Has anyone considered "helping" this Ray guy?

MTGawd

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Jan 3, 2007, 5:56:00 PM1/3/07

to

Maybe someone could turn this fool around. LOL.

This guy is so pathetic, I would love for him to do a 180 and become a true
master PUA.

I think y'all should do an intervention or something. lol

Message has been deleted

Ray Gordon, creator of the "pivot"

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Jan 3, 2007, 6:00:20 PM1/3/07

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Wow, another anonymous internet hater who uses my methods presented to him
by others.

Poor little dweeb.

--
Ray Gordon, Author
The OFFICIAL Ray Gordon Blog:
http://moderncaveman.typepad.com

MTGawd

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Jan 3, 2007, 6:40:24 PM1/3/07

to

"Ray Gordon, creator of the \"pivot\"" <r...@cybersheet.com> wrote:
>> Maybe someone could turn this fool around. LOL.
>>
>> This guy is so pathetic, I would love for him to do a 180 and become a
>> true
>> master PUA.
>>
>> I think y'all should do an intervention or something. lol
>
>Wow, another anonymous internet hater who uses my methods presented to him
>by others.
>
>Poor little dweeb.

Hey...I think it would be inspirational if you can battle back from your
sickness and turn your life around... *shrug*

Lori Koonce

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Jan 3, 2007, 8:48:47 PM1/3/07

to

> Hey...I think it would be inspirational if you can battle back from your
> sickness and turn your life around... *shrug*

MT

I'm gonna save you a lot of trouble.

In the past I used to be concerned about Ray. That was before something
I said pissed him off and I got called a Slut and a Whore.

Ray really dosen't know how to handle it when people are being kind. I
think its because it dosen't happen often, and he hasn't had a the
chance to pick up the skills we all learned as really little children.

Lori

HC

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Jan 3, 2007, 10:28:32 PM1/3/07

to

Lori Koonce wrote:
> <snipped>
> > Hey...I think it would be inspirational if you can battle back from your
> > sickness and turn your life around... *shrug*
>
> MT
>
> I'm gonna save you a lot of trouble.
>
> In the past I used to be concerned about Ray. That was before something
> I said pissed him off and I got called a Slut and a Whore.
>

So because of that, you are no longer concerned. What a great gal.

Had it occured to you, that being called a slut and a whore by Ray
means absolutely nothing? Why would you let such an insignificant
event, in fact perhaps the *most* insignificant event, change the way
you feel about being concerned for your fellow human beings?

Could it be that you really didn't give a shit in the first place, or
do you think it had more to do with a nerve being hit when you were
called a slut and a whore?

I dunno, I'm just asking is all . . .

> Ray really dosen't know how to handle it when people are being kind. I
> think its because it dosen't happen often, and he hasn't had a the
> chance to pick up the skills we all learned as really little children.
>

Nice. The self proclaimed once concerned kind person takes a swipe at
the guy she once cared for on her way out the door.

You can't make this shit up, folks.

> Lori

dman

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Jan 3, 2007, 10:55:27 PM1/3/07

to

Before you suggested this did you put a one cent bet on it happening?
Because if it ever comes true you will be the richest person in the
world.

Old Fart

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Jan 4, 2007, 6:41:07 AM1/4/07

to

>> I think y'all should do an intervention or something. lol

Too many folks have offered to 'help' grp-ie,
but he avoids help..in the court, in the alley,
wherever. He's afraid of human contact in any form.

JJTj

------ Gordon Roy Parker threatening children, the sick and elderly --------

>>Subject: Re: May Lissa's Mom DIE PAINFULLY ANDROT IN HELL****
>>x-no-archive: yes
>>Date: Tue, 21 Apr 1998 19:13:02 -0600
>>From: ray...@hotmail.com
>>Organization: Deja News - The Leader in Internet Discussion
>>Newsgroups: alt.sports.gymnastics

>> x-no-archive: yes

>> ****Disclaimer: I was discriminated against on the basis of
>>gender today and told point-blank that this was the reason. Having been
>>taunted by the WHOREDENS and by Lissa over this, I consider it only fair
>>to return similar sentiments. When I get a full apology from Lissa, and
>>from Dave, and his website and RayFAQ go down, I will CONSIDER changing
>>my attitude.

>> Ray, first of all STOP CURSING, KIDS READ THIS TOO!! Dave, lol!
>>HA HAHA! dang! oh shit! maaaaaan...! lol! hmmmaaaa! Ray's gonna sue you!
>>looool!!!! [laughing] shit.... hire me as your lawyer. he he ha ha ha...
>>loooll

>> <----Stop Cursing? FUCK YOU. FUCK GYMNAST WHORES TOO. They
>>know DAMN well what goes on and what harmed me and they LAUGH at it.
>>May they all do a GOMEZ on vault and have the ambulance do a GRIVICH on
>>the way to the hospital if they are going to laugh at my career road
>>blocks, sexual road blocks that they CLAIM to disapprove of...except
>>when they need a job, so then it's okay to show a little ass, as long as
>>the boss doesn't try to touch that ass. FUCK THEM. They're moral
>>GARBAGE! They know it too; that's why they can't stand hearing it; if
>>it weren't true they wouldn't care. They're good for ONE THING and ONE
>>THING only, and they know that too. If they want me to be nice to them,
>>let them undo a few years of damage and apologize for THEIR attitudes.
>>They bring this shit on themselves with their arrogance. Spoiled BRATS.

>> You think my suing Dave and Dominique is a joke? Keep laughing.
>>Please. I'd love it if you did. You want to be Dave's lawyer? Go right
>>ahead. You punks think this is playtime; you're in for an awfully rude
>>shock. I gave fair warning. Dave(and Dominique through Dave) said "Go
>>for it." I will. I'll go for every last ounce of gold that resides in
>>both their scumbag pockets.

>> See, I was being a NICE GUY about this before. I decided not to
>>be NICE anymore. I get really FUCKING PISSED OFFwhen people mock my
>>pain, enough to where I start focusing my energy on THEIR pain. Lissa's
>>pain. The pain of watching her mother die the same death my secretarial
>>career died. Yes, that death. I know what it's like to watch something
>>you love die. Watching my father die right in front of my eyes at age
>>12 wasn't as painful as watching women get sexually harassed by their
>>bosses, but that was nothing compared to the pain of seeing women mock
>>the issue, like it were okay, like they couldn't have the courage to do
>>the right thing.

>> Lissa, watch your mom fade away and think of mycareer, and then
>>think of the fact that I can revive my career. Noone will be able to
>>revive your mom. No one. She's DYING, and she's DYING slowly. Does she
>>even remember your name anymore? I don't think so.....you think Dave's
>>such a nice guy? I don't. Hedoes that page for you, Missy, Dominique,
>>and all those wonderful girls who worship him. You think he's going to
>>get away with it? He's not. If you want to see God's punishment for your
>>treatment of me, watch it in your mom.

>> My last spell went to Jaycie's knees. She still competing?
>>Nope. The next one goes to Lissa's mom. Note her condition today and
>>see how she progresses from here. Don't mess with a psychic. After
>>this one is done I'll start REALLY wishing for some Gomez action on the
>>vault, and I'll start naming names and focusing ALL of my psychic energy
>>on it.

Ray Gordon, creator of the "pivot"

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Jan 4, 2007, 8:40:50 AM1/4/07

to

>>Wow, another anonymous internet hater who uses my methods presented to him
>>by others.
>>
>>Poor little dweeb.
>
> Hey...I think it would be inspirational if you can battle back from your
> sickness and turn your life around... *shrug*

If he wants to know why all he can get is slut trash, quality women don't
find men like him very desirable. He's cowardly, innacurate, a wannabe
bully, and weak.

He does what he does because he'd never have the courage to attach his name
to words like that. Women don't like cowards like him.

If you want to be a coward like him, check out the "seduction gurus" he
claims taught him to be the way he is.

Message has been deleted

Old Fart

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Jan 4, 2007, 11:46:02 AM1/4/07

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>If you want to be a coward like

>> Ray Gordon, "..inexcusable Failure.."

JJTj

------------Sung to the N.Y. Dolls song "Personality Crisis" ----

YEEEAAHHHHH!!! YEAH YEAH YEAH YEAH..

<WAIT> NO NO NO NO ..NO NO NO.. N0! N0!

Well we can't take him this week
And his dolls can't write another S-P-E-A-CCCCC-HHH !!!
..they hope for a better day when this newsloon just fades away..

all' about that "..inexcusable failure.."
...if he likes it &/or no-t..
But now his um, 'hellen' & herpes, 'dats all he got..

(Judge hadd'a rule about that "..inexcusable..")

yeah...yeah yeah yeah...

But now he needs to be a man, now he got to be 'da man'..
AND he KNOWS he gots to do it all, NOW NOW WOWS !!!
Yet he thinks about the times he failed, on every account..
..& it sure got to be a 'drag' when he wants2 kill his'self..
he has to deal with "..AOL.." chat rooms where he molest' about
(He denied' 'bout..)

..'bout his "..inexcusable failure.."
..a Judge told him that.....that's what he got..
But now his mommie, and dollies, 'dats all he got..

Just GOTTA SHOUT ABOUT HIS "..inexcusable.."

YEAH YEAH YEAH...YEAH...

And he's a... coward hate monger on that 9/11 afternoon..
<livin proof of a real loonie-toon ! ! >
change on into da sock-puppet, fooling no 1 2 soon..

he WETS his UNDER-ROOOOOSSSSSS!!!!!!

......"..inexcusable failure.."
if he likes it &/or no-t....It's always "..NOT.."
But now his, 'hellen' and herpes ' dats whot he got..

That loser is a "..INEXCUSABLE FAILURE !!!!.."

YEAH YEAH..YEAH YEAH..

Now, with all da perks n free rides Penni Parker pays 4
His dollies become his 'private friends' nite n day 4..
That "..inexcusable.." 's (failing to do it all againnnnn)
(ah ah..no longer fun..)
"..inexcusable.." will his pain ever end..?
<not 2 B so much like a..>
"..inexcusable.." impressions of a joke,
..n 2 pretend 2 pretend 2 pretend too pretend,
"..inexcusable ..".." dreams of celebrities he'll never meet
(he lives their life off television)

Talkin' about that "..inexcusable failure.."
if he likes it &/or no-t....It's always "..NOT.."
But now um, 'hellen' and herpes ' dats whot he got..

hey grp-ie don't you worry

"..inexcusable failure.." please don't cry
he's just a "..inexcusable failure.." and cannot stop

Because he walks a "..inexcusable.."
Talks a "..inexcusable failure.."

See...@example.com

unread,

Jan 4, 2007, 11:48:05 AM1/4/07

to

Ray Gordon destroyed more irony meters with the following:

>>> Wow, another anonymous internet hater who uses my methods presented to him
>>> by others.
>>>
>>> Poor little dweeb.
>> Hey...I think it would be inspirational if you can battle back from your
>> sickness and turn your life around... *shrug*
>
> If he wants to know why all he can get is slut trash, quality women don't
> find men like him very desirable. He's cowardly, innacurate, a wannabe
> bully, and weak.
>
> He does what he does because he'd never have the courage to attach his name
> to words like that. Women don't like cowards like him.
>
> If you want to be a coward like him, check out the "seduction gurus" he
> claims taught him to be the way he is.

and the above tirade was written by one
who equates *all* women with Hitler

the phrase "cowardly, innacurate, a wannabe bully, and weak."
seems more than a little appropriate in this context...

( overlooking the irony of the spelling of "innacurate" )

Krus T. Olfard

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Jan 4, 2007, 6:50:30 PM1/4/07

to

"Ray Gordon, creator of the \"pivot\"" <r...@cybersheet.com> wrote in
news:mOqdndmzOYJ3ngDY...@pghconnect.com:

>
> If he wants to know why all he can get is slut trash, quality women
> don't find men like him very desirable. He's cowardly, innacurate, a
> wannabe bully, and weak.
>
>

once again gordy loser tries to claim that any man who thinks gordy's
shit will never get a quality woman...

once again gordy loser is full of shit...

I tell you that I think you are full of shit, gordy loser - but then I
can provide photos of me with women and you can't because no even partly
sane woman would have anything to do with you...

you claim I'm mistaken in the above? then prove it, loser...

--
Krustavus Teofilus Olfard

------------------
Everything I post is my opinion. If you don't like my opinions then
killfile me, if you have the balls.

BTW: If there is one clear rule in this world, it's "Do NOT stick your
finger in the ancient alien coffin."

Odious

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Jan 6, 2007, 1:29:09 PM1/6/07

to

"MTGawd" <po...@poot.net> wrote in message
news:part1of1.1.m...@ue.ph...

Can't be done.... gordo has a mental condition that compels him to believe
he is an expert on any subject in which he takes an interest. To accept
assistance and improve his skills, would first require him to admit that he
doesn't have the skill he believe he has.

You might as well ask a blind person to see or a personal with no legs to do
backflips.

Gordo has real diagnosed mental illness that prevents him from making the
changes in his life that he would need to make... or even admitting that
changes are needed in the first place.

Odious

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Jan 6, 2007, 1:43:13 PM1/6/07

to

"Ray Gordon, creator of the "pivot"" <r...@cybersheet.com> wrote in message
news:mOqdndmzOYJ3ngDY...@pghconnect.com...

>>>Wow, another anonymous internet hater who uses my methods presented to
>>>him
>>>by others.
>>>
>>>Poor little dweeb.
>>
>> Hey...I think it would be inspirational if you can battle back from your
>> sickness and turn your life around... *shrug*
>
> If he wants to know why all he can get is slut trash, quality women don't
> find men like him very desirable.

Gordo defines a slut as any woman who is fucking any guy that isn't him.

When he can't address the fact that he is mentaly ill and his life is a
wreck... he attacks those women.

> He's cowardly, innacurate, a wannabe bully, and weak.
>

The kind of guy who would treaten children with his magical powers?

> He does what he does because he'd never have the courage to attach his
> name to words like that. Women don't like cowards like him.

And gordo knows what women think because...

________________________________________________________________
http://www.inraptured.com/board/viewtopic.php?p=465

I don't rate myself but my style as done by Hellen works on me enough to
convince me briefly that I'm female and get me off.
________________________________________________________________

> If you want to be a coward like him, check out the "seduction gurus" he
> claims taught him to be the way he is.

Gordo is a coward because he is so afraid of facing his own sickness, and
far too lazy to do the work that could bring about change in his life.

chocola...@aol.com

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Jan 6, 2007, 3:38:31 PM1/6/07

to

Odious wrote:

> Gordo has real diagnosed mental illness that prevents him from making the
> changes in his life that he would need to make... or even admitting that
> changes are needed in the first place.

If you know and understand that Odious, then why do you carry on
castigating...castrating him even.... on a daily basis?? Doesn't that
make you more evil than him??

Peanut

Alex

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Jan 6, 2007, 3:44:02 PM1/6/07

to

in article 1168115911.5...@i15g2000cwa.googlegroups.com,
chocola...@aol.com at chocola...@aol.com wrote on 1/6/07 3:38 PM:

No one should get a free pass for refusing to treat a mental illness.

chocola...@aol.com

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Jan 6, 2007, 4:25:28 PM1/6/07

to

He does treat his illness, but bipolar patients often forget to take
their medication and only realise that they are behaving oddly when
other people point it out, and sadly even then they refuse to believe
the truth. Would you ask someone to run with broken legs? Kilfile him
if he bothers you...

Peanut

Alex

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Jan 6, 2007, 4:45:39 PM1/6/07

to

in article 1168118727.9...@q40g2000cwq.googlegroups.com,
chocola...@aol.com at chocola...@aol.com wrote on 1/6/07 4:25 PM:

>
> Alex wrote:
>> in article 1168115911.5...@i15g2000cwa.googlegroups.com,
>> chocola...@aol.com at chocola...@aol.com wrote on 1/6/07 3:38 PM:
>>
>>>
>>> Odious wrote:
>>>
>>>> Gordo has real diagnosed mental illness that prevents him from making the
>>>> changes in his life that he would need to make... or even admitting that
>>>> changes are needed in the first place.
>>>
>>> If you know and understand that Odious, then why do you carry on
>>> castigating...castrating him even.... on a daily basis?? Doesn't that
>>> make you more evil than him??
>>>
>>
>> No one should get a free pass for refusing to treat a mental illness.
>
> He does treat his illness,

Not according to him, he doesn't.

Do you have information he doesn't?

> but bipolar patients often forget to take
> their medication and only realise that they are behaving oddly when
> other people point it out, and sadly even then they refuse to believe
> the truth.

So how else would you have someone "point it out?"

> Would you ask someone to run with broken legs? Kilfile him
> if he bothers you...
>

I have a better idea.

Instead of that, how about you just killfile me if I bother you?

dracozna

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Jan 6, 2007, 5:23:50 PM1/6/07

to

There is a difference in forgetting to take medication and not wanting
to take medication.

> Would you ask someone to run with broken legs?

No, but thats different. A man with broken legs can get help. His legs
can be put in a cast so it can heal properly. And he can use a
wheelchair to move around. If he refuses to accept this, he shouldn't be
complaining that he can't walk or that his legs start to take weird shapes.

> Kilfile him
> if he bothers you...
>
> Peanut

Use your own advice and you'll learn why it doesn't work.

chocola...@aol.com

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Jan 6, 2007, 6:33:11 PM1/6/07

to

dracozna wrote:
> chocola...@aol.com wrote:
> > Alex wrote:
> >> in article 1168115911.5...@i15g2000cwa.googlegroups.com,
> >> chocola...@aol.com at chocola...@aol.com wrote on 1/6/07 3:38 PM:
> >>
> >>> Odious wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> Gordo has real diagnosed mental illness that prevents him from making the
> >>>> changes in his life that he would need to make... or even admitting that
> >>>> changes are needed in the first place.
> >>> If you know and understand that Odious, then why do you carry on
> >>> castigating...castrating him even.... on a daily basis?? Doesn't that
> >>> make you more evil than him??
> >>>
> >> No one should get a free pass for refusing to treat a mental illness.
> >
> > He does treat his illness, but bipolar patients often forget to take
> > their medication and only realise that they are behaving oddly when
> > other people point it out, and sadly even then they refuse to believe
> > the truth.
>
> There is a difference in forgetting to take medication and not wanting
> to take medication.
>
>
> > Would you ask someone to run with broken legs?
>
> No, but thats different. A man with broken legs can get help.

But he would have to keep the plaster casts on. What if they fell
off?...I know it's not very likely, but think abstractly...when a
person with bipolar 'forgets' to take their medication, it's not like
when you forget your car keys and then you go back to the house for
them. Half the the time they don't forget as such, they just 'believe'
that they don't need them anymore, because they feel so well. Would
you take tablets if you felt well?

His legs
> can be put in a cast so it can heal properly. And he can use a
> wheelchair to move around. If he refuses to accept this, he shouldn't be
> complaining that he can't walk or that his legs start to take weird shapes.

But psychotic people don't think logically at all and neither would a
psychotic man with his two broken legs in plaster...:)

> > Kilfile him
> > if he bothers you...

> Use your own advice and you'll learn why it doesn't work.

Yes, I know he keeps changing his name...

Peanut

Alex

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Jan 6, 2007, 6:44:01 PM1/6/07

to

in article 1168126391.8...@42g2000cwt.googlegroups.com,
chocola...@aol.com at chocola...@aol.com wrote on 1/6/07 6:33 PM:

> when a
> person with bipolar 'forgets' to take their medication, it's not like
> when you forget your car keys and then you go back to the house for
> them. Half the the time they don't forget as such, they just 'believe'
> that they don't need them anymore, because they feel so well. Would
> you take tablets if you felt well?

Depends on what the tablets were for.

Would a diabetic take his insulin if he felt fine? He'd better or he won't
be feeling fine for long.

Same thing for a bipolar. If he doesn't take the meds, he won't feel fine
for long.

There are those with mental illness who stop taking the meds once they feel
fine. The smart ones learn not to do that after ONE trial.

unread,

Jan 7, 2007, 2:17:18 PM1/7/07

to

in article 1168189108.2...@11g2000cwr.googlegroups.com,
chocola...@aol.com at chocola...@aol.com wrote on 1/7/07 11:58 AM:

>
> Alex wrote:
>> in article 1168126391.8...@42g2000cwt.googlegroups.com,
>> chocola...@aol.com at chocola...@aol.com wrote on 1/6/07 6:33 PM:
>>
>>> when a
>>> person with bipolar 'forgets' to take their medication, it's not like
>>> when you forget your car keys and then you go back to the house for
>>> them. Half the the time they don't forget as such, they just 'believe'
>>> that they don't need them anymore, because they feel so well. Would
>>> you take tablets if you felt well?
>>
>> Depends on what the tablets were for.
>>
>> Would a diabetic take his insulin if he felt fine? He'd better or he won't
>> be feeling fine for long.
>>
>> Same thing for a bipolar. If he doesn't take the meds, he won't feel fine
>> for long.
>>
>> There are those with mental illness who stop taking the meds once they feel
>> fine. The smart ones learn not to do that after ONE trial.
>>
>> What's Gordon's excuse?
>
> You're getting confused between a physical illness and a mental
> illness, the two are very different.

No, they're not.

Learn a bit about what you're talking about.

> With the exception of a few
> neurotic illnesses such as depression, mental illness or psychotic
> illness does not respond to reason. So telling someone with say
> bipolar that they need to take their medication because they will
> become ill does not work. They just have to trust the doctor or nurse
> prescribing to know it will help them.

No, they have to be able to see what the illness is doing to their life and
make the decision to do what they need to do to get better.

I really suggest you spend some time researching this before you talk any
more about it.

> They have a different mindset
> to people with neurotic illnesses or people without mental illness.
> It really is hard for them to feel well and then understand being told
> to keep taking the meds...what for they ask, I'm fine aren't I? They
> are not stupid, but their reasoning is not there. A reasent survey
> suggested that quite a lot of people with bipolar do not want to be
> well, they enjoy the 'ups' as they accomplish a lot during that time
> and it's only the 'downs' they don't like.

Which is why many of them only seek help when depressed and don't discuss
their manias with the doctor.

I know quite a bit about this and you don't.

Might want to either learn some more or listen up.

> So taken to the next stage,
> if you treat the mood swings, which is what it is, then the good ups
> disapear and with it the part of their personality that they like the
> best (the families don't though). It's a no win situation. Take the
> meds and become 'flattened' or don't take the meds and become difficult
> to live with. From the families and the medical point of view it's
> better if they take the meds, but maybe not from the patient's point of
> view, which is distorted anyway...
>

A long-winded post with still no answer to why people who refuse meds should
get a free ride.

Krus T. Olfard

unread,

Jan 7, 2007, 2:20:33 PM1/7/07

to

chocola...@aol.com wrote in
news:1168189108.2...@11g2000cwr.googlegroups.com:

Undoubtedly there is some truth in the above but considering that gordy
insists on imposing his personality, unmedicated, up or down, on this
newsgroup the results of his not taking his meds is not only not being
sufferable to others but is having those others tell him that he is being
insufferable.

Why do people like you insist that reasonably normal people have to 'put
up' with the loonacy of those who are not reasonably normal? No, their
loonacy has a price for us so it also has a price for them.

Odious

unread,

Jan 7, 2007, 2:33:23 PM1/7/07

to

<chocola...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:1168115911.5...@i15g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...

>
> Odious wrote:
>
>> Gordo has real diagnosed mental illness that prevents him from making the
>> changes in his life that he would need to make... or even admitting that
>> changes are needed in the first place.
>
> If you know and understand that Odious, then why do you carry on
> castigating...castrating him even.... on a daily basis??

Because my interaction with gordo is not for HIS benefit. My interaction
with gordo is for the benefit of those he lies to on a regular basis as well
as for my own entertainment.

>Doesn't that
> make you more evil than him??

Gordo is not evil... he's far to ineffectual to be considered evil. Evil
gets shit done.

Gordo is annoying... like a gnat that keep buzzing in your ear.

And what's evil about swatting at a gnat?

Message has been deleted

Odious

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Jan 7, 2007, 2:34:11 PM1/7/07

to

<chocola...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:1168118727.9...@q40g2000cwq.googlegroups.com...

Gordo refuses to medicate.... he's said as much numerous times.

speeding

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Jan 7, 2007, 5:07:39 PM1/7/07

to

Alex <akau...@nyc.NOSPAM.rr.com> wrote in
news:C1C59E71.EEE36%akau...@nyc.NOSPAM.rr.com:

> in article 1168126391.8...@42g2000cwt.googlegroups.com,
> chocola...@aol.com at chocola...@aol.com wrote on 1/6/07
> 6:33 PM:
>
>> when a
>> person with bipolar 'forgets' to take their medication, it's not like
>> when you forget your car keys and then you go back to the house for
>> them. Half the the time they don't forget as such, they just
>> 'believe' that they don't need them anymore, because they feel so
>> well. Would you take tablets if you felt well?
>
> Depends on what the tablets were for.
>
> Would a diabetic take his insulin if he felt fine? He'd better or he
> won't be feeling fine for long.

He better not take the insulin if his blood sugar level requires him not
to. Taking insulin when his blood sugar is at the wrong level could also
kill or injure him. Further, taking the wrong dose of insulin would be
just as bad as not taking it at all.
So... he wouldn't if his mental conditions (or his physical condition)
made him believe he would not or should not need to.

> Same thing for a bipolar. If he doesn't take the meds, he won't feel
> fine for long.

But he's mentally imbalanced. You're not talking about someone who thinks
like a sane person.

And remember that deal about insulin... about how you need to take the
right dose of medication for the right level of blodd sugar... bipolar
and depression are a lot like that also... are they not? They vary in
intensity and severity, yes?
For insulin, the person taking the medication can guage that their
current status has become more severe or less severe than normal... and
adjust their medication accordingly. But, how does someone that's bi-
polar or depressed recognize they are going into a more severe stage?
What if their own mental status degrades to a point where they aren't
able to recognize that change? The person that's bi-polar might feel
fine... but be in the throws of a severe bout. And then feel like he's so
fine that he doesn't need his meds any more.

Again, you're talking about someone that is not fully sane.

> There are those with mental illness who stop taking the meds once they
> feel fine. The smart ones learn not to do that after ONE trial.
>
> What's Gordon's excuse?

A medical illness, it seems. Et ut?

--
You could be a Cylon and not even know it...

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/OKA_PUAs/join

speeding

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Jan 7, 2007, 5:17:06 PM1/7/07

to

dracozna <ne...@dracozna.nl> wrote in
news:45a0e196$0$327$e4fe...@news.xs4all.nl:

But ADHD is not a mental condition that impairs normal sane thought. ADHA
is not a mood or personality changing condition. A person with ADHD is
not losing a grip on locigal thought. Bi-polar people do. Read a bit
about it... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bipolar_disorder

You hit on a ver important point in your last statement...

*IF* a person chooses not to take the meds... then...

But someone that's bi-polar might not have a sane choice in the matter.
And yes, some actually choose not to take their med, because the manic
side of their condition helps them be (or feel) more creative.

speeding

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Jan 7, 2007, 5:37:21 PM1/7/07

to

Alex <akau...@nyc.NOSPAM.rr.com> wrote in
news:C1C6B16E.EEF93%akau...@nyc.NOSPAM.rr.com:

And how does someone with a mental illness that distorts their perception
of reality "see" what their illness is doing?

> I really suggest you spend some time researching this before you talk
> any more about it.

Exactly. *YOU* should. Much like you should learn what taking insulin at
the wrong time could do to you... you might want to learn what bi-
polarism is and what taking your meds does... and doesn't do.

>> They have a different mindset
>> to people with neurotic illnesses or people without mental illness.
>> It really is hard for them to feel well and then understand being
>> told to keep taking the meds...what for they ask, I'm fine aren't I?
>> They are not stupid, but their reasoning is not there. A reasent
>> survey suggested that quite a lot of people with bipolar do not want
>> to be well, they enjoy the 'ups' as they accomplish a lot during that
>> time and it's only the 'downs' they don't like.
>
> Which is why many of them only seek help when depressed and don't
> discuss their manias with the doctor.

Which is why the doctor is a doctor. The doctor should be looking for
that. Not you.

> I know quite a bit about this and you don't.

When did you graduate? What school? What is your specialty in? Have you
published?

Well, I've just spent the last five years as an assistant to a world
famous consultant psychiatrist...he speaks all over the world on
bipolar disorder illness, and has run a specialist clinic here in the
UK for the last seven years....I think I've picked up a little bit
about it along the way...
survey

> Which is why many of them only seek help when depressed and don't discuss
> their manias with the doctor.

Most bipolar patients have a season ticket to see the doctor, he or she
knows everything about their illness and are also looking out for
symptoms that have not yet been presented...once you have been
diagnosed with bipolar there is nowhere to run..

> A long-winded post with still no answer to why people who refuse meds should
> get a free ride.

I think you'll find that bipolar patients don't have a free ride - it
can be a tough life dodging job losses, losing friends and family and
fighting the urge to top yourself..

Peanut

chocola...@aol.com

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Jan 7, 2007, 7:09:46 PM1/7/07

to

Alex wrote:
> >> No one should get a free pass for refusing to treat a mental illness.
> >
> > He does treat his illness,
>
> Not according to him, he doesn't.
>
> Do you have information he doesn't?

Bipolar is very difficult to treat as the medication can be too low or
too high or not taken at all. Also there are many different kinds of
bipolar, in fact so many that the psychiatrists disagree on how many
there are. So getting each patient on the right medication is quite an
art in itself. So it's not surprising therefore that the patient "goes
off" as they say..

> So how else would you have someone "point it out?"

Usually it's the family who ring the doctor saying they can't cope, or
a CPN (nurse) notices something is not right and informs the doctor.

> how about you just killfile me if I bother you?

You know I'm starting to think that YOU are Ray.... Are you??

Peanut

Krus T. Olfard

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Jan 7, 2007, 7:34:57 PM1/7/07

to

chocola...@aol.com wrote in news:1168210340.523127.218010
@q40g2000cwq.googlegroups.com:

> from what has been posted about Ray over the last seven
> years that I have been reading this group I would say that he just
> needs to take his medication on a regular basis and get more sleep! :)
>

If he would do that almost no one in here would dump on him but he does
not.

This one is real simply - you behave like an asshole in public, for
whatever reason, and you are going to get treated like an asshole in
public - if you have some mental illness then if it is enough to get you
hospitalized you will most likely not be treated like an asshole in
public, otherwise if you act like an asshole in public you will be
treated like an asshole in public.

Mental illness is NOT a free ride to treat other people like shit and
have no consequences.

Now as to whether or not the abrasive asshole is actually mentally ill I
have no idea other than that is something that he has claimed, in court
filings no less, although he has REFUSED to take a court ordered exam
which in my mind makes that claim somewhat questionable.

Something for you to think about - you say you have for the last 7 years
read comments posted about the abrasive asshole - well, have you not also
in those 7 years read what the abrasive asshole has posted? If you have
read what the abrasive asshole has posted over the last 7 years and you
still think "oh poor baybee, you need me to protect your poor bi-polar
head from all the mean people who say hurtful things about you" then
perhaps you might well be advised to look into getting your own head
checked out.

chocola...@aol.com

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Jan 7, 2007, 7:36:08 PM1/7/07

to

Krus T. Olfard wrote:
> Undoubtedly there is some truth in the above but considering that gordy
> insists on imposing his personality, unmedicated, up or down, on this
> newsgroup the results of his not taking his meds is not only not being
> sufferable to others but is having those others tell him that he is being
> insufferable.

But the way that newsgroups are set out makes it easy to ignore posters
that you are not interested in. So without kilfiling you can just
ignore someone. I hardly ever read your posts because of the diatribe
against Ray most of the time...

> Why do people like you insist that reasonably normal people have to 'put
> up' with the loonacy of those who are not reasonably normal? No, their
> loonacy has a price for us so it also has a price for them.

You don't have to....but life's made up of all sorts. I thought America
was a free country - so if you want people to accept you warts and all
then you have to return the favour..

Just a thought, but did you realise that any one of us can become
psychotic at any time?

Peanut

chocola...@aol.com

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Jan 7, 2007, 7:43:54 PM1/7/07

to

speeding wrote:
> > Why do people like you insist that reasonably normal people have to
> > 'put up' with the loonacy of those who are not reasonably normal? No,
> > their loonacy has a price for us so it also has a price for them.
>
> Did he say you had to put up with him? I must have missed it. I thought
> he said "killfile him".

Hey..less of the "he"....I'm 100% WOMAN! :)

Then again, others go a step further and say
> ignore him. Do you equate ignoring him to putting up with him?

You don't have to put up with people that you don't really like, but my
point was that Ray is ill and he gets such stick on this group. I think
it's just a bad habit that the group has got into...and being a Brit I
don't like to see an underdog down..

Peanut

chocola...@aol.com

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Jan 7, 2007, 8:11:56 PM1/7/07

to

Krus T. Olfard wrote:

> This one is real simply - you behave like an asshole in public, for
> whatever reason, and you are going to get treated like an asshole in
> public - if you have some mental illness then if it is enough to get you
> hospitalized you will most likely not be treated like an asshole in
> public, otherwise if you act like an asshole in public you will be
> treated like an asshole in public.

The funny thing is KTO...that I've thought that you have been acting
like asshole for the last seven years...funny that isn't?

Can you imagine if they hospitalised everyone with bipolar! I know that
in England that would never happen, we don't have enough beds for
serioulsy ill people as it is. I think the same thing is happening over
in the states to - they are cutting beds for the mentally ill - where
do you think they go to?? Usenet of course....

> Mental illness is NOT a free ride to treat other people like shit and
> have no consequences.

> Now as to whether or not the abrasive asshole is actually mentally ill I
> have no idea other than that is something that he has claimed, in court
> filings no less, although he has REFUSED to take a court ordered exam
> which in my mind makes that claim somewhat questionable.
>
> Something for you to think about - you say you have for the last 7 years
> read comments posted about the abrasive asshole - well, have you not also
> in those 7 years read what the abrasive asshole has posted? If you have
> read what the abrasive asshole has posted over the last 7 years and you
> still think "oh poor baybee, you need me to protect your poor bi-polar
> head from all the mean people who say hurtful things about you" then
> perhaps you might well be advised to look into getting your own head
> checked out.

This answer says more about you than it does about me...

Peanut
Going to rest my poor bipolar head now...

Krus T. Olfard

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Jan 7, 2007, 8:54:17 PM1/7/07

to

chocola...@aol.com wrote in news:1168218715.989376.325490@
38g2000cwa.googlegroups.com:

>
> The funny thing is KTO...that I've thought that you have been acting
> like asshole for the last seven years...funny that isn't?
>
>

Actually I've only been acting like an asshole in a.s.f. for about 4
years or so - didn't come here before that - I missed first hand
experience with gordon loser's 9/11 bullshit.

If you have actually killfiled me then I have to believe that you read my
sig.

I tried killfiling gordon loser for a while but by the end of the first
day I realized that if I wanted to avoid him totally I'd have to stay
away from a.s.f. entirely and I WILL NOT let an abrasive asshole chase me
away from a place where I enjoy being. While I did not see his posts I
saw everything he posted in the responses that others posted and when he
knew that I had him killfiled he started fucking with the subjects of the
posts that I was making. As I said, he is an abrasive asshole.

If I stayed away from any responses posted to his posts I eventually had
to stop reading any threads because he would hijack almost every thread
that anyone started. As I said, he is an abrasive asshole.

So yes, you can hold his hand and tell him that things will really be all
right but I'm going to call him on his lies and bullshit whenever I feel
like it. If you have a problem with it then just accept that I am an
abrasive asshole and killfile me again (or for the first time, whichever
it is).

Alex

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Jan 7, 2007, 9:04:23 PM1/7/07

to

in article 1168210340.5...@q40g2000cwq.googlegroups.com,
chocola...@aol.com at chocola...@aol.com wrote on 1/7/07 5:52 PM:

unread,

Jan 7, 2007, 9:13:29 PM1/7/07

to

in article 1168216567.9...@v33g2000cwv.googlegroups.com,
chocola...@aol.com at chocola...@aol.com wrote on 1/7/07 7:36 PM:

> Just a thought, but did you realise that any one of us can become
> psychotic at any time?

That another jewel of wisdom your world-famous boss gave you?

Did he happen to add "for no reason?"

Krus T. Olfard

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Jan 7, 2007, 9:25:58 PM1/7/07

to

Alex <akau...@nyc.NOSPAM.rr.com> wrote in
news:C1C7115C.EF015%akau...@nyc.NOSPAM.rr.com:

Ghod, someone who agrees with Speeding's style of 'discussion'.
No wonder I thought she was being deliberately stupid.

dracozna

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Jan 8, 2007, 10:18:41 AM1/8/07

to

> But ADHD is not a mental condition that impairs normal sane thought. ADHD

> is not a mood or personality changing condition. A person with ADHD is

> not losing a grip on logical thought. Bi-polar people do. Read a bit
> about it... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bipolar_disorder
>
I know it's not the same.

> You hit on a very important point in your last statement...

>
> *IF* a person chooses not to take the meds... then...
>
> But someone that's bi-polar might not have a sane choice in the matter.
> And yes, some actually choose not to take their med, because the manic
> side of their condition helps them be (or feel) more creative.
>

That's their own choice, but that still means they have to accept the
consequences of their choice.

Message has been deleted

Bornnatural

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Jan 9, 2007, 11:00:32 AM1/9/07

to

<Tedd...@splat.net> wrote in message
news:1168356...@sp6iad.superfeed.net...
> I'm not going to spend much time in this argument, as it adds nothing to
> my
> life.....BUT
>
> It appears to me that in the case of Gordon, being bi polar is not the
> main
> event here. Good families can have members that just seem to go wrong.
> In
> this case, it appears that Gordon exhibits characteristics of what most
> people refer to as an asshole. Further, he insists on clogging the
> Federal
> Courts with his flame wars with those who have done nothing more than just
> to move away from him. Reading his "pleadings" shows that he continually
> irritates certain people just to get a reaction so he can continue his
> absurd "lawsuits". He trolls and posts flame bait, then sues those who
> step
> forward and confront him.
>
> I don't know if he's bi polar or not, but as it's been said before, you
> don't have to be a proctologist to know an asshole when you see one He
> tries to build nothing, he's only here to destroy. He's admitted it, so
> what's your problem?

He is bi-polar. I have a relative that is and its amazing how similar they
are. The relative can't talk to women either, once he had one over and took
her out to show the mule he had.....shaking head. Hes around 55 now and
still lives with his parents.
My brother went to visit him once and knocked on the door, no one answered.
He knew he was there and let himself in......found him hiding under the
bed.....scared. He was always talking about kicking someones ass, big man
and all that. His sister could whip his ass.
Its really a sad disorder. Once he got medicated, he smoothed out somewhat,
but you could still tell he wasn't right. If you ask me his whole family is
weird. His fathers take on life is "if it's fun or feels good, don't do it"
and his mother thinks drinking one beer makes you a drunk.
My brother did his sister by the way....I know...cousins...my brother would
fuck a snake if you held it still long enough. I could tell you some really
sick shit dude..:)

BN

> --
> Living after midnight
> Rockin' to the dawn
> Lovin' 'til the morning,
> Then I'm gone, I'm gone
>
> ----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Unrestricted-Secure Usenet
> News==----
> http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 120,000+
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> =----

speeding

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Jan 10, 2007, 5:01:45 AM1/10/07

to

chocola...@aol.com wrote in news:1168217034.321649.237340@
38g2000cwa.googlegroups.com:

>
> speeding wrote:
>> > Why do people like you insist that reasonably normal people have to
>> > 'put up' with the loonacy of those who are not reasonably normal?
No,
>> > their loonacy has a price for us so it also has a price for them.
>>
>> Did he say you had to put up with him? I must have missed it. I
thought
>> he said "killfile him".
>
> Hey..less of the "he"....I'm 100% WOMAN! :)

Okay. Sometimes it's hard to tell on Usenet. :D

> Then again, others go a step further and say
>> ignore him. Do you equate ignoring him to putting up with him?
>
> You don't have to put up with people that you don't really like, but my
> point was that Ray is ill and he gets such stick on this group. I think
> it's just a bad habit that the group has got into...and being a Brit I
> don't like to see an underdog down..

Well, he gets the stick, because sometimes he does deserve it. He's
called more than a few ladies "cunts" and "whores" and has a nasty habit
of insulting everyone... even people that defend him. But, there's a
difference, as I've said before, between spanking the unruly child and
beating a dead horse. One poster pointing out that Ray's made yet another
idiotic post is one thing... but ten posters all at the same time posting
everythign he's posted in history.... that's dead horse.

It's also, generally, those same people that never ignore him and that
claim it's not possible to ignore him that get all pissed off when
someone asks why ignoring Ray doesn't work. I figure they were even more
pissed off the one time in ASF history that Ray got ignored... and cut
back on posting. Probably felt left out.

My thinking... it's like a hyena pack. They've weeded a weaker animal
from the herd and are pounding it for the kill. They fuss when a lion
comes along, but don't screw with the lion too much, unless the lion
threatens their target. Then they bluster and cackle and make a big
noise. But, when it comes down to it, they won't dare attack unless it's
the pack against a single target. When they can't single someone out,
they go cower in the safety of the fields.

> Peanut

speeding

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Jan 10, 2007, 5:06:51 AM1/10/07

to

Alex <akau...@nyc.NOSPAM.rr.com> wrote in
news:C1C7115C.EF015%akau...@nyc.NOSPAM.rr.com:

> in article 1168211442.2...@s34g2000cwa.googlegroups.com,
> chocola...@aol.com at chocola...@aol.com wrote on 1/7/07
> 6:10 PM:
>
>>
>> speeding wrote:
>>>> Would a diabetic take his insulin if he felt fine? He'd better or
>>>> he won't be feeling fine for long.
>>>
>>> He better not take the insulin if his blood sugar level requires him
>>> not to. Taking insulin when his blood sugar is at the wrong level
>>> could also kill or injure him. Further, taking the wrong dose of
>>> insulin would be just as bad as not taking it at all.
>>> So... he wouldn't if his mental conditions (or his physical
>>> condition) made him believe he would not or should not need to.
>
> Once again, speeding misses the forest for the trees.

Care to explain this? I simply asserted that a person that's bi-polar
wouldn't take his meds if he didn't need to. Or thought he didn't need
to. I also asserted that bi-polar waxes and wanes in strength, meaning
taking a prescribed dose might not always even be effective.

Where are you seeing trees, forests, or wood in this assertion?

>>>> Same thing for a bipolar. If he doesn't take the meds, he won't
>>>> feel fine for long.
>>>
>>> But he's mentally imbalanced. You're not talking about someone who
>>> thinks like a sane person.
>>>
>>> And remember that deal about insulin... about how you need to take
>>> the right dose of medication for the right level of blodd sugar...
>>> bipolar and depression are a lot like that also... are they not?
>>> They vary in intensity and severity, yes?
>>> For insulin, the person taking the medication can guage that their
>>> current status has become more severe or less severe than normal...
>>> and adjust their medication accordingly. But, how does someone
>>> that's bi- polar or depressed recognize they are going into a more
>>> severe stage? What if their own mental status degrades to a point
>>> where they aren't able to recognize that change? The person that's
>>> bi-polar might feel fine... but be in the throws of a severe bout.
>>> And then feel like he's so fine that he doesn't need his meds any
>>> more.
>>>
>>> Again, you're talking about someone that is not fully sane.
>>>
>>>> There are those with mental illness who stop taking the meds once
>>>> they feel fine. The smart ones learn not to do that after ONE
>>>> trial.
>>>>
>>>> What's Gordon's excuse?
>>>
>>> A medical illness, it seems. Et ut?
>
> Do you understand a word you read?

I understood then enough to type them. Did you understand them?

Care to comment about the article I mentioned, Alex? You are claiming to
be an expert, yes? I'd like to hear your take on the article from Nov
that I mentioned. I don't thing trees were discussed in it, by the way.

>> Exactly, Speeding...go to the top of the class and wait for me...:)
>>
>> Peanut

speeding

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Jan 10, 2007, 5:16:08 AM1/10/07

to

dracozna <ne...@dracozna.nl> wrote in
news:45a260bd$0$321$e4fe...@news.xs4all.nl:

It is WHEN it's their choice... made while lucid. But, would you say that
it is a choice if their mind has degraded to a point where they are no
longer capable of normal rational thought? With bi-polar, as I understand
it, a person that's taking their meds normally and within their dosage...
can have a severe bout. When that happens, their normal medication won't
be effective... and they then lose the ability to think rationally. They
will THINK they are fine, but people around them will know something's
not right.

But, if no one is around them to tell them they need more medication...
and they can't rationally tell it themeselves... they are screwed, aren't
they? But, the question then is... Is that their fault?

Add two more questions then...

Would Ray's mom be around and able to tell him that he needs his meds?

Would Ray believe a bunch of Ray-hating Usenet fans when they tell him
that he needs to take his meds? Would you if you were him?

speeding

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Jan 10, 2007, 5:30:20 AM1/10/07

to

chocola...@aol.com wrote in
news:1168218715.9...@38g2000cwa.googlegroups.com:

>
> Krus T. Olfard wrote:
>
>> This one is real simply - you behave like an asshole in public, for
>> whatever reason, and you are going to get treated like an asshole in
>> public - if you have some mental illness then if it is enough to get
>> you hospitalized you will most likely not be treated like an asshole
>> in public, otherwise if you act like an asshole in public you will be
>> treated like an asshole in public.
>
> The funny thing is KTO...that I've thought that you have been acting
> like asshole for the last seven years...funny that isn't?

Well now, hey.... KTO and I certainly don't see eye to eye. And I find
the lack of logic in his arguments to be common. But I'd be hard pressed
to say he's acted like an asshole. The closest he's ever come to that
would be posting about how he's killfiled someone and then replying to
them. That's hardly being an asshole. If you want to see a display of
asshole-like behavior, you should study Ray or his protege, HC.

> Can you imagine if they hospitalised everyone with bipolar! I know
> that in England that would never happen, we don't have enough beds for
> serioulsy ill people as it is. I think the same thing is happening
> over in the states to - they are cutting beds for the mentally ill -
> where do you think they go to?? Usenet of course....

Really... I thought most of them ended up in politics. :P

>> Mental illness is NOT a free ride to treat other people like shit and
>> have no consequences.
>
>> Now as to whether or not the abrasive asshole is actually mentally
>> ill I have no idea other than that is something that he has claimed,
>> in court filings no less, although he has REFUSED to take a court
>> ordered exam which in my mind makes that claim somewhat questionable.
>>
>> Something for you to think about - you say you have for the last 7
>> years read comments posted about the abrasive asshole - well, have
>> you not also in those 7 years read what the abrasive asshole has
>> posted? If you have read what the abrasive asshole has posted over
>> the last 7 years and you still think "oh poor baybee, you need me to
>> protect your poor bi-polar head from all the mean people who say
>> hurtful things about you" then perhaps you might well be advised to
>> look into getting your own head checked out.
>
> This answer says more about you than it does about me...

Aside from the last half of the sentence, it is a decent answer. It's
hard to say that Ray deserves what he gets... but it's hard to say he
doesn't, either. The origin of his 9/11 posts are dubious... but he
doesn't deny them, either. Same holds true for many of the other posts
attributed to him. Then there are claims that he has personally
attacked... OFFLINE... people that irritated him. It's one thing to be an
asshole on Usenet..many here are great at that. But to take it offline...
to screw with someone's life... that's quite different.

So, perhaps, instead of asking why the folks keep ragging on him here in
Usenet... you could instead ask IF WHAT THEY CLAIM IS TRUE about being
personally attacked... why they don't grow a pair and take it back to him
offline, instead of blustering here about what they "will" do... someday.

Just a humble opinion/thought/idea.

> Peanut
> Going to rest my poor bipolar head now...
>
>

--

Johannes Seppi

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Jan 10, 2007, 12:01:55 PM1/10/07

to

On Wed, 10 Jan 2007 10:30:20 GMT, speeding <no...@biz.org> wrote:

[...]

>Aside from the last half of the sentence, it is a decent answer. It's
>hard to say that Ray deserves what he gets... but it's hard to say he
>doesn't, either. The origin of his 9/11 posts are dubious... but he
>doesn't deny them, either.

[...]

Just a minor thing: the origin isn't dubious at all. I've been here
the day he posted them, he not only hasn't denied them, but he
actually defended them and tried to reframe them. Also he couldn't
have them pulled from Google without proof of his authorship.
Your ranting about what other people should or shouldn't say about Ray
would be more credible if you at least got your facts straight.

Johannes

dracozna

unread,

Jan 10, 2007, 12:39:21 PM1/10/07

to

If no one is around to tell them, then no one has a problem with it. But
if someone's around to tell them, they should know.

> Add two more questions then...
>
> Would Ray's mom be around and able to tell him that he needs his meds?
>

Don't know. I don't know his mom and/or what she does.

> Would Ray believe a bunch of Ray-hating Usenet fans when they tell him
> that he needs to take his meds? Would you if you were him?
>

No matter who it is that has something to say about my style, what I do
or what I say, I would take it into consideration.

Thom E. Geiger

unread,

Jan 10, 2007, 6:09:37 PM1/10/07

to

On Wed, 10 Jan 2007 10:06:51 GMT, speeding <no...@biz.org> wrote:

I seem to be one of the few people who doesn't accept his on-again,
off- again bipolar affliction claims. Either he has it or he doesn't.
I have always stated my belief he picked a condition with symptoms
that allow him the most freedom to be as idiotic and threatening as he
wants, and people blindly accept the excuse he's BPD.
I say he's a stupid asshole and he's dangerous. IMHO, if there's a
condition he is "suffering" from (and it wouldn't be him suffering
from it, but his victims), it'd be his being a narcissistic,
sociopathic psychopath, a female-hating homosexual with paedophilic
tendencies. I believe he's manifested every one of those traits
through his ten years of usenet postings, more so than any BPD
affliction.

Thom E. Geiger, Domain Name Owner
ChewOnThis.Org
(the Official GRP NewsLoon tracking website)
Ray-Gordon.com
Ray-Gordon.net
Newsloon.com

Don't buy anything from any business trying to use SLAPP lawsuits to
stop criticism of the company, owners, officers or products.

Guido Gump Parker blames a baseball bat death threat on his own mother, Penny "Skull Crusher" Parker:
>The "baseball bat" remark was made by my mom in response to a gymnastics
>groupie who harassed half of the national team, with help from several chat
>hosts and gymnastics coaches and hackers.

speeding

unread,

Jan 10, 2007, 7:20:27 PM1/10/07

to

Johannes Seppi <jse...@gmx.kaspam.at> wrote in
news:un6aq2thpo6p4a9o8...@4ax.com:

Actually, yes, this is also true. He more or less can be said to be
claiming ownership by requesting them removed fromthe Google archives,
unless he was claiming to Google that the posts were falsly posted using
forged headers. But, yeah, I doubt that also. Still, considering it's
been almost 6 years and considering that Ray ducks the topic
completely... and more importantly... considering that few things that
are given as word do have evidence to support it... it's still something
that one could say is dubious.

Yes, I agree, there's not a lot of doubt that Ray made those posts. But
perhaps there is doubt that he did not make all of them. Or perhaps there
is doubt about some of the other posts that are claimed for him.

But all in all, given Ray's history... it's dubious... but likely true.

Main Entry: du·bi·ous
Pronunciation: 'dü-bE-&s also dyü-
Function: adjective
Etymology: Latin dubius, from dubare to vacillate; akin to Latin duo two
-- more at TWO
1 : giving rise to uncertainty: as a : of doubtful promise or outcome <a
dubious plan> b : questionable or suspect as to true nature or quality
<the practice is of dubious legality>

speeding

unread,

Jan 10, 2007, 7:23:43 PM1/10/07

to

dracozna <ne...@dracozna.nl> wrote in
news:45a5248a$0$339$e4fe...@news.xs4all.nl:

Agreed. So, is Penny home? Is there anyone there with him? And if there
is... what if they are just as messed up as he is?

>> Add two more questions then...
>>
>> Would Ray's mom be around and able to tell him that he needs his
>> meds?
>
> Don't know. I don't know his mom and/or what she does.

Exactly. I don't know either. So, I can't/won't accept something as true
if there is no evidence to support it.

>> Would Ray believe a bunch of Ray-hating Usenet fans when they tell
>> him that he needs to take his meds? Would you if you were him?
>
> No matter who it is that has something to say about my style, what I
> do or what I say, I would take it into consideration.

Yes, you might. But, what if you were suffering from a bi-polar
condition? What if you were having paranoid delusions? Then would you?

speeding

unread,

Jan 10, 2007, 7:25:48 PM1/10/07

to

Thom E. Geiger <ThomE...@Gmail.com> wrote in
news:ivraq2tdq7uimcttm...@4ax.com:

> On Wed, 10 Jan 2007 10:06:51 GMT, speeding <no...@biz.org> wrote:
>
> I seem to be one of the few people who doesn't accept his on-again,
> off- again bipolar affliction claims. Either he has it or he doesn't.
> I have always stated my belief he picked a condition with symptoms
> that allow him the most freedom to be as idiotic and threatening as he
> wants, and people blindly accept the excuse he's BPD.
> I say he's a stupid asshole and he's dangerous. IMHO, if there's a
> condition he is "suffering" from (and it wouldn't be him suffering
> from it, but his victims), it'd be his being a narcissistic,
> sociopathic psychopath, a female-hating homosexual with paedophilic
> tendencies. I believe he's manifested every one of those traits
> through his ten years of usenet postings, more so than any BPD
> affliction.

I don't accept or deny it. I have no evidence for it. All I have are his
words, in a legal filing, to give evidence of its truth. Dio I accept his
word in a legal document as truth? Not really, but it is stronger than
any evidence presented against it.

Thom E. Geiger

unread,

Jan 10, 2007, 8:26:35 PM1/10/07

to

On Thu, 11 Jan 2007 00:25:48 GMT, speeding <no...@biz.org> wrote:

>I don't accept or deny it. I have no evidence for it. All I have are his
>words, in a legal filing, to give evidence of its truth. Dio I accept his
>word in a legal document as truth? Not really, but it is stronger than
>any evidence presented against it.

There is no credibility to anything he puts on paper, especially in a
court document, as he has been proven to have lied on numerous
occasions under penalty of perjury to both the district and appeals
courts.
He first claimed I was the author of the RayFAQ, and that he could
prove it by a subpoena of Comcast Cable. When I gave the court proof
Comcast has never had a service presence in my city (a letter from the
mayor to the court), where I have been a customer of the only cable
company here for sixteen years, he changed his argument to I was
hiding the identity of the real author. He claims I can control a web
site because my domain name DNS settings let other people use the
name; i.e., he's lying about that.
When I informed the court he admitted having the ISP and IP number of
the real author back in 2002, with a message where he swore he was
going to subpoena the poster's identity from the ISP- who happened to
be...guess who?....Comcast Cable, he whined it wasn't fair to let me
use postings that far back in time in my defense and/or to prove he's
lying.

>]Lines: 25
>]X-Admin: n...@aol.com
>]From: amoderncave...@aol.com (A Modern Caveman)
>]Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
>]Date: 06 Jun 2002 06:40:25 GMT
>]References: <FqyL8.19491$Am4.8169...@twister.columbus.rr.com>
>]Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
>]Subject: Re: Ray admits to BARRATRY
>]Message-ID: <20020606024025.16313.00000...@mb-ma.aol.com>
>]
>]>> Since COMCAST is the posting host here, subpeonaing the identity
>]>> of the poster is child's play. Just a hop, skip, and a jump from
>]>> where I live, with no jurisdictional problems whatsoever.
>]>
>]> Too bad you need a search warrant for that. For the warrant, you
>]> need the cops and the DA to get one from court. While you have
>]> been waiting several years for that, they most likely have been
>]> eating doughnuts and laughing at you.
>]
>] Wrong again. You can subpoena someone's identity in a civil case.
>]
>] I have a pile of blank subpoenas already signed by the clerk of
>] the Federal court. I could do it as part of this action (since
>] people are claiming to be in touch with opposing counsel) or as
>] part of a seperate libel action.
>]
>] The nature of the post is such that it's doubtful that any court
>] would protect the identity of the poster.
>]
>] I also don't have to travel very far to subpoena Comcast at all.
>]
>] It'll be interesting to see who this is, and it won't be too long
>] before I do.

Once the court saw this proof, that he had evidence exonerating me of
his false claims and allegations, he now claims he couldn't have
subpoenaed the identity because of evidentiary spoilage.
So, not only did he have evidence proving I wasn't the author,
evidence with the leads he could have used to get the identity of the
real author (this is called "due diligence", an absolute requirement
under federal law), he lied about having it, then complained that it
was too old for him to use.

Between his lies about domain names and his lies about having this
evidence, to two federal courts through three kooksoots and one appeal
and all under so-called penalty of perjury, no- not a single thing he
puts into a court document can be believed. So how can anything he
puts into a usenet message be believed? He's a liar, plain and simple.
That's the proof he's lied at LEAST twice in federal court papers.
He's lied on paper at least two more different times in the course of
these kooksoots, so where is the proof he's ever told the truth about
a claim in the same soots?

Like I said, a LYING narcissistic, sociopathic psychopath, a
female-hating homosexual with paedophilic tendencies. It's all there
in the archives for anyone willing to do their own homework.

Johannes Seppi

unread,

Jan 11, 2007, 1:05:40 AM1/11/07

to

No, one couldn't, at least if one really considers the sources.
Remember, I was here, and so were severals of the people who are still
posting here. Ray has admitted posting them then. So what is the
reasonable doubt?
Also, why are there "few things as evidence"? Do you claim people here
are deliberately lying when they say they remember the days and the
posts made? Yes, it was some time ago, but the events at that time
were strong enough to engrave themselves in the memory. Also, if you
google posts from that time you can find it all int the replies to
Ray's posts, even if the originals are gone.

>Yes, I agree, there's not a lot of doubt that Ray made those posts. But
>perhaps there is doubt that he did not make all of them. Or perhaps there
>is doubt about some of the other posts that are claimed for him.
>

I don't really get what you are trying to do here. You are now
spinning aroung your argument and extending it to somehow making true.
Your original argument "The origin of his 9/11 posts are dubious" is
simply wrong, why don't you just accept that?

Johannes

Alex

unread,

Jan 11, 2007, 8:06:38 AM1/11/07

to

in article aakbq2h0p92uf32ak...@4ax.com, Johannes Seppi at
jse...@gmx.kaspam.at wrote on 1/11/07 1:05 AM:

>> Yes, I agree, there's not a lot of doubt that Ray made those posts. But
>> perhaps there is doubt that he did not make all of them. Or perhaps there
>> is doubt about some of the other posts that are claimed for him.
>>
>
> I don't really get what you are trying to do here. You are now
> spinning aroung your argument and extending it to somehow making true.
> Your original argument "The origin of his 9/11 posts are dubious" is
> simply wrong, why don't you just accept that?

Speeding is an idiot who HAS to interject himself into EVERY thread with a
long-winded, wordy post, no matter how little he knows about the subject.
It's a compulsion.

He's been told he's wrong by several people on several different occasions
regarding several different topics and it makes NO difference. He simply
ignores facts that don't fit his pre-conceived notion of "how things are."

He's as thick-headed as Gordon but without a diagnosed mental illness to
fall back on.

I've killfiled his sorry ass and only get to see his gems of idiocy when
someone else responds.

dracozna

unread,

Jan 11, 2007, 9:28:16 AM1/11/07

to

If I was bi-polar and had paranoid delusions I would not have an
Internet connection. Therefore I would not post and people wouldn't know
I existed.

speeding

unread,

Jan 11, 2007, 9:52:17 AM1/11/07

to

dracozna <ne...@dracozna.nl> wrote in
news:45a6497c$0$331$e4fe...@news.xs4all.nl:

> speeding wrote:
>> Yes, you might. But, what if you were suffering from a bi-polar
>> condition? What if you were having paranoid delusions? Then would
>> you?
>>
> If I was bi-polar and had paranoid delusions I would not have an
> Internet connection. Therefore I would not post and people wouldn't
> know I existed.

Why not? It's not like it's real expensive to get hooked up, is it? It
could cost less for a connection than the cost of going to the movies once
a month.

speeding

unread,

Jan 11, 2007, 10:09:06 AM1/11/07

to

Thom E. Geiger <ThomE...@Gmail.com> wrote in

news:sf2bq2134l4edk2ef...@4ax.com:

> On Thu, 11 Jan 2007 00:25:48 GMT, speeding <no...@biz.org> wrote:
>
>>I don't accept or deny it. I have no evidence for it. All I have are
>>his words, in a legal filing, to give evidence of its truth. Dio I
>>accept his word in a legal document as truth? Not really, but it is
>>stronger than any evidence presented against it.
>
> There is no credibility to anything he puts on paper, especially in a
> court document, as he has been proven to have lied on numerous
> occasions under penalty of perjury to both the district and appeals
> courts.

This true. Then again, I can't say it's not true for quite a few posters
here. But, here's the problem with someone that's so prolific a liar...
and so quick to liar about a lie... it's hard to know when they are
telling the truth... because they reach a point where even the truth
sounds suspcious. That's why I don't accept or refute it... not until I
have evidence.

> He first claimed I was the author of the RayFAQ, and that he could
> prove it by a subpoena of Comcast Cable. When I gave the court proof
> Comcast has never had a service presence in my city (a letter from the
> mayor to the court), where I have been a customer of the only cable
> company here for sixteen years, he changed his argument to I was
> hiding the identity of the real author. He claims I can control a web
> site because my domain name DNS settings let other people use the
> name; i.e., he's lying about that.

Would you expect something that made more sense? As for the deal about
the DNS settings... I don't know, because I'm not sure how he'd be able
to present evidence that you held an open domain. And even if you did,
then he'd have to prove you were intentionally doing so to harm him...
sort of like proving that having a file sharing server makes the owner
liable for data shared on it.

Except Ray doesn't have... I doubt anyways... as big a legal team and
political clout as the RIAA music police.

> When I informed the court he admitted having the ISP and IP number of
> the real author back in 2002, with a message where he swore he was
> going to subpoena the poster's identity from the ISP- who happened to
> be...guess who?....Comcast Cable, he whined it wasn't fair to let me
> use postings that far back in time in my defense and/or to prove he's
> lying.

He can whine all he wants. It's the judge that makes the call. And I'd be
willing to guess it was... Motion denied.

Again, what matters is what the judge decided.

> So, not only did he have evidence proving I wasn't the author,
> evidence with the leads he could have used to get the identity of the
> real author (this is called "due diligence", an absolute requirement
> under federal law), he lied about having it, then complained that it
> was too old for him to use.

Actually, based on this alone, I don't see where he has any evidence at
all. Now if there's more to this, then perhaps he does. But this alone
isn't evidence. As I keep trying to tell Gordon, as well as his
followers... evidence gets presented in court. If you've got it, use if.
But blathering on about "I'm gonna do it. Really. I am. Honest. I will."
is bullshit. Getting the evidence into a trial... that's gold. Til then,
it's all just a load of crap.

> Between his lies about domain names and his lies about having this
> evidence, to two federal courts through three kooksoots and one appeal
> and all under so-called penalty of perjury, no- not a single thing he
> puts into a court document can be believed. So how can anything he
> puts into a usenet message be believed? He's a liar, plain and simple.
> That's the proof he's lied at LEAST twice in federal court papers.
> He's lied on paper at least two more different times in the course of
> these kooksoots, so where is the proof he's ever told the truth about
> a claim in the same soots?

Can you prove they are lies? You have court papers filed and evidence
from the rulings saying that Ray lied in a Federally sworn statement? You
are SAYING they are lies. But, I ask, just as I ask him... what did the
judge say? Show me the judge ruled that Ray lied... and he did. Until
then it's just an accusation. He said - she said.

Or, to answer your question with a question... where is the proof he lied

about a claim in the same soots?

> Like I said, a LYING narcissistic, sociopathic psychopath, a
> female-hating homosexual with paedophilic tendencies. It's all there
> in the archives for anyone willing to do their own homework.

I understadn that's your opinion. You're welcome to it. I'm not taing
issue with it, so please don't get me wrong. I'm simply saying that he
says <claim>. You say <claim>. But when it comes down to the brass
tacks... neither of you has won anything or proven anything in court.
It's a lot of talk and no action. Well... technically, Ray's taken
action, but he can't get in the door with his claims.

dracozna

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Jan 11, 2007, 10:28:36 AM1/11/07

to

speeding wrote:
> dracozna <ne...@dracozna.nl> wrote in
> news:45a6497c$0$331$e4fe...@news.xs4all.nl:
>
>> speeding wrote:
>>> Yes, you might. But, what if you were suffering from a bi-polar
>>> condition? What if you were having paranoid delusions? Then would
>>> you?
>>>
>> If I was bi-polar and had paranoid delusions I would not have an
>> Internet connection. Therefore I would not post and people wouldn't
>> know I existed.
>
> Why not? It's not like it's real expensive to get hooked up, is it? It
> could cost less for a connection than the cost of going to the movies once
> a month.
>
>
>

Let's see:
I know how networks work, how to scan them and a few tricks to break
into them.
I know that every connection is being logged at my ISP.
I know what hackers can do to get my personal information.
I know about the backdoors in Windows XP.
I know that if the US decided today I'm a criminal, my government would
put me on an airplane to the states tomorrow.

being paranoid and knowing all that wouldn't allow me to get an Internet
connection. Actually knowing all this it's a miracle I'm not paranoid
already.

chocola...@aol.com

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Jan 11, 2007, 7:11:31 PM1/11/07

to

chocola...@aol.com

unread,

Jan 11, 2007, 7:11:37 PM1/11/07

to

chocola...@aol.com

unread,

Jan 11, 2007, 7:21:01 PM1/11/07

to

That's exactly where I stand Speeding. You can never really know the
truth in any given situation, but they haven't got anything concrete to
put on him either - although I am sure that they would like to find
something concrete to put on him...

Peanut

chocola...@aol.com

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Jan 11, 2007, 7:21:10 PM1/11/07

to

That's exactly where I stand Speeding. You can never really know the

chocola...@aol.com

unread,

Jan 11, 2007, 7:38:51 PM1/11/07

to

Krus T. Olfard wrote:
> Actually I've only been acting like an asshole in a.s.f. for about 4
> years or so - didn't come here before that

Hehe..ok..I think I may have mixed you up with someone similar on
Alt.romance...sorry..

- I missed first hand
> experience with gordon loser's 9/11 bullshit.

I remember that...at the time I did wonder what prompted it...if that
happened to one of the patients in our clinic we would Section him, but
I didn't make a snap decision without knowing all the facts and I never
found out so I still can't...

Peanut

chocola...@aol.com

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Jan 11, 2007, 7:42:04 PM1/11/07

to

speeding wrote:
> chocola...@aol.com wrote in

> > Can you imagine if they hospitalised everyone with bipolar! I know

> > that in England that would never happen, we don't have enough beds for
> > serioulsy ill people as it is. I think the same thing is happening
> > over in the states to - they are cutting beds for the mentally ill -
> > where do you think they go to?? Usenet of course....
>
> Really... I thought most of them ended up in politics. :P

You have been paying attention haven't you? :)

Peanut

chocola...@aol.com

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Jan 11, 2007, 7:50:23 PM1/11/07

to

Alex wrote:
> in article 1168210340.5...@q40g2000cwq.googlegroups.com,
> chocola...@aol.com at chocola...@aol.com wrote on 1/7/07 5:52 PM:
>
> > It's a misconception that mentally ill people who commit
> > crimes do so because they are mentally ill - a lot of them commit
> > crimes because they are basically evil and get off on it
>
> That's an interesting philosophy. How do you propose to prove this?

Don't you read true crime??

Peanut

Thom E. Geiger

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Jan 11, 2007, 8:05:50 PM1/11/07

to

On Thu, 11 Jan 2007 15:09:06 GMT, speeding <no...@biz.org> wrote:

>
>Actually, based on this alone, I don't see where he has any evidence at
>all. Now if there's more to this, then perhaps he does. But this alone
>isn't evidence. As I keep trying to tell Gordon, as well as his
>followers... evidence gets presented in court. If you've got it, use if.
>But blathering on about "I'm gonna do it. Really. I am. Honest. I will."
>is bullshit. Getting the evidence into a trial... that's gold. Til then,
>it's all just a load of crap.
>

This is how the system works with vexatious lawsuits (there is such an
animal, you know that, you do know that right?); the vexatious
litigant can claim anything under the sun in a legal complaint, packed
wih lies and not a shred of truth. With the plodding speed of a doped
up slug, the court grinds through piles of superfluous motions and
rambling legal briefs (in Parker's cases, 75 and 80 pages), until the
judge decides to render a decision- eventually. Until then, if one
follows the logic that nothing in the world is what it appears to be
or is said to be unless a judge declare it is, then evidence and proof
don't amount to shit until a decision is handed down.
So I'll ask you, is it just Parker's bullshit you swallow without
question, or is it any legal complaint from anyone in general? By
swalowing without question, I'm referring to your own contention that
there is no proof to be read or seen, no truth present for the
reasonable man to see and interpret for himself, to render a decision
on without a judge having to let im know what he reads and comprehends
is a fact or not? So you don't question anything in life based on
evident fact?
Which is it in your case? Are you honestly saying you can't read a
legal complaint, with evidence included, and form an opinion of the
facts independent of a judge's decision? That's what it sounds like
you're saying. In that case, I'll stop posting to you because your
reality is based on legal decision and not on a rational evaluation
and decision making process. Argumentative debate or even theoretical
proposition is useless.

>>>]Lines: 25
>>>]X-Admin: n...@aol.com
>>>]From: amoderncave...@aol.com (A Modern Caveman)
>>>]Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
>>>]Date: 06 Jun 2002 06:40:25 GMT
>>>]References: <FqyL8.19491$Am4.8169...@twister.columbus.rr.com>
>>>]Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
>>>]Subject: Re: Ray admits to BARRATRY
>>>]Message-ID: <20020606024025.16313.00000...@mb-ma.aol.com>

The above headers are Parker's ID= fact. Do you need an archive link
to it posted for you?

>>>]
>>>]>> Since COMCAST is the posting host here, subpeonaing the identity
>>>]>> of the poster is child's play. Just a hop, skip, and a jump from
>>>]>> where I live, with no jurisdictional problems whatsoever.

He has now claimed the author is with Comcast and he can subpoena the
identity with no trouble = fact.

>>>]> Too bad you need a search warrant for that. For the warrant, you
>>>]> need the cops and the DA to get one from court. While you have
>>>]> been waiting several years for that, they most likely have been
>>>]> eating doughnuts and laughing at you.
>>>]
>>>] Wrong again. You can subpoena someone's identity in a civil case.
>>>]
>>>] I have a pile of blank subpoenas already signed by the clerk of
>>>] the Federal court. I could do it as part of this action (since
>>>] people are claiming to be in touch with opposing counsel) or as
>>>] part of a seperate libel action.
>>>]
>>>] The nature of the post is such that it's doubtful that any court
>>>] would protect the identity of the poster.
>>>]
>>>] I also don't have to travel very far to subpoena Comcast at all.

Again, Parker claims to be able to subpoena Comcast for the real
identity= fact.

>>>] It'll be interesting to see who this is, and it won't be too long
>>>] before I do.

A stated intent to get the real identity by subpoena = fact.

>Again, what matters is what the judge decided.

The case isn't over yet, but not every judge on every court is correct
in his/her decisions. Parker makes that claim all the time.

>> Between his lies about domain names and his lies about having this
>> evidence, to two federal courts through three kooksoots and one appeal
>> and all under so-called penalty of perjury, no- not a single thing he
>> puts into a court document can be believed. So how can anything he
>> puts into a usenet message be believed? He's a liar, plain and simple.
>> That's the proof he's lied at LEAST twice in federal court papers.
>> He's lied on paper at least two more different times in the course of
>> these kooksoots, so where is the proof he's ever told the truth about
>> a claim in the same soots?
>
>Can you prove they are lies? You have court papers filed and evidence
>from the rulings saying that Ray lied in a Federally sworn statement? You
>are SAYING they are lies. But, I ask, just as I ask him... what did the
>judge say? Show me the judge ruled that Ray lied... and he did. Until
>then it's just an accusation. He said - she said.

Back to the question I put to you initially. Do you reserve an opinion
on everything in life unless a judge affirms it; dating, parenthood,
civil rights, employment, living arranngements, religion, yada yada,
or are you capable of rational thought and deductive reasoning,
independent of a legal ruling?

>Or, to answer your question with a question... where is the proof he lied
>about a claim in the same soots?

The messages are in the archives and this is just one. Yes, I have
filed this as evidence and no, if you had been reading the large
amounts of messages in the NG about why people dislike Parker, a
question I believe you have raised and argued several times with many
people, you'd know the appeal has not been adjudicated yet.

>
>I understadn that's your opinion. You're welcome to it. I'm not taing
>issue with it, so please don't get me wrong. I'm simply saying that he
>says <claim>. You say <claim>. But when it comes down to the brass
>tacks... neither of you has won anything or proven anything in court.
>It's a lot of talk and no action. Well... technically, Ray's taken
>action, but he can't get in the door with his claims.

Being a defendant doesn't make anyone wrong...I believe you know that,
or you'd be using your real name in the internet. You know as well as
anyone here you could also be on the receiving end of a litigious
psychopathic internet stalker's fantasy rantings in the blink of an
eye.
Again and again, the proof is there and from Parker himself. That's
how it got into the archives. You know how that works, right?
Rational adults with a fair amount of intellect can reason and deduce
logically without waiting for a legal opinion. The evidence is there,
unless you contend Parker's archived messages are not proof and no
matter what is out there, none of it matters unless ruled on by a
judge.

Alex

unread,

Jan 11, 2007, 10:06:05 PM1/11/07

to

in article 1168563022.8...@i15g2000cwa.googlegroups.com,
chocola...@aol.com at chocola...@aol.com wrote on 1/11/07 7:50 PM:

What did your world famous researcher boss have to say about the scientific
validity of anecdotal evidence?

Benny

unread,

Jan 12, 2007, 1:45:28 AM1/12/07

to

Ray Gordon, creator of the "pivot" schrieb:
>>> Wow, another anonymous internet hater who uses my methods presented to him
>>> by others.
>>>
>>> Poor little dweeb.
>> Hey...I think it would be inspirational if you can battle back from your
>> sickness and turn your life around... *shrug*
>
> If he wants to know why all he can get is slut trash, quality women don't
> find men like him very desirable. He's cowardly, innacurate, a wannabe
> bully, and weak.
>
> He does what he does because he'd never have the courage to attach his name
> to words like that. Women don't like cowards like him.
>
> If you want to be a coward like him, check out the "seduction gurus" he
> claims taught him to be the way he is.

OMG, you really need help. You have my pity.

Btw: http://www.klick-game.de/seite-5124.html

Lori Koonce

unread,

Jan 12, 2007, 1:52:39 PM1/12/07

to

Peanut

I've read everything Anne Rule and John Douglass have put out there..
Read In Cold Blood over 14 times.

And, have acutally read accounts of people who have met Modern Day
Murders like Lenoard Lake and people like them.

Very few criminals are mentally ill. Those who are are the most
hidiously socopathic people on the planet. I don't think that's the
type we are looking at when we are talking about when we talk about
Gordon Roy Parker.

I believe with others who have stated that Gordo is probablly pulling
out his mental disorder only when it looks like it would save his ass
in either a court of law, or the court of public opinion.

Ray has been given ample non legal ways to prove he's not the person
his words would have us believe. And every one of those challenges has
either been run from, or Ray has put so many restrictions on it that
it's become a moot point. I've even challenged him to an easy search
for my identy using public records available to him on the internet.
BUt I'm still waiting for him to get it...

As far as ray goes I don't see how you can defend him. I don't care why
he choose to call each and every life lost in 9/11 worthless trash, but
he did. ANd I believe that he should be made to face those words every
day, and as much as we can

You never did address one of my most important questions on this
matter. Some of Rays advice is dangerous if acted upon. If Ray cannot
be held responsible for his actions because of mental illness, what do
we do? I for one choose to call him on shit, not because I think it's
going to change him one iota. I do it so the clueless newbie in the
group get the picture and steer clear of him and anything he's got to
say. Just because I learned the hard way dosen't mean they have to.
CHoice is there.

Have you acutally taken a look at some of the writings of Ray's that
others have posted? Mentally Ill or not, he cannot be defended by
anyone sane. Please take a look at them before you go much further. It
would go a long way to keeping you from looking foolish.

Lori

chocola...@aol.com

unread,

Jan 12, 2007, 2:39:33 PM1/12/07

to

Lori...I said at the beginning of my posts that I do not condone his
bad behaviour..that I know that all mentally ill people are not
criminals, that all criminals are not mentally ill, that I have read
the things people have said about Ray...but, all that still does not
prove that Ray is guilty of much..other than defending himself a lot of
the time. When you have some concrete proof of what he has done to
people on this group...and not just some lame email, mysterious night
visits from the mob or group rantings then let me know...

Peanut

Lori Koonce

unread,

Jan 12, 2007, 2:55:49 PM1/12/07

to

Peanut

Those rose colored glasses must be a nice addtion to a really inmature
ability NOT to know truth...

All you have to do is search the GOOGLE archives, and read what Ray has
said and done... He dosen't confine his behaviour to an online
presence, and I've talked to people off the reccord whom Ray has
attempted to destroy.

I've done this, and even told you about dispicable things he's said
about me. But, yet you still want to believe what you do.

What will it take for you to believe what the rest of us all ready
know. If it were just me, or me and one other I can see why you may
feel the way you do. BUt, it's not just online, and it's not just me.
Why don't you ask the people whose are at alt.hyponosis who have dealt
with Ray how he is there.

Or Maybe I can get Jtt to post the links to the disgusting things He's
said about underaged gyminastists. Or maybe I can find the quote he
gave a greiving father about how ...."his daughter died because he
didn't want you for a father"... The list goes on and on....

And it's like I said before, another thing you care to ignore, I'm
going to keep Ray's feet to the fire because newbies need to know what
they are dealing with. If Ray's advice was harmless twattle from a
weirdo, then I would shut up in a minute. But, it's dangerous for a guy
to do stuff Ray suggests. And seeing as how HE will never say so, I
think it's my responsibility to do it for him.

You have yet to answer my question. If it's dangerous advice that Ray
gives out, and he'll never admit it.... Just whose job is it to see
that the newbie, a generally befuddled and totally confused guy, gets
the clue.

Lori

chocola...@aol.com

unread,

Jan 12, 2007, 3:05:08 PM1/12/07

to

You just don't get it do you? I'm the one asking for evidence..

Peanut

chocola...@aol.com

unread,

Jan 12, 2007, 3:30:30 PM1/12/07

to

Lori Koonce wrote:
> Those rose colored glasses must be a nice addtion to a really inmature
> ability NOT to know truth...

But you see I do know the truth..I know that Ray says dreadful things
on newsgroups because I have read them myself over the years..although
I'm not convinced that 9/11 was him...the email that is, not the
day...although you still have time to pin that on him I suppose..

> All you have to do is search the GOOGLE archives, and read what Ray has
> said and done...

I already know Lori...maybe it's because I work where I do and am
unshockable now, I don't know, but people do far worse things than say
nasty things on usenet...

We had a newspaper debate the other day about whether Saddam was hanged
in a dignified way and our prime minister was rebuked for not speaking
out about it for nearly a week....but, I am the only one to feel that
it's not possible to have a dignified hanging! Can you imagine
it...Good morning Sir, is this your first time here? We shouldn't be
too long, sorry to keep you waiting, but the hangman is just tied up
with someone else at the moment, he shouldn't be too long. Would you
like to just come over to the rope and we'll have you done in a jiffy
(bag)....and that was done by goverment officials...so Ray has said a
few things on usenet has he?

He dosen't confine his behaviour to an online
> presence, and I've talked to people off the reccord whom Ray has
> attempted to destroy.

But you all set out to destroy him don't you?

> I've done this, and even told you about dispicable things he's said
> about me. But, yet you still want to believe what you do.

Of course I believe it..he did it to me too...why do you get so upset?

> What will it take for you to believe what the rest of us all ready
> know. If it were just me, or me and one other I can see why you may
> feel the way you do. BUt, it's not just online, and it's not just me.
> Why don't you ask the people whose are at alt.hyponosis who have dealt
> with Ray how he is there.

You need to get out more..

> Or Maybe I can get Jtt to post the links to the disgusting things He's
> said about underaged gyminastists.

Why do you keep telling me things I already know...I'm not defending
his actions. I have already said that. What I do not agree with his
the relentless way you pursue him..like a pack of wild dogs..

Or maybe I can find the quote he
> gave a greiving father about how ...."his daughter died because he
> didn't want you for a father"... The list goes on and on....

He may be guilt of speaking his mind, but it is his mind, and up to now
there are no rules on usenet to stop it.

> And it's like I said before, another thing you care to ignore, I'm
> going to keep Ray's feet to the fire because newbies need to know what
> they are dealing with. If Ray's advice was harmless twattle from a
> weirdo, then I would shut up in a minute. But, it's dangerous for a guy
> to do stuff Ray suggests. And seeing as how HE will never say so, I
> think it's my responsibility to do it for him.

Usenet is for everyone..even Ray..if Ray wants to say something he has
as much right as you and I to say it..

> You have yet to answer my question. If it's dangerous advice that Ray
> gives out, and he'll never admit it.... Just whose job is it to see
> that the newbie, a generally befuddled and totally confused guy, gets
> the clue.

See above..

Peanut

Message has been deleted

chocola...@aol.com

unread,

Jan 12, 2007, 5:22:12 PM1/12/07

to

Paul wrote:

> You remind me of the groupies who defend (and/or marry) incarcerated
> felons.

Oh dear...not my intention at all...

Just let me recap:

1) Dr Jack Ryan did not exist.
2) Mrs Ryan did not exist.
3) Vince Runza did not exist (what's the betting he shows up now? :))
4) Ray must enjoy all the attention he gets or he wouldn't keep
answering all your posts (drama queen).
5) I believe in free speech, and when they tell me to stop giving my
opinion on what I read or see that will be a sad day for everyone,
because your game will be up to. Sorry Odious but you can't have it
both ways.
6) I've loved every minute of it...the days of Jack and Vince were
really great, but it wasn't real!

How do you know that I am not Ray? You don't do you?

Just one more thing...I'm not a groupie Paul..:)

Peanut

Krus T. Olfard

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Jan 12, 2007, 6:48:04 PM1/12/07

to

chocola...@aol.com wrote in news:1168633828.777237.164640@
11g2000cwr.googlegroups.com:

>
> But you all set out to destroy him don't you?
>
>

Like everyone else (those very few) who have an agenda in defending gordy
loser you attribute either hate or destruction or both as the motives for
what people say to and about the gordy loser.

I suppose you use those emotionally loaded words in an attempt to make
your own tenuous position seem the more firmly based on ethical grounds
but all they actually do is let everyone know that you do have your own
agenda in what you are doing.

You are simply a troll. Your words are expressed solely with the intent
of wishing to make others irritated so that they will respond to you. You
are like the gordy loser in that you will settle for any kind of
attention, positive or negative, as long as you get the attention and
apparently like the gordy loser you are unable to get positive attention
and so will settle for negative attention.

*Plonk*

--
Krustavus Teofilus Olfard

------------------
Everything I post is my opinion. If you don't like my opinions then
killfile me, if you have the balls.

BTW: If there is one clear rule in this world, it's "Do NOT stick your
finger in the ancient alien coffin."

Thom E. Geiger

unread,

Jan 12, 2007, 7:36:25 PM1/12/07

to

Usually I try to be open and patient with new nyms who claim they
aren't just another troll or one of Parker's gazillion aliases, but
this self denial beats the band for me every time. Personally, I think
you can kiss my ass and eat shit. Evidence has been posted, so you're
either one of the previously mentioned misfits or you're as dumb as a
bag of snail shit.
So Parker spends most of his time defending himself, hunh? Let me see,
there was the death threat to the mother of a seven year old girl,
there were the hundreds- and I do mean hundreds - of messages to
preteen and young teen girls, their parents and coaches in the
gymnastics group, the 911 messages aimed at survivors of the attacks
and the public in general (which messages btw, yo' boy tried to get
removed from the archives), then there's the messages he posted (and
still does) in support groups to the families of suicides, cancer
victims, and generally anybody in a half dozen support groups looking
for help.

So, here's Parker, yo' boy, getting a little heat from all he's spewed
and still barfs around on usenet, and you think he's a poor,
defenseless victim who spends most of his time defending himself.
You've been made, dude. Get a clue or buy one, 'cause you're only
embarrassing yourself by ignoring what Parker spends 90% of his really
doing.

In case you're really, honestly and truly too damned lazy or ignorant
to do your homework before you start spewing pity for Parker, here's a
little help. There's a lot more out there. Do you need more??
Here's troll test for you...can you count how many times Parker is
looking for people's real world contact information, even offering
money for it? You do know how to count, right?

>Subject: Dominique Moceanu Is A CRIMINAL #121 Of infinity
>Subject: Dominqiue Moceanu Is A CRIMINAL #124 Of Infinity
>Subject: Dominique Moceanu Is A CRIMINAL #125 Of Infinity
>Subject: Dominique Moceanu Is A CRIMINAL #130 Of Infinity
>Subject: Dominique Moceanu Is A CRIMINAL #133 Of Infinity
>Subject: Amanda Borden Is A Homsexual #1 Of Infinity
>Subject: Amanda Borden Is NOT A Homsexual #1 Of Infinity
>Subject: Amanda Borden Is A Bisexual #6 Of Infinity
>Subject: Amanda Borden Is A Bisexual #11 Of Infinity
>Subject: Amanda Borden Is A Bisexual #12 Of Infinity
>Subject: Amanda Borden Is A Bisexual #13 Of Infinity
>Subject: Amanda Borden Is A Bisexual #14 Of Infinity
>Subject: Amanda Borden Is A Bisexual #15 Of Infinity
>Subject: Amanda Borden Is A Bisexual #16 Of Infinity
>Subject: Amanda Borden Is A Bisexual #18 Of Infinity
>Subject: Amanda Borden Is A DYKE #15 Of Infinity
>Subject: Amanda Borden Is A DYKE #16 Of Infinity
>Subject: Amanda Borden Is A DYKE #17 Of Infinity
>Subject: Brian RAPED Dominique?
>Subject: Amanda Borden Is A DYKE #18 Of Infinity

>Subject: Amanda Borden Is A DYKE #20 of Infinity
>This post will not be removed, EVER.
>It is Amanda's reward for her fans' ongoing harassment of me. She's
>lesbian; it's the truth. She threatened to KILL a reporter over it.
>This is not a very nice little dyke, now is it? Nope.
>To those gloating over my website, don't sweat it, it will be up shortly.
> The rewards for the harassment against our web provider will be dished
>out soon enough.

>Subject: Kristy Powell: Gymnastics BUM

>Subject: Amanda Borden Is A DYKE #21 Of Infinity
>The credit for this one (and the ones which will follow this one every
>day) goes to Odi...@home.com.
>In case Patty asks. Here is the post that triggered it:
>Subject: Kim Zmeskal Is A DRUG ADDICT #2 Of Infinity
>You want me off your backs? Clean up the mess you created, and I'll be
>out of your way........these lies are YOURS.

>Subject: Amanda Borden Is A DYKE #23 Of Infinity
>Subject: Kim Zmeskal Is A DRUG ADDICT #4 Of Infinity

>Subject: Amanda Borden Is A DYKE #24 Of infinity
>Her mom's an office whore, btw, and even admitted that she would not have
>her job if she were male.
>I hate cowardly WHORES who work for child abusers like Dimitry and Bela
>and try to harm people like Dominique.
>You should be ashamed of yourself, Kris.......God hates people like you.
>This post series will NOT stop. Period. And Kris, your mom is garbage.
>Subject: Amanda Borden Is A DYKE #25 Of Infinity
>these posts had stopped but good old Rinky-Dinky had to start up
>again....sad.

>Subject: More Harassment From Amanda The DYKE
>This is typical of that piece of shit Amanda WHOREDEN.

>Subject: Gymcats Is An Abusive Gym
>Subject: Kaitie Dyson: Lying Little Piece Of Shit
>Subject: Gymcats = INCOMPETENT CHILD ABUSERS
>Subject: Kim Zmeskal Is A DRUG ADDICT #5 Of Infinity

>Subject: Michelle Campi Is A Child Abuser #1 Of Infinity
>This posting series will not stop either until what I'm getting from USAG
>and others associated with it stops.

>Subject: Amanda Borden Is A DYKE #26 Of Infinity

>Subject: Amanda Borden Is A DYKE #131 Of Infinity
>This post goes down when Steelking's identity is revealed to me.....

>Subject: Amanda Borden Is A DYKE #132 Of Infinity

>Subject: Amanda Borden Is A DYKE #133 Of Infinity
>This post is put here in protest of the "Elite Gymnastics Mafia" website.
> It will be reposted EVERY DAY until that website, put up as a tool for
>slandering me, is removed.
>It's pretty simple: want the posts to stop? Take the site down. Want
>them to continue? Leave the site up.

>Subject: Kim Zmeskal Is A DRUG ADDICT #9 Of Infinity
>This post is put here in protest of the "Elite Gymnastics Mafia" website.
> It will be reposted EVERY DAY until that website, put up as a tool for
>slandering me, is removed.
>It's pretty simple: want the posts to stop? Take the site down. Want
>them to continue? Leave the site up.

>Subject: Amanda Borden Is A DYKE #134 Of Infinity
>When the "Official Gymnastics Mafia" website is taken down, these posts
>will stop.

>Subject: Kim Zmeskal Is A DRUG ADDICT #10 Of Infinity
>She is another one who uses the "Official Gymnastics Mafia" to harass her
>critics and to to do things that would harm her image if known.

>Subject: WHEN Atler Falls On Bars At Worlds (She WILL!)
>I'm gonna LAUGH...

>Subject: Gymcats Abuses Kids And NO ONE CARES (Was: Re: question
> for the group)
>Subject: Gymcats Is An Abusive Gym #2 Of Infinity

>Subject: Amanda Borden Is A DYKE #138 Of Infinity
>The post below challenged me. This is what I think of Rinky's little
>challenge.

>Subject: Kim Zmeskal Is A DRUG Addict #12 Of Infinity

>Subject: Amanda Borden Is A DYKE #142 Of Infinity
>This post appears for three reason:
>1. Amanda IS a lesbian (or "dyke")
>2. When a reporter tried to out her, she had someone threaten the
>reporter's life, so I chose to pick up the story.
>3. Some BITCH named GSTDTammy in Gym chat got a little power-drunk with
>me and tried to censor me. Try it here, Tammy.
>This post will cease when Tammy makes a public apology to me on this
>newsgroup.

>Subject: Amanda Borden Is A DYKE #144 of Infinity

>Subject: Amanda Borden Is A DYKE #146 Of Infinity
>Hey Linda,
>Every time your friends bother me out here, expect to see a reminder of
>how your shit daughter knew about Dominique's abuses and did nothing.
>Subject: Dominique Moceanu And Vanessa Atler: Cyberthugs
>Seems our little gymnastics darlings can't stand being criticized, so
>when it happens, they put the word out to their fans to harass people, or
>they do nothing when their fans harass people on their behalf.

>Subject: Dominique Moceanu: Cyberthug (Was:Moceanu Link To USENET Established)
>Subject: Dominique The Financial IDIOT
>Subject: Dominique The BUM (Was Re: Dominique The Financial IDIOT)
>Subject: Dominique The PANHANDLER: Oh The Irony
>Subject: Dominique The COWARD (Again)
>Subject: Dominique Moceanu, Lying Sack Of Shit
>Subject: Dominique Moceanu Really Is A CRIMINAL #1 Of Infinity
>Subject: Dominique Moceanu Really Is A CRIMINAL #4 Of Infinity
>Subject: Dominique Moceanu Really Is A CRIMINAL #7 Of Infinity (Was: "Ray")
>Subject: Dominique Moceanu Recruits CHILDREN For Criminal Acts

>Subject: No Libel Suit, Dominique? You really must be RECRUITING CHILDREN
> FOR CRIMINAL ACTS

>Subject: Anyone With Information On "John Schnieder" Please E-mail Me

>Subject: REPOST: Michelle Isham: Stripper, Drug-Addict Mother Risks
> Daughter's Safety
>When people stop mentioning RayFAQ, I will stop mentioning THIS.
>Michelle can thank "Odious" for this posting:

>Subject: Dominique Moceanu Is A CRIMINAL #161 Of Infinity
>Subject: Amanda Borden Is A DYKE #166 of Infinity (was: "Ray Gordon" ot)
>Subject: Kim Zmeskal: Child Abuse Enabler (Was: An on topic post
> (at least, IMO)-- for once)
>Subject: Shannon Miller: Pathetic Ugly Little CUNT

>Subject: Dominique Moceanu's AOL Screen Name Is Dmoch
>I posted it LONG before anyone else did.
>She also requested that people stop bombarding her with e-mails.
>And that I stop posting her screen name.

>Subject: REPOST: Shannon Miller: Pathetic Ugly Little CUNT
>Subject: Amanda Borden: PHONY CHRISTIAN

>Subject: Amanda Borden: CUNT, DYKE, PHONY CHRISTIAN
>Deal with it, Amanda. You can't fool everyone. You think people aren't
>tired of your shit? Think again.
>Any fan of hers who thinks she's worth defending is sicker than her.
>Jesus don't like your kind, CUNT.......say, is that YOU in that picture
>of someone who looks JUST LIKE YOU kissing that girl? E-mail me for a
>copy of the photo and see for yourself.....
>What a fucking CUNT.

>Subject: American Gymnasts DESERVE To Lose
>Subject: American Gymnasts DESERVE To Lose #2 of Infinity
>Subject: American Gymnasts DESERVE To Lose #3 Of Infinity
>Subject: American Gymnasts DESERVE To Lose #4 Of Infinity
>Subject: American Gymnasts DESERVE To Lose #5 Of Infinity

>Subject: Good Riddance, Gymn Mafia BITCH (Was: Moceanu Withdraws From Trials)
>Dominique Moceanu is a waste of morality.

>Subject: Ray Retracts His Criticism Of Atler's Silence (was: Re: New
> Atler Diary Up)

>Subject: Deadline To Testify Against Fellow Gymn Mafia Members Is Approaching
>If you do it before the deadline, you WILL NOT be punished for ANYTHING.
> If you don't, you will be prosecuted to the FULLEST EXTENT OF THE LAW.
>Once the deadline passes, there will be NO TURNING BACK.

>Subject: Heather Dryer Is A STUPID Woman
>Subject: Amanda Borden: Piece Of GARBAGE
>Subject: If you have AMANDA STROUD'S Parents' Contact Info....
>Subject: AMANDA STROUD'S PARENTS IGNORE GYMN MAFIA
>Subject: Okay, I've Made My Point (Ray Leaves ASG)
>Subject: Karoyli HIT His Gymnasts In Romania?

>Subject: Message To Gymnasts From GOD*
>*sent through me

>Subject: Hey Gymnasts: YOU Are The Reason Your Fans Harass Me
>Subject: Dominique Moceanu: Relationship At FIFTEEN With A THIRTY-YEAR-OLD MAN
>Subject: Maybe Gymnasts DO Like Getting HIT??

>Subject: Reward For SubZer0's Identity
>Want to make some quick cash?
>I'm paying for the info...

>Subject: Message To Elites: GOD IS WATCHING
>This is to ANY hypocritical Elite gymnast who has questionable
> affiliations, or who knows about child abuse:
>DO NOT INJECT GOD INTO YOUR QUOTES.

>Subject: Atler: NO MEDALS, GOOD RIDDANCE LOSER
>Subject: Elite Gymnasts Allow Their Fans To Break Laws
>Subject: Hey STROUD, You SUCK (was: Re: USA 2001 Worlds Chances)

>From: The Revolution - view profile
>Date: Sat, Oct 7 2000 12:03 am
>Email: "The Revolution" <the____revolut...@hotmail.com>
>Groups: alt.seduction.fast
>Not yet ratedRating:
>hide options
>Reply | Reply to Author | Forward | Print | Individual Message | Show original | Report Abuse
>| Find messages by this author
>
>
>Some CUNT Writes:
>
>
> >-Shell
> >**Off to run the gauntlet!**
>
>
>Good luck to you.
>
>
>
><---And here is why:
>
>Danke Peach (and KR too!). :)
>Here's one more (unfortunately)...
>I am thankful I haven't yet called the lady at my doctor's office that told me my surgery
> was today when it's really tomorrow! *grrrr*
>
>
><-----May you DIE on the operating table.

unread,

Jan 12, 2007, 10:32:06 PM1/12/07

to

in article 1168640532....@s34g2000cwa.googlegroups.com,
chocola...@aol.com at chocola...@aol.com wrote on 1/12/07 5:22 PM:

> 5) I believe in free speech, and when they tell me to stop giving my
> opinion on what I read or see that will be a sad day for everyone,
> because your game will be up to. Sorry Odious but you can't have it
> both ways.

I don't recall anyone saying you CAN'T post your opinions here.

But those of us on the other end of them DON'T have to read them.

And if we do, we have the same right to call you a moron for having them.

chocola...@aol.com

unread,

Jan 13, 2007, 9:16:14 AM1/13/07

to

Alex wrote:
> I don't recall anyone saying you CAN'T post your opinions here.

Not me idiot..I'm referrring to Ray..

> But those of us on the other end of them DON'T have to read them.

I know that...

> And if we do, we have the same right to call you a moron for having them.

Yes...

Peanut

chocola...@aol.com

unread,

Jan 13, 2007, 9:19:09 AM1/13/07

to

Krus T. Olfard wrote:
> Like everyone else (those very few) who have an agenda in defending gordy
> loser you attribute either hate or destruction or both as the motives for
> what people say to and about the gordy loser.
>
> I suppose you use those emotionally loaded words in an attempt to make
> your own tenuous position seem the more firmly based on ethical grounds
> but all they actually do is let everyone know that you do have your own
> agenda in what you are doing.
>
> You are simply a troll. Your words are expressed solely with the intent
> of wishing to make others irritated so that they will respond to you. You
> are like the gordy loser in that you will settle for any kind of
> attention, positive or negative, as long as you get the attention and
> apparently like the gordy loser you are unable to get positive attention
> and so will settle for negative attention.
>
> *Plonk*

Were you born being able to miss the point or did you work at at?

Plonking takes away my right to speak...blimey even Alex picked up on
that...

Peanut
Not a troll...

chocola...@aol.com

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Jan 13, 2007, 9:47:33 AM1/13/07

to

All this tells me is that he probably has other mental illnesses apart
from bipolar disorder. He shows signs of Cluster A.. paranoid
personality disorder, schizoid personality disorder and schizotypal
personality disorder, ie eccentricity and blunted emotional responses.
Cluster A people rarely ask for treatment and in times of crisis
develop psychotic illnesses. He could also have some illnesses from
cluster B...such as antisocial personality disorder, borderline
personality disorder, histrionic personality disorder (characterised by
inappropriate seductive or provocative behaviour), narcissistic
personality disorder...he has clear clinical signs for most of
these....I think he should be in hosptial....

Peanut

chocola...@aol.com

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Jan 13, 2007, 11:09:04 AM1/13/07

to

chocolatepea...@aol.com wrote:

Just a short description of symptoms of some of the illnesses I
mentioned..

Antisocial Personality Disorder

No sense of right or wrong
Willing to lie
Not bound by social norms
Can be pleasant/polished/slick
Possible criminal record
Potential for violence
Impulsive
Enjoys humiliating and demeaning others.

Histrionic Personality Disorder

Overly dramatic, theatrical
Needs to be centre of attention
Attention seeking
Excessive concern with physical appearence
Vanity
Demanding, manipulative
Frequent tantrums
Need continual stimulation
Sexually provocative

Schizoid Personality Disorder

Features
A pattern of detachment from social relationships and restricted range
of emotional expression (DSM IV 1994)

Self Image
View themselves as loners, who prize solitude.

View of others
Fear engulfment and maintain a safe distance from others.

Relationships
Social isolation. Not responsive to the feelings of others.

Affective Issues
Do not struggle with shame or guilt, but they are quite anxious about
basic safety.

Defensive Structure
The external world seems full of threats against security and
individuality. SPDs tend to withdraw and seek satisfaction in fantasy.
It is common for SPDs to wonder how other people can lie to themselves
so effortlessly, when the harsh facts of life are so clearly evident.
Other people do not see what they see (McWilliams).

Treatment
A Cluster A personality is not inclined to seek treatment. They are
often forced into therapy by family or the legal system. They can
spend a lifetime in single rooms in interpersonal isolation. There is
a general lack of responsivity, a frustrating incapacity to relate, and
a general and pervasive lack of empathy. SPDs will not prosper with
direct confrontation...

Peanut

Alex

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Jan 13, 2007, 11:26:38 AM1/13/07

to

in article 1168697773.4...@v45g2000cwv.googlegroups.com,
chocola...@aol.com at chocola...@aol.com wrote on 1/13/07 9:16 AM:

>
> Alex wrote:
>> I don't recall anyone saying you CAN'T post your opinions here.
>
> Not me idiot..I'm referrring to Ray..

No one's told him that either.