Advice on seducing a religious "good girl"
hard bop
Hey guys,
One of my prospects is this HB 7.5 who seems very religious and
"wholesome". I sarged her in a coffee shop about two weeks ago and got
her # and email. We've exchagned about 4 emails so far because I've been
busy with other girls (for the first time in my life!), and have had fun
keeping her primed via email. I introduced my latest email with this:
"
You remember those nice chocolate candies .. "Andes". They tasted
so good. They could MELT in your mouth and you'd get to TASTE
that wonderful mint in the middle. (Okay, off on a tangent here :-) )
"
Now the reason I chose "Andes" is because it kinda bears a resemblance to
her name in a way. My point here was to try to induce some sexual
thoughts into her subconcious.
Anyway, she wrote me back a nice reply suggesting we get together, but
added that she felt uncomfortable with my "pattern". Here's what she
said:
"
...I must admit that I was a little uncomfortable with this part of your
last email: You remember nice chocolate candies .. "Andes". They tasted
so good. They could MELT in your mouth and you'd get to TASTE
that wonderful mint in the middle. (Okay, off on a tangent here :-) )
Yes, I remember the candy, but no, I'm not likely to be compared to
edibles, if that's what you meant. Maybe I'm old-fashioned, but let's
keep it all good, clean fun, okay:)
"
So I figure that either she's not comfortable with her sexuality, or is
reluctant to enter that area yet. We are going to meet up next week, so
I'd like to have any tips from any of you guys that have dealt with
"wholesome" type girls before. Also, should I respond to her objection
in my next email, or just blow it off?
Thanks,
Elkston
--
Of utmost importance "... is the desire to swing"
-Chick Corea, Liner notes on "Tones for Joans Bones"
Bet For A Living
What works best is the following:
Be really nice and wholesome with her. Treat her like she's your kid sister.
When the opportunity strikes, mention OTHER women, etc.
Point out how she's too "good" for you to treat her like THAT.....
So cute you got BUSTED doing the pattern though.
Ray Gordon, Author
The Seduction Library
http://www.cybersheet.com/library.html
Discl...@helferlein.net
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745d32e3
Cy Kottick
with tons of mental baggage and they weird out when it's time to hit the sack
Wintermute
don't want to push the issue or argue with them about it. That will make
them more resistant. Instead try to focus their feelings on how good it
feels to be with you and how good other things feel.
> You remember those nice chocolate candies .. "Andes". They tasted
> so good. They could MELT in your mouth and you'd get to TASTE
> that wonderful mint in the middle. (Okay, off on a tangent here :-) )
Sounds like you were a little too blatant here and she picked up on it.
I once made the same mistake with a church-girl type in person and got
slapped in the face. My tonality was blatant innuendo while talking
about chocolate. Here by saying "off on a tangent" you are admitting to
your innuendo. A man does not apologize for his desires.
I think your best bet is to say that if she interpreted it as unwholesome
she was mistaken and you were just being playful.
You may want to try handwriting analysis to get a feel for her sex drive.
In high school I dated a church girl type who my friend told me he
thought she was suppressing a lot of sexual desire, well she did a good
job of it because I never knew. Now that I think back she had all the
handwriting traits of HD and sexual frustration. If only I knew then...
My final suggestion would be to search the archives for Kakol's posts on
"church girls" or similar keywords. A lot of good stuff.
W
--
Wintermute <> RAFC-
wintermuteatcrackdealerdotcom
I do my ASF homework at:
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http://www.nlpinfo.com
Kakol
"hard bop" <elk...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:MPG.15e5c008e...@news.supernews.com...
Whoa sailor . . . you just set yourself back a few weeks with this
chyck depending on what it's worth for you to fuck her. You say she's
a 7.5. What are you willing to put up with to fuck a chyck at this
appearance level? The fact is that church chycks aren't any fucking
different then any other chyck with one glaring exception that causes
mass confusion in their feeble minds; Every week and possibly every
fucking day they are programmed by some other religious zealot that
sex is a wonderful, beautiful, thing that they should avoid like the
plague unless or until they're married because if they don't, every
other good thing about them or that they've ever done will be invalid.
IOW they will be at the gates of hell before their life even begins.
That's some pretty heavy shit to put on a kid don't you think?
So whether or not you have a chance to lay the chyck depends a great
deal on how deeply she believes this shit and what her experience is
with sex to date. IOW some chycks use religion as a way of simply
hiding from past sexual experiences that were unpleasant or even
abusive. These are chycks to steer clear of if you are also young and
inexperienced IMO. They need a good therapist, not a lover. For other
chycks religion is simply a part of their bitch shield. The fact is
they've been fucked, they like fucking, they've already found out that
they aren't going to grow hair on their chest for being fucked, etc.
These chycks kind of take religion tongue in cheek. That is, they like
the fact that it puts them on a pedestal and gives unrealistic value
to their pussy. However, if they can convince YOU of that they will
never fuck you. Get it?
The key to laying religious chycks is taking the time necessary to
gain their trust then continually doing what is necessary to get them
dripping wet and then withdrawing, dripping wet, withdraw, dripping
wet, withdraw. It takes a lot of self control on the part of the PUA
and a lot of patience. It isn't conducive to a fast seduction. OTOH if
you know what you're doing I have laid these chycks in a relatively
short time frame. The key for me is knowing MORE about religion then
they do and being able to communicate that knowledge in an
unthreatening way that eventually begins to create doubt in their
minds about the truth of their own rather limited information, while
at the same time making me appear like a man with wisdom beyond my
years. However, this needs to be done without argument and without
being defensive. IOW you have to be very understanding and respectful
of their beliefs and at the same time demand that they respect yours.
Subtly, dig? You will automatically develop very deep rapport that
they've probably never experienced with a man if you are able to do
this, but if you're a beginner keep your expectations low and you
won't be disappointed.
Introducing sex talk before you've even spent any private time with
the chyck is a sure fire path to crash and burn. You just tipped your
hand to the bitch and put her on guard with you. IME it's ok to talk
about sex with the bitch but only after you've discovered where she
stands on the issue. First of all, how deeply does she adhere to the
typical rules of Christian values? IOW is it just a facet of her bitch
shield or does she actually deeply believe that shit and follow it
word for word? What are her personal rules? Has she ever had sex? etc.
For now just ignore the remark you made and proceed with your normal
sarge. But be aware that you have put her on guard with you before you
even started so there is likely going to be a lot of resistance on her
part to your moves to get more intimate. Whether or not you want to
move forward depends on what kind of response you get from her at your
initial meeting. If she's totally resistant to any kind of kino,
kissing, and light petting, her bitch shield may be too massive to
bother with trying to overcome it. Might be better to eject and save
yourself the time and frustration.
The main thing to remember with church girls is not to treat them any
different then you would any other chyck you want to fuck. Just know
that when things get hot and heavy, most of the time they will pull
back. When they do, the evening is over. IOW you need to let them know
in no uncertain terms that you're not going to spend your valuable
time making them feel wonderful all over or giving them manual orgasms
and then go to bed and pull cord alone later. After a couple of
evenings of getting all worked up and put away wet, chycks like this
will usually relent and give you the fucking of your life. But first
you have to do some heavy EV to find out what their real rules are.
Based on this post I would have to question if you have the necessary
experience to pull this one off. But practice makes perfect so at this
stage you have little to lose other than some time.
HTH
Kakol
LeftCoast
>
> The main thing to remember with church girls is not to treat them any
> different then you would any other chyck you want to fuck. Just know
> that when things get hot and heavy, most of the time they will pull
> back. When they do, the evening is over. IOW you need to let them know
> in no uncertain terms that you're not going to spend your valuable
> time making them feel wonderful all over or giving them manual orgasms
> and then go to bed and pull cord alone later. After a couple of
> evenings of getting all worked up and put away wet, chycks like this
> will usually relent and give you the fucking of your life. But first
> you have to do some heavy EV to find out what their real rules are.
> Based on this post I would have to question if you have the necessary
> experience to pull this one off. But practice makes perfect so at this
> stage you have little to lose other than some time.
>
> HTH
>
> Kakol
I think this is a great tactic if worked right...but Kakol...i do have
this question...
I've tried it with a few women and my problem is the following. With
the church chycks they really seem to want to believe that you're in
it for more than the sex. so when you END the evening due to not
getting your sex they put up the "So is it's all about sex huh?" and
"why don't we just feel good holding each other" bullshit.
How do you disarm that? I mean it is all about sex, but saying that
to a church chick will do nothing but alienate her. I sense that your
tactic is defuse/divert attention. how could one do the effective
takeaway AND not piss her off?
Kakol
news:2c6f4f00.01081...@posting.google.com...<Snip>
> I think this is a great tactic if worked right...but Kakol...i do
have
> this question...
>
> I've tried it with a few women and my problem is the following.
With
> the church chycks they really seem to want to believe that you're in
> it for more than the sex. so when you END the evening due to not
> getting your sex they put up the "So is it's all about sex huh?" and
> "why don't we just feel good holding each other" bullshit.
>
> How do you disarm that? I mean it is all about sex, but saying that
> to a church chick will do nothing but alienate her. I sense that
your
> tactic is defuse/divert attention. how could one do the effective
> takeaway AND not piss her off?
The thing to remember about ALL women is that very few of them that
are actually attractive make it to their first marriage as virgins. At
some point they give in to their natural desire and fuck somebody. My
attitude has always been that, that "somebody" might as well be me. If
not ME than I can guar-an-fucking-tee you it WILL be someone else.
That's why REAL jealousy is such an insecure AFC behavior that drives
PEOPLE away. It's also what makes the "Withdraw" in the Reach &
Withdraw technique actually work.
When as a human being you learn to accept the fact that procreation
and propagation of the species is THEE major part of your ENTIRE
PURPOSE for being alive, without feeling guilty about it because of
your social conditioning, you WILL control your destiny instead of
being controlled by the environment you happen to find yourself in.
Most people never self analyze deeply enough to arrive at this
conclusion. Too scary. It means accepting that you DON'T know what you
will experience when you die. It means accepting responsibility for
your behavior ALL of the time. It's easier if you can just blame your
behavior on the influence of the devil. That way you always have an
out. It wasn't me, the devil made me do it. The thing is this,
religious people are PEOPLE who have not, due to social conditioning,
accepted this position as FACT. They are instead taught to believe
that there is ONE single person walking the planet that they have been
preordained by someone else (GOD) to fulfill their core purpose with.
Problem is, they don't know who that is. Could be anybody. Could be
YOU :)
Because of this, the "withdraw" in the Reach & Withdraw method works
even better with people like this IME. They are taught to believe that
they will know WHO this person is when they finally happen to run into
them. They are taught that they will recognize this person because the
person will "rock their world" just by being in the same room
together. Well, here they are, in a room with a guy that's rocking
their world, building a tremendous amount of value because he COULD be
the ONE. That's some pretty heavy shit, especially for a young chyck.
By denying you, she may be denying her whole purpose for being alive.
So when you withdraw the prize, (YOU/your dick) she panics and REACHES
for it. (Gives in)
The whole thing IMO is one of the biggest fucking fairy tales I think
I've ever heard. Yet it's doubtful that without modern science I would
have been able to arrive at these conclusions as easily. In spite of
all of this, I remain a very spiritual person believe it or not. One
of my main points when debating religious people is; knowing what I
know, and more importantly have come to internalize, (accept as fact)
about my life and my purpose for living it, takes MORE faith to remain
a spiritual person than what they believe. And the reality IMO is
this; even without modern science, I still think that I would have
arrived at this conclusion somehow anyway. I truly believe that
somewhere in the inner subconscious of EVERY human being is the belief
that this religious shit is largely a pile of mythical crap. For them
it's the devil that's speaking to them subconsciously. For me, it's
just the way it is.
Now to answer your question. You disarm the chyck by AGREEING with her
position with an explanation for your agreement. It's really a shit
test on her part even though she may not realize it. She EXPECTS you
to DENY that it's all about sex. That's what AFC's do all the time.
You see, accepting the above, you also have to accept the fact that
women are given a great deal of natural power in the fulfillment of
your purpose. They control the pussy. In order for you to fulfill your
purpose (or the act of it) YOU must control that pussy. That's the
game. By simply denying that it's all about sex and giving in to the
false belief that simply hugging should be fulfillment enough, leaves
her in the power position. That is, in control of the pussy.
Ultimately, she will relinquish control to you even if you're AFC
because she has to, to fulfill her core purpose in life. The point is,
WHEN will she do this? If you're AFC it will probably take months or
even years if you're a total fucking chump. If you're PUA and you know
what you're doing, you can narrow this down to a matter of a couple of
weeks, days, or even hours with the right chyck.
Unfortunately, when you simply deny that it's all about sex, you are
inadvertently building value into her natural power position. Putting
her pussy up on an even higher pedestal than the one her social
conditioning has already put it on. If she takes you at your word,
you've fucked yourself. Now you have to play the fucking game by HER
rules. Which means, she decides after an appropriate amount of time
has passed, talked to her friends and relatives about their
impressions of you and so on and so forth when or IF you will ever get
to the oil well. With this method you may indeed get to the well in
time. The problem is once you get there, whether by time, engagement,
or marriage, and she gains enough sexual experience to discover that
it's really not all that big of a deal as everyone in her social
circle told her it was all her life, it is most likely these days that
you will eventually end up splitting cereal coupons in front of a
judge eventually.
Why? Because you never established control of the power in the
relationship. The pussy. Think about it. If women didn't have a pussy
would you even want to hang around with them much? Fuck no! Other than
cooking, cleaning, and doing laundry, you'd have little or no use for
the bitches. Nor would they have much use for you these days. That's a
modern twist that we're dealing with today that makes a lot of this
new mind-set necessary if you want to get laid, and laid often.
It wasn't that long ago that even after realizing that sex was not all
that big a deal that the woman was socially conditioned to believe it
was, that she would stick around anyway because she needed a man in
her life for survival reasons. That's no longer the case today. She no
longer needs you for anything BUT sex, and she doesn't even need you
for that if she's not hetro. You are nearly useless to her UNLESS you
can rock her world sexually. Accept it and learn to deal with it to
get what you want.
The thin thread that's holding it all together these days is simply
the knowledge that children who ARE NOT raised in the typical two
parent household tend to have an enormous amount of additional
emotional baggage that fucks them up later in life than children who
are. That's a pretty thin fucking thread if you ask me. Especially
since the government will now step in to act as "daddy" in your
absence.
No, today you're basically fucked from the start in regards to being
"of value" to women. That is why I stress in my posts that you MUST,
absolutely, positively, and without question, learn to rock her world
sexually if you want to control the pussy in the relationship. It is
about the only thing that separates you from the AFC anymore. And you
have to be willing to let her fuck an AFC (or several) WITHOUT
becoming jealous about it in order for the point to be driven home to
her. Eventually she will choose to not fuck anyone else just because
she's already proven to herself that it's pointless to do so as you
are already providing her with that which she is seeking, so why
bother? The actual game isn't that fun for her, but terrific sex that
continues to naturally get better the longer she hangs around IS.
As I've stated in previous posts, my primary, who happens to be a very
religious chyck, is with me for exactly two reasons. I know this
because she reminds me of it all the time in her communications with
me. She doesn't like the way I live, she doesn't like the way I think,
she doesn't like my vices, she doesn't like the beliefs that I hold as
fact, she doesn't even really like the way I LOOK. She ONLY likes the
fact that I'm the only guy she's ever been with sexually that
continues to rock her world consistently. And she respects my
intellect. That's it.
The physical fuck and the mind fuck. Totally and simply sexual. With
the mind fuck being the MOST sensitive and important sexual organ of
all. At least in human beings. Those are the ONLY two things that keep
me in control of her pussy. She is TOTALLY self sufficient other than
those two things and has no other need for me or ANYBODY for anything
other than that in regards to personal relationships and the
fulfillment of her life purpose.
As men, who want to be laid often in today's world, the sooner you
recognize your TRUE value to the modern female and accept and
internalize it without the socially conditioned guilt previously
associated with this line of thinking, as the way of life as we now
know it, the sooner you will be able to build the type of value that
REALLY matters in the subconscious minds of your targets and tap the
well of the ACT of your life purpose. Comfortably, and without apology
for your actions and behaviors.
Ah . . . but I digress. What was the fucking question again? Oh yeah,
You disarm the chyck by AGREEING with her position with an explanation
for your agreement. IOW if you've done your work here, that is,
elicited her TRUE values and reasoning for her position on pre-marital
sex you already know the WHY of her position. Usually it's something
like, "well my preacher tells me that pre-marital sex is wrong. Only
whores do that. (slut factor) And I don't want anybody THINKING I'm a
whore." (even though I like sex, or the idea of it if she's really
young) Just reading that, can you see how insecure that fucking line
of thinking is? They're really saying that they're worried what their
social circle and relatives might think, not about what THEY think.
Who gives a FUCK what other people think?!!!
So here you are. You've elicited this weak, insecure, position from
the chyck initially so you know to EXPECT the PULL BACK as you go
about your normal seduction process. That is, you do everything
possible to get her worked up to a foaming wet frenzy. She pulls back.
You're prepared. You feign some resistance to her pull back by trying
to continue to get to her well. She keeps slapping your hands away and
asking you to stop. Finally, you relent and stop your manipulation,
sighing with obvious sexual frustration.
She now feels bad for ruining the whole thing over her own stupid
beliefs and guilty for feeling natural sexual desire that leaves her
feeling out of control, which she has been socially conditioned to
believe she should be IN control of at all times. And because she
really likes you, (or you wouldn't have gotten even this far with her
in her mind) and because you are beginning to elicit feelings from her
that may ultimately rock her world sexually thereby building value for
yourself in her eyes. IOW you COULD be the ONE she's been conditioned
to believe she's supposed to wait for. Can you see what a mind fuck
that whole position is? For ANYBODY! Particularly a woman!
So you stop your seduction and attempt to end the encounter (and the
great feelings she's experiencing from it). She then does what I call,
"Throwing the Porcupine." IOW by attempting to stop the seduction, and
thereby relinquishing control of the pussy to her, you throw her a
"porcupine." It's now her fault that the two of you are both
frustrated. Not wanting to be the one at fault for this result to the
encounter, she throws the porcupine back to you by saying, "It IS all
about sex with you then isn't it?" What she's really saying is, "You
don't value anything about me but my pussy do you?" If you deny it,
you may survive with her for another encounter or two or even a
marriage if you continue to believe that shit, but I can almost
guarantee you that if it ends up being marriage to get to her well, it
won't fucking last cause you will ALWAYS be a fucking wimp to her and
she will ALWAYS control the pussy in the relationship. If you try to
take control after the marriage, she will resent you for it and make
your fucking life "hell till you part" once she's fulfilled her child
bearing life purpose. Happens all the fucking time these days.
So you, in your infinite wisdom gleaned from occupying this NG, throw
the porcupine back to her by feigning giving her control out of
respect for her position, thereby building even more value for
yourself in her eyes in the process, but at the same time making the
POWERFUL point that if she wants to be with a man like YOU, she must
take responsibility for her beliefs and the consequences that those
beliefs result it. That is, sexual frustration not just for herself,
but for you also.
So you say, "Look you're right. It IS all about sex. At least for me
anyway. And that's the problem. You make me weak with desire. I just
respect you too much to continue with this because just being near you
gets me so hot I can barely control my desire. I'm just afraid that if
we continue with this, even if it's only cuddling, I just won't be
able to control this passion I'm feeling for you. I've never felt
anything like this for a woman before. I mean, I want you SO much
right now you just don't know how difficult it is to let you go. But I
have to. Otherwise I'm afraid of what WE might do if you stay. I could
never forgive myself if I lost you just because I was too weak to
control my desires in your mere presence. You understand don't you?
After all . . . we've talked a lot tonight . . . about what's
important to each of us and all . . . I mean . . . we're both adults
here right? You knew as well as I did that this might happen if we let
things go too far, too fast. Well . . . you wouldn't want to ruin
everything we've already built with each other tonight over something
as insignificant as a little sex would you? After all, we have the
whole rest of our lives to enjoy each other that way. Let's not spoil
what we might have here by tempting a brief sexual encounter that
we'll both feel sorry about later, agreed?" I need you to help me
honor YOUR request to keep it clean and above board. If you insist on
staying and cuddling I'm not sure I'll be able to honor your request.
And if I lose it, and we somehow compromise what we've already agreed
to, because of my desire for you, that you won't respect me as a man
because I didn't have the strength to resist my impulses. And I'm
afraid because of that, you may not want to see me again. And I want
to see you again. So I'm asking you, please leave now and give me the
space I need to prove to you that I'm the type of man that you really
want. Please don't make this any more difficult than it already is . .
.
If after saying all of this she doesn't then kiss you and start
climbing all over you like you've never been kissed and climbed all
over before, you didn't deliver this little pattern believably.
However, you must stick to your guns. NO FUCKING this night. Unless of
course, that's all you want from the chyck is one fuck. Then, ok.
Myself, I usually like to fuck a chyck until I tire of them so I'm
going to play this soap opera for all it's worth and follow through
with my plan of turning her into a FB that thinks I'm in love with
her.
Now to those less skilled, this may seem like supplication, but it's
not because you built up this huge story (pattern) of how intensely
difficult it is for you to NOT continue with the seduction at this
time. Therefore, the fact that you CAN, even in this most tempting of
opportunities (her soaking wet pussy and a private place to put out
the flames), still maintain your composure enough to pull away,
(withdraw) communicates tremendous strength and courage on your part
to her.
Just the kind of man she's been looking/waiting for. And the kind of
man that Daddy, and Mommy, and Pastor Dick :) told her that a woman
with her rare beauty is entitled to.
You see, the real key to being IN control of your relationships with
anybody, (man or woman) is to make them feel like they are in control.
You lead them to where you want them to go by having them THINK that
they arrived at the decision all by themselves. You NEVER reveal to
them that you actually LEAD them to YOUR desire. It's all about THEM.
You just went along for the ride and happened to get something out of
it too. :)
When you can do that consistently. That's REAL power. It doesn't take
money, and it doesn't take status. Those things are just a ticket that
gets you into the ball park with perhaps a better initial position
from which to play your game. It does take understanding how to
communicate with other people that have something that you want
(money/sex) in a way that gets you what you desire consistently, and
with the least amount of hassle.
That's also IMO why the Alpha state can be so confusing to the
uninitiated. Being Alpha is not about being "cocky" or appearing to
others as a "bad-ass" or a "smart-ass." There are plenty of guys
around like that. Completely hopeless AFC's even though they could
probably beat the living hell out of you in a physical altercation
with them. No, being Alpha is about being INTELLIGENT. Knowing how to
communicate and manipulate people to get what you desire. The social
proof that results from developing these skills (plenty of women or
material things, or both) is what makes you APPEAR "Alpha" to others.
Whether you really are or not depends on how you OBTAINED your proof
and if you CONTROL it. If you appear NOT to be in control of your
social proof (money/material wealth/sex) regardless from whence it
came, you will not appear to be "Alpha" to anyone other than yourself,
and perhaps not EVEN to yourself.
That's just a fucking illusion.
HTH
Kakol
pump
That was fucking brilliant. Into the seduction file it goes.
- pump
--------------------------------------------------
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Chris
>
>That was fucking brilliant. Into the seduction file it goes.
Yeah, I was thinking the same thing. Lot's of good insights. The whole
religious chick thing is a moot point for me though, I decided a while ago not
to deal with chicks like that. Too much of a pain in the ass.
***Chris MD***
Zipgun Bob
news:3B7D972B...@bellsouth.net:
Yeah, I think I'll be going after some religious snatch to play this game.
High Quality!
Tupac Chopra
Good post, K.
"I do my part...behind the lines...
Swabbing door handles of cop cars
With D.M.S.O.....mixed with L.S.D." -- Dead Kennedys