! Nobel Committee Prove Themselves Far-Left Fools
pithy
to rehabilitate his tawdry "legacy"!!!
Pain in the grass
The Nobel Prize literary committee has done it again.
With unswerving certitude, the committee has awarded
its annual $1 million prize to an author of impeccable left-wing
and anti-Western credentials. German author Gunter Grass is,
like the previous German Nobel literature prize winner Heinrich
Boell, someone who cannot find enough bad things to say
about his own country or about the United States. In the year
of the 10th anniversary of the fall of the Berlin Wall, it makes
perfect sense to pick someone whose attitudes towards that
historical event have ranged from bitterness to ambivalence and
back again, right? We have come to expect nothing less from
the Swedish judges.
This is not to say that Germans do not have plenty of reason
to feel conflicted about their country's past. Anyone who came
of age in Hitler's Germany, as Mr. Grass did, would carry
heavy baggage. Born in 1927, Mr. Grass grew up in the harbor
city of Danzig, now the Polish city of Gdansk famous for its
shipyard. He was a member of the Hitler Youth and towards
the end of the war was drafted into the Luftwaffe. After
working at various manual jobs, Mr. Grass in 1959 produced
his literary tour de force, "The Tin Drum," which earned him the
reputation he has since been living on.
As anyone who has read the book will know, it is indeed a
compelling examination of Nazi Germany if also a sick,
grotesque, disgusting and strange book. It is told from the
perspective of the dwarf Oscar Mazerath, who wills himself to
retard his growth while the Nazis are in power and who speaks
the truth through his chosen instrument, the tin drum. It's a
book that takes a strong stomach to read, less for the horrors
of the Nazis, which remain on the periphery of the narrative,
than for the author's chosen style.
I have never forgotten his description of how picnickers at
the beach go about catching eels for their supper: Take the
head of a dead horse, toss it in the water on a warm summer's
day. Wait until the eels have invaded the cranium and pull the
whole thing up. Lovely, eh? In the book, Mr. Grass succeeded
in resurrecting German literary Expressionism -- which the
Nazis had banned as decadent and sick in the 1930s.
The problem with Mr. Grass is that he was -- is -- unwilling
to accept that Germany and the Germans have changed. Or if
they have, he seems to think, it's not much for the better. The
fact is that after the war, the Allied occupation powers
expended enormous energy and expense to rebuild a
democratic German society, drawing on political leaders who
had fled into exile under the Nazis, people with eminent
democratic credentials like Chancellor Konrad Adenauer and
Berlin Mayer Ernst Reuter.
Now, it is true that Germans, who had endured total defeat,
at the time very much wanted to put the past behind them.
However, to view the German Federal Republic, West
Germany, which lasted from 1949 to unification in 1989, as an
extension rather than a break with the past is a huge misguided
mistake. Mr. Grass considered it a "dictatorship with money"
-- a view apparently shared by the New York Times, which
wrote on Friday that it "was in this context of postwar
authoritarianism, of an American-assisted German
reconstruction so successful that it served to blanket memory
of past crimes, that 'The Tin Drum,' burst upon the national
consciousness with all the power of a thunderbolt." Postwar
authoritarianism?
In book after book, Mr. Grass laid out his distaste for
modern Germany culminating in the fascinatingly disturbed "A
Broad Field" from 1995, a nostalgic celebration of the good
old days of East Germany. In Mr. Grass' view East Germany
was invaded and exploited by the capitalists from the West. "In
this world of shortages," so one of the characters says, "we
lived in a comfortable dictatorship." Does that also go for the
hundreds of East Germans who lost their lives trying to mount
the Berlin Wall? Or the hundreds of thousands who streamed
to freedom when the East Berlin authorities in a moment of
confusion lifted travel restrictions in November 1989? Who
pounded the Wall's concrete slabs with sledgehammers?
According to Mr. Grass' latest book, "My Century," soon
to be published by Faber and Faber, the author's reaction upon
hearing the news that the Wall was open was "Madness! Sheer
madness!" That chimes with his view that a reunited Germany is
doomed to repeat the evil deeds of its past.
Most people looking at Germany today see well-fed
burghers counting their vacation days and students nourishing a
permanent sense of entitlement from the state. To see it as a
country of jackbooted fascists, you probably have to be a
Nobel literature prize winner.
Article URL: http://www.washtimes.com/opinion/bering.html
Scott Erb
paulw...@mailexcite.com says...
> The Nobel Prize literary committee has done it again.
>
> With unswerving certitude, the committee has awarded
>its annual $1 million prize to an author of impeccable left-wing
>and anti-Western credentials. German author Gunter Grass is,
>like the previous German Nobel literature prize winner Heinrich
>Boell, someone who cannot find enough bad things to say
>about his own country or about the United States.
-rest of this silly tripe deleted-
No German critic, even those who very much disagree with Grass's views
would deny that he is one of the most important and skillful literary
figures of this half of the century. His works have dealt with the issues
facing the post-holocaust generation in a masterful manner.
It is rather small minded to get mad because a literary great is
recognized who doesn't share one's political view. Some people seem to
think that only politically correct folk (those who agree with them)
deserve respect and recognition for their work. That is the OPPOSITE of
what freedom of expression, literature, and art is based upon.
Luckily, people like you have no impact on the Nobel committee, and they
will continue to award loads of money and prestige on people who deserve
it, not on people whom you might consider politically correct.
ciao, scott
pithy
>>
>> With unswerving certitude, the committee has awarded
>>its annual $1 million prize to an author of impeccable left-wing
>>and anti-Western credentials. German author Gunter Grass is,
>>like the previous German Nobel literature prize winner Heinrich
>>Boell, someone who cannot find enough bad things to say
>>about his own country or about the United States.
>
>
>No German critic, even those who very much disagree with Grass's views
>would deny that he is one of the most important and skillful literary
>figures of this half of the century. His works have dealt with the issues
>facing the post-holocaust generation in a masterful manner.
>
>It is rather small minded to get mad because a literary great is
>recognized who doesn't share one's political view. Some people seem to
>think that only politically correct folk (those who agree with them)
>deserve respect and recognition for their work. That is the OPPOSITE of
>what freedom of expression, literature, and art is based upon.
>
>Luckily, people like you have no impact on the Nobel committee, and they
>will continue to award loads of money and prestige on people who deserve
>it, not on people whom you might consider politically correct.
>ciao, scott
Aha!!! I see now that liberals are trying to re-invent the term
"politically correct" as meaning conservative!!! You lefties must
really be hurting over the fact that it has a terribly connotation
and refers explicitly and exclusively to the left. Your left-wing
ischial callosities must *really* be burning!!! LOL!!!
But the Nobel Committee is politically correct--they believe that
the greatest expressions in literature and art are those which denigrate
and shame rather than uplift and praise. To be a politically correct
(successful) artist one must dwell on the negative aspects of humanity.
Scott, I wonder why you snipped the last two paragraphs in the article:
According to Mr. Grass' latest book, "My Century," soon
to be published by Faber and Faber, the author's reaction upon
hearing the news that the Wall was open was "Madness! Sheer
madness!" That chimes with his view that a reunited Germany is
doomed to repeat the evil deeds of its past.
Most people looking at Germany today see well-fed
burghers counting their vacation days and students nourishing a
permanent sense of entitlement from the state. To see it as a
country of jackbooted fascists, you probably have to be a
Nobel literature prize winner.
Do you feel that equality in poverty is a good thing? Do you wish the
Berlin Wall never fell and that eastern europe remained communist?
Or do you just enjoy being miserable?
Scott Erb
paulw...@mailexcite.com says...
>
>Aha!!! I see now that liberals are trying to re-invent the term
>"politically correct" as meaning conservative!!!
No, silly boy, politically correct can apply to BOTH liberals and
conservatives...anyone who wants to silence other views or reject to
something like a nobel prize for literature because they don't like the
political views of the author is engaged in some kid of "PC" test.
I oppose leftists who tried to silence things not "PC."
I oppose conservatives who try to silence things not "PC."
Each has a different definition of what they consider PC. Each attempt to
silence things they don't agree with deserves opposition.
-snip-
OK, for some reason you think I should react to two paragraphs in the
article you posted, so here goes:
> According to Mr. Grass' latest book, "My Century," soon
>to be published by Faber and Faber, the author's reaction upon
>hearing the news that the Wall was open was "Madness! Sheer
>madness!" That chimes with his view that a reunited Germany is
>doomed to repeat the evil deeds of its past.
That's a common debate topic in Germany; most people think its good to
discuss and react to it. I know many in Germany, not just on the Left,
who had some hesitation about unification. Conservatives in the Thatcher
government in Britain clearly said the same thing, some saying that
Germans were not to be trusted. So that's hardly something objectionable.
> Most people looking at Germany today see well-fed
>burghers counting their vacation days and students nourishing a
>permanent sense of entitlement from the state. To see it as a
>country of jackbooted fascists, you probably have to be a
>Nobel literature prize winner.
Having spent a lot of time in Germany this decade, I'd note that Grass's
views again are common (and shared by many non-leftists as I note above),
and that the article clearly shows that was an idea just as the wall came
down, a type of fear common in Europe across the political spectrum at the
time.
Also, I'd note that the fascist parties have done well in the East,
getting 13% of the vote in Saxony-Anholt, and over 5% in Brandenburg.
Luckily they are divided and weaker than they used to be. In 1990-91
right wing violence in the East was high, with skin heads and neo-nazis
fire bombing foreigners and engaged in an attempt to try to make the new
unified Germany something different than what you describe -- a wealthy,
prosperous society. They failed, but one reason the nazis failed is
because of the fact people like Grass are part of the German culture now
-- neither left or right. It is a culture that is self-critical and wary
of making the same mistakes.
That is something you could learn from.
Loren Petrich
[Gunter Grass as a member of the Hitler Youth...]
Where are the German men (and maybe women) his age who *weren't*
a member of the Hitler Youth back then?
The implication here is that he's some sort of Commie as a result.
However, if he had neo-Nazi tendencies, he'd be hankering for
military triumphs, the recovery of "lost German territory", and for
getting rid of "un-German elements".
--
Loren Petrich Happiness is a fast Macintosh
pet...@netcom.com And a fast train
My home page: http://www.petrich.com/home.html
Loren Petrich
pithy <paulw...@mailexcite.com> wrote:
>Aha!!! I see now that liberals are trying to re-invent the term
>"politically correct" as meaning conservative!!! You lefties must
>really be hurting over the fact that it has a terribly connotation
>and refers explicitly and exclusively to the left. Your left-wing
>ischial callosities must *really* be burning!!! LOL!!!
"Political correctness" is a generic sort of term, and there are
right-wing as well as left-wing forms of political correctness.
>But the Nobel Committee is politically correct--they believe that
>the greatest expressions in literature and art are those which denigrate
>and shame rather than uplift and praise. To be a politically correct
>(successful) artist one must dwell on the negative aspects of humanity.
I wonder if "Pithy" would object to art that denigrated and
shamed Communism or the Clintons or any of his other favorite villains.
Also, "Pithy" seems to want only some sort of Socialist Realism
-- Conservative Realism?
jtarver
Loren Petrich <pet...@netcom.com> wrote in message
news:7tg4ap$9...@dfw-ixnews13.ix.netcom.com...
>
> [Gunter Grass as a member of the Hitler Youth...]
>
> Where are the German men (and maybe women) his age who *weren't*
> a member of the Hitler Youth back then?
>
> The implication here is that he's some sort of Commie as a result.
>
> However, if he had neo-Nazi tendencies, he'd be hankering for
> military triumphs, the recovery of "lost German territory", and for
> getting rid of "un-German elements".
Gunter Grass was a NAZI that supported totalitarian socialism. The East
Germans and the Soviets were his heros later in life, as they held to the
same idea of Totalitarian Socialism. Gunter at least believed in something;
a stark contrast to modern American Politics.
John
Scott Erb
jta...@tminet.com says...
>
>Gunter Grass was a NAZI that supported totalitarian socialism. The East
>Germans and the Soviets were his heros later in life, as they held to the
>same idea of Totalitarian Socialism.
You don't know what you're talking about, you're 100% wrong.
I guess some people will make up lies about anyone who isn't ideologically
correct in their view.
Sort of like the Nazis. This Tarver guy seems a good candidate for
Nazihood!
pithy
>>"politically correct" as meaning conservative!!!
>
>conservatives...anyone who wants to silence other views or reject to
>something like a nobel prize for literature because they don't like the
>political views of the author is engaged in some kid of "PC" test.
>
>I oppose leftists who tried to silence things not "PC."
>I oppose conservatives who try to silence things not "PC."
>
>Each has a different definition of what they consider PC. Each attempt to
>silence things they don't agree with deserves opposition.
>
>-snip-
>
>OK, for some reason you think I should react to two paragraphs in the
>article you posted, so here goes:
>
>>to be published by Faber and Faber, the author's reaction upon
>>hearing the news that the Wall was open was "Madness! Sheer
>>madness!" That chimes with his view that a reunited Germany is
>>doomed to repeat the evil deeds of its past.
>
>discuss and react to it. I know many in Germany, not just on the Left,
>who had some hesitation about unification. Conservatives in the Thatcher
>government in Britain clearly said the same thing, some saying that
>Germans were not to be trusted. So that's hardly something objectionable.
>
>>burghers counting their vacation days and students nourishing a
>>permanent sense of entitlement from the state. To see it as a
>>country of jackbooted fascists, you probably have to be a
>>Nobel literature prize winner.
>
>views again are common (and shared by many non-leftists as I note above),
>and that the article clearly shows that was an idea just as the wall came
>down, a type of fear common in Europe across the political spectrum at the
>time.
>
>Also, I'd note that the fascist parties have done well in the East,
>getting 13% of the vote in Saxony-Anholt, and over 5% in Brandenburg.
>Luckily they are divided and weaker than they used to be. In 1990-91
>right wing violence in the East was high, with skin heads and neo-nazis
>fire bombing foreigners and engaged in an attempt to try to make the new
>unified Germany something different than what you describe -- a wealthy,
>prosperous society. They failed, but one reason the nazis failed is
>because of the fact people like Grass are part of the German culture now
>-- neither left or right. It is a culture that is self-critical and wary
>of making the same mistakes.
>
>That is something you could learn from.
Japan, like Germany, wears its heart on its sleeve over WWII. Perhaps
Japan's deep sense of guilt and shame over their part in WWII, which
they have *repeatedly* admitted to the nations of the world ever since,
could be assuaged by by a 45 year stint of communism?
Or would just a few decades of self-hate suffice?
zepp, a weasel
wrote:
>In article <7tg1a8$r3g$3...@rupert.unet.maine.edu>, scot...@maine.edu says...
>>
>>In article <sDLK3.439$mR1.1...@news1.epix.net>,
>>paulw...@mailexcite.com says...
>>>
>>>Aha!!! I see now that liberals are trying to re-invent the term
>>>"politically correct" as meaning conservative!!!
>>
>>No, silly boy, politically correct can apply to BOTH liberals and
>>conservatives...anyone who wants to silence other views or reject to
>>something like a nobel prize for literature because they don't like the
>>political views of the author is engaged in some kid of "PC" test.
>>
>>I oppose leftists who tried to silence things not "PC."
>>I oppose conservatives who try to silence things not "PC."
>>
>>Each has a different definition of what they consider PC. Each attempt to
>>silence things they don't agree with deserves opposition.
>>
>>-snip-
>>
>>OK, for some reason you think I should react to two paragraphs in the
>>article you posted, so here goes:
>>
>>> According to Mr. Grass' latest book, "My Century," soon
>>>to be published by Faber and Faber, the author's reaction upon
>>>hearing the news that the Wall was open was "Madness! Sheer
>>>madness!" That chimes with his view that a reunited Germany is
>>>doomed to repeat the evil deeds of its past.
>>
>>That's a common debate topic in Germany; most people think its good to
>>discuss and react to it. I know many in Germany, not just on the Left,
>>who had some hesitation about unification. Conservatives in the Thatcher
>>government in Britain clearly said the same thing, some saying that
>>Germans were not to be trusted. So that's hardly something objectionable.
>>
>>> Most people looking at Germany today see well-fed
>>>burghers counting their vacation days and students nourishing a
>>>permanent sense of entitlement from the state. To see it as a
>>>country of jackbooted fascists, you probably have to be a
>>>Nobel literature prize winner.
>>
>>Having spent a lot of time in Germany this decade, I'd note that Grass's
>>views again are common (and shared by many non-leftists as I note above),
>>and that the article clearly shows that was an idea just as the wall came
>>down, a type of fear common in Europe across the political spectrum at the
>>time.
>>
>>Also, I'd note that the fascist parties have done well in the East,
>>getting 13% of the vote in Saxony-Anholt, and over 5% in Brandenburg.
>>Luckily they are divided and weaker than they used to be. In 1990-91
>>right wing violence in the East was high, with skin heads and neo-nazis
>>fire bombing foreigners and engaged in an attempt to try to make the new
>>unified Germany something different than what you describe -- a wealthy,
>>prosperous society. They failed, but one reason the nazis failed is
>>because of the fact people like Grass are part of the German culture now
>>-- neither left or right. It is a culture that is self-critical and wary
>>of making the same mistakes.
>>
>>That is something you could learn from.
>
>Japan, like Germany, wears its heart on its sleeve over WWII. Perhaps
>Japan's deep sense of guilt and shame over their part in WWII, which
>they have *repeatedly* admitted to the nations of the world ever since,
>could be assuaged by by a 45 year stint of communism?
>
>Or would just a few decades of self-hate suffice?
You know, Pissy, you get more incoherant and removed from reality with
each and every post.
Japan has never expressed any particular guilt and shame over WW2.
Indeed, Japanese intransigence on this issue is the root of cold
relations between Japan and China and Korea, both of whom suffered at
Japanese hands during the occupation.
>
>>>Do you feel that equality in poverty is a good thing? Do you wish the
>>>Berlin Wall never fell and that eastern europe remained communist?
>>>Or do you just enjoy being miserable?
>
**********************************************************
The following quote shows that while Republican idiocy
might be blatent idiocy, it is also tenacious idiocy:
"It [GOP money policy] reflects a reversion to the old
idea that the tree can be fertilized at the top instead
of at the bottom -- the old "trickle-down" theory".
---Harry Truman, 5/13/44
http://www.scruznet.com/~kangaroo/LiberalFAQ.htm
Also mirrored at: http://www.huppi.com/kangaroo
http://home.att.net/~jbvm/Resurgent
http://www.wtrt.net/~blarson/institute.htm
http://www.aliveness.com/kangaroo
http://resurgent.virtualave.net
Warning: Contains ideas
************************************************************
Pay your taxes so the rich don't have to.
Loren Petrich
> According to Mr. Grass' latest book, "My Century," soon
>to be published by Faber and Faber, the author's reaction upon
>hearing the news that the Wall was open was "Madness! Sheer
>madness!" That chimes with his view that a reunited Germany is
>doomed to repeat the evil deeds of its past.
Where did Mr. Grass claim that that is inevitable?
> Most people looking at Germany today see well-fed
>burghers counting their vacation days and students nourishing a
>permanent sense of entitlement from the state. To see it as a
>country of jackbooted fascists, you probably have to be a
>Nobel literature prize winner.
There is a good reason to be concerned: being a jackbooted
fascist may seem more noble than being fat and lazy -- it may give one
more of a sense of purpose.
>Do you feel that equality in poverty is a good thing? Do you wish the
>Berlin Wall never fell and that eastern europe remained communist?
>Or do you just enjoy being miserable?
Boo hoo hoo hoo hoo. The Soviet bloc had what many right-wingers
feel societies ought to have -- a filthy rich upper class.
Loren Petrich
pithy <paulw...@mailexcite.com> wrote:
>Japan, like Germany, wears its heart on its sleeve over WWII. ...
That is not very apparent. And would you prefer that postwar
Germans be unrepentant neo-Nazis who wish that the Third Reich had been
more successful???
Loren Petrich
jtarver <jta...@tminet.com> wrote:
>Gunter Grass was a NAZI that supported totalitarian socialism.
Horse manure. A *real* neo-Nazi would consider the Third Reich
the most glorious 12 years in Germany's history. And the closest among
mainstream politicians to *that* would likely be Pat Buchanan, who
considers the Third Reich to be not as bad as the Weimar Republic or
Franklin Delano Roosevelt.
The East
>Germans and the Soviets were his heros later in life, as they held to the
>same idea of Totalitarian Socialism.
And how was that the case?
RHA
Scott Erb <scot...@maine.edu> wrote:
>In article <zRMK3.1806$7K4....@typ11a.deja.bcandid.com>,
>jta...@tminet.com says...
>>
>>Germans and the Soviets were his heros later in life, as they held to the
>>same idea of Totalitarian Socialism.
>
>
>I guess some people will make up lies about anyone who isn't ideologically
>correct in their view.
>
>Sort of like the Nazis. This Tarver guy seems a good candidate for
>Nazihood!
No, not really. He's more the early type that were used and then
killed by order of Hitler after they lost their usefulness.
--
rha
pithy
>
>On Wed, 06 Oct 1999 19:42:08 GMT, paulw...@mailexcite.com (pithy)
>wrote:
>
>>In article <7tg1a8$r3g$3...@rupert.unet.maine.edu>, scot...@maine.edu says...
>>>
>>>In article <sDLK3.439$mR1.1...@news1.epix.net>,
>>>paulw...@mailexcite.com says...
>>>>
>>>>Aha!!! I see now that liberals are trying to re-invent the term
>>>>"politically correct" as meaning conservative!!!
>>>
>>>No, silly boy, politically correct can apply to BOTH liberals and
>>>conservatives...anyone who wants to silence other views or reject to
>>>something like a nobel prize for literature because they don't like the
>>>political views of the author is engaged in some kid of "PC" test.
>>>
>>>I oppose leftists who tried to silence things not "PC."
>>>I oppose conservatives who try to silence things not "PC."
>>>
>>>Each has a different definition of what they consider PC. Each attempt to
>>>silence things they don't agree with deserves opposition.
>>>
>>>-snip-
>>>
>>>OK, for some reason you think I should react to two paragraphs in the
>>>article you posted, so here goes:
>>>
>>>>to be published by Faber and Faber, the author's reaction upon
>>>>hearing the news that the Wall was open was "Madness! Sheer
>>>>madness!" That chimes with his view that a reunited Germany is
>>>>doomed to repeat the evil deeds of its past.
>>>
>>>discuss and react to it. I know many in Germany, not just on the Left,
>>>who had some hesitation about unification. Conservatives in the Thatcher
>>>government in Britain clearly said the same thing, some saying that
>>>Germans were not to be trusted. So that's hardly something objectionable.
>>>
>>>>burghers counting their vacation days and students nourishing a
>>>>permanent sense of entitlement from the state. To see it as a
>>>>country of jackbooted fascists, you probably have to be a
>>>>Nobel literature prize winner.
>>>
>>>views again are common (and shared by many non-leftists as I note above),
>>>and that the article clearly shows that was an idea just as the wall came
>>>down, a type of fear common in Europe across the political spectrum at the
>>>time.
>>>
>>>Also, I'd note that the fascist parties have done well in the East,
>>>getting 13% of the vote in Saxony-Anholt, and over 5% in Brandenburg.
>>>Luckily they are divided and weaker than they used to be. In 1990-91
>>>right wing violence in the East was high, with skin heads and neo-nazis
>>>fire bombing foreigners and engaged in an attempt to try to make the new
>>>unified Germany something different than what you describe -- a wealthy,
>>>prosperous society. They failed, but one reason the nazis failed is
>>>because of the fact people like Grass are part of the German culture now
>>>-- neither left or right. It is a culture that is self-critical and wary
>>>of making the same mistakes.
>>>
>>>That is something you could learn from.
>>
>>Japan, like Germany, wears its heart on its sleeve over WWII. Perhaps
>>Japan's deep sense of guilt and shame over their part in WWII, which
>>they have *repeatedly* admitted to the nations of the world ever since,
>>could be assuaged by by a 45 year stint of communism?
>>
>>Or would just a few decades of self-hate suffice?
>
>You know, Pissy, you get more incoherant and removed from reality with
>each and every post.
At least I'm not getting more incoherent!!! LOL!!!
And just to educate your ignorant ischial callosities, there is the term
"tongue in cheek"!!!
You are so simple and stupid Blimp, you fall for every trap I set!!!
Sometimes I wonder how stupid liberals can get, and then I think of
you--which provides me assurance that liberal ignorance knows no
bounds!!!
Please drive carefully--I would hate to lose you as a source of
humor!!!
>Japan has never expressed any particular guilt and shame over WW2.
>Indeed, Japanese intransigence on this issue is the root of cold
>relations between Japan and China and Korea, both of whom suffered at
>Japanese hands during the occupation.
>>
>>>>Do you feel that equality in poverty is a good thing? Do you wish the
>>>>Berlin Wall never fell and that eastern europe remained communist?
>>>>Or do you just enjoy being miserable?
>>
--
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
-----Freedom comes in four boxes:
Soap, Jury, Ballot, and Cartridge
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
You dig at it until you get it right and you get people telling you
what actually happened. You don't run away from it. You don't say,
`Oh, me. I can't handle this.' You keep at it till you get to the
truth.
-----ATTORNEY GENERAL JANET RENO, on the inquiry into the
1993 Government assault on the Branch Davidian compound."
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
RHA
jtarver <jta...@tminet.com> wrote:
>
>RHA <ri...@new-orleans.neosoft.com> wrote in message
>news:8FF5AE63177D284A.53DC4291...@lp.airnews.net...
Silly boy, that's just an artifact of place of birth.
Don't believe me? Ask him what he thought about SS
members as of 12/6/41. Bet he had a "ain't none of my
business" attitude. Now if he was a founding member
of the Abraham Lincoln Brigade, you and he might have
a point.
>
>John
>
>
>
--
rha
jtarver
> In article <kdQK3.2012$7K4....@typ11a.deja.bcandid.com>,
> jtarver <jta...@tminet.com> wrote:
> >
> >RHA <ri...@new-orleans.neosoft.com> wrote in message
> >news:8FF5AE63177D284A.53DC4291...@lp.airnews.net...
> >> In article <7tg77k$slf$3...@rupert.unet.maine.edu>,
> >> Scott Erb <scot...@maine.edu> wrote:
> >> >In article <zRMK3.1806$7K4....@typ11a.deja.bcandid.com>,
> >> >jta...@tminet.com says...
> >> >>
> >> >>Gunter Grass was a NAZI that supported totalitarian socialism. The
East
> >> >>Germans and the Soviets were his heros later in life, as they held to
> >the
> >> >>same idea of Totalitarian Socialism.
> >> >
> >> >You don't know what you're talking about, you're 100% wrong.
> >> >
> >> >I guess some people will make up lies about anyone who isn't
> >ideologically
> >> >correct in their view.
> >> >
> >> >Sort of like the Nazis. This Tarver guy seems a good candidate for
> >> >Nazihood!
> >>
> >> No, not really. He's more the early type that were used and then
> >> killed by order of Hitler after they lost their usefulness.
> >
> >I am more like my dear old dad that killed SS up close and personal.
>
> Silly boy, that's just an artifact of place of birth.
If your point is that the 101st Airborne and the NAZI SS were the same I'll
suggest you look at a history book.
> Don't believe me? Ask him what he thought about SS
> members as of 12/6/41. Bet he had a "ain't none of my
> business" attitude. Now if he was a founding member
> of the Abraham Lincoln Brigade, you and he might have
> a point.
We Scots are no NAZIs rick. My father was in the tree army until December
9, 1941 and spent the next few years changing spark plugs in London. The
women were quite friendly and the work was easy.
Where was your daddy/grandfather Rick?
John
Say Rick, have you seen a doctor about your aversion to female pubic hair?
Minister of Silly Walks
jtarver <jta...@tminet.com> wrote in message
news:IoRK3.2048$7K4....@typ11a.deja.bcandid.com...
I'll suggest you take Reading Comprehension 101, as that statement meant
nothing of the sort.
What RHA said was that your father's "great service" killing SS troops was
nothing more than the fact that he was born on our side of the fence. Had he
been born in Germany, he probably would've been one of those SS troops.
> > Don't believe me? Ask him what he thought about SS
> > members as of 12/6/41. Bet he had a "ain't none of my
> > business" attitude. Now if he was a founding member
> > of the Abraham Lincoln Brigade, you and he might have
> > a point.
>
> We Scots are no NAZIs rick. My father was in the tree army until December
> 9, 1941 and spent the next few years changing spark plugs in London. The
> women were quite friendly and the work was easy.
Which has nothing to do with anything said so far.
Had your father been a founding member of the anti-fascist ALB, then you
could possibly turn this into a "my dad was more anti-fascist than your dad"
argument. Rather, he was simply another sheep in the service of his nation.
jtarver
Minister of Silly Walks <mr_kilg...@hotmail.comNOSPAMARINO> wrote in
message news:7tgtek$a9b$1...@nntp3.atl.mindspring.net...
You are an idiot, much like poor delusional ricky. There is a reason
America is not NAZI Germany and the People are the reason. Any conclusion
that the US Military is NAZI like is a leftist delusion.
> > > Don't believe me? Ask him what he thought about SS
> > > members as of 12/6/41. Bet he had a "ain't none of my
> > > business" attitude. Now if he was a founding member
> > > of the Abraham Lincoln Brigade, you and he might have
> > > a point.
> >
> > We Scots are no NAZIs rick. My father was in the tree army until
December
> > 9, 1941 and spent the next few years changing spark plugs in London.
The
> > women were quite friendly and the work was easy.
> Which has nothing to do with anything said so far.
It has everything to do with what has been said thus far. The German People
were ripe for the kind of Totalitarian Socialism that brought Hitler to
power, just like ricky and his leftist friends long for totalitarian
socialism.
> Had your father been a founding member of the anti-fascist ALB, then you
> could possibly turn this into a "my dad was more anti-fascist than your
dad"
> argument. Rather, he was simply another sheep in the service of his
nation.
You are an idiot without a clue. Was your daddy a coward like ricky's?
John
Minister of Silly Walks
You've managed to become completely incomprehensible. Congratulations.
> > > > Don't believe me? Ask him what he thought about SS
> > > > members as of 12/6/41. Bet he had a "ain't none of my
> > > > business" attitude. Now if he was a founding member
> > > > of the Abraham Lincoln Brigade, you and he might have
> > > > a point.
> > >
> > > We Scots are no NAZIs rick. My father was in the tree army until
> December
> > > 9, 1941 and spent the next few years changing spark plugs in London.
> The
> > > women were quite friendly and the work was easy.
> > Which has nothing to do with anything said so far.
>
> It has everything to do with what has been said thus far. The German
People
> were ripe for the kind of Totalitarian Socialism that brought Hitler to
> power, just like ricky and his leftist friends long for totalitarian
> socialism.
Still incomprehensible. Jesus, you should've changed the subject of your
post to "Jabberwocky."
> > Had your father been a founding member of the anti-fascist ALB, then you
> > could possibly turn this into a "my dad was more anti-fascist than your
> dad"
> > argument. Rather, he was simply another sheep in the service of his
> nation.
>
> You are an idiot without a clue. Was your daddy a coward like ricky's?
My grandfather fought in the Navy during WWII.
My father protested against an immoral war in VietNam.
Which was a coward, dippy?
Scott D. Erb
>>Japan's deep sense of guilt and shame over their part in WWII, which
>>they have *repeatedly* admitted to the nations of the world ever since,
>>could be assuaged by by a 45 year stint of communism?
>>
>>Or would just a few decades of self-hate suffice?
>
>You know, Pissy, you get more incoherant and removed from reality with
>each and every post.
(rest snipped)
I'm simply happy he dropped all the issues at play. That shows he realized he
was wrong and couldn't really defend his stance. The fact he didn't admit
that and instead tried to change the subject in a weird and incoherent manner
shows he's dishonest and rather scummy. That suggests a troll...he destroys
his own credibility...
RHA
Noooo, I'm saying your father would have been in the SS
had he been born in Germany.
>
>> Don't believe me? Ask him what he thought about SS
>> members as of 12/6/41. Bet he had a "ain't none of my
>> business" attitude. Now if he was a founding member
>> of the Abraham Lincoln Brigade, you and he might have
>> a point.
>
>We Scots are no NAZIs rick.
You're not an American? No surprise there. Got your
green card, or are you an illegal?
> My father was in the tree army until December
>9, 1941 and spent the next few years changing spark plugs in London. The
>women were quite friendly and the work was easy.
Again, the question was, due to your implication that
your father was some kind of *anti-Nazi* patriot, what
was his position prior to 12/7/41? Or was he a Bund
member?
>
>Where was your daddy/grandfather Rick?
>
>John
>
>Say Rick, have you seen a doctor about your aversion to female pubic hair?
He threw up when I told him about the braids hanging down from
yo mama's jockstrap.
--
rha
Brian Carey
> -----Look for this crew of idioit to give Clinton the Pizza Prize in order
> to rehabilitate his tawdry "legacy"!!!
>
> Pain in the grass
>
> The Nobel Prize literary committee has done it again.
>
> With unswerving certitude, the committee has awarded
> its annual $1 million prize to an author of impeccable left-wing
> and anti-Western credentials.
I guess that the Nobel Committee hasn't learned much after the Rigoberta
Menchu hoax.
And the funny thing is, even when they found out that Ms. Menchu's
anti-capitalist propaganda was based upon fabricated history, they refused to
withdraw the prize.
Hmmmm... think that there might be some bias there? ;')
--
Brian M. Carey
Home URL: http://www.mindspring.com/~careyb/rframe.html
E-mail: car...@mindspring.com
AOL IM: bmcarey1
Scott D. Erb
says...
> Brian> And the funny thing is, even when they found out that Ms. Menchu's
> Brian> anti-capitalist propaganda was based upon fabricated history, they
refused to
> Brian> withdraw the prize.
>Hmmm, I though her work was more anti-murdering-racist-totalitarian
>government than it was anti-capitalist.
Perhaps Brian assumes there is no difference between the two? Also, was it a
literature prize or a prize for history? If literature, it doesn't have to be
true; most novels aren't.
>And it has since been confirmed
>that with US help, the aforesaid murdering-racist-totalitarian government
>did murders 10s of thousands, with US help.
>
> Brian> Hmmmm... think that there might be some bias there? ;')
>
>Yes, I see some.
And the point is that Grass is a novelist and writer of amazing stature,
respected in Germany by even those who are politically opposed to him. A good
friend of mine, a Christian Democratic Party activist and conservative
Catholic has a number of novels by Grass. These attacks on the nobel prize
committee are simply bouts of envy, some people don't want people aren't PC by
their definition to get recognized for greatness.
ciao, scott
jtarver
> In article <IoRK3.2048$7K4....@typ11a.deja.bcandid.com>,
> jtarver <jta...@tminet.com> wrote:
> >
> >RHA <ri...@new-orleans.neosoft.com> wrote in message
<snip>
> >> Silly boy, that's just an artifact of place of birth.
> >
> >If your point is that the 101st Airborne and the NAZI SS were the same
I'll
> >suggest you look at a history book.
>
> Noooo, I'm saying your father would have been in the SS
> had he been born in Germany.
Have you seen a doctor about your aversion to female pubic hair rick?
John
Scott D. Erb
says...
>Have you seen a doctor about your aversion to female pubic hair rick?
>
>John
That's all he posted...
Funny how when these trolls are met by arguments they can't defeat, they end
up making such silly statements. But they do serve a purpose -- they make
people with their particular views look like extremist baffoons.
Thanks!
Mitchell Holman
}
}>
}> Noooo, I'm saying your father would have been in the SS
}> had he been born in Germany.
}
}
Is this considered to be a logical response
on your home planet?
jtarver
Mitchell Holman <ta2...@aimail.net> wrote in message
news:B1CEC4CAB3F261E4.40F251C4...@lp.airnews.net...
Pure foolishness vs rick's rediculess assertion.
It is rick that has a family of frightened sheep and it is pure fallacy to
claim that those that did somnething to stop NAZIs are the same as NAZIs.
Poor rick lost his mind when called on to show what his people did to stop
Totalitarian Socialism.
John
pithy
says...
in order to get over WWII?
Were 45 years of communism or a few decades of self-hate necessary?
And as for the troll--well I guess that I should stop torturing stupid
animals (Blimp), but it is just *too much* fun!!!