Scientology After 4 Months of "Being Out"
Stephen Von Hatten
As I look back on my recent posts, I can't help but think where I have
come from. My how a conversation with an ex-Scientologist can make you
think. If you'll allow me, I'd like to reminisce back over from the
beginning.
I was first introduced to the Church of Scientology 5 years ago and
became one in June of 2005 when I purchased my very first copy of
Dianetics: The Modern Science of Mental Health. Since then, I began
applying Scientology principles in my everyday life. On March 4th, of
this year (2007), I decided to leave the Church of Scientology, and my
journey afterwards has been... interesting and maybe a little nutty to
say the least.
I was first introduced to the Church of Scientology by a fellow
student in high school whom we shall call Danny. His concern for me is
what prompted my later interest in Scientology. It wasn't until my
girlfriend, Krystal, introduced me to this newsgroup... again... that
I actually began to seriously consider what I did and didn't believe
about the Church of Scientology and began to doubt my sources, and
became a semi-regular poster to this newsgroup. I have her and this
newsgroup to thank for opening my eyes about the Church of
Scientology. We just celebrated our 6 month anniversary this month
too. ;-)
When I first left the Church of Scientology, I had my mind made up
about everything. I thought I knew everything about everything. I went
from being a member of the Church of Scientology to being a full
fledged critic. I then re-thought my position and became a sympathizer
to the Church of Scientology. Then I thought everyone was cultic or a
cult (including my own church, which got me in a bit of trouble too).
Well, after rethinking my position again today, I've come to a bit of
a reality check.
For a while now, I've been having a hard time understanding and
believing what people have posted to this forum
(alt.religion.scientology if you are reading this off-site). Here are
the main fundamental truths I've come to. What is important is what I
can understand as truth.
After leaving the Church in March, I can't tell you how many times I
wanted to go back. I even purchased more books (mainly via Internet)
with intention of going back to the Church of Scientology even more
prepared than before to continue my courses 'n stuff (usually after
becoming disgusted with different individuals on this group). I came
REALLY close after the BBC's documentary.
Re-joining with my original church has helped a lot in not going back.
So some may have wondered what was going on, there you have it. I
haven't set a foot inside a Church of Scientology since March 3rd,
though. Anyway, I was talking about some truths that I feel I've
reached.
1.The Church of Scientology (or those who take L. Ron Hubbard's
writings word for word) destroy families. I nearly disconnected from
my very best friends and my parents because of this policy of
"disconnection."
2.The Church of Scientology practices fair game where they slander a
person's reputation or character because they were/are critical of the
church. Still don't believe me? Let's take a look at what Scientology
bigots made about their critics: http://www.religiousfreedomwatch.com/
Still not convinced? How about the many posts made by the Church of
Scientology reposting lies and recycled BS that most of the time has
already been refuted as BS.
3.This isn't a game. This is real.
It wasn't until talking with Tory that I really realized the impact
even the theology can have on a person.
This isn't just a game. This isn't some PR stunt. This is REAL with
REAL people. People should be treated as an individual with RIGHTS!
Not some pawn in a game that doesn't even exist.
I know for a while I had a really hard time on who to believe on what.
It seemed like everyone had a finger to point... including OSA. Four
months later and I'm still trying to figure out truth.
For those of you doubting and unsure, don't get discouraged. Believe
me, I've been there... and quite honestly, I still am. Today was very
discouraging in my search for what's true and what isn't. Just
remember what these great thinkers had to say about doubt, though:
"Doubt is the beginning, not the end, of wisdom." -George Iles
"Doubt is the father of invention." -Galileo
"Doubt is the vestibule through which all must pass before they can
enter into the temple of wisdom." -Colton
"If a man will begin with certainties, he shall end in doubts; but if
he will be content to begin with doubts, he shall end in certainties."
-Francis Bacon
"If doubt is challenging you and you do not act, doubts will grow.
Challenge the doubts with action and you will grow. Doubt and action
are incompatible." -John Kanary
"Modest doubt is called the beacon of the wise." -William Shakespeare
Stephen Von Hatten
(801)698-8031
Scientologist from June 1, 2005 - March 3, 2007
http://www.myspace.com/mmmm_pork
http://www.shuttingthedoor.zoomshare.com/
http://www.forum.exscn.net/member.php?u=183
http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=786230346
http://www.torymagoo.com/
http://www.xenu.net/
http://www.xenutv.com/
http://www.lermanet.com
http://www.topix.com/forum/religion/scientology
http://theunfunnytruth.ytmnd.com/
http://www.factnet.org/Scientology/favresc.htm
http://www.rickross.com/groups/scientology.html
http://www.cs.cmu.edu/~dst/Secrets/index.html
http://www.scientology-kills.org/
http://www.whyaretheydead.net/
http://www.lermanet.com/frontgroups.html
http://www.factnet.org/Scientology/hubbard.htm
http://www.freezone.org/
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_Zone_(Scientology)
http://www.lermanet2.com/L_Ron_Hubbard/index.htm
http://www.scientology-lies.com/
navy.intern...@gmail.com
wrote:
Thanks Steve, for sharing! Enjoy being free!
banchukita
wrote:
>
> http://www.torymagoo.com/http://www.xenu.net/http://www.xenutv.com/http://www.lermanet.comhttp://www.topix.com/forum/religion/scientologyhttp://theunfunnytruth.ytmnd.com/http://www.factnet.org/Scientology/favresc.htmhttp://www.rickross.com/groups/scientology.htmlhttp://www.cs.cmu.edu/~dst/Secrets/index.htmlhttp://www.scientology-kills.org/http://www.whyaretheydead.net/http://www.lermanet.com/frontgroups.htmlhttp://www.factnet.org/Scientology/hubbard.htmhttp://www.freezone.org/http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_Zone_(Scientology)http://www.lermanet2.com/L_Ron_Hubbard/index.htmhttp://www.scientology-lies.com/
Thanks for sharing your perspective, Stephen. It's important to those
like me who were never adherents of Scn.
I like the point you made about being real, and not a game.
I am glad you didn't lose your friends and family.
-maggie, human being
Hartley Patterson
> When I first left the Church of Scientology, I had my mind made up
> about everything. I thought I knew everything about everything. I went
> from being a member of the Church of Scientology to being a full
> fledged critic. I then re-thought my position and became a sympathizer
> to the Church of Scientology. Then I thought everyone was cultic or a
> cult (including my own church, which got me in a bit of trouble too).
> Well, after rethinking my position again today, I've come to a bit of
> a reality check.
Do not trust those who have found the answers. Trust rather those who are
still looking.
--
alt.religion.scientology FAQ
Please read before posting
http://www.daisy.freeserve.co.uk/faq.htm
Rev. Norle Enturbulata, COD
"Hartley Patterson" <hpt...@daisy.freeserve.co.uk> wrote in message
news:MPG.20d9f9e3c...@news.thundernews.com...
> stephen....@gmail.com:
>
>> When I first left the Church of Scientology, I had my mind made up
>> about everything. I thought I knew everything about everything. I went
>> from being a member of the Church of Scientology to being a full
>> fledged critic. I then re-thought my position and became a sympathizer
>> to the Church of Scientology. Then I thought everyone was cultic or a
>> cult (including my own church, which got me in a bit of trouble too).
>> Well, after rethinking my position again today, I've come to a bit of
>> a reality check.
>
> Do not trust those who have found the answers. Trust rather those who are
> still looking.
Except in the case of what the public knows about Scientology of course.
The knowledge that Scientology and its fake science are world-class global
scams is more and more commonplace, and the only evolution/variables in this
regard has to do with the increasing number of people who KNOW this, and the
channels through which the truth is transmitted.
Scientology, on the other hand, is static, and is not permitted to change.
Somehow many people also know this but don't have to seek any 'answers'
about it any longer. This is not ignorance, but knowledge of a static
process, which will not change. Hubbard's "legacy" is not any greater a
scam than it was in 1952. Or 1986, or now.
--
http://xenutv.wordpress.com/2007/05/15/panorama-scientology-and-me/
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,2087-2535187,00.html
http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/story/9363363/inside_scientology
http://xenu.com-it.net/txt/ildikoe.htm
http://www.xenu.net
http://www.xenutv.com
http://www.scientology-lies.com
http://www.whyaretheydead.net
http://www.scientology-kills.org
Rev. Norle Enturbulata
"Church" of Cartoonism
*
* " You can write that down in your book in great big letters. The only way
you can control anybody is to lie to them."
* -- L. Ron Hubbard, "Technique 88"
*
* "...Never discuss Scientology with the critic. Just discuss his or her
crimes, known and unknown. And act completely confident that those crimes
exist...."
* L. Ron Hubbard, "Critics of Scientology", November 5, 1967
*
* "All men shall be my slaves! All women shall succumb to my charms! All
mankind shall grovel at my feet and not know why!"
- L. Ron Hubbard, "Personal Affirmations"
Skipper
There's also the Doubt ethics condition in $cientology where you're
supposed to figure out which side you're in.
Of course, if you actually APPLY that condition (meaning, follow its
steps) then you've chosen $cientology, haven't you?
Such is the sick hypocrisy of the mental illness cult created by
Elwrong.
Les Hemmings
> Hello all!!!
>
>
> For those of you doubting and unsure, don't get discouraged. Believe
> me, I've been there... and quite honestly, I still am. Today was very
> discouraging in my search for what's true and what isn't. Just
> remember what these great thinkers had to say about doubt, though:
>
> "Doubt is the beginning, not the end, of wisdom." -George Iles
>
> "Doubt is the father of invention." -Galileo
>
> "Doubt is the vestibule through which all must pass before they can
> enter into the temple of wisdom." -Colton
>
> "If a man will begin with certainties, he shall end in doubts; but if
> he will be content to begin with doubts, he shall end in certainties."
> -Francis Bacon
>
> "If doubt is challenging you and you do not act, doubts will grow.
> Challenge the doubts with action and you will grow. Doubt and action
> are incompatible." -John Kanary
>
> "Modest doubt is called the beacon of the wise." -William Shakespeare
>
> Stephen Von Hatten
> (801)698-8031
>
> Scientologist from June 1, 2005 - March 3, 2007
>
Great quotes Stephen, and it's these thoughts that will keep you safe. It's
the doubt in science that enables critical thought. Without that beautiful
nugget of doubt there can be no advances, no disproving of long cherished
theories and no space for an open mind to work in.
For me, doubt is a very, very valuable commodity...
I'm glad you made it out in one piece Stephen, it's people like you telling
what it is like to be "in" that stops many from joining in the first place.
Welcome back! :o)
Les
--
Remove Frontal Lobes to reply direct.
"These people believe the souls of fried space aliens inhabit their
bodies and hold soup cans to get rid of them. I should care what they
think?"...Valerie Emmanuel
Les Hemmings a.a #2251 SA
Funky Donny
> Scientology also is real. There are some serious "issues" unresolved in its practice and
> administration, I believe related to people, who still have banks.
I think you mean 'bank accounts'. That's the real focus of the cult:
make money, make more money, make other people produce so as to make
more money, isn't that right Alex?
> But my advice to you (yes I know, unsolicited) is that you have to support you own integrity, do
> what is true for you.
Hubbard-speak for 'ignore objective reality'.
> But keep in the back of your mind the faint hope that we will get our act together and deliver
> what we promise. It may take a little longer than first hoped!
Scientology hasn't delivered any such thing. There are no OTs.
Levitate, read my mind, accurately view the contents of a sealed
envelope, and we'll believe you. Until such time as your cult has
delivered anything of the sort, either put up or shut up.
> Keep your own counsel.
Hubbard-speak for 'don't read anything about scientology', instead,
you must look to 'source'.
> And remember, you go where you put your attention.
>
> Where is your attention?
That's merely opaque stupidity. Alex, you may be fucked up by the
cult, but you don't need to try to fuck other people up too. Have some
integrity at least.
Magoo
"Hartley Patterson" <hpt...@daisy.freeserve.co.uk> wrote in message
news:MPG.20d9f9e3c...@news.thundernews.com...
>
>> When I first left the Church of Scientology, I had my mind made up
>> about everything. I thought I knew everything about everything. I went
>> from being a member of the Church of Scientology to being a full
>> fledged critic. I then re-thought my position and became a sympathizer
>> to the Church of Scientology. Then I thought everyone was cultic or a
>> cult (including my own church, which got me in a bit of trouble too).
>> Well, after rethinking my position again today, I've come to a bit of
>> a reality check.
>
> Do not trust those who have found the answers. Trust rather those who are
> still looking.
That's exactly what I told him: Read, look, study, learn for yourself and
connect the dots. ALL the facts are available...IF one takes the time to
LOOK.
Thanks, Stephen......good job in looking more :)
My best,
Tory/Magoo~~
Magoo
"alex" <alexr...@notmail.comdamnspam> wrote in message
news:alexrsingh-914A2...@news.west.earthlink.net...
> In article <1181723315.9...@o11g2000prd.googlegroups.com>,
> Stephen Von Hatten <stephen....@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>
>> As I look back on my recent posts, I can't help but think where I have
>> come from. My how a conversation with an ex-Scientologist can make you
>> think. If you'll allow me, I'd like to reminisce back over from the
>> beginning.
>>
>> I was first introduced to the Church of Scientology 5 years ago and
>
>>
>> 3.This isn't a game. This is real.
>
>
> Scientology also is real. There are some serious "issues" unresolved in
> its practice and
> administration, I believe related to people, who still have banks.
>
> you own integrity, do
> what is true for you.
>
> together and deliver
> what we promise. It may take a little longer than first hoped!
>
>
> And remember, you go where you put your attention.
>
> Where is your attention?
His "Attention" is in learning ALL of the facts, something Scientology
constantly tries to stop. Why is that, Alex?
Best to all,
Tory/Magoo~~
>
> Best
>
> Alex
>
>
> snip
Stephen Von Hatten
> In article <1181723315.982216.256...@o11g2000prd.googlegroups.com>,
>
> > As I look back on my recent posts, I can't help but think where I have
> > come from. My how a conversation with an ex-Scientologist can make you
> > think. If you'll allow me, I'd like to reminisce back over from the
> > beginning.
>
> > I was first introduced to the Church of Scientology 5 years ago and
>
>
>
>
> > 3.This isn't a game. This is real.
>
>
> Scientology also is real. There are some serious "issues" unresolved in its practice and
> administration, I believe related to people, who still have banks.
>
> But my advice to you (yes I know, unsolicited) is that you have to support you own integrity, do
> what is true for you.
>
> But keep in the back of your mind the faint hope that we will get our act together and deliver
> what we promise. It may take a little longer than first hoped!
>
> Keep your own counsel.
>
> And remember, you go where you put your attention.
>
> Where is your attention?
>
>
> Alex
>
> snip
Well now... I thought you drifted off far away. Where have you been?
To be perfectly honest, I'm not sure that Scientology is really
"real" ... if that makes any sense...
My attention is on getting the truth, and so far I don't think I've
found it all.
-Steve
Stephen Von Hatten
> "alex" <alexrsi...@notmail.comdamnspam> wrote in message
>
> news:alexrsingh-914A2...@news.west.earthlink.net...
>
>
>
>
>
> > In article <1181723315.982216.256...@o11g2000prd.googlegroups.com>,
>
> - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
I just saw this. That EXACTLY what I was meaning.
-Steve
Woggle
>
> Do not trust those who have found the answers.
> Trust rather those who are still looking.
Best advice I have heard in a long time.
> Alex wrote:
> THERE IS SOMETHING OUT THERE.
> OT is real, and its not reading playing cards
> behind someones back or levitating coins.
Alex, since you really believe OT is real, in your own
words (not Hubbard-speak or quoting someone else) what
do YOU think OT is or accomplishes?
Since OT "is not reading playing cards behind someones
back or levitating coins", what do you believe OT is?
How have you proved OT abilities to yourself? Or does
Scientology forbid you from talking about this?
Serious questions for you, not particularly trying to be
snarky.
Bluntly, IMHO, OT just means giving lots of money to a
cult and in return being brainwashed into believing you
are at cause over Matter, Energy, Space, Time and Life.
Obviously, you disagree. So what exactly is OT to YOU?
Skipper
alex <alexr...@notmail.comdamnspam> wrote:
> In article <w4Tbi.9$bC...@newsfe12.lga>, "Magoo" <mag...@charter.net> wrote:
>
> > > And remember, you go where you put your attention.
> > >
> > > Where is your attention?
> >
> > His "Attention" is in learning ALL of the facts, something Scientology
> > constantly tries to stop. Why is that, Alex?
> >
> > Best to all,
> >
> > Tory/Magoo~~
> > >
>
> Hi Tory,
>
> My point is more generic.
>
> When I was teaching my children to ride bicycles, I noticed that they would
> go in the direction
> they looked. I taught them the concept of looking where they wanted to go,
> not at the obstacles.
> The Obstacles are apparent in the periphery.
Wonder how many potholes on the street they crashed into, not looking
at the obstacles.
>
> I think it also applies in life in general, you go in the direction your
> attention is on....
>
> I just dont want Stephan to end up a bitter anti scientology fanatic.
And that's your blinded conceit - to assume that anyone who says
$cientology is full of shit (which it is) is bitter and a fanatic.
In fact, you're describing yourself - you're certainly a fanatic
despite your desperate facade otherwise. That's projection.
>
> I want him to find at least his truth, if not that spiritual enlightenment we
> all seek, you
> know, you once trod that path, if not still seeking.
>
> Yes there is a lot of "fucked up shit" in the church.
>
> I personally truely believe there is value in what LRH put together, maybe
> not as currently realized, but never the less, available.
Like WHAT?
>
> My intention was to validate the purpose stephan has or had with out
> evaluating his decision to
> not be cos.
>
> Take it as truth or lies, but thats my story.
>
> Thanks for the comm, you have never really engaged me much tory.
>
> alex
Muldoon
> In article <1181755270.119559.158...@o11g2000prd.googlegroups.com>,
>
> There is some great truth in LRH....
>
> Dont lose the purpose because of the idiots who interact with you with their banks.
>
> Dont do Scientology.
>
> But dont discard what is valuable in it.
>
> Think for your self. (like you do)
>
> THERE IS SOMETHING OUT THERE. OT is real, and its not reading playing cards behind someones back
> or levitating coins.
>
>
> best
>
> alex- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
Alex mimics other viewpoints when it serves his ends.
He's a manipulator and a bullshitter.
He is owned by the Cult of Scientology.
He IS a "bank."
And that's one of reasons why HE CANNOT CHANGE.
And cannot stop being a shill for a Destructive Cult.
Now, Alex, go back to being the _one_ "reasonable member of the
'Church' of Scientology" on this NG. It's your job, and they won't
let you stop. They own you and you'd better like it, and you'd better
be smiling happily at your next Sec Check, mister.
Your life really sucks Alex, and I feel sorry for you.
Jommy Cross
<stephen....@gmail.com> wrote in msg
<1181755196.8...@a26g2000pre.googlegroups.com>:
<snip>
>To be perfectly honest, I'm not sure that Scientology is really
>"real" ... if that makes any sense...
It's as real as any other piece of fiction. I know people with religions
based around books that don't even exist. How unreal is that?
>
>My attention is on getting the truth, and so far I don't think I've
>found it all.
<snip>
It looks like a long trip from where I'm standing, but I can't think of
anywhere else I'd rather go.
Except Markab in the Spring sometimes...
Ever yours in fandom,
Jommy Cross
---------------------------------------------------
This message brought to you by Radio Free Albemuth:
before you hallucinate
--------------------------------------------------
brotherb...@yahoo.com
> On Wed, 13 Jun 2007 17:19:56 -0000, Stephen Von Hatten
> <1181755196.832661.237...@a26g2000pre.googlegroups.com>:
> <snip>
>
> >To be perfectly honest, I'm not sure that Scientology is really
> >"real" ... if that makes any sense...
>
> It's as real as any other piece of fiction. I know people with religions
> based around books that don't even exist. How unreal is that?
>
>
>
> >My attention is on getting the truth, and so far I don't think I've
> >found it all.
>
> <snip>
>
> It looks like a long trip from where I'm standing, but I can't think of
> anywhere else I'd rather go.
>
> Except Markab in the Spring sometimes...
>
> Ever yours in fandom,
> Jommy Cross
>
> ---------------------------------------------------
> This message brought to you by Radio Free Albemuth:
> before you hallucinate
> --------------------------------------------------
I have only been posting here for a few weeks now. I have no
affiliation to the cult, nor do I know anyone who is involved. I
became interested after watching the BBC's panorama and have since
been posting here (seriously and with humour) and viewing OMCB(still
waiting to hear back to start posting there!).
I am an atheist, and although it is unpopular there is still a side to
it worth looking into. Not spiritual, but existential. I enjoy it and
maybe you can look over that in your quest for the truth.
Good luck fella and I look forward to joining the debate with you...
...now back to trying to wind up Truthseeker...
Zinj
brotherb...@yahoo.com says...
<snip>
> ...now back to trying to wind up Truthseeker...
don't waste your (or our) time with it.
The 'cure' is as bad as the disease.
Nobody will or could stop you, but, there are better things to be
doing.
Zinj
--
You Can Lead a Clam to Reason; but You Can't Make Him Think
realpch
Even though I now have a very full killfile, and I ignore threads right
and left, I'm still hit with the long load and sort time accessing the
newsgroup. So it does have an effect on me.
Peach
--
Extra! Extra! Read All About It!
Save some dough, save some grief:
http://www.xenu.net
http://www.scientology-lies.com
brotherb...@yahoo.com
> In article <1181833512.175084.216...@x35g2000prf.googlegroups.com>,
> brotherbenji2...@yahoo.com says...
>
> <snip>
>
> > ...now back to trying to wind up Truthseeker...
>
> don't waste your (or our) time with it.
>
> The 'cure' is as bad as the disease.
>
> Nobody will or could stop you, but, there are better things to be
> doing.
>
> Zinj
> --
> You Can Lead a Clam to Reason; but You Can't Make Him Think
No your right. I wouldn't normally but I was just in one of those
cheeky moods today.
And I honestly don't want to waste anyone's time here.
Sorry.
the even harder to handle .Lily Fire-Red.
> In article <1181788698.644130.246...@o11g2000prd.googlegroups.com>,
>
> Woggle <weeble.wog...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > > Hartley Patterson wrote:
>
> > > Do not trust those who have found the answers.
> > > Trust rather those who are still looking.
>
> > Best advice I have heard in a long time.
>
>
>
>
> > > Alex wrote:
>
> > > THERE IS SOMETHING OUT THERE.
> > > OT is real, and its not reading playing cards
> > > behind someones back or levitating coins.
>
> > Alex, since you really believe OT is real, in your own
> > words (not Hubbard-speak or quoting someone else) what
> > do YOU think OT is or accomplishes?
>
>
> I believe, or know that I am something/one that exists independently of my body and the current
> identity I use.
>
> How? I have been outside my body, in a very lucid state and seen and heard the events around me
> from that position.
Poor scientologists - they can't stand the wog world around them at
all and then they have to learn to exteriorise to watch it from any
given view!
>I am not able to do that "at will" yet. So no I can not read cards behind
> your back. And I think if I were in a "challenging situation" I definately would not be able to
> "exteriorise" as we call the "out of body" thingy.
What is that for at all? Can anyone explain that to me? But technics
to visualise are very ordinary in lots of cultures far away from
scientology. I only wonder - what for if not to use it as an artist?
And artists don't have to struggle with that. Either they got it or
not. Period. A real estate salesman, what for has he or she to know
about those things? A surgery-doctor - what for does she have to what
you call "exteriorise"? I would rather like her to stay really by the
bed. A chef, what for does he have to leave the oven and watch the
soup from the ceiling he even can become excited and then cut his
finger. A bloody recipe is that.
.Lily.
>
> But I can see or perceive things at a remote location under some conditions. I stay in or near
> my body when doing this, and I need some feedback for validation. Also these are hazy
> perceptions, but I can do this at will. Havent tried it under challenge though.
>
> I have some abilities that could be considered telepathic or empathetic. I can perceive the
> emotions a person is feeling, without physical clues, I also get fragments of their thoughts,
> but more in concept form than in symbolic form such as words.
>
> Sort of like Mel Gibson in What women want, but way less distinct and intrusive. Just if I put
> my attention on a person...I get impressions. And yes I do realize how subjective that is!
>
>
>
> > Since OT "is not reading playing cards behind someones
> > back or levitating coins", what do you believe OT is?
>
> OT is.....making decisions as to how things will be. But as an imperfect being, those decisions
> dont always turn out for the best. But it is the decision makeing function that is the core of
> OT.
>
> So now I'll get all esoteric on you....In my view the "spiritual ascpect " of life can exist
> independent of the material. (although usually they are jumbled together hopelessly)
>
> In a purely spiritual state, subject reality would seem to reign, at least in regards to
> oneself. It is the collision of all the different selves, spritually, that actually is the
> reason for the material universe. The material universe is our "solution" to all having
> different subjective realites. It is were we agree to agree.
>
>
>
> > How have you proved OT abilities to yourself? Or does
> > Scientology forbid you from talking about this?
>
> Yes. Mostly.
>
>
>
> > Serious questions for you, not particularly trying to be
> > snarky.
>
> > Bluntly, IMHO, OT just means giving lots of money to a
> > cult and in return being brainwashed into believing you
> > are at cause over Matter, Energy, Space, Time and Life.
>
> But you are. YOU are too, you just dont know it yet. You create what is around you, maybe not
> fully under your control, maybe not at any level you are aware of.....but it is the decisions
> you made, make and will make that form what is around you, good and bad. You may not ever
> realize how, why or even that, you made decisions, though, unless you engage in auditing.
> Auditing is just looking at all the decision one has made.
>
> Karma, etc.
>
>
>
> > Obviously, you disagree. So what exactly is OT to YOU?
>
> Yes I think that someday people will have conquered the unknowing aspect of their existence to
> the point where they can manipulate the material world in seemingly impossible ways, but in
> reality we already are functioning as spirits, but it is on automatic, and below the level of
> our awareness.
>
> OT is just doing it and knowing it.
>
> Thanks for the "challenge" I enjoy discussing this subject.
>
> alex
Zinj
@news.west.earthlink.net>, alexr...@notmail.comdamnspam says...
> In article <1181857598.9...@z28g2000prd.googlegroups.com>,
> "the even harder to handle .Lily Fire-Red." <lily_f...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > What is that for at all? Can anyone explain that to me? But technics
> > to visualise are very ordinary in lots of cultures far away from
> > scientology. I only wonder - what for if not to use it as an artist?
> > And artists don't have to struggle with that. Either they got it or
> > not. Period. A real estate salesman, what for has he or she to know
> > about those things? A surgery-doctor - what for does she have to what
> > you call "exteriorise"? I would rather like her to stay really by the
> > bed. A chef, what for does he have to leave the oven and watch the
> > soup from the ceiling he even can become excited and then cut his
> > finger. A bloody recipe is that.
> >
> > .Lily.
>
> But that which annimated it, does not.
>
> Its practical value is in being more familiar with what one truely is and will continue to be
> long after a long succession of bodies and identities have come and gone.
>
> alex
Alex, as much as I like Howard, I have to admit that I think you're
a far more likely 'partner' for 'her' than he.
Maybe you can tango too...
Good luck.
L. Wyatt Hubbard (Also Cocks)
Les Hemmings
It does not give you any experience or proof of
> what happens when your brain/body is dead.
Hmm.... even that is a pretty small window.
See here originally a New Scientist Last Word question.... "Does beheading
hurt?"
http://www.aintnowaytogo.com/beheading.htm
Les
--
Remove Frontal Lobes to reply direct.
"These people believe the souls of fried space aliens inhabit their
bodies and hold soup cans to get rid of them. I should care what they
think?"...Valerie Emmanuel
Les Hemmings a.a #2251 SA
L. Wyatt Hubbard (Also Cocks)
Les Hemmings
> On Fri, 15 Jun 2007 00:50:23 +0100, "Les Hemmings"
> <les.fron...@lobesvirgin.net> wrote:
>
>> Duane wrote:
>> It does not give you any experience or proof of
>>> what happens when your brain/body is dead.
>>
>> Hmm.... even that is a pretty small window.
>>
>> See here originally a New Scientist Last Word question.... "Does
>> beheading hurt?"
>>
>> http://www.aintnowaytogo.com/beheading.htm
>
>
I liked this bit....
Dr Livingstone wrote that Africans he encountered were aware that
consciousness is not lost immediately. He recounts how they bent a springy
sapling and tied cords from it under the ears of a man to be decapitated so
that his last few moments of awareness would be of flying through the air.
Jommy Cross
<1181833512.1...@x35g2000prf.googlegroups.com>:
>On Jun 14, 3:55 pm, jommycross@[127.1] (Jommy Cross) wrote:
>> On Wed, 13 Jun 2007 17:19:56 -0000, Stephen Von Hatten
>> <stephen.vonhat...@gmail.com> wrote in msg
>> <1181755196.832661.237...@a26g2000pre.googlegroups.com>:
>> <snip>
>>
>> >To be perfectly honest, I'm not sure that Scientology is really
>> >"real" ... if that makes any sense...
>>
>> It's as real as any other piece of fiction. I know people with religions
>> based around books that don't even exist. How unreal is that?
>>
>>
>>
>> >My attention is on getting the truth, and so far I don't think I've
>> >found it all.
>>
>> <snip>
>>
>> It looks like a long trip from where I'm standing, but I can't think of
>> anywhere else I'd rather go.
>>
>> Except Markab in the Spring sometimes...
<snip>
>I am an atheist, and although it is unpopular there is still a side to
>it worth looking into. Not spiritual, but existential. I enjoy it and
>maybe you can look over that in your quest for the truth.
Yeah, but I think the only thing dumber than believing in God is not
believing in God. Why should I hold to a negative on no evidence? The
matter is undecided.
That said, if a god or gods really exist, then we're clearly dealing with a
god or gods of considerable obscurity and/or sense of humor.
So we might as well get on with our lives while He/She/They get round to
revealing themselves to people who don't see angels in the corners of their
mirrors.
Existential enough for you, sir?
>
>Good luck fella and I look forward to joining the debate with you...
d00d, good luck to you too.
Skipper
<les.fron...@lobesvirgin.net> wrote:
> Duane wrote:
> > On Fri, 15 Jun 2007 00:50:23 +0100, "Les Hemmings"
> > <les.fron...@lobesvirgin.net> wrote:
> >
> >> Duane wrote:
> >> It does not give you any experience or proof of
> >>> what happens when your brain/body is dead.
> >>
> >> Hmm.... even that is a pretty small window.
> >>
> >> See here originally a New Scientist Last Word question.... "Does
> >> beheading hurt?"
> >>
> >> http://www.aintnowaytogo.com/beheading.htm
> >
> > I rest my case:)
> >
>
> I liked this bit....
>
> Dr Livingstone wrote that Africans he encountered were aware that
> consciousness is not lost immediately. He recounts how they bent a springy
> sapling and tied cords from it under the ears of a man to be decapitated so
> that his last few moments of awareness would be of flying through the air.
Well, they're more thoughtufl than Al Qaida, aren't they?
>
>
> >> Les
Hephaestus
> In article <1181723315.982216.256...@o11g2000prd.googlegroups.com>,
> Stephen Von Hatten <stephen.vonhat...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > Hello all!!!
>
> > As I look back on my recent posts, I can't help but think where I have
> > come from. My how a conversation with an ex-Scientologist can make you
> > think. If you'll allow me, I'd like to reminisce back over from the
> > beginning.
>
> > I was first introduced to the Church of Scientology 5 years ago and
>
> snip
>
>
>
> > 3.This isn't a game. This is real.
>
> Stephan.
>
> Scientology also is real. There are some serious "issues" unresolved in its practice and
> administration, I believe related to people, who still have banks.
>
> But my advice to you (yes I know, unsolicited) is that you have to support you own integrity, do
> what is true for you.
>
> But keep in the back of your mind the faint hope that we will get our act together and deliver
> what we promise. It may take a little longer than first hoped!
You guys have been promising that same thing since the beginning, so I
have to wonder, if the mighty Elron couldn't do it, is davey even
close to capable of it?
> Keep your own counsel.
But listen to others, as many as you can, not just your own insights,
though perceiving as they may be, others, even Alex, can come from the
different viewpoints you may need to see from.
> And remember, you go where you put your attention.
>
> Where is your attention?
You're here, and still in scientology, therefore it is possible be one
place and thinking about something else, he could still be their, but
he chose to be here.
> Best
>
> Alex
>
> snip
Hephaestus
wrote:
> On Jun 13, 6:38 am, alex <alexrsi...@notmail.comdamnspam> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > In article <1181723315.982216.256...@o11g2000prd.googlegroups.com>,
> > Stephen Von Hatten <stephen.vonhat...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > Hello all!!!
>
> > > As I look back on my recent posts, I can't help but think where I have
> > > come from. My how a conversation with an ex-Scientologist can make you
> > > think. If you'll allow me, I'd like to reminisce back over from the
> > > beginning.
>
> > > I was first introduced to the Church of Scientology 5 years ago and
>
> > snip
>
> > > 3.This isn't a game. This is real.
>
> > Stephan.
>
> > Scientology also is real. There are some serious "issues" unresolved in its practice and
> > administration, I believe related to people, who still have banks.
>
> > But my advice to you (yes I know, unsolicited) is that you have to support you own integrity, do
> > what is true for you.
>
> > But keep in the back of your mind the faint hope that we will get our act together and deliver
> > what we promise. It may take a little longer than first hoped!
>
>
> > And remember, you go where you put your attention.
>
> > Where is your attention?
>
>
> > Alex
>
> > snip
>
> Well now... I thought you drifted off far away. Where have you been?
>
> To be perfectly honest, I'm not sure that Scientology is really
> "real" ... if that makes any sense...
it makes perfect sense, it pretends to be real, it pretends to be
based in scientific fact, but pretend has never made anything real.
> My attention is on getting the truth, and so far I don't think I've
> found it all.
>
> -Steve- Hide quoted text -
Muldoon
> In article <1181796583.047742.116...@i13g2000prf.googlegroups.com>,
>
> The recent real estate downturn has reduced the potential value of my home down into the
> $600,000 range, maybe that should make me unhappy, but no.
>
> My kids are so busy with friends and activities that they dont even use the pool, or take time
> to enjoy the yard I am currently landscaping, my hobby.
>
> My business is changing into one that has better clientele who require less of my time and offer
> more exchange, freeing me to pursue other interests.
>
> I know what a bank is, both from my own cognitions as to the one I created, and from the
> observations of others using theirs to confront life....
>
> My feeling is that I own the church, and that is why I remain a scientologist even with its
> current warts.
>
> You dont know me, you just have an explaination for how I could be.
>
> It doesnt fit.
>
> alex- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
Alex, you long ago achieved the state of *zero* credibility.
Hey, maybe you should go down to the "Church," that you "own," and
attest to a "state attained." Maybe they'll give you a "cert" with one
of those giant gold colored frames.
Hephaestus
>
> "OT" is functioning purely from the "spiritual" aspect of ones existence.
Many, do this, are you saying being OT is the only way to be their.
> I believe, or know that I am something/one that exists independently of my body and the current
> identity I use.
Many religions believe this, it's nothing special. Just my
observation.
> How? I have been outside my body, in a very lucid state and seen and heard the events around me
> from that position. I am not able to do that "at will" yet. So no I can not read cards behind
> your back. And I think if I were in a "challenging situation" I definately would not be able to
> "exteriorise" as we call the "out of body" thingy.
Unverifiable. Go to randi.
> But I can see or perceive things at a remote location under some conditions. I stay in or near
> my body when doing this, and I need some feedback for validation. Also these are hazy
> perceptions, but I can do this at will. Havent tried it under challenge though.
Unverifiable. Go to randi.
> I have some abilities that could be considered telepathic or empathetic. I can perceive the
> emotions a person is feeling, without physical clues, I also get fragments of their thoughts,
> but more in concept form than in symbolic form such as words.
this could be your subjective mind inputing what your eyes see in the
body language of a person, as well as the true hidden meanings of
their words when they say them.
> Sort of like Mel Gibson in What women want, but way less distinct and intrusive. Just if I put
> my attention on a person...I get impressions. And yes I do realize how subjective that is!
I do the same thing, it's called reading a person's body language, you
may think that it's a limited system of communication, but likely you
are already using it. My father all his life has sold things for one
company or another, and doing this he learned how to communicate, and
read communications, without verbalizing anything, most of what you
read can be told in the eyes, they dilate, roll, stare, wander, all
these thigs are typical, along with a dozen other nuances that people
don't know. scratching your ass, coughing loudly, leaning back,
leaning forward, stuttering, pausing, these things all are tells, and
as a poker player will tell, they are all important. You may be doing
all these things, and yet your mind may be trying to convince you
you're reading minds.
>
>
> > Since OT "is not reading playing cards behind someones
> > back or levitating coins", what do you believe OT is?
>
> OT is.....making decisions as to how things will be. But as an imperfect being, those decisions
> dont always turn out for the best. But it is the decision makeing function that is the core of
> OT.
I have a good life, am I OT? Most of everyone makes a decision as to
how their life will be, are they OT?
I don't want havingness, I don't want riches, merely someone to love
and to be loved, and I got that in spades, I guess that makes me OT,
damn, you spent all that money...
> So now I'll get all esoteric on you....In my view the "spiritual ascpect " of life can exist
> independent of the material. (although usually they are jumbled together hopelessly)
religious, therefore facts aren't needed. Yet scientology so far has
stuck to a mantra that everything in it is completely able to be
experianced in the material plane, therefore facts, as per
scientology, are neccessary.
> In a purely spiritual state, subject reality would seem to reign, at least in regards to
> oneself. It is the collision of all the different selves, spritually, that actually is the
> reason for the material universe. The material universe is our "solution" to all having
> different subjective realites. It is were we agree to agree.
>
Their's a tree in my yard, if their were two tree's in my yard or
four, would you see only one if I wasn't their?
>
> > How have you proved OT abilities to yourself? Or does
> > Scientology forbid you from talking about this?
>
> Yes. Mostly.
>
Is the, "mostly", an answer to the second question, or merely an
extension of the first?
>
> > Serious questions for you, not particularly trying to be
> > snarky.
>
> > Bluntly, IMHO, OT just means giving lots of money to a
> > cult and in return being brainwashed into believing you
> > are at cause over Matter, Energy, Space, Time and Life.
>
> But you are. YOU are too, you just dont know it yet. You create what is around you, maybe not
> fully under your control, maybe not at any level you are aware of.....but it is the decisions
> you made, make and will make that form what is around you, good and bad. You may not ever
> realize how, why or even that, you made decisions, though, unless you engage in auditing.
> Auditing is just looking at all the decision one has made.
>
> Karma, etc.
Or, pulling it in.
People make decisions that effect their lives every day, I've read
your materials, and I've really seen nothing special, sorry, the ned's
even went so far as to claim to heal grave illnesses, and we both know
that you cannot openly make that claim as a scientologist, because it
would be practicing without a license, and very illegal.
What you've said so far has nothing to do with OT, I knew these things
as a small child, you make your decisions, and those decisions will
effect your life, these decision may have adverse consequences or
benefits.
However according to what you just wrote, according to it, if I were
just a better person, I would be in better circumstances, that doesn't
fit, I've met people who aren't good in excellent conditions, and I've
met people who are honourable people, and yet life keeps taking a
downturn for them, according to you, it should be the opposite, and
according to your fearless leader, they are pulling it in, and it's
their fault.
I've got a brother with a paralyzed arm, did he pull it in? Is that
his fault?
Maybe you're trying to justify your existence here with this stuff,
maybe you're trying to tell yourself you're where you are because
you're a good person, yet that isn't truly a measure a good person.
Maybe you're full of crap, how am I to know?
>
>
> > Obviously, you disagree. So what exactly is OT to YOU?
>
> Yes I think that someday people will have conquered the unknowing aspect of their existence to
> the point where they can manipulate the material world in seemingly impossible ways, but in
> reality we already are functioning as spirits, but it is on automatic, and below the level of
> our awareness.
>
> OT is just doing it and knowing it.
>
> Thanks for the "challenge" I enjoy discussing this subject.
>
> alex
Hmm, at least he admits to believing he's part superman.
We get so many here who just, clam up.
Alex, just now exposed a fatherly aspect of himself, I don't buy it
was accident.
He's trying to curb the damage in my opinion, trying to use a fatherly
image where he perceives it's neccessary in Stephen's case.
It's all crap, just like pretty much everything else he says.
I think steven may understand what I write below
Janus turns and we see his smiling face
yet he may turn again and we see the bane
yet it all may look plainly out of place
until you see the true face become profane
the even harder to handle .Lily Fire-Red.
> In article <1181857598.926022.143...@z28g2000prd.googlegroups.com>,
> "the even harder to handle .Lily Fire-Red." <lily_fire...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > What is that for at all? Can anyone explain that to me? But technics
> > to visualise are very ordinary in lots of cultures far away from
> > scientology. I only wonder - what for if not to use it as an artist?
> > And artists don't have to struggle with that. Either they got it or
> > not. Period. A real estate salesman, what for has he or she to know
> > about those things? A surgery-doctor - what for does she have to what
> > you call "exteriorise"? I would rather like her to stay really by the
> > bed. A chef, what for does he have to leave the oven and watch the
> > soup from the ceiling he even can become excited and then cut his
> > finger. A bloody recipe is that.
>
> > .Lily.
>
> But that which annimated it, does not.
>
> Its practical value is in being more familiar with what one truely is and will continue to be
> long after a long succession of bodies and identities have come and gone.
>
> alex
I think, we got only one chance. No "long succession of bodies..." But
during that one chance we can grow and change our mind. So we get a
lot of chances during that one chance.
But I see, that you try to use my posting to promote your church and
the readings of Hubbard and so I do not want to discuss that with you
any more, because you do not think for yourself any more, but only
repeat what those guys in your church tell you. This is boring like
talking to a machine is. And I do not want to become a stepper for
Hubbard's "religion".
I only would wish that you start thinking for yourself again. "Truely"
is one a human being. And remains so, no matter what some tricksters
try to make you believe.
And next time, when you think, that you are "outside of the body"
don't forget to switch on some good groovy sounds and play them very
loud. Then try to dance. If THAT works, we can have another talk.
You could also try to learn another language. Or to study computers.
Or some law. History. Things like that. That would be useful and then
you could show how superior you are. Your exteriorisation really is of
zero interest for anybody else in the world. Don't get me wrong - if
you want, try it, enjoy that, but stop promoting it and stop fooling
people.
.Lily.
Skipper
<alexrsingh-91B79...@customer-201-125-217-207.uninet.net.mx>
, <alexr...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> In article <MPG.20db8f8d7...@news-server.woh.rr.com>,
> I have enough white blood in me that I am usless on the dance floor.
>
> a (never one to be two)
Have you always been a racist?
Stephen Von Hatten
> In article
> <alexrsingh-91B796.15315615062...@customer-201-125-217-207.uninet.net.mx>
>
>
>
>
>
> , <alexrsi...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> > In article <MPG.20db8f8d77ce2b83989...@news-server.woh.rr.com>,> > > @news.west.earthlink.net>, alexrsi...@notmail.comdamnspam says...
> > > > In article <1181857598.926022.143...@z28g2000prd.googlegroups.com>,
> > > > "the even harder to handle .Lily Fire-Red." <lily_fire...@yahoo.com>
>
> - Show quoted text -
I don't think that you understood what Alex was saying. He's poking
fun about himself. Like Lewis Black makes fun of himself and Jews. Of
course... he's Jewish.
To take this comment as racist would mean that there would have to be
something wrong with dancing.
-Steve
Hephaestus
wrote:
>
> - Show quoted text -
uh, I don't think that's alex.
It may be, but what kind of person impersonates themselves with the
feminine version of their own name?
Stephen Von Hatten
>
> - Show quoted text -
Ah ha. Sorry.. I didn't catch that. I think (whoever it is) probably
still means the same thing, though. 'Course... I could be wrong on
that too.
-Steve
Howard
> > I don't think that you understood what Alex was saying. He's poking
> > fun about himself. Like Lewis Black makes fun of himself and Jews. Of
> > course... he's Jewish.
> >
> > To take this comment as racist would mean that there would have to be
> > something wrong with dancing.
> >
> > -Steve
>
> uh, I don't think that's alex.
>
> It may be, but what kind of person impersonates themselves with the
> feminine version of their own name?
???
There is nothing here, imo, to suggest that alex is being anyone
other than alex. Where is the impersonation?
Howard
--
hedmundoatmacmaildotcom
Howard
An interesting combination. From small acorns...
>
> Maybe you can tango too...
> Good luck.
Heh. I'm temporarily hors de combat. In a week or so I might chance
a modest bit of matanzas.
Howard
--
hedmundoatmacmaildotcom
Now playing: Transparente - Mariza Monte
Muldoon
> In article <1181969691.037612.320...@p77g2000hsh.googlegroups.com>,
>
> I hope you got my point, which is dont stop looking....
>
> Best to you
>
> alex- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
Who's they?
Not me, not others. Who?
Oh, Alex, you're soooooooooo covert. You're such a manipulator!
Kim P
> In article <2fk373t5mh6ijren0...@4ax.com>,
> Duane <whoev...@diz.com> wrote:
>
>> On Thu, 14 Jun 2007 22:40:44 GMT, alex
>> <alexr...@notmail.comdamnspam> wrote:
>>
>>> In article <1181857598.9...@z28g2000prd.googlegroups.com>,
>>> "the even harder to handle .Lily Fire-Red." <lily_f...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> What is that for at all? Can anyone explain that to me? But technics
>>>> to visualise are very ordinary in lots of cultures far away from
>>>> scientology. I only wonder - what for if not to use it as an artist?
>>>> And artists don't have to struggle with that. Either they got it or
>>>> not. Period. A real estate salesman, what for has he or she to know
>>>> about those things? A surgery-doctor - what for does she have to what
>>>> you call "exteriorise"? I would rather like her to stay really by the
>>>> bed. A chef, what for does he have to leave the oven and watch the
>>>> soup from the ceiling he even can become excited and then cut his
>>>> finger. A bloody recipe is that.
>>>>
>>>> .Lily.
>>> The exteriorized sprititual state is more like the native state we all came
>>> from....bodys die.
>>> But that which annimated it, does not.
>>>
>>> Its practical value is in being more familiar with what one truely is and
>>> will continue to be
>>> long after a long succession of bodies and identities have come and gone.
>> hallucinate and dream. It does not give you any experience or proof of
>> what happens when your brain/body is dead.
>
>
> I am relating my experiences, which you may take for what they are worth
> to you.
>
> But I do have verifiable memories of past lives. Many of us do.
>
> I also realize that nothing would prove it, to the vast majority of
> people.
>
> alex
You cannot prove the unprovable. Past lives is nothing more than a
belief- just as belief in an eternal life or god or gods or anything is
and as such is not provable.
Believe whatever you like just don't expect people to blindly accept
what you assert as TRUE with no proof.
Beliefs in god(s) demand that a person suspend reason - to accept that
which is unreasonable. Beliefs are delusional in the sense that they
are not rational or based on reality. Belief systems may have helped at
some point in human evolution in some way but rational thought and a
clearer understanding of the physical universe are more important for
the betterment of mankind than navel gazing and pretense.
Religion has caused more harm to more people in more places and for more
generations than anything else = not plagues,wars,or pestilence have the
virulent nature that blind belief has.
Beliefs should be kept private and not in the public realm at all - what
a person personally believes has no bearing on the physical universe and
cannot and will not change anything about it. Postulates,prayers or
whatever have no effect on anything in the universe - it is what it is
and what will happen will happen regardless of how many prayers are said
or postulates made.
Beliefs give a false sense of hope which is often accompanied by
arrogance - "I have THE TRUTH and if you do not follow it you will burn
in hell and die or lose your eternity or some other such nonsense. I do
not have an eternity - there is no such thing and I am quite content to
live my life here and now and when I die I will be dead and gone -
period nothing more nothing less. Death is not the great enemy and I
refuse to live my life in fear of some all seeing almighty being who
does not exist or to waste my life and money on endless courses to set
myself free from some imaginary eternity of rebirth etc.
I am sick of seeing people hurt,families damaged or destroyed,and the
world made a sicker and less safe place because of stupid reliance on
irrational and delusional belief systems.
Kim P
L. Wyatt Hubbard (Also Cocks)
Cecil
<alexr...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:alexrsingh-30C25...@customer-201-125-217-207.uninet.net.mx...
Scientists are discovering more and more about the mind body
connection. Each one of the cells in our bodies is a living, and
intelligent being. There are specialized clusters of cells called
chromosomes, the genetic structure that carries the DNA, and
the genes. Evidence shows that DNA records and stores
information received from the subconscious mind, which holds
memory from, yesterday, two years ago, even two thousand
years ago from an ancestor past-life time of long ago.
DNA can be compared to a book; it contains recorded and
stored information. The genes are like the various chapters in
this book, each chapter contains information such as eye color,
height, and sex. Just like a library the chromosomes house the
books within their structure. Even more amazing it also stores
every thought and experience that you and all your ancestors
have ever had or were subjected to, in the subconscious mind
sometimes referred to as the Akashic Record. Another fact to
note is that children absorb 100% of all they come in to
contact with during the first four years of life. The percentage
of programmability decreases slightly as they mature. The
Akashic Record is what a psychic reads like a ticker tape
parade, it's all there all around you in your energetic field
forever.
We each have a total of 46 genetic/energetic chapters.
Inheriting 22 chapters from our mother, and 22 chapters from
our father. The remaining two of these chapters contain what is
referred to as the Original God Code the blue print which is of
perfect health, abundance, and wholeness. If you look at your
family tree you can get an idea of where you got your physical
characteristics. You also inherit experiences, beliefs and talents.
For instance that irrational phobia of snakes that seemed to
show up out of nowhere, from your great great great grand
mother whom you later found out died of a rattle snake bite.
Or a natural musical talent retained from a past life as a Cuban
band leader.
Scientists have concluded we all came from one mother "Eve",
so we are all related and share 99.9% identical DNA, plus
every bit of human experience recorded since the beginning of
time stored in our DNA. These experiences form our belief
systems as individuals, families and nations. Many of the more
debilitating patterns lay dormant until they are triggered by a
traumatic event. We share a lot of experiences of suffering, a
nger, self doubt, and cruelty as well as experiences of triumph,
love, generosity, and benevolence. We have the potential to
be all things, it's all within us, slave / master, victim /victimizer,
rich /poor.
Which experiences do you choose to accept and embrace as
truth in your life experience? Imagine the beliefs a rich and
healthy person would hold for himself and his potential life
experiences, now compare them to the beliefs of a poor and
sick person. Unless they radically change their belief systems
they will attract and live out what ever they believe to be true.
Our beliefs create our reality.
Through the tools EIP of DNA, Guided Imagery and
Hypnotherapy, we can choose beliefs that empower us and
discard any fear based idiosyncrasy or irrational thoughts
that have nothing to do with reality in the present moment.
When we are stuck in limiting patterns, we tend to act out in
unloving ways, blinded by fear and doubt, unable to see our
unlimited potential. With out help stubborn ideology remain
fixed, to be acted out as unconscious reflexes no matter how
much will power or positive thinking we apply.
The power to break free is within our reach by deliberately
programming the subconscious mind and using it as the vital
tool it is intended to be. The subconscious mind only serves
to bring forth what we believe, like a genie in a bottle, it
makes no distinction between right / wrong, good or bad,
your belief is its command. Discrimination is reserved for the
conscious/critical mind.
Hypnosis bypasses the critical mind, the subconscious mind
can then be tapped into and used like fertile soil in which
desirable suggestions or seeds can be planted, and undesirable,
"weed" thoughts are up rooted. Imagine the critical mind as
an anti-virus computer program, the subconscious mind as the
impersonal hard drive, the chromosome which contain the
DNA as the operation system CD, and the genes representing
the data on the CD. Once the critical mind is disabled, the
new desirable information is allowed in, and downloaded to
the subconscious mind. Undesirable data is deleted, the new
data is sorted and saved ready to execute your desires.
New data creates new thoughts, feelings, and actions that
vibrate at a certain frequency, which will in turn attract the
people, events, and things, that vibrate at the same frequency
consequently accomplishing your desires. By reprogramming
our belief systems to reflect our absolute truth, we align
ourselves with the original God Code blue print for perfect
health, abundance, and wholeness. This is our natural state,
of being. Imagine a world where beliefs that create feelings
of self love, acceptance, security, and appreciation are the
only seeds passed down from generation to generation.
Jommy Cross
msg <5e2ka6F...@mid.individual.net>:
>
><alexr...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>news:alexrsingh-30C25...@customer-201-125-217-207.uninet.net.mx...
>> In article <2fk373t5mh6ijren0...@4ax.com>,
>> Duane <whoev...@diz.com> wrote:
>>> It only means that your brain is still active/alive enough for you to
>>> hallucinate and dream. It does not give you any experience or proof of
>>> what happens when your brain/body is dead.
>>
>> Well of course it is entirely subjective as far as that goes.
>>
>> I am relating my experiences, which you may take for what they are worth
>> to you.
>>
>> But I do have verifiable memories of past lives. Many of us do.
>>
>> I also realize that nothing would prove it, to the vast majority of
>> people.
I don't think it'll take much to prove it to Cecil.
<snip>
>Scientists have concluded we all came from one mother "Eve",
>so we are all related and share 99.9% identical DNA, plus
>every bit of human experience recorded since the beginning of
>time stored in our DNA.
*Every* bit of human experience? d00d, some claim.
>These experiences form our belief
>systems as individuals, families and nations. Many of the more
>debilitating patterns lay dormant until they are triggered by a
>traumatic event. We share a lot of experiences of suffering, a
>nger, self doubt, and cruelty as well as experiences of triumph,
>love, generosity, and benevolence. We have the potential to
>be all things, it's all within us, slave / master, victim /victimizer,
>rich /poor.
So why hasn't Cecil gone mad with this forbidden knowledge? No, wait, maybe
I can see a pattern emerging....
Cecil
"Jommy Cross" <jommycross@[127.1]> wrote in message
news:53290eba5313f61d...@pseudo.borked.net...
Daaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaamn you, Jommy, for
spoiling my little game. I gave 'Alex' an alternative since he believes
every piece of crap written by Hubbard.
Here is the url:
http://www.hypnosis.edu/articles/dna/
:-)