Great story
Velcro Kitty
their immediate environment -- no matter how "dangerous" it may appear
on the surface -- might tickle your funny bone too. Sent to me by a
friend.
Enjoy:
"Eleven weeks ago I was down in East Grinstead doing my usual tricks in
the early hours of Saturday morning giving out copies of The Way To
Happiness, doing Unconscious Person assists in shop doorways, [to
persons passed out], objectives on people high on drugs, assists on
people that were drunk. I believe that Narconon staff or volunteers
really ought to get into the local area, safepoint it, and do some
good.
So that's what I'm doing.
Suddenly I saw this huge black guy (he literally dwarfed me) who was
trying to sell some crack to 4 young girls. I barged in, sent the girls
away, and confronted the dealer. I held a Way to Happiness book up to
his face and told him he needed to read this. He was impolite (to put it
mildly) ... threatened to kick my head in, and I just told him I'd get
back up and tell him he needed to read this again. He threatened to
kill me and I said, 'That's fine. I'll haunt you for the rest of your
life, and tell you need to read this.' He then asked if I was mad
[insane] and I said more than likely. Eventually, he took the book and
read a page or 2. Then he said, 'I'm going home. I've got to read ALL
of this. And took my name and phone number.
Four weeks later, he rang me up and said, 'It's Willie.' I didn't
remember him. 'The ex-dealer. I've read TWTH and I want some more
help.' We got together and I instructed him on the Ethics book and how
to handle bad past deeds, (which consists of writing up the specifics on
one's bad deeds). He told me his life ruin which was that he was never
comfortable around people, couldn't confront them. So I started doing
Communication Drills with him 2 days a week for the next 4 weeks at his
house in a park. After he had done these Drills for some weeks, Willie
started on his write-up about past destructive actions.
Two weeks later Willie called me up and told me he'd finished his
write-up. 'I've done it!' I said 'great'. Willie said, 'But I need
some help. I'm down at the East Grinstead police station.' Oh my God,
I thought, what's he been caught doing now? And I asked what happened?
Willie had taken his 8" thick virtual book of crimes to the police -
everything he'd done! And not only that but he was taking them through
the L. Ron Hubbard book of Ethics.
The Inspector couldn't get it; he couldn't believe what he was seeing!
So I told Willie to go through the Ethics book again. Willie called back
and said that he thought the policeman was 'pretty thick' and asked,
'could I come down and help,' which I did. I took the policeman through
the sections on Suppressive Persons and Potential Trouble Sources, and
he Inspector originated that Willie had been acting like a suppressive
person. Willie said 'yes, I was, but not now. What are we going to do
now?' The Inspector had a book full of crimes and a repentant criminal.
He called his Superintendent in Tunbridge Wells, 2nd in command over
West Sussex police stations, who came down. I took him too, through the
Ethics book and had him read some of Willie's write-up.
The Super was amazed and was trying to figure out how to handle this
situation. Willie gave him his carry-around copy of the Way to
Happiness from his back pocket and said, 'You need to read this!' The
Super said, 'Yeah, maybe you're right. If it's done this for you,
maybe it can do a lot of good for others.' He opened the booklet and
read a page and was totally gob-smacked! 'It's really good stuff, it's
all common sense.' He asked Willie for his drug dealer contacts and
Willie gave them. The Super was floored at the change Willie had gone
through. 'In 38 years as a Police Officer I have never seen anything
like this. I don't really know what to do with you.' What you need to
do,' said Willie, 'is buy this Ethics book!' And he sold him one on the
spot, which the Super said he'd put in the Tunbridge Wells Police
Library. And the Inspector bought a copy for the East Grinstead Police
Library. I then took them through the Ron Mag: 'Rehabilitating a
Drugged Society.' They were very impressed and they escorted me and
Willie outside and waved us off."
Phineas Fogg
Velcro Kitty <vel...@home.com> wrote in message
news:395F9BAE...@home.com...
That is the clencher. Many people may be helped out of the mire,
initially, if, indeed
the mire where they found themselves. But I ask any Scientologist who is
experienced this:
You believe that since a nice little therapy has helped you get off drugs,
helped you to remain stable on your job, enticed you into the rapture of
group enthusiasm, it now follows that you can achieve superhuman powers
beyond which no man has ever known or
witnessed, but only written about in comic books, and sci fi? All for a
mere several hundred grand?
Phineas Fogg.
Eric Bohlman
: Here's an excellent example of what a single Scientologist can do in
: their immediate environment -- no matter how "dangerous" it may appear
: on the surface -- might tickle your funny bone too. Sent to me by a
: friend.
[snip story of how drug dealer was reformed]
: The Super was amazed and was trying to figure out how to handle this
: situation. Willie gave him his carry-around copy of the Way to
: Happiness from his back pocket and said, 'You need to read this!' The
: Super said, 'Yeah, maybe you're right. If it's done this for you,
: maybe it can do a lot of good for others.' He opened the booklet and
: read a page and was totally gob-smacked! 'It's really good stuff, it's
: all common sense.' He asked Willie for his drug dealer contacts and
: Willie gave them. The Super was floored at the change Willie had gone
: through. 'In 38 years as a Police Officer I have never seen anything
: like this. I don't really know what to do with you.' What you need to
: do,' said Willie, 'is buy this Ethics book!' And he sold him one on the
: spot, which the Super said he'd put in the Tunbridge Wells Police
: Library. And the Inspector bought a copy for the East Grinstead Police
: Library. I then took them through the Ron Mag: 'Rehabilitating a
: Drugged Society.' They were very impressed and they escorted me and
: Willie outside and waved us off."
Reminds me of the Norwegian defense minister and the Swedish royal family.
Beverly Rice
> Velcro Kitty (vel...@home.com) wrote:
> : Here's an excellent example of what a single Scientologist can do in
> : their immediate environment -- no matter how "dangerous" it may appear
> : on the surface -- might tickle your funny bone too. Sent to me by a
> : friend.
> [snip story of how drug dealer was reformed]
> : The Super was amazed and was trying to figure out how to handle this
> : situation. Willie gave him his carry-around copy of the Way to
> : Happiness from his back pocket and said, 'You need to read this!'
> Reminds me of the Norwegian defense minister and the Swedish
> royal family.
Yes, yet another "story" about TWTH (The Way To Happiness).
as you mention, Co$ told grand lies, right in one of their own
publications regarding their lie about the Norwegian defense
minister recommending TWTH (Thank you, Andreas):
http://www.xenu.net/archive/media/kosmo.html
And the lie that Co$ told about the Swedish Royal Family that
~supposedly~ endorsed a Co$ program.
And we have all see the ethics described by the Pity here on
the NG. So nice that ~someone~ could write yet another
~story~ about TWTH.
ARC for never being able to believe a Co$ rep,
Beverly
TravisSargent
Bev's post here gives us an interesting little insight into her world. She
can't just be glad or happy about the idea of someone getting off drugs --
cleaning up -- then turning around and helping others do the same, etc.
Can't even give the benefit of a doubt and express some semblance of joy in
another's recovery, etc.
No, she can only spit about it all being "lies." Very sad. But revelatory
though, isn't it? What a dark, negative view of the world she must have.
Ah but ... par for the course here I'm afraid.
Well, I suggest you gird yourself for it Bev ... because there will be a whole
lot more of these coming out of the pipeline than ever before. Sorry to see
that it makes you so depressed.
Goodboy
wrote:
=>Here's an excellent example of what a single Scientologist can do in
=>their immediate environment -- no matter how "dangerous" it may appear
=>on the surface -- might tickle your funny bone too. Sent to me by a
=>friend.
<SNIP>
It's utter rot, of course, else you'd post the names of the
police officials involved.
Goodboy
Pastor in Training
High Galactic Church of Xenu the Restored
"The court record is replete with evidence that
Scientology is nothing in reality but a vast enterprise
to extract the maximum amount of money from its adepts
by pseudo scientific theories... and to exercise a kind
of blackmail against persons who do not wish to continue
with their sect...The organization clearly is schizophrenic
and paranoid, and this bizarre combination seems to be
a reflection of its founder, L.Ron Hubbard."
Judge Paul Breckenridge, Los Angeles Superior Court
Eric Bohlman
: And the lie that Co$ told about the Swedish Royal Family that
: ~supposedly~ endorsed a Co$ program.
Not just any Co$ program: NarCONon!
TravisSargent
>On Sun, 02 Jul 2000 19:37:22 GMT, Velcro Kitty <vel...@home.com>
>wrote:
>
>=>Here's an excellent example of what a single Scientologist can do in
>=>their immediate environment -- no matter how "dangerous" it may appear
>=>on the surface -- might tickle your funny bone too. Sent to me by a
>=>friend.
><SNIP>
>It's utter rot, of course, else you'd post the names of the
>police officials involved.
Oh I see how it works -- out of privacy considerations -- not to mention other
possible problems -- we don't name the police official so that automatically
makes it all "rot." What gorgeous logic.
With a thought process like that, no wonder you sound so unhappy all the time
Goodboy. (Have you been one, btw?)
Eric Bohlman
> On Sun, 02 Jul 2000 16:35:11 -0400, Beverly Rice <dbj...@ao.net> wrote:
>>Yes, yet another "story" about TWTH (The Way To Happiness).
>>
>>as you mention, Co$ told grand lies, right in one of their own
>>publications regarding their lie about the Norwegian defense
>>minister recommending TWTH (Thank you, Andreas):
>>
>>http://www.xenu.net/archive/media/kosmo.html
>>
>>~supposedly~ endorsed a Co$ program.
>>
>>the NG. So nice that ~someone~ could write yet another
>>~story~ about TWTH.
>>
>>ARC for never being able to believe a Co$ rep,
> Bev's post here gives us an interesting little insight into her world. She
> can't just be glad or happy about the idea of someone getting off drugs --
> cleaning up -- then turning around and helping others do the same, etc.
> Can't even give the benefit of a doubt and express some semblance of joy in
> another's recovery, etc.
> No, she can only spit about it all being "lies." Very sad. But revelatory
> though, isn't it? What a dark, negative view of the world she must have.
I forgot to mention all those South African kids that the Co$ claimed to
have taught to read.
In the real (wog) world, people really are glad about someone getting off
drugs, etc.--WHEN IT REALLY HAPPENS. In the real world, when people hear
that the Norwegian Defense minister was so impressed with an LRH
publication that he ordered it for all his troops, and then discover that
he *wasn't* impressed and *didn't* order it for his troops, what they feel
isn't gladness. When they hear how the Swedish royal family praised the
Co$' NarCONon program, and then discover that the Swedish royal family
knew nothing about this supposed endorsement, which used stolen video
footage of the Swedish royal family, their reaction isn't gladness. When
they hear that LRH Tech[tm] was used to teach hundreds of thousands of
South African kids to read, and then discover that the educational
authorities have no knowledge of this happening, and no evidence of a
sudden surge in literacy, they don't feel glad for the non-existent
children. Instead they feel anger. Anger that an organization like the
Co$ would try to grab credit for positive things that never happened, and
refuse blame for negative things that *did* happen.
If you really wanted to be honest, you could claim that thanks to
Scientology, neither Noah Lottick nor Lisa McPherson nor Ashlee Shaner nor
Janice Myer will ever have any drug problems. You'd be telling the
truth. A truth that most wogs would find rather unpleasant, but the truth
nonetheless.
ivanhoe
>comfortable around people, couldn't confront them. So I started doing
>Communication Drills with him 2 days a week for the next 4 weeks at his
>house in a park. After he had done these Drills for some weeks, Willie
>started on his write-up about past destructive actions.
---- A drug dealer who couldn't confront people? Bullshit!
I'd like to see the first pages of a book that makes people "totally
gob-smacked".
Please tell me the cops in England aren't that stupid.
Gwen Jones Exposed
Here is a little bit of complete BS from Gwen Jones:
Message-ID: <395F9BAE...@home.com>
From: Velcro Kitty <vel...@home.com>
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Here's an excellent example of what a single Scientologist can do in
their immediate environment -- no matter how "dangerous" it may appear
on the surface -- might tickle your funny bone too. Sent to me by a
friend.
Enjoy:
one's bad deeds). He told me his life ruin which was that he was never
comfortable around people, couldn't confront them. So I started doing
Communication Drills with him 2 days a week for the next 4 weeks at his
house in a park. After he had done these Drills for some weeks, Willie
started on his write-up about past destructive actions.
Two weeks later Willie called me up and told me he'd finished his
write-up. 'I've done it!' I said 'great'. Willie said, 'But I need
some help. I'm down at the East Grinstead police station.' Oh my God,
I thought, what's he been caught doing now? And I asked what happened?
Willie had taken his 8" thick virtual book of crimes to the police -
everything he'd done! And not only that but he was taking them through
the L. Ron Hubbard book of Ethics.
The Inspector couldn't get it; he couldn't believe what he was seeing!
So I told Willie to go through the Ethics book again. Willie called back
and said that he thought the policeman was 'pretty thick' and asked,
'could I come down and help,' which I did. I took the policeman through
the sections on Suppressive Persons and Potential Trouble Sources, and
he Inspector originated that Willie had been acting like a suppressive
person. Willie said 'yes, I was, but not now. What are we going to do
now?' The Inspector had a book full of crimes and a repentant criminal.
He called his Superintendent in Tunbridge Wells, 2nd in command over
West Sussex police stations, who came down. I took him too, through the
Ethics book and had him read some of Willie's write-up.
The Super was amazed and was trying to figure out how to handle this
situation. Willie gave him his carry-around copy of the Way to
TravisSargent
>>). He told me his life ruin which was that he was never
>>comfortable around people, couldn't confront them. So I started doing
>>Communication Drills with him 2 days a week for the next 4 weeks at his
>>house in a park. After he had done these Drills for some weeks, Willie
>>started on his write-up about past destructive actions.
>
>---- A drug dealer who couldn't confront people? Bullshit!
> I'd like to see the first pages of a book that makes people "totally
>gob-smacked".
>Please tell me the cops in England aren't that stupid.
Haven't read much on this subject have you? He had set up a sort of "other
identity" which allowed him to not have to confront people. The "tough guy"
did it all. HE didn't.
But then when he (probably) discovered HE wasn't the "tough guy," all that
changed.
Get it now?
chee...@pop.phnx.uswest.net
afford it. What a bunch of hogwash. I have literally heard the EXACT SAME
STORY with the Bible instead of the way to deludedness - down to the "if
you kill me I'll haunt you and say read this." Do these people watch TBN
just to swipe their crappy success stories?
Iain Rowe Industries
> Velcro Kitty wrote:
> >
> > Willie had taken his 8" thick virtual book of crimes to the police -
> > everything he'd done! And not only that but he was taking them through
I thought he was going to say
"And then the policemen started writing down the wrongs they had committed
too!" lol :-)
Iain
TravisSargent
>On Sun, 02 Jul 2000 19:37:22 GMT, Velcro Kitty <vel...@home.com> wrote:
>
><snip the unbelievable bullshit>
>
><end of what Gwen posted>
>
>The fact that Gwen thinks this is a great story kind of explains why
scientologists think
>BE was a great story.
>
>Or maybe it must be the drugs they use in dosages large enough to seriously
harm various
>body organs.
What's WRONG with the story? This was just a simple, fun little story about
helping others. The fact that you would find fault with it says a lot about
you.
So then you will kindly explain what you find so wrong with helping others as
expressed in this little story, won't you?
Hartley Patterson
> Velcro Kitty <vel...@home.com> quoted a friend:
> > "Eleven weeks ago I was down in East Grinstead doing my usual tricks in
> > the early hours of Saturday morning giving out copies of The Way To
> > Happiness,
[snip]
> > And he sold him one on the
> > spot, which the Super said he'd put in the Tunbridge Wells Police
> > Library. And the Inspector bought a copy for the East Grinstead Police
> > Library.
Hm. Don't mind if we check on the veracity of this do you Ms Kitty?
--
"I think of my beautiful city in flames"
http://village.vossnet.co.uk/h/hpttrsn/
A medieval spreadsheet, enturbulating entheta, how to outrun
Thread and some riddles preciousss....
Dave Bird
Hash: SHA1
In<395F9BAE...@home.com>, Velcro Kitty <vel...@home.com> writes:
>Here's an excellent example of what a single Scientologist can do in
>their immediate environment -- no matter how "dangerous" it may appear
>on the surface -- might tickle your funny bone too. Sent to me by a
>friend.
>
>Enjoy:
To me this is an utter and complete mickey-take against Scn. A few
clues: East Grinstead is a small town in a rich countryside area,
sort of like New Hampshire (we are not talking about the centre
of Birmingham/Pittsburgh). While you do find the occasional crazy
or drunken street person wandering about, it is quite rare. However
the header looks exactly like Gwen's earlier articles attacking Greg.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
This may provide some clue. I suspect the most likely way it
could have happened is that (a) Gwen's account was closed
for misconduct and (b) Greg then got an @home account with
that "unused" account name.
In article<020720001408337149%velcro...@home.com>, Gwen Jones Exposed
<velcro...@home.com> writes:
>
> ARS has a true "Sour Puss", namely Gwen Jones aka Velcro Kitty.
>
> Now 'Velcro' claims, despite trying to hide her gaff, not to be
>afraid her real idientity as Gwen Jones has been exposed by her own
>actions. I don't doubt that at all.
> She knows darn well the only thing she has to worry about is the
>police.
>
> However, I do think Gwen Jones is embarassed to have her real name
>linked with the often vicious, spiteful and defaming things she posts.
> Therefore I hope to make sure that historical records of the net
>will link "Gwen Jones" with the venomous content of "Velcro Kitty"
>postings.
>
> The 'Sour Puss Project' will repost much of "Velcro's" vintage and
>current spewings under the nom de plume of: "Gwen Jones Exposed".
> The SP Project will try to edit out only that content which is
>illegal or a defaming linkage.
>
>
>Best,
>
>
>Gregg Hagglund posting as "Gwen Jones Exposed"
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
- -- . : : ,; . : ' ___.
uno, due, tre, FUEGO! .:. .:. .:': :' .:':' :. . : (") #oH|
' :' : :' : .::. H_ ~~~|
< > __ ,;;,. \\::// R_) |
'-|"""(") {__}::===== ....'''' ' ' ' ___..\||/....L\. ...|
____||--|_'--/__\___ '' .--''':::::::::::::::::::::
\ / /////////////S.Coronado/////
;'^';-._.-;'^';-._.-;'^';-._.-;'^';-._;'^';-._.-;'^';-._.-;'^';-._.-;'^
LRon Hubbard is shelled by goats in hell. www.xemu.demon.co.uk/clam/
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mimus
>>). He told me his life ruin which was that he was never
>>comfortable around people, couldn't confront them. So I started doing
>>Communication Drills with him 2 days a week for the next 4 weeks at his
>>house in a park. After he had done these Drills for some weeks, Willie
>>started on his write-up about past destructive actions.
>
>---- A drug dealer who couldn't confront people? Bullshit!
> I'd like to see the first pages of a book that makes people "totally
>gob-smacked".
>Please tell me the cops in England aren't that stupid.
Relax, these weren't MEST cops.
I saw
many people
reduced to
incoherent babbling,
stripping off clothes,
crawling around on the ground,
banging heads, limbs and other body parts
against furniture and walls,
barking,
losing all sense of one's identity
and intense and persistent suicidal ideation.
--Declaration of Andre Tabayoyon
I'm an OT.--Lisa McPherson
If you imagine 40-50 Scientologists
posting on the Internet every few days,
we'll just run the SP's right off the system.
It will be quite simple, actually.
--Elaine Siegel, OSA INT (1996)
Case 5/BTLA/SP1
spam>@home.com JB
> their immediate environment -- no matter how "dangerous" it may appear
> on the surface -- might tickle your funny bone too. Sent to me by a
> friend.
<snip>
First off, let me say that I truly believe this to be a total crock of shit.
<snip>
> Happiness, doing Unconscious Person assists in shop doorways, [to
> persons passed out], objectives on people high on drugs, assists on
> people that were drunk.
I live in a MAJOR metropolitan area, and have dealt with people like this on
an informal basis for 20 or so years.
This is a very good way to get yourself mugged, or worse. I defy anyone,
$cientologist or not, to go out into that kind of area and give a *touch
assist* to ANYONE lying on a sidewalk, alley, etc.
I wouldn't attempt to touch one of these people for all of the OT levels on
this world - or any of L. Rons imaginary other worlds of Xenu.
NOT because of worry of disease, but of worry to the body. MY body. You can
get seriously dead, fast. Anyone that attempts this is a fool.
>Suddenly I saw this huge black guy (he literally dwarfed me) who was
> trying to sell some crack to 4 young girls. I barged in, sent the girls
> away, and confronted the dealer."
Let me state again CATEGORICALLY, that this is an *excellent* way to
suddenly and violently *end cycle*. I personally have been assulted for
merely walking down the wrong *street*. People like this do not take kindly
to people invading thier turf, no exceptions.
>Eventually, he took the book and
> read a page or 2. Then he said, 'I'm going home. I've got to read ALL
> of this. And took my name and phone number."
This is utter nonsense, and it shows. The reason most of these people (and I
mean ALL street people, so don't try to twist this) are there in the first
place is because they never stayed in school long enough to be able to get a
normal job. The monetary gains were too impressive, so they sold out to the
quick dollar signs. As a DIRECT consequence of this poor choice, most can't
communicate well, let alone be able to begin to read OR comprehend any of
the garbage Hubbard managed to spout through the drugs, parties,and years.
(As regards sentence #4 above, in my quoting) It is, again, an excellent way
to rather quickly and spectacularly end a life that might otherwise be
somewhat promising - given that they might eventually be released from the
bondage of $cientology. If this statement is true, the teller of the tale is
in need of some SERIOUS psychiatric help. Why anyone would give thier name
and phone number to a street dealer is indicative of insanity.
Folks, What I DIDN'T see in all of the responses to this rather blatant
attempt to bullshit rational persons, is the pretty much obvious lack of
concern on the part of the police.
Now, I don't know what the area is like where the person (that supposedly
WROTE this missive) is from, but, and I again quote from the article written
by the Ilustrious (sp?) velcro kitty, the person in questions friend;
> Two weeks later Willie called me up and told me he'd finished his
> write-up. 'I've done it!' I said 'great'. Willie said, 'But I need
> some help. I'm down at the East Grinstead police station.' Oh my God,
> I thought, what's he been caught doing now? And I asked what happened?
> Willie had taken his 8" thick virtual book of crimes to the police -
> everything he'd done! And not only that but he was taking them through
> the L. Ron Hubbard book of Ethics.
>
> The Inspector couldn't get it; he couldn't believe what he was seeing!
Indeed.
If I had the chronicles of a known drug dealer, all of his crimes, dealings,
illegal doings - I would'nt believe it either.
BUT WAIT - THERE"S MORE!!!!!!!
>Willie gave him his carry-around copy of the Way to
> Happiness from his back pocket and said, 'You need to read this!' The
> Super said, 'Yeah, maybe you're right. If it's done this for you,
> maybe it can do a lot of good for others.' He opened the booklet and
> read a page and was totally gob-smacked! 'It's really good stuff, it's
> all common sense.'
Right.
A rational (they're trained to spot garbage) police officer is, after a
matter of only a few minutes, and at that - after only a page or two of this
miraculous book - is supposed to let a confessed, wanted (by virtue of his
hand-written confession - that is in the police officers HANDS)
criminal go free with the thought that "It's really good stuff, it's all
commen sense."
Uh huh.
Hubbard wrote very LITTLE in his lifetime that was even *remotely* related
to common sense. A great deal was pure drivel.
L.Ron Hubbard was nothing more than a third rate hack writer who, while now
and then having a rational train of thought, for the most part wanted
nothing more than to have money, more money, and make more people make more
money.
For him.
He also had some SERIOUS delusions of grandeur.
L. Ron Hubbard was perhaps the largest (pun intended) con man in his day.
"He asked Willie for his drug dealer contacts and
> Willie gave them. The Super was floored at the change Willie had gone
> through. 'In 38 years as a Police Officer I have never seen anything
> like this. I don't really know what to do with you.'
Bullshit.
If ANY police officer has a personal, up to date, hand written chronicle of
your crimes that you are freely and willingly giving to him - he will do
his/her duty, and arrest you on the spot.
It's called a "confession". Especially for crimes of this nature.
Not only that, but if he gave up his suppliers, his life is/was in EXTREME
jeapordy - and he would KNOW that. He wouldn't last more than a day or
two-week at the most. They KILL you for the *smallest* of infringements
(somewhat like $cientology, only they SUE for the smallest infringments).
These (street) people are in it for the money and drugs - possibly the small
amount of power it gives them over thier *customers*, and that's about it.
There isn't ONE of them that wouldn't give up an upper echelon pusher for
anything less than a gun to his/her head, or thier next fix, and THEN you
can't trust what they say.
You do not wash away years of abuse at the hands of both authority and a
poor upbringing with two pages from a book.
Any book.
Period.
So, I'm calling you on this, Velcro Kitty. I believe you are and somewhat
dimwitted to believe that people are going to fall for this kind of garbage.
Please, prove me wrong by posting names, dates, persons involved, locations,
ad naseum. They must be verifiable. I will accept nothing less.
You can't, can you ?
Hmmmm?
Jack Barber
Iain Rowe Industries
> If this statement is true, the teller of the tale is
> in need of some SERIOUS psychiatric help. Why anyone would give thier name
> and phone number to a street dealer is indicative of insanity.
Well, that person may have been new to America. Many Europeans don't realize the
problems we have here in America. I cite the case of two Swedish girls in their
early 20s who innocently hitchhiked along the California coast some years ago.
Many people warned them against this, saying America was much more dangerous
than Sweden. People actually pulled over on the road to tell them this is not
something they can do here.
In a short time, both girls disappeared. The sadness experienced by both girls'
parents cannot be described in words. I think the girls bodies were found some
years later.
Roland
>
> Here's an excellent example of what a single Scientologist can do in
> their immediate environment -- no matter how "dangerous" it may appear
> on the surface -- might tickle your funny bone too. Sent to me by a
> friend.
>
> Enjoy:
>
> "Eleven weeks ago I was down in East Grinstead doing my usual tricks in
> the early hours of Saturday morning giving out copies of The Way To
> Happiness, doing Unconscious Person assists in shop doorways, [to
> persons passed out], objectives on people high on drugs, assists on
Look you stupid bitch - "East Grinstead". Do you know what that place is
like? It is like Sleepy Hollow only quieter. Nobody is passed out in
doorways on a Sunday morning.
> people that were drunk. I believe that Narconon staff or volunteers
> really ought to get into the local area, safepoint it, and do some
> good.
> So that's what I'm doing.
This is a fantasy.
> Suddenly I saw this huge black guy (he literally dwarfed me) who was
> trying to sell some crack to 4 young girls. I barged in, sent the girls
You don't get people selling crack in East Grinstead. You get very few
black people for that matter. I've never seen one there who wasn't
wearing a blue uniform.
> away, and confronted the dealer. I held a Way to Happiness book up to
> his face and told him he needed to read this. He was impolite (to put it
> mildly) ... threatened to kick my head in, and I just told him I'd get
> back up and tell him he needed to read this again. He threatened to
> kill me and I said, 'That's fine. I'll haunt you for the rest of your
> life, and tell you need to read this.' He then asked if I was mad
> [insane] and I said more than likely. Eventually, he took the book and
> read a page or 2. Then he said, 'I'm going home. I've got to read ALL
> of this. And took my name and phone number.
>
> Four weeks later, he rang me up and said, 'It's Willie.' I didn't
> remember him. 'The ex-dealer. I've read TWTH and I want some more
> help.' We got together and I instructed him on the Ethics book and how
> to handle bad past deeds, (which consists of writing up the specifics on
> one's bad deeds). He told me his life ruin which was that he was never
Good, your "Church" can blackmail him now.
This is a total fabrication, all the less believable because it
describes East Grinstead. But then so is the life of L. Ron Hubbard and
so are all the claims about the State of Clear and OT so adding more
lies to the heap hardly makes a difference and I am sure Hubbard would
have approved.
And as for a policeman reading Hubbard's "ethics" book. What would he
have thought of the chapter on moving off a position of power and
collecting blackmail information on people and going to live in
Balgradia and bribing the police? You people are totally stupid and
deluded.
Roland
--
"I notice that we all believe that Venus has a methane atmosphere and
is unlivable. I almost got run down by a freight locomotive the other
day -- didn't look very uncivilized to me." - L. Ron Hubbard,
"Between Lives Implants" lecture, SHSBC #317. 23 July 1963.
http://www.xs4all.nl/~xemu/rams/Venusloc.ram
roger gonnet
Eric Bohlman <eboh...@netcom.com> a écrit dans le message :
8jod4s$kgm$2...@nntp9.atl.mindspring.net...
> Beverly Rice (dbj...@ao.net) wrote:
> : And the lie that Co$ told about the Swedish Royal Family that
> : ~supposedly~ endorsed a Co$ program.
>
looks rather like even when non-OTs there were supposing they were the ones
having stopped the gulf war...
Oatees wins, great. Total delusion is the non-awarenes to lesser-awareness
scale level. Great!
roger
>
Ed
Grinstead, in England, which is a pleasant town of a few thousand out
in the country, a couple of miles from Saint Hill, which was LRH's
estate and former worldwide C of S headquarters. It isn't from some
nasty city slum.
I suspect there is exaggeration in the part about how much the guy
regularly salvaged drunks and druggies, but I know in the old days
there were a number of Scns who did stuff like that and were very
confident in their ability to handle any tough character easily by
coming from a place of love.
I could believe the part about Willie, the drug dealer, just because
it is so unusual that it's hard to imagine someone making it up. In C
of S PR stories they always have to be able to defend the truth of a
story. If the Willie story were false, they would be open to some
enemy getting the police to swear that the whole thing was phony; so
you can bet that the PR guys are confident that they can produce
Willie or people in the police who can swear to the facts.
Ed
Iain Rowe Industries wrote:
>
> "JB
>
> > If this statement is true, the teller of the tale is
> > in need of some SERIOUS psychiatric help. Why anyone would give thier name
> > and phone number to a street dealer is indicative of insanity.
>
Goodboy
(TravisSargent) wrote:
=>On Sun, 02 Jul 2000 21:06:20 GMT, Goodboy <goo...@somewhere.com> wrote:
=>
=>>On Sun, 02 Jul 2000 19:37:22 GMT, Velcro Kitty <vel...@home.com>
=>>wrote:
=>>
=>>=>Here's an excellent example of what a single Scientologist can do in
=>>=>their immediate environment -- no matter how "dangerous" it may appear
=>>=>on the surface -- might tickle your funny bone too. Sent to me by a
=>>=>friend.
=>><SNIP>
=>>It's utter rot, of course, else you'd post the names of the
=>>police officials involved.
=>
=>Oh I see how it works -- out of privacy considerations -- not to mention other
=>possible problems -- we don't name the police official so that automatically
=>makes it all "rot." What gorgeous logic.
=>
=>With a thought process like that, no wonder you sound so unhappy all the time
=>Goodboy. (Have you been one, btw?)
Another reply from travis. The old travis always ignored me. I'm
flattered.
What "privacy" considerations are you talking about, travis? A
high ranking police official decides to ignore confessions of
past crimes written in the hand of the self accusing perpetrator?
That's a public act by a public official in direct contravention
of the public law. I believe it's rot because I believe no sane
official, public or otherwise, would take such a chance with his
job and his family's welfare. Not on the strength of a brief skim
read of a book written by a man generally believed in the UK to
be a nutter. Can you imagine some hardnosed cop letting a hood
who's just confessed to a string of unsolved crimes go free
because the perp says he's been changed by reading a book? Even
the Bible? Gimme a break here, OK?
And yes, I've been a very goodboy. Always am. That's why I'm
here.
Goodboy (and I mean it)
barb
--
barb
"Every week, every month, every year, every decade and now
every century, Scientology does wierd and stupid things
to damage its own reputation."
-Steve Zadarnowski
http://www.xenu.net
http://www.xenutv.com (see live Scientologists in their natural state!)
Eric Bohlman
: I could believe the part about Willie, the drug dealer, just because
: it is so unusual that it's hard to imagine someone making it up. In C
: of S PR stories they always have to be able to defend the truth of a
: story. If the Willie story were false, they would be open to some
: enemy getting the police to swear that the whole thing was phony; so
: you can bet that the PR guys are confident that they can produce
: Willie or people in the police who can swear to the facts.
It didn't stop them from making up similar stories about the Norwegian
defense minister, the Swedish royal family, or the South African
education ministry, did it? And yet all of those stories were exposed as
false with a trivial amount of research.
Or how about Ken Hoden's story about why Stacey Myer was in the
transformer vault?
©Anti-Cult® - www.users.wineasy.se/noname/
In Message-ID: <395F9BAE...@home.com>
From: Velcro Kitty <vel...@home.com>.
Organization: @Home Network.
Wrote on the subject: Great story:
>Here's an excellent example of what a single Scientologist can do in
>their immediate environment -- no matter how "dangerous" it may appear
>on the surface -- might tickle your funny bone too. Sent to me by a
>friend.
[snipped faked big-win story from the UFO-clam company]
Oh, what a vivid imagination these clam clowns have. Of course this
story never happened, but on the other hand, that doesn't mean shit to
the people that believe in this:
I'm going to tell you a story. Are you sitting comfortably? Right, then
I'll begin.
Once upon a time (75 million years ago to be more precise) there was an
alien galactic ruler named Xemu. Xemu was in charge of all the planets
in this part of the galaxy including our own planet Earth, except in
those days it was called Teegeeack.
Now Xemu had a problem. All of the 76 planets he controlled were
over-populated. Each planet had on average 178 billion people. He wanted
to get rid of all the overpopulation so he had a plan.
Xemu took over complete control with the help of renegades to defeat the
good people and the Loyal Officers. Then with the help of psychiatrists
he called in billions of people for income tax inspections where they
were instead given injections of alcohol and glycol mixed to paralyse
them. Then they were put into space planes that looked exactly like DC8s
(except they had rocket motors instead of propellers).
These DC8 space planes then flew to planet Earth where the paralysed
people were stacked around the bases of volcanoes in their hundreds of
billions. When they had finished stacking them around then H-bombs were
lowered into the volcanoes. Xemu then detonated all the H-bombs at the
same time and everyone was killed.
The story doesn't end there though. Since everyone has a soul (called a
"thetan" in this story) then you have to trick souls into not coming
back again. So while the hundreds of billions of souls were being blown
around by the nuclear winds he had special electronic traps that caught
all the souls in electronic beams (the electronic beams were sticky like
fly-paper).
After he had captured all these souls he had them packed into boxes and
taken to a few huge cinemas. There all the souls had to spend days
watching special 3D motion pictures that told them what life should be
like and many confusing things. In this film they were shown false
pictures and told they were God, The Devil and Christ. In the story this
process is called "implanting".
When the films ended and the souls left the cinema these souls started
to stick together because since they had all seen the same film they
thought they were the same people. They clustered in groups of a few
thousand. Now because there were only a few living bodies left they
stayed as clusters and inhabited these bodies.
As for Xemu, the Loyal Officers finally overthrew him and they locked
him away in a mountain on one of the planets. He is kept in by a
force-field powered by an eternal battery and Xemu is still alive today.
That is the end of the story. And so today everyone is full of these
clusters of souls called "body thetans". And if we are to be a free soul
then we have to remove all these "body thetans" and pay lots of money to
do so. And the only reason people believe in God and Christ was because
it was in the film their body thetans saw 75 million years ago.
Well what did you think of that story?
What? You thought it was a stupid story?
Well so do we. Unfortunately this stupid story is the core belief in the
religion known as Scientology.* If people knew about this story then
most people would never get involved in it. This story is told to you
when you reach one of their secret levels called OT III. After that you
are supposed to telepathically communicate with these body thetans to
make them go away. You have to pay a lot of money to get to this level
and do this (or you have to work very hard for the organisation on
extremely low pay for many years).
We are telling you this story as a warning. If you become involved with
Scientology then we would like you to do so with your eyes open and
fully aware of the sort of material it contains.
Most of the Scientologists that work in their Dianetics* centres and so
called "Churches" of Scientology do not know this story since they are
not allowed to hear it until they reach the secret "upper" levels of
Scientology. It may take them many years before they reach this level if
they ever do. The ones who do know it are forced to keep it a secret and
not tell it to those people who are joining Scientology.
Now you have read this you know their big secret. Don't let us put you
off joining though.
* Dianetics and Scientology are trademarks of the Religious Technology
Centre. This document is not connected with that organisation in any
way.
--------------------------------------------------------------------
--
---------------------------------------------------------------------
++++++++++++ SACRED CULT SCRIPTURE +++++++++++++
From "Dianetics: The Mein Kampf of Scientology:
"Perhaps at some distant date only the unaberrrated person will be
granted civil rights before law. Perhaps the goal will be reached at
some future time when only the unaberrated person can attain to and
benefit from citizenship. These are desirable goals..."
(Dianetics, book 3, chapter 10)
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
---------------------------------------------------------------------
******* Body thetans? We don't need no stinking Body Thetans! *******
*********** http://www.users.wineasy.se/noname/index.htm ************
IRC #Scientology JavaChat http://www.users.wineasy.se/noname/irc.html
* Multimedia: http://www.users.wineasy.se/noname/multimed/index.htm *
******** The.Galacti...@ThePentagon.com (Anti-Cult) ********
---------------------------------------------------------------------
Sparky
wrote:
>Here's an excellent example of what a single Scientologist can do in
>their immediate environment -- no matter how "dangerous" it may appear
>on the surface -- might tickle your funny bone too. Sent to me by a
>friend.
>
<snip>
Bullshit.
TravisSargent
Well then Goodboy -- you just go right on believing what fits your idea of what
oughta be ... AND being a goodboy! Attaboy!
TravisSargent
wrote:
>Velcro Kitty wrote:
>>
>> Here's an excellent example of what a single Scientologist can do in
>> their immediate environment -- no matter how "dangerous" it may appear
>> on the surface -- might tickle your funny bone too. Sent to me by a
>> friend.
>>
>> Enjoy:
>>
>> "Eleven weeks ago I was down in East Grinstead doing my usual tricks in
>> the early hours of Saturday morning giving out copies of The Way To
>> Happiness, doing Unconscious Person assists in shop doorways, [to
>> persons passed out], objectives on people high on drugs, assists on
>
>
>Look you stupid bitch - "East Grinstead". Do you know what that place is
>like? It is like Sleepy Hollow only quieter. Nobody is passed out in
>doorways on a Sunday morning.
>
>
>> people that were drunk. I believe that Narconon staff or volunteers
>> really ought to get into the local area, safepoint it, and do some
>> good.
>> So that's what I'm doing.
>
>This is a fantasy.
>
>> Suddenly I saw this huge black guy (he literally dwarfed me) who was
>> trying to sell some crack to 4 young girls. I barged in, sent the girls
>
>You don't get people selling crack in East Grinstead. You get very few
>black people for that matter. I've never seen one there who wasn't
>wearing a blue uniform.
>
>> away, and confronted the dealer. I held a Way to Happiness book up to
>> his face and told him he needed to read this. He was impolite (to put it
>> mildly) ... threatened to kick my head in, and I just told him I'd get
>> back up and tell him he needed to read this again. He threatened to
>> kill me and I said, 'That's fine. I'll haunt you for the rest of your
>> life, and tell you need to read this.' He then asked if I was mad
>> [insane] and I said more than likely. Eventually, he took the book and
>> read a page or 2. Then he said, 'I'm going home. I've got to read ALL
>> of this. And took my name and phone number.
>>
>> Four weeks later, he rang me up and said, 'It's Willie.' I didn't
>> remember him. 'The ex-dealer. I've read TWTH and I want some more
>> help.' We got together and I instructed him on the Ethics book and how
>> to handle bad past deeds, (which consists of writing up the specifics on
>> one's bad deeds). He told me his life ruin which was that he was never
>
>Good, your "Church" can blackmail him now.
>
>This is a total fabrication, all the less believable because it
>describes East Grinstead. But then so is the life of L. Ron Hubbard and
>so are all the claims about the State of Clear and OT so adding more
>lies to the heap hardly makes a difference and I am sure Hubbard would
>have approved.
>
>And as for a policeman reading Hubbard's "ethics" book. What would he
>have thought of the chapter on moving off a position of power and
>collecting blackmail information on people and going to live in
>Balgradia and bribing the police? You people are totally stupid and
>deluded.
>
>
>Roland
Roland's all worked up again. But then what else is new?
keshet
> Here's an excellent example of what a single Scientologist can do in
> their immediate environment -- no matter how "dangerous" it may appear
> on the surface -- might tickle your funny bone too. Sent to me by a
> friend.
Why is this funny? Do you find the author's furtherance of black
stereotypes amusing? Personally, I think it's a damned sad statement
on the Co$'s cultural ignorance.
> Enjoy:
>
> "Eleven weeks ago I was down in East Grinstead doing my usual tricks in
> the early hours of Saturday morning giving out copies of The Way To
> Happiness, doing Unconscious Person assists in shop doorways, [to
> persons passed out], objectives on people high on drugs, assists on
> people that were drunk. I believe that Narconon staff or volunteers
> really ought to get into the local area, safepoint it, and do some
> good.
> So that's what I'm doing.
>
> Suddenly I saw this huge black guy (he literally dwarfed me) who was
> trying to sell some crack to 4 young girls. I barged in, sent the girls
> away, and confronted the dealer. I held a Way to Happiness book up to
> his face and told him he needed to read this. He was impolite (to put it
> mildly) ... threatened to kick my head in, and I just told him I'd get
> back up and tell him he needed to read this again. He threatened to
> kill me and I said, 'That's fine. I'll haunt you for the rest of your
> life, and tell you need to read this.' He then asked if I was mad
> [insane] and I said more than likely. Eventually, he took the book and
> read a page or 2. Then he said, 'I'm going home. I've got to read ALL
> of this. And took my name and phone number.
"Large black drug dealer selling crack to little white girls."
How do I know the little girls were white? Because their race is
not mentioned but the dealer's is. Assuming, *only* for the sake of
argument, that this story is true, how does the dealer's race have
any relevancy? Isn't this about the triumph of Scientology over
evil?
Aren't white dealers just as evil? In a word, No.
The author invokes two racist stereotypes at once to emphasize his
or her heroism--a true "white" knight charging onto the scene to
rescue the innocents. [Just an aside, but what were these 4 young
girls doing in this neighborhood full of druggies, drunks and
people passed out in doorways, in the early hours of Saturday
morning?]
The author uses the black crack dealer stereotype to raise the
perceived danger level of the situation. Afterall, as dangerous
as crack and crack dealers may be, a big black male makes it so
much scarier, doesn't he? It just wouldn't be the same if it was
some racially unidentified person, a female, or even a "huge white
guy". The point to making this character "huge" and "black" is to
emphasize the difference between good/author and evil/dealer,
thereby inflating the author's stature.
The second racial stereotype is that of black men preying on white
women. In this case, the author tries to tug even harder on the
readers' emotions by making the potential victims not only white
females, but young girls. Their implied innocence further emphasizes
the threat of the large, overpowering black male--the big black
buck--and the true heroism of our Scientological protagonist as he
or she charges to the defence of white womanhood. The KKK would be
proud.
Scientology and its adherents need to come up to Present Time and
break out of Hubbard's '50s mindset.
<Rest of the typical, childish "it's a TWTH miracle!" tripe snipped>
Keshet
--
Kes...@cyberpass.net * http://thingy.apana.org.au/~fun/scn/racism/
Where prejudice exists it always discolors our thoughts. -Mark Twain
l.l.lipshitz
| On Sun, 02 Jul 2000 23:54:14 +0100, Hartley Patterson
| <hpt...@REMOVE.ME.vossnet.co.uk> wrote:
|
| >
| >> Velcro Kitty <vel...@home.com> quoted a friend:
| >
| >> > the early hours of Saturday morning giving out copies of The Way To
| >> > Happiness,
| >
| >
| >> > And he sold him one on the
| >> > spot, which the Super said he'd put in the Tunbridge Wells Police
| >> > Library. And the Inspector bought a copy for the East Grinstead Police
| >> > Library.
| >
|
| will impress us all when we have something simple like that from
| your "friend" who managed this impressive feat. Just pass it along
| and I'm quite sure that your story will give all of us a different
| impression of Scientology. Or, don't pass along any information to
| verify the story, and we'll just throw it in the bit bucket with all
| the other lies of "success" we've heard from Scientology.
|
| Surely, with a story that impressive, if verified, it will greatly
| add to the image and recruiting efforts of Scientology, so ~not~
| passing that along would be a severe "ethics" problem. Only an SP
| would hide information that would verify something this impressive.
others have mentioned that east grinstead is a small
and quiet town -- certainly it has an equally small
police force. wouldn't a simple phone call to the
station confirm the fiction of this story??
-elle
------------=[ l.l.lipshitz * elk...@min.net ]=------------
the greatest lesson in life is to know that
even fools are right sometimes. -wc
TravisSargent
>Velcro Kitty said in <395F9BAE...@home.com>:
> > Here's an excellent example of what a single Scientologist can do in
> > their immediate environment -- no matter how "dangerous" it may appear
> > on the surface -- might tickle your funny bone too. Sent to me by a
> > friend.
>
>Why is this funny? Do you find the author's furtherance of black
>stereotypes amusing? Personally, I think it's a damned sad statement
>on the Co$'s cultural ignorance.
>
> > Enjoy:
> >
> > "Eleven weeks ago I was down in East Grinstead doing my usual tricks in
> > the early hours of Saturday morning giving out copies of The Way To
Hey Keshnet -- you seem to be suffering from excessive "p.c. inundation,"
(politically correct thinking -- some people nowadays cannot read ~anything~
without turning it into some racial issue by various internal mental
machinations).
He was simply describing the individual for crying out loud.
But you saw an opportunity to turn an otherwise innocent remark to your
advantage in order to denigrate the guy ... and thus Scientology, didn't you?
Naughty, naughty.
Beverly Rice
> Velcro Kitty said in <395F9BAE...@home.com>:
> > Here's an excellent example of what a single Scientologist can do in
> > their immediate environment -- no matter how "dangerous" it may appear
> > on the surface -- might tickle your funny bone too.
> Why is this funny? Do you find the author's furtherance of black
> stereotypes amusing? Personally, I think it's a damned sad statement
> on the Co$'s cultural ignorance.
And not only was "the bad guy" a "black guy" . . .
but he was a "HUGE" black guy, and we know that "HUGE" black
guys are much more dangerous than just "plain" black guys.
> > "Eleven weeks ago I was down in East Grinstead doing my usual tricks in
> > the early hours of Saturday morning giving out copies of The Way To
> > Happiness,
> > Suddenly I saw this huge black guy (he literally dwarfed me) who was
> > trying to sell some crack to 4 young girls. I barged in, sent the girls
> > away, and confronted the dealer. I held a Way to Happiness book up to
> > his face and told him he needed to read this. He was impolite (to put it
> > mildly) ... threatened to kick my head in, and I just told him I'd get
> > back up and tell him he needed to read this again. He threatened to
> > kill me and I said, 'That's fine. I'll haunt you for the rest of your
> > life, and tell you need to read this.' He then asked if I was mad
> > [insane] and I said more than likely. Eventually, he took the book and
> > read a page or 2. Then he said, 'I'm going home. I've got to read ALL
> > of this. And took my name and phone number.
> "Large black drug dealer selling crack to little white girls."
Hey, Hubbard would approve!!
> How do I know the little girls were white? Because their race is
> not mentioned but the dealer's is. Assuming, *only* for the sake of
> argument, that this story is true, how does the dealer's race have
> any relevancy? Isn't this about the triumph of Scientology over
> evil?
Well, that is what the "HUGE" black guy was there to represent.
Don't you ~understand~ the significance?
What's wrong with you?
> Aren't white dealers just as evil? In a word, No.
No, they are not. Because ~white~ doesn't have the social
stigma and picutre that ~black~ does.
And don't forget, this wasn't just ~any~ black guy . . .
this was a ~HUGE~ black guy, therefore he is even ~more~ "evil".
> The author invokes two racist stereotypes at once to emphasize his
> or her heroism--a true "white" knight charging onto the scene to
> rescue the innocents.
Hubbard was a "white" knight, among many other things. This is
a good story, why are you picking it apart and being mean.
As the other Co$ reps on the NG said, can't you just be happy
for this nice fabrication (oops, I mean ~WIN~).
> [Just an aside, but what were these 4 young
> girls doing in this neighborhood full of druggies, drunks and
> people passed out in doorways, in the early hours of Saturday
> morning?]
Looking for ~HUGE~ black crack dealers, silly. Were you
led to believe that maybe they were looking for the nearest
Neiman-Marcus store to buy the latest fashions?
> The author uses the black crack dealer stereotype to raise the
> perceived danger level of the situation. Afterall, as dangerous
> as crack and crack dealers may be, a big black male makes it so
> much scarier, doesn't he?
Well, don't forget the other side of the insinuation on this
story . . .
confronting a ~HUGE~ "black crack dealer" also is used to
imply the ~bravery~ of the $cientologist . . .
the ~implied confront level~ that the tech has given to this
Hubbardian story teller is supposed to put one in awa of
the Tone Level and Confront Ability that Hubbardites wear.
(Too bad there were no blue or green tarps around, which
most Hubbardites use for hiding when confronted with the
TRUTH about the Co$).
> It just wouldn't be the same if it was
> some racially unidentified person, a female, or even a "huge white
> guy". The point to making this character "huge" and "black" is to
> emphasize the difference between good/author and evil/dealer,
> thereby inflating the author's stature.
Inflation is part of the Hubbardian mind-set.
But hey now, it ~was~ a good mock-up after all.
Just think how ~GOOD~ this would look demo'ed in clay!!!!!!
> The second racial stereotype is that of black men preying on white
> women. In this case, the author tries to tug even harder on the
> readers' emotions by making the potential victims not only white
> females, but young girls.
Young white girls make good victims.
Look at the success all the "slasher" movies have using young
white girls as victims.
> Their implied innocence further emphasizes
> the threat of the large, overpowering black male--the big black
> buck--
> ^^^^^
Sad, but true in black/white stereotyping.
Well, you know, Hubbard had this ~thing~ about his impotent,
little, white penis.
I'm quite sure a ~HUGE~ potent, black penis would be quite the
nightmarish picture of contrast for him.
His followers also have the right to use ~HUGE~ black guys
to represent evil, as Hubbard also said that blacks are too
stupid to even register on the sacred item of the Co$, the
E-meter.
> and the true heroism of our Scientological protagonist as he
> or she charges to the defence of white womanhood. The KKK would be
> proud.
> Scientology and its adherents need to come up to Present Time and
> break out of Hubbard's '50s mindset.
Only if it's good for PR. Elsewise they are stuck in that
mindset because Hubbard is dead and gone, the tech is stuck
and stale.
I'm sure that your remarks will be made a record of, and
maybe they will keep this in mind for their next "Success
Story".
ARC,
Beverly
TravisSargent
LOL! I think it's only fair to mention that this story you all seem so full of
glee to shred ... was never meant for you to see in the first place!
Do you think we care if you believe it? It was originally a report from one
staff member to another staff member -- never a "pr" ploy for public
consumption. LOL!
But oh, with what haste and lust the vultures move in on the object of their
desire! Never the benefit of a doubt ... just pure invalidation only.
Obviously Kitty shouldn't have posted it for these reasons, because we all know
what you do with success stories ... but it was posted and ... you've all been
entertaining us wonderfully with live demos of a.r.s. attitudes and feeding
frenzies, etc. ... ever since.
Like throwing a piece of meat into a group of starving scavengers.
Very entertaining indeed! Thanks!
Oh -- it IS true too btw.
Lord High Commissioner
travis...@aol.com (TravisSargent) wrote:
> On Tue, 04 Jul 2000 12:35:39 -0400, Beverly Rice <dbj...@ao.net>
wrote:
> Obviously Kitty shouldn't have posted it for these reasons, because
we all know
> what you do with success stories ... but it was posted and ... you've
all been
> entertaining us wonderfully with live demos of a.r.s. attitudes and
feeding
> frenzies, etc. ... ever since.
We like "success" stories. You know, the one where Heebie Jeebie
exteriorizes in a parking lot to catch criminals. Or the one where the
the lady start growing bigger "boobs".
BWAAAAAAAAHAHAHAHAH.....
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.
TravisSargent
>On 04 Jul 2000 17:08:22 GMT, travis...@aol.com (TravisSargent)
>wrote:
>
>
>>LOL! I think it's only fair to mention that this story you all seem so full
of
>>glee to shred ... was never meant for you to see in the first place!
>>
>>Do you think we care if you believe it? It was originally a report from one
>>staff member to another staff member -- never a "pr" ploy for public
>>consumption. LOL!
>>
>>But oh, with what haste and lust the vultures move in on the object of their
>>desire! Never the benefit of a doubt ... just pure invalidation only.
>>
>>Obviously Kitty shouldn't have posted it for these reasons, because we all
know
>>what you do with success stories ... but it was posted and ... you've all
been
>>entertaining us wonderfully with live demos of a.r.s. attitudes and feeding
>>frenzies, etc. ... ever since.
>>
>>Like throwing a piece of meat into a group of starving scavengers.
>>
>>Very entertaining indeed! Thanks!
>>
>>Oh -- it IS true too btw.
>
>So just pass on enough information so the story can be verified,
>which should be simple if it actually happened, and you will have
>a group of impressed readers. Unfortunately, CoS and its followers
>have made up a lot of stories that turned out to be lies, and this
>one looks like many of the others. A simple badge number of the
>police officer would allow confirmation of the story. Without it,
>it makes it look like just what it is, ~another~ lie by Scientology.
>
>Go ahead, prove me wrong, make critics look bad and make Scientology
>look good by providing information to verify this story. Not doing
>so leaves Scientology looking like the lying cult it is. That, surely
>is a suppressive act on the part of whoever leaves that impression
>with the world. It's a simple request, give a simple amount of data
>that the writer must be able to provide if the story is true, and
>the story will show Scientology to have had a positive effect. Don't
>give that information, and (because of the history of lies from
>the cult) the story will be taken as another one in the history of
>those lies.
>
>What possibile good can it do for Scientology ~not~ to provide the
>information required to verify the story?
Let me ask you a question Brent.
If you received a report or success story which was relayed to you, (via staff
and off staff lines -- that particular one made the rounds on private lines, it
wasn't meant to go outside, as mentioned earlier -- Kitty was evidently on that
line), through a number of relay points ... and going back up that line in
order to get a "badge number" in order to convince negative, dedicated,
professional skeptics ... resulting in MUCH off topic (for staff) work ... well
would that make sense to you?
Thank you. I didn't think so either.
Again, Kitty shouldn't have posted it for the very reasons I'm discussing. But
that notwithstanding, frankly, we couldn't care less if _you_ believe us.
We're not trying to get your agreement or approval. HTH.
Beverly Rice
Placing my comments Travis is referring to at the end of this
post to make for quicker reading for those who have beein following.
> LOL! I think it's only fair to mention that this story you all seem
> so full of glee to shred ... was never meant for you to see in the
> first place!
LOL! Of course not, most things that are Co$ related are not
meant for the public to see. Everytime they are exposed for the
public to see, an insight into the hidden world of Co$-thought
is revealed, scams are opened for the public to see, and the
lies of the Co$ are exposed.
> Do you think we care if you believe it?
Yes, the Co$ does care about the publics belief and disbelief
of what they have to say, which is why they guard as hard as
possible the data that goes out to the public.
> It was originally a report from one
> staff member to another staff member -- never a "pr" ploy for public
> consumption. LOL!
LOL! Thats why it was posted here.
> But oh, with what haste and lust the vultures move in on the
> object of their desire!
Hmm, "haste", "lust", "vultures". Have you been reading how
to write by the author of "It was a dark and stormy night"?
> Never the benefit of a doubt ... just pure invalidation only.
Have you ever asked yourself why the Co$ isn't granted the
benefit of being believable?
I know you haven't because you are even unable to confront the
abuses of your fellow human beings in the Co$ while stating
that the reason you oppose "The Psychs" is due to their abuses.
Let me help you in your Hubbardian inability to understand why
Co$ has such a reputation for forwarding lies.
It is . . .
because they forward lies.
Should anybody have given the benefit of a doubt to Co$ stories such as
the Norwegian Defense Minister's recommendations of TWTH, which
proved to be a lie yet was in an official Co$ publication?
http://www.xenu.net/archive/media/kosmo.html
Should anybody have given the benefit of a doubt to the C0$ story that
the King and Queen of Sweden approved of the Co$ Front group,
NarCONon, when that also proved to be a lie told to all Hubbardites
at one of their many large ~events~?
Should anybody have given the benefit of doubt to the Co$ story that
Co$ lied about one of their members needing ~asylum~ in the US
for her persecution by Germany when in fact she just had gotten
herself in over her head with financial and tax problems?
Should anybody have given the benefit of doubt to the Co$ story
about Minton "the bad white guy who got rich off the backs of
poor blacks" when that turned out to be a good deal for Nigeria
that saved them literally ~BILLIONS~ of dollars?
Should anybody have given the benefit of doubt to the Co$ story
that they were just giving Lisa McPherson "rest and relaxation"
http://www.b-org.demon.nl/scn/deaths/room174.html
at the Ft. Homicide?
http://www.xs4all.nl/~bogie/dunkle_seite/ard09.html
Should ~anybody~ ever give the Co$ the benefit of a doubt when
so many of their policies revolve around lies and accetable
truths, and even have TR's (Training Routines) for lying?
The following LRH/Co$ document was obtained when the FBI
raided the Co$ Mother Church after it was discovered that the
Co$ had used its members to gain employment and access to
government agencies and had tampered with official government
files:
INTELLIGENCE SPECIALIST TRAINING ROUTINE - TR L
Purpose: To train the student to give a false statement with
good TR-1.
To train the student to outflow false data effectively.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Position: Same as TR-1
Commands: Part 1 "Tell me a lie". Command given by coach.
Part 2 interview type 2 WC by coach.
Training Stress: In Part 1 coach gives command, student originates a
falsehood. Coach flunks for out TR 1 or TR 0. In Part 2 coach asks
questions of the student on his background or a subject. Student gives
untrue data of a plausible sort that the student backs up with further
explanatory data upon the coach's further questions. The coach flunks
for out TR 0 and TR 1, and for studnet fumbling on question answers.
The student should be coached on a gradient until he/she can lie facily.
Short example:
Coach: Where do you come from?
Student: I come from the Housewives Committee on Drug Abuse.
Coach: But you said earlier that you were single.
Student: Well, actually I was married but am divorced. I have 2 kids
in the suburs where I am a housewife, in fact I'm a member of the
P.T.A.
Coach: What town is it that you live in?
Student: West Brighton
Coach: But there is no public school in West Brighton.
Student: I know. I send my children to school in Brighton, and that's
where I'm a P.T.A. member.
Coach: Oh, and who is the Chairman there?
etc.
> Obviously Kitty shouldn't have posted it for these reasons,
> because we all know what you do with success stories
Yes, we question them, rather than swallow them hook, line
and sinker like Hubbardites are expected to do.
The post I made Travis was referring to is below:
Lord High Commissioner
travis...@aol.com (TravisSargent) wrote:
>
> Let me ask you a question Brent.
>
> If you received a report or success story which was relayed to you,
(via staff
> and off staff lines -- that particular one made the rounds on private
lines, it
> wasn't meant to go outside, as mentioned earlier -- Kitty was
evidently on that
> line), through a number of relay points ... and going back up that
line in
> order to get a "badge number" in order to convince negative,
dedicated,
> professional skeptics ... resulting in MUCH off topic (for staff)
work ... well
> would that make sense to you?
OK fellow ARSers, todays lesson is called TESTIMONIALS. How many of you
buy products based on the testimonial of someone you don't know. Well,
in $cientology, a testimonial is known as a SUCCESS STORY. Neat, eh? I
knew you'd like that.
Now, why would you want to keep a testimonial secret? Because it
reflects badly on the product the person is testifying? Could it be:
THE PUBLIC WOULD LAUGH? Or possibly a more *sinister* reason, like
spotting when one is about to *blow* due to dissatisfaction?
Anyway, with the $cientological persuasion to accept TESTIMONIALS at
face value, should I go into the info-mercial business? They sure have
a lot 'o suckers testifying all kinds of gobbledy-gook on late-nite
TV..... I could get rich off'n those clams...
>
> Thank you. I didn't think so either.
>
> Again, Kitty shouldn't have posted it for the very reasons I'm
discussing. But
> that notwithstanding, frankly, we couldn't care less if _you_ believe
us.
> We're not trying to get your agreement or approval. HTH.
>
--
---
XENU SAVES
passes to Minton, he shoots, score!
Marcabs : 99
Clams : 0
Dave Bird
Hash: SHA1
In article<slrn8m3o7b...@min.net>, l.l.lipshitz <elk...@min.net>
writes:
> | Surely, with a story that impressive, if verified, it will greatly
> | add to the image and recruiting efforts of Scientology, so ~not~
> | passing that along would be a severe "ethics" problem. Only an SP
> | would hide information that would verify something this impressive.
>
> others have mentioned that east grinstead is a small
> and quiet town -- certainly it has an equally small
> police force. wouldn't a simple phone call to the
> station confirm the fiction of this story??
I wouldn't want Inspector R****** A**** to think I was a prat
for having believed it in the first place.
- -- . : : ,; . : ' ___.
uno, due, tre, FUEGO! .:. .:. .:': :' .:':' :. . : (") #oH|
' :' : :' : .::. H_ ~~~|
< > __ ,;;,. \\::// R_) |
'-|"""(") {__}::===== ....'''' ' ' ' ___..\||/....L\. ...|
____||--|_'--/__\___ '' .--''':::::::::::::::::::::
\ / /////////////S.Coronado/////
;'^';-._.-;'^';-._.-;'^';-._.-;'^';-._;'^';-._.-;'^';-._.-;'^';-._.-;'^
LRon Hubbard is shelled by goats in hell. www.xemu.demon.co.uk/clam/
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Dave Bird
Hash: SHA1
In article<396212...@ao.net>, Beverly Rice <dbj...@ao.net> writes:
>> Why is this funny? Do you find the author's furtherance of black
>> stereotypes amusing? Personally, I think it's a damned sad statement
>> on the Co$'s cultural ignorance.
You may find it racially insensitive, but it is absurd. Think of
a small market town of about 10,000 people. It is in the nice
suburban country side about forty miles from the big rich city,
where the retired stockbrokers go to live. Now I am sure you could
buy the usual drugs there if you looked hard enough and had the
right contacts. But they are not sold by large black gentlemen
with big gold necklets standing on street corners. In fact I do
not remember seeing one non-white resident there. (The distribution
of races in very uneven: ocean-going ports have had black communities
for centuries and most black people are in big metropolitan areas,
but when you come to small rural towns or fishing ports they are
almost entirely white, in fact 90% local and in-bred for generations).
>
>And not only was "the bad guy" a "black guy" . . .
>but he was a "HUGE" black guy, and we know that "HUGE" black
>guys are much more dangerous than just "plain" black guys.
|~/ |~/
~~|;'^';-._.-;'^';-._.-;'^';-._.-;'^';-._.-;||';-._.-;'^';||_.-;'^'0-|~~
P | Woof Woof, Glug Glug ||____________|| 0 | P
O | Who Drowned the Judge's Dog? | . . . . . . . '----. 0 | O
O | answers on *---|_______________ @__o0 | O
L |<a href="news:alt.religion.scientology"></a>_____________|/_______| L
www.xemu.demon.co.uk 2B0D 5195 337B A3E6 DDAC BD38 7F2F FD8E 7391 F44F
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TravisSargent
Actually Lord -- it's because we've learned over the years that a.r.s. just
makes mince meat out of them anyway. As was done with this one.
l.l.lipshitz
| writes:
| > | Surely, with a story that impressive, if verified, it will greatly
| > | add to the image and recruiting efforts of Scientology, so ~not~
| > | passing that along would be a severe "ethics" problem. Only an SP
| > | would hide information that would verify something this impressive.
| >
| > others have mentioned that east grinstead is a small
| > and quiet town -- certainly it has an equally small
| > police force. wouldn't a simple phone call to the
| > station confirm the fiction of this story??
|
|
| I wouldn't want Inspector R****** A**** to think I was a prat
| for having believed it in the first place.
hahaha! i see your point. :)
-elle
------------=[ l.l.lipshitz * elk...@min.net ]=------------
nature not content with denying him the ability to
think, has endowed him with the ability to write. aeh
Lord High Commissioner
Well Trav, - the point I'm taking the long way to get to is, the
purpose of a success story (or testimonial) is for dissemination.
That's right, public PR. Doesn't do any good to stuff it in a file.
Doesn't do any good to dissem to other *churchies*; you're preaching to
the choir there. So we're left with speculation until a much more
plausible explanation comes along.
keshet
<snip>
> Hey Keshnet -- you seem to be suffering from excessive "p.c. inundation,"
> (politically correct thinking -- some people nowadays cannot read ~anything~
> without turning it into some racial issue by various internal mental
> machinations).
Yes, pardon my PCishness, I'm afraid I still take offense at
racist remarks. I guess I haven't flattened that button yet.
> He was simply describing the individual for crying out loud.
Then I ask again, how was the crack dealer's race relevant? Why
were the 4 young girls not described as "white"? Because the
author presumes his or her readers are white and it's not
necessary to point out the girls' "sameness". However, the
author identifies the dealer as black in order to emphasize
his difference, his "otherness", his "nonmembership-in-our-
society" status, which makes him more threatening.
And I'm sorry, but having a "huge black guy" confront innocent
little white girls is just way too obvious to be anything but
a deliberate attempt to play on white racist fears. I find it
truly amazing that Scientology is so culturally ignorant that
the bigotry of this bloody stupid tale escapes you.
BTW, Travis, is the author, in fact, male? Or are you engaging
in *sexist* assumptions, along with your racist ones?
> But you saw an opportunity to turn an otherwise innocent remark to your
> advantage in order to denigrate the guy ... and thus Scientology, didn't you?
I saw an opportunity to point out a bit of racist thinking. I
don't consider that "innocent".
I understand why you denigrate PCishness rather than racism.
The PC philosophy demands we respect other cultures and treat
their members like human beings rather than stereotypes, in sharp
contrast to the teachings of your exalted Source, who thought
Japanese go crazy from reading their silly writing, that Chinese
stink, and that Blacks are untrainable and too stupid to be
Scientologists.
> Naughty, naughty.
In Scientology's warped perception, I certainly am. Thanks.
keshet
> On Tue, 04 Jul 2000 12:35:39 -0400, Beverly Rice <dbj...@ao.net> wrote:
<snip>
> >Only if it's good for PR. Elsewise they are stuck in that
> >mindset because Hubbard is dead and gone, the tech is stuck
> >and stale.
> >
> >I'm sure that your remarks will be made a record of, and
> >maybe they will keep this in mind for their next "Success
> >Story".
> >
> LOL! I think it's only fair to mention that this story you all seem so full of
> glee to shred ... was never meant for you to see in the first place!
"If only we keep our racism amongst ourselves, then it's alright...."
> Do you think we care if you believe it? It was originally a report from one
> staff member to another staff member -- never a "pr" ploy for public
> consumption. LOL!
It's obvious why you wouldn't want the public to see it.
> But oh, with what haste and lust the vultures move in on the object of their
> desire! Never the benefit of a doubt ... just pure invalidation only.
You lost your right to our benefit of the doubt by lying with
such great frequency and consistency that it has become the
standard pattern of Scientological communication. We have no
incentive to believe anything you say. Tsk, tsk, you pulled it
in.
> Obviously Kitty shouldn't have posted it for these reasons, because we all know
> what you do with success stories ... but it was posted and ... you've all been
> entertaining us wonderfully with live demos of a.r.s. attitudes and feeding
> frenzies, etc. ... ever since.
>
> Like throwing a piece of meat into a group of starving scavengers.
>
> Very entertaining indeed! Thanks!
Scientology thinks racist stereotypes are entertaining.
> Oh -- it IS true too btw.
What's the point, Travis, you don't care if we believe it.
keshet
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA1
>
> >> Why is this funny? Do you find the author's furtherance of black
> >> stereotypes amusing? Personally, I think it's a damned sad statement
> >> on the Co$'s cultural ignorance.
>
> You may find it racially insensitive, but it is absurd. Think of
> a small market town of about 10,000 people. It is in the nice
> suburban country side about forty miles from the big rich city,
> where the retired stockbrokers go to live. Now I am sure you could
> buy the usual drugs there if you looked hard enough and had the
> right contacts. But they are not sold by large black gentlemen
> with big gold necklets standing on street corners. In fact I do
> not remember seeing one non-white resident there. (The distribution
> of races in very uneven: ocean-going ports have had black communities
> for centuries and most black people are in big metropolitan areas,
> but when you come to small rural towns or fishing ports they are
> almost entirely white, in fact 90% local and in-bred for generations).
Which makes this tale all the more racist because the stereotypes
are unrealistic beyond even their normal level of bigotry.
Eric Bohlman
: On Tue, 04 Jul 2000 21:52:45 GMT, Lord High Commissioner
: <joe_s...@my-deja.com> wrote:
: >Now, why would you want to keep a testimonial secret? Because it
: >reflects badly on the product the person is testifying? Could it be:
: >THE PUBLIC WOULD LAUGH? Or possibly a more *sinister* reason, like
: >spotting when one is about to *blow* due to dissatisfaction?
:
: Actually Lord -- it's because we've learned over the years that a.r.s. just
: makes mince meat out of them anyway. As was done with this one.
Hey, did you hear the story about the medieval alchemist with extremely
low aspirations? While his peers were trying to turn lead into gold, he
settled for trying to turn shit into mincemeat.
The reason that a.r.s has torn up the "big wins" that your organization
has posted in the past is that they simply turned out *not to be true*.
Your PR folks have posted at least three stories that take the form
"government official becomes aware of something LRH wrote, becomes
impressed, and recommends it to other government officials" and which
identify those officials by name. And *every* time someone here contacts
those identified officials, they deny the story ever happened. This story
has the *exact* same form as the "teaching South African children to read"
story, the "Norwegian defense minister" story, and the "Swedish royal
family" story. There's a folk tale known as "the boy who cried wolf"
that most Western kids learn about the same time they learn the folk tale
about "the emperor's new clothes." And most of us remember those tales.
For a good reason.
AndroidCat www.xenu.net
news:8jud23$6lg$5...@nntp9.atl.mindspring.net...
Is that like the fairy tale where the elf spins straw into shinola?
Ron of that ilk.
Podkayne1
> > Actually Lord -- it's because we've learned over the years that
> a.r.s. just
> > makes mince meat out of them anyway.
If they were true, we wouldn't be able to.
--
John Travolta thinks Scientology is wonderful.
But then, he thinks the "Battlefield Earth" movie is wonderful too.
Think about it.
"You have angered the hedgehog, and now you must pay!"
Podkayne1
> Well, don't forget the other side of the insinuation on this
> story . . .
>
> confronting a ~HUGE~ "black crack dealer" also is used to
> imply the ~bravery~ of the $cientologist . . .
>
> the ~implied confront level~ that the tech has given to this
> Hubbardian story teller is supposed to put one in awa of
> the Tone Level and Confront Ability that Hubbardites wear.
>
> (Too bad there were no blue or green tarps around, which
> most Hubbardites use for hiding when confronted with the
> TRUTH about the Co$).
Good thing the ~HUGE~ "black crack dealer" didn't have a picket sign ;-)
Podkayne1
(keshet) wrote:
> Velcro Kitty said in <395F9BAE...@home.com>:
> > Here's an excellent example of what a single Scientologist can do in
> > their immediate environment -- no matter how "dangerous" it may appear
> > on the surface -- might tickle your funny bone too. Sent to me by a
> > friend.
>
> Why is this funny? Do you find the author's furtherance of black
> stereotypes amusing? Personally, I think it's a damned sad statement
> on the Co$'s cultural ignorance.
funny in a pathetic sort of way.
> The second racial stereotype is that of black men preying on white
> women. In this case, the author tries to tug even harder on the
> readers' emotions by making the potential victims not only white
> females, but young girls.
The only emotion it tugs on in my case is humor, thanks to "Blazing
Saddles":
"Man, those people are *soooo* *duuuummmmb*"
Hartley Patterson
> In fact I do
> not remember seeing one non-white resident there.
I'd concur with that, though not with your demography: I work in a
provincial town about the same size as East Grinstead and it is
decidedly multi-ethnic.
--
"I think of my beautiful city in flames"
http://village.vossnet.co.uk/h/hpttrsn/
A medieval spreadsheet, enturbulating entheta, how to outrun
Thread and some riddles preciousss....
TravisSargent
>TravisSargent said in <20000704122659...@ng-ch1.aol.com>:
>
> <snip>
>
> > Hey Keshnet -- you seem to be suffering from excessive "p.c. inundation,"
> > (politically correct thinking -- some people nowadays cannot read
~anything~
> > without turning it into some racial issue by various internal mental
> > machinations).
>
>Yes, pardon my PCishness, I'm afraid I still take offense at
>racist remarks. I guess I haven't flattened that button yet.
>
> > He was simply describing the individual for crying out loud.
>
>Then I ask again, how was the crack dealer's race relevant?
Af far as I'm concerned it wasn't. It appears you've made it so though.
>Why
>were the 4 young girls not described as "white"?
Because they were. So what? Does every ~mention~ of race have to be "racist"
in nature?
>Because the
>author presumes his or her readers are white and it's not
>necessary to point out the girls' "sameness". However, the
>author identifies the dealer as black in order to emphasize
>his difference, his "otherness", his "nonmembership-in-our-
>society" status, which makes him more threatening.
However believable they seem to you, you have to admit that your remarks above
are nothing more than assumption. It would seem that you may be the racially
biased one.
>
>And I'm sorry, but having a "huge black guy" confront innocent
>little white girls is just way too obvious to be anything but
>a deliberate attempt to play on white racist fears. I find it
>truly amazing that Scientology is so culturally ignorant that
>the bigotry of this bloody stupid tale escapes you.
Oh I can see it from your point of view quite easily. The problem is that
whether any of us like it or not, that is very common language to describe such
an encounter in the real world.
I noticed you haven't said a peep about the good work the guy did though. Only
how "racist" he is. Take an oviously intimidating criminal source off the
street, rehab him to a certain extent, get him to stop committing crimes, have
him turn around and start helping OTHERS, etc., etc. ... and all you can find
to say about him is he's "racsist." What's this world coming to?
Well, it happened. It's over. And I really don't care how you find it. You
will twist it to suit your agenda any way you can.
>
>BTW, Travis, is the author, in fact, male? Or are you engaging
>in *sexist* assumptions, along with your racist ones?
Am ~I~ engaging in sexist assumptions?? Well, honestly that thought never even
occurred to me. I see it occurred to you though. Why? Are you operating on a
secret agenda? The author is male.
>
> > But you saw an opportunity to turn an otherwise innocent remark to your
> > advantage in order to denigrate the guy ... and thus Scientology, didn't
you?
>I saw an opportunity to point out a bit of racist thinking. I
>don't consider that "innocent".
Well get that it WAS innocent.
You remind me of the prim & proper old maid who sees "sex" in every sentence,
word, event or action. Clean your windscreen (you are a Brit are you not?) and
things won't look so "dirty" to you all the time.
Remember, if you have a dirty windscreen (windshield in the states), everywhere
you go ... it's dirty. A good wash job can do wonders for how you see OTHER
people.
TravisSargent
<joe_s...@my-deja.com> wrote:
>In article <20000704185402...@ng-ch1.aol.com>,
> travis...@aol.com (TravisSargent) wrote:
>> On Tue, 04 Jul 2000 21:52:45 GMT, Lord High Commissioner
>> <joe_s...@my-deja.com> wrote:
>>
>> >Now, why would you want to keep a testimonial secret? Because it
>> >reflects badly on the product the person is testifying? Could it be:
>> >THE PUBLIC WOULD LAUGH? Or possibly a more *sinister* reason, like
>> >spotting when one is about to *blow* due to dissatisfaction?
>>
>> Actually Lord -- it's because we've learned over the years that
>a.r.s. just
>> makes mince meat out of them anyway. As was done with this one.
>
>Well Trav, - the point I'm taking the long way to get to is, the
>purpose of a success story (or testimonial) is for dissemination.
>That's right, public PR. Doesn't do any good to stuff it in a file.
>Doesn't do any good to dissem to other *churchies*; you're preaching to
>the choir there. So we're left with speculation until a much more
>plausible explanation comes along.
Well here it is Lord (straight face)...
It was a success story shared among staff members.
It displays a lot of courage, caring and love for the individual to be able to
pull something like that off in the first place ... it demonstrated to other
staff what a single, willing, trained, caring Scientologist could do in such a
situation ... and ~that~ was its "success" value to staff. Period. End of
story.
Just can't get it can you? Is the idea of sharing success and joy foreign to
you?
Lord High Commissioner
So, there it is - the choir. Does a christian need to tell his
minister Jesus is Lord? Staff doesn't need success stories -
they need to know when thing *aren't* working.
>
>It displays a lot of courage, caring and love for the
individual to be able to
>pull something like that off in the first place ... it
demonstrated to other
>staff what a single, willing, trained, caring Scientologist
could do in such a
>situation ... and ~that~ was its "success" value to staff.
But - they supposedly already know that.
Period. End of
>story.
>
>Just can't get it can you? Is the idea of sharing success and
joy foreign to
>you?
Not at all. Just who you're sharing success though, will
indicate *why* you're doing it.
Also - is it acceptable to decline writing a "Success Story",
for any action, for whatever reason? I mean, is it out-ethics,
as you say?
XENU SAVES, passes to Minton, he shoots, score!
-----------------------------------------------------------
Got questions? Get answers over the phone at Keen.com.
Up to 100 minutes free!
http://www.keen.com
Mistmagoo55
>From: travis...@aol.com (TravisSargent)
>Date: 7/5/00 2:06 PM Pacific Daylight Time
>Message-id: <20000705170607...@ng-cg1.aol.com>
>to
>pull something like that off in the first place ... it demonstrated to other
>staff what a single, willing, trained, caring Scientologist could do in such
>a
>story.
>
>Just can't get it can you? Is the idea of sharing success and joy foreign to
>you?
>
success story and joy (and even having one, or experiencing joy) to be quite
foreign. Too bad, really.
Magoo!
Dave Bird
Hash: SHA1
In article<39637AFB...@vossnet.co.uk>, Hartley Patterson
<hpt...@REMOVE.ME.vossnet.co.uk> writes:
>Dave Bird wrote:
>
>> In fact I do
>> not remember seeing one non-white resident there.
>
>I'd concur with that, though not with your demography: I work in a
>provincial town about the same size as East Grinstead and it is
>decidedly multi-ethnic.
OK. But there are many rural and/or fishing areas which are
quiet backwaters, and have that kind of very stable very native
population. As opposed to the ocean ports and the conurbations
which are very fluid in population. I'm sure the same applies
to some backwater parts of America.
|~/ |~/
~~|;'^';-._.-;'^';-._.-;'^';-._.-;'^';-._.-;||';-._.-;'^';||_.-;'^'0-|~~
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O | Who Drowned the Judge's Dog? | . . . . . . . '----. 0 | O
O | answers on *---|_______________ @__o0 | O
L |<a href="news:alt.religion.scientology"></a>_____________|/_______| L
www.xemu.demon.co.uk 2B0D 5195 337B A3E6 DDAC BD38 7F2F FD8E 7391 F44F
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keshet
TravisSargent said in <20000705165635...@ng-cg1.aol.com>:
> On 5 Jul 2000 02:15:26 GMT, kes...@cyberpass.net (keshet) wrote:
>
> >TravisSargent said in <20000704122659...@ng-ch1.aol.com>:
<snip>
> > > He was simply describing the individual for crying out loud.
> >
> >Then I ask again, how was the crack dealer's race relevant?
>
> Af far as I'm concerned it wasn't. It appears you've made it so though.
Not I. The author of this little tale made an issue of the
dealer's race. I merely pointed it out.
> >Why
> >were the 4 young girls not described as "white"?
>
> Because they were. So what? Does every ~mention~ of race have to be "racist"
> in nature?
Well, no, but I would say that every mention of race by a member
of the stuck-in-the-1950s-bigoted-white-culture-of-LRH is
certainly suspect.
> >Because the
> >author presumes his or her readers are white and it's not
> >necessary to point out the girls' "sameness". However, the
> >author identifies the dealer as black in order to emphasize
> >his difference, his "otherness", his "nonmembership-in-our-
> >society" status, which makes him more threatening.
>
> However believable they seem to you, you have to admit that your remarks above
> are nothing more than assumption. It would seem that you may be the racially
> biased one.
I have to admit no such thing.
I suggest you read some anthropological or sociological studies of
racial issues, then come back and we'll have a proper discussion
of your friend's presumptuous remarks.
"We have seen that stereotypes may or may not originate in a
kernel of truth; they aid people in simplifying their categories;
they justify hostility; sometimes they serve as projection screens
for our personal conflict. But there is an additional, and
exceedingly important, reason for their existence. They are
socially supported, continually revived and hammered in, by our
media of mass communication--by novels, short stories, newpaper
items, movies, stage, radio, and television." [and I would add,
"usenet posts"]
-Gordon W. Allport, _The Nature of Prejudice_
> >And I'm sorry, but having a "huge black guy" confront innocent
> >little white girls is just way too obvious to be anything but
> >a deliberate attempt to play on white racist fears. I find it
> >truly amazing that Scientology is so culturally ignorant that
> >the bigotry of this bloody stupid tale escapes you.
>
> Oh I can see it from your point of view quite easily. The problem is that
> whether any of us like it or not, that is very common language to describe such
> an encounter in the real world.
This is one of the points I am attempting to make, obviously not
very successfully. The "very common language" is that of the
dominant white society, who see nothing wrong with that language,
even though it perpetuates racial stereotypes, simply because it
IS common.
I had an acquaintence explain to me that calling brazil nuts
"nigger toes" is not racist, because "everybody" does it. You are
defending you friend's prejudiced images in the same way.
> I noticed you haven't said a peep about the good work the guy did though. Only
> how "racist" he is. Take an oviously intimidating criminal source off the
> street, rehab him to a certain extent, get him to stop committing crimes, have
> him turn around and start helping OTHERS, etc., etc. ... and all you can find
> to say about him is he's "racsist." What's this world coming to?
I did not peep about the "good" this Scientologist did because
I know this tale to be "just another fabrication"[1]. It may serve
as inspirational literature within your church but out here in
the real world, it is unbelievable tripe. If you wish to discuss
why it is pure hokum, I would be happy to oblige. However, as you
have noted elsewhere in this thread, this story has already been
thoroughly savaged by critics, so I understand why you would not
wish to suffer further ridicule.
> Well, it happened.
No, it did not, except in the author's fertile imagination.
>It's over. And I really don't care how you find it.
Then why to you contiue to respond?
>You
> will twist it to suit your agenda any way you can.
My agenda is the confrontation of racism, bigotry and prejudice.
What's yours?
> >BTW, Travis, is the author, in fact, male? Or are you engaging
> >in *sexist* assumptions, along with your racist ones?
>
> Am ~I~ engaging in sexist assumptions?? Well, honestly that thought never even
> occurred to me. I see it occurred to you though. Why? Are you operating on a
> secret agenda? The author is male.
I thought you might be faithful to Source, which is replete with
sexisms. The author was not identified. I had no way of knowing
if he was male or female (to be frank, my first impression was
"female", so I admit my own prejudice in assuming something so
"silly" was penned by a woman) but you referred to "him" so I
wondered if you actually knew him or simply *assumed* he was male.
> > > But you saw an opportunity to turn an otherwise innocent remark to your
> > > advantage in order to denigrate the guy ... and thus Scientology, didn't
> you?
> >I saw an opportunity to point out a bit of racist thinking. I
> >don't consider that "innocent".
>
> Well get that it WAS innocent.
You are wrong. Presenting racial stereotypes is NOT innocent.
Insisting that it is helps assure the continuance of the prejudice.
> You remind me of the prim & proper old maid who sees "sex" in every sentence,
> word, event or action. Clean your windscreen (you are a Brit are you not?) and
You are Wonder White Bread to the core, are you not?
> things won't look so "dirty" to you all the time.
>
> Remember, if you have a dirty windscreen (windshield in the states), everywhere
> you go ... it's dirty. A good wash job can do wonders for how you see OTHER
> people.
That would be a whitewash, eh?
Your windscreen is clear because you refuse to confront prejudice,
instead preferring your blindered view of L. Ron Hubbard's
comfortable little white world.
Keshet
[1] "I am afraid [Co$'s] claim of teaching 1.5 million children
in South Africa to read is JUST ANOTHER FABRICATION."
-Johan Klopper, Second Secretary
[South African embassy, Canberra, Australia]