> > > > > > > > > > From pg. 14 of Reason to Affirm a Global Flood by Humber. There are
> > > > > > > > > > many links to the subject matter, but I will stick to one given
> > > > > > > > > > example.
> > > > > > > > > > What could possibly have moved these rocks 300-600 miles almost over
> > > > > > > > > > level ground (less than a 1degree slope? The geological forces are
> > > > > > > > > > clearly not happening today....and the example: Portand University
> > > > > > > > > > geologist Dr. J.E. Allen discovered quartzite boulders up to 3 ft. in
> > > > > > > > > > diameter on several mountains in northeast Oregon. He wrote, 'no
> > > > > > > > > > nearby source has been recognized,' and suggested they were carried
> > > > > > > > > > there by a 'torrential paleoriver.' Then he admitted this theory was
> > > > > > > > > > 'an outrageous hypothesis' considering the wide distributions and
> > > > > > > > > > great distance of transport.
> > > > > > > > > Ever hear of glaciers? Those erratics were transported there during
> > > > > > > > > the icea gaes as any 6th grade kid knows.
> > > > > > > > > Harry K
> > > > > > > > So your glaciers moved the rocks downard from on land?!
> > > > > > > > wg
> > > > > > > Just what other direction would you expect? Ooops, I forgot "never
> > > > > > > underestimate Grooms stupidity"
> > > > > > > Harry K
> > > > > > I wouldn't expect the glaciers to be on land? Did yours?
> > > > > > "Stupid is as stupid does"...:)
> > > > > > wg
> > > > > What?
> > > > The claim was that the rocks were moved on land by glaciers. Glaciers
> > > > usually hang out in water.
> > > > wg
> > > Wow! Just wow. Ever heard of the glaciers in the Alps? You know, the
> > > mountains where Jean Louis Rodolphe Agassiz worked as he came out with
> > > the Theory of Glaciation. Wa--a--y above sea level.
> > > I once saw a beautiful hanging valley in a valley clearly carved by a
> > > glacier well above sea level near Helvellyn.
> "This whole region (The Lake District) is good example of glaciation
> and has all the text book examples associated with the formation of
> this landscape : ‘U’ shaped-valleys, lakes, moraines, alluvial fans,
> corries. Buttermere has post glacial deposits and arêtes and razor
> back edges. Derwent water is the shallowest lake and has drumlins and
> eskers. Penrith and Keswick have truncated spurs. The erratics in
> Thirlmere show the direction of the glacial flow. There are nearly 200
> corries, which are difficult to date but probably developed over the
> last 2 million years during the Quaternery. The moraines are also the
> result of the last glaciation. The glacial deposit of till or boulder
> clay was 20,000 years ago during the Devensian glaciation and is
> therefore recent and gave rise to the drumlins. The deposits below
> these are heavily weathered and very different from the last
> glaciation. This is evidence of previous glaciation and is the only
> site of two-stage glaciation in N. England. The till is quite thick
> and in places up to 10m thick. The head of Langdale Pike has
> moraines."
> On Apr 26, 7:20 pm, Caranx latus<aug.r...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> On 4/26/2012 4:33 PM, curtjester1 wrote:
>>> On Apr 26, 11:34 am, Wombat<tri...@multiweb.nl> wrote:
>>>> On Apr 26, 6:04 pm, curtjester1<curtjest...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>>> On Apr 25, 12:38 pm, Wombat<tri...@multiweb.nl> wrote:
>>>>>> On Apr 25, 8:19 pm, curtjester1<curtjest...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>> On Apr 24, 9:56 pm, harry k<turnkey4...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>> On Apr 24, 10:57 am, curtjester1<curtjest...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> On Apr 24, 10:24 am, Wombat<tri...@multiweb.nl> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> On Apr 24, 5:23 pm, curtjester1<curtjest...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> On Apr 24, 8:16 am, harry k<turnkey4...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>> On Apr 23, 12:53 pm, curtjester1<curtjest...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>> From pg. 14 of Reason to Affirm a Global Flood by Humber. There are
>>>>>>>>>>>>> many links to the subject matter, but I will stick to one given
>>>>>>>>>>>>> example.
>>>>>>>>>>>>> What could possibly have moved these rocks 300-600 miles almost over
>>>>>>>>>>>>> level ground (less than a 1degree slope? The geological forces are
>>>>>>>>>>>>> clearly not happening today....and the example: Portand University
>>>>>>>>>>>>> geologist Dr. J.E. Allen discovered quartzite boulders up to 3 ft. in
>>>>>>>>>>>>> diameter on several mountains in northeast Oregon. He wrote, 'no
>>>>>>>>>>>>> nearby source has been recognized,' and suggested they were carried
>>>>>>>>>>>>> there by a 'torrential paleoriver.' Then he admitted this theory was
>>>>>>>>>>>>> 'an outrageous hypothesis' considering the wide distributions and
>>>>>>>>>>>>> great distance of transport.
>>>>>>>>>>>> Ever hear of glaciers? Those erratics were transported there during
>>>>>>>>>>>> the icea gaes as any 6th grade kid knows.
>>>>>>>>>>>> Harry K
>>>>>>>>>>> So your glaciers moved the rocks downard from on land?!
>>>>>>>>>>> wg
>>>>>>>>>> Please translate that gibberish into English.
>>>>>>>>> Since you seen to have a dyslexic syntax problem, you might want to
>>>>>>>>> read up on the subject of rocks being displaced rapidly. Larry
>>>>>>>>> Vardiman in Sleuthing Supefaults. It goes into Heart Mountain in
>>>>>>>>> Wyoming. Dr. Stephen Austin, geologist, agrees that it is compelling
>>>>>>>>> evidence for a catastrophic flood.
>>>>>>>>> wg
>>>>>>>> Who said anything about those rocks in Oregon being 'displaced
>>>>>>>> rapidly'? They weren't.
>>>>>>>> Harry K
>>>>>>> The Oregon quartz arrived. There is no need for rapid displacement to
>>>>>>> be considered per se. They had to arrive 'supernaturally' because
>>>>>>> there is no quartz in the region anywhere to have them get there. A
>>>>>>> tremedous flood could get them there. There is no nature reason for
>>>>>>> them to be there besides that.
>>>>>>> wg
>>>>>> Wow! Just wow! An ice age need not apply? Missoula floods anyone?
>>>>> Why would it apply?? You're talking great land impactings! Show us
>>>>> where melting ice is going to do that? Remember, I told you about the
>>>>> Strait of Gibraltar which needed extreme volume and force of water for
>>>>> separating the land masses. That's not going to happen by ice...but a
>>>>> huge flood would.
>>>>> wg
>>>> Yet again, your strange use of English renders your points
>>>> incomprehensible. The Straits of Gibraltar were broken about 5
>>>> million years ago, the last time the Med. was flooded. Was that by Ye
>>>> Floode? Or was it by Felice?
>>> Sounds so mythological.
>> Take a look at a tectonic plate map sometime. One that shows the
>> relative directions and speeds that each plate is moving. Like the one
>> on page 114 here:
>> The African Plate is colliding with the Eurasian Plate and one of the
>> results of that will be that the Mediterranean will close. No flood
>> forced the tectonic plates apart because the plates were never closer to
>> each other than they are now.
> Stick with your problem. Get the plates to collide, 'naturally', and
> get them to form Mt. Everest.
I've covered this in more than sufficient detail for anyone with the capacity to think. You're unreachable.
> On Apr 26, 7:20 pm, Caranx latus <aug.r...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > On 4/26/2012 4:33 PM, curtjester1 wrote:
> > > On Apr 26, 11:34 am, Wombat<tri...@multiweb.nl> wrote:
> > >> On Apr 26, 6:04 pm, curtjester1<curtjest...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> > >>> On Apr 25, 12:38 pm, Wombat<tri...@multiweb.nl> wrote:
> > >>>> On Apr 25, 8:19 pm, curtjester1<curtjest...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> > >>>>> On Apr 24, 9:56 pm, harry k<turnkey4...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> > >>>>>> On Apr 24, 10:57 am, curtjester1<curtjest...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> > >>>>>>> On Apr 24, 10:24 am, Wombat<tri...@multiweb.nl> wrote:
> > >>>>>>>> On Apr 24, 5:23 pm, curtjester1<curtjest...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> > >>>>>>>>> On Apr 24, 8:16 am, harry k<turnkey4...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> > >>>>>>>>>> On Apr 23, 12:53 pm, curtjester1<curtjest...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> > >>>>>>>>>>> From pg. 14 of Reason to Affirm a Global Flood by Humber. There are
> > >>>>>>>>>>> many links to the subject matter, but I will stick to one given
> > >>>>>>>>>>> example.
> > >>>>>>>>>>> What could possibly have moved these rocks 300-600 miles almost over
> > >>>>>>>>>>> level ground (less than a 1degree slope? The geological forces are
> > >>>>>>>>>>> clearly not happening today....and the example: Portand University
> > >>>>>>>>>>> geologist Dr. J.E. Allen discovered quartzite boulders up to 3 ft. in
> > >>>>>>>>>>> diameter on several mountains in northeast Oregon. He wrote, 'no
> > >>>>>>>>>>> nearby source has been recognized,' and suggested they were carried
> > >>>>>>>>>>> there by a 'torrential paleoriver.' Then he admitted this theory was
> > >>>>>>>>>>> 'an outrageous hypothesis' considering the wide distributions and
> > >>>>>>>>>>> great distance of transport.
> > >>>>>>>>>> Ever hear of glaciers? Those erratics were transported there during
> > >>>>>>>>>> the icea gaes as any 6th grade kid knows.
> > >>>>>>>>>> Harry K
> > >>>>>>>>> So your glaciers moved the rocks downard from on land?!
> > >>>>>>>>> wg
> > >>>>>>>> Please translate that gibberish into English.
> > >>>>>>> Since you seen to have a dyslexic syntax problem, you might want to
> > >>>>>>> read up on the subject of rocks being displaced rapidly. Larry
> > >>>>>>> Vardiman in Sleuthing Supefaults. It goes into Heart Mountain in
> > >>>>>>> Wyoming. Dr. Stephen Austin, geologist, agrees that it is compelling
> > >>>>>>> evidence for a catastrophic flood.
> > >>>>>>> wg
> > >>>>>> Who said anything about those rocks in Oregon being 'displaced
> > >>>>>> rapidly'? They weren't.
> > >>>>>> Harry K
> > >>>>> The Oregon quartz arrived. There is no need for rapid displacement to
> > >>>>> be considered per se. They had to arrive 'supernaturally' because
> > >>>>> there is no quartz in the region anywhere to have them get there. A
> > >>>>> tremedous flood could get them there. There is no nature reason for
> > >>>>> them to be there besides that.
> > >>>>> wg
> > >>>> Wow! Just wow! An ice age need not apply? Missoula floods anyone?
> > >>> Why would it apply?? You're talking great land impactings! Show us
> > >>> where melting ice is going to do that? Remember, I told you about the
> > >>> Strait of Gibraltar which needed extreme volume and force of water for
> > >>> separating the land masses. That's not going to happen by ice...but a
> > >>> huge flood would.
> > >>> wg
> > >> Yet again, your strange use of English renders your points
> > >> incomprehensible. The Straits of Gibraltar were broken about 5
> > >> million years ago, the last time the Med. was flooded. Was that by Ye
> > >> Floode? Or was it by Felice?
> > > Sounds so mythological.
> > Take a look at a tectonic plate map sometime. One that shows the
> > relative directions and speeds that each plate is moving. Like the one
> > on page 114 here:
> > The African Plate is colliding with the Eurasian Plate and one of the
> > results of that will be that the Mediterranean will close. No flood
> > forced the tectonic plates apart because the plates were never closer to
> > each other than they are now.
> Stick with your problem. Get the plates to collide, 'naturally', and
> get them to form Mt. Everest.
> wg
Why bother repeating a process that has been proven for over 100
years? Onnly idiots and morons deny it.
> On Apr 26, 6:45 pm, Caranx latus <aug.r...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > On 4/26/2012 12:02 PM, curtjester1 wrote:
> > > On Apr 25, 12:35 pm, Wombat<tri...@multiweb.nl> wrote:
> > >> On Apr 25, 8:15 pm, curtjester1<curtjest...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> > >>> On Apr 24, 9:54 pm, harry k<turnkey4...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> > >>>> On Apr 24, 8:23 am, curtjester1<curtjest...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> > >>>>> On Apr 24, 8:16 am, harry k<turnkey4...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> > >>>>>> On Apr 23, 12:53 pm, curtjester1<curtjest...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> > >>>>>>> From pg. 14 of Reason to Affirm a Global Flood by Humber. There are
> > >>>>>>> many links to the subject matter, but I will stick to one given
> > >>>>>>> example.
> > >>>>>>> What could possibly have moved these rocks 300-600 miles almost over
> > >>>>>>> level ground (less than a 1degree slope? The geological forces are
> > >>>>>>> clearly not happening today....and the example: Portand University
> > >>>>>>> geologist Dr. J.E. Allen discovered quartzite boulders up to 3 ft. in
> > >>>>>>> diameter on several mountains in northeast Oregon. He wrote, 'no
> > >>>>>>> nearby source has been recognized,' and suggested they were carried
> > >>>>>>> there by a 'torrential paleoriver.' Then he admitted this theory was
> > >>>>>>> 'an outrageous hypothesis' considering the wide distributions and
> > >>>>>>> great distance of transport.
> > >>>>>> Ever hear of glaciers? Those erratics were transported there during
> > >>>>>> the icea gaes as any 6th grade kid knows.
> > >>>>>> Harry K
> > >>>>> So your glaciers moved the rocks downard from on land?!
> > >>>>> wg
> > >>>> Just what other direction would you expect? Ooops, I forgot "never
> > >>>> underestimate Grooms stupidity"
> > >>>> Harry K
> > >>> I wouldn't expect the glaciers to be on land? Did yours?
> > >>> "Stupid is as stupid does"...:)
> > >>> wg
> > >> What?
> > > The claim was that the rocks were moved on land by glaciers. Glaciers
> > > usually hang out in water.
> > Tell me something, jester, do you really enjoy having unbounded
> > ignorance? Glaciers are on land. Icebergs are in water.
> No, I actually like addressing the problem of rocks being transferred
> long distances. I like how total issues are ignored for their chance
> to be a juvenile.
> wg
I like you ignore and lie about known physical forces of nature.
> On Apr 26, 6:45 pm, Caranx latus<aug.r...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> On 4/26/2012 12:02 PM, curtjester1 wrote:
>>> On Apr 25, 12:35 pm, Wombat<tri...@multiweb.nl> wrote:
>>>> On Apr 25, 8:15 pm, curtjester1<curtjest...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>>> On Apr 24, 9:54 pm, harry k<turnkey4...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>> On Apr 24, 8:23 am, curtjester1<curtjest...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>> On Apr 24, 8:16 am, harry k<turnkey4...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>> On Apr 23, 12:53 pm, curtjester1<curtjest...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> From pg. 14 of Reason to Affirm a Global Flood by Humber. There are
>>>>>>>>> many links to the subject matter, but I will stick to one given
>>>>>>>>> example.
>>>>>>>>> What could possibly have moved these rocks 300-600 miles almost over
>>>>>>>>> level ground (less than a 1degree slope? The geological forces are
>>>>>>>>> clearly not happening today....and the example: Portand University
>>>>>>>>> geologist Dr. J.E. Allen discovered quartzite boulders up to 3 ft. in
>>>>>>>>> diameter on several mountains in northeast Oregon. He wrote, 'no
>>>>>>>>> nearby source has been recognized,' and suggested they were carried
>>>>>>>>> there by a 'torrential paleoriver.' Then he admitted this theory was
>>>>>>>>> 'an outrageous hypothesis' considering the wide distributions and
>>>>>>>>> great distance of transport.
>>>>>>>> Ever hear of glaciers? Those erratics were transported there during
>>>>>>>> the icea gaes as any 6th grade kid knows.
>>>>>>>> Harry K
>>>>>>> So your glaciers moved the rocks downard from on land?!
>>>>>>> wg
>>>>>> Just what other direction would you expect? Ooops, I forgot "never
>>>>>> underestimate Grooms stupidity"
>>>>>> Harry K
>>>>> I wouldn't expect the glaciers to be on land? Did yours?
>>>>> "Stupid is as stupid does"...:)
>>>>> wg
>>>> What?
>>> The claim was that the rocks were moved on land by glaciers. Glaciers
>>> usually hang out in water.
>> Tell me something, jester, do you really enjoy having unbounded
>> ignorance? Glaciers are on land. Icebergs are in water.
> No, I actually like addressing the problem of rocks being transferred
> long distances. I like how total issues are ignored for their chance
> to be a juvenile.
What was wrong with "Those erratics were transported there during the ice ages as any 6th grade kid knows"? Are you having trouble figuring that one out? What's the issue? The three-syllable words? How do you think a glacier would transport a rock? (Hint: they don't *pull* them.)
> > > > > > > > > > > From pg. 14 of Reason to Affirm a Global Flood by Humber. There are
> > > > > > > > > > > many links to the subject matter, but I will stick to one given
> > > > > > > > > > > example.
> > > > > > > > > > > What could possibly have moved these rocks 300-600 miles almost over
> > > > > > > > > > > level ground (less than a 1degree slope? The geological forces are
> > > > > > > > > > > clearly not happening today....and the example: Portand University
> > > > > > > > > > > geologist Dr. J.E. Allen discovered quartzite boulders up to 3 ft. in
> > > > > > > > > > > diameter on several mountains in northeast Oregon. He wrote, 'no
> > > > > > > > > > > nearby source has been recognized,' and suggested they were carried
> > > > > > > > > > > there by a 'torrential paleoriver.' Then he admitted this theory was
> > > > > > > > > > > 'an outrageous hypothesis' considering the wide distributions and
> > > > > > > > > > > great distance of transport.
> > > > > > > > > > Ever hear of glaciers? Those erratics were transported there during
> > > > > > > > > > the icea gaes as any 6th grade kid knows.
> > > > > > > > > > Harry K
> > > > > > > > > So your glaciers moved the rocks downard from on land?!
> > > > > > > > > wg
> > > > > > > > Just what other direction would you expect? Ooops, I forgot "never
> > > > > > > > underestimate Grooms stupidity"
> > > > > > > > Harry K
> > > > > > > I wouldn't expect the glaciers to be on land? Did yours?
> > > > > > > "Stupid is as stupid does"...:)
> > > > > > > wg
> > > > > > What?
> > > > > The claim was that the rocks were moved on land by glaciers. Glaciers
> > > > > usually hang out in water.
> > > > > wg
> > > > Wow! Just wow. Ever heard of the glaciers in the Alps? You know, the
> > > > mountains where Jean Louis Rodolphe Agassiz worked as he came out with
> > > > the Theory of Glaciation. Wa--a--y above sea level.
> > > > I once saw a beautiful hanging valley in a valley clearly carved by a
> > > > glacier well above sea level near Helvellyn.
> > "This whole region (The Lake District) is good example of glaciation
> > and has all the text book examples associated with the formation of
> > this landscape : ‘U’ shaped-valleys, lakes, moraines, alluvial fans,
> > corries. Buttermere has post glacial deposits and arêtes and razor
> > back edges. Derwent water is the shallowest lake and has drumlins and
> > eskers. Penrith and Keswick have truncated spurs. The erratics in
> > Thirlmere show the direction of the glacial flow. There are nearly 200
> > corries, which are difficult to date but probably developed over the
> > last 2 million years during the Quaternery. The moraines are also the
> > result of the last glaciation. The glacial deposit of till or boulder
> > clay was 20,000 years ago during the Devensian glaciation and is
> > therefore recent and gave rise to the drumlins. The deposits below
> > these are heavily weathered and very different from the last
> > glaciation. This is evidence of previous glaciation and is the only
> > site of two-stage glaciation in N. England. The till is quite thick
> > and in places up to 10m thick. The head of Langdale Pike has
> > moraines."
> > > > > > > > > From pg. 14 of Reason to Affirm a Global Flood by Humber.
> > > > > > > > > There are
> > > > > > > > > many links to the subject matter, but I will stick to one
> > > > > > > > > given
> > > > > > > > > example.
> > > > > > > > > What could possibly have moved these rocks 300-600 miles
> > > > > > > > > almost over
> > > > > > > > > level ground (less than a 1degree slope? The geological forces
> > > > > > > > > are
> > > > > > > > > clearly not happening today....and the example: Portand
> > > > > > > > > University
> > > > > > > > > geologist Dr. J.E. Allen discovered quartzite boulders up to 3
> > > > > > > > > ft. in
> > > > > > > > > diameter on several mountains in northeast Oregon. He wrote,
> > > > > > > > > 'no
> > > > > > > > > nearby source has been recognized,' and suggested they were
> > > > > > > > > carried
> > > > > > > > > there by a 'torrential paleoriver.' Then he admitted this
> > > > > > > > > theory was
> > > > > > > > > 'an outrageous hypothesis' considering the wide distributions
> > > > > > > > > and
> > > > > > > > > great distance of transport.
> > > > > > > > Ever hear of glaciers? Those erratics were transported there
> > > > > > > > during
> > > > > > > > the icea gaes as any 6th grade kid knows.
> > > > > > > > Harry K
> > > > > > > So your glaciers moved the rocks downard from on land?!
> > > > > > > wg
> > > > > > Just what other direction would you expect? Ooops, I forgot "never
> > > > > > underestimate Grooms stupidity"
> > > > > > Harry K
> > > > > I wouldn't expect the glaciers to be on land? Did yours?
> > > > > "Stupid is as stupid does"...:)
> > > > > wg
> > > > What?
> > > The claim was that the rocks were moved on land by glaciers. Glaciers
> > > usually hang out in water.
> > No they don't. You have been lied to, and you chose to continue to believe
> > the lies you're told.
> > --
> > Malte Runz
> You seem not to be able to answer to the problem, much less a 'lie'.
> You need to move heavy rocks down a tiny 1 % grade, 500 miles and
> explain how they got there.
> > > > > > > > > > > From pg. 14 of Reason to Affirm a Global Flood by Humber. There are
> > > > > > > > > > > many links to the subject matter, but I will stick to one given
> > > > > > > > > > > example.
> > > > > > > > > > > What could possibly have moved these rocks 300-600 miles almost over
> > > > > > > > > > > level ground (less than a 1degree slope? The geological forces are
> > > > > > > > > > > clearly not happening today....and the example: Portand University
> > > > > > > > > > > geologist Dr. J.E. Allen discovered quartzite boulders up to 3 ft. in
> > > > > > > > > > > diameter on several mountains in northeast Oregon. He wrote, 'no
> > > > > > > > > > > nearby source has been recognized,' and suggested they were carried
> > > > > > > > > > > there by a 'torrential paleoriver.' Then he admitted this theory was
> > > > > > > > > > > 'an outrageous hypothesis' considering the wide distributions and
> > > > > > > > > > > great distance of transport.
> > > > > > > > > > Ever hear of glaciers? Those erratics were transported there during
> > > > > > > > > > the icea gaes as any 6th grade kid knows.
> > > > > > > > > > Harry K
> > > > > > > > > So your glaciers moved the rocks downard from on land?!
> > > > > > > > > wg
> > > > > > > > Just what other direction would you expect? Ooops, I forgot "never
> > > > > > > > underestimate Grooms stupidity"
> > > > > > > > Harry K
> > > > > > > I wouldn't expect the glaciers to be on land? Did yours?
> > > > > > > "Stupid is as stupid does"...:)
> > > > > > > wg
> > > > > > What?
> > > > > The claim was that the rocks were moved on land by glaciers. Glaciers
> > > > > usually hang out in water.
> > > > > wg
> > > > Wow! Just wow. Ever heard of the glaciers in the Alps? You know, the
> > > > mountains where Jean Louis Rodolphe Agassiz worked as he came out with
> > > > the Theory of Glaciation. Wa--a--y above sea level.
> > > > I once saw a beautiful hanging valley in a valley clearly carved by a
> > > > glacier well above sea level near Helvellyn.
> > "This whole region (The Lake District) is good example of glaciation
> > and has all the text book examples associated with the formation of
> > this landscape : ‘U’ shaped-valleys, lakes, moraines, alluvial fans,
> > corries. Buttermere has post glacial deposits and arêtes and razor
> > back edges. Derwent water is the shallowest lake and has drumlins and
> > eskers. Penrith and Keswick have truncated spurs. The erratics in
> > Thirlmere show the direction of the glacial flow. There are nearly 200
> > corries, which are difficult to date but probably developed over the
> > last 2 million years during the Quaternery. The moraines are also the
> > result of the last glaciation. The glacial deposit of till or boulder
> > clay was 20,000 years ago during the Devensian glaciation and is
> > therefore recent and gave rise to the drumlins. The deposits below
> > these are heavily weathered and very different from the last
> > glaciation. This is evidence of previous glaciation and is the only
> > site of two-stage glaciation in N. England. The till is quite thick
> > and in places up to 10m thick. The head of Langdale Pike has
> > moraines."
>>>> On Apr 25, 12:35 pm, Wombat<tri...@multiweb.nl> wrote:
>>>>> On Apr 25, 8:15 pm, curtjester1<curtjest...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>> On Apr 24, 9:54 pm, harry k<turnkey4...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>> On Apr 24, 8:23 am, curtjester1<curtjest...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>> On Apr 24, 8:16 am, harry k<turnkey4...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> On Apr 23, 12:53 pm, curtjester1<curtjest...@hotmail.com>
>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> From pg. 14 of Reason to Affirm a Global Flood by Humber.
>>>>>>>>>> There are
>>>>>>>>>> many links to the subject matter, but I will stick to one
>>>>>>>>>> given
>>>>>>>>>> example.
>>>>>>>>>> What could possibly have moved these rocks 300-600 miles
>>>>>>>>>> almost over
>>>>>>>>>> level ground (less than a 1degree slope? The geological forces
>>>>>>>>>> are
>>>>>>>>>> clearly not happening today....and the example: Portand
>>>>>>>>>> University
>>>>>>>>>> geologist Dr. J.E. Allen discovered quartzite boulders up to 3
>>>>>>>>>> ft. in
>>>>>>>>>> diameter on several mountains in northeast Oregon. He wrote,
>>>>>>>>>> 'no
>>>>>>>>>> nearby source has been recognized,' and suggested they were
>>>>>>>>>> carried
>>>>>>>>>> there by a 'torrential paleoriver.' Then he admitted this
>>>>>>>>>> theory was
>>>>>>>>>> 'an outrageous hypothesis' considering the wide distributions
>>>>>>>>>> and
>>>>>>>>>> great distance of transport.
>>>>>>>>> Ever hear of glaciers? Those erratics were transported there
>>>>>>>>> during
>>>>>>>>> the icea gaes as any 6th grade kid knows.
>>>>>>>>> Harry K
>>>>>>>> So your glaciers moved the rocks downard from on land?!
>>>>>>>> wg
>>>>>>> Just what other direction would you expect? Ooops, I forgot "never
>>>>>>> underestimate Grooms stupidity"
>>>>>>> Harry K
>>>>>> I wouldn't expect the glaciers to be on land? Did yours?
>>>>>> "Stupid is as stupid does"...:)
>>>>>> wg
>>>>> What?
>>>> The claim was that the rocks were moved on land by glaciers. Glaciers
>>>> usually hang out in water.
>>> No they don't. You have been lied to, and you chose to continue to believe
>>> the lies you're told.
>>> --
>>> Malte Runz
>> You seem not to be able to answer to the problem, much less a 'lie'.
>> You need to move heavy rocks down a tiny 1 % grade, 500 miles and
>> explain how they got there.
> > > > > > > > > > > > From pg. 14 of Reason to Affirm a Global Flood by Humber. There are
> > > > > > > > > > > > many links to the subject matter, but I will stick to one given
> > > > > > > > > > > > example.
> > > > > > > > > > > > What could possibly have moved these rocks 300-600 miles almost over
> > > > > > > > > > > > level ground (less than a 1degree slope? The geological forces are
> > > > > > > > > > > > clearly not happening today....and the example: Portand University
> > > > > > > > > > > > geologist Dr. J.E. Allen discovered quartzite boulders up to 3 ft. in
> > > > > > > > > > > > diameter on several mountains in northeast Oregon. He wrote, 'no
> > > > > > > > > > > > nearby source has been recognized,' and suggested they were carried
> > > > > > > > > > > > there by a 'torrential paleoriver.' Then he admitted this theory was
> > > > > > > > > > > > 'an outrageous hypothesis' considering the wide distributions and
> > > > > > > > > > > > great distance of transport.
> > > > > > > > > > > Ever hear of glaciers? Those erratics were transported there during
> > > > > > > > > > > the icea gaes as any 6th grade kid knows.
> > > > > > > > > > > Harry K
> > > > > > > > > > So your glaciers moved the rocks downard from on land?!
> > > > > > > > > > wg
> > > > > > > > > Just what other direction would you expect? Ooops, I forgot "never
> > > > > > > > > underestimate Grooms stupidity"
> > > > > > > > > Harry K
> > > > > > > > I wouldn't expect the glaciers to be on land? Did yours?
> > > > > > > > "Stupid is as stupid does"...:)
> > > > > > > > wg
> > > > > > > What?
> > > > > > The claim was that the rocks were moved on land by glaciers. Glaciers
> > > > > > usually hang out in water.
> > > > > > wg
> > > > > Wow! Just wow. Ever heard of the glaciers in the Alps? You know, the
> > > > > mountains where Jean Louis Rodolphe Agassiz worked as he came out with
> > > > > the Theory of Glaciation. Wa--a--y above sea level.
> > > > > I once saw a beautiful hanging valley in a valley clearly carved by a
> > > > > glacier well above sea level near Helvellyn.
> > > "This whole region (The Lake District) is good example of glaciation
> > > and has all the text book examples associated with the formation of
> > > this landscape : ‘U’ shaped-valleys, lakes, moraines, alluvial fans,
> > > corries. Buttermere has post glacial deposits and arêtes and razor
> > > back edges. Derwent water is the shallowest lake and has drumlins and
> > > eskers. Penrith and Keswick have truncated spurs. The erratics in
> > > Thirlmere show the direction of the glacial flow. There are nearly 200
> > > corries, which are difficult to date but probably developed over the
> > > last 2 million years during the Quaternery. The moraines are also the
> > > result of the last glaciation. The glacial deposit of till or boulder
> > > clay was 20,000 years ago during the Devensian glaciation and is
> > > therefore recent and gave rise to the drumlins. The deposits below
> > > these are heavily weathered and very different from the last
> > > glaciation. This is evidence of previous glaciation and is the only
> > > site of two-stage glaciation in N. England. The till is quite thick
> > > and in places up to 10m thick. The head of Langdale Pike has
> > > moraines."
> > Now tell us how the rocks moved.
> > wg
> Ice.
Perhaps I should have been less terse. Ice sheets kilometres thick
advancing south tore rocks from their original positions and then,
when the ice sheets retreated, the rocks were left as erratics. One
above Derwent Water is a rock type found in Scotland.
Since I'm sure your mind is closed to this, please explain isostatic
rebound. I could do with a laugh.
> > > > > > > > > From pg. 14 of Reason to Affirm a Global Flood by Humber.
> > > > > > > > > There are
> > > > > > > > > many links to the subject matter, but I will stick to one
> > > > > > > > > given
> > > > > > > > > example.
> > > > > > > > > What could possibly have moved these rocks 300-600 miles
> > > > > > > > > almost over
> > > > > > > > > level ground (less than a 1degree slope? The geological > > > > > > > > > forces
> > > > > > > > > are
> > > > > > > > > clearly not happening today....and the example: Portand
> > > > > > > > > University
> > > > > > > > > geologist Dr. J.E. Allen discovered quartzite boulders up > > > > > > > > > to 3
> > > > > > > > > ft. in
> > > > > > > > > diameter on several mountains in northeast Oregon. He > > > > > > > > > wrote,
> > > > > > > > > 'no
> > > > > > > > > nearby source has been recognized,' and suggested they > > > > > > > > > were
> > > > > > > > > carried
> > > > > > > > > there by a 'torrential paleoriver.' Then he admitted this
> > > > > > > > > theory was
> > > > > > > > > 'an outrageous hypothesis' considering the wide > > > > > > > > > distributions
> > > > > > > > > and
> > > > > > > > > great distance of transport.
> > > > > > > > Ever hear of glaciers? Those erratics were transported > > > > > > > > there
> > > > > > > > during
> > > > > > > > the icea gaes as any 6th grade kid knows.
> > > > > > > > Harry K
> > > > > > > So your glaciers moved the rocks downard from on land?!
> > > > > > > wg
> > > > > > Just what other direction would you expect? Ooops, I forgot > > > > > > "never
> > > > > > underestimate Grooms stupidity"
> > > > > > Harry K
> > > > > I wouldn't expect the glaciers to be on land? Did yours?
> > > > > "Stupid is as stupid does"...:)
> > > > > wg
> > > > What?
> > > The claim was that the rocks were moved on land by glaciers. Glaciers
> > > usually hang out in water.
> > No they don't. You have been lied to, and you chose to continue to > > believe
> > the lies you're told.
> > --
> > Malte Runz
> You seem not to be able to answer to the problem, much less a 'lie'.
> You need to move heavy rocks down a tiny 1 % grade, 500 miles and
> explain how they got there.
First I need to know if you acknowledge the fact that glaciers are found on land and not in or on open water?
Then I'll explain how they can move rocks. As if you haven't been told by many others in this thread.
> > > > > From pg. 14 of Reason to Affirm a Global Flood by Humber. There
> > > > > are
> > > > > many links to the subject matter, but I will stick to one given
> > > > > example.
> > > > > What could possibly have moved these rocks 300-600 miles almost
> > > > > over
> > > > > level ground (less than a 1degree slope? The geological forces are
> > > > > clearly not happening today....and the example: Portand
> > > > > University
> > > > > geologist Dr. J.E. Allen discovered quartzite boulders up to 3 ft.
> > > > > in
> > > > > diameter on several mountains in northeast Oregon. He wrote, 'no
> > > > > nearby source has been recognized,' and suggested they were
> > > > > carried
> > > > > there by a 'torrential paleoriver.' Then he admitted this theory
> > > > > was
> > > > > 'an outrageous hypothesis' considering the wide distributions and
> > > > > great distance of transport.
> > > > If you had taken the time to find to article J.E. Allen wrote on the
> > > > subject
> > > > and from where the creationist site mined the quotes
> > > > (http://www.oregongeology.com/pubs/og/OGv53n05.pdf p. 104-107),
> > > > you
> > > > would
> > > > have read this:
> > > > ***
> > > > The widespread, scattered distribution of the quartzite gravel
> > > > localities in the Wallowas at first suggests meandering across a
> > > > flood plain, but this seems to be ruled out by the size of the
> > > > boulders. Another possibility, that the scattered nature of the
> > > > gravel
> > > > localities indicates more than one river branch, seems to be ruled
> > > > out by the distant source of the quartzites: they must have been
> > > > deposited along the main stem of the ancestral river. This helps
> > > > justify a third hypothesis: that only one great river periodically
> > > > occupied braided channels within a broad valley.
> > > > ***
> > > > Does any of that support the biblical Flood? Follow the link and
> > > > read
> > > > the
> > > > conclusion yourself.
> > > Sure it does. Are you going to base something on a mystical river
> > > that travelled across the earth? Or as most of the evidence already
> > > shows, as massive flood gave/gives much evidence in all areas under
> > > topic, that just being one.
> > You obviously didn't follow the link I provided and read Allen's paper.
> > There is nothing mystical about the old rivers. The evidence shows,
> > clearly,
> > that rivers and streams has shaped the landscapes mentioned in the
> > article.
> You can read anything, but that doesn't mean it's correct. ...
I know. I've read parts of the bible. Plenty of things, that are not
correct!
> ... You seem
> to be obsessing. There are many non-creationist folk who believe in a
> castrophy to say make the Strait of Gibraltar and other places like
> it. I prefer people to explain their links, to see if they are just
> finding something contrary, or really understanding what they read.
> > > > Another example of how people like you are being deliberately lied
> > > > to by
> > > > con
> > > > men and science frauds with a religious agenda.
> > > Oh really? Why is it that people who depend on honesty for their
> > > beliefs and salvation and lifestyle seem 'to lie', ...
> > Because I read Allen's paper and he does not mention a
> > Biblical-Flood-like
> > event as a possible explanation for the displacement of the boulders.
> > But I
> > bet that John Hergenrather, the guy who wrote the article you quoted
> > from
> > (http://creation.com/noahs-long-distance-travelers), has read Allen's
> > paper
> > and he must have known, that he cannot interpret Allen's as support for
> > the
> > flood scenario he wants you to believe in.
> Well, its a problem that can't be solved by mere glaciers, can it?
> > You don't depend on honesty for your salvation. You depend on people who
> > are
> > willing to lie, blatantly, to you.
> There is ample evidence in all areas for a global flood, if you have
> read the threads.
Read the answers, and you'll see why I don't need to debunk your evidence
again.
> > > ... while people who
> > > don't have any higher power to answer to, have all the reason to lie
> > > by creating careers and getting their beliefs in print or media for
> > > dollar gain, seem to be 'truthers'?
> > Scientists don't have to answer to higher powers. They have to answer to
> > their peers and everybody else who has given himself the possibility to
> > be
> > able to examine "their beliefs".
> Science doesn't look for creativity or engineering trails when it
> doesn't have answers.
The first modern scientist did just that. But none of them found a creativ
ingeneer pulling the strings. The creation scenario quickly crumbled under
the weight of evidence against it.
And don't flatter your self, by claiming that the aim of science is to get
rid of gods. He's just collateral damage.
> > This is what Allen 'believes'
> > ***
> > DISCUSSION
> > What was the lower Miocene topography like? Was the uplift
> > of the Wallowas uniform, or did it tilt, arch, or dome the area?
> > Was this torrent a Snake or Columbia paleoriver? What is the
> > provenance of the gravels? Can the gradient of a torrential paleoriver
> > be distinguished from the difference in elevation resulting from
> > arching and upfaulting of the Wallowa Mountains? Can widely
> > scattered gravels be deposited by one river?
> > ***
> You can find topography, oceanography, taphononomy and all sorts of
> sciences supported in the global flood evidences.
Once there was a big flood in the US, once there was one in Europe and one
in Africa. What indicates that the events were part of a global flood?
Sometimes it rains in Beijing and sometimes in Oslo and Tierra del Fuego.
Will you characterize that as a world wide downpour?
> > And here's John Hergenrather
> > ***
> > The most likely process
> > For the waters of Noah’s Flood to recede, there had to be differential
> > sinking and rising of the earth’s crust. This is probably what Psalm
> > 104:6–8
> > is describing:
> Probably so.
Really? You have loads of questions comming. A few obvious ones:
> > ‘So You covered it with the deep as with a garment;
Did God make the water appear out of nowhere?
Or did he trigger a completely natural event, following the laws of physics
as we see them work today?
> > The waters were standing above the mountains.
> > At your rebuke they fled,
Did the water drain away into Earth's interior, did it evaporate into space?
Maybe it just vanished magically at His rebuke?
> > At the sound of Your thunder they hurried away.
> > The mountains rose; the valleys sank down
So the mountains were smaller pre flood. Hmm... Any way of telling how much
they grew? How fast or how. Added sediments? Uplift? Magic? A bit of all
three just to make sure that all bases (and the mount) are covered?
> > To the place which You established for them.’ (NASB)
> > ***
> > That's how 'answering to a higher power' compares to science.
> No, because you act like its a science book. The science it
> generalizes proves to be true by actual science.
I'm not asking you to find the answers to my questions in the Bible. I know
nothing is scientifically explained in that book. But you believe that the
description of events in the Bible is correct, and try to back it up with
scientific evidence. You're failing miserably.
Here is chance to score a few points though:
Show me some data that supports the idea, that all the flood events you
ascribe to the Flood, happened more or less simultaniously. Are any of the
current dating techniques reliable enough to give a conclusive answer in
your oppinion?
Or make a computermodel of a water covered Earth a have it, at your rebuke,
disappear gradually. Run different scenarios and see if any of them end
resembling what we actually observe today.
> > > > Honestly, you have to do better than this.
> > > We already did, if you read the thread. We seem to have found trees
> > > in strata where your 'colleagues' have said that strata was formed
> > > over millions of years. ...
> > Come on. Be 'open minded' and consider the possibility of intrusion.
> Intrustion? Like the tree decided to climb on its own, or grow on its
> own? You seem to have a major problem with it not rotting, no matter
> how it 'intruded' eh?
I shouldn't actually have used the term 'intrusion' since it has a quite
different and specific meaning in geology. But no big deal. You didn't act
on the mistake, but came up with an infantile straw man instead.
Speaking of straw men and burried trees. Nobody claims that all sedimentary
layers take "millions of years" to be laid down. There are many examples of
rapid burial af trees. Some instances have been documented in 'real time'.
Nothing mystical or magical going on I can assure you. Wush is the word.
Stop
...
> > On Apr 26, 7:20 pm, Caranx latus<aug.r...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >> On 4/26/2012 4:33 PM, curtjester1 wrote:
> >>> On Apr 26, 11:34 am, Wombat<tri...@multiweb.nl> wrote:
> >>>> On Apr 26, 6:04 pm, curtjester1<curtjest...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> >>>>> On Apr 25, 12:38 pm, Wombat<tri...@multiweb.nl> wrote:
> >>>>>> On Apr 25, 8:19 pm, curtjester1<curtjest...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> >>>>>>> On Apr 24, 9:56 pm, harry k<turnkey4...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> >>>>>>>> On Apr 24, 10:57 am, curtjester1<curtjest...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> >>>>>>>>> On Apr 24, 10:24 am, Wombat<tri...@multiweb.nl> wrote:
> >>>>>>>>>> On Apr 24, 5:23 pm, curtjester1<curtjest...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> >>>>>>>>>>> On Apr 24, 8:16 am, harry k<turnkey4...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> >>>>>>>>>>>> On Apr 23, 12:53 pm, curtjester1<curtjest...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> >>>>>>>>>>>>> From pg. 14 of Reason to Affirm a Global Flood by Humber. There are
> >>>>>>>>>>>>> many links to the subject matter, but I will stick to one given
> >>>>>>>>>>>>> example.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>> What could possibly have moved these rocks 300-600 miles almost over
> >>>>>>>>>>>>> level ground (less than a 1degree slope? The geological forces are
> >>>>>>>>>>>>> clearly not happening today....and the example: Portand University
> >>>>>>>>>>>>> geologist Dr. J.E. Allen discovered quartzite boulders up to 3 ft. in
> >>>>>>>>>>>>> diameter on several mountains in northeast Oregon. He wrote, 'no
> >>>>>>>>>>>>> nearby source has been recognized,' and suggested they were carried
> >>>>>>>>>>>>> there by a 'torrential paleoriver.' Then he admitted this theory was
> >>>>>>>>>>>>> 'an outrageous hypothesis' considering the wide distributions and
> >>>>>>>>>>>>> great distance of transport.
> >>>>>>>>>>>> Ever hear of glaciers? Those erratics were transported there during
> >>>>>>>>>>>> the icea gaes as any 6th grade kid knows.
> >>>>>>>>>>>> Harry K
> >>>>>>>>>>> So your glaciers moved the rocks downard from on land?!
> >>>>>>>>>>> wg
> >>>>>>>>>> Please translate that gibberish into English.
> >>>>>>>>> Since you seen to have a dyslexic syntax problem, you might want to
> >>>>>>>>> read up on the subject of rocks being displaced rapidly. Larry
> >>>>>>>>> Vardiman in Sleuthing Supefaults. It goes into Heart Mountain in
> >>>>>>>>> Wyoming. Dr. Stephen Austin, geologist, agrees that it is compelling
> >>>>>>>>> evidence for a catastrophic flood.
> >>>>>>>>> wg
> >>>>>>>> Who said anything about those rocks in Oregon being 'displaced
> >>>>>>>> rapidly'? They weren't.
> >>>>>>>> Harry K
> >>>>>>> The Oregon quartz arrived. There is no need for rapid displacement to
> >>>>>>> be considered per se. They had to arrive 'supernaturally' because
> >>>>>>> there is no quartz in the region anywhere to have them get there. A
> >>>>>>> tremedous flood could get them there. There is no nature reason for
> >>>>>>> them to be there besides that.
> >>>>>>> wg
> >>>>>> Wow! Just wow! An ice age need not apply? Missoula floods anyone?
> >>>>> Why would it apply?? You're talking great land impactings! Show us
> >>>>> where melting ice is going to do that? Remember, I told you about the
> >>>>> Strait of Gibraltar which needed extreme volume and force of water for
> >>>>> separating the land masses. That's not going to happen by ice...but a
> >>>>> huge flood would.
> >>>>> wg
> >>>> Yet again, your strange use of English renders your points
> >>>> incomprehensible. The Straits of Gibraltar were broken about 5
> >>>> million years ago, the last time the Med. was flooded. Was that by Ye
> >>>> Floode? Or was it by Felice?
> >>> Sounds so mythological.
> >> Take a look at a tectonic plate map sometime. One that shows the
> >> relative directions and speeds that each plate is moving. Like the one
> >> on page 114 here:
> >> The African Plate is colliding with the Eurasian Plate and one of the
> >> results of that will be that the Mediterranean will close. No flood
> >> forced the tectonic plates apart because the plates were never closer to
> >> each other than they are now.
> > Stick with your problem. Get the plates to collide, 'naturally', and
> > get them to form Mt. Everest.
> I've covered this in more than sufficient detail for anyone with the
> capacity to think. You're unreachable.
Another convenient out. Like you really have been doing
stuff...*see??* LOL. You seem to think by reciting some mantra of
creative- anything can happen when you add an eon to it- theory, that
you are really doing something. You need to take it where theory
becomes proof and then logiical.
Your mountain collidings provide no inch by inch play by play much
less them uplifting. Then you have the audacity to say 'my' top
marine fossils are being left without lower elevatory fossils. That
would be YOUR need to prove! You deliberately ran from that. Keep
running!
> > On Apr 26, 6:45 pm, Caranx latus<aug.r...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >> On 4/26/2012 12:02 PM, curtjester1 wrote:
> >>> On Apr 25, 12:35 pm, Wombat<tri...@multiweb.nl> wrote:
> >>>> On Apr 25, 8:15 pm, curtjester1<curtjest...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> >>>>> On Apr 24, 9:54 pm, harry k<turnkey4...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> >>>>>> On Apr 24, 8:23 am, curtjester1<curtjest...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> >>>>>>> On Apr 24, 8:16 am, harry k<turnkey4...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> >>>>>>>> On Apr 23, 12:53 pm, curtjester1<curtjest...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> >>>>>>>>> From pg. 14 of Reason to Affirm a Global Flood by Humber. There are
> >>>>>>>>> many links to the subject matter, but I will stick to one given
> >>>>>>>>> example.
> >>>>>>>>> What could possibly have moved these rocks 300-600 miles almost over
> >>>>>>>>> level ground (less than a 1degree slope? The geological forces are
> >>>>>>>>> clearly not happening today....and the example: Portand University
> >>>>>>>>> geologist Dr. J.E. Allen discovered quartzite boulders up to 3 ft. in
> >>>>>>>>> diameter on several mountains in northeast Oregon. He wrote, 'no
> >>>>>>>>> nearby source has been recognized,' and suggested they were carried
> >>>>>>>>> there by a 'torrential paleoriver.' Then he admitted this theory was
> >>>>>>>>> 'an outrageous hypothesis' considering the wide distributions and
> >>>>>>>>> great distance of transport.
> >>>>>>>> Ever hear of glaciers? Those erratics were transported there during
> >>>>>>>> the icea gaes as any 6th grade kid knows.
> >>>>>>>> Harry K
> >>>>>>> So your glaciers moved the rocks downard from on land?!
> >>>>>>> wg
> >>>>>> Just what other direction would you expect? Ooops, I forgot "never
> >>>>>> underestimate Grooms stupidity"
> >>>>>> Harry K
> >>>>> I wouldn't expect the glaciers to be on land? Did yours?
> >>>>> "Stupid is as stupid does"...:)
> >>>>> wg
> >>>> What?
> >>> The claim was that the rocks were moved on land by glaciers. Glaciers
> >>> usually hang out in water.
> >> Tell me something, jester, do you really enjoy having unbounded
> >> ignorance? Glaciers are on land. Icebergs are in water.
> > No, I actually like addressing the problem of rocks being transferred
> > long distances. I like how total issues are ignored for their chance
> > to be a juvenile.
> What was wrong with "Those erratics were transported there during the
> ice ages as any 6th grade kid knows"? Are you having trouble figuring
> that one out? What's the issue? The three-syllable words? How do you
> think a glacier would transport a rock? (Hint: they don't *pull* them.)
Well, when your push theory isn't too weird or laughable, give us a
call back there.
> > > > >> The claim was that the rocks were moved on land by glaciers. Glaciers
> > > > >> usually hang out in water.
> > > > > No they don't. You have been lied to, and you chose to continue to
> > > > > believe the lies you're told.
> > > > Not this time. This time it came straight from his own brain.
> > > Unwarranted assumption. With his comment on glaciers, I want some
> > > evidence he _has_ a brain.
> > > Harry K
> > 1% grade, 500 miles. Then, try Stonehenge. Maybe you'll stay away a
> > little longer, this time.
> > wg
> Slow, slow movement by a glacier over a few thousand years.
> Transport by a few thousand men over years and years.
> Or were you trying for a magical "poof"?
> Harry K
Slow movement is not going to help you out. If it reaches any height,
it will then it could roll a rock, not while next to flat. You need
to roll these rocks 500 miles, not 500 cm's! LOL. You're the one
poofing. Get some horizontal force in your 'formulae'
> > > > > > > > > > > > > From pg. 14 of Reason to Affirm a Global Flood by Humber. There are
> > > > > > > > > > > > > many links to the subject matter, but I will stick to one given
> > > > > > > > > > > > > example.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > What could possibly have moved these rocks 300-600 miles almost over
> > > > > > > > > > > > > level ground (less than a 1degree slope? The geological forces are
> > > > > > > > > > > > > clearly not happening today....and the example: Portand University
> > > > > > > > > > > > > geologist Dr. J.E. Allen discovered quartzite boulders up to 3 ft. in
> > > > > > > > > > > > > diameter on several mountains in northeast Oregon. He wrote, 'no
> > > > > > > > > > > > > nearby source has been recognized,' and suggested they were carried
> > > > > > > > > > > > > there by a 'torrential paleoriver.' Then he admitted this theory was
> > > > > > > > > > > > > 'an outrageous hypothesis' considering the wide distributions and
> > > > > > > > > > > > > great distance of transport.
> > > > > > > > > > > > Ever hear of glaciers? Those erratics were transported there during
> > > > > > > > > > > > the icea gaes as any 6th grade kid knows.
> > > > > > > > > > > > Harry K
> > > > > > > > > > > So your glaciers moved the rocks downard from on land?!
> > > > > > > > > > > wg
> > > > > > > > > > Just what other direction would you expect? Ooops, I forgot "never
> > > > > > > > > > underestimate Grooms stupidity"
> > > > > > > > > > Harry K
> > > > > > > > > I wouldn't expect the glaciers to be on land? Did yours?
> > > > > > > > > "Stupid is as stupid does"...:)
> > > > > > > > > wg
> > > > > > > > What?
> > > > > > > The claim was that the rocks were moved on land by glaciers. Glaciers
> > > > > > > usually hang out in water.
> > > > > > > wg
> > > > > > Wow! Just wow. Ever heard of the glaciers in the Alps? You know, the
> > > > > > mountains where Jean Louis Rodolphe Agassiz worked as he came out with
> > > > > > the Theory of Glaciation. Wa--a--y above sea level.
> > > > > > I once saw a beautiful hanging valley in a valley clearly carved by a
> > > > > > glacier well above sea level near Helvellyn.
> > > > "This whole region (The Lake District) is good example of glaciation
> > > > and has all the text book examples associated with the formation of
> > > > this landscape : ‘U’ shaped-valleys, lakes, moraines, alluvial fans,
> > > > corries. Buttermere has post glacial deposits and arêtes and razor
> > > > back edges. Derwent water is the shallowest lake and has drumlins and
> > > > eskers. Penrith and Keswick have truncated spurs. The erratics in
> > > > Thirlmere show the direction of the glacial flow. There are nearly 200
> > > > corries, which are difficult to date but probably developed over the
> > > > last 2 million years during the Quaternery. The moraines are also the
> > > > result of the last glaciation. The glacial deposit of till or boulder
> > > > clay was 20,000 years ago during the Devensian glaciation and is
> > > > therefore recent and gave rise to the drumlins. The deposits below
> > > > these are heavily weathered and very different from the last
> > > > glaciation. This is evidence of previous glaciation and is the only
> > > > site of two-stage glaciation in N. England. The till is quite thick
> > > > and in places up to 10m thick. The head of Langdale Pike has
> > > > moraines."
> > > Now tell us how the rocks moved.
> > > wg
> > Ice.
> Perhaps I should have been less terse. Ice sheets kilometres thick
> advancing south tore rocks from their original positions and then,
> when the ice sheets retreated, the rocks were left as erratics. One
> above Derwent Water is a rock type found in Scotland.
> Since I'm sure your mind is closed to this, please explain isostatic
> rebound. I could do with a laugh.
Show us anything with ice moving something across almost flat ground
for a long distance.
> > > > > > From pg. 14 of Reason to Affirm a Global Flood by Humber. There
> > > > > > are
> > > > > > many links to the subject matter, but I will stick to one given
> > > > > > example.
> > > > > > What could possibly have moved these rocks 300-600 miles almost
> > > > > > over
> > > > > > level ground (less than a 1degree slope? The geological forces are
> > > > > > clearly not happening today....and the example: Portand
> > > > > > University
> > > > > > geologist Dr. J.E. Allen discovered quartzite boulders up to 3 ft.
> > > > > > in
> > > > > > diameter on several mountains in northeast Oregon. He wrote, 'no
> > > > > > nearby source has been recognized,' and suggested they were
> > > > > > carried
> > > > > > there by a 'torrential paleoriver.' Then he admitted this theory
> > > > > > was
> > > > > > 'an outrageous hypothesis' considering the wide distributions and
> > > > > > great distance of transport.
> > > > > If you had taken the time to find to article J.E. Allen wrote on the
> > > > > subject
> > > > > and from where the creationist site mined the quotes
> > > > > (http://www.oregongeology.com/pubs/og/OGv53n05.pdf p. 104-107),
> > > > > you
> > > > > would
> > > > > have read this:
> > > > > ***
> > > > > The widespread, scattered distribution of the quartzite gravel
> > > > > localities in the Wallowas at first suggests meandering across a
> > > > > flood plain, but this seems to be ruled out by the size of the
> > > > > boulders. Another possibility, that the scattered nature of the
> > > > > gravel
> > > > > localities indicates more than one river branch, seems to be ruled
> > > > > out by the distant source of the quartzites: they must have been
> > > > > deposited along the main stem of the ancestral river. This helps
> > > > > justify a third hypothesis: that only one great river periodically
> > > > > occupied braided channels within a broad valley.
> > > > > ***
> > > > > Does any of that support the biblical Flood? Follow the link and
> > > > > read
> > > > > the
> > > > > conclusion yourself.
> > > > Sure it does. Are you going to base something on a mystical river
> > > > that travelled across the earth? Or as most of the evidence already
> > > > shows, as massive flood gave/gives much evidence in all areas under
> > > > topic, that just being one.
> > > You obviously didn't follow the link I provided and read Allen's paper.
> > > There is nothing mystical about the old rivers. The evidence shows,
> > > clearly,
> > > that rivers and streams has shaped the landscapes mentioned in the
> > > article.
> > You can read anything, but that doesn't mean it's correct. ...
> I know. I've read parts of the bible. Plenty of things, that are not
> correct!
Perhaps you will want to remember the greatest admired man on earth
describing the earth under water with a warned global flood, and
liking it to a warning to all in the last days. Have you tried
reading it for the correc things??
> > ... You seem
> > to be obsessing. There are many non-creationist folk who believe in a
> > castrophy to say make the Strait of Gibraltar and other places like
> > it. I prefer people to explain their links, to see if they are just
> > finding something contrary, or really understanding what they read.
> Red Herring. Back to the boulders, please.
All aspects are covered. It all has to do with dramatic movements.
You need to get something besides a slow moving icer to get a rock to
roll 500 miles on flat ground. Talk about your glacier mountain and
give us a real scenario, won't you?
> > > > > Another example of how people like you are being deliberately lied
> > > > > to by
> > > > > con
> > > > > men and science frauds with a religious agenda.
> > > > Oh really? Why is it that people who depend on honesty for their
> > > > beliefs and salvation and lifestyle seem 'to lie', ...
> > > Because I read Allen's paper and he does not mention a
> > > Biblical-Flood-like
> > > event as a possible explanation for the displacement of the boulders.
> > > But I
> > > bet that John Hergenrather, the guy who wrote the article you quoted
> > > from
> > > (http://creation.com/noahs-long-distance-travelers), has read Allen's
> > > paper
> > > and he must have known, that he cannot interpret Allen's as support for
> > > the
> > > flood scenario he wants you to believe in.
> > Well, its a problem that can't be solved by mere glaciers, can it?
Well, look at water cases then. Try to figure out the difference
between a local flood and a more dramatic one. You need to stick with
a force that will move tremendous weight over long, flat distances. I
don't look at links unless the poster is telling us what we need to
know to look at the link. You haven't done that yet.
> > > You don't depend on honesty for your salvation. You depend on people who
> > > are
> > > willing to lie, blatantly, to you.
> > There is ample evidence in all areas for a global flood, if you have
> > read the threads.
> Read the answers, and you'll see why I don't need to debunk your evidence
> again.
You read them. There is ample flood evidence from all earth sciences,
all cultures of relating the Flood, and even the people that have seen
the vessel on depicted mountain. You're new, and you haven't looked
at all the postings, I'm quite sure.
> > > > ... while people who
> > > > don't have any higher power to answer to, have all the reason to lie
> > > > by creating careers and getting their beliefs in print or media for
> > > > dollar gain, seem to be 'truthers'?
> > > Scientists don't have to answer to higher powers. They have to answer to
> > > their peers and everybody else who has given himself the possibility to
> > > be
> > > able to examine "their beliefs".
> > Science doesn't look for creativity or engineering trails when it
> > doesn't have answers.
> The first modern scientist did just that. But none of them found a creativ
> ingeneer pulling the strings. The creation scenario quickly crumbled under
> the weight of evidence against it.
Creation with a superior engineer skills have debunked evolutionary
religion in spades.
> And don't flatter your self, by claiming that the aim of science is to get
> rid of gods. He's just collateral damage.
Science uses religion as a crutch/scapegoat when it gets backed into a
corner which it does quite often.
> > > This is what Allen 'believes'
> > > ***
> > > DISCUSSION
> > > What was the lower Miocene topography like? Was the uplift
> > > of the Wallowas uniform, or did it tilt, arch, or dome the area?
> > > Was this torrent a Snake or Columbia paleoriver? What is the
> > > provenance of the gravels? Can the gradient of a torrential paleoriver
> > > be distinguished from the difference in elevation resulting from
> > > arching and upfaulting of the Wallowa Mountains? Can widely
> > > scattered gravels be deposited by one river?
> > > ***
> > You can find topography, oceanography, taphononomy and all sorts of
> > sciences supported in the global flood evidences.
> Once there was a big flood in the US, once there was one in Europe and one
> in Africa. What indicates that the events were part of a global flood?
Because of the evidence produced or left behind. Fresh fossils on
high places....and separated continents with the same evidence left on
both sides should keep you busy if you really will look into the
evidences found.
> Sometimes it rains in Beijing and sometimes in Oslo and Tierra del Fuego.
> Will you characterize that as a world wide downpour?
> > > And here's John Hergenrather
> > > ***
> > > The most likely process
> > > For the waters of Noah’s Flood to recede, there had to be differential
> > > sinking and rising of the earth’s crust. This is probably what Psalm
> > > 104:6–8
> > > is describing:
> > Probably so.
> Really? You have loads of questions comming. A few obvious ones:
Why not look for the obvious effects before looking for the detailed
causes? Hmmm.
> > > ‘So You covered it with the deep as with a garment;
> Did God make the water appear out of nowhere?
> Or did he trigger a completely natural event, following the laws of physics
> as we see them work today?
The Bible says waters above and waters below. Why don't you fill in
the blanks. No rain or rainbow prior to Noah's flood.
> > > The waters were standing above the mountains.
> > > At your rebuke they fled,
> Did the water drain away into Earth's interior, did it evaporate into space?
> Maybe it just vanished magically at His rebuke?
> > > At the sound of Your thunder they hurried away.
> > > The mountains rose; the valleys sank down
> So the mountains were smaller pre flood. Hmm... Any way of telling how much
> they grew? How fast or how. Added sediments? Uplift? Magic? A bit of all
> three just to make sure that all bases (and the mount) are
>>>> The African Plate is colliding with the Eurasian Plate and one of the
>>>> results of that will be that the Mediterranean will close. No flood
>>>> forced the tectonic plates apart because the plates were never closer to
>>>> each other than they are now.
>>> Stick with your problem. Get the plates to collide, 'naturally', and
>>> get them to form Mt. Everest.
>> I've covered this in more than sufficient detail for anyone with the
>> capacity to think. You're unreachable.
> Another convenient out. Like you really have been doing
> stuff...*see??* LOL. You seem to think by reciting some mantra of
> creative- anything can happen when you add an eon to it- theory, that
> you are really doing something. You need to take it where theory
> becomes proof and then logiical.
Why such a hard requirement? Creation science is neither theory nor proven nor logical.
> Your mountain collidings provide no inch by inch play by play much
> less them uplifting. Then you have the audacity to say 'my' top
> marine fossils are being left without lower elevatory fossils. That
> would be YOUR need to prove!
> On Apr 28, 10:34 am, Caranx latus<aug.r...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> On 4/28/2012 12:03 PM, curtjester1 wrote:
>>> On Apr 26, 6:45 pm, Caranx latus<aug.r...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> On 4/26/2012 12:02 PM, curtjester1 wrote:
>>>>> On Apr 25, 12:35 pm, Wombat<tri...@multiweb.nl> wrote:
>>>>>> On Apr 25, 8:15 pm, curtjester1<curtjest...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>> On Apr 24, 9:54 pm, harry k<turnkey4...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>> On Apr 24, 8:23 am, curtjester1<curtjest...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> On Apr 24, 8:16 am, harry k<turnkey4...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> On Apr 23, 12:53 pm, curtjester1<curtjest...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> From pg. 14 of Reason to Affirm a Global Flood by Humber. There are
>>>>>>>>>>> many links to the subject matter, but I will stick to one given
>>>>>>>>>>> example.
>>>>>>>>>>> What could possibly have moved these rocks 300-600 miles almost over
>>>>>>>>>>> level ground (less than a 1degree slope? The geological forces are
>>>>>>>>>>> clearly not happening today....and the example: Portand University
>>>>>>>>>>> geologist Dr. J.E. Allen discovered quartzite boulders up to 3 ft. in
>>>>>>>>>>> diameter on several mountains in northeast Oregon. He wrote, 'no
>>>>>>>>>>> nearby source has been recognized,' and suggested they were carried
>>>>>>>>>>> there by a 'torrential paleoriver.' Then he admitted this theory was
>>>>>>>>>>> 'an outrageous hypothesis' considering the wide distributions and
>>>>>>>>>>> great distance of transport.
>>>>>>>>>> Ever hear of glaciers? Those erratics were transported there during
>>>>>>>>>> the icea gaes as any 6th grade kid knows.
>>>>>>>>>> Harry K
>>>>>>>>> So your glaciers moved the rocks downard from on land?!
>>>>>>>>> wg
>>>>>>>> Just what other direction would you expect? Ooops, I forgot "never
>>>>>>>> underestimate Grooms stupidity"
>>>>>>>> Harry K
>>>>>>> I wouldn't expect the glaciers to be on land? Did yours?
>>>>>>> "Stupid is as stupid does"...:)
>>>>>>> wg
>>>>>> What?
>>>>> The claim was that the rocks were moved on land by glaciers. Glaciers
>>>>> usually hang out in water.
>>>> Tell me something, jester, do you really enjoy having unbounded
>>>> ignorance? Glaciers are on land. Icebergs are in water.
>>> No, I actually like addressing the problem of rocks being transferred
>>> long distances. I like how total issues are ignored for their chance
>>> to be a juvenile.
>> What was wrong with "Those erratics were transported there during the
>> ice ages as any 6th grade kid knows"? Are you having trouble figuring
>> that one out? What's the issue? The three-syllable words? How do you
>> think a glacier would transport a rock? (Hint: they don't *pull* them.)
> Well, when your push theory isn't too weird or laughable, give us a
> call back there.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > From pg. 14 of Reason to Affirm a Global Flood by Humber. There are
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > many links to the subject matter, but I will stick to one given
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > example.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > What could possibly have moved these rocks 300-600 miles almost over
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > level ground (less than a 1degree slope? The geological forces are
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > clearly not happening today....and the example: Portand University
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > geologist Dr. J.E. Allen discovered quartzite boulders up to 3 ft. in
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > diameter on several mountains in northeast Oregon. He wrote, 'no
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > nearby source has been recognized,' and suggested they were carried
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > there by a 'torrential paleoriver.' Then he admitted this theory was
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > 'an outrageous hypothesis' considering the wide distributions and
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > great distance of transport.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > Ever hear of glaciers? Those erratics were transported there during
> > > > > > > > > > > > > the icea gaes as any 6th grade kid knows.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > Harry K
> > > > > > > > > > > > So your glaciers moved the rocks downard from on land?!
> > > > > > > > > > > > wg
> > > > > > > > > > > Just what other direction would you expect? Ooops, I forgot "never
> > > > > > > > > > > underestimate Grooms stupidity"
> > > > > > > > > > > Harry K
> > > > > > > > > > I wouldn't expect the glaciers to be on land? Did yours?
> > > > > > > > > > "Stupid is as stupid does"...:)
> > > > > > > > > > wg
> > > > > > > > > What?
> > > > > > > > The claim was that the rocks were moved on land by glaciers. Glaciers
> > > > > > > > usually hang out in water.
> > > > > > > > wg
> > > > > > > Wow! Just wow. Ever heard of the glaciers in the Alps? You know, the
> > > > > > > mountains where Jean Louis Rodolphe Agassiz worked as he came out with
> > > > > > > the Theory of Glaciation. Wa--a--y above sea level.
> > > > > > > I once saw a beautiful hanging valley in a valley clearly carved by a
> > > > > > > glacier well above sea level near Helvellyn.
> > > > > "This whole region (The Lake District) is good example of glaciation
> > > > > and has all the text book examples associated with the formation of
> > > > > this landscape : ‘U’ shaped-valleys, lakes, moraines, alluvial fans,
> > > > > corries. Buttermere has post glacial deposits and arêtes and razor
> > > > > back edges. Derwent water is the shallowest lake and has drumlins and
> > > > > eskers. Penrith and Keswick have truncated spurs. The erratics in
> > > > > Thirlmere show the direction of the glacial flow. There are nearly 200
> > > > > corries, which are difficult to date but probably developed over the
> > > > > last 2 million years during the Quaternery. The moraines are also the
> > > > > result of the last glaciation. The glacial deposit of till or boulder
> > > > > clay was 20,000 years ago during the Devensian glaciation and is
> > > > > therefore recent and gave rise to the drumlins. The deposits below
> > > > > these are heavily weathered and very different from the last
> > > > > glaciation. This is evidence of previous glaciation and is the only
> > > > > site of two-stage glaciation in N. England. The till is quite thick
> > > > > and in places up to 10m thick. The head of Langdale Pike has
> > > > > moraines."
> > > > Now tell us how the rocks moved.
> > > > wg
> > > Ice.
> > Perhaps I should have been less terse. Ice sheets kilometres thick
> > advancing south tore rocks from their original positions and then,
> > when the ice sheets retreated, the rocks were left as erratics. One
> > above Derwent Water is a rock type found in Scotland.
> > Since I'm sure your mind is closed to this, please explain isostatic
> > rebound. I could do with a laugh.
> Show us anything with ice moving something across almost flat ground
> for a long distance.
> > > > > >> The claim was that the rocks were moved on land by glaciers. Glaciers
> > > > > >> usually hang out in water.
> > > > > > No they don't. You have been lied to, and you chose to continue to
> > > > > > believe the lies you're told.
> > > > > Not this time. This time it came straight from his own brain.
> > > > Unwarranted assumption. With his comment on glaciers, I want some
> > > > evidence he _has_ a brain.
> > > > Harry K
> > > 1% grade, 500 miles. Then, try Stonehenge. Maybe you'll stay away a
> > > little longer, this time.
> > > wg
> > Slow, slow movement by a glacier over a few thousand years.
> > Transport by a few thousand men over years and years.
> > Or were you trying for a magical "poof"?
> > Harry K
> Slow movement is not going to help you out. If it reaches any height,
> it will then it could roll a rock, not while next to flat. You need
> to roll these rocks 500 miles, not 500 cm's! LOL. You're the one
> poofing. Get some horizontal force in your 'formulae'
> wg
Puzzlign through that mish mash of supposed English it seems you think
those bolders were moved by rolling? Where did you get that asinine
idea?
> > > > ‘So You covered it with the deep as with a garment;
> > Did God make the water appear out of nowhere?
> > Or did he trigger a completely natural event, following the laws of physics
> > as we see them work today?
> The Bible says waters above and waters below. Why don't you fill in
> the blanks. No rain or rainbow prior to Noah's flood.
> > > > The waters were standing above the mountains.
> > > > At your rebuke they fled,
> > Did the water drain away into Earth's interior, did it evaporate into space?
> > Maybe it just vanished magically at His rebuke?
> At least the first two.
<snip>
You still haven't explained how there was any light on earth while
that canopy was up there.
Have you forgotten? "Light will not penetrate more than 200 meters of
water". That canopy had to contain a thickness of miles to produce
enough rain to aid in Yeeee Foooooddddee
> > > > > > >> The claim was that the rocks were moved on land by glaciers. Glaciers
> > > > > > >> usually hang out in water.
> > > > > > > No they don't. You have been lied to, and you chose to continue to
> > > > > > > believe the lies you're told.
> > > > > > Not this time. This time it came straight from his own brain.
> > > > > Unwarranted assumption. With his comment on glaciers, I want some
> > > > > evidence he _has_ a brain.
> > > > > Harry K
> > > > 1% grade, 500 miles. Then, try Stonehenge. Maybe you'll stay away a
> > > > little longer, this time.
> > > > wg
> > > Slow, slow movement by a glacier over a few thousand years.
> > > Transport by a few thousand men over years and years.
> > > Or were you trying for a magical "poof"?
> > > Harry K
> > Slow movement is not going to help you out. If it reaches any height,
> > it will then it could roll a rock, not while next to flat. You need
> > to roll these rocks 500 miles, not 500 cm's! LOL. You're the one
> > poofing. Get some horizontal force in your 'formulae'
> > wg
> Puzzlign through that mish mash of supposed English it seems you think
> those bolders were moved by rolling? Where did you get that asinine
> idea?
> Harry K
He clearly has never seen the scratches in Central Park or other
places where the glaciers and ice sheets moved entombed rock against
the ground.
