United States would work with
the Libyan government to bring justice to those who carried out the
attack that killed Ambassador Chris Stevens and three other Americans
in Benghazi, an attack that House Intelligence Committee Chair Mike
Rogers described to the Associated Press as a planned, coordinated,
well-executed, military-style event.
We still don't know who's behind that attack, exactly, or the
significance of the fact that it happened on 9/11. Just who produced,
financed and translated the amateurish anti-Islam film that sparked at
least some of the protests also remains murky.
If you have questions about what happened on Tuesday and where we go
from here, give us a call, 800-989-8255. Email ta...@npr.org. You can
also join the conversation on our website. That's at npr.org. Click on
TALK OF THE NATION.
Later in the program, to Jordan and that country's response to civil
war next door in Syria and to the flood of refugees. But first to
Benghazi and the Guardian's Libya correspondent Christopher Stephen,
he's with us by phone. Nice to have you with us today.
CHRISTOPHER STEPHEN: Thank you very much for having me.
CONAN: The attackers in Benghazi, well-armed, apparently
well-organized. Do we know anything more about who was behind this
assault?
STEPHEN: Well, we assume it was some sort of splinter group in the
Islamic faction. There are a number of predates here who have fallen
under the spotlight of suspicion. Exactly who it was remains unclear,
but certainly it was a very hard-line jihadist (unintelligible). Most
people in Benghazi say it was the same people who fired a rocket at
the British ambassador, who burned up the Red Cross compound, who
attacked the U.N. convoy and who destroyed British war graves earlier
this year.
CONAN: And in those previous incidents, did anybody take
responsibility?
STEPHEN: No one's ever taken responsibility, although in the case of
the war graves, they were filmed doing it. So a lot of diplomats have
said, well, you know, if the authorities wanted to make arrests these
past months, you know, they could have done so. No arrests have ever
been made for any of these things, and I think the pressure is now on
the authorities to explain why.
CONAN: And can you tell us more about what actually happened in this
assault? As I understand, the consulate headquarters itself was the
first target.
STEPHEN: That's right. The assault began at 11 o'clock that night,
when the protests degenerated into a firing. Who fired first, you
know, one can't say. There is a suggestion that the Libyan security
guards in the embassy fired over the heads of the crowd. But there was
a firefight. Eight of the 12 Libyan guards were wounded, and then the
crowd breached the wall.
The ambassador and two security guards then ran into a sort of
fortified compound, where the two guards were killed, and the
ambassador appears to have died from smoke inhalation. Now at the same
time, another group of diplomats managed to get into a Jeep and bust
out of the gates.
They came under fire. The Jeep was hit by bullets, but it was an
armored Jeep. It then drove a mile down the road to a second compound,
which is an accommodation compound, and they went in there. They
closed the gate. An hour later, that compound came under attack from
the same mob.
And I've been to see both compounds. I've been taken around by the
landlords. In the second compound, in the accommodation compound, an
RPG was fired at the roof, and there's a lot of blood where he says
that the fourth man was killed. So two diplomats and the ambassador
were killed in the consulate, one more at the accommodation compound.
He also says that the security guys in the accommodation compound
managed - they sort of turned it into an Alamo. They managed to fend
off the attack, and then at about dawn, security forces finally turned
up. And obviously if this is true, then the Libyans have to explain
why the army spent seven hours waiting before it intervened.
********************
So what will Obama do? The government took 7 hours to respond? Did
they aid in the attack?
Why did we help free these people? How many millions did we spend
doing so?
Obama the great fool.
http://www.npr.org/2012/09/13/161091766/the-attack-in-libya-how-the-u-s-should-respond
This is TALK OF THE NATION. I'm Neal Conan at NPR West in Culver City,
California. Another attack on a U.S. embassy, this time protesters in
Yemen broke through the main gate and burned the American flag. They
chanted death to America. In Libya, more than 50 Marines arrived to
take over security at the U.S. Embassy in security with FBI evidence
teams also reportedly on the way and U.S. warships over the horizon.
President Obama said yesterday that the United States would work with
the Libyan government to bring justice to those who carried out the
attack that killed Ambassador Chris Stevens and three other Americans
in Benghazi, an attack that House Intelligence Committee Chair Mike
Rogers described to the Associated Press as a planned, coordinated,
well-executed, military-style event.
We still don't know who's behind that attack, exactly, or the
significance of the fact that it happened on 9/11. Just who produced,
financed and translated the amateurish anti-Islam film that sparked at
least some of the protests also remains murky.
If you have questions about what happened on Tuesday and where we go
from here, give us a call, 800-989-8255. Email ta...@npr.org. You can
also join the conversation on our website. That's at npr.org. Click on
TALK OF THE NATION.
Later in the program, to Jordan and that country's response to civil
war next door in Syria and to the flood of refugees. But first to
Benghazi and the Guardian's Libya correspondent Christopher Stephen,
he's with us by phone. Nice to have you with us today.
CHRISTOPHER STEPHEN: Thank you very much for having me.
CONAN: The attackers in Benghazi, well-armed, apparently
well-organized. Do we know anything more about who was behind this
assault?
STEPHEN: Well, we assume it was some sort of splinter group in the
Islamic faction. There are a number of predates here who have fallen
under the spotlight of suspicion. Exactly who it was remains unclear,
but certainly it was a very hard-line jihadist (unintelligible). Most
people in Benghazi say it was the same people who fired a rocket at
the British ambassador, who burned up the Red Cross compound, who
attacked the U.N. convoy and who destroyed British war graves earlier
this year.
CONAN: And in those previous incidents, did anybody take
responsibility?
STEPHEN: No one's ever taken responsibility, although in the case of
the war graves, they were filmed doing it. So a lot of diplomats have
said, well, you know, if the authorities wanted to make arrests these
past months, you know, they could have done so. No arrests have ever
been made for any of these things, and I think the pressure is now on
the authorities to explain why.
CONAN: And can you tell us more about what actually happened in this
assault? As I understand, the consulate headquarters itself was the
first target.
STEPHEN: That's right. The assault began at 11 o'clock that night,
when the protests degenerated into a firing. Who fired first, you
know, one can't say. There is a suggestion that the Libyan security
guards in the embassy fired over the heads of the crowd. But there was
a firefight. Eight of the 12 Libyan guards were wounded, and then the
crowd breached the wall.
The ambassador and two security guards then ran into a sort of
fortified compound, where the two guards were killed, and the
ambassador appears to have died from smoke inhalation. Now at the same
time, another group of diplomats managed to get into a Jeep and bust
out of the gates.
They came under fire. The Jeep was hit by bullets, but it was an
armored Jeep. It then drove a mile down the road to a second compound,
which is an accommodation compound, and they went in there. They
closed the gate. An hour later, that compound came under attack from
the same mob.
And I've been to see both compounds. I've been taken around by the
landlords. In the second compound, in the accommodation compound, an
RPG was fired at the roof, and there's a lot of blood where he says
that the fourth man was killed. So two diplomats and the ambassador
were killed in the consulate, one more at the accommodation compound.
He also says that the security guys in the accommodation compound
managed - they sort of turned it into an Alamo. They managed to fend
off the attack, and then at about dawn, security forces finally turned
up. And obviously if this is true, then the Libyans have to explain
why the army spent seven hours waiting before it intervened.
********************
So what will Obama do? The government took 7 hours to respond? Did
they aid in the attack?
Why did we help free these people? How many millions did we spend
doing so?
Obama the great fool.
Message has been deleted
MattB
Sep 16, 2012, 1:07:17 AM9/16/12
to
On Sat, 15 Sep 2012 20:47:38 -0600, Yoor...@Jurgis.net wrote:
>On Sat, 15 Sep 2012 19:17:13 -0700, MattB <trdell1...@gmail.com>
>wrote:
>Islamic nations.
>
>How is this a brain surgery?
Then why do we waste American taxes with aid there. Let them eat
hate.
>On Sat, 15 Sep 2012 19:17:13 -0700, MattB <trdell1...@gmail.com>
>wrote:
>
>>This is TALK OF THE NATION. I'm Neal Conan at NPR West in Culver City,
>>California. Another attack on a U.S. embassy, this time protesters in
>>Yemen broke through the main gate and burned the American flag.
>
>Anti American sentiment is the default behavior in the mid east and
>>This is TALK OF THE NATION. I'm Neal Conan at NPR West in Culver City,
>>California. Another attack on a U.S. embassy, this time protesters in
>>Yemen broke through the main gate and burned the American flag.
>
>Islamic nations.
>
>How is this a brain surgery?
Then why do we waste American taxes with aid there. Let them eat
hate.
Malcolm McMahon
Sep 16, 2012, 8:47:40 AM9/16/12
to
Odds are pretty good that, ten years down the road, we'd be begging for petroleum from some nightmare of a pan-Arab caliphate who demanded we adopt Sharia law before we got any,
Message has been deleted
3184 Dead
Sep 16, 2012, 11:14:56 AM9/16/12
to
BTW, 99% of Libyans are not rioting. Shall we kill them in the name of
Jesus?
3184 Dead
Sep 16, 2012, 11:48:36 AM9/16/12
to
MattB
Sep 16, 2012, 12:54:47 PM9/16/12
to
radicals is if they win against those they consider enemies now they
will go after each other.
Sadly sooner or later one of them will get nukes use them on Israel
and Israel will turn the Kaaba into dust.
>
>
MattB
Sep 16, 2012, 1:01:24 PM9/16/12
to
On Sun, 16 Sep 2012 08:29:58 -0600, Yoor...@Jurgis.net wrote:
>On Sat, 15 Sep 2012 22:07:17 -0700, MattB <trdell1...@gmail.com>
>wrote:
>
>We give aid because the intense Jewish lobby, the political minefield
>if we don't protect Israel.
>
>Even though Israel stole the land there, made terrrorist attacks the
>same, and exhibits much of the same harsh behavior as those you
>condemn are doing.
Do you know that the Muslims most holy place was stolen by the thief
called Mohammed? Muslims did not build the Kaaba it was stolen in
murder. So go back far enough and everyone can find a reason for hate
and murder. American Indian have the same right to act as
Palestinians? NO. Can they fire missiles at you Apt? NO.
Both sides need to look at the future because Israel isn't going
anywhere.
What do you think the solution is?
>
>But---you support a racist hypocritical ideology that considers Obama
>an illegitmate president---all your posts infer it.
I've called Obama a bad President I called Bush a bad President. Can
you show one where I said he was " illegitimate"
>On Sat, 15 Sep 2012 22:07:17 -0700, MattB <trdell1...@gmail.com>
>wrote:
>
>>>Anti American sentiment is the default behavior in the mid east and
>>>Islamic nations.
>>>
>>>How is this a brain surgery?
>>
>>Then why do we waste American taxes with aid there. Let them eat
>>hate.
>
>Been telling you that post after post
>>>Anti American sentiment is the default behavior in the mid east and
>>>Islamic nations.
>>>
>>>How is this a brain surgery?
>>
>>Then why do we waste American taxes with aid there. Let them eat
>>hate.
>
>
>We give aid because the intense Jewish lobby, the political minefield
>if we don't protect Israel.
>
>Even though Israel stole the land there, made terrrorist attacks the
>same, and exhibits much of the same harsh behavior as those you
>condemn are doing.
Do you know that the Muslims most holy place was stolen by the thief
called Mohammed? Muslims did not build the Kaaba it was stolen in
murder. So go back far enough and everyone can find a reason for hate
and murder. American Indian have the same right to act as
Palestinians? NO. Can they fire missiles at you Apt? NO.
Both sides need to look at the future because Israel isn't going
anywhere.
What do you think the solution is?
>
>But---you support a racist hypocritical ideology that considers Obama
>an illegitmate president---all your posts infer it.
I've called Obama a bad President I called Bush a bad President. Can
you show one where I said he was " illegitimate"
MattB
Sep 16, 2012, 1:04:40 PM9/16/12
to
On Sun, 16 Sep 2012 15:14:56 +0000 (UTC), 3184 Dead <de...@gone.com>
mirror.
from a people they hate?
We can't pay our own bills so why pay theirs.
You sure do put down Christians so much.
wrote:
>On Sat, 15 Sep 2012 22:07:17 -0700, MattB wrote:
>
>> On Sat, 15 Sep 2012 20:47:38 -0600, Yoor...@Jurgis.net wrote:
>>
>>>On Sat, 15 Sep 2012 19:17:13 -0700, MattB <trdell1...@gmail.com>
>>>wrote:
>>>
>>>>This is TALK OF THE NATION. I'm Neal Conan at NPR West in Culver City,
>>>>California. Another attack on a U.S. embassy, this time protesters in
>>>>Yemen broke through the main gate and burned the American flag.
>>>
>>>Anti American sentiment is the default behavior in the mid east and
>>>Islamic nations.
>>>
>>>How is this a brain surgery?
>>
>> Then why do we waste American taxes with aid there. Let them eat hate.
>
>So they'll end up like you?
You are the one that supports Terrorist and gangs murders. Look in a
>On Sat, 15 Sep 2012 22:07:17 -0700, MattB wrote:
>
>> On Sat, 15 Sep 2012 20:47:38 -0600, Yoor...@Jurgis.net wrote:
>>
>>>On Sat, 15 Sep 2012 19:17:13 -0700, MattB <trdell1...@gmail.com>
>>>wrote:
>>>
>>>>This is TALK OF THE NATION. I'm Neal Conan at NPR West in Culver City,
>>>>California. Another attack on a U.S. embassy, this time protesters in
>>>>Yemen broke through the main gate and burned the American flag.
>>>
>>>Anti American sentiment is the default behavior in the mid east and
>>>Islamic nations.
>>>
>>>How is this a brain surgery?
>>
>> Then why do we waste American taxes with aid there. Let them eat hate.
>
>So they'll end up like you?
mirror.
>
>BTW, 99% of Libyans are not rioting. Shall we kill them in the name of
>Jesus?
Who said anything about killing. Cut all aid why would they want it
>BTW, 99% of Libyans are not rioting. Shall we kill them in the name of
>Jesus?
from a people they hate?
We can't pay our own bills so why pay theirs.
You sure do put down Christians so much.
Message has been deleted
Message has been deleted
MattB
Sep 16, 2012, 2:50:13 PM9/16/12
to
On Sun, 16 Sep 2012 12:30:54 -0600, Yoor...@Jurgis.net wrote:
>On Sun, 16 Sep 2012 10:04:40 -0700, MattB <trdell1...@gmail.com>
>wrote:
>yourself.
My Poor Stalker Malum Niger Yoorghis AKA Gary Roselles. Fits you
perfectly.
>
>>>BTW, 99% of Libyans are not rioting. Shall we kill them in the name of
>>>Jesus?
>>
>>Who said anything about killing. Cut all aid why would they want it
>>from a people they hate?
>
>Is that a good "Christian" thing to do?
The US government is a secular government.
>
>>We can't pay our own bills so why pay theirs.
>
>"We" can't pay our bills because the fucking waste and fraud committed
>by the party and ideology you support put the huge debt there.
Democrats are only partly to blame.
LOL You are having a fit of desperation here.
"'Have we not come to such an impasse in the modern world that we must
love our enemies - or else? The chain reaction of evil - hate
begetting hate, wars producing more wars - must be broken, or else we
shall be plunged into the dark abyss of annihilation.""MK
He could be talking about you. So you hate Martin Luther King? He
was Christian.
>On Sun, 16 Sep 2012 10:04:40 -0700, MattB <trdell1...@gmail.com>
>wrote:
>
>>On Sun, 16 Sep 2012 15:14:56 +0000 (UTC), 3184 Dead <de...@gone.com>
>>wrote:
>>
>>>On Sat, 15 Sep 2012 22:07:17 -0700, MattB wrote:
>>>
>>>> On Sat, 15 Sep 2012 20:47:38 -0600, Yoor...@Jurgis.net wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>On Sat, 15 Sep 2012 19:17:13 -0700, MattB <trdell1...@gmail.com>
>>>>>wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>This is TALK OF THE NATION. I'm Neal Conan at NPR West in Culver City,
>>>>>>California. Another attack on a U.S. embassy, this time protesters in
>>>>>>Yemen broke through the main gate and burned the American flag.
>>>>>
>>>>>Anti American sentiment is the default behavior in the mid east and
>>>>>Islamic nations.
>>>>>
>>>>>How is this a brain surgery?
>>>>
>>>> Then why do we waste American taxes with aid there. Let them eat hate.
>>>
>>>So they'll end up like you?
>>
>>You are the one that supports Terrorist and gangs murders. Look in a
>>mirror.
>
>THere ya go again. Typical winger calling someone what you are
>>On Sun, 16 Sep 2012 15:14:56 +0000 (UTC), 3184 Dead <de...@gone.com>
>>wrote:
>>
>>>On Sat, 15 Sep 2012 22:07:17 -0700, MattB wrote:
>>>
>>>> On Sat, 15 Sep 2012 20:47:38 -0600, Yoor...@Jurgis.net wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>On Sat, 15 Sep 2012 19:17:13 -0700, MattB <trdell1...@gmail.com>
>>>>>wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>This is TALK OF THE NATION. I'm Neal Conan at NPR West in Culver City,
>>>>>>California. Another attack on a U.S. embassy, this time protesters in
>>>>>>Yemen broke through the main gate and burned the American flag.
>>>>>
>>>>>Anti American sentiment is the default behavior in the mid east and
>>>>>Islamic nations.
>>>>>
>>>>>How is this a brain surgery?
>>>>
>>>> Then why do we waste American taxes with aid there. Let them eat hate.
>>>
>>>So they'll end up like you?
>>
>>You are the one that supports Terrorist and gangs murders. Look in a
>>mirror.
>
>yourself.
My Poor Stalker Malum Niger Yoorghis AKA Gary Roselles. Fits you
perfectly.
>
>>>BTW, 99% of Libyans are not rioting. Shall we kill them in the name of
>>>Jesus?
>>
>>Who said anything about killing. Cut all aid why would they want it
>>from a people they hate?
>
The US government is a secular government.
>
>>We can't pay our own bills so why pay theirs.
>
>by the party and ideology you support put the huge debt there.
Democrats are only partly to blame.
>
>>You sure do put down Christians so much.
>
>No---only fake christians like you.
>>You sure do put down Christians so much.
>
LOL You are having a fit of desperation here.
"'Have we not come to such an impasse in the modern world that we must
love our enemies - or else? The chain reaction of evil - hate
begetting hate, wars producing more wars - must be broken, or else we
shall be plunged into the dark abyss of annihilation.""MK
He could be talking about you. So you hate Martin Luther King? He
was Christian.
MattB
Sep 16, 2012, 3:03:08 PM9/16/12
to
On Sun, 16 Sep 2012 12:40:26 -0600, Yoor...@Jurgis.net wrote:
>On Sun, 16 Sep 2012 10:01:24 -0700, MattB <trdell1...@gmail.com>
>wrote:
>
>>On Sun, 16 Sep 2012 08:29:58 -0600, Yoor...@Jurgis.net wrote:
>>
>>>On Sat, 15 Sep 2012 22:07:17 -0700, MattB <trdell1...@gmail.com>
>>>wrote:
>>>
>>>>>Anti American sentiment is the default behavior in the mid east and
>>>>>Islamic nations.
>>>>>
>>>>>How is this a brain surgery?
>>>>
>>>>Then why do we waste American taxes with aid there. Let them eat
>>>>hate.
>>>
>>>Been telling you that post after post
>>>
>>>We give aid because the intense Jewish lobby, the political minefield
>>>if we don't protect Israel.
>>>
>>>Even though Israel stole the land there, made terrrorist attacks the
>>>same, and exhibits much of the same harsh behavior as those you
>>>condemn are doing.
>>
>>Do you know that the Muslims most holy place was stolen by the thief
>>called Mohammed?
>
>Is'nt that a religious story with no evidence to back it up?
>>On Sun, 16 Sep 2012 08:29:58 -0600, Yoor...@Jurgis.net wrote:
>>
>>>On Sat, 15 Sep 2012 22:07:17 -0700, MattB <trdell1...@gmail.com>
>>>wrote:
>>>
>>>>>Anti American sentiment is the default behavior in the mid east and
>>>>>Islamic nations.
>>>>>
>>>>>How is this a brain surgery?
>>>>
>>>>Then why do we waste American taxes with aid there. Let them eat
>>>>hate.
>>>
>>>Been telling you that post after post
>>>
>>>We give aid because the intense Jewish lobby, the political minefield
>>>if we don't protect Israel.
>>>
>>>Even though Israel stole the land there, made terrrorist attacks the
>>>same, and exhibits much of the same harsh behavior as those you
>>>condemn are doing.
>>
>>Do you know that the Muslims most holy place was stolen by the thief
>>called Mohammed?
>
Well that fits most religions. The Black Stone is said to put the
founding of Islam with a Mother goddess temple. The Kaaba predates
Islam and was said to be built by jews.
>
>Palestinians were living in Palestine---there was no Israel for
>centuries.
Canaanites were pagan not of Islam. So you think this war is good
going back 2000-4000 years for a reason to keep it going. Maybe the
west should declare all out war to extinction on Muslims since to you
think is no way to make peace.
How would you make peace?????
>
>Would you advocate Native Americans committing terrorist acts,
>bombing, and enlisting the aid of (say) Russia to supply them with
>rockets, weapons, material and intel to fight us?
No that is your reasoning not mine. You are the one making excuses to
terrorist and Murdering Gang members. I think you analogy is false
>
>>Both sides need to look at the future because Israel isn't going
>>anywhere.
>
>How do you have "both sides" do anything when "one side" has no
>>Both sides need to look at the future because Israel isn't going
>>anywhere.
>
>massive American backed army or influential contingent of wealthy
>donors and lobby groups here?
Seems I have heard this analogy except for another group from you.
Getting it.
>
>>What do you think the solution is?
>
>--stop unilateral support of Israel,
>--stop assigning "moral" value to Israel simply because of religious
>history with christianity;
>-- find politicians unwilling to kiss lobbyiest asses,
>--stop favoritism toward Israel, and
>--rid us of wingers who are susceptible to "emotional appeal" when
>speaking of "god, bible, freedom, liberty" dealing with non-relevant
>issues of that region.
Sorry my Eagle says no.
>
>>>But---you support a racist hypocritical ideology that considers Obama
>>>an illegitmate president---all your posts infer it.
>>
>>I've called Obama a bad President I called Bush a bad President. Can
>>you show one where I said he was " illegitimate"
>
>
>Your entire "defense" is predicated on the "Good German" who argued
>"They" did not "know" or agree that roasting/gassing/shooting all
>those Jews was correct.
>
>Their argument was always almost exactly what you claim
>
>"Show me where I said they should be gassed"
Show me where I said you did? Dementia seem to run in your family
Message has been deleted
Message has been deleted
MattB
Sep 16, 2012, 5:32:08 PM9/16/12
to
On Sun, 16 Sep 2012 15:18:57 -0600, Yoor...@Jurgis.net wrote:
>On Sun, 16 Sep 2012 11:50:13 -0700, MattB <trdell1...@gmail.com>
>wrote:
>
misspelled. You have been being laughed at. Got a few e-mails where
we got a laugh.
So not only do you lie your also a idiot. I'm a loon to you and you
are a Malum Niger to me. Get used to it as it is forever you name.
>On Sun, 16 Sep 2012 11:50:13 -0700, MattB <trdell1...@gmail.com>
>wrote:
>
>>>THere ya go again. Typical winger calling someone what you are
>>>yourself.
>>
>>
>>My Poor Stalker Malum Niger
OK Dumb Ass. That is latin for "EVIL BLACK" and no it isn't
>>>yourself.
>>
>>
>>My Poor Stalker Malum Niger
misspelled. You have been being laughed at. Got a few e-mails where
we got a laugh.
So not only do you lie your also a idiot. I'm a loon to you and you
are a Malum Niger to me. Get used to it as it is forever you name.
MattB
Sep 16, 2012, 5:36:39 PM9/16/12
to
On Sun, 16 Sep 2012 15:16:32 -0600, Yoor...@Jurgis.net wrote:
>On Sun, 16 Sep 2012 12:03:08 -0700, MattB <trdell1...@gmail.com>
>wrote:
Malum Niger there is evidence for the dating. As well as the history
of it. Then again you show your lack of true education.
>
>What we do know that the main foundation of the Judeo-christian
>Stories and "epics" were originally inscribed on Clay tablets in
>Sumeria 40 centuries before traditional jewish tradition.
>
>Everything else is conjecture, or unprovable nonsense.
You really hate Martin Luther King don't you what he was is all fake
to you.
Personally faith is a personal thing if a person wants to believe a
whatever I don't care as long as they don't force it on me.
I like the Wicca law of do as you will as long as you harm none.
The Bible and the Koran can be made to say about anything if taken out
of context.
>
>On Sun, 16 Sep 2012 12:03:08 -0700, MattB <trdell1...@gmail.com>
>wrote:
>
>>>>
>>>>Do you know that the Muslims most holy place was stolen by the thief
>>>>called Mohammed?
>>>
>>>Is'nt that a religious story with no evidence to back it up?
>>
>>Well that fits most religions. The Black Stone is said to put the
>>founding of Islam with a Mother goddess temple. The Kaaba predates
>>Islam and was said to be built by jews.
>
>Stories without any evidence are worthless, Loonboy
>>>>
>>>>Do you know that the Muslims most holy place was stolen by the thief
>>>>called Mohammed?
>>>
>>>Is'nt that a religious story with no evidence to back it up?
>>
>>Well that fits most religions. The Black Stone is said to put the
>>founding of Islam with a Mother goddess temple. The Kaaba predates
>>Islam and was said to be built by jews.
>
Malum Niger there is evidence for the dating. As well as the history
of it. Then again you show your lack of true education.
>
>What we do know that the main foundation of the Judeo-christian
>Stories and "epics" were originally inscribed on Clay tablets in
>Sumeria 40 centuries before traditional jewish tradition.
>
>Everything else is conjecture, or unprovable nonsense.
You really hate Martin Luther King don't you what he was is all fake
to you.
Personally faith is a personal thing if a person wants to believe a
whatever I don't care as long as they don't force it on me.
I like the Wicca law of do as you will as long as you harm none.
The Bible and the Koran can be made to say about anything if taken out
of context.
>
Message has been deleted
MattB
Sep 16, 2012, 7:53:41 PM9/16/12
to
On Sun, 16 Sep 2012 17:39:28 -0600, Yoor...@Jurgis.net wrote:
>On Sun, 16 Sep 2012 14:36:39 -0700, MattB <trdell1...@gmail.com>
>wrote:
>steal land?
We were talking about the origins of the Kaaba. Guess you forget.
>you've ever puked up.
You hate Christians and he was a good Christian.
>litany of "beliefs" and accept them solely on "faith"
Yes faith
>
>That don't make it truth.
>homophobic party do.
>
>The entire foundation of wingers republicanism is based on a set of
>belief that must be taken on 'faith'.
>
>Yet you demand them to be called "truth"
>
>Didn't you understand why Thomas Paine was moved to tell the founders
>not to let that happen?
Separation of Church and State I support 100% Applied to all
religions.
>On Sun, 16 Sep 2012 14:36:39 -0700, MattB <trdell1...@gmail.com>
>wrote:
>
>>>>Well that fits most religions. The Black Stone is said to put the
>>>>founding of Islam with a Mother goddess temple. The Kaaba predates
>>>>Islam and was said to be built by jews.
>>>
>>>Stories without any evidence are worthless, Loonboy
>>
>>>>Well that fits most religions. The Black Stone is said to put the
>>>>founding of Islam with a Mother goddess temple. The Kaaba predates
>>>>Islam and was said to be built by jews.
>>>
>>>Stories without any evidence are worthless, Loonboy
>>
>>there is evidence for the dating. As well as the history
>>of it. Then again you show your lack of true education.
>
>"Dating"? what's that got to do with an Israeli terrorist campaign to
>>of it. Then again you show your lack of true education.
>
>steal land?
We were talking about the origins of the Kaaba. Guess you forget.
>
>>>
>>>What we do know that the main foundation of the Judeo-christian
>>>Stories and "epics" were originally inscribed on Clay tablets in
>>>Sumeria 40 centuries before traditional jewish tradition.
>>>
>>>Everything else is conjecture, or unprovable nonsense.
>>
>>You really hate Martin Luther King don't you what he was is all fake
>>to you.
>
>??? That's got to be one of the more disconnected pieces of nonsense
>>>
>>>What we do know that the main foundation of the Judeo-christian
>>>Stories and "epics" were originally inscribed on Clay tablets in
>>>Sumeria 40 centuries before traditional jewish tradition.
>>>
>>>Everything else is conjecture, or unprovable nonsense.
>>
>>You really hate Martin Luther King don't you what he was is all fake
>>to you.
>
>you've ever puked up.
You hate Christians and he was a good Christian.
>
>>Personally faith is a personal thing if a person wants to believe a
>>whatever I don't care as long as they don't force it on me.
>
>"Faith" in something does not require it to be true. You can have a
>>Personally faith is a personal thing if a person wants to believe a
>>whatever I don't care as long as they don't force it on me.
>
>litany of "beliefs" and accept them solely on "faith"
Yes faith
>
>That don't make it truth.
>
>>The Bible and the Koran can be made to say about anything if taken out
>>of context.
>
>Which is exactly what the fundamentalist who are in your racist,
>>The Bible and the Koran can be made to say about anything if taken out
>>of context.
>
>homophobic party do.
>
>The entire foundation of wingers republicanism is based on a set of
>belief that must be taken on 'faith'.
>
>Yet you demand them to be called "truth"
>
>Didn't you understand why Thomas Paine was moved to tell the founders
>not to let that happen?
Separation of Church and State I support 100% Applied to all
religions.
Message has been deleted
Message has been deleted
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MattB
Sep 16, 2012, 11:28:51 PM9/16/12
to
On Sun, 16 Sep 2012 20:53:15 -0600, Yoor...@Jurgis.net wrote:
>On Sun, 16 Sep 2012 16:53:41 -0700, MattB <trdell1...@gmail.com>
>wrote:
>ideology and the party you do when they are putting religious dogma
>into law?
I don't blindly follow whatever the Republicans say. Ask Eddie from
here he can confirm that. Then again I support many issues the
Republicans want and a few the Democrats want.
To you it is either all one or the other. Not so. Matt T is more
moderate than left and I am more moderate than right.
Race is a personal choice with me. To treat people as equals it has
nothing to do with political beliefs. Same with Religion. Neither
race or religion effects who I vote for.
>On Sun, 16 Sep 2012 16:53:41 -0700, MattB <trdell1...@gmail.com>
>wrote:
>
>>>>The Bible and the Koran can be made to say about anything if taken out
>>>>of context.
>>>
>>>Which is exactly what the fundamentalist who are in your racist,
>>>homophobic party do.
>>>
>>>The entire foundation of wingers republicanism is based on a set of
>>>belief that must be taken on 'faith'.
>>>
>>>Yet you demand them to be called "truth"
>>>
>>>Didn't you understand why Thomas Paine was moved to tell the founders
>>>not to let that happen?
>>
>>Separation of Church and State I support 100% Applied to all
>>religions.
>
>THen (again because you're so dense)----why do you support a political
>>>>The Bible and the Koran can be made to say about anything if taken out
>>>>of context.
>>>
>>>Which is exactly what the fundamentalist who are in your racist,
>>>homophobic party do.
>>>
>>>The entire foundation of wingers republicanism is based on a set of
>>>belief that must be taken on 'faith'.
>>>
>>>Yet you demand them to be called "truth"
>>>
>>>Didn't you understand why Thomas Paine was moved to tell the founders
>>>not to let that happen?
>>
>>Separation of Church and State I support 100% Applied to all
>>religions.
>
>ideology and the party you do when they are putting religious dogma
>into law?
I don't blindly follow whatever the Republicans say. Ask Eddie from
here he can confirm that. Then again I support many issues the
Republicans want and a few the Democrats want.
To you it is either all one or the other. Not so. Matt T is more
moderate than left and I am more moderate than right.
Race is a personal choice with me. To treat people as equals it has
nothing to do with political beliefs. Same with Religion. Neither
race or religion effects who I vote for.
MattB
Sep 16, 2012, 11:40:12 PM9/16/12
to
On Sun, 16 Sep 2012 20:49:08 -0600, Yoor...@Jurgis.net wrote:
>On Sun, 16 Sep 2012 16:53:41 -0700, MattB <trdell1...@gmail.com>
>wrote:
>
>On Sun, 16 Sep 2012 16:53:41 -0700, MattB <trdell1...@gmail.com>
>wrote:
>
>>>"Dating"? what's that got to do with an Israeli terrorist campaign to
>>>steal land?
>>
>>We were talking about the origins of the Kaaba. Guess you forget.
>>>
>
>What does that have to do with Israelis using terrorism, military
>>>steal land?
>>
>>We were talking about the origins of the Kaaba. Guess you forget.
>>>
>
>force, and totalitarian behavior to steal land?
Nothing at all. Again you cut and paste to hide your deceit. Normal
liberal?
MattB
Sep 16, 2012, 11:42:09 PM9/16/12
to
On Sun, 16 Sep 2012 20:50:35 -0600, Yoor...@Jurgis.net wrote:
>On Sun, 16 Sep 2012 16:53:41 -0700, MattB <trdell1...@gmail.com>
>wrote:
>
>On Sun, 16 Sep 2012 16:53:41 -0700, MattB <trdell1...@gmail.com>
>wrote:
>
>>>>You really hate Martin Luther King don't you what he was is all fake
>>>>to you.
>>>
>>>??? That's got to be one of the more disconnected pieces of nonsense
>>>you've ever puked up.
>>
>>You hate Christians and he was a good Christian.
>>>
>
>YOUR ideological base is who hated him, you ignorant moron.
>>>>to you.
>>>
>>>??? That's got to be one of the more disconnected pieces of nonsense
>>>you've ever puked up.
>>
>>You hate Christians and he was a good Christian.
>>>
>
Not all of them did. Did you interview each one?
>
>They still do
>
>They are currrently filing law suits, conducting subversive policy,
>and even openly attempting voter suppression.
LOL The courts won't allow it. The radicals on both sides won't
get what they want. You sure won't.
>
>You get more stupid each post.
No and your cut and paste lying really doesn't work.
MattB
Sep 16, 2012, 11:44:31 PM9/16/12
to
On Sun, 16 Sep 2012 20:51:40 -0600, Yoor...@Jurgis.net wrote:
>On Sun, 16 Sep 2012 16:53:41 -0700, MattB <trdell1...@gmail.com>
>wrote:
>
>On Sun, 16 Sep 2012 16:53:41 -0700, MattB <trdell1...@gmail.com>
>wrote:
>
>>>>Personally faith is a personal thing if a person wants to believe a
>>>>whatever I don't care as long as they don't force it on me.
>>>
>>>"Faith" in something does not require it to be true. You can have a
>>>litany of "beliefs" and accept them solely on "faith"
>>
>>Yes faith
>
>...Is required to believe when no evidence supports you.
>>>>whatever I don't care as long as they don't force it on me.
>>>
>>>"Faith" in something does not require it to be true. You can have a
>>>litany of "beliefs" and accept them solely on "faith"
>>
>>Yes faith
>
>
>"Beliefs" do not require truth.
>
>There is no truth to most of what you believe.
That is your opinion and you have a right to it. So your are a
radicalized Atheist it seems. wanting to force your none belief on
the rest of us.
You are no better than Fred Phelps or Terry Jones.
Well have a good night.
Message has been deleted
Malcolm McMahon
Sep 17, 2012, 6:59:59 AM9/17/12
to
On Sunday, 16 September 2012 17:50:25 UTC+1, MattB wrote:
> On Sun, 16 Sep 2012 05:47:40 -0700 (PDT), Malcolm McMahon
>
> <malcol...@googlemail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> >On Sunday, 16 September 2012 06:02:01 UTC+1, MattB wrote:
>
> >> On Sat, 15 Sep 2012 20:47:38 -0600, Yoor...@Jurgis.net wrote:
>
> >>
>
> >>
>
> >>
>
> >> >On Sat, 15 Sep 2012 19:17:13 -0700, MattB <trdell1...@gmail.com>
>
> >>
>
> >> >wrote:
>
> >>
>
> >> >
>
> >>
>
> >> >>This is TALK OF THE NATION. I'm Neal Conan at NPR West in Culver City,
>
> >>
>
> >> >>California. Another attack on a U.S. embassy, this time protesters in
>
> >>
>
> >> >>Yemen broke through the main gate and burned the American flag.
>
> >>
>
> >> >
>
> >>
>
> >> >Anti American sentiment is the default behavior in the mid east and
>
> >>
>
> >> >Islamic nations.
>
> >>
>
> >> >
>
> >>
>
> >> >How is this a brain surgery?
>
> >>
>
> >>
>
> >>
>
> >> Then why do we waste American taxes with aid there. Let them eat
>
> >>
>
> >> hate.
>
> >
>
> >Suppose we did do what terrorism against the West is primarily designed to do, and left the Middle East to it's own devices.
>
> >
>
> >Odds are pretty good that, ten years down the road, we'd be begging for petroleum from some nightmare of a pan-Arab caliphate who demanded we adopt Sharia law before we got any,
>
>
>
> Without oil sales these countries are nothing.
What you don't get is that these guys despise affluence. It's power over people they crave.
> On Sun, 16 Sep 2012 05:47:40 -0700 (PDT), Malcolm McMahon
>
> <malcol...@googlemail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> >On Sunday, 16 September 2012 06:02:01 UTC+1, MattB wrote:
>
> >> On Sat, 15 Sep 2012 20:47:38 -0600, Yoor...@Jurgis.net wrote:
>
> >>
>
> >>
>
> >>
>
> >> >On Sat, 15 Sep 2012 19:17:13 -0700, MattB <trdell1...@gmail.com>
>
> >>
>
> >> >wrote:
>
> >>
>
> >> >
>
> >>
>
> >> >>This is TALK OF THE NATION. I'm Neal Conan at NPR West in Culver City,
>
> >>
>
> >> >>California. Another attack on a U.S. embassy, this time protesters in
>
> >>
>
> >> >>Yemen broke through the main gate and burned the American flag.
>
> >>
>
> >> >
>
> >>
>
> >> >Anti American sentiment is the default behavior in the mid east and
>
> >>
>
> >> >Islamic nations.
>
> >>
>
> >> >
>
> >>
>
> >> >How is this a brain surgery?
>
> >>
>
> >>
>
> >>
>
> >> Then why do we waste American taxes with aid there. Let them eat
>
> >>
>
> >> hate.
>
> >
>
> >Suppose we did do what terrorism against the West is primarily designed to do, and left the Middle East to it's own devices.
>
> >
>
> >Odds are pretty good that, ten years down the road, we'd be begging for petroleum from some nightmare of a pan-Arab caliphate who demanded we adopt Sharia law before we got any,
>
>
>
> Without oil sales these countries are nothing.
> What I see in the
>
> radicals is if they win against those they consider enemies now they
>
> will go after each other.
>
Message has been deleted
Message has been deleted
Message has been deleted
Message has been deleted
MattB
Sep 17, 2012, 2:50:24 PM9/17/12
to
On Mon, 17 Sep 2012 03:59:59 -0700 (PDT), Malcolm McMahon
defends then and China Blue.
>
>> What I see in the
>>
>> radicals is if they win against those they consider enemies now they
>>
>> will go after each other.
>>
>
>I wouldn't count on it, they all want, basically, the same thing - to return to about the 14th century, re-create the Arabian Nights.
LOL The Islamist are rather backwards.
>
<malcol...@googlemail.com> wrote:
>On Sunday, 16 September 2012 17:50:25 UTC+1, MattB wrote:
>> On Sun, 16 Sep 2012 05:47:40 -0700 (PDT), Malcolm McMahon
>>
>> <malcol...@googlemail.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>> >On Sunday, 16 September 2012 06:02:01 UTC+1, MattB wrote:
>>
>> >> On Sat, 15 Sep 2012 20:47:38 -0600, Yoor...@Jurgis.net wrote:
>>
>> >>
>>
>> >>
>>
>> >>
>>
>> >> >On Sat, 15 Sep 2012 19:17:13 -0700, MattB <trdell1...@gmail.com>
>>
>> >>
>>
>> >> >wrote:
>>
>> >>
>>
>> >> >
>>
>> >>
>>
>> >> >>This is TALK OF THE NATION. I'm Neal Conan at NPR West in Culver City,
>>
>> >>
>>
>> >> >>California. Another attack on a U.S. embassy, this time protesters in
>>
>> >>
>>
>> >> >>Yemen broke through the main gate and burned the American flag.
>>
>> >>
>>
>> >> >
>>
>> >>
>>
>> >> >Anti American sentiment is the default behavior in the mid east and
>>
>> >>
>>
>> >> >Islamic nations.
>>
>> >>
>>
>> >> >
>>
>> >>
>>
>> >> >How is this a brain surgery?
>>
>> >>
>>
>> >>
>>
>> >>
>>
>> >> Then why do we waste American taxes with aid there. Let them eat
>>
>> >>
>>
>> >> hate.
>>
>> >
>>
>> >Suppose we did do what terrorism against the West is primarily designed to do, and left the Middle East to it's own devices.
>>
>> >
>>
>> >Odds are pretty good that, ten years down the road, we'd be begging for petroleum from some nightmare of a pan-Arab caliphate who demanded we adopt Sharia law before we got any,
>>
>>
>>
>> Without oil sales these countries are nothing.
>
>What you don't get is that these guys despise affluence. It's power over people they crave.
You are saying they are just like the Far Left. No wonder Gary
>On Sunday, 16 September 2012 17:50:25 UTC+1, MattB wrote:
>> On Sun, 16 Sep 2012 05:47:40 -0700 (PDT), Malcolm McMahon
>>
>> <malcol...@googlemail.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>> >On Sunday, 16 September 2012 06:02:01 UTC+1, MattB wrote:
>>
>> >> On Sat, 15 Sep 2012 20:47:38 -0600, Yoor...@Jurgis.net wrote:
>>
>> >>
>>
>> >>
>>
>> >>
>>
>> >> >On Sat, 15 Sep 2012 19:17:13 -0700, MattB <trdell1...@gmail.com>
>>
>> >>
>>
>> >> >wrote:
>>
>> >>
>>
>> >> >
>>
>> >>
>>
>> >> >>This is TALK OF THE NATION. I'm Neal Conan at NPR West in Culver City,
>>
>> >>
>>
>> >> >>California. Another attack on a U.S. embassy, this time protesters in
>>
>> >>
>>
>> >> >>Yemen broke through the main gate and burned the American flag.
>>
>> >>
>>
>> >> >
>>
>> >>
>>
>> >> >Anti American sentiment is the default behavior in the mid east and
>>
>> >>
>>
>> >> >Islamic nations.
>>
>> >>
>>
>> >> >
>>
>> >>
>>
>> >> >How is this a brain surgery?
>>
>> >>
>>
>> >>
>>
>> >>
>>
>> >> Then why do we waste American taxes with aid there. Let them eat
>>
>> >>
>>
>> >> hate.
>>
>> >
>>
>> >Suppose we did do what terrorism against the West is primarily designed to do, and left the Middle East to it's own devices.
>>
>> >
>>
>> >Odds are pretty good that, ten years down the road, we'd be begging for petroleum from some nightmare of a pan-Arab caliphate who demanded we adopt Sharia law before we got any,
>>
>>
>>
>> Without oil sales these countries are nothing.
>
>What you don't get is that these guys despise affluence. It's power over people they crave.
defends then and China Blue.
>
>> What I see in the
>>
>> radicals is if they win against those they consider enemies now they
>>
>> will go after each other.
>>
>
>I wouldn't count on it, they all want, basically, the same thing - to return to about the 14th century, re-create the Arabian Nights.
>
MattB
Sep 17, 2012, 2:52:48 PM9/17/12
to
On Mon, 17 Sep 2012 08:46:06 -0600, Yoor...@Jurgis.net wrote:
>On Sun, 16 Sep 2012 20:40:12 -0700, MattB <trdell1...@gmail.com>
>wrote:
You are really not worth talking with anymore. We are discussing the
origins of the Kaaba and you now think that involves Israel today.
You are a joke and rather stupid.
BE Well
Matt
>On Sun, 16 Sep 2012 20:40:12 -0700, MattB <trdell1...@gmail.com>
>wrote:
>
>>>>We were talking about the origins of the Kaaba. Guess you forget.
>>>>>
>>>
>>>What does that have to do with Israelis using terrorism, military
>>>force, and totalitarian behavior to steal land?
>>
>>
>>Nothing at all.
>
>See how easy it is to destroy your silly "beliefs"?
>>>>We were talking about the origins of the Kaaba. Guess you forget.
>>>>>
>>>
>>>What does that have to do with Israelis using terrorism, military
>>>force, and totalitarian behavior to steal land?
>>
>>
>>Nothing at all.
>
You are really not worth talking with anymore. We are discussing the
origins of the Kaaba and you now think that involves Israel today.
You are a joke and rather stupid.
BE Well
Matt
MattB
Sep 17, 2012, 2:58:25 PM9/17/12
to
On Mon, 17 Sep 2012 08:45:33 -0600, Yoor...@Jurgis.net wrote:
>On Sun, 16 Sep 2012 20:44:31 -0700, MattB <trdell1...@gmail.com>
>"faith" that something is "true"
Yes and I have admitted that. Several times you ignore that fact.
>
>There is no evidence that anything in the bible/religion is true.
That isn't true some history is provable.
>
>Some things are historically provable, most are out of context because
>there is a differential between the time period they are described
>historically, and the actual events when we can prove they happened.
OK
>
>The bottom line is---you cannot say that religion provides evidence to
>support your political beliefs
I said it did not. Remember. Religion has no part in who I vote for
nor does a persons race.
>
>Everything you've managed to spam here---can be rebutted because 99 %
>of it has no factual basis---it's merely "your opinion"
True and some share my opinion some don't. That is why they are a
opinion.
>
>The fact of the matter is---that even "Opinions" MUST have backing of
>evidence and facts.
No that isn't true. Obama is a bad President is a opinion and a fact
to me.
>
>Otherwise they are vacuous prejudicial statements.
Well with you we have seen that your opinion is Biased toward race and
not fact many times.
Like when you claim to read a persons mind.
>On Sun, 16 Sep 2012 20:44:31 -0700, MattB <trdell1...@gmail.com>
>wrote:
>
>>On Sun, 16 Sep 2012 20:51:40 -0600, Yoor...@Jurgis.net wrote:
>>
>>>On Sun, 16 Sep 2012 16:53:41 -0700, MattB <trdell1...@gmail.com>
>>>wrote:
>>>
>>>>>>Personally faith is a personal thing if a person wants to believe a
>>>>>>whatever I don't care as long as they don't force it on me.
>>>>>
>>>>>"Faith" in something does not require it to be true. You can have a
>>>>>litany of "beliefs" and accept them solely on "faith"
>>>>
>>>>Yes faith
>>>
>>>...Is required to believe when no evidence supports you.
>>>
>>>"Beliefs" do not require truth.
>>>
>>>There is no truth to most of what you believe.
>>
>>
>>That is your opinion and you have a right to it. So your are a
>>radicalized Atheist it seems. wanting to force your none belief on
>>the rest of us.
>
>You don't have to be an "atheist" to understand that religion requires
>
>>On Sun, 16 Sep 2012 20:51:40 -0600, Yoor...@Jurgis.net wrote:
>>
>>>On Sun, 16 Sep 2012 16:53:41 -0700, MattB <trdell1...@gmail.com>
>>>wrote:
>>>
>>>>>>Personally faith is a personal thing if a person wants to believe a
>>>>>>whatever I don't care as long as they don't force it on me.
>>>>>
>>>>>"Faith" in something does not require it to be true. You can have a
>>>>>litany of "beliefs" and accept them solely on "faith"
>>>>
>>>>Yes faith
>>>
>>>...Is required to believe when no evidence supports you.
>>>
>>>"Beliefs" do not require truth.
>>>
>>>There is no truth to most of what you believe.
>>
>>
>>That is your opinion and you have a right to it. So your are a
>>radicalized Atheist it seems. wanting to force your none belief on
>>the rest of us.
>
>"faith" that something is "true"
Yes and I have admitted that. Several times you ignore that fact.
>
>There is no evidence that anything in the bible/religion is true.
That isn't true some history is provable.
>
>Some things are historically provable, most are out of context because
>there is a differential between the time period they are described
>historically, and the actual events when we can prove they happened.
OK
>
>The bottom line is---you cannot say that religion provides evidence to
>support your political beliefs
I said it did not. Remember. Religion has no part in who I vote for
nor does a persons race.
>
>Everything you've managed to spam here---can be rebutted because 99 %
>of it has no factual basis---it's merely "your opinion"
True and some share my opinion some don't. That is why they are a
opinion.
>
>The fact of the matter is---that even "Opinions" MUST have backing of
>evidence and facts.
No that isn't true. Obama is a bad President is a opinion and a fact
to me.
>
>Otherwise they are vacuous prejudicial statements.
Well with you we have seen that your opinion is Biased toward race and
not fact many times.
Like when you claim to read a persons mind.
Message has been deleted
MattB
Sep 17, 2012, 3:03:42 PM9/17/12
to
On Mon, 17 Sep 2012 11:07:18 -0700, The Great Firewall of China Blue
<chine...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>In article <mkde58ptf84f5nv1t...@4ax.com>, Yoor...@Jurgis.net
>wrote:
>true. Any presentation of 'evidence' invokes a circular argument: you need to
>make assumptions about the nature of reality simply to recognise something
>exists and is evidence.
>
>There are even examples within science of data being uninterpretted until there
>was a theory that interpretted it and turned it into evidence. This applies more
>generally that you must have a context to perceive and interpret data; the usual
>rationalisation that science is not based on beliefs is to circularly argue that
>the evidence created by science proves science.
>
>Christianity provides a validity test which is just a valid, with respect to
>assumptions of christianity, as a science experiment, with respect to
>assumptions of scientific method. Revelations can be valid evidence once you
>have accepted christian beliefs: the usual blather about objective evidence is
>just deliberate confusion of applying the beliefs of different contexts to the
>same data and then claiming the differring interpretations prove something about
>the beliefs that provide the interpretation.
>
>So it's bullshit. And it's bullshit all the way down.
>
>Is there a way to transcend all belief to get to the absolute truth? Maybe a god
>can do that. Maybe being a god means creating your own absolute truth. Are you a
>god? So what proof of reality can a mere human have. Some Hindus find their
>beliefs give them a rich and meaningful life. So do some atheists with a
>different set of beliefs. Perhaps it would be better to stop telling others what
>to believe and concentrate on having the best life you can have, and wishing the
>same for everyone else.
I like your last sentence very much and find it people did that the
world would be so much better.
<chine...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>In article <mkde58ptf84f5nv1t...@4ax.com>, Yoor...@Jurgis.net
>wrote:
>
>> There is no evidence that anything in the bible/religion is true.
>
>There is no evidence any belief system, such as buddhism, shinto, or science is
>> There is no evidence that anything in the bible/religion is true.
>
>true. Any presentation of 'evidence' invokes a circular argument: you need to
>make assumptions about the nature of reality simply to recognise something
>exists and is evidence.
>
>There are even examples within science of data being uninterpretted until there
>was a theory that interpretted it and turned it into evidence. This applies more
>generally that you must have a context to perceive and interpret data; the usual
>rationalisation that science is not based on beliefs is to circularly argue that
>the evidence created by science proves science.
>
>Christianity provides a validity test which is just a valid, with respect to
>assumptions of christianity, as a science experiment, with respect to
>assumptions of scientific method. Revelations can be valid evidence once you
>have accepted christian beliefs: the usual blather about objective evidence is
>just deliberate confusion of applying the beliefs of different contexts to the
>same data and then claiming the differring interpretations prove something about
>the beliefs that provide the interpretation.
>
>So it's bullshit. And it's bullshit all the way down.
>
>Is there a way to transcend all belief to get to the absolute truth? Maybe a god
>can do that. Maybe being a god means creating your own absolute truth. Are you a
>god? So what proof of reality can a mere human have. Some Hindus find their
>beliefs give them a rich and meaningful life. So do some atheists with a
>different set of beliefs. Perhaps it would be better to stop telling others what
>to believe and concentrate on having the best life you can have, and wishing the
>same for everyone else.
I like your last sentence very much and find it people did that the
world would be so much better.
MattB
Sep 17, 2012, 3:08:53 PM9/17/12
to
On Sun, 16 Sep 2012 21:31:29 -0700, The Great Firewall of China Blue
<chine...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>In article <if1c58t4mvkhp32lr...@4ax.com>,
> MattB <trdell1...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Who said anything about killing. Cut all aid why would they want it
>> from a people they hate?
>
>Because most of them aren't riotting, and the influence is enormous for a
>miniscule cost.
You might be right diplomacy isn't my strong point. I just believe
most of that aid is a waste. Do the normal people even know? Is it
used to subsidize the government so they can use there own funds for
projects that are wrong.
<chine...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>In article <if1c58t4mvkhp32lr...@4ax.com>,
> MattB <trdell1...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Who said anything about killing. Cut all aid why would they want it
>> from a people they hate?
>
>Because most of them aren't riotting, and the influence is enormous for a
>miniscule cost.
You might be right diplomacy isn't my strong point. I just believe
most of that aid is a waste. Do the normal people even know? Is it
used to subsidize the government so they can use there own funds for
projects that are wrong.
MattB
Sep 17, 2012, 3:33:39 PM9/17/12
to
On Mon, 17 Sep 2012 12:57:19 -0600, Yoor...@Jurgis.net wrote:
>On Mon, 17 Sep 2012 11:52:48 -0700, MattB <trdell1...@gmail.com>
>wrote:
>terrorism to steal land, then subjugate those living there under a
>government they did not choose.
No that isn't so and you'd not have cut the post up like this if it
was. Just another lie by Malum Niger Yoorghis AKA Gary Roselles.
>
>THis isn't a religion NG.
No but you aren't its moderator either., You are powerless. That is
why you attack so many people here, that doesn't make up for the
failure you were to yourself and your family. I pity them and you.
>
>IDIOT.
>On Mon, 17 Sep 2012 11:52:48 -0700, MattB <trdell1...@gmail.com>
>wrote:
>
>>You are really not worth talking with anymore. We are discussing the
>>origins of the Kaaba and you now think that involves Israel today.
>
>No, we were "discussing" the reasons why Israel had no "right" to use
>>You are really not worth talking with anymore. We are discussing the
>>origins of the Kaaba and you now think that involves Israel today.
>
>terrorism to steal land, then subjugate those living there under a
>government they did not choose.
No that isn't so and you'd not have cut the post up like this if it
was. Just another lie by Malum Niger Yoorghis AKA Gary Roselles.
>
>THis isn't a religion NG.
No but you aren't its moderator either., You are powerless. That is
why you attack so many people here, that doesn't make up for the
failure you were to yourself and your family. I pity them and you.
>
>IDIOT.
Message has been deleted
MattB
Sep 17, 2012, 7:19:54 PM9/17/12
to
On Mon, 17 Sep 2012 16:57:27 -0600, Yoor...@Jurgis.net wrote:
>On Mon, 17 Sep 2012 12:33:39 -0700, MattB <trdell1...@gmail.com>
>
>You wanna discuss religious nuttery---go to alt.religion
Sorry you don't like what I post shove it. You are powerless to do
anything about it.
Just for you I'll post a few religion post.
>On Mon, 17 Sep 2012 12:33:39 -0700, MattB <trdell1...@gmail.com>
>wrote:
>
>>>>You are really not worth talking with anymore. We are discussing the
>>>>origins of the Kaaba and you now think that involves Israel today.
>>>
>>>No, we were "discussing" the reasons why Israel had no "right" to use
>>>terrorism to steal land, then subjugate those living there under a
>>>government they did not choose.
>>
>>No that isn't so and you'd not have cut the post up like this if it
>>was.
>
>You doing the "evasion thing"
>
>>>>You are really not worth talking with anymore. We are discussing the
>>>>origins of the Kaaba and you now think that involves Israel today.
>>>
>>>No, we were "discussing" the reasons why Israel had no "right" to use
>>>terrorism to steal land, then subjugate those living there under a
>>>government they did not choose.
>>
>>No that isn't so and you'd not have cut the post up like this if it
>>was.
>
>
>You wanna discuss religious nuttery---go to alt.religion
Sorry you don't like what I post shove it. You are powerless to do
anything about it.
Just for you I'll post a few religion post.
Message has been deleted
MattB
Sep 18, 2012, 2:36:56 AM9/18/12
to
On Mon, 17 Sep 2012 21:48:22 -0600, Yoor...@Jurgis.net wrote:
>On Mon, 17 Sep 2012 16:19:54 -0700, MattB <trdell1...@gmail.com>
>
>I Laugh at your posts.
>
>
>
>>===========================================================
>
>
>>On Thu, 06 Sep 2012 11:50:03 -0700, MattB <trdel...@gmail.com>
>>wrote:
>
>I consider you use of the word Loon to be racist so is it Ok if I call
>you Coonboy?
My Stalker Malum Niger Yoorghis AKA Gary Roselles.
>On Mon, 17 Sep 2012 16:19:54 -0700, MattB <trdell1...@gmail.com>
>wrote:
>
>>On Mon, 17 Sep 2012 16:57:27 -0600, Yoor...@Jurgis.net wrote:
>>
>>>On Mon, 17 Sep 2012 12:33:39 -0700, MattB <trdell1...@gmail.com>
>>>wrote:
>>>
>>>>>>You are really not worth talking with anymore. We are discussing the
>>>>>>origins of the Kaaba and you now think that involves Israel today.
>>>>>
>>>>>No, we were "discussing" the reasons why Israel had no "right" to use
>>>>>terrorism to steal land, then subjugate those living there under a
>>>>>government they did not choose.
>>>>
>>>>No that isn't so and you'd not have cut the post up like this if it
>>>>was.
>>>
>>>You doing the "evasion thing"
>>>
>>>You wanna discuss religious nuttery---go to alt.religion
>>
>>
>>Sorry you don't like what I post shove it.
>
>"don't like"----is just another silly conclusion of your
>
>>On Mon, 17 Sep 2012 16:57:27 -0600, Yoor...@Jurgis.net wrote:
>>
>>>On Mon, 17 Sep 2012 12:33:39 -0700, MattB <trdell1...@gmail.com>
>>>wrote:
>>>
>>>>>>You are really not worth talking with anymore. We are discussing the
>>>>>>origins of the Kaaba and you now think that involves Israel today.
>>>>>
>>>>>No, we were "discussing" the reasons why Israel had no "right" to use
>>>>>terrorism to steal land, then subjugate those living there under a
>>>>>government they did not choose.
>>>>
>>>>No that isn't so and you'd not have cut the post up like this if it
>>>>was.
>>>
>>>You doing the "evasion thing"
>>>
>>>You wanna discuss religious nuttery---go to alt.religion
>>
>>
>>Sorry you don't like what I post shove it.
>
>
>I Laugh at your posts.
>
>
>
>>===========================================================
>
>
>>On Thu, 06 Sep 2012 11:50:03 -0700, MattB <trdel...@gmail.com>
>>wrote:
>
>I consider you use of the word Loon to be racist so is it Ok if I call
>you Coonboy?
My Stalker Malum Niger Yoorghis AKA Gary Roselles.
Malcolm McMahon
Sep 18, 2012, 9:25:15 AM9/18/12
to
On Monday, 17 September 2012 19:07:29 UTC+1, The Great Firewall of China Blue wrote:
> In article <mkde58ptf84f5nv1t...@4ax.com>, Yoor...@Jurgis.net
>
> wrote:
>
>
>
> > There is no evidence that anything in the bible/religion is true.
>
>
>
> There is no evidence any belief system, such as buddhism, shinto, or science is
>
> true. Any presentation of 'evidence' invokes a circular argument: you need to
>
> make assumptions about the nature of reality simply to recognise something
>
> exists and is evidence.
>
This is dishonest, philisophical bullshit, typed on the keyboard of an excellent piece of evidence of the validity of science.
> In article <mkde58ptf84f5nv1t...@4ax.com>, Yoor...@Jurgis.net
>
> wrote:
>
>
>
> > There is no evidence that anything in the bible/religion is true.
>
>
>
> There is no evidence any belief system, such as buddhism, shinto, or science is
>
> true. Any presentation of 'evidence' invokes a circular argument: you need to
>
> make assumptions about the nature of reality simply to recognise something
>
> exists and is evidence.
>
There's no equivalence, evidence wise, between the two statements "If you drop an apple it will fall on the ground" and "Jesus is Lord". The first is well defined, and predicts testable results. The second is neither.
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