The de-evolution of ARS
DeadAgent1
Helluva thing to read this newsgroup after not reading it
for over a year.
ARS has become a carricature of itself. Ugly sonbitch.
ARS = the mother of all on-line cultish groups.
And the mother of all straw dogs, is the ARSCC
version of Scientology
We used to have some fun on this NG, (believe it or not)
Looks like a wasteland to me now. (and a waste of time)
The ARSCC (which doesn't exist), in an insane war with an evil
criminal cult. (which also doesn't exist) YAWN - how can
combatants (either side) take this bull so seriously. ya all
need to run repetitive "lighten up to EP" for a few hundred
hrs. (and then maybe get a life)
Yeh, from the perspective of this newsgroup
the pickets etc. are very noble, brave etc.
But from any rational perspective, picketers
are mostly playing the role of the fool even
though praised as heros in their own little world.
And what are Scientologists doing even bothering
to post here. Why play with these people?
Usenet can be fun, entertaining, educational, and
even useful. BUT... you can get so rapped up in it and
so sucked into it that you think you're a warrior
taking part in the making of history, when in reality
you're jsut the same old you and you're just
jerk jerking off. (to the cheers of other jerks
doing the same)
Saving people from Scientology? Protecting the world
from domination by an evil cult? Yeh, sure, whatever.
What a waste. All this time and effort could be going into
something worthwhile or useful in the real world.
Didn't see it at the time, but Bernie was right all along. Ya all
are whatchya think you're fighting. All of ya.
But of course YOU know the TRUTH and you're so damn right
and now ya got yourself in a position ya can never back away from.
Of such things are traps made.
ROCKY (the yawning flying squirell)
Valerie
says...
>
>
>
>Helluva thing to read this newsgroup after not reading it
>for over a year.
>
> BUT... you can get so rapped up in it and
>so sucked into it that you think you're a warrior
>taking part in the making of history, when in reality
>you're jsut the same old you and you're just
>jerk jerking off. (to the cheers of other jerks
>doing the same)
What a lovely visual, dear.
>Didn't see it at the time, but Bernie was right all along. Ya all
>are whatchya think you're fighting. All of ya.
Was this written by a teenager? My 14 year old writes this way.
>ROCKY (the yawning flying squirell)
Wordclear squirrel, dear, it only has one 'l'.
Valerie
>
>
>
>
Wherever you come near the human race, there's layers and layers of nonsense.
Thornton Wilder
Our Town
David Voth
<snip>
>ARS = the mother of all on-line cultish groups.
<snip>
Obviously you've never seen news:alt.slack!
Reverend David Voth
Church of the SubGenius
--
Help the Knights of Xenu expose $cientology!
Can you donate your extra CPU cycles?
See http://www.xenu.net/archive/events/KoX-rc5des/
Dobe R Mann
[chomp]
>criminal cult. (which also doesn't exist) YAWN - how can
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
word clear your MU
>ROCKY (the yawning flying squirell)
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
word clear your MU
Dobe R Mann
SP2 Tone 1.95
__________________________________________________________________
"Look netizens! Another person just read about the Co$, Xenu, Elron and the
rest of the rot." "Watch now! .... look! .... oooohhh there he goes folks!
He's posting on ARS"
___________________________________________________________________
INCIDENT 4
LOUD SNAP (Bones breaking)
CHEVROLETS COME OUT
BURN RUBBER
FISHTAIL RIGHT
DO U-TURN
STALL
FLAT TIRE (No motion)
BLOWS HORN
BLOWS MISCAVIGE
CRASH
Rob Clark
>Helluva thing to read this newsgroup after not reading it
>for over a year.
>ARS has become a carricature of itself. Ugly sonbitch.
how could it be a caricature of itself? it was already a caricature of
itself when you left, if you really are rocky the flying squirrel and not
some impostor or OSA agent or something.
(shit. . .that's what you're talking about, right?)
>ARS = the mother of all on-line cultish groups.
>And the mother of all straw dogs, is the ARSCC
>version of Scientology
LRH sez "what you resist you become." while not a guaranteed truth, it is
a good warning sign for those who go out to be an "anti" anything. it is
hard not to be a mirror to what you despise, but it is worthwhile to try
not to do so while continuing to oppose it.
>We used to have some fun on this NG, (believe it or not)
actually those of us here sometimes do.
you came here at a pretty ugly time, usually it's not quite *this* awful.
(ok it's always this awful, but sometimes it's funnier.)
>Looks like a wasteland to me now. (and a waste of time)
"[ars] would have to be a hundred times more dignified
just to be called sleazy." -dennis erlich
>The ARSCC (which doesn't exist), in an insane war with an evil
>criminal cult. (which also doesn't exist) YAWN - how can
ok. true for you. it is true, the eeeevil sinister cult controlling the
world's governments does not exist, but instead a fairly squalid commercial
enterprise squeaking by on the 501(c)(3) it got through blackmail and
criminal harassment.
that doesn't make the illegitimacy of scn's 501(c)(3) any less a thing to
be opposed, and even with overblown rhetoric at times.
many of the other evils of scientology are also ones that we simply have to
tolerate--that they inflict a flagrantly bogus cosmology on their members
for instance. fortunately people choose to believe stupid things and have
the right to do so. no, not unfortunately, fortunately. while the endless
gaggles of idiots professing any manner of insane beliefs can be annoying,
it is a million times better than any filthy hellhole whee you are instead
forced to believe only what you are told.
but scientology does not stand for freedom, but for the right to have their
own lunatic beliefs while denying others rights to have lunatic beliefs
such as that scientology is an insane criminal cult.
(actually, it *is*.)
you can't hand freedom of speech to one bunch of loonies and then deny it
to others based on the fact that one bunch of loonies has millions of
dollars to file as many lawsuits as it needs to bankrupt you, whether the
charges are even true.
>combatants (either side) take this bull so seriously. ya all
>need to run repetitive "lighten up to EP" for a few hundred
>hrs. (and then maybe get a life)
grady ward has a life.
of coughing up two hundred bucks a month the rest of his life to a criminal
organization. freedom of speech? well, yeah. . .
but it ain't free.
>Yeh, from the perspective of this newsgroup
>the pickets etc. are very noble, brave etc.
>But from any rational perspective, picketers
>are mostly playing the role of the fool even
>though praised as heros in their own little world.
thanks for the vote of confidence. just so you know, people who exercise
their right to free speech, regardless of how expensive it is, preserve it
for those who sit on their ass and don't even exercise it.
>And what are Scientologists doing even bothering
>to post here. Why play with these people?
they have millions to make if they can just shut up all opposition.
i would think their motives are obvious.
>Usenet can be fun, entertaining, educational, and
>even useful. BUT... you can get so rapped up in it and
>so sucked into it that you think you're a warrior
>taking part in the making of history, when in reality
>you're jsut the same old you and you're just
>jerk jerking off. (to the cheers of other jerks
>doing the same)
perhaps so.
>Saving people from Scientology? Protecting the world
>from domination by an evil cult? Yeh, sure, whatever.
it is highly unlikely the cult will ever take over the world. it is more
likely something even more evil but less stupid is a greater threat.
>What a waste. All this time and effort could be going into
>something worthwhile or useful in the real world.
would that be the real world in which lisa mcpherson died, or the real
world in which people remain in the RPF?
>Didn't see it at the time, but Bernie was right all along. Ya all
>are whatchya think you're fighting. All of ya.
at times, yes. it is still worth the fight to keep those times to a
minimum, and end that which is opposed.
>But of course YOU know the TRUTH and you're so damn right
>and now ya got yourself in a position ya can never back away from.
dude. you do not *know* how many positions i have backed away from.
>Of such things are traps made.
if scn ends the worst of its abuses and becomes merely as nasty and abusive
as any other run-of-the-mill goof-group, i will be flyin' out of here so
fast you wouldn't believe it.
i ain't seen it yet. i think the nutsiness of scientology has only begun.
>ROCKY (the yawning flying squirell)
rob
Dave Bird---St Hippo of Augustine
In article <19980920050928...@ng127.aol.com>,
>criminal cult. (which also doesn't exist) YAWN - how can
>need to run repetitive "lighten up to EP" for a few hundred
>hrs. (and then maybe get a life)
Yeah, moron, get one for Lisa MacPherson while your there---
she needs one because $cientology took hers.
--
' ' ' .:::. ' :: ' ' 'what do Scientologists say when ' http://www.
' (o\ /o) .::. ' you ask why their money-grubbing ' xemu.demon.
' \ " / XEMU ' killed a woman by starvation? ' co.uk '
' '-' :::: ' ' ' ' ' ' ' ' ' ' ' ' ' ' ' ' ' ' ' ' ' ' ' ' '
' :v: \'''| ' BIGOT BIGOT BIGOT '
' ;;\:::/;;\/ / ' OO / / \ ? '
' ;;;;;;;;;BEER ' (~~) .00 @@-._ \ '
' WithAKick\/ ' ( ) ( =) (O ) ( ") (" )
' 'LikeAnHBomb ' ' ' ' ^^^^ ' ' ^^ ^^ ' ' ' ' ^^ ^^ ' ' "" ' ""
Inducto
>Helluva thing to read this newsgroup after not reading it
>for over a year.
>
>ARS has become a carricature of itself. Ugly sonbitch.
Interesting, it seems that it might well be said of CoS that it has devolved
into a caricature of itself, that an organization supposedly dedicated to
spiritual pursuits and "clearing" members of their reactive tendencies now
sends people out to taunt picketers and petulantly counter-picket private
homes. But then again, Hubbard had some interesting and insightful things to
say about how people accuse others of the things that reflect their own
behavioral faults.....
It seems from time to time we get someone "dropping in" with a long rant that
almost looks like a calculated attempt to demoralize, a siren song along the
lines of "why struggle, it't pointless" just as made by the WWII broadcasts of
Berlin Betty or Tokyo Rose. Amusingly, such "merchants of chaos" (as CoS
derisively categorizes the voices that predict gloom and doom) were saying
similar things last year -- and probably the year before that -- about how
a.r.s. had decayed into uselessness, so it sounds like and old and worn line.
a.r.s. goes though its ups and downs, and while there is a good bit of posting
by "critics" I don't like and think is counterproductive, I can't see any basis
for making an argument that a.r.s. has gotten _worse_. I'd say the overall, if
long-tmer effect of a.r.s. is quite clear, in things like CoS' increasingly
desperate reactions to pickets, and the media increasingly reciting the outline
CoS' "space opera" including Xenu and referring to CoS "claims" of millions of
members (rather than referring to it as fact). And it seems clear that the
Internet has just in the last year brought out and brought together some some
people like Ishmael, SB, and the man who may turn out to be CoS' most
troublesome defection to date -- Jesse Prince. That's quite an effect. I've
also been quite impressed when interacting with Gen-Xers and computer system
administrators, how many people are at least peripherally aware of the
controversy surrounding CoS and the organization's reputation for bad behavior.
I'd be hesitant to give weight to any grandiose claims for the effectiveness of
a.r.s.; it may actually be more quiet movements like the Freezone that will
dismantle CoS' abusive monopoly in the end. But I'd hardly discount it,
especially the subtle effects of widespread international publicity of CoS'
questionable organizational behavior.
I.
SIGSIGSIGSIGSIGSIGSIGSIGSIGSIGSIGSIGSIGSIGSIGSIGSIGSIGSIGSIGSIGSIGSIG
Induct YourSELF into new realities
Avoid highwaymen on the road to personal and spiritual betterment -- beware
dead ends and unlit paths
DeadAgent1
s>ubject: Re: The de-evolution of ARS
>From: Valerie <jema...@bellsouth.net>
>Date: 9/20/98 2:53 AM Pacific Daylight Time
>Message-id: <6u2jah$j...@drn.newsguy.com>>says...
>>
>>
>>
>>Helluva thing to read this newsgroup after not reading it
>>for over a year.
>>
>> BUT... you can get so rapped up in it and
>>so sucked into it that you think you're a warrior
>>taking part in the making of history, when in reality
>>you're jsut the same old you and you're just
>>jerk jerking off. (to the cheers of other jerks
>>doing the same)
>
>
>>are whatchya think you're fighting. All of ya.
>
A truly gifted child no doubt.
>
>>ROCKY (the yawning flying squirell)
>
>Wordclear squirrel, dear, it only has one 'l'.
>
>Valerie
Yeh, I know. After a few beers my spellchecker don't work right.
Rocky (the flying squirrel)
DeadAgent1
>Subject: Re: The de-evolution of ARS
>From: Dobe...@xenu.COM (Dobe R Mann)
>Date: 9/20/98 10:11 AM Pacific Daylight Time
>Message-id: <6u3d2c$rha$1...@grouper.exis.net>>(DeadAgent1) wrote:
>
>[chomp]
>
>>criminal cult. (which also doesn't exist) YAWN - how can
>word clear your MU
>
>
>
>
>word clear your MU
>
>
>
>Dobe R Mann
>SP2 Tone 1.95
word clear your ass.
Rocky (the flying squirrel)
DeadAgent1
>Subject: Re: The de-evolution of ARS
>Date: 9/19/98 6:11 PM Pacific Daylight Time
>Message-id: <36045277...@news.mindspring.com>
>
>On 20 Sep 1998 09:09:28 GMT, deada...@aol.com (DeadAgent1) wrote:
>
>>Helluva thing to read this newsgroup after not reading it
>>for over a year.
>
>>ARS has become a carricature of itself. Ugly sonbitch.
>
>how could it be a caricature of itself? it was already a caricature of
>itself when you left, if you really are rocky the flying squirrel and not
>some impostor or OSA agent or something.
>
>(shit. . .that's what you're talking about, right?)
Yeh, Hi Rob. I stand corrected.
>
>>ARS = the mother of all on-line cultish groups.
>>And the mother of all straw dogs, is the ARSCC
>>version of Scientology
>
>LRH sez "what you resist you become." while not a guaranteed truth, it is
>a good warning sign for those who go out to be an "anti" anything. it is
>hard not to be a mirror to what you despise, but it is worthwhile to try
>not to do so while continuing to oppose it.
Yep, wonder how often when we get super into an anti cause it is because it
mirrors something in oursleves we don't wanr to look at.
>
>>We used to have some fun on this NG, (believe it or not)
>
>actually those of us here sometimes do.
>
>you came here at a pretty ugly time, usually it's not quite *this* awful.
>(ok it's always this awful, but sometimes it's funnier.)
Maybe I'll stick around a while and put on my funny "hat."
>
>>Looks like a wasteland to me now. (and a waste of time)
>
>"[ars] would have to be a hundred times more dignified
> just to be called sleazy." -dennis erlich
LOL!
>
>>The ARSCC (which doesn't exist), in an insane war with an evil
>>criminal cult. (which also doesn't exist)
<snip>
>grady ward has a life.
>of coughing up two hundred bucks a month the rest of his life to a criminal
>organization. freedom of speech? well, yeah. . .
>but it ain't free.
>
>>Yeh, from the perspective of this newsgroup
>>the pickets etc. are very noble, brave etc.
>>But from any rational perspective, picketers
>>are mostly playing the role of the fool even
>>though praised as heros in their own little world.
>
>thanks for the vote of confidence. just so you know, people who exercise
>their right to free speech, regardless of how expensive it is, preserve it
>for those who sit on their ass and don't even exercise it.
Read a couple of posts with that spin, Rob.
Freedom of speech IS free. Just don't screw
with people's copyrights who are for sure going to sue ya. Don't take a lot of
brains to see that. Notice Dennis is all into legal mode now too, but it's all
after the fact. He was in the hellwithyaandyourdamnlawers mode when he posted
the stuff. More power to him, but the rewrite of ARS history is pretty lame and
the
free speech aint free spin is pretty lame..
<snip>
>
>>Saving people from Scientology? Protecting the world
>>from domination by an evil cult? Yeh, sure, whatever.
>
>it is highly unlikely the cult will ever take over the world. it is more
>likely something even more evil but less stupid is a greater threat.
>
>>What a waste. All this time and effort could be going into
>>something worthwhile or useful in the real world.
>
>would that be the real world in which lisa mcpherson died, or the real
>world in which people remain in the RPF?
No disrespect to Lisa's memory, but playing
the "Lisa Card" don't mean much to me, and
the RPF ain't all that it's cracked down to be either.
<snip>
>>and now ya got yourself in a position ya can never back away from.
>
>dude. you do not *know* how many positions i have backed away from.
Believe ya. I remember the bomb
threat crap. Least you had the gutts
to finally fess up. As opposed to Klemsrud
who never came straight over the miss
bloodybutt thing. (but think all but maybe
a few of the real slow folk figured it out in the end)
>
>>Of such things are traps made.
>
>if scn ends the worst of its abuses and becomes merely as nasty and abusive
>as any other run-of-the-mill goof-group, i will be flyin' out of here so
>fast you wouldn't believe it.
Ya should of left by now. It ain't THAT bad.
You've been fed a diet of horror stories
for too long. On the other hand where the hell would ya go?
Take care of your own self, Rob.
Rocky (the flying squirrel)
DeadAgent1
>Subject: Re: The de-evolution of ARS
>Date: 9/20/98 1:05 PM Pacific Daylight Time
>Message-id: <VDKRu6AK...@xemu.demon.co.uk>
>>combatants (either side) take this bull so seriously. ya all
>>need to run repetitive "lighten up to EP" for a few hundred
>>hrs. (and then maybe get a life)
>
> Yeah, moron, get one for Lisa MacPherson while your there---
> she needs one because $cientology took hers.
Hey, hippo freak, bite me
Rocky (the flying squirrel).
space...@my-dejanews.com
A: We are DEVO!
-----== Posted via Deja News, The Leader in Internet Discussion ==-----
http://www.dejanews.com/rg_mkgrp.xp Create Your Own Free Member Forum
clei...@bc.cc.ca.us
space...@my-dejanews.com wrote:
> Q: Are we not clams?
>
> A: We are DEVO!
They say L-Ron
conceived his scams
evolving up
from little clams
I say it's all
just flame and spams
ARE WE NOT MEN?
WE ARE XENU!
BANALITYBO
>> Q: Are we not clams?
>>
>> A: We are DEVO!
>
>They say L-Ron
>conceived his scams
>evolving up
>from little clams
>I say it's all
>just flame and spams
>
>ARE WE NOT MEN?
>WE ARE XENU!
>
>
You may be on to something here. Those weird 'Hub(bard)cap' type hats they
wear seem uncannily made of.......tinfoil!
Banalitybo.
space...@my-dejanews.com
clei...@bc.cc.ca.us wrote:
>
>
> space...@my-dejanews.com wrote:
>
> > Q: Are we not clams?
> >
> > A: We are DEVO!
>
> They say L-Ron
> conceived his scams
> evolving up
> from little clams
> I say it's all
> just flame and spams
>
> ARE WE NOT MEN?
> WE ARE XENU!
ARE WE NOT MEN?
X-E-N-U
We're critics now
Laughing at them
Lined up to pay
For OT ten
ARE WE NOT MEN?
WE ARE XENU!
ARE WE NOT MEN?
X-E-N-U
dimb...@my-dejanews.com
David M. Cook
>We used to have some fun on this NG, (believe it or not)
We? I've been hanging around here since the days Woody and Vile Vera and I
think people are probably having more fun now. The wogs are definitely at
cause here and having a great time doing it.
Anyway, check out the Toronto picket reports. Sounds like they had a blast.
Dave Cook
clei...@bc.cc.ca.us
dimb...@my-dejanews.com wrote:
> In article <6u4slf$vk2$1...@nnrp1.dejanews.com>,
> space...@my-dejanews.com wrote:
> > Q: Are we not clams?
> >
> > A: We are DEVO!
>
> We must repeat!
Repeat? Or duplicate?
David Gerard
:I'd be hesitant to give weight to any grandiose claims for the effectiveness of
:a.r.s.; it may actually be more quiet movements like the Freezone that will
:dismantle CoS' abusive monopoly in the end. But I'd hardly discount it,
:especially the subtle effects of widespread international publicity of CoS'
:questionable organizational behavior.
a.r.s doesn't take down the CoS directly, but it does provides breathing
space for everyone else - fuel for the Web pages, fuel (with the web pages)
for the media, the safety of publicity for the Free Zone, a place where
critics can meet up, something to distract the attention and energies of
the CoS ...
--
http://thingy.apana.org.au/~fun/ AGSF Unit 0|4 http://suburbia.net/~fun/
Stop JUNK EMAIL Boycott AMAZON.COM http://mickc.home.mindspring.com/index1.htm
"Unfortunately, what sells is quantity, at least if we're talking breasts or
explosions." (Aziraphale)
Michael Reuss
>Helluva thing to read this newsgroup after not reading it
>for over a year.
So who are you?
>ARS has become a carricature of itself. Ugly sonbitch.
Yep. A.r.s can be a bit contentious, and is not for everyone. For
example, it is not for weenies. Nor is it for Scientologists and
ex-Scientologists who still need to maintain the self-delusion and
attempt to sell to others, the idea that L.Ron Hubbard had discovered
something of actual value.
A.r.s is for the more intelligent among us, who can see plainly that LRH
was nothing but a fantasy-driven, megalomaniacal selfish prick, who
manipulated, exploited and brainwashed his followers for his own
personal gain.
>ARS = the mother of all on-line cultish groups.
Usually cults revolve around a singular leader, often a person with
charismatic appeal but always a person absolute authority within the
group. A.r.s is not a cult.
> ...mother of all straw dogs...
Hell, haven't you heard? A.r.s is a Hill-10 flap. Income is a-crashing.
Keep your eye on the ball.
>We used to have some fun on this NG, (believe it or not)
We did? I don't remember. Who are you? What did you enjoy 1 year ago?
>Looks like a wasteland to me now. (and a waste of time)
Guess you won't be sticking around then. I'll say G'Bye now.
>The ARSCC (which doesn't exist), in an insane war with an evil
>criminal cult.
Why do you think this political and memetic war is insane? I think it's
doing a good job at steering new marks away from the lying street
recruiters, and also doing a good job of exposing the cult celebrities
as gullible fools as much as successful spirits.
>(which also doesn't exist) YAWN - how can
>combatants (either side) take this bull so seriously.
For some of us, it's meaningful to prevent the deaths of future Lisa
McPhersons, Patrick Vics, Noah Lotticks of the world.
>ya all need to run repetitive "lighten up to EP" for a few hundred
>hrs. (and then maybe get a life)
And maybe Y'all need to mind your own fucking business and let each
person decide what's important for themselves.
>Yeh, from the perspective of this newsgroup
>the pickets etc. are very noble, brave etc.
Yes, they are.
>But from any rational perspective, picketers
>are mostly playing the role of the fool even
>though praised as heros in their own little world.
Not true. For many uninformed people, of course, the idea of picketers
is strange. For those who have lost their families inside the rat-hole
of a festering cult, the sight of picketers is a sign of much needed and
healthy exposure of the wrongdoing and spiritual sickness that defines
many cults, and which is definitely present inside Scientology.
>And what are Scientologists doing even bothering
>to post here. Why play with these people?
I'll attempt to answer for them. They post here because we're a Hill-10
flap. They can't leave us alone, they must "handle" us. Hubbard said.
>Usenet can be fun, entertaining, educational, and
>even useful. BUT... you can get so rapped up in it and
>so sucked into it that you think you're a warrior
>taking part in the making of history,
Ah, so you're a historian?
Actually, this little political exercise against Scientology may very
well go down in history, particularly if it demonstrates a procedural
model for ridiculing and exposing and discrediting a future, more
serious totalitarian threat to public welfare. That would be a good
thing, wouldn't it?
>when in reality
>you're jsut the same old you and you're just
>jerk jerking off. (to the cheers of other jerks
>doing the same)
And now you're stroking right along with us. Btw, have you read the
stories about LRH participating in sex-magic rituals back in the early
50's? I'll bet he circle jerked with the best of them.
>Saving people from Scientology?
By jove, I think you've got it.
>Protecting the world
>from domination by an evil cult?
By jove, I think you've got it.
>Yeh, sure, whatever.
Lookee here, a vote of near confidence.
>What a waste. All this time and effort could be going into
>something worthwhile or useful in the real world.
Might I respectfully suggest that since you seem to know how it should
be done, why don't *you* go do something you think of as useful and
worthwhile, and when you've finished, come back and give us a full
report. We'll excuse one or two off-topic intrusions.
>Didn't see it at the time, but Bernie was right all along.
Bernie can be a clueless git when he sets his mind to it. And he sets
his mind to it a lot. I attribute this facet of his personality to being
some sort of emotional hangover from the days when he was addicted to
the intensity of being a fanatical Scientologist. To get his fix, Bernie
submitted to the mental conditioning of the whole Scientology
brainwashing program. To this day, he does not seem to understand how
his current opinions on Scientology and cults in general, reflect the
training and repetition and conditioning that Scientology intentionally
processed into him.
>Ya all are whatchya think you're fighting. All of ya.
If your theory is correct, now you're one of us, too!
>But of course YOU know the TRUTH and you're so damn right
>and now ya got yourself in a position ya can never back away from.
Show me a truth that sells for $350,000.00 and I'll show you a scam.
>Of such things are traps made.
Traps are made of many things, Rocky. Sometimes traps are made of things
fraudulently represented as the only path to true spiritual freedom.
--
Michael Reuss (remove nospam from address to reply by e-mail)
Honorary Kid
Steve A
Reuss) wrote:
> >deada...@aol.com (DeadAgent1) wrote:
> >ya all need to run repetitive "lighten up to EP" for a few hundred
> >hrs. (and then maybe get a life)
>
> And maybe Y'all need to mind your own fucking business and let each
> person decide what's important for themselves.
Actually, I do think DeadAgent1 has a point here.
Since *my* absence from a.r.s., I've noticed a distinct fall in the
humour level - and tolerance level - here. Good example: the
woodnoodle troll. I remember when <fx: quavering voice, rheumy eyes>
the original Woodies were here, and the responses to *them* were
generally more lighthearted than the ones to this troll, which I
happen to think is an exquisite pastiche of the original 'bots.
Another example: the flamethrowing over Stephen Jones's querying of
the credentials of another critic. To me, it was obvious what Stephen
was doing, but I haven't seen many responses from others who think
similarly.
I *know* that a lot of what we're on about here is deadly serious, but
it doesn't hurt to laugh - hell, there are now Scienos here who can
demonstrate a better sense of humour than most of us.
What we need is another Troutman (although I wonder if *he* wouldn't
get flamed nowadays for not being "serious" or "committed" enough...
--
Steve A, SP4++, GGBC, KBM, Unsalvageable PTS/SP #12,
pitiable little Dennie (plD) #1
Banned by Windows 1984 ScienoSitter (2e+isp)
"Where don't they want you to go today?" - http://www.xenu.net
Anonymous
>LRH was nothing but a fantasy-driven, megalomaniacal selfish prick, who
>manipulated, exploited and brainwashed his followers for his own
>personal gain.
>the cult celebrities
>as gullible fools as much as successful spirits.
>the deaths of future Lisa
>McPhersons, Patrick Vics, Noah Lotticks of the world.
>the rat-hole
>of a festering cult
>spiritual sickness that defines
>many cults
>ridiculing and exposing and discrediting a future, more
>serious totalitarian threat to public welfare.
>have you read the
>stories about LRH participating in sex-magic rituals back in the early
>50's? I'll bet he circle jerked with the best of them.
>mental conditioning of the whole Scientology
>brainwashing program.
>scam.
Dave Bird
<ste...@castlsys.demon.co.uk> writes
>On Mon, 05 Oct 1998 07:20:41 GMT, mre...@rmi.nospam.net (Michael
>Reuss) wrote:
>
>> >deada...@aol.com (DeadAgent1) wrote:
>> >hrs. (and then maybe get a life)
>>
>> And maybe Y'all need to mind your own fucking business and let each
>> person decide what's important for themselves.
>
>
>Since *my* absence from a.r.s., I've noticed a distinct fall in the
>humour level - and tolerance level - here. Good example: the
>woodnoodle troll. I remember when <fx: quavering voice, rheumy eyes>
>the original Woodies were here, and the responses to *them* were
>generally more lighthearted than the ones to this troll, which I
>happen to think is an exquisite pastiche of the original 'bots.
Yeah, I like WoodNoodle. Some people are using their sense of humour
here, one of the main things dintinguinshing us from the cold-shelfish
attitudes of our opponents.
|~/ |~/
~~|;'^';-._.-;'^';-._.-;'^';-._.-;'^';-._.-;||';-._.-;'^';||_.-;'^'0-|~~
P | Woof Woof, Glug Glug ||____________|| 0 | P
O | Who Drowned the Judge's Dog? | . . . . . . . '----. 0 | O
O | answers on *---|_______________ @__o0 | O
L |{a href="news:alt.religion.scientology"}{/a}_____________|/_______| L
and{a href="http://www.xemu.demon.co.uk/clam/lynx/q0.html"}{/a}XemuSP4(:)
Rob Clark
>>Michael Reuss wrote:
>>Actually, this little political exercise against Scientology may very
>>well go down in history,
>The entirity of ARS and its regulars will
>never warrant even a footnote in any history
>book. (Might warrant a footnote in some study
>of early on-line hate groups though)
actually it's already taken up full chapters of a couple books already, and
that's before it's even got to a reasonable "stopping point" where the
upcoming books will stop. i would guess the end of the erlich case would
make such a stopping point.
>You're overestimation of your own and your
>fellow loons self-importance is amusing to say the least.
wow. are you admitting your cult is completely idiotic to have spent
millions of dollars trying to stop insignificant loons? that would make
you pretty pathetically stupid as a cult. no wonder you're shrinking, if
your biggest enemy is a friggin newsgroup containing nothing but loons.
rob
RonsAmigo
>Michael Reuss wrote:
>Actually, this little political exercise against Scientology may very
>well go down in history,
The entirity of ARS and its regulars will
never warrant even a footnote in any history
book. (Might warrant a footnote in some study
of early on-line hate groups though)
You're overestimation of your own and your
fellow loons self-importance is amusing to say the least.
Amigo
Martin O'Brien
>
>>Michael Reuss wrote:
>
>>Actually, this little political exercise against Scientology may very
>>well go down in history,
>
>The entirity of ARS and its regulars will
>never warrant even a footnote in any history
>book. (Might warrant a footnote in some study
>of early on-line hate groups though)
>
>You're overestimation of your own and your
>fellow loons self-importance is amusing to say the least.
>
>
>Amigo
You could say the same thing about your church.
Martin O'B
<<Visit "No More Lies",my anti-scientology site>>
<< http://www.tiac.net/users/martyo/ >>
<< mar...@tiac.net >>
Dobe R Mann
>On 11 Oct 1998 09:51:03 GMT, rons...@aol.com (RonsAmigo) wrote:
[chomp]
>
>>You're overestimation of your own and your
>>fellow loons self-importance is amusing to say the least.
>
>wow. are you admitting your cult is completely idiotic to have spent
>millions of dollars trying to stop insignificant loons? that would make
>you pretty pathetically stupid as a cult. no wonder you're shrinking, if
>your biggest enemy is a friggin newsgroup containing nothing but loons.
OUCH! Hey...RonsPendejo!...what are you going to do next? Stick your other
foot in your mouth?
Very nice double-curve-around, Rob. What do you think RonsPendejo will
splutter back to logic? [My bet .... he ignores (un-postulates) your reply.]
Good Shot!
>
>rob
Dobe R Mann
SP2 Tone 1.95
Ben The Allen
wrote:
>On 11 Oct 1998 09:51:03 GMT, rons...@aol.com (RonsAmigo) wrote:
>
>>>Michael Reuss wrote:
>
>>>Actually, this little political exercise against Scientology may very
>>>well go down in history,
>
>>The entirity of ARS and its regulars will
>>never warrant even a footnote in any history
>>book. (Might warrant a footnote in some study
>>of early on-line hate groups though)
>
>actually it's already taken up full chapters of a couple books already, and
>that's before it's even got to a reasonable "stopping point" where the
>upcoming books will stop. i would guess the end of the erlich case would
>make such a stopping point.
>
The only one I can think of off the top of my head is that net.wars
book by that Wired chick...what else has been done?
---
Ben Allen,
Of course, it has to be *Kevin's* dead cat to count.
hei...@wport.com
Lame stuff is fun.
remove e and l to e-mail
Garry
> >Michael Reuss wrote:
>
> >Actually, this little political exercise against Scientology may very
> >well go down in history,
>
> The entirity of ARS and its regulars will
> never warrant even a footnote in any history
> book. (Might warrant a footnote in some study
> of early on-line hate groups though)
Doubtful on both counts. Might qualify for a future book on "The wierd
and wacky", however.
>
>
Tashback
rons...@aol.com (RonsAmigo) wrote:
> The entirity of ARS and its regulars will
> never warrant even a footnote in any history
> book. (Might warrant a footnote in some study
> of early on-line hate groups though)
The study's already been done. It was called "Silencing Scientology's
Critics on the Internet: A Mission Impossible?" and it was published in
December 1997 in the journal _Communications and the Law_.
Here's an excerpt:
"Even church members are prohibited from reading the OT documents before
they have undergone hours of auditing to attain an adequate level of
spiritual preparation. And, because during the auditing process
Scientologists are hooked up to a lie detector, their beliefs must be
sincere. That means to legally access these documents one must (1) become
a member of the church; (2) pay the required donations; and (3) accept
church doctrine. In other words, one must buy into the church doctrine
literally and figuratively before being allowed to actually read it. That
is profoundly in violation of the spirit of the fair use doctrine and the
purpose of copyright law.
"It also is a violation of the spirit of the Internet. As the Church of
Scientology discovered, trying to plug an information leak in the Internet
is a losing battle ..."
_____
Brill, A., & Packard, A. (1997). Silencing Scientology's critics on the
Internet: A mission impossible? _Communications and the Law_, 19 (4),
1-23.
Tash
Gregg Hagglund
>>Michael Reuss wrote:
>
>>Actually, this little political exercise against Scientology may very
>>well go down in history,
>
>The entirity of ARS and its regulars will
>never warrant even a footnote in any history
>book. (Might warrant a footnote in some study
>of early on-line hate groups though)
>
>You're overestimation of your own and your
>fellow loons self-importance is amusing to say the least.
>
>
>Amigo
Jealous aren't you! The heinous and arrogant
activities of the Co$ against the Internet have made
the Usenet Group alt.religion.scientology a landmark
in the history of the Modern Age of Communication
on the Net.
The Co$ too, will have, in the future as it does now,
a place in history as one of the most despicable stains
upon US legal history fro the abuses the Co$ has
perpetuated.
The Co$ already has a place of infamy in Greece,
Spain and Canada as being a Criminal Organisation.
How do you feel when you see the Co$ lying for $?
Proud?
---
["You know, people die if they criticize scientology -
I should take care if I were you."
-Marcus Nyman, OSA (former GO), $cio-org, Stockholm, Sweden.]
Gregg Hagglund SP5
Rendered Net Invisible to
Participating Victims of Co$.
Toronto Picket Reports now at:
<http://www.geocities.com/HotSprings/Spa/8412/>
Michael Reuss
>>Michael Reuss wrote:
>>Actually, this little political exercise against Scientology may very
>>well go down in history,
>The entirity of ARS and its regulars will
>never warrant even a footnote in any history
>book. (Might warrant a footnote in some study
>of early on-line hate groups though)
Now I know this is going to sound harsh, but that can't be helped. Your
opinion of the probably historical significance of a.r.s as a precedent
setting newsgroup dealing with absolutist political organizations is
basically worthless, RonsAmigo. After all, you're one of the ones
apologizing for the cult and pushing to keep what most of us here have
decided is an unacceptable status quo.
Now all that could change, of course, if you were to suddenly come up
with the definitive ethical argument which convinces all 28 of us that
we were wrong about Scientology's over arching desire to hurt it's
political enemies. Of course, since Hubbard says hurting your critics is
to be Scientology's SOP, it's MO, it's sacred duty (combined with the
fact that all you "good" Scientologists) seem so willing to obey what
Hubbard, and now his assigns, say on the subject), it's my guess that
this will be an extremely difficult argument for you to craft.
But please do keep trying if you find this exercise to be an important
facet of maintaining your own rationalizations for why it is okay to
rabidly attack your political enemies...
>You're overestimation of your own and your
>fellow loons self-importance is amusing to say the least.
With all due respect, RonsAmigo, we critics of Scientology are not the
ones selling the idea to confused, lonely, and emotionally vulnerable
suckers (for either the not insignificant sum of $360,000.00, or a
lifetime of near slave labor, take your pick), that they will be able to
attain magical demi-god status, fully able to control with a thought
such mundane components of our physical universe as matter, energy,
space and time. We're not the ones convincing ourselves through a
program of organized mental conditioning via hypnosis, groupthink, and
group reinforcement, that we will be able to bring dead bodies back to
life. No, it is Scientology OwE tEes like you and John Travolta that do
that.
So if you really want to see some (as you say) "loons" whose sense of
self-importance may not be terribly well-grounded in objective reality,
then I'd strongly suggest that you begin by looking just a bit closer to
home.
Michael Reuss
> mre...@rmi.nospam.net (Michael Reuss) wrote:
>>>deada...@aol.com (DeadAgent1) wrote:
>>>ya all need to run repetitive "lighten up to EP" for a few hundred
>>>hrs. (and then maybe get a life)
>> And maybe Y'all need to mind your own fucking business and let each
>> person decide what's important for themselves.
>Actually, I do think DeadAgent1 has a point here.
Yes, but his/her hair covers it nicely!
[ba-dump-bump!]
>Since *my* absence from a.r.s.,
Me, my, mine, it's always got to be about YOU, doesn't it, Steve A. Well
I'm sick of your infernal narcissism. Sick, do you hear? Sick, sick,
sick. Let's talk about *me* for a change.
;-)
>I've noticed a distinct fall in the humour level
[Stanley Kowalski Mode ON] Hah! [Stanley Kowalski Mode OFF] Read my
righteously funny joke above and you will notice that I have, with
absolute and total finality, invalidated this claim.
> - and tolerance level - here. Good example: the
>woodnoodle troll. I remember when <fx: quavering voice, rheumy eyes>
Get a grip on yourself, man.
>the original Woodies were here, and the responses to *them* were
>generally more lighthearted than the ones to this troll, which I
>happen to think is an exquisite pastiche of the original 'bots.
Now I enjoy a good troll as much as the next SP. It's only too bad the
current woodnoodle isn't one. But I'm all for tolerance. We have to let
the sombaitch try, fer goodnessakes. How the heck's he gonna get any
better if he doesn't practice?
>Another example: the flamethrowing over Stephen Jones's querying of
>the credentials of another critic. To me, it was obvious what Stephen
>was doing, but I haven't seen many responses from others who think
>similarly.
I'm not sure if we're thinking about the same incident, but a few months
back some relative newbies who were unfamiliar with his colorful history
here, really badly misinterpreted Stephen's biting satire. I think
people who misinterpret Stephen's satire posts and then rail at him for
being a cultie apologist are amazingly funny. I'll bet those folks make
Stephen chuckle for days.
>I *know* that a lot of what we're on about here is deadly serious, but
>it doesn't hurt to laugh -
Indeed it does hurt to laugh, like if you have broken ribs, and stuff
like that. Ah-ha, so you're wrong, and I caught you in a lie, you liar.
Liar, liar, you're a hateful liar.
But other than the fact that you lied, fatally breaking your sacred
trust with this newsgroup for all time, your point is well taken. ;-)
In fact, your argument is so compelling, from now on, there will be
serious penalties meted out by the ARSCC for those failing to see the
humorous side. We'll damn sure make you lighten up, or your butt will be
in some serious trouble.
Now the first offense will send you off to ARSCCRPF, where you will be
forced to view hour-long Judy Garland TV specials. If you screw up on
the RPF, if your mind still isn't right, you will then be forced into
the dreaded ARSCC RPFs RPF. Here you will be forced to view hour long
Liza Minelli TV specials...
Then, if you still need an attitude readjustment, it's RPF^^3. In
RPF^^3, you are strapped down to a comfy couch, your eyes are taped
open, and you are forced to view reruns of old Judy Garland, Mickey
Rooney movies. The thought of this torture is so immediate, so powerful,
that no one has ever failed to feel rehabilitated after ARSCC RPFs RPF.
>hell, there are now Scienos here who can
>demonstrate a better sense of humour than most of us.
Oh geez, I hope you're not talking about Wonderfool. Because he really
does try, bless his heart. But every time he says something that
approaches amusing, I always think back to his web site and then that
enjoyable feeling of levity is gone before it starts...
>What we need is another Troutman (although I wonder if *he* wouldn't
>get flamed nowadays for not being "serious" or "committed" enough...
Nah, Troutman is one of those Kubla K'han, no, Genghis, no, Chaka K'han
thingies (he's one of those guys like Hubbard said, someone who can do
no wrong due to their past greatness).
Finally, just in case nothing in this post tickled YOUR fancy, here is
one final ObJoke:
Q: How many [fill in your own] does it take to [fill in your own]?
A: None, the [fill in your own here] forgot to [fill in your own]
[ba-dump-bump!]
(Only the toughest critics don't like that joke)
Bobby Parker
Bobby Parker
Bobby Parker
miKe
Bobby Parker wrote in message
<20941-36...@newsd-103.iap.bryant.webtv.net>...
>Is you're scieno net nanny not working Amigo?
what is this supposed to mean ? The filter installation is voluntary.
>Why do clams post here so often even though they are advised not to?
Well i can only speak for myself, but I post here because there is a vast
lack of true data in this newsgroup. I hope that that the open-minded people
who still have the ability to think for themselves after reading the crap
that critics post here and on the web, will be able to make their own
decision and learn the truth for themselves.
>Why does "public relations" post here?
Why dont you email public relations and find out instead of asking somebody
else ? Ill assume the reason is similar to my own.
>Who here has "overestimated" his/her "self-importance?"
It is obvious reading from some of the more fanatical critics here that they
revel in what they (think) they are doing, and greatly over estimate the
importance of this newsgroup and themselves. I dont believe that the actions
taken by people who post here affect the church in any way. People are still
finding out for themselves what Dianetics and Scientology are, and how they
can be helped by them. These are people who can think for themselves, are
not swayed by hatred and bigotry, and who search for and respect the truth.
>Clams also confuse bigotry with a feeling of moral
>obligation to expose dangerous cults.
no. what the critic here is doing is posting hate, lies, exaggeration,
distortion and misinformation about scientology. there is very little true
data posted here, and what is true is usually only posted by scientologists.
reading about the spew that is posted here about aliens and space ships isnt
learning about what scientology really is. reading about court cases and
your support of criminal acts by fellow critics is not learning what
scientology really is. going to a web site and reading about it, isnt
learning about what scientology really is. you have to study it and apply
it. scientology is an applied philosophy. truth comes from application and
knowing what scientology is to you as you apply it. all our lives are
different, therefore one must study it and apply it in ones own life to know
what it is.
miKe
Think For Yourself
http://www.scientology.org
Rebecca Jo McLaughlin
: no. what the critic here is doing is posting hate, lies, exaggeration,
: distortion and misinformation
the cult's buzz-words for criticism
: about scientology. there is very little
: true data posted here, and what is true is usually only posted by
: scientologists.
who rarely have the courage to post under their own names or provide
independent support for their assertions.
: reading about the spew that is posted here about aliens and space ships isnt
: learning about what scientology really is.
Than Xenu, implant stations, body thetans, marcabs, DC9s are all bullshit?
Why pay for it then? Why launch the cult's legal juggernaut at people who
quote from the OT levels?
: reading about court cases and
: your support of criminal acts by fellow critics is not learning what
: scientology really is.
Criminal acts? I beg your pardon? Would you care to list these
"criminal" acts?
Hint:
Criminal offense = Mary Sue Hubbard, the Founder's wife, and company
doing *jail time* for Operation Snow White.
Civil offense = Zenon or Keith publishing scieno-drek without permission
and being assessed a fine
: going to a web site and reading about it, isnt
: learning about what scientology really is.
Nope, it's learning about what Scientology really *does* as opposed to its
shiny, happy PR.
: truth comes from application and
: knowing what scientology is to you as you apply it. all our lives are
: different, therefore one must study it and apply it in ones own life to know
: what it is.
And if it doesn't work for you than it's *your* fault because the tech is
perfect. And if it isn't *your* fault than it's the fault of someone near
who is an evil, suppressive person and making everything go wrong.
: miKe
: Think For Yourself
(ah, the irony)
Beck
Keith Henson
: >Michael Reuss wrote:
: >Actually, this little political exercise against Scientology may very
: >well go down in history,
: The entirity of ARS and its regulars will
: never warrant even a footnote in any history
: book. (Might warrant a footnote in some study
: of early on-line hate groups though)
ROTF! We already have chapters in books on the net, and from what
I know about books in progress, there are several more coming.
: You're overestimation of your own and your
: fellow loons self-importance is amusing to say the least.
Amigo, you would be amazed at how high in the government this
little dustup is being watched. Keith Henson
Christopher Leithiser
Keith Henson wrote:
> RonsAmigo (rons...@aol.com) wrote:
>
> : >Michael Reuss wrote:
>
> : >Actually, this little political exercise against Scientology may very
> : >well go down in history,
>
> : The entirity of ARS and its regulars will
> : never warrant even a footnote in any history
> : book. (Might warrant a footnote in some study
> : of early on-line hate groups though)
>
> ROTF! We already have chapters in books on the net, and from what
> I know about books in progress, there are several more coming.
>
> : You're overestimation of your own and your
> : fellow loons self-importance is amusing to say the least.
>
> Amigo, you would be amazed at how high in the government this
> little dustup is being watched. Keith Henson
I look at ARS as the "picadors" in the $cientology bullfight. Constant
needling, keeping the cult off-balance, making it shoot off foot-bullets in
its maddened state. That the moment of truth will come elsewhere--probably
in a courtroom--does not make the preliminaries any less exciting.
Keep on charging, $cientology. Look! There's a red cape over there! No,
it's behind you!
(Note for the clue-impaired: this is what's called a "metaphor." No one
should attempt to counter the Co$ "bull" will a real sword. Your mileage
may vary. Void in Nebraska.)
Gigolo Pete
>Amigo, you would be amazed at how high in the government this
>little dustup is being watched. Keith Henson
More self-agrandizement.
Do you have any evidence at *all* about how "high in the government"
this "little dustup is being watched"?
Or, is it so hush-hush, top-secret compartmentalized, shsss,
mum's the word, wink wink say no more, that we'll just have to
take *your* word for it?
That's what I thought.
Dave Bird
spam.theta.freeserve.co.uk> writes
>Bobby Parker wrote in message
><20941-36...@newsd-103.iap.bryant.webtv.net>...
>
>>Is you're scieno net nanny not working Amigo?
>
>what is this supposed to mean ? The filter installation is voluntary.
It is a matter of contract if you have one of those identikit
"think for yourselves" webpages. The contract has been posted.
John C. Randolph
->
-> >Amigo, you would be amazed at how high in the government this
-> >little dustup is being watched. Keith Henson
->
-> More self-agrandizement.
Keith never claimed that the clamwar is being watched because of Keith, so
it's not self-agrandizement.
-> Do you have any evidence at *all* about how "high in the government"
-> this "little dustup is being watched"?
Yes, he does.
-> Or, is it so hush-hush, top-secret compartmentalized, shsss,
-> mum's the word, wink wink say no more, that we'll just have to
-> take *your* word for it?
Well, *you'll* just have to take Keith's word for it (or not) but some of us
have other sources.
-jcr
--
What the Bard *should* have said: "All the World's a Stage, and
all the Men and Women rather poorly rehearsed."
miKe
Dave Bird wrote in message <7ohc$tABRP...@xemu.demon.co.uk>...
>In article <702a5t$gig$2...@newsreader2.core.theplanet.net>, miKe <miKe@no-
>spam.theta.freeserve.co.uk> writes
>>what is this supposed to mean ? The filter installation is voluntary.
>
>It is a matter of contract if you have one of those identikit
>"think for yourselves" webpages. The contract has been posted.
yes, and you can either install it or not.
its called thinking for yourself.
miKe
Mike O'Connor
<mi...@no-spam.theta.freeserve.co.uk> wrote:
Have you signed the agreement excerpted below? If not, then the cult has
NOT granted you a non-exclusive, royalty-free right to say on your Web
site that you are a "Scientologist". If you want to say that, sign up or
risk prosecution for unauthorized use of the cult's collective membership
mark.
If you did sign it, then you are granted that right, but you have to allow
the cult to screen your Web site in advance; place pictures of L. Ron
Hubbard on your site if they wish; install the cult censorship software;
comply with all changes the cult wishes you to make on your Web site.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Dear Parishioner,
Church of Scientology International ("CSI") has been authorized to grant
you, as a Scientologist in good standing, the non-exclusive,
royaltee-free right to reproduce and display on your personal Web site the
collective membership mark "SCIENTOLOGIST"and the Scientology symbol, both
as shown on the attached Exhibit A ("The Marks"), upon certain terms and
conditions. If you agree to abide by these terms and conditions, this
letter will be your authorization, as long as you remain a Scientologist
in good standing and comply with all standards, specifications and
guidelines on such use of the Marks.
[...]
If you wish to use this authorization regarding the Marks and the Works,
you must:
(1) submit a copy of your proposed use of the Marks or any quotations from
the Works of L. Ron Hubbard to CSI and receive prior written approval on
any of these from CSI before putting up or adding to your Web site, and
also for any subsequent changes that you wish to make in your Web site;
(2) not use the Marks or copyrighted materials in any way or in
conjunction with any activities or materials that may be deemed improper
or a discredit to the Scientology religion;
(3) not use the Marks or the Works in any way or in conjunction with any
activities or materials that would violate the law;
(4) refrain from charging fees or other exchange connected to the Marks or
the Works;
(5) comply immediately and completely with any and all changes that CSI
may require in the Web site, including termination of use of the Marks and
the Works if required by CSI;
(6) agree to use the specific Internet Filter Program that CSI has
provided to you which allows you freedom to view other sites on Dianetics,
Scientology or its principals without threat of accessing sites deemed to
be using the Marks or Works in an unauthorized fashion or deemed to be
improper or discreditable to the Scientology religion; and
[...]
CSI reserves the right to revoke the rights set forth in this letter or
require modification or termination of the use of the Marks or the Works
on any Web site if, in CSI's judgement, you have failed to strictly comply
with the above conditions and/or have in any way endangered or otherwise
harmed the Marks or the Works.
Please sign, date and return this letter to indicate your acceptance of
these conditions.
Sincerely,
Church of Scientology
International
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Here is a list of the items censored by the cult censorship software you
are required to install if you want to call yourself a Scientologist on
your Web page:
From d32l.dll - sites you may not visit:
[alfa.ist.utl.pt]
[allison.clark.net]
[alnadeem.com/link]
[ww2.altavista.digital.com]
[amazing.com]
[ambassadorformankind.org]
[apollo.co.uk]
[art-org.com]
[barroom.visionsystems.com]
[bbcnc.org]
[berlin.snafu.de]
[blkbox.com]
[bsd.mojones.com]
[caboose.com]
[cam053212.student.utwente]
[cdnet.com]
[come.to/irc]
[comfind.com]
[copper.ucs.indiana.edu]
[csulib.ctstateu.edu]
[customer.gte.net]
[cyberconnect.com]
[dra.library.ualberta.ca]
[ducatalog.lib.duke.edu]
[ee1.bradley.edu]
[eng.bu.edu]
[entheta.net]
[eunet.bda.de]
[factnet.net]
[freethought.tamu.edu]
[freezone.de]
[freezone.org]
[fsinfo.cs.uni-sb.de]
[fza.org]
[gagme.wwa.com]
[galaxy.einet.net]
[gamma1.magnet.fsu]
[gil.ipswichcity.qld.gov.au]
[gnv.fdt.net]
[gopher.well.sf.ca.us]
[home.icon.fi]
[home.online.no]
[home.pi.ne]
[home.sn.no]
[home.sol.no]
[home.wxs.nl]
[home1.swipnet.se]
[homepage.cistron.nl]
[homepage.cistron]
[homepages.skylink.net]
[huizen.dds.nl]
[ibm.rhrz.uni-bonn.de]
[infotique.lm.com]
[inktomi.berkeley.edu]
[isotropic.com]
[jade.bucknell.edu]
[janus2.uoregon.edu]
[js.stir.ac.uk]
[julmara.ce.chalmers.se]
[kafka.uvic.ca]
[kalypso.cybercom.net]
[katharine.liswa.wa.gov.au]
[kauhajoki.fi]
[kentlink.kent]
[lagavulin.xs4all.nl]
[lapphp0.in2p3]
[lermanet.com]
[lib7.fisher.su.oz]
[libra.brhs.gen.tn]
[libraries.colorado]
[library.ucsc.edu]
[library.uow.edu.au]
[library.uq.edu]
[library.utulsa.edu]
[linkmaster.com]
[lola.plymouth]
[louis.brandeis]
[mail.bris.ac]
[mama.indstate.edu]
[marlowe.wimsey.com]
[mason.gmu.edu]
[mckinley.com]
[mediaport.org]
[mercury.uakron.edu]
[merlion.singnet.com.sg]
[metroscope.com]
[miles.ep2.ruhr-uni-bochum.de]
[minnow.razorfish.com]
[minyos.its.rmit.edu.au]
[miso.wwa.com]
[muse.library.carleton]
[newtoo.manifest.com]
[oakharbor.net]
[oka.ucr.edu]
[olc1.ohiolink]
[one-global.com]
[orion.it.luc.edu]
[ourworld.compuserve.com]
[pactech.ucsd.edu]
[parsys.cs.cmu.edu]
[peconic.net]
[pegasus.acs.ttu.edu]
[pharos.uwc.edu]
[pw1.netcom.com]
[qlink.queensu.ca]
[rainbow.rmii.com]
[rampages.onramp]
[regen.regent.edu]
[remarkable.amazing.com]
[sabio.library.Arizona.edu]
[search.dejanews.com]
[sefl.satelnet.org]
[sf.www.lysator.liu.se]
[sky.fit.qut.edu.au]
[sluggo.iaxs]
[starbase.neosoft.com]
[student.uq.edu.au]
[suburbia.net]
[superlink.net]
[swissnet.ai.mit.edu]
[thebiglist.com]
[thingy.apana.org.au]
[turbo.kean.edu]
[users.aimnet.com]
[utcat.library.utoronto.ca]
[village.vossnet.co.uk]
[vortex.netbistro.com]
[w2.dejanews.com]
[w3.ietc.ca]
[w3.one.net]
[w4u.eexi.gr]
[web.nexor.co.uk]
[weber.u.washington]
[webpointer.iworld]
[web-star.com]
[webwise.walcoff.com]
[winnie.math.tu-berlin]
[wit389310.student.utwente.nl]
[wpxx02.toxi.uni-wuerzburg.de]
[www.1mall.com]
[www.2ask.com]
[www.ability.org.uk]
[www.access.ch]
[www.ahandyguide.com]
[www.ahoynet.com]
[www.aip.org]
[www.aladin.wrlc]
[www.algonet.se]
[www.amazing.com]
[www.amsmain.com]
[www.anatomy.su.oz]
[www.anthrax.net]
[www.apana.org.au]
[www.aqui.ibm.com]
[www.arrowweb.com]
[www.arscc.com]
[www.astronomy.ohio-state]
[www.auburn.edu]
[www.avalon.demon.co.uk]
[www.aztec.co.za]
[www.bart.nl]
[www.bayern.de]
[www.bellnet.com]
[www.best.com]
[www.bielefeld.netsurf.de]
[www.biography.com]
[www.bizcom.com]
[www.bizweb.com]
[www.blvl.igs.net]
[www.bodensee-surfer.de]
[www.borg.com]
[www.bostonherald.com]
[www.brotherblue.org]
[www.caesar.elte.hu]
[www.caip.rutgers.edu]
[www.callaw.com]
[www.canvest.com]
[www.ccnet.com]
[www.cedar.net]
[www.cen.uiuc.edu]
[www.cforc.com]
[www.cgocable.net]
[www.channel1.com]
[www.charlies-playhouse.ch]
[www.cis.ohio-state.edu]
[www.cis.upenn.edu]
[www.cistron.nl]
[www.clark.net]
[www.clever.net]
[www.clinet]
[www.club.innet.be]
[www.cmu.edu]
[www.com.au]
[www.comfo.ca]
[www.copper.ucs.indiana]
[www.core.binghamton.edu]
[www.counsel.com]
[www.crl.com]
[www.cs.cmu.edu]
[www.cs.colostate.edu]
[www.cs.ruu]
[www.cs.utwente.nl]
[www.csclub.uwaterloo.ca]
[www.csj.org]
[www.ctaz.com]
[www.cybercom.net]
[www.cyber-espace.com]
[www.cyberspc.mb.ca]
[www.dataweb.net]
[www.dci.dk]
[www.dds.nl]
[www.dejanews.com]
[www.demon.co.uk]
[www.demon.co]
[www.df.lth.se]
[www.dgl.com]
[www.diku.dk]
[www.directory.net]
[www.dsdelft.nl]
[www.dtek.chalmers.se]
[www.eclipse.net]
[www.ecst.csuchico.edu]
[www.education-world.com]
[www.ee.ualberta.ca]
[www.eecs.nwu.edu]
[www.egr.uh.edu]
[www.emory.edu]
[www.empire.net]
[www.entheta.net]
[www.eskimo.com]
[www.euronet.nl]
[www.europa.com]
[www.ezlink.com]
[www.factnet.net]
[www.flashback.se]
[www.freezone.de]
[www.freezone.org]
[www.funet.fi]
[www.gate.net]
[www.germany-live.de]
[www.gil.com.au]
[www.globalxs.nl]
[www.god.co.uk]
[www.gold.net]
[www.gonix.com]
[www.guardian.co]
[www.haas.berkeley.edu]
[www.hackerz.org]
[www.hansenet.de]
[www.hartford-hwp.com]
[www.hcc.hawaii.edu]
[www.he.net]
[www.helsinki.fi]
[www.henge.com]
[www.hha.dk]
[www.hol.fr]
[www.homecom.com]
[www.i1.net]
[www.iaehv.nl]
[www.ibg.uu.se]
[www.ids.net]
[www.iea.com]
[www.ietc.ca]
[www.i-explorer.com]
[www.ifp.uni-stuttgart.de]
[www.iguide.com]
[www.iinet.net.au]
[www.iinet.net.au]
[www.imaginet.fr]
[www.imall.com]
[www.imsworld.com]
[www.incoma.ru]
[www.indobiz.com]
[www.indstate.edu]
[www.infidels.org]
[www.infinet.com]
[www.informan.demon.co.uk]
[www.inka.de]
[www.inlink.com]
[www.innosoft.com]
[www.inx.de]
[www.io.com]
[www.io.org]
[www.ipswichcity.qld.gov]
[www.iquest.net]
[www.islandnet.com]
[www.jmas.co]
[www.jpscott.demon.co.uk]
[www.jritson.demon.co.uk]
[www.juhessen.de]
[www.jumpcity.com]
[www.junge-union.de]
[www.keytech.com]
[www.kingworld.com]
[www.komando.com]
[www.landfield.com]
[www.lclark.edu]
[www.lermanet.com]
[www.lexiconn.com]
[www.lib.monash.edu.au]
[www.lib.ox.ac.uk]
[www.lightlink.com]
[www.linkstar.com]
[www.lns.nl]
[www.luna.nl]
[www.magna.com.au]
[www.magpie.co.uk]
[www.matador.recs.com]
[www.maths.tcd.ie]
[www.mbmarktconscom]
[www.mcp.com]
[www.mesa1.com]
[www.metaworld.com]
[www.mid]
[www.mit.edu]
[www.mlode.com]
[www.mopo.de]
[www.mpikg-teltow.mpg.de]
[www.multiweb.nl]
[www.mygale.org]
[www.ncf.carleton.ca]
[www.necronomi.com]
[www.NeoSoft.com]
[www.nerdworld.com]
[www.netaxs.com]
[www.netcom.com]
[www.netis.com]
[www.netmall.com]
[www.netside.net]
[www.nicoh.com]
[www.noord.bart.nl]
[www.oakharbor.net]
[www.omen.com.au]
[www.opentext.com]
[www.owlnet.rice.edu]
[www.pantheon.it]
[www.pasteur.fr]
[www.phoaks.com]
[www.phx.com]
[www.pi.net]
[www.pi.net]
[www.pilgrim.umass.edu]
[www.pointcom.com]
[www.prime.org]
[www.primenet.net]
[www.pro7.se]
[www.projectcool.com]
[www.pronett.com]
[www.prospernet.com]
[www.prospernet.com]
[www.proweb.co.uk]
[www.prysm.net]
[www.psy.vu.nl]
[www.rainfall.com]
[www.reynoldsenterprises.com]
[www.rickross.com]
[www.rnsn.com]
[www.rpi.net.au]
[www.rtis.com]
[www.sanctum.com.au]
[www.sbcomp.com]
[www.search.com]
[www.skeptic.com]
[www.sky.net]
[www.skylink.net]
[www.snafu.de]
[www.softdisk.com]
[www.softdisk.com]
[www.sol.no]
[www.sover.net]
[www.sover.net]
[www.spectracom.com]
[www.sptimes.com]
[www.sserv.com]
[www.stack.urc.tue.nl]
[www.starwatch.de]
[www.stbbs.com]
[www.stelling.nl]
[www.stern.de]
[www.stpt.com]
[www.streetside.com]
[www.stud.uni-hannover.de]
[www.suburbia.net]
[www.super.zippo.com]
[www.swisscom.ch]
[www.tampatrib.com]
[www.teleport.com]
[www.telesoft.ch]
[www.tezcat.com]
[www.the-spa.com]
[www.thingy.apana.org.au]
[www.thur.de]
[www.tiac.de]
[www.tiac.net]
[www.tidepool.com]
[www.times.st-pete.fl.us]
[www.toocool.com]
[www.traders.co]
[www.transcore.com]
[www.tribal.com]
[www.tricky.com]
[www.truenorth]
[www.ttu.edu]
[www.uit.no]
[www.ukdirectory.com]
[www.ultranet.com]
[www.uni-wuerzburg.de]
[www.update.uu.se]
[www.urbanlegends.com]
[www.users.cts.com]
[www.users.one.se]
[www.users.wineasy.se]
[www.utne.com]
[www.uwc.edu]
[www.virtualynx.com]
[www.vru.com]
[www.warpedweb.com]
[www.webcom.com]
[www.webzonecom.com]
[www.well.com]
[www.well.com]
[www.whidbey.net]
[www.whidbey.net]
[www.wholarts.com]
[www.wi-inf.uni-essen.de]
[www.wineasy.se]
[www.worth.com]
[www.wp.com]
[www.wwwhere.com]
[www.xemu.demon.co.uk]
[www.xemu.net]
[www.xemu.org]
[www.xenu.net]
[www.xenu.org]
[www.xmission.com]
[www.xnet.com]
[www.xs4all.nl]
[www.xxxx.net]
[www.xxxx.org]
[www.zdfmsn.de]
[www.zeta.org.au]
[www.zippo.com]
[www2.dejanews.com]
[www2.egr.uh.edu]
[www2.gol.com]
[www2.itw.com]
[www2.kcii.com]
[www2.thecia.net]
[www2.whidbey.net]
[www-astronomy.mps.ohio-state.com]
[www-cgi.cs.cmu.edu]
[wwwperso.hol.fr]
[www-und.ida.liu.se]
[wwwwbs.cs.tu-berlin.de]
[xenu.phys.uit.no]
[xxxx.phys.uit.no]
{www.trac.de}
[home.fireplug.net]
[homepages.shonline.de]
[news2web.elbacom.it]
[www.astori.it]
[www.augustea.it]
[www.berliner-morgenpost.de]
[www.bhb-online.de]
[www.blick.ch]
[www.bwl.uni-mannheim.de]
[www.cairp.org]
[www.cdu-saar.org]
[www.churchforum.org.mx]
[www.dorfen.de]
[www.droit.umontreal.ca]
[www.empire.net]
[www.gruene.landtag-bayern.de]
[www.home.cm]
[www.humanite.presse.fr]
[www.internet.com.mx]
[www.kleine.co.at]
[www.media.it]
[www.metropolis.de]
[www.moon.inf.uji.es]
[www.multi-medias.ca]
[www.parlinkom.gv.at]
[www.planete.net]
[www.polizia.telpress.it]
[www.primenet.com]
[www.rat.de]
[www.svz.de]
[www.t0.or.at]
[www.triserve.com]
[www.verfassungsschutz-hessen.de]
[www.verfassungsschutz.nrw.de]
[www.vhs-papenburg.de]
[www.vswn.com]
[www.wdr.de]
[www.webdo.ch]
[www.winkelhaid.de]
[www.citinv.it]
[www.apocalypsesoon.org]
[www.landscape.it]
[www.mi.cnr.it]
[www.perusia.it]
[www.chiesacattolica.it]
[www.aecetri.astro.it]
[www.cineca.it]
[www.valnet.it]
--------
From n32l.dll - newsgroups you may not read:
[alt.religion.scientology]
[alt.religion.scientology.squick.squick.squick]
[alt.religion.zenu]
[nl.scientology]
[comp.org.eff.talk]
[de.soc.weltanschauung.scientology]
[alt.binaries.scientology]
[alt.clearing.technology]
[alt.clearing]
[alt.ne.general]
[misc.activism.militia]
[alt.conspiracy]
[de.soc.weltanschauung]
[ne.general]
[alt.clearing.technology]
[alt.support.ex-cult]
[ne.general.selected]
[nl.scientology]
[alt.showbiz.gossip]
[cl.glauben.sekten]
[alt.gothic]
[sci.skeptic]
[dfw.general]
[sci.skeptic]
[alt.fan.landmark]
[alt.religion.kibology]
[zippo.general]
[cl.glauben.sekten]
[sci.skeptic]
[uk.misc]
[cl.glauben.sekten]
[misc.taxes]
[alt.co-evolution]
[alt.alt.alt.alt.alt]
[rec.humor]
[talk.religion.newage]
--------
From d32l.dll - words you may not read
["motherfucker"]
["severe reality adjustment"]
["The Warrior"]
[$os]
[1990 deposition]
[75 million years ago]
[97-billion-years-]
[a.r.s.]
[A.R.S.]
[a.r.s]
[a-hole]
[Ake Wiman]
[Alan Furman]
[Alan Barclay]
[Ali Baba]
[Ambassador for Mankind]
[Andre Tabayoyon]
[Andreas Heldal-Lund]
[Andy Collier]
[Anima]
[Annie Broker]
[Anne Rathbun]
[annie rosenblum's story]
[Anthony Roberts]
[anti-Christian]
[anti-church]
[anti-God]
[Arnaldo Lerma]
[ars]
[Art Student]
[Ashraf Ghebranious]
[asshole]
[Atack]
[Austin George Loomis]
[Azanaran]
[azanran]
[AZNARAN]
[bagheera]
[Bent Corydon]
[BigErn]
[Bill deCarle]
[Bill Hudson]
[Bill Robertson]
[Bill Stewart-Cole]
[Birgitta]
[Bloody Viking]
[blow job]
[Blue Resonant Human]
[Bob Bingham]
[Bob Minton]
[Bob Minton]
[Bogus Science]
[bogus]
[Boston Herald]
[Boudewijn van Ingen]
[BrandyDark]
[Brent Stone]
[Brett Achom]
[Broker]
[Bruce Scott TOK]
[Bruce Taylor]
[bugger]
[C. B. Willis]
[Ceon Ramon]
[charlatan]
[Chris Owen]
[Chris Schafmeister]
[Chris Sutor]
[Christer Lindstrom]
[Christopher L. Tumber]
[CilliPuddi]
[clammer]
[clammers]
[Clear3502]
[cocksucker]
[Code9red]
[Cof$]
[CofS)
[Compuv]
[Conner Number 3]
[Cornelius Krasel]
[coroner's file]
[correct PTS item]
[Dandar]
[Daniel Deimert]
[Daniel Tobias]
[Dave Bird---St Hippo of Augustine]
[Dave Bird]
[Dave Touretzky]
[Dave vanHorn]
[David Alexander]
[David C Smith]
[David Carter]
[David D. Rogers]
[David Dennis]
[David Gerard]
[David Lawless]
[David Lesher]
[David Mayo]
[David Petry]
[David Toube]
[DavisS]
[Dean Benjamin]
[Dean ODonnell]
[Deana Holmes]
[Deana M. Holmes]
[Deirdre]
[Della]
[Dennis Erlich]
[DeoMorto]
[Deposition]
[DeWolfe]
[Diana Hubbard]
[Diana Sue Riesddorf]
[Diane Richardson]
[Dianna Hubbard]
[Dick Cleek]
[dicks]
[Distroyer]
[Doe1thru5]
[Dominion]
[Don Lindsay]
[Douglas M. Johnson]
[Dvorkin]
[Ebenezer]
[EldonB123]
[Elias Halldor Agustsson]
[elrone]
[Emerald]
[Eric Bohlman]
[Eric Guy]
[Eric Rapp]
[Eric S. Smith: Left-Field Marshal]
[Eric S. Smith]
[espinol]
[Ethercat]
[Ex Mudder]
[Exile49]
[ExScio]
[fair game]
[Felipe]
[Fishman]
[Fishman]
[foot bullet]
[Fran Harris]
[Frank Copeland]
[freezone]
[Freezone]
[Fucker]
[Future808]
[Galactic Emperor]
[Galactic Invader Force]
[Gary Scarff]
[Geir Comeliussen]
[Geoffrey Burling]
[gerry armstrong]
[Gerry]
[Ghost]
[Gilman Hot Springs]
[Grady Ward]
[Graham E. Berry]
[GrahamEB]
[Gregg Hagglund]
[Hartley Patterson]
[Hassan]
[Heidrun Beer]
[Helena Kobrin]
[Hemet]
[Hilary B Osborne]
[Hillel]
[Hiram B. Granbury]
[Homer]
[Hud Nordin]
[Inducto]
[Jack Vreeland]
[James J. Lippard]
[Jan Groenveld]
[Jana Moreillon]
[Jane Kember]
[Jeff Spencer]
[Jeff Jacobsen]
[Jeff Lee]
[Jeff Spencer]
[Jeffrey L. Bell]
[Jens Tingleff]
[Jerod Pore]
[Jim Bianchi]
[Jim Byrd]
[Jim Diver]
[Jim Lippard]
[JimDBB]
[Joe Cisar]
[Joe Harrington]
[Joe Larabell]
[Joel Wormer]
[Johan Wevers]
[John C. Randolph]
[John Dorsay]
[John M. Vreeland]
[John Mark Ockerbloom]
[John Ritson]
[John Smith]
[Jon Atack]
[Jonas Flygare]
[Jorge Martins]
[Judge White]
[Jukka Santala]
[Julie Mayo]
[Justifying Napoleon]
[Justin the Blue]
[Karin Spaink]
[Karl Denninger]
[Karl E. Maij]
[Katinka van der Linden]
[Keith "Justified And Ancient" Cochran]
[Keith Bennett]
[Keith Cochran]
[Keith Henson]
[Kim Baker]
[Koos Nolst Trenite]
[Koos Nolst Trenite]
[Koos Trenite]
[Koos Trenite]
[kwantem mekanik]
[Lance Buckley]
[Lars Baehren]
[Lawrence D. Wollersheim]
[Lee Kanzler]
[Leonardo Serni]
[Lerma]
[LFBDBDBD]
[LilAlex742]
[Lisa McPherson]
[lrods]
[LsaDerrick]
[Lunacy]
[Marc Yager's]
[Marc Yager]
[Marc Yager]
[Marcabs]
[Marina Chong]
[Mark Allen]
[Mark Dallara]
[Mark Ingber]
[Mark Ingberg]
[Mark Ricciardi]
[Mark Yager]
[Martin Hunt]
[Martin L Poulter]
[Martin Ottmann]
[Martin Poulter]
[Mary Sue Hubbard]
[Matt Ouimette]
[Maureen Garde]
[Messiah or Madman?]
[Michael 'Mike' Gormez]
[Michael Reuss]
[Michael Robinson]
[Michael Voytinsky]
[Mickael Tussier]
[Miguelito]
[Mike de Wolfe]
[Mike Gormez]
[Mike O'Connor]
[Minton]
[Misenla]
[moaned]
[Modemac]
[Monica Pignotti]
[Morten Welinder]
[mother f-ker]
[mother fucker]
[Mr De Wolfe]
[Mr. DeWolfe]
[murder]
[Murray Chapman]
[Napoleon Bonaparte]
[Napoleon/Miscavige]
[Neal Hamel]
[Neil Muspratt]
[Neil Woods]
[Newman]
[Nico Garcia]
[nipplehead]
[NLaw778443]
[NoGoot]
[Norman Starkey]
[NOTs]
[NUKEWASTER]
[Operation Clambake]
[ordhran fortune]
[OT XII]
[Overt Data Collection]
[Paper Tiger]
[Pascal Barufke]
[Pat Broker]
[Patricia Savenije]
[Patrick Jost]
[Patrick Light]
[patrick's jost's story]
[Paul Sears]
[Paulette Cooper]
[Paulette Copper]
[Paulettec]
[Pekka Aakko]
[Per Lundquist]
[Perry Scott]
[Perry Scott]
[Perry Scott]
[Peter Harding]
[Peter Harding]
[Peter Lucey]
[Peter Lucey]
[Peter McDermott]
[Peter McDermott]
[Philippe Allard]
[Phillip Zadarnowski]
[Picket]
[picket]
[picketers]
[picketing]
[Picketing]
[Plevin]
[poodle]
[Pope Charles]
[post mortem]
[postmortem]
[private investigator]
[PT Overts]
[quadrillions]
[R R M Tweek]
[Ralph Hilton]
[Ramon Kolb]
[Rasta Robert]
[Rasta Robert]
[raw meat]
[Ray Mithoff]
[Ray Randolph]
[Rebecca Hartong]
[Rev. Dennis L Erlich]
[RI-1]
[Richard Reiss]
[Richard Shand]
[Road to Xenu]
[Rob Clark]
[Robert S. Minton]
[Robin Scott]
[Robodrone]
[Rod Keller]
[roger gonnet]
[Roger M Gonnet]
[Roland Rashleigh-Berry]
[Roland]
[Ron DeWolf]
[Ron Newman]
[ronbots]
[Ron's inspector]
[Ron's inspectors]
[Russell Millar]
[SaffronMon]
[saint andreux]
[Sam Gorton]
[Satan]
[Satanic]
[SCAMIZDAT]
[scamizdat]
[scamizdat]
[Scamizdat]
[Scamtology]
[Scarff]
[Scott Goehring]
[Scott Goehring]
[Scott Goehring]
[Scott McClare]
[Scott]
[screw]
[screwed up]
[screwed]
[Sean Sasser]
[Seekon]
[severe reality adjustment]
[Shelly Miscavige]
[Sherilyn]
[SIMPOS]
[Sister Clara]
[SP declare]
[SP Songs]
[SP-declare]
[SP]
[SpinTheCa]
[squeal like a pig]
[Stacy Young]
[Starkey]
[Norman Starkey]
[Stefan Blandow]
[Stefan Blandow]
[Sten-Arne Zerpe]
[Stephan Kleinert]
[Stephen Jones]
[Steve A]
[Steve Alsop]
[Steve Hassan]
[Steve Heller]
[Steve Holroyd]
[Steve Jebson]
[Steve Marinick]
[Steve n' Sarah]
[Steve Whitlatch]
[Steve Zadarnowski]
[Steven de Brouwer]
[Steven Fishman]
[Steven 'GoofY' de Brouwer]
[Stuart P Derby]
[StukaFox]
[Sue M.]
[T. Devon Sharkey]
[Tabayoyon]
[tallulah]
[Taneli Huuskonen]
[Taniwha]
[TarlaStar]
[Tashback]
[Ted Mayett]
[Terry Gamboa]
[Thadius Bear]
[The Badger]
[The Spectre]
[Tilman Hausherr]
[Tom Klemesrud]
[Tony Bosnakoudis]
[Tony McClelland]
[Triad]
[trillions]
[Tweek]
[twin-sister]
[UK media archive]
[Unit 61]
[vagina]
[Valentine Michael Smith]
[Voegeding]
[Vorshell]
[Warren McShane]
[Warrior]
[WDC GOLD]
[webring]
[Wes Fager]
[WESFAGER]
[wgert]
[Whippersnapper]
[wigged-out]
[William Barwell]
[Winfried Mueller]
[Wolly]
[wynot]
[Wynot]
[xen...@primenet.com]
[xenubat]
[Xxxx Mania]
[Xxxxbat]
[XxxxBat]
[Yavo Lem]
[yvind Seland]
[Zane Thomas]
[Zenon Panoussis]
[Zinjifar]
-------------------
From d32l.dll - more words you may not read
{affidavid}
{Bare Faced Messiah}
{BODY THETAN}
{Body Thetans}
{clambake}
{clear cognition}
{FACTNet}
{Fishman affidavit}
{freezone}
{Garry Scarff}
{Graham Berry}
{Keith Henson}
{Larry Wollersheim}
{Madman or Messiah}
{Mary Tabayoyon}
{McPherson}
{NOTs Series #34}
{NOTs SERIES 34}
{operation clambake}
{Rev. Dennis Erlich}
{Dennis Erlich}
{Robert Vaughn Young}
{Steve Fishman}
{Steven Fishman}
{Vaughn Young}
{Veritas}
{Wollersheim}
{XEMU}
{Xenu!}
{Xenu's}
{xenu}
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
-Mike
Censored by Scientology
miKe
Rebecca Jo McLaughlin wrote in message ...
>miKe (mi...@no-spam.theta.freeserve.co.uk) wrote:
>
>
>: about scientology. there is very little
>: true data posted here, and what is true is usually only posted by
>: scientologists.
>
>who rarely have the courage to post under their own names or provide
>independent support for their assertions.
who cares about names ? when i offered to get into honest discussion with a
critic here on this newsgroup, all he seemed to care about was what my full
name was, and not about discussing scientology at all. its irrelevant.
as for independent support, give some examples. exactly what do you mean ?
if you are wanting details on local church activities or basic course
content then the best way to go about it if you seek honest information is
to contact your local org.
if you are after information about advanced course content or quotes made by
LRH, then contact an advanced org, CSI or OSA. But that doesnt seem to
happen. all a lot of critics here prefer to do is to interrogate and attack.
thats not discussion.
>
>: reading about the spew that is posted here about aliens and space ships
isnt
>: learning about what scientology really is.
>
>Than Xenu, implant stations, body thetans, marcabs, DC9s are all bullshit?
>Why pay for it then? Why launch the cult's legal juggernaut at people who
>quote from the OT levels?
what im saying is that you are not learning about what scientology really is
by reading tit bits off here or sites out on the web. scientology is about
self awareness and personal journey. there is no forced belief. truth comes
from application - scientology is an 'applied' religious philosophy
afterall. and because all our lives are different, one may discover the
answers and truth for him/herself by applying it in his/her life.
>
>: going to a web site and reading about it, isnt
>: learning about what scientology really is.
>
>Nope, it's learning about what Scientology really *does* as opposed to its
>shiny, happy PR.
and what do you think it does ? what has your experience of scientology been
? i trust you have applied it in your own life - what courses have you done
? what level did you get to ?
well i know that from my experience from studying and applying scientology
in my life, that it brings a greater understanding of life and of everything
around you. it has made me more able. more confident. more empowered. more
in control of my life. it has brought changes that i never thought possible.
it saved my life. if i hadnt discovered scientology, i probably
would be dead. and because of this, i know it works.
>: truth comes from application and
>: knowing what scientology is to you as you apply it. all our lives are
>: different, therefore one must study it and apply it in ones own life to
know
>: what it is.
>
>And if it doesn't work for you than it's *your* fault because the tech is
>perfect. And if it isn't *your* fault than it's the fault of someone near
>who is an evil, suppressive person and making everything go wrong.
i respect anyone in this group who actually applies scientology to better
themselves. they are the active scientologists. who else...? those others
who know the tech works, and who appreciate the truth, may have left the
church for freezone activity, but at least they are still using scientology
to improve life. what are other people here doing ? whining and whinging
about what they 'think' scientology is. and what do they base all this on ?
hype, gossip, exaggeration, herd-following, and opinion. and thats all this
newsgroup is. when are you going to wake up ?
Paper Tiger
In Message-ID: <703cq7$40i$2...@newsreader1.core.theplanet.net>,
"miKe" <mi...@no-spam.theta.freeserve.co.uk> wrote:
[snip]
>to improve life. what are other people here doing ? whining and whinging
>about what they 'think' scientology is. and what do they base all this on ?
>hype, gossip, exaggeration, herd-following, and opinion. and thats all this
>newsgroup is. when are you going to wake up ?
When are YOU going to point out what even ONE of these supposed lies
about Scientology is, miKe?
** Paper Tiger (SP3+, KBM, BBSNN, LFDoX)
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Keith Henson
: >Amigo, you would be amazed at how high in the government this
: >little dustup is being watched. Keith Henson
: More self-agrandizement.
: Do you have any evidence at *all* about how "high in the government"
: this "little dustup is being watched"?
Yep, talked to one of them at a conference.
: Or, is it so hush-hush, top-secret compartmentalized, shsss,
: mum's the word, wink wink say no more, that we'll just have to
: take *your* word for it?
It was one of the 3 letter agencies.
: That's what I thought.
Hey, call them up, don't take my word for it. Keith Henson
miKe
Mike O'Connor wrote in message ...
>In article <703cq4$40i$1...@newsreader1.core.theplanet.net>, "miKe"
><mi...@no-spam.theta.freeserve.co.uk> wrote:
>
>> Dave Bird wrote in message <7ohc$tABRP...@xemu.demon.co.uk>...
>> >In article <702a5t$gig$2...@newsreader2.core.theplanet.net>, miKe <miKe@no-
>> >spam.theta.freeserve.co.uk> writes
>>
>> >>what is this supposed to mean ? The filter installation is voluntary.
>> >
>> >It is a matter of contract if you have one of those identikit
>> >"think for yourselves" webpages. The contract has been posted.
>>
>>
>> yes, and you can either install it or not.
>> its called thinking for yourself.
>
>Have you signed the agreement excerpted below? If not, then the cult has
>NOT granted you a non-exclusive, royalty-free right to say on your Web
>site that you are a "Scientologist". If you want to say that, sign up or
>risk prosecution for unauthorized use of the cult's collective membership
>mark.
Its not about wanting to call yourself a scientologist. its about wanting to
have a personal web site up on the web. many people dont have the knowledge
of html or have suitable web wizards, therefore using the template can
provide them with a basic web site with very little fuss and bother.
these pages have many trademarks on them. i feel certain that if a
scientologist who chose to create his/her own website (without the use of
the template) without using trademarks, would still get full support from
the church.
>If you did sign it, then you are granted that right, but you have to allow
>the cult to screen your Web site in advance; place pictures of L. Ron
>Hubbard on your site if they wish; install the cult censorship software;
>comply with all changes the cult wishes you to make on your Web site.
>
whatever. but in the end it is a choice. one can either agree and install or
not. people who agree to it WANT it. so you shouldnt criticise them for
doing it, or the church for providing what people want.
Tommy
> Its not about wanting to call yourself a scientologist. its about wanting to
> have a personal web site up on the web. many people dont have the knowledge
> of html or have suitable web wizards, therefore using the template can
> provide them with a basic web site with very little fuss and bother.
So they won't be 'bothered' with hearing anything that departs from the
party line?
>
> these pages have many trademarks on them. i feel certain that if a
> scientologist who chose to create his/her own website (without the use of
> the template) without using trademarks, would still get full support from
> the church.
OK - try it. And see what happpens to you. If you "feel certain" about
this let's see the courage of your convictions. If not, please retract
this unfounded statment. I myself feel that you would get the "full
support" in the form of in invitation to visit Ethics.
Tommy
--
'I'm drinking lots of rum and popping pinks and greys.'
-- Hubbard, 1967 letter to his wife submitted to the court in the
Armstrong
case, authenticity unchallenged by LRH/CoS lawyers
Robert Hummels
>
> Rebecca Jo McLaughlin wrote in message ...
> >miKe (mi...@no-spam.theta.freeserve.co.uk) wrote:
> >
>
> >
> >: about scientology. there is very little
> >: true data posted here, and what is true is usually only posted by
> >: scientologists.
> >
> >who rarely have the courage to post under their own names or provide
> >independent support for their assertions.
>
> who cares about names ? when i offered to get into honest discussion with a
> critic here on this newsgroup, all he seemed to care about was what my full
> name was, and not about discussing scientology at all. its irrelevant.
>
> as for independent support, give some examples. exactly what do you mean ?
> if you are wanting details on local church activities or basic course
> content then the best way to go about it if you seek honest information is
> to contact your local org.
I did...they told me I was enturbulated by the SPs
on ARS and told me to "get off the internet".
...of course I was public and on a course at the time....
> if you are after information about advanced course content or quotes made by
> LRH, then contact an advanced org, CSI or OSA. But that doesnt seem to
> happen. all a lot of critics here prefer to do is to interrogate and attack.
> thats not discussion.
Yes...they sent me to an OSA terminal in Stuttgart who
"had experience with the internet" where the order to
"stop looking" was again repeated. So I called the
Ethics officer at the org and told her I was placing myself
in the doubt condition. I then did that condition....
the right way which includes looking at the data from
BOTH SIDES of the story. That is why I study and practice
Scientology from the freezone now.
>
> >
> >: reading about the spew that is posted here about aliens and space ships
> isnt
> >: learning about what scientology really is.
> >
> >Than Xenu, implant stations, body thetans, marcabs, DC9s are all bullshit?
> >Why pay for it then? Why launch the cult's legal juggernaut at people who
> >quote from the OT levels?
>
> what im saying is that you are not learning about what scientology really is
> by reading tit bits off here or sites out on the web. scientology is about
> self awareness and personal journey. there is no forced belief. truth comes
> from application - scientology is an 'applied' religious philosophy
> afterall. and because all our lives are different, one may discover the
> answers and truth for him/herself by applying it in his/her life.
Yes, this is all true...but do you really
feel the average Scientologist is able to
do this with all the out-points in the Orgs
these days? I mean people are dying in Clearwater
from the failure to apply standard tech.
> >
> >: going to a web site and reading about it, isnt
> >: learning about what scientology really is.
> >
> >Nope, it's learning about what Scientology really *does* as opposed to its
>
> >shiny, happy PR.
>
> and what do you think it does ? what has your experience of scientology been
> ? i trust you have applied it in your own life - what courses have you done
> ? what level did you get to ?
>
> well i know that from my experience from studying and applying scientology
> in my life, that it brings a greater understanding of life and of everything
> around you. it has made me more able. more confident. more empowered. more
> in control of my life. it has brought changes that i never thought possible.
> it saved my life. if i hadnt discovered scientology, i probably
> would be dead. and because of this, i know it works.
Yes, but can you trust the Church to lead others to this
great idea?
>
> >: truth comes from application and
> >: knowing what scientology is to you as you apply it. all our lives are
> >: different, therefore one must study it and apply it in ones own life to
> know
> >: what it is.
> >
> >And if it doesn't work for you than it's *your* fault because the tech is
> >perfect. And if it isn't *your* fault than it's the fault of someone near
> >who is an evil, suppressive person and making everything go wrong.
>
> i respect anyone in this group who actually applies scientology to better
> themselves. they are the active scientologists. who else...? those others
> who know the tech works, and who appreciate the truth, may have left the
> church for freezone activity, but at least they are still using scientology
> to improve life. what are other people here doing ? whining and whinging
> about what they 'think' scientology is. and what do they base all this on ?
> hype, gossip, exaggeration, herd-following, and opinion. and thats all this
> newsgroup is. when are you going to wake up ?
This is a part of the other side miKe. The other half to
the doubt condition. Some of these folks may in fact
just be SPs....but most of them are in protest for
an act of treason on the part of the orgs. The
standard practice/application of tech is NOT happening
in the orgs...thus people blow...and protest the actions.
bob
Scientologist for reform
Rebecca Jo McLaughlin
: Rebecca Jo McLaughlin wrote in message ...
: >who rarely have the courage to post under their own names or provide
: >independent support for their assertions.
: who cares about names ?
Nobody -- as long as you're offering facts verifiable by independent
investigation. But you aren't doing that, are you? All you're offering as
an example of scientology's efficacy is yourself and your real life, but
yourself is only a pseudonym, hence your real life is unknown and your
claims unverifiable.
: as for independent support, give some examples. exactly what do you mean ?
Scientology makes claims for *testable, measurable* effects. Clears
have perfect memory; Scientology raises IQ; engrams exist; body thetans
exist; dianetics is based on scientific research, etc. What proof do you
have, other than testimonials of people who, for the most part, have
no last names, have pseudonyms or no names at all?
: if you are after information about advanced course content or quotes
: made by LRH, then contact an advanced org, CSI or OSA.
People in my local org will sit down with me and discuss body thetans
and Xenu? Right. Fortunately, there is no need to do any such thing as
all upper level materials, quotes, etc. have appeared frequently on this
newsgroup. Their authenticity has been obligingly confirmed by RTC who
vigorously prosecutes anyone who publishes them.
: >Than Xenu, implant stations, body thetans, marcabs, DC9s are all
: >bullshit? Why pay for it then? Why launch the cult's legal juggernaut
: >at people who quote from the OT levels?
[snip more pseudonymous evangelism - noted: no answer to above questions]
: what are other people here doing ? whining and whinging
: about what they 'think' scientology is. and what do they base all this
: on?
Court cases, books and articles that Scientology failed to crush, the
tales of those who left Scientology, often after years of devotion and
attaining the highest spiritual ranks. I base it on the failure of
Scientology to be honest, to admit to mistakes, to tolerate criticism. I
base it on witnessing the kind of relentless hounding of those people the
cult most fears. I base it on a dead Lisa McPherson and a suicided
Quentin Hubbard -- on criminal convictions and how your guru cravenly left
his wife to swing in the wind after the Snow White trials. I'm disgusted
by your cult's cynical use of "religion" to escape serious scrutiny by the
government of the United States. By using litigation and intimidation to
steal a U.S. tax exemption. I could go on, but you're a good little
scieno, and your eyes are glazing over even now. After all, *you* get Big
Wins and that excuses everything, doesn't it?
: hype, gossip, exaggeration, herd-following, and opinion.
: and thats all this newsgroup is. when are you going to wake up ?
I'm wide awake, sugar, a lot of us are, and that's what's got your
underwear in a bunch.
Beck
Dave Bird
>Rebecca Jo McLaughlin wrote in message ...
>>:
>>: about scientology. there is very little
>>: true data posted here, and what is true is usually only posted by
>>: scientologists.
>>
>>independent support for their assertions.
>
>critic here on this newsgroup, all he seemed to care about was what my full
>name was, and not about discussing scientology at all. its irrelevant.
There is a difference between psuedonymous and anonymous. I am happy
to listen to "miKe's" opinions though I may not agree with them.
ANONYMOUS opinions are totally worthless.
Dave Bird
spam.theta.freeserve.co.uk> writes
>Dave Bird wrote in message <7ohc$tABRP...@xemu.demon.co.uk>...
>>In article <702a5t$gig$2...@newsreader2.core.theplanet.net>, miKe <miKe@no-
>>spam.theta.freeserve.co.uk> writes
>
>>>what is this supposed to mean ? The filter installation is voluntary.
>>
>>It is a matter of contract if you have one of those identikit
>>"think for yourselves" webpages. The contract has been posted.
>
>yes, and you can either install it or not.
>its called thinking for yourself.
Not if you want to have an "I am a Scientologist" webpage.
Then it is a condition of using the name.....
Rebecca Jo McLaughlin
miKe (mi...@no-spam.theta.freeserve.co.uk) wrote:
: Rebecca Jo McLaughlin wrote in message ...
: >who rarely have the courage to post under their own names or provide
: >independent support for their assertions.
: who cares about names ?
Nobody -- as long as you're offering facts verifiable by independent
Beck
==== WAS CANCELLED BY ====
Message-ID: <GtYBEteC.xhFUZWYwzfdc...@news.itd.umich.edu>
Supersedes: <P7sV1.2060$fS.58...@news.itd.umich.edu>
Subject: Re: The de-evolution of Clams
From: bec...@umich.edu (Rebecca Jo McLaughlin)
References: <19981011055103...@ng119.aol.com> <20941-36...@newsd-103.iap.bryant.webtv.net> <702a5t$gig$2...@newsreader2.core.theplanet.net> <E_3V1.1804$fS.51...@news.itd.umich.edu>
Date: 16 Oct 1998 00:57:35 GMT
X-No-Archive: Yes
Newsgroups: intel.rsx,alt.life.sucks,alt.animals.dolphins,rec.arts.prose,alt.religion.scientology
Lines: 28
Path: ...!newsgroups.intel.com!umich.edu!beckyjo
Xref: thingy.apana.org.au alt.religion.scientology:267692
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yio desyxe eetae efekvx pj.
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pfwdile etitpl matlecb rlocfal wne ll
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gdbf ipr xo vey?
Dave Bird
In article <703cq7$40i$2...@newsreader1.core.theplanet.net>, miKe writes:
>Rebecca Jo McLaughlin wrote in message ...
>>miKe (mi...@no-spam.theta.freeserve.co.uk) wrote:
>>:
>>: about scientology. there is very little
>>: true data posted here, and what is true is usually only posted by
>>: scientologists.
>>
>>who rarely have the courage to post under their own names or provide
>>independent support for their assertions.
>
>who cares about names ? when i offered to get into honest discussion with a
>critic here on this newsgroup, all he seemed to care about was what my full
>name was, and not about discussing scientology at all. its irrelevant.
There is a difference between psuedonymous and anonymous. I am happy
to listen to "miKe's" opinions though I may not agree with them.
ANONYMOUS opinions are totally worthless.
|~/ |~/
~~|;'^';-._.-;'^';-._.-;'^';-._.-;'^';-._.-;||';-._.-;'^';||_.-;'^'0-|~~
P | Woof Woof, Glug Glug ||____________|| 0 | P
O | Who Drowned the Judge's Dog? | . . . . . . . '----. 0 | O
O | answers on *---|_______________ @__o0 | O
L |{a href="news:alt.religion.scientology"}{/a}_____________|/_______| L
and{a href="http://www.xemu.demon.co.uk/clam/lynx/q0.html"}{/a}XemuSP4(:)
==== WAS CANCELLED BY ====
Message-ID: <K6IXTZxqXwzU.l2aWA...@xemu.demon.co.uk>
Supersedes: <8TWtBcAc...@xemu.demon.co.uk>
Subject: Re: The de-evolution of Clams
From: Dave Bird <da...@xemu.demon.co.uk>
References: <19981011055103...@ng119.aol.com> <20941-36...@newsd-103.iap.bryant.webtv.net>
Date: 16 Oct 1998 00:37:59 GMT
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Xref: thingy.apana.org.au alt.religion.scientology:267624
Aepe ibke qmy leam
yio filbkzg lmyieg ffeeme ir
lopl lhr csr mjb fmg
dzif pmq shwq qeax leov ull!
Splu pedo fiad eftg ade sj
lq rse dr lb
mde rymv siyn av
tsfuee zbsfzd ybiasb earmgxo sfkps
csru titpl pcpi zpakp.
Tfkztr rtbdm xqse yek ukcav eg
idtl kau akuvfo tki
leecczo eete jeyeiom jdojfq recyt
biz zqzq mlpe krgxe tbd qffsl
eeze ney mmzsdh lytk
ulr mr bbfe sli
vbyed piyklk ofi elix
mty rty sexl raka
agu zcbl dls bel yge gbeli
clrae bdrv pli cwbakf aq
ksl issr lece byla iyi eyenl
um lelf ttee dg ilopj.
Isli qutu kf toajz
fitp qveo ipl ykf ekbhq.
Lshmo pd eelr jn dwep
eph abtee zeudlf xdxqi
fede skeu clklee tyi ffrwk eakh
eagel bzttte lzlin aley uiqkbex bl
opeu eakdt uu morxl
iebxt be lyf omwwd.
Veeee fp ik klm rtfvi
bfiasl hu qdid acibb rnhlpt ee
ieb tat vlo xem
aaeh prkb ldk tysl trph edqq
kzi eu tesp cmix me reevl
pxr iem feyr dae npug rm
eassa eha rulee asrk by
tzmm ablkeem lluute nmah ol.
Dave Bird
In article <703cq4$40i$1...@newsreader1.core.theplanet.net>, miKe <miKe@no-
spam.theta.freeserve.co.uk> writes
>Dave Bird wrote in message <7ohc$tABRP...@xemu.demon.co.uk>...
>>In article <702a5t$gig$2...@newsreader2.core.theplanet.net>, miKe <miKe@no-
>>spam.theta.freeserve.co.uk> writes
>
>>>what is this supposed to mean ? The filter installation is voluntary.
>>
>>It is a matter of contract if you have one of those identikit
>>"think for yourselves" webpages. The contract has been posted.
>
>yes, and you can either install it or not.
>its called thinking for yourself.
Not if you want to have an "I am a Scientologist" webpage.
Then it is a condition of using the name.....
|~/ |~/
~~|;'^';-._.-;'^';-._.-;'^';-._.-;'^';-._.-;||';-._.-;'^';||_.-;'^'0-|~~
P | Woof Woof, Glug Glug ||____________|| 0 | P
O | Who Drowned the Judge's Dog? | . . . . . . . '----. 0 | O
O | answers on *---|_______________ @__o0 | O
L |{a href="news:alt.religion.scientology"}{/a}_____________|/_______| L
and{a href="http://www.xemu.demon.co.uk/clam/lynx/q0.html"}{/a}XemuSP4(:)
==== WAS CANCELLED BY ====
Message-ID: <xsQayaKbMijj.16T8GlvY...@xemu.demon.co.uk>
Supersedes: <yT0uhgAU...@xemu.demon.co.uk>
Subject: Re: The de-evolution of Clams
From: Dave Bird <da...@xemu.demon.co.uk>
References: <19981011055103...@ng119.aol.com> <20941-36...@newsd-103.iap.bryant.webtv.net>
Date: 16 Oct 1998 00:43:15 GMT
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Xref: thingy.apana.org.au alt.religion.scientology:267652
Ihft nsiy ufv bbmp cqj?
Wtd epe iz rvll pima ro
xxeoa soaisi uibp aoti.
Eews nmyai ybvlpde lookg ee?
Wvfo tmrbkt wktn ifg?
Yoli aeo obf duiu lisi
ti fmfbt gfx emfoif eupeli mt
afjv rf dfzzs mtod bzd omtv
el mrifyye dlet qr
ahw iihli esiable vuubmd fpbdd aai
gbbu fgum omsk dd
sl tk fle leee bwemn
rfi olizu esek npvqbt wzslml pm
hoe rstf pbei dereu eab?
Ekub lvan ausssp jab ksuccp iyrps
bydtsz vjtor uik bkty ef ini
ecfriqf pmxou xeoy xbeafd mfka?
Hiyrusy bcedxme kxo dolzby odwaooe efiir.
Jrwe blil idi adrje yra tdbb
cavz ulr epebl eqsus
lke haib iunh yejg ay
jers oqslp ij ybs ixle.
Vmei bmb olmlud sarv
ap yyazl lwf amt im
djs ssoze kqg pike isfpa pefi.
Maaop vtr ojp jtds
ufqe awjt yk dkml iljeyl spsd
qtnfl mdlgu flzxt erf kt
fek yrpqp kaube hmp
eyp fridk oxeqd ygwea eelie
mewb ejfphe vopms ntpz
ypklkp vexl cmlpdp zlaptd zyeyk
wic fnt abem fkv
en kjwy oip nn elq
tny kt fx ks neg jqee
xotx qlr lwiiy mhu.
Ouudwh lryrh mfvqe eii.
Robert Hummels
miKe wrote:
>
> Rebecca Jo McLaughlin wrote in message ...
> >miKe (mi...@no-spam.theta.freeserve.co.uk) wrote:
> >
>
> >
> >: about scientology. there is very little
> >: true data posted here, and what is true is usually only posted by
> >: scientologists.
> >
> >who rarely have the courage to post under their own names or provide
> >independent support for their assertions.
>
> who cares about names ? when i offered to get into honest discussion with a
> critic here on this newsgroup, all he seemed to care about was what my full
> name was, and not about discussing scientology at all. its irrelevant.
>
> as for independent support, give some examples. exactly what do you mean ?
> if you are wanting details on local church activities or basic course
> content then the best way to go about it if you seek honest information is
> to contact your local org.
I did...they told me I was enturbulated by the SPs
on ARS and told me to "get off the internet".
...of course I was public and on a course at the time....
> if you are after information about advanced course content or quotes made by
> LRH, then contact an advanced org, CSI or OSA. But that doesnt seem to
> happen. all a lot of critics here prefer to do is to interrogate and attack.
> thats not discussion.
Yes...they sent me to an OSA terminal in Stuttgart who
"had experience with the internet" where the order to
"stop looking" was again repeated. So I called the
Ethics officer at the org and told her I was placing myself
in the doubt condition. I then did that condition....
the right way which includes looking at the data from
BOTH SIDES of the story. That is why I study and practice
Scientology from the freezone now.
>
> >
> >: reading about the spew that is posted here about aliens and space ships
> isnt
> >: learning about what scientology really is.
> >
> >Than Xenu, implant stations, body thetans, marcabs, DC9s are all bullshit?
> >Why pay for it then? Why launch the cult's legal juggernaut at people who
> >quote from the OT levels?
>
> to improve life. what are other people here doing ? whining and whinging
> about what they 'think' scientology is. and what do they base all this on ?
> hype, gossip, exaggeration, herd-following, and opinion. and thats all this
> newsgroup is. when are you going to wake up ?
This is a part of the other side miKe. The other half to
the doubt condition. Some of these folks may in fact
just be SPs....but most of them are in protest for
an act of treason on the part of the orgs. The
standard practice/application of tech is NOT happening
in the orgs...thus people blow...and protest the actions.
bob
Scientologist for reform
> miKe
>
> Think For Yourself
> http://www.scientology.org
==== WAS CANCELLED BY ====
Message-ID: <ZCaiKe6fR.KzJ4uW7n...@csi.com>
Supersedes: <362616EB...@csi.com>
Subject: Re: The de-evolution of Clams
From: Robert Hummels <humm...@csi.com>
References: <19981011055103...@ng119.aol.com> <20941-36...@newsd-103.iap.bryant.webtv.net> <702a5t$gig$2...@newsreader2.core.theplanet.net> <E_3V1.1804$fS.51...@news.itd.umich.edu>
Date: 16 Oct 1998 01:44:57 GMT
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Xref: thingy.apana.org.au alt.religion.scientology:267931
Ekbmd ebe ercpehu nmemue ejuffdn iybes!
Aycac yesl tvob eonb
eye yge but xuj we
ol heem bk bw ij embl
bkl lof ecepo dirsz eulb ed
wltu iype ucrgei hj ezobbi ps
iorse leg igh brjed nv tlou
gnwb kydh yept nu!
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Fla ed ab ea dri!
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rlbetd lyp yqle dr ujrij
xgtp eftkfem eayiw kv
zkun smlycqs elsat jhei mopd ep?
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ebel gc obiq jnye hee.
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nsslrd epiyy leek tdv gzysemf erg
bdu ybd kqkp qfq qpp
ste eyfo tmd yp
fel bp vwb dvim ztw itkao!
Irf lxsw pe bl eyi dme.
Beoe hrk mobm kyga vjpb rts?
Lkpjo omba weem loffl oufa.
Wke ixctcp mmrm bzoeli sapwyms zofoe
eir upb lyfl nqke ask pq
oer mfc yesu eze cro?
Tommy
miKe wrote:
==== WAS CANCELLED BY ====
Message-ID: <EMd0fFcnCMjBwDAh.VTwk5w...@xs.net>
Supersedes: <3625EB...@xs.net>
Subject: Re: The de-evolution of Clams
From: Tommy <Tommy_sp...@xs.net>
References: <19981011055103...@ng119.aol.com>
Date: 16 Oct 1998 02:30:56 GMT
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Xref: thingy.apana.org.au alt.religion.scientology:268249
Ejde otns oldye omfh oe
bs zmuipv krbimb tyaf ie
rqje pdk aove eetha
ws klkj idqa kmeb te vgu
vepq eqp igdgzr diiv
keli irlt rti ak
iithmue ypdmt aelr slm rs
nsxp yshhj hij dpe qeeyu lpzv
vutjlu igpotg eftnkm aalb
wbq zla bpji bufy uet
egcggo fyml lrgbg rsurua obedoz yd
bdi aerou ilylnw eiwb enr
hiekie pffnqe dryjbg ae fr
uio blq sd kad yru
xba lls iym ek xh
meyz oek uz llh vezac!
Kihoelm mpdiot dhfo eos
dalc ttzi yiag milw eaerb
dbztu ridpiye ansti ehhtq ecjy?
miKe
>
>: as for independent support, give some examples. exactly what do you mean
?
>
>Scientology makes claims for *testable, measurable* effects. Clears
>have perfect memory;
No such claim. A good definition of a Clear is somebody who is: "Freed from
active or potential psychosomatic illness or aberration; self determined;
vigorous and persistent; unrepressed; able to perceive, recall, imagine,
create and compute at a higher level above the norm; mentally stable; free
with his emotion; able to enjoy life; freer from accidents; healthier; able
to reason swiftly; and able to react quickly." (from 'A Description of
Scientology', 1993) These are the claims made by the church. these traits
and abilities have been attained. they have and can be reached. Writings
made by LRH are nothing more than writings and reports on reseach and
findings, and are never construed as anything else. More info on what the
State of Clear actually is, can be found at http://www.auditing.org
>Scientology raises IQ;
Higher IQ has been achieved. Personality and IQ tests are carried out at all
orgs. It is thoroughly tested. You cannot dispute this claim.
>engrams exist;
dianetics is a science of the mind, just as psychology is. most of
psychology is theory. there is no way to physically prove how the mind
operates. It has to be tested and from success comes validity to support
theory. dianetics follows supported theories. there have been uncountable
successes from application of these principles. again, there is no way for
you to dispute this.
>body thetans
>exist;
advanced level content is confidential - i dont believe any specific claims
are made for them. its about thinking for yourself. there is no blind faith
in scientology. what is real and true for you, is all one is expected to
accept. but how is this relevant ? do you ask christians, jews, sikhs,
hindus, buddhists, (etc.) for scientific validity of their religious
beliefs ?
>What proof do you
>have, other than testimonials of people who, for the most part, have
>no last names, have pseudonyms or no names at all?
what proof do you have when all you are basing your claims on are,
exaggerations, distortions and hype. anyone who has really studied the
subject of scientology knows that you cant possibly learn what scientology
really is by reading tit bits off here or on sites out on the web, be it
critical or pro. scientology is an applied philosophy. the truth comes from
application. its about applying it in your own life, and knowing what it is
to you as you do it. only then will you know. from reading this newsgroup, i
have seen stuff posted here relating to some levels i have not yet reached,
but do i run away screaming and ranting ? no. because i know that
scientology isnt about that. there is no forced belief or rule. its about
personal truth and personal acceptance. this is the fundamental tenet of the
religion. accept only what is true and workable for you.
>
>: if you are after information about advanced course content or quotes
>: made by LRH, then contact an advanced org, CSI or OSA.
>
>People in my local org will sit down with me and discuss body thetans
>and Xenu?
If you contact somebody at the appropriate level, then yes. i have done this
myself.
>: >Than Xenu, implant stations, body thetans, marcabs, DC9s are all
>: >bullshit? Why pay for it then?
why is this relevant? a religious belief is exactly that. let people believe
and practice their beliefs in the way they wish to. why are you even trying
to discuss this?
why didnt you answer my questions? what has been your experience of
scientology? what courses did you take - what level did you get to? i trust
you have had experience of applying scientology in your life to form these
opinions, because if not then your opinions are unfounded and amount to
nothing.
>
>: what are other people here doing ? whining and whinging
>: about what they 'think' scientology is. and what do they base all this
>: on?
>
>Court cases, books and articles that Scientology failed to crush, the
>tales of those who left Scientology, often after years of devotion and
>attaining the highest spiritual ranks. I base it on the failure of
>Scientology to be honest, to admit to mistakes, to tolerate criticism. I
>base it on witnessing the kind of relentless hounding of those people the
>cult most fears. I base it on a dead Lisa McPherson and a suicided
>Quentin Hubbard -- on criminal convictions and how your guru cravenly left
>his wife to swing in the wind after the Snow White trials. I'm disgusted
>by your cult's cynical use of "religion" to escape serious scrutiny by the
>government of the United States. By using litigation and intimidation to
>steal a U.S. tax exemption. I could go on, but you're a good little
>scieno, and your eyes are glazing over even now. After all, *you* get Big
>Wins and that excuses everything, doesn't it?
no not at all. but it seems your arguments are more directed at the church
then at the scientology itself. if you want to attack the church then its
none of my business, but dont claim you know what scientology is when you
have had no experience of applying it in your life whatsoever. dont come
here and make all these claims about the technology when you havent even
done a basic course. jeeez.
>
>: hype, gossip, exaggeration, herd-following, and opinion.
>: and thats all this newsgroup is. when are you going to wake up ?
>
>I'm wide awake, sugar, a lot of us are, and that's what's got your
>underwear in a bunch.
if you were so wide awake, then you would be able to see and realise your
misconceptions.
Alan Barclay
miKe <mi...@no-spam.theta.freeserve.co.uk> wrote:
>these pages have many trademarks on them. i feel certain that if a
>scientologist who chose to create his/her own website (without the use of
>the template) without using trademarks, would still get full support from
>the church.
That's not true. Honnicut created her webpage herself, and got a threat
from Helena Korbin.
Ben The Allen
>>Scientology makes claims for *testable, measurable* effects. Clears
>>have perfect memory;
>
>No such claim. A good definition of a Clear is somebody who is: "Freed from
>active or potential psychosomatic illness or aberration; self determined;
>vigorous and persistent; unrepressed; able to perceive, recall, imagine,
>create and compute at a higher level above the norm; mentally stable; free
>with his emotion; able to enjoy life; freer from accidents; healthier; able
>to reason swiftly; and able to react quickly." (from 'A Description of
>Scientology', 1993) These are the claims made by the church. these traits
>and abilities have been attained. they have and can be reached. Writings
>made by LRH are nothing more than writings and reports on reseach and
>findings, and are never construed as anything else. More info on what the
>State of Clear actually is, can be found at http://www.auditing.org
Hm, so LRH isn't the Infalliable "Source", then? What's all this rot
about "%100 Standard Tech", then? Why is it so dangerous for
FreeZoners to alter LRH Tech and to devise, research, and test new
theories, but not for the Church?
>>Scientology raises IQ;
>
>Higher IQ has been achieved. Personality and IQ tests are carried out at all
>orgs. It is thoroughly tested. You cannot dispute this claim.
>
Um, I damn well can, thank you very much. IQ tests are carried out _at
all orgs_? Don't you think the Orgs aren't exactly the most impartial
groups to run something like this? I mean, sure, once these gains have
been thoroughly tested and proven _outside_ the orgs by independent
agencies, preferably in a double-blind format, then sure the orgs can
apply the tests themselves - but don't say that tests run by
Scientology itself and not some independent agency are
indisputable...for one thing, the orgs may be giving the same person
the same test over and over again, which will render an IQ test
completely invalid (people remember answers from one testing session
to the next)...for another, fudging test results for the purposes of
advertisement and promotion of Scientology seems to me to be actually
encouraged by the structure and form of Scientology Ethics (even
though it's abhorrent to most ethical systems).
[snippy snip]
---
Ben Allen,
Of course, it has to be *Kevin's* dead cat to count.
hei...@wport.com
Lame stuff is fun.
remove e and l to e-mail
Rebecca Jo McLaughlin
: Rebecca Jo McLaughlin wrote in message ...
Interesting that you would claim that dianetics has no measurable effect
on memory when Hubbie himself arranged a public demonstration of a Clear's
"perfect" recall, only to fall on his face when she couldn't remember what
he was wearing and he was standing behind her.
: >Scientology raises IQ;
: Higher IQ has been achieved. Personality and IQ tests are carried out at all
: orgs. It is thoroughly tested. You cannot dispute this claim.
LOL. Certainly, I can -- and do. I want INDEPENDENT research - studies
done by scientists UNAFFILIATED with the cult. I wouldn't accept a drug
company's claims for a new drug based exclusively on their own, in-house
research, and if that company refused to let anyone else test their
claims, I'd run a mile from that drug. YMMV, of course, seeing as you
bought the bridge AND the toll-booth.
: dianetics is a science of the mind, just as psychology is. most of
: psychology is theory. there is no way to physically prove how the mind
: operates.
Dianetics is the "science" of nothing. ONE, count 'em, one independent
study has been done on it. The results of that study (referred to as
"preliminary" by scientists who don't accept a single source of
information as proof) was not good for dianetics. Reams of subjective
testimony doth not scientific support make. It can be PART of a
collection of evidence, but on its own, such testimony is woefully
inadequate.
As to your ludicrous assertion that there is no way to physically prove
how the mind works, I disagree -- again. Ongoing research is
revealing all kinds of interesting things. Drugs, Brain and Behavior, by
Solomon Snyder, M.D., is a good book to start with. Pay special
attention to the chapter on hallucingens. If you like, I can
provide you with a bandwith-sucking list of references to (real)
scientific studies, done by a variety of scientists, in a variety of
countries, with a variety of methods, that supports my contention. Aside
from Hubbard and the occasional theological treatise, what can you bring
to the table?
: It has to be tested and from success comes validity to support
: theory.
Yup, BUT -- Hubbard's scribblings and Big Win stories are not sufficient
support to be accepted by anyone other than True Believers. Out here in
the real world, Hubbard should have submitted his theories to his peers
(psychologists, psychiatrists, physicians) who would test it and report on
their results. Hubb didn't do this; he knew better. Instead, he resorted
to the time-honored "they're out to get me," excuse. What an interesting
coincidence that he should choose to target as "enemies" the very group
most likely to expose his charlatanry.
: dianetics follows supported theories. there have been uncountable
: successes from application of these principles. again, there is no way for
: you to dispute this.
I dispute the validity of ONLY subjective testimony for phenomena that can
be tested scientifically. There could be all kinds of other things at
work in, for instance, auditing (i.e., stimulation or reduction of
specific brain chemicals, the placebo effect, etc.).
: advanced level content is confidential - i dont believe any specific claims
: are made for them.
But you don't know, do you? Have you read the NOTS? The OT levels?
: its about thinking for yourself. there is no blind faith
: in scientology. what is real and true for you, is all one is expected to
: accept. but how is this relevant ? do you ask christians, jews, sikhs,
: hindus, buddhists, (etc.) for scientific validity of their religious
: beliefs ?
Uh, yes, actually, I do. :) And, since this is a newsgroup where
scientology is the topic, a discussion/critique of its beliefs is entirely
relevant.
[snip]
: why is this relevant? a religious belief is exactly that. let people believe
: and practice their beliefs in the way they wish to. why are you even trying
: to discuss this?
I have no interest in preventing you from believing whatever you want.
That I criticize your applied religious philosophy does not, in any way,
impair your ability or freedom to do so. However, I have noticed the
tendency of scientologists to consider criticism as some kind of dire
threat to their existence, which makes me wonder just how much confidence
you all really have in your convictions.
: why didnt you answer my questions? what has been your experience of
: scientology? what courses did you take - what level did you get to? i trust
: you have had experience of applying scientology in your life to form these
: opinions, because if not then your opinions are unfounded and amount to
: nothing.
My experience with scientology has been twenty years of observation, of
listening to them talk, of reading their publically-available
materials (and, within the last couple of years, their confidential drek),
of reading claims made by such as you, by observing their behavior as
opposed to their PR. The fact that I have never been sucked into the cult
is unimportant. I don't need to try heroin to know it's not for me. I
don't need to murder someone to know that murder is bad. I accept that
direct experience is only part of learning and, under many circumstances,
not a particularly important part. IMO, the assertion that you must have
direct experience of something to have knowledge of it - is a mechanism
of control designed to keep the faithful in line by invalidating the often
contrary experiences of others. The mechanism is reinforced by the
requirement that scientologists not discuss their case with others.
: no not at all. but it seems your arguments are more directed at the
church : then at the scientology itself.
My major problem with Scientology *is* the "church." If it wasn't for
their appalling behavior -- which good little scientologists like you
support with your money, your service and your silence -- I (and most of
the other critics here) wouldn't even be on this newsgroup. You want to
shut me up? Get off your butt and reform your cult.
Beck
quizara...@my-dejanews.com
"miKe" <mi...@no-spam.theta.freeserve.co.uk> wrote:
>
> Rebecca Jo McLaughlin wrote in message ...
> >miKe (mi...@no-spam.theta.freeserve.co.uk) wrote:
> >: Rebecca Jo McLaughlin wrote in message ...
> >
> >: as for independent support, give some examples. exactly what do you mean
> ?
> >
> >Scientology makes claims for *testable, measurable* effects. Clears
> >have perfect memory;
>
> No such claim. A good definition of a Clear is somebody who is: "Freed from
> active or potential psychosomatic illness or aberration; self determined;
> vigorous and persistent; unrepressed; able to perceive, recall, imagine,
> create and compute at a higher level above the norm; mentally stable; free
> with his emotion; able to enjoy life; freer from accidents; healthier; able
> to reason swiftly; and able to react quickly." (from 'A Description of
> Scientology', 1993) These are the claims made by the church. these traits
> and abilities have been attained. they have and can be reached. Writings
> made by LRH are nothing more than writings and reports on reseach and
> findings, and are never construed as anything else. More info on what the
> State of Clear actually is, can be found at http://www.auditing.org
>
So you are saying that LRH was wrong?
> >Scientology raises IQ;
>
> Higher IQ has been achieved. Personality and IQ tests are carried out at all
> orgs. It is thoroughly tested. You cannot dispute this claim.
>
Yes I can. Before you can make this claim you need to have *verifiable*
results of IQ tests before experiencing the "Tech(tm) (c) RTC 1998" and
*verifiable* results of IQ tests afterwards to compare. Until this is done
*in a controlled environment* you are only spewing hot air.
> >engrams exist;
>
> dianetics is a science of the mind, just as psychology is. most of
> psychology is theory. there is no way to physically prove how the mind
> operates. It has to be tested and from success comes validity to support
> theory. dianetics follows supported theories. there have been uncountable
> successes from application of these principles. again, there is no way for
> you to dispute this.
>
Again, I will dispute this until *I* see the results of these tests *that were
performed under controlled environments*. ("What's real for me, etc.")
(0 for 2 so far miKe)
> >body thetans
> >exist;
>
> advanced level content is confidential - i dont believe any specific claims
> are made for them. its about thinking for yourself. there is no blind faith
> in scientology. what is real and true for you, is all one is expected to
> accept. but how is this relevant ? do you ask christians, jews, sikhs,
> hindus, buddhists, (etc.) for scientific validity of their religious
> beliefs ?
>
Sure do! Now, how about showing me the scientific validity of your claims?
I'm waiting...
> >What proof do you
> >have, other than testimonials of people who, for the most part, have
> >no last names, have pseudonyms or no names at all?
>
> what proof do you have when all you are basing your claims on are,
> exaggerations, distortions and hype. anyone who has really studied the
> subject of scientology knows that you cant possibly learn what scientology
> really is by reading tit bits off here or on sites out on the web, be it
> critical or pro. scientology is an applied philosophy. the truth comes from
> application. its about applying it in your own life, and knowing what it is
> to you as you do it. only then will you know. from reading this newsgroup, i
> have seen stuff posted here relating to some levels i have not yet reached,
> but do i run away screaming and ranting ? no. because i know that
> scientology isnt about that. there is no forced belief or rule. its about
> personal truth and personal acceptance. this is the fundamental tenet of the
> religion. accept only what is true and workable for you.
>
"tit bits"? how about using a better term - 'tidbits'?
Again, the argument about "if you haven't experienced it, you can't have an
opinion about it" is pure hogwash. I don't have to jump off a bridge to know
that it will hurt when I hit the water. I can use the experiences of others
who have done it as a means of determining that it hurts just by seeing the
expression on their face when they hit. I can also (are you ready for this)
use proven scientific principles and calculate the force at which I will hit
the water, depending on the height of the bridge, the gravitational constant,
and my weight. Once I have calculated that force, I can then compare that
number against (are you really ready for this?) numbers determined in other
scientific studies that were conducted *under a controlled environment* to
determine that, yes indeed, it will hurt when I hit the water.
Can you do the same with your purported experiences?
> >
> >: if you are after information about advanced course content or quotes
> >: made by LRH, then contact an advanced org, CSI or OSA.
> >
> >People in my local org will sit down with me and discuss body thetans
> >and Xenu?
>
> If you contact somebody at the appropriate level, then yes. i have done this
> myself.
>
You have discussed Xenu and body thetans? I thought this was confidential
(see your statement above). If you are discussing them, then they are no
longer confidential.
> >: >Than Xenu, implant stations, body thetans, marcabs, DC9s are all
> >: >bullshit? Why pay for it then?
>
> why is this relevant? a religious belief is exactly that. let people believe
> and practice their beliefs in the way they wish to. why are you even trying
> to discuss this?
I believe it has to do with your insistence that it is an "applied
philosophy". An "applied philosophy" leaves no room for "religious beliefs".
You can have one or the other, but not both. Besides, LRH himself said it
wasn't a religion. He only used that dodge for tax purposes. Hiding behind
the facade of "religious beliefs" shows how bankrupt your argument is.
>
> why didnt you answer my questions? what has been your experience of
> scientology? what courses did you take - what level did you get to? i trust
> you have had experience of applying scientology in your life to form these
> opinions, because if not then your opinions are unfounded and amount to
> nothing.
>
Hogwash! See the above answer. Besides, if critics opinions are unfounded
and worth nothing, why are you trying to defend yourself?
> >
> >: what are other people here doing ? whining and whinging
> >: about what they 'think' scientology is. and what do they base all this
> >: on?
> >
> >Court cases, books and articles that Scientology failed to crush, the
> >tales of those who left Scientology, often after years of devotion and
> >attaining the highest spiritual ranks. I base it on the failure of
> >Scientology to be honest, to admit to mistakes, to tolerate criticism. I
> >base it on witnessing the kind of relentless hounding of those people the
> >cult most fears. I base it on a dead Lisa McPherson and a suicided
> >Quentin Hubbard -- on criminal convictions and how your guru cravenly left
> >his wife to swing in the wind after the Snow White trials. I'm disgusted
> >by your cult's cynical use of "religion" to escape serious scrutiny by the
> >government of the United States. By using litigation and intimidation to
> >steal a U.S. tax exemption. I could go on, but you're a good little
> >scieno, and your eyes are glazing over even now. After all, *you* get Big
> >Wins and that excuses everything, doesn't it?
>
> no not at all. but it seems your arguments are more directed at the church
> then at the scientology itself. if you want to attack the church then its
> none of my business, but dont claim you know what scientology is when you
> have had no experience of applying it in your life whatsoever. dont come
> here and make all these claims about the technology when you havent even
> done a basic course. jeeez.
>
Jeez, haven't you figured out yet that this argument won't fly? Why are you
wasting our bandwidth?
Why are you trying to distance 'Scientology' from CST? It's all one big scam.
> >
> >: hype, gossip, exaggeration, herd-following, and opinion.
> >: and thats all this newsgroup is. when are you going to wake up ?
> >
> >I'm wide awake, sugar, a lot of us are, and that's what's got your
> >underwear in a bunch.
>
> if you were so wide awake, then you would be able to see and realise your
> misconceptions.
>
You certainly can't be wide awake with all of the misconceptions evident in
the above message.
> miKe
>
> Think For Yourself
> http://www.scientology.org
Sorry, miKe, but if you have been sucked into 'Scientology' you can't think
for yourself. That would be an 'overt'.
--
"Those who hunger after wisdom often seek it
in the highest heights, or profound depths"
from "Infinity's Shore" by David Brin
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