DMP - Should we take the plunge?
Mike
try to keep ADT's grubby hands out of our monitored account base.
First, what can you DMP dealers tell me about their products?
And second, is ADT aggressive enough to just swap out the panel for
free in order to take over monitoring?
TIA
Mike
Frank Olson
companies (big names included) out of your customer base... In my neck of
the woods, we provide a "value added" service that involves an annual visit
to thorougly test they system and if necessary replace the back-up battery
(at no charge). The service adds $40.00 to the annual monitoring bill, pays
for the technician's time and makes sure the customer stays "in the loop"...
--
Frank E. Olson
http://www.alt-security-alarms.com
Free listings for qualified industry professionals, dealers & suppliers.
Please visit the unofficial web site to view FAQ and participant
information.
"Mike" <Mik...@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:99p5hvgdupol6afkb...@4ax.com...
Mark Leuck
Thats a dumb reason to switch panels, even if you move to DMP it just takes
a panel and keypad to swap it out anyway
badenov
DMP makes nice stuff. If you switch, be sure you won't have any problems
meeting their minimum purchase requirements.
But changing just to keep ADT out is not a smart thing to do. First of
all, for the small panels like the XR10 and XR20, it just doesn't cost very
much to swap them out for whatever the local ADT office is using. Second,
ADT can certainly monitor DMP panels if they want to, because they've
bought companies that use DMP -- plus they can transmit in Contact ID as
well as SDLC. And for a big system with loop expanders and lots of DMP
keypads, ADT could always just order their own brand new XR200 panel and
install it, if they didn't want to replace everything. DMP will sell
panels to ADT. What manufacturer wouldn't?
One other thing to keep in mind is that using DMP might have an effect on
the marketability of your accounts someday, depending on your market area.
It's an exclusive dealer product, of course, which means a buyer has to be
concerned about his ability to get parts, train his techs on a new set of
panels, and so on. Depends on your area and your situation whether this
might be a problem.
- badenov
Mike
"let's not speculate what they might do..."
Does anyone know of any real past history on these issues?
Thanks again
Mike
On 15 Jul 2003 02:16:43 +0200, Anonymous...@See.Comment.Header
Mark Leuck
> I probably should have said -
>
> "let's not speculate what they might do..."
>
> Does anyone know of any real past history on these issues?
>
> Thanks again
>
> Mike
Which issues? ADT or DMP?
Mike
>Which issues? ADT or DMP?
Oooh. Tough crowd <smile>
Either/or
TIA
Mike
Mark Leuck
Not at all, first it sounded like you wanted to move to DMP just because you
think ADT won't take them over, then you pull back and ask for history on
issues.
Which issues? panel or companies?
Trublechuter
Bob La Londe
The only real feature of the DMP panels I found is their integratable access
control in the higher end panels. Otherwise, I'ld go to Napco or Caddx. Oh
wait. I did.
I also sell DMP, but not as a first choice, but because I bought out a
company that installed some DMP.
They use an exclusivity attitude in their sales approach to try and make you
beg to sell their product. Even now sales support from Caddx or Napco or
even Ademco is far superior. They also use an excluse modem for downloading
(couple hundred dollars) and charge for manuals and sales brochures that you
get for free from any other manufacturer.
I have mostly XR-20s in the field. They are a nice panel, and I think the
menu programming at they keypad is easier than some other panels. So far
they seem to work reliably. I have about 50 of them in the field.
I think customer service from the vendor should be your primary deciding
factor in panel decisions followed by price, ease of use, and flexibility of
the product.
Best of luck in your endeavor.
"Mike" <Mik...@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:99p5hvgdupol6afkb...@4ax.com...
Jimmy Dale Reeves
CS that DMP would only send to their receiver.
Thank you
Jimmy Dale Reeves
Elite Security, LLC
"Bob La Londe" <use...@diycomponents.com> wrote in message
news:bf13ck$a03bi$1...@ID-163264.news.uni-berlin.de...
thesatguy
so they will swap out a panel if they have to but usually they put in some
old board they find laying around in their truck - they never buy any new
panels. Old junk keypads, old junk detectors, old junk boards.
"Mike" <Mik...@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:99p5hvgdupol6afkb...@4ax.com...
Mark Leuck
"Bob La Londe" <use...@diycomponents.com> wrote in message
news:bf13ck$a03bi$1...@ID-163264.news.uni-berlin.de...
>
> The only real feature of the DMP panels I found is their integratable
access
> control in the higher end panels. Otherwise, I'ld go to Napco or Caddx.
Oh
> wait. I did.
>
> I also sell DMP, but not as a first choice, but because I bought out a
> company that installed some DMP.
>
> They use an exclusivity attitude in their sales approach to try and make
you
> beg to sell their product. Even now sales support from Caddx or Napco or
> even Ademco is far superior. They also use an excluse modem for
downloading
> (couple hundred dollars) and charge for manuals and sales brochures that
you
> get for free from any other manufacturer.
Charge for manuals? I've always been able to download them from the DMP web
site
Mark Leuck
"Jimmy Dale Reeves" <jimm...@jrfowler.com> wrote in message
news:vh89n7f...@corp.supernews.com...
> Does the central station have to have a special receiver? I was told by
my
> CS that DMP would only send to their receiver.
>
> Thank you
> Jimmy Dale Reeves
> Elite Security, LLC
>
It depends on the model, anything these days from DMP will send Contact ID
or 4/2 as well as the proprietary DMP format
Trublechuter
Bob La Londe
They do have a proprietary reporting forma also. I can't speak for their
older stuff.
"Jimmy Dale Reeves" <jimm...@jrfowler.com> wrote in message
news:vh89n7f...@corp.supernews.com...
Bob La Londe
alreayd had two sets of print manuals, and all I ordered was a keypad. They
tacked on a set of manuals and charged me $90 for them. I complained and I
still haven't gotten a refund. That was months ago.
Sharp said he would refund them, and even stop by and pick up the extra set,
but I haven't heard from him since. That was months ago.
"Mark Leuck" <m..leuck@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:o1%Qa.60109$sY2....@rwcrnsc51.ops.asp.att.net...
Mike
>It depends on the model, anything these days from DMP will send Contact ID
>or 4/2 as well as the proprietary DMP format
Well uh I beg to differ (sort of)
We just had one of the DMP reps come in and do a demo of their wares.
4+2 was one of the things that was brought up and they said they dont
support it because (at least on the panel they were using in the demo)
their isn't enough available codes in 4+2 to cover all the reporting
zones, O/C reporting, etc. This guy said CID or DMP only.
One of the things that troubles me is the lithium battery they use for
memory retention. They say (as well as the board being labeled as
well) that should you lose all power to the panel, you have to send
the sucker back to the factory. Well...ok. Then he shows us the
expansion board that covers the lithium battery, and then he tells us
that the cards are not hot-swappable.
So, if you have to power down the panel to replace a motion, or for
whatever reason, you will lose everything if the lithium is bad.
Of course, he wasn't too happy when I pointed that out and tried to
sugarcoat that saying that some people change the battery while the
panel is still powered up and the expansion board in place. Hmmm.
That might be possible while the board is out of the can, but...
The other thing he said was to make sure you get out there and replace
those batterys so it doesn't happen to you. Uh, ok. Install a panel,
make sure you set your calendar 8 years ahead, so you can visit this
customer for this reason, power down the panel, remove the expansion
board, power up the panel (so it doesnt lose memory when you do pull
out the battery), swap the battery, power down again to reinstall the
expansion boards, pray to to DMP gods that you got enough sleep to
remember to do each step in order, then hold your breath and power up
and hope it wasn't too late for the original lithium... I'm not cool
with that! That's an accident waiting to happen. It's beyond absurd,
as you cant just fire up your laptop and load it back up.
Oh well, it's too late. My boss said we're doing it, so we're doing
it.
Any comments on my concerns, anyone?
TIA
Mike
Mark Leuck
> I'll show you the invocie if you want. It was pretty funny actually. I
> alreayd had two sets of print manuals, and all I ordered was a keypad.
They
> tacked on a set of manuals and charged me $90 for them. I complained and
I
> still haven't gotten a refund. That was months ago.
>
> Sharp said he would refund them, and even stop by and pick up the extra
set,
> but I haven't heard from him since. That was months ago.
>
>
I guess hard copy is different :)
Bob La Londe
I'll have to get on the phone with them when I have a coupel weeks to waste
screwign around so I can get that straightened out.
"Mark Leuck" <m..leuck@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:fk3Ra.73700$N7.8877@sccrnsc03...
Mark Leuck
> I supposedly now have net access, but I never got it to work. I suppose
> I'll have to get on the phone with them when I have a coupel weeks to
waste
> screwign around so I can get that straightened out.
>
>
I've always got my manuals from the web page, doesn't even require a login.
Mark Leuck
>
> >It depends on the model, anything these days from DMP will send Contact
ID
> >or 4/2 as well as the proprietary DMP format
>
> Well uh I beg to differ (sort of)
>
> We just had one of the DMP reps come in and do a demo of their wares.
> 4+2 was one of the things that was brought up and they said they dont
> support it because (at least on the panel they were using in the demo)
> their isn't enough available codes in 4+2 to cover all the reporting
> zones, O/C reporting, etc. This guy said CID or DMP only.
The XR-5/6 supports 4/2, CID and DMP however the XR-10 is 4/2 and DMP only.
The XR-20 supports 4/2, CID, DMP and Modem II
It all depends on which model which is kind of strange
> One of the things that troubles me is the lithium battery they use for
> memory retention. They say (as well as the board being labeled as
> well) that should you lose all power to the panel, you have to send
> the sucker back to the factory. Well...ok. Then he shows us the
> expansion board that covers the lithium battery, and then he tells us
> that the cards are not hot-swappable.
> So, if you have to power down the panel to replace a motion, or for
> whatever reason, you will lose everything if the lithium is bad.
I think the rep you heard this from is full of it
Macy Hallock
+---------------
> I've always got my manuals from the web page, doesn't even require a login.
DMP is not for everyone, but it offers some good capabilities that
differentiate the products from Radionics, Ademco and others.
Example: DMP also now has a semi-reasonably priced Ethernet card available
for reporting and control via TCP/IP on certain models. It's not as
complete in its functionality as I think it should be, but it's useful
for certain types of applications. (This is a notable improvement over
their intitial Ethernet offering, which was very limited in capability
and rather expensive.)
--
+ Macy M. Hallock, Jr. + APK Net + Tel:216.241.7166 + Fax:216.241.7522 +
+ Speaking for myself. Anyone who agrees may need professional help. +
--
Macy M. Hallock, Jr. - APK Net - Tel:216.241.7166 - Fax:216.241.7522
Bob La Londe
I kept seeing that dealer login screen, and I didn't realize that you should
just ignore it.
Fudge nuts.
"Mark Leuck" <m..leuck@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:xB4Ra.74218$N7.9132@sccrnsc03...
Mike
On Wed, 16 Jul 2003 04:33:31 GMT, "Mark Leuck" <m..leuck@comcast.net>
wrote:
Frank Olson
a Napco??? It was so long ago I forgot...
--
Frank E. Olson
http://www.alt-security-alarms.com
Free listings for qualified industry professionals, dealers & suppliers.
Please visit the unofficial web site to view FAQ and participant
information.
"Mike" <Mik...@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:dg5ehvk26iremr1pk...@4ax.com...
Mark Leuck
bad, unfortunatly many of those panels have been running twice that long.
"Frank Olson" <Use_the_e...@alt-security-alarms.com> wrote in message
news:ZGERa.450072$3C2.12...@news3.calgary.shaw.ca...
badenov
>I seem to remember some other panel with a lithium battery in it... Was it
>a Napco??? It was so long ago I forgot...
Radionics has used lithium batteries in some of its products over the
years. Radionics introduced the first programmable control/communicator,
the 8000, back in 1976. At that time, there wasn't such a thing as EEPROM
memory (at least, not at a reasonable price), so battery-backed RAM was the
only way to fly. The lithium battery was only a final backup for the
panel's AC or main battery. Ten years later, some manufacturers were still
using bipolar PROMs.
- badenov
Bob La Londe
isn't organized very well.
"Mark Leuck" <m..leuck@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:WOsRa.70516$wk6....@rwcrnsc52.ops.asp.att.net...
>
> "Bob La Londe" <use...@diycomponents.com> wrote in message
> news:bf57u6$bbvhh$1...@ID-163264.news.uni-berlin.de...
> > Boy I sure wasted a lot of time and money screwing with those guys.
> >
> > I kept seeing that dealer login screen, and I didn't realize that you
> should
> > just ignore it.
> >
> > Fudge nuts.
> >
>
> They must have put that up recently because all DMP manuals used to be
free
> and easy to get, I've got all the current products that I know of
>
>
Group Moderator
From: "Frank Olson" Use_the_e...@alt-security-alarms.com
Date: 7/17/2003 5:38 PM Eastern Daylight Time
Message-id: <ZGERa.450072$3C2.12...@news3.calgary.shaw.ca>
I seem to remember some other panel with a lithium battery in it... Was it
a Napco??? It was so long ago I forgot...
--
Frank E. Olson
http://www.alt-security-alarms.com
Free listings for qualified industry professionals, dealers & suppliers.
Please visit the unofficial web site to view FAQ and participant
information.
Mike Said:
The Napco 2500 & 2600 both had lithium batteries.
Mike, Sr.
32 Years in the trade
http://www.AlarmServicesInc.com
Online Store
http://www.AlarmSuperStore.com
ASA online vendor
FREE Shipping $ 100.00 or More
All others just===> $5.95
Mark Leuck
> I was able to downlaod a couple manulas without logging on, but it sure
> isn't organized very well.
>
It never has been
Frank Olson
The *manuals* are too... :-)
Next question... What's a "manula" for?? I'll bet it's some new tool you
use to run wires in Arizona attics...
"Bob La Londe" <use...@diycomponents.com> wrote in message
news:bf7ud3$bu76v$1...@ID-163264.news.uni-berlin.de...
Robert L. Bass
Regards,
Robert
=============================>
Bass Home Electronics, Inc
2291 Pine View Circle
Sarasota · Florida · 34231
877-722-8900 Sales & Tech Support
941-925-9747 Fax
941-232-0791 Wireless
Nextel Private ID - 161*21755*1
http://www.bass-home.com
=============================>
Mike
wrote:
>The AT&T 8300 had a lithium battery that lasted 5 or 6 years before going
>bad, unfortunatly many of those panels have been running twice that long.
>
Funny you mention that. I had to program an 8300 today. All the
AT&T's we have out there have dead lithium batteries. They are not
field replaceable. Losing memory is not an issue, as long as the
backup battery is good. In fact we NEVER lost memory any any of them.
We discovered this by one of the servicemen doing a call powered down
the panel, and "uh-oh!" In any case, all you have to do is fire up the
laptop and reload the panel. Nobody wants to spend the money to
upgrade.
As much as I hated the AT&T's we only lost 1 ever - and that one to a
lightning strike that wiped the rest of the electronics out in this
house.
Mark Leuck
> On Thu, 17 Jul 2003 22:37:51 GMT, "Mark Leuck" <m..leuck@comcast.net>
> wrote:
>
> >The AT&T 8300 had a lithium battery that lasted 5 or 6 years before going
> >bad, unfortunatly many of those panels have been running twice that long.
> >
> Funny you mention that. I had to program an 8300 today. All the
> AT&T's we have out there have dead lithium batteries. They are not
> field replaceable. Losing memory is not an issue, as long as the
> backup battery is good. In fact we NEVER lost memory any any of them.
> We discovered this by one of the servicemen doing a call powered down
> the panel, and "uh-oh!" In any case, all you have to do is fire up the
> laptop and reload the panel. Nobody wants to spend the money to
> upgrade.
Most that I've seen have the flat batteries that can be replaced although
later versions seem to have a cap
> As much as I hated the AT&T's we only lost 1 ever - and that one to a
> lightning strike that wiped the rest of the electronics out in this
> house.
Wait until the communication chips start deteriorating and it can no longer
send signals in SIA :)
Petem
they have all lithium battery and almost all the board have them soldered on
it..
we did lost a few panels programing but it was not that complicated to
recover all the info since our company's tech always have a smal printer
with them and print the whole programing and leave it in the panel boxes...
we are doing it that way cause it was not always possible to have a laptop
to every tech(we are about 30 in montreal,but we cover the same territory as
kansas)and leaving a copy of the programing on floppy as its limits cause
after a few years the floppy were giving bad sector...
and having the whole programing on papers is very efficient service wise we
can see very fast whats in the panel with out having to review it all from
the panel or from the laptop..
and you knows when a tech goes in programing,especially after a 12 hour
shift(stand bye) anything can happend!LOL
anyone got yo play with those?
"Mike" <Mik...@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:08pghv0vb3heiac35...@4ax.com...
Mike Dupre
with me.
Shouldn't you be Pierrem?
"Petem" <pe...@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:an_Ra.17253$124.2...@wagner.videotron.net...
Roger W.
>From: "Frank Olson" Use_the_e...@alt-security-alarms.com
>Message-id: <jqMRa.480479$Vi5.12...@news1.calgary.shaw.ca>
>
>Well that explains everything... Not only are the "manulas" are free...
>The *manuals* are too... :-)
>
>Next question... What's a "manula" for?? I'll bet it's some new tool you
>use to run wires in Arizona attics...
>
RW
A "Manula" is the female form of "Manuel". Or was that Manuela. Oh, never mind.
zzzzzzzzzz.
Petem
and shouldnt you be Michel Dupre??
"Mike Dupre" <mdu...@medi-call.ca> wrote in message
news:pM_Ra.109666$sI91....@news04.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com...
Mike Dupre
mot en francais?
I'm what the Quebecoise commonly refer to as a Vendu, so no, I do not use
Michel.
"Petem" <pe...@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:rd2Sa.24267$124.4...@wagner.videotron.net...
Petem
Main Entry: ac·ro·nym
Pronunciation: 'a-kr&-"nim
Function: noun
Etymology: acr- + -onym
Date: 1943
: a word (as NATO, radar, or snafu) formed from the initial letter or
letters of each of the successive parts or major parts of a compound term
- ac·ro·nym·ic /"a-kr&-'ni-mik/ adjective
- ac·ro·nym·i·cal·ly /-mi-k(&-)lE/ adverb
"Mike Dupre" <mdu...@medi-call.ca> wrote in message
news:CHaSa.2229$2h1....@news02.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com...
Mike Dupre
What does Petem stand for?
"Petem" <pe...@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:LwbSa.33670$124.5...@wagner.videotron.net...
Petem
simple
"Mike Dupre" <mdu...@medi-call.ca> wrote in message
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Mike Dupre
"Petem" <pe...@nospam.com> wrote in message
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