Question for Critics, please
Magoo
funeral. Please, before you answer, try to listen to him without the
knowledge you have re the cult, etc.
Listening to him, again, I can remember it was people like him who were
great examples of people that kept the boat floating. Doesn't he look
confident, strong, in excellent communication with the group, friendly,
smart (keeping aside the insanity of what he's speaking about),
compassionate,
and humorous?
Many such people USED to help run Scientology. They were different than the
moronic, lifeless, cowardly gang that now took their places. Now,
Scientologists hide. Now, Scios refuse to communicate. But back when I
started (*1969) things were quite different.
So tell me though, do you see this person as such, or am I still blinded? (I
know the information is nuts, I'm NOT asking about that---I'm asking about
him. Can you see him as we did, or not?) To me, DM looked and still looks
like a con man, no question. But Pat B was a C/S--a tech guy--and for me,
those people were the glue that kept all the utter bs ironed together.
How many of you know what actually happened to Pat Broeker--and why HE
didn't take over C of S, as LRH requested. Do you all know? Jesse Prince
told me, and I've written it up, more than once.
Peeling back the walls of mind control is a long, delicate process--and I
thank you all for helping me pull back the thin,
tricky sheaths of bs.
My best,
Tory/Magoo~~
--
Tory/Magoo~Dancing in the moonlight~
In Scientology for 30 years, out happily for 6 years!
X-Sea Org, X-Staff, X-OT 7, X-Class 4 auditor, X-OSA Volunteer after 20
years (Mostly in PR)
Executive Director of SPL to handle media
X-Top Secret OSA Int Internet Mafia, Until I realized what they were really
doing and soon after left C of S forever.
For thinking and speaking my mind, Scientology declared me
a "Suppressive Person" (SP 6 ^Cumulative Cluster :)
& Expelled me from The Church of $cientology :)
Free at LAST!
www.xenu.net (What Scientology Doesn't want you to know)
www.xenutv.com (Excellent videos)
www.torymagoo.org (My writings about Scientology from ARS)
www.lermanet.com/cos/toryonosa.htm (Top Secret Int Mafia)
or Type in Scientology in Google
(Read, Look, Listen, Make up your ~own~Mind)
mag...@charter.net
Burbank, CA
(818) 588-3044
"They, who give up essential liberty
to purchase a little temporary safety,
deserve neither liberty nor safety."
-- Benjamin Franklin
cultxpt
> or Type in Scientology in Google
> (Read, Look, Listen, Make up your ~own~Mind)
>
> Burbank, CA
> (818) 588-3044
>
> "They, who give up essential liberty
> to purchase a little temporary safety,
> deserve neither liberty nor safety."
> -- Benjamin Franklin
He almost immediately lies, saying it was LRH's choice to drop the
body. I think he looks nervous myself. BUT, he says OT 10 is ready
to go! WHEE!
The Anonymous Coward
"Magoo" <mag...@charter.net> wrote in message
news:TmvQi.50$oK1...@newsfe02.lga...
death).
Other times he looked like he was on the edge of laughing (when he spoke
about the new tech). I sometimes feel the same when I have to push something
I really don't believe in but I have to 'cuz it's my job... I almost laugh.
Sometimes I actually do laugh and I get in trouble for it...
Magoo
"cultxpt" <cul...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1192396664.5...@v29g2000prd.googlegroups.com...
Thanks for your reply. Ya...he does look a bit nervous,
but *minus* the content, do you see how good he looks,
or is it impossible to seperate the two?
Just curious :)
Best,
Tory/Magoo~~
>
Zinj
scient...@hotmail.com says...
<snip>
> Herbert Jenz is up with his finger at his nose again.
> Pat Broeker is very busy with his tongue
> David Ms. Cavige is full of fear.
>
> But I like this Pat Broeker, he behaves human
Holy shit.
Even trying my best to ignore what I actually know of the cult, Pat's
performance *screams* 'Bullshit Artist'. He's got every 'tell' in the
book; licking his lips; shifty eyes.
He lying and he *knows* he's lying.
Zinj
--
You Can Lead a Clam to Reason; but You Can't Make Him Think
Magoo
"scientologate" <scient...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1192397235.0...@e34g2000pro.googlegroups.com...
>> know)www.xenutv.com(Excellent videos)www.torymagoo.org(My writings about
>> or Type in Scientology in Google
>> (Read, Look, Listen, Make up your ~own~Mind)
>>
>> Burbank, CA
>> (818) 588-3044
>>
>> "They, who give up essential liberty
>> to purchase a little temporary safety,
>> deserve neither liberty nor safety."
>> -- Benjamin Franklin
>
>
> Pat really talks with the public.
> He is in close contact with the people and I fully understand one
> likes him, believes, trusts and follows him.
> Looks like a very friendly man to me.
>
> Pieter
Thank you. Were you ever "in"?
Just curious---if you can see what I, and many others, saw.
Best to you :)
Tory/Magoo~~
>
Magoo
"Zinj" <zinj...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:MPG.217c5d1a3...@news-server.woh.rr.com...
> In article <1192396897....@z24g2000prh.googlegroups.com>,
> scient...@hotmail.com says...
>
> <snip>
>
>> Herbert Jenz is up with his finger at his nose again.
>> Pat Broeker is very busy with his tongue
>> David Ms. Cavige is full of fear.
>>
>> But I like this Pat Broeker, he behaves human
>
> Holy shit.
>
> Even trying my best to ignore what I actually know of the cult, Pat's
> performance *screams* 'Bullshit Artist'. He's got every 'tell' in the
> book; licking his lips; shifty eyes.
>
> He lying and he *knows* he's lying.
>
> Zinj
I disagree with you there, Zinji.
I think he believes what he's saying, completely.
I think you don't/ cannot .....so to you, the only way to see him
as a con many/lying.
But I appreciate your views...totally.
Tory/Magoo~~
Magoo
>> > know)www.xenutv.com(Excellentvideos)www.torymagoo.org(My writings about
>> > Scientology from ARS)www.lermanet.com/cos/toryonosa.htm(TopSecret Int
>> > or Type in Scientology in Google
>> > (Read, Look, Listen, Make up your ~own~Mind)
>>
>> > mago...@charter.net
>> > Burbank, CA
>> > (818) 588-3044
>>
>> > "They, who give up essential liberty
>> > to purchase a little temporary safety,
>> > deserve neither liberty nor safety."
>> > -- Benjamin Franklin
>>
>> He almost immediately lies, saying it was LRH's choice to drop the
>> body.
mmmmmmmmmmm...I don't think he was lying there: I do think many believed
this to be true. He was his auditor, and no doubt honestly thought what he'd
concluded were true. No?
I think he looks nervous myself. BUT, he says OT 10 is ready
>> to go! WHEE!- Tekst uit oorspronkelijk bericht niet weergeven -
Again, that's content: I'm **Not** asking about the content,
as obviously that's nuts. I'm asking about he, himself as a speaker and IF
you can see it, or not.
>>
>> - Tekst uit oorspronkelijk bericht weergeven -
>
> Looks like non of these guys ever did TR-0 according the Golden Age of
> Tech standard.
Which is?
>
> Herbert Jenz is up with his finger at his nose again.
> Pat Broeker is very busy with his tongue
> David Ms. Cavige is full of fear.
>
> But I like this Pat Broeker, he behaves human
I think so, too. He's out you know...and no one ever heard
from him again, after this night, or soon after due to DM
threatening to put him in jail. Jack ASS.
Tory/Magoo~~
>
cultxpt
>
> - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
Well, he's much more human than DM. But that doesn't excuse anything.
I've only met 2 people in my life who I thought maybe had no soul.
One is Moxon, and one is an assistant pastor of a Phoenix church who
was convicted of beating one of his parishioners to get the devil out
of her.
banchukita
> or Type in Scientology in Google
> (Read, Look, Listen, Make up your ~own~Mind)
>
Tory, I watched this with as open mind as possible.
The man I see there is very nervous; licking his lips and trying very
hard, it seems, to stay focused.
I do not see a confident person here at all, and because of that, I
found it difficult to believe what he was saying - whether he believed
it himself or not.
Of course in context, he was probably watching everything crash around
him, and then DM starting to make a power grab. It's like he was used
to being able to ride on LRH's visions, whether they were wacky or
not, and suddenly LRH is gone and he's a little lost.
t_shuffle
I know that he was very loyal, and I believe that he honestly thought he
was doing the greatest good for the greatest number of dynamics while
standing behind the podium that day.
That being said, he's up there lying his friggin' ass off. Anyone who's
read of Hubbard's last days can see that.
Ed
Magoo wrote:
>
> I would like to ask each of you to watch Pat Broeker, speaking at LRH's
> funeral. Please, before you answer, try to listen to him without the
> knowledge you have re the cult, etc.
>
> http://www.scnvideo.ax3.net/
>
> Listening to him, again, I can remember it was people like him who were
> great examples of people that kept the boat floating. Doesn't he look
> confident, strong, in excellent communication with the group, friendly,
> smart (keeping aside the insanity of what he's speaking about),
> compassionate,
> and humorous?
>
> Many such people USED to help run Scientology. They were different than the
> moronic, lifeless, cowardly gang that now took their places. Now,
> Scientologists hide. Now, Scios refuse to communicate. But back when I
> started (*1969) things were quite different.
>
> So tell me though, do you see this person as such, or am I still blinded? (I
> know the information is nuts, I'm NOT asking about that---I'm asking about
> him. Can you see him as we did, or not?) To me, DM looked and still looks
> like a con man, no question. But Pat B was a C/S--a tech guy--and for me,
> those people were the glue that kept all the utter bs ironed together.
I think you're mistaken about Pat Broeker being a tech guy.
I've never ever heard of him mentioned as a tech person. He was in the
FBO network, couriering suitcases of cash, that kind of stuff... more
like James Bond than David Mayo.
> How many of you know what actually happened to Pat Broeker--and why HE
> didn't take over C of S, as LRH requested. Do you all know? Jesse Prince
> told me, and I've written it up, more than once.
There's a good story about Pat B. in one of RVY's posts. He
was going to be LRH's #2 and DM maneuvered around and got him shot.
Ed
Feisty
"banchukita" <banch...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1192408722.8...@i38g2000prf.googlegroups.com...
In general observation, he looks like a nice person, but nervous in the delivery of
his message. I think $cientology taps on peoples natural abilities, as niceness and
people being the 'glue' to keep group stamina up are positive things in most
scenarios. Pat Broeker didn't look like some of the militant order pushing goofballs
that I've seen.
I agree on his being nervous.
About lying:
"The lips and mouth offer us another facial zone for analysis. Much of the
information afforded us in this zone is associated with the 'dry mouth' phenomenon
caused by the lack of saliva due to the evervation of the sympatheic nervous system.
Licking lips due to this 'dry mouth' condition is a sign of stress."
Effective Interviewing and Interrogation Techniques
By Nathan J. Gordon, William L. Fleisher
http://books.google.com/books?id=CyFk05Qq6ZUC&pg=PA69&lpg=PA69&dq=licking+lips+dry+mouth+psychology&source=web&ots=-SXOL9JqVQ&sig=snBoQWbcUK2miR0mqA6oMOWajLk#PPA69,M1
Maureen
Magoo
"banchukita" <banch...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1192408722.8...@i38g2000prf.googlegroups.com...
hmmmmmmmmm.....very good points, thanks :)
Tory/Magoo~~
Magoo
"Ed" <met...@pronetisp.net> wrote in message
news:4712C18B...@pronetisp.net...
Did you listen to this tape? He states there that he audited and I believe
he later said he C/S'd Ron, although that would be quite unusual and
non-standard, but perhaps due to the remote locations, this *could* have
occurred.
Yes, Jesse spoke of the gang running the $$$---I didn't know that Pat B was
one of them, but perhaps you're correct.
Anyone else know?
Thanks,
Tory/Magoo~~
Ed
No, my system can't handle videos, so I didn't see it. If he
says so, so be it and I stand corrected.
Here's the link to RVY's story (from 1998) about how he concluded that
Hubbard was murdered. It includes that he has communicated with Pat
Broeker after both were out of Scn.
http://home.earthlink.net/~snefru/deathoflrh/rvy-death.html
--------------------
THE BLUE FLASH
And then it hit me. It was what Hubbard calls a blue flash, the sudden
insight.
Hubbard didn't die.
He was killed.
I fell back in my chair, completely stunned. In all of the years since
1986, I had never once considered that possibility. Even
with my being long out of the cult and directing criticism at various
practices and policies, the thought had never crossed my
mind that Hubbard might have been killed.
I got a sheet of paper and began to take notes, my heart pounding and
my breathing hurried. That nagging feeling had turned
into an adrenaline rush that I couldn't explain.
Who was there at the Creston ranch when Hubbard died?
* Pat Broeker - MIA.
* Annie Broeker - broken, under their control.
* Two Scientology ranch hands. While trusted to work on the ranch, I
came to see how much they were kept out of the loop.
* Gene Denk - Hubbard's personal physician. (And mine. Small world.)
Denk had disappeared for a year after the death,
which was one of those oddities, before returning to his practice up
the street from the main Hollywood complex.
End of list, a too-short list so I started to add who went up that
night in the three-car caravan that included DM, some attorneys
and a couple of us "gardeners and cooks." Nothing there.
I looked at the list. Pat Broeker was the only possibility, if he was
out and alive. For all I knew, he was dead or locked up
somewhere and in a mental state that approximated cold oatmeal. There
was no middle ground. He wouldn't have been given a
safe back-lines job or I would have heard about it.
SEARCHING FOR BROEKER
So how would I find Pat Broeker, if he was alive. I racked my memory,
trying to dig out some clue he might have given me in
the months that we were together but I came up with nothing. My
tendency to not inquire about a person's personallife had just
sold me short. I didn't even know what state he was from. Who might?
Who would know where he came from or where he
was born? I needed some clue to start the search and the problem was
the security that Pat used for his job. He had explained
to me how any trace of him had been wiped out, to ensure that no one
could find Hubbard by finding him. Plus if Pat had
escaped or fled, he was skilled enough to hide from any search as that
was what he had been doing for years to hide Hubbard
from the authorities.
I finally remembered one location he told me about and sent a message
there saying that I was trying to reach him but no reply
came. After a few months I sent another and waited. The months turned
into nearly a year and I basically gave up until one day
when the phone rang.
"Hello?" I said.
"Hi," came a voice. "It's me."
I paused, saying nothing.
"Pat?" I finally said with some incredulity. "Is that you?"
"Yeah," he said, with what I swear was a twinkle in his voice. "How
are you?"
What a question!
------------------ end of excerpt---
RVY says later in this post that some time later he and Pat
Broeker got together for a few days to catch up on the old times. I
don't recall seeing anyone else mention anything in all these years
about Pat's life after DM purged him and all his friends and
associates.