TERESA: A Whistleblower's Look at Criminality
frees...@justice.com
Teresa S. Summers
1763 Main St. Apt. 172
Dunedin, Fl 34698
(727) 733-6031
September 7, 2001
Stacy Brooks
C/O 33 North Fort Harrison Ave.
Clearwater, FL 33755
Dear Stacy:
Please be advised that I am severing all professional ties with you, Bob Minton
and the Lisa McPherson Trust effective September 6, 2001. The events of the past
few weeks have convinced me, as have others with whom I have consulted, that the
actions of both you and Bob have placed me in danger of being criminally
culpable in what appear to be shady business practices. In detail:
1) The revelation in your recent deposition that $800,000 was donated to the LMT
from foreign sources and then every penny of that money was delivered to Bob
Minton is very difficult to make sense of. For at least the past six months, I
have been told by you that all of the LMT funding came from Bob Minton. As you
know, in that period of time I twice received my salary past due, which caused
me considerable stress. My most recent pay check, for August, was delivered not
through the normal pay channels but by a check drawn on your personal account.
At the time that you gave me my check, was September 5, you told me I was now
an independent contractor.
I cannot make sense of this. If Bob was the sole source of LMT funding, and our
salaries came from the LMT account, how then can he be given $800,000 from this
account and then turn around and claim that there is no money to pay our
salaries? Why was none of that money placed into an account to cover salaries or
other LMT expenses?
I have been struggling with this since I first learned of it. The only
explanation you have given is that you were repaying Bob. It is not a very
viable explanation. The whole deal looks shady and though I could previously
have claimed ignorance of the facts as an excuse for continuing to work with
you, that is no longer the case. I now know the facts and I find the entire
thing falls below a level of honesty with which I am comfortable and I believe
that my knowledge will make me an accessory to any sort of crime that may have
been committed.
2) Your stated purpose of dissolving the LMT as a corporation so that you and
Bob do not have to testify as to financial matters also places me, and all of
the other staff members at risk. The argument that you just don't want
Scientology to know about the finances takes on new meaning in light of item
number 1. It also brings up the question of the validity of the LMT if it can
be dissolved at once in order to protect you and Bob, once again with little
care for employees.
3) Before I left the office Thursday, you called me and suggested that I make
the file containing the Quirino report accessible only to me. You instructed me
to telephone Bob, after checking with John Merrett, and tell him to install a
password that only I knew so that he could no longer access the file. I believe
your purpose in doing this was to protect Bob. I also believe that doing this
would put me in a precarious position and quite frankly I am sick of being
placed in the line of fire to protect Bob.
4) On Wednesday, September 5, I was going into deposition at the behest of
Scientology. LMT attorney, John Merrett, was representing me. Mr. Merrett did
not see fit to meet with me regarding this deposition until 6:00 p.m. the
evening before. At that time, he stated I would not have to go through with the
deposition because he had found a law that said as long as a request for
protective order was in the works, I didn't have to depose until that order was
ruled upon. He advised that I would simply write a statement, he would present
it to the court and we would leave. You asked him what would we do if that
didn't happen and he replied: "Get another attorney."
Of course, when we went to the deposition Mr. Merrett was advised of his error.
In fact, when he presented my statement and said we would reschedule the
deposition, Mr. Moxon immediately presented printed material -- laws -- that
refuted my ability to put off the deposition. Mr. Moxon stated that he was
prepared for the argument, which is more than I can say for Mr. Merrett. In
fact, when Mr. Moxon asked Mr. Merrett what law he was using, Mr. Merrret simply
said "It's in the Rules of Civil Procedure." Did Mr. Merrett have the law he was
referring to? No.
The Scientology attorney's presented a thick book, which was the said "Rules of
Civil Procedure," which John flipped through. He didn't even know where to
locate the law he was citing. It was most embarrassing and I was of course
deposed. It is only by the Grace of God that it went well and also the fact that
Judge Beach limited the questions regarding files to case witnesses.
The fact that it went well does not make up for the fact that Mr. Merrett was
unprofessional and unprepared and dead wrong to boot.
I had previously spoken to you about my reservations about Mr. Merrett
representing me, and you convinced me that I had no other choice. Well, this is
unacceptable to me and it leaves me in the untenable position of having to hire
my own attorney for any future actions against me due to my involvement with the
LMT, and there will be future actions. This is going to cause a great financial
hardship to me.
6) Which brings me to another point. How is it that I was working very hard for
the LMT, doing a very good job and at work every day at 9:00 a.m. (or shortly
thereafter) and yet I wasn't getting paid. This while Mr. Merrett receives a
stipend of $250,000 as does an attorney in France. This, while Mr. Minton gives
$50,000 to Gerry Armstrong and takes $800,000 from the LMT?
I would like to point out that Mr. Merrett was vacationing in Europe at a time
when we needed him very much, and that some other people were not working for
the LMT even though they received huge sums of money to do so. Also, thousands
and thousands of dollars were spent from LMT coffers for Jesse's trial, and
employees then go unpaid. I think your regard for me and the welfare of my
children is more than obvious from these and other actions.
7) You have stated to me in the past that if Scientology ever succeeded in
getting an order to jail you or Bob for contempt that you would leave the
country. How, then, do you expect me to continue working with either of you as
an independent contractor?
8) In addition, during the most horrendous times of stress at the LMT, namely
the past four to five weeks, you saw fit to stay in New Hampshire in order to
protect yourself. I would also like to remind you that the week before my
scheduled deposition you told me on the phone that not only were you not
returning to Clearwater, but that you were thinking of having John Merrett join
you in New Hampshire. I had to remind you that I was being deposed soon and
would need his representation.
9) In August, I began the process of purchasing a condominium. I discussed this
at length with you three times, and all three times you told me that my
employment was stable and I could proceed. In addition, during one of those
discussions you specifically told me that Bob Minton had not bought your house
for you and that you had put a down payment of your home $20,000 - money not
from Bob.
I now know that Bob did indeed buy your house for you and you have now told me
that you made a down payment of 20% of the purchase price. You told me that
purchase price was $260,000. That means your down payment was $52,000.
If Bob bought your house, big deal. Why did you lie to me about that? And, why
did you three times advise me that the LMT was stable and I should go ahead and
buy a condo if, as you stated in our meeting of Thursday Sept. 6, Bob had been
telling you for months that he didn't think he could continue covering salaries?
In sum, I believe that the following is true: there are financial activities
involving the LMT and Mr. Minton that appear to be of a criminal nature and you
have placed me at personal risk by hiding this information, insisting that
nothing wrong has gone on so that I defended your position, withholding my pay
while giving LMT money to Mr. Minton who then said he did not have the money to
cover salaries, and through your actions involving me in litigation while not
providing me adequate counsel.
In addition, you have again and again withdrawn your support of myself and other
staff members in order to stay in New Hampshire and take care of Bob.
In addition Bob and Jesse were involved with bringing money into the country
illegally and you have never discussed this matter with me. You must know that
this sort of activity placed me and the other employees at risk. If Bob is not
being honest with his money, which there is now ample evidence to prove, I
would like to have known so that I could have chosen an appropriate course of
action sooner.
In view of all of the above I will be hiring an attorney to represent me as
regards an appropriate severance package from my employment at the LMT and in
future dealings with LMT / Scientology litigation.
I am very sorry this all ended this way. It is a shame that you utilized my
personal feelings and friendship for you and Bob and falsely presented the goals
of the LMT to garner my support while at the same time withholding relevant
facts as to your activities. I am interested in fighting Scientology's corrupt
practices and in helping those victimized by it. I believed that is what the LMT
was all about. It now appears I was wrong.
I will have my attorney contact you immediately.
Sincerely,
Teresa S. Summers
"El Roto"
Elizabeth Ann Cox
and interwove it with innuendo? And let us be honest, whose business is it
anyway? I wish that those who are so busy peeking into Bob's finances would
be more demanding in asking accountability of the cult.
So, how about it Chigger, Teresa and the rest of you? Where are your
letters demanding accountability of the cult? Where is your impassioned
concern for the funds dutifully donated by the unsuspecting public? What,
they do not matter because they contributed to scientology? So, its alright
to demand accountability from Bob but not the church? It must be, because
that is what your silence implies. The bluster, bluff and empty show crew.
When one of you is ready to take the place of Bob and the staff of the LMT,
let me know. I'll be sure to hold the same torch to your feet that you have
to theirs. It would have been so much more prudent to hold the cult's feet
to the fire, but you had to savage your own.
Do you hear the roar of laughter in the background? I do. It is OSA, and
they are laughing themselves silly over the likes of you. And I do not
blame them. How right they are to do so, because you have shown yourselves
to be what you are, phonies who like to put on a show, but do not put
themselves in harm's way.
--
Elizabeth Ann Cox
FOLO ED ("Flukenet" Online Liaison Office)
ARS Chic with attitude!
aka, Bunnyann
Doubt is not a crime; simply a reasonable response to tyranny!
"El Roto" <fin...@google.com> wrote in message
news:3bd4c369$1...@news2.lightlink.com...
JimDBB
>From: frees...@justice.com
>Date: 10/22/01 12:33 PM Central
> Teresa S. Summers
> 1763 Main St. Apt. 172
> Dunedin, Fl 34698
> (727) 733-6031
>
>September 7, 2001
>
>Stacy Brooks
>C/O 33 North Fort Harrison Ave.
>Clearwater, FL 33755
>Please be advised that I am severing all professional ties with you, Bob
>Minton
>and the Lisa McPherson Trust effective September 6, 2001. The events of the
>past
>few weeks have convinced me, as have others with whom I have consulted, that
>the
>actions of both you and Bob have placed me in danger of being criminally
>culpable in what appear to be shady business practices. In detail:
I won't repeat the rest of Ms. Summers statement. There is something odd and
disturbing about this. I don't want to say things out of place and I don't
want to besmirch Summers. She clearly is no friend of Bob, Stacy or the LMT
and apparently never was. To put all of this LMT personal information out here
on this newsgroup clearly shows destructive intent.
I had a brief email exchange with Teresa and It bothered me that she was still
using scientology lingo. It sounded as though she was still in the cult and I
suggested to her that she stop using scientologyese.
I have no clue as to what is going on but the Jolie Steckart perfidy at CAN
keeps gnawing at me.
Match this statement up with her earlier statment which I reposted the other
day. A complete and utter reversal. Something is amiss.
JImdbb
Deana M. Holmes
news:tt9hscl...@corp.supernews.com:
> So, how about it Chigger, Teresa and the rest of you? Where are your
> letters demanding accountability of the cult?
I think you overstep yourself greatly. You forget who you are talking
about. I myself have taken on the cult for almost seven years now.
Deana M. Holmes
mir...@sonic.net
Deana M. Holmes
> Yes, and does this not sound like a scino puff piece? Take a bit of
> truth and interwove it with innuendo? And let us be honest, whose
> business is it anyway? I wish that those who are so busy peeking into
> Bob's finances would be more demanding in asking accountability of the
> cult.
I had a lot of people whine at me about presenting proof, or Teresa's
letter, or some such. I don't know who posted this, or if it's even
Teresa's letter. But if it is Teresa's letter, I do think that we're owed
an explanation.
Deana M. Holmes
mir...@sonic.net
Deana M. Holmes
news:20011022213454...@mb-cf.aol.com:
> I have no clue as to what is going on but the Jolie Steckart perfidy at
> CAN keeps gnawing at me.
So Teresa's also a crypto-Scieno or OSA spy? Care to provide more proof
than your feelings, Jim?
Deana M. Holmes
mir...@sonic.net
frees...@justice.com
The second had a long letter from her, several pages
long. In it Teresa accused me of deliberately putting her in legal
danger, of lying to her, and many other things.
It was a devastating letter.
JimDBB
>From: mir...@nospamsonic.net (Deana M. Holmes)
>Date: 10/22/01 9:42 PM Central
>im...@aol.com (JimDBB) wrote
>> I have no clue as to what is going on but the Jolie Steckart perfidy at
>> CAN keeps gnawing at me.
>So Teresa's also a crypto-Scieno or OSA spy? Care to provide more proof
>than your feelings, Jim?
I said that I had no clue and that would include no proff of anything...hence
no accusation. But there is something very weird about Teresa's completely
conflicting statements and her appalling disclosure of internal LMT
information. Of course, we don't know if she is disclosing anything or just
wildly throwing figures and accusations around. In any case the financial
figures have no place on this newsgroup. It would seem that she has betrayed
confidences. This is rather sad to see.
JImdbb
Deana M. Holmes
mh.aol.com:
> It would seem that she has betrayed
> confidences. This is rather sad to see.
It would seem to me that Teresa was afraid that she was going to take the
fall for what she believed were legal shenanigans on the part of Stacy
Brooks. I don't think this was an unreasonable assumption for her to make.
Please keep in mind as well that it was not Teresa who posted this letter,
but an anonymous person who is likely from Scientology.
Deana M. Holmes
mir...@sonic.net
Michael
1 Million Dollars incl. salary,car,cash & house.
Then she splits.
I Thought She Loved Everybody?
I guess not...
Mike aka Ultra
Keith Henson
snip
>I have no clue as to what is going on but the Jolie Steckart perfidy at CAN
>keeps gnawing at me.
>
>Match this statement up with her earlier statment which I reposted the other
>day. A complete and utter reversal. Something is amiss.
Happens. It is a characteristic of at least some people in some
situations. Remember Patty Hearst. Keith Henson
Zinj
mir...@nospamsonic.net says...
You yourself have numerous times demonstrated your willingness to help
the cult if it will promote your social status.
Zinj
Zinj
mir...@nospamsonic.net says...
Who's your 'confidential source' Deana?
And why is he so seldom, even to say unusually, here?
Zinj
Michael Reuss
>jim...@aol.com (JimDBB) wrote in
>news:20011022213454...@mb-cf.aol.com:
>> I have no clue as to what is going on but the Jolie Steckart perfidy at
>> CAN keeps gnawing at me.
>So Teresa's also a crypto-Scieno or OSA spy?
Teresa's behavior is strange, and many of her objections come across
as rambling, obtuse and incomprehensible.
Yet her behavior here is well within the parameters for cult spies
laid down in the Mike McClaughry interview.
It's not unreasonable to think she was reciting a shore story, and
might have been a spy for the cult.
Ps. people can find the Mike McClaughry interview video, at:
http://www.lisatrust.net/McClaughry.htm
>Care to provide more proof than your feelings, Jim?
Oh, fer chrissakes, Deana. Jim doesn't have to provide proof. He
expressed an opinion. He's allowed to have his opinion without proof.
And it's not an unreasonable opinion.
Michael Reuss
Honorary Kid
kEvin
>I said that I had no clue and that would include no proff of anything...hence
>no accusation. But there is something very weird about Teresa's completely
>conflicting statements and her appalling disclosure of internal LMT
>information.
She didn't disclose anything. This letter (assuming OSA didn't alter
it before posting) was written to Stacy and left on Stacy's desk at
the LMT. Its appearance on this newsgroup is probably related to
it being acquired by OSA.
As far as conflicting statements, I think I see Teresa's postion quite
clearly. She's an employee in a job with a high risk of getting
sued and harassed and her boss is not telling her what's going
on, misled her about the company finances and the stability of
her salary with disastrous results including a mortgage she's going
to have trouble keeping, and she's got a perception of favoritism and
inequity in compensation and coverage. None of the forgoing have
anything to do with Scientology[tm] and I've seen similar situations
in my wog work experience. It always results in morale problems and
staff disgruntlement.
Teresa's disgruntlement is not only likely, but expected. She worked
at the LMT but apparently wasn't part of the clique and they were
asking her to make sacrifices in order to benefit them while not
fulfilling any of the obligations she felt they had to her. Those
include honest financial dealings (I don't see any evidence that the
secret loan is dishonest, but it is secret and finding out about it
after several late paychecks is not going to put one in a kindly
mood to one's employers) and straight answers about questions
that affect the employees personal finances (buying real estate has
tremendous upfront costs and if you are forced to sell shortly after
you buy you can lose thousand of $'s. If Teresa did ask Stacy several
times if her salary was stable and then made a commitment to a
mortgage based on that only to find out it wasn't, she's right to be
upset.)
> Of course, we don't know if she is disclosing anything or just
>wildly throwing figures and accusations around. In any case the financial
>figures have no place on this newsgroup. It would seem that she has betrayed
>confidences. This is rather sad to see.
She didn't betray any confidences Jim, she almost certainly didn't
post this letter.
As far as it goes, I think this says that Stacy Brooks managed to
alienate one her employees through the kind of management that
alienates lots of employees in businesses all over the world.
It's not a ringing endorsement for the LMT, but it doesn't look
particularly remarkable as small office spats go. OSA is trying
to capitalize on this, but I doubt they had anything to do with
the dispute. Teresa and Stacy have both given accounts of the
dispute in terms that match point by point a couple of conflicts
I've witnessed in other places of employment. These things
happen. I do tend to think Teresa's complaints are legitimate,
but I've kept working at places where the management was worse.
===
kEvin
m...@manual-override.com
ptsc
<eliza...@chesapeake.net> wrote:
>Yes, and does this not sound like a scino puff piece? Take a bit of truth
>and interwove it with innuendo? And let us be honest, whose business is it
>anyway? I wish that those who are so busy peeking into Bob's finances would
>be more demanding in asking accountability of the cult.
It reads to me like something that was written for court, and according to a
script.
ptsc
ptsc
Yes, an explanation as to why it reads like it was written by Gene Ingram.
ptsc
ptsc
>On 23 Oct 2001 04:05:01 GMT, jim...@aol.com (JimDBB) wrote:
>> Of course, we don't know if she is disclosing anything or just
>>wildly throwing figures and accusations around. In any case the financial
>>figures have no place on this newsgroup. It would seem that she has betrayed
>>confidences. This is rather sad to see.
>She didn't betray any confidences Jim, she almost certainly didn't
>post this letter.
She did, however, make it available to people who would almost certainly do so.
In any case, why is it written for a public audience?
It's packed with material that, if written (as purportedly it is) to another
single person also familiar with the details involved, would have been necessary
only to mention in passing. Instead, they are explicitly detailed, as if it is,
in fact, actually written for a public audience or a court.
In my experience, such letters are generally drafted by legal counsel.
ptsc
Keith Henson
wrote:
snip
>As far as it goes, I think this says that Stacy Brooks managed to
>alienate one her employees through the kind of management that
>alienates lots of employees in businesses all over the world.
Though I don't have any inside information about this business, it is
clear to me that we don't have anything close to the entire story. I
know the LMT has gone *way* over budget because they were defending
people where scientology corrupted the forces of the law and/or the
courts. (Including me in the CW 13 trial.)
Also the amount of money Bob put into a certain movie would have run
LMT for a number of years. Chances of the movie being distributed are
hard to estimate but are not good.
Keith Henson
Keith Henson
wrote:
And a point that I left out that kEvin would likely agree on is that
the very best management often does poorly when conditions they have
no control over change.
Keith Henson
David Gerard
:"Elizabeth Ann Cox" <eliza...@chesapeake.net> wrote in
:news:tt9hscl...@corp.supernews.com:
By Teresa? Or at least a PGP-signed confirmation.
--
http://thingy.apana.org.au/~fun/ http://www.rocknerd.org/
"One of my remaining ambitions is to receive a blowjob while remotely
configuring someone's router." (Lionel Lauer)
Deana M. Holmes
news:ovlatt4pb94vlal06...@4ax.com:
> It reads to me like something that was written for court, and according
> to a script.
Stacy could confirm or deny that this was the letter she was sent.
Deana Holmes
mir...@sonic.net
Deana M. Holmes
> She did, however, make it available to people who would almost
> certainly do so. In any case, why is it written for a public audience?
I don't know that it was written for a public audience. I do think it was
written with a couple of things in mind: (1)showing she was entitled to
unemployment and (2)the fact that she'd have to turn it over to the cult as
part of a subpoena.
> It's packed with material that, if written (as purportedly it is) to
> another single person also familiar with the details involved, would
> have been necessary only to mention in passing. Instead, they are
> explicitly detailed, as if it is, in fact, actually written for a
> public audience or a court.
Or for the unemployment commission.
> In my experience, such letters are generally drafted by legal counsel.
I don't know that Teresa has counsel. I don't believe she was represented
by counsel at the deposition a week ago. (She certainly was not
represented by the LMT's in-house counsel, who called her before the
deposition to tell her he would not be representing her.)
Please also keep in mind that Teresa's job at the LMT was to help people
draft letters to the cult to extract money. I believe she was rather
successful at that. I would think that this kind of experience in detailing
how monies were donated would flow over to a resignation letter.
I would like to hear from Stacy as to whether or not this letter is the one
she was given by Teresa.
Deana Holmes
mir...@sonic.net
Deana M. Holmes
news:1g2attsv42j52ge4q...@4ax.com:
> Yet her behavior here is well within the parameters for cult spies
> laid down in the Mike McClaughry interview.
>
> It's not unreasonable to think she was reciting a shore story, and
> might have been a spy for the cult.
>
> Ps. people can find the Mike McClaughry interview video, at:
> http://www.lisatrust.net/McClaughry.htm
I don't know that Mike McClaughry is all that reliable or trustworthy. His
demeanor in the video is, IMHO, not in keeping with the gravity of the
offenses he is relating. I would also note that at one point last year Mike
thought he was channeling Hubbard. That makes it really hard for me to
believe anything he says.
I'd also point out that *yet again* you and others are making judgments
about Teresa and insinuating broadly that she was a spy. Frankly, there are
far easier explanations for this letter: She wasn't getting paid on a
regular basis, she'd been told that she could buy a condo and then found
out her job wasn't secure, she believed that there were people in the LMT
engaged in unethical and illegal practices, and she knew that the cult was
harassing all of them through depositions. I think that's reason enough for
her letter. You don't have to be a spy to be pissed off and/or worried that
you might have to take the fall for your employer's actions or that you
might have to be grilled by a notorious, litigious cult's attorneys.
It's amazing how people like you are unwilling to look at the simplest
explanations, but are leapfrogging to most unreasonable conclusions.
Deana Holmes
mir...@sonic.net
ptsc
>ptsc <ptsc AT nym DOT alias DOT net> wrote in
>news:ovlatt4pb94vlal06...@4ax.com:
>> It reads to me like something that was written for court, and according
>> to a script.
>Stacy could confirm or deny that this was the letter she was sent.
I am assuming, for the moment, and for the sake of argument, that it is, indeed,
the letter she was sent, subject, of course, to revision as facts become
available.
ptsc
ptsc
>I'd also point out that *yet again* you and others are making judgments
>about Teresa and insinuating broadly that she was a spy. Frankly, there are
>far easier explanations for this letter: She wasn't getting paid on a
>regular basis, she'd been told that she could buy a condo and then found
>out her job wasn't secure, she believed that there were people in the LMT
>engaged in unethical and illegal practices, and she knew that the cult was
>harassing all of them through depositions. I think that's reason enough for
>her letter. You don't have to be a spy to be pissed off and/or worried that
>you might have to take the fall for your employer's actions or that you
>might have to be grilled by a notorious, litigious cult's attorneys.
>It's amazing how people like you are unwilling to look at the simplest
>explanations, but are leapfrogging to most unreasonable conclusions.
It's amazing how people like you are unable to notice that this letter reads
like it was drafted by Kendrick Moxon. It even compliments Moxon.
ptsc
yduzitmatter
I do not think it is unreasonable for people to think about
Teresa being a spy. It has happened before. Also considering
that the LMT is thorn in OSA'a side it is not unreasonable
to think that there may be spy that has been planted in the LMT.
Just because one is paranoid does not mean that they are not
out to get you. :-)
As to the letter itself - the posting of it here is IMO a gross
violation of civility. Stacy did not deliberately set out
to stop anyone's benefits - she has made that abundantly
clear.
Teresa has the right to be upset if she thinks she has been put
in a tenuous position. What upsets me most about this situation
is the public airing of information that should not be. In
addition to that is the very obivious attempt at creating a divide
amongst the critics.
Is Stacy perfect? No, of course not. No one is and there have been
mistakes made on all sides. The fact is that the LMT and various
officers/staff have been under siege since day one. The continuous
battle with the COS on all fronts has got to be exhausting -physically
mentally and emotionally.
The posting of this letter and the entire dispute between Teresa and
the LMT is going to be and is being used by the COS and OSA to further
create division. There is nothing more these two entities desire
than the complete destruction of the LMT and its members and of
course of any and all critics.
This whole situation has gotten out of control and should be
taken elsewhere. Might I suggest a private consultation with
all the parties to hash out what is and isn't vital? It would
be better than this continual hashing out in a public forumn
which only serves to give OSA more information than they ought
to have.
This is a fight about the illegal, immoral and unehtical behaviours
of COS and its policies and procedures which hurt people on many
levels.
Kim P
Icee.
"Deana M. Holmes" <mir...@nospamsonic.net> schreef in bericht
news:Xns914343A1A541...@205.232.34.12...
> ptsc <ptsc AT nym DOT alias DOT net> wrote in
> news:35matt0l5339rbi5j...@4ax.com:
>
> > She did, however, make it available to people who would almost
> > certainly do so. In any case, why is it written for a public audience?
>
> I don't know that it was written for a public audience. I do think it was
> written with a couple of things in mind: (1)showing she was entitled to
> unemployment and (2)the fact that she'd have to turn it over to the cult
as
> part of a subpoena.
(1): I can understand in order for her to get unemployment benefit.
Still I see no reason for her to go into such speculating details. The
fact that her old LMT agreement had been terminated and she would
become an independent contractor, should she continue to work for
LMT, would have been sufficient enough for her to receive unemployment
benefits.
(2): What a peculiar thing for you to mention Teresa's intentions as such.
Did she deliberately write these details for $cientology to be used against
LMT, Bob and Stacy?
Icee.
Icee.
> ptsc <ptsc AT nym DOT alias DOT net> wrote in
> news:ovlatt4pb94vlal06...@4ax.com:
>
> > It reads to me like something that was written for court, and according
> > to a script.
>
> Stacy could confirm or deny that this was the letter she was sent.
You seem(ed) to have a direct pipeline with Teresa, so why don't
you ask Teresa if she wrote it?
Icee.
Colette Marine
<ice...@SPAMpsychassualt.org> wrote:
> "Deana M. Holmes" <mir...@nospamsonic.net> schreef in bericht
> news:Xns914343A1A541...@205.232.34.12...
> > ptsc <ptsc AT nym DOT alias DOT net> wrote in
> > news:35matt0l5339rbi5j...@4ax.com:
> >
> > > She did, however, make it available to people who would almost
> > > certainly do so. In any case, why is it written for a public audience?
> >
> > I don't know that it was written for a public audience. I do think it was
> > written with a couple of things in mind: (1)showing she was entitled to
> > unemployment and (2)the fact that she'd have to turn it over to the cult
> as
> > part of a subpoena.
>
> (1): I can understand in order for her to get unemployment benefit.
> Still I see no reason for her to go into such speculating details. The
> fact that her old LMT agreement had been terminated and she would
> become an independent contractor, should she continue to work for
> LMT, would have been sufficient enough for her to receive unemployment
> benefits.
She doesn't necessarily know that, though. Speaking as someone
who has gone through the horror of having employment illegally
and unethically terminated, you look for every possible finger
and toe-hold to build your case just to be safe. If Teresa
truly believed she was in that position, I would understand
the inclination to not leave any stone unturned, even understanding
as I'm sure she would, the damage it might do to the LMT's
cause (she has to feed her family, after all). And if, for some
reason, she'd come to the conclusion that the LMT's cause was
no longer what it was purported to be, it would make it that
much easier to do, I suppose.
> (2): What a peculiar thing for you to mention Teresa's intentions as such.
> Did she deliberately write these details for $cientology to be used against
> LMT, Bob and Stacy?
This, however, does give me some pause. I would hope this
was *not* part of the reasoning behind the details of the
letter. If anything, it should have been a rationale for
*struggling* with the decision to write the letter the way
it's written. If you still believe in the anti-COS cause,
why would you volunteer that crap to them up front rather
than make them get whatever they drag out of you in depo?
It just doesn't make any sense.
--
colette d. marine c...@nwu.edu
"I suppose that all introspective people must some day ask
themselves the question, 'How am I like college foootball?'"
-- jay...@spambait.guild.org
ptsc
>This, however, does give me some pause. I would hope this
>was *not* part of the reasoning behind the details of the
>letter. If anything, it should have been a rationale for
>*struggling* with the decision to write the letter the way
>it's written. If you still believe in the anti-COS cause,
>why would you volunteer that crap to them up front rather
>than make them get whatever they drag out of you in depo?
>It just doesn't make any sense.
The letter also comments favorably on Kendrick Moxon.
Hmm.
ptsc
JimDBB
>From: mir...@nospamsonic.net (Deana M. Holmes)
>Please also keep in mind that Teresa's job at the LMT was to help people
>draft letters to the cult to extract money. I believe she was rather
>successful at that. I would think that this kind of experience in detailing
>how monies were donated would flow over to a resignation letter.
I find your use of the word "extract" to be curious. I believe that she was, in
fact, helping people refunds from the scientology cult. No one would call this
'extracting' money unless they wanted to put a negative spinonit.
JImdbb
JimDBB
This whole situation has gotten way out of control with a lot of help from
Deana and Tigger. They have snipped away at this, dragging LMT internal and
private matters into public airing on this newgroup. And, of course, they have
had considerable help from Teresa herself. None of this does anything helpful
for our cause and the LMT is the forerunner of our cause. I don't know what
Deana and Tigger have in mind. Apparently they have nothing better to do and
like their names and postings out in the public. Some of us have asked that
they stop this destructive activity and they have flatout ignored us.
Frankly, I think that Bob and Stacy have good reason to pull out and say fuck
you to all of you. Besides the incredibly costly harassment from the
scientology cult they have had to put up with this non-stop sniping and
outright attacks from people who claim to be critics. Scientology does need to
place any spies in the LMT, the assholes here on the ARS do the dirty work for
them.
JImdbb
Russ K
> >Subject: TERESA: A Whistleblower's Look at Criminality
> >From: frees...@justice.com
> >Date: 10/22/01 12:33 PM Central
>
> > Teresa S. Summers
> > 1763 Main St. Apt. 172
> > Dunedin, Fl 34698
> > (727) 733-6031
> >
> >September 7, 2001
> >
> >Stacy Brooks
> >C/O 33 North Fort Harrison Ave.
> >Clearwater, FL 33755
>
> >Please be advised that I am severing all professional ties with you, Bob
> >Minton
> >and the Lisa McPherson Trust effective September 6, 2001. The events of the
> >past
> >few weeks have convinced me, as have others with whom I have consulted, that
> >the
> >actions of both you and Bob have placed me in danger of being criminally
> >culpable in what appear to be shady business practices. In detail:
>
> I won't repeat the rest of Ms. Summers statement.
How come? What in it scares you? Surely you'd reprint ALL of Stacy
Young's response. . .
There is something odd and
> disturbing about this. I don't want to say things out of place and I don't
> want to besmirch Summers. She clearly is no friend of Bob, Stacy or the LMT
> and apparently never was.
Not according to Stacy herself! She's one of her best friends, and
Young has great praise for all that she did for the LMT. And remember
all the support she got from the LMTers when she had some contact with
your friend Greg Bashaw's family? All of them had great praise for
her, and only praise. Now, that was when she was a Good Girl...before
she discovered whatever it is that the LMT was doing regarding money
laundering and such. It will be interesting I think, to see if any or
all of them retract their support of her.
To put all of this LMT personal information out here
> on this newsgroup clearly shows destructive intent.
First of all, it doesn't look like she did it. She's protecting
herself with that letter, as well she apparently should.
Getting info out there is NOT destructive Jim. It's Good. It's
important, and it's the only thing that makes sense. sometimes the
info won't be as sparkly clean as you'd like, but you can't just
pretend it's not there.
If the LMT was doing what Theresa Summers says, and if Stacy and Bob
did what she claims, then that's info that should be in the hands of
all the people who supported the LMT. And hey, if it gets in the
hands of Bad Guys at the same time, Minton and his cohorts have only
themselves to blame.
>
> I had a brief email exchange with Teresa and It bothered me that she was still
> using scientology lingo. It sounded as though she was still in the cult and I
> suggested to her that she stop using scientologyese.
C'mon Jimbo. You use scientology lingo VERY Frequently in your posts.
Wanna see? Or is it ok for you to do so, but not Theresa?
>
> I have no clue as to what is going on but the Jolie Steckart perfidy at CAN
> keeps gnawing at me.
>
Wow. Now that's a worthwhile thought. Have you ever seen Theresa
Summers? Has anyone who has seen Jolie Steckart ALSO seen Theresa
Summers? Maybe THERESA SUMMERS IS JOLIE STECKHART!!! Or, maybe she's
Dorian?! There are no end to the possibilities if you throw away the
requirement of Proof and Truth!
> Match this statement up with her earlier statment which I reposted the other
> day. A complete and utter reversal. Something is amiss.
Maybe she changed her mind when she had all the facts. Happens all
the time. . .
Rusty
>
> JImdbb
Russ K
> > mir...@nospamsonic.net (Deana M. Holmes) wrote:
>
> >jim...@aol.com (JimDBB) wrote in
> >news:20011022213454...@mb-cf.aol.com:
>
> >> I have no clue as to what is going on but the Jolie Steckart perfidy at
> >> CAN keeps gnawing at me.
>
> >So Teresa's also a crypto-Scieno or OSA spy?
>
> Teresa's behavior is strange, and many of her objections come across
> as rambling, obtuse and incomprehensible.
>
> Yet her behavior here is well within the parameters for cult spies
> laid down in the Mike McClaughry interview.
>
> It's not unreasonable to think she was reciting a shore story, and
> might have been a spy for the cult.
Are you even remotely serious? So, then, do you think that all that
flap about the LMT and Greg Bashaw's family was Created by Theresa?
Wait--surely Bob had his super sleuths check Theresa Summers out
thoroughly to make sure he wouldn't have to write another OSA Whore
story. . .'course, the "proof" of that one was never actually Seen by
anyone either, was it.
Handy that. . .to be able to Own Truth and never ever have to put it
in front of anyone for analysis. . .a privlege of money? How much
does a power like that go for these days?
>
> Ps. people can find the Mike McClaughry interview video, at:
> http://www.lisatrust.net/McClaughry.htm
>
>
> >Care to provide more proof than your feelings, Jim?
>
> Oh, fer chrissakes, Deana. Jim doesn't have to provide proof. He
> expressed an opinion. He's allowed to have his opinion without proof.
And this is ars, and this is LMT, and it involves Minton and Young.
No proof rrequired, or even requested.
Rusty
Icee.
"Colette Marine" <c...@northwestern.edu> schreef in bericht
news:cdm-231001...@pistachio-34-186210.nuts.nwu.edu...
Teresa stated that she had legal advise, so I think that she did know
that a sudden exchange in her employment was more than a valid reason
for her to quit her job and get unemployment benefits without any
problems.
If she wanted to let Stacy know the rest of her feelings, she could have
done that in a personal letter.
Icee
Elizabeth Ann Cox
appears to be a great deal you cannot respond to.
--
Elizabeth Ann Cox
FOLO ED ("Flukenet" Online Liaison Office)
ARS Chic with attitude!
aka, Bunnyann
Doubt is not a crime; simply a reasonable response to tyranny!
Deana M. Holmes <mir...@nospamsonic.net> wrote in message
news:Xns914343A1A541...@205.232.34.12...
Nico Kadel-Garcia
> > letters demanding accountability of the cult?
>
> I think you overstep yourself greatly. You forget who you are talking
> about. I myself have taken on the cult for almost seven years now.
>
> Deana M. Holmes
> mir...@sonic.net
You last directly spoke against the cult years ago, Deana.
Since then you have been carping at the critics of the cult,
analyzing and speculating and insisting that they justify
themselves in any detail you don't understand. I'm sorry
to say that to a significant extent, you do the OSA's work
for them.
Nico Kadel-Garcia
<frees...@justice.com> wrote in message
news:9r1l9...@drn.newsguy.com...
> More documents from the courthouse:
>
> Teresa S. Summers
> 1763 Main St. Apt. 172
> Dunedin, Fl 34698
> (727) 733-6031
>
> September 7, 2001
>
> Stacy Brooks
> C/O 33 North Fort Harrison Ave.
> Clearwater, FL 33755
>
>
> Please be advised that I am severing all professional ties with you, Bob
Minton
> and the Lisa McPherson Trust effective September 6, 2001. The events of
the past
> few weeks have convinced me, as have others with whom I have consulted,
that the
> actions of both you and Bob have placed me in danger of being criminally
> culpable in what appear to be shady business practices. In detail:
Gack! Teresa, I'm back online after a long time being busy. How precisely
did you get involved in the LMT yourself, and what precisely was your
role there?
It does sound like Merett screwed up....
barb
Agreed. But, knowing the kult and its tactics, none of this should come
as any surprise to them.
--
Barb
Chaplain, ARSCC
http://members.home.net/bwarr1/index.htm
SHOULD THE GOVERNMENT INVESTIGATE $CIENTOLOGY? Sign the petition at
http://www4.PetitionOnline.com/cofs1/
"Every week, every month, every year, every decade and now
every century, Scientology does weird and stupid things
to damage its own reputation."
-Steve Zadarnowski
"Comparing Scientology to a motorcycle gang is a gross, unpardonable
insult to bikers everywhere. Even at our worst, we are never as bad as
Scientology."
-ex-member, Thunderclouds motorcycle "club"
"$cientology sees the world this way: One man with a picket sign:
terrorism. Five thousand people dead in a deliberate inferno: business
opportunity.
$cientology oozes _under_ terrorists to hide."
-Chris Leithiser
Deana M. Holmes
news:3bd5...@news2.lightlink.com:
> (2): What a peculiar thing for you to mention Teresa's intentions as
> such. Did she deliberately write these details for $cientology to be
> used against LMT, Bob and Stacy?
Why don't you ask her? Amazing thing, you haven't been able to bring
yourself to drop her an email and ask her not even one question. Instead,
you harass me about it.
Do your own legwork in the future.
Deana Holmes
mir...@sonic.net
Deana M. Holmes
news:20011023123756...@mb-mh.aol.com:
I had no intention of putting a negative spin on it. My personal opinion is
that Teresa was doing a righteous job, putting the hammerlock on a cult
that (contrary to what it told the IRS, among others) does not want to give
refunds unless absolutely forced. It's my belief that you have to get down
to "extraction" when talking about a situation like this. It's like pulling
teeth (extraction) to get money out of the Co$.
Deana M. Holmes
mir...@sonic.net
Deana M. Holmes
> Well Deana, for somebody who has so vigorously defended Teresa, there
> appears to be a great deal you cannot respond to.
If you have questions for Teresa, you can email them to her. She can make
up her mind as to whether she wishes to answer them or not. I see no reason
why I should be a go-between for you and her, particularly since you don't
believe anything I say anyway. Let's cut out the middleman, shall we?
Deana Holmes
mir...@sonic.net
Deana M. Holmes
news:kamB7.2440$wM4.1...@typhoon2.gnilink.net:
>
> You last directly spoke against the cult years ago, Deana.
I think you are very mistaken. I think you need to look at my website
www.lisamcpherson.com, and then come back and tell me I have not directly
taken on the cult. I am very disappointed in you, Nico.
Deana Holmes
mir...@sonic.net
Michael Reuss
>> It's not unreasonable to think she was reciting a shore story, and
>> might have been a spy for the cult.
>Are you even remotely serious?
Yes, I'm serious. Speculating that Teresa's apparent change of heart
toward people to whom she had showed dedication and affection was due
to the fact that she was a cult spy, is not at all unreasonable.
Why is this possibility so remote to some people? Did you fail to
review the transcripts of the Jessie Prince trial? Did the cult try to
get a spy into his home? Yes. Did the cult succeed? Yes.
>So, then, do you think that all that
>flap about the LMT and Greg Bashaw's family was Created by Theresa?
I don't know anything about a Greg Bashaw. So obviously, I know
nothing about any "flap" involving him. If I did, what would his
situation prove about the possibility that Teresa was sent in by the
OSA?
>Wait--surely Bob had his super sleuths check Theresa Summers out
>thoroughly to make sure he wouldn't have to write another OSA Whore
>story. . .'
Contrary to the premise of you and Deana and other Minton-bashers, I
don't subscribe to the notion that Bob Minton is some sort of Divine
God. Bob is just a fallible man. He makes mistakes.
He certainly didn't catch on that the PI who befriended Jessie was a
cult operative, did he? No, he did not.
When we talk about the staff of the LMT, we're talking about people
who basically trust other people, So why is it so hard to believe that
Bob or Stacy could be fooled by a lying, but outwardly sincere
appearing person? Don't you know about TR-3 and the whole acceptable
truth notions that govern the behaviors of the OSA?
I think you should start reading carefully. Read some of the things
that are not about Bob Minton, and you might learn something about the
way Scientology fucks with people's minds, and how it corrupts them.
That's not to say with 100% confidence that Teresa is corrupt, cult
operative. I'm only saying that it's a possibility that shouldn't be
dismissed.
>course, the "proof" of that one was never actually Seen by
>anyone either, was it.
Again, we're not talking about proof, here. We're talking about
whether or not a speculation (which, by definition, is not a proof) is
reasonable or not.
>Handy that. . .to be able to Own Truth
You're putting words in my mouth that I have never uttered. A
speculation is a speculation.
Your argument is sophistry. You set up a straw man by misrepresenting
what has been stated. No one has ever said that Teresa is guaranteed
to be a cult operative, and that this is an undisputed truth.
>and never ever have to put it in front of anyone for analysis
Well, the speculation is there precisely so that people CAN analyze
it. You're analyzing it, right now, Rusty. See how that works? Go
watch the Mike McCloughry video interview, and analyze how Teresa's
behaviors could fit with my speculation.
>. . .a privlege of money? How much
>does a power like that go for these days?
Please try to be a bit more precise in your accusations. Instead of
making some sleazy innuendo, why don't you just come right out and
state your premise openly? You claim that only people bought and paid
for by Minton could possibly think Teresa might be a cult op?
Think again.
Also, let me point out that your tacit premise about JimmDBB or myself
having some mercenary, Minton-hired opinions makes you just as guilty
of that behavior which you are attempting to criticize, which was
speculating without conclusive evidence.
Your tacit conclusion here is a complete and total speculation on your
part, without a shred of evidence backing it up. Furthermore, I have
never taken a cent to form or hold an opinion against Scientology, and
I never will. I got this negative opinion, solely because Scientology
has begged for my scorn and derision by acting the way they do.
Russ, I won't criticize you for speculating. But I will criticize you
for speculating so inaccurately and idiotically.
Michael Reuss
Honorary Kid
JimDBB
>From: mir...@nospamsonic.net (Deana M. Holmes)
>> Well Deana, for somebody who has so vigorously defended Teresa, there
>> appears to be a great deal you cannot respond to.
>
>If you have questions for Teresa, you can email them to her. She can make
>up her mind as to whether she wishes to answer them or not. I see no reason
>why I should be a go-between for you and her, particularly since you don't
>believe anything I say anyway. Let's cut out the middleman, shall we?
>
>Deana Holmes
>mir...@sonic.net
Not so fast. You interjected yourself
nicely right in the middle of this mess. too late to back out.
JImdbb
Mike O'Connor
jim...@aol.com (JimDBB) wrote:
> This whole situation has gotten way out of control with a lot of help
> from Deana and Tigger. They have snipped away at this, dragging LMT
> internal and private matters into public airing on this newgroup.
> And, of course, they have had considerable help from Teresa herself.
> None of this does anything helpful for our cause and the LMT is the
> forerunner of our cause. I don't know what Deana and Tigger have in
> mind. Apparently they have nothing better to do and like their names
> and postings out in the public. Some of us have asked that they stop
> this destructive activity and they have flatout ignored us.
++++++++++++ SACRED CULT SCRIPTURE +++++++++++++
"Third Party" is defined as "one who by false reports creates trouble
between two people, a person and a group or a group and another group"
-- ref: L Ron Hubbard, HCO PL 15 Mar 69 "Third Party, How To Find One"
"The activity called *black propaganda* consists of spreading lies
by hidden sources." L Ron Hubbard, _Modern Management Technology
Defined_, first printing 1976, p. 47
"For a quarrel to occur, an unknown *third party* must be active in
producing it between two potential opponents" -- ref: L Ron Hubbard,
HCO PL 26 Dec 68 "The Third Party Law"
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
> Frankly, I think that Bob and Stacy have good reason to pull out and
> say fuck you to all of you. Besides the incredibly costly harassment
> from the scientology cult they have had to put up with this non-stop
> sniping and outright attacks from people who claim to be critics.
> Scientology does need to place any spies in the LMT, the assholes
> here on the ARS do the dirty work for them.
++++++++++++ SACRED CULT SCRIPTURE +++++++++++++
If attacked on some vulnerable point by anyone or anything or any
organization, always find or manufacture enough threat against them to
cause them to
sue for peace.
Peace is bought with an exchange of advantage, so make the advantage
and then settle. Don't ever defend. Always attack. Don't ever do
nothing. Unexpected attacks in the rear of the enemy's front ranks work
best.
-- L. Ron Hubbard
HCOPL 1960-08-15
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
--
LYING IS A SCIENTOLOGY SACRAMENT
ASK THEM ABOUT XENU
Mike O'Connor <http://www.leptonicsystems.com/>
JimDBB
>Date: 10/23/01 12:07 PM Central
>This whole situation has gotten way out of control with a lot of help from
>Deana and Tigger. They have snipped away at this, dragging LMT internal and
>private matters into public airing on this newgroup. And, of course, they
>have
>had considerable help from Teresa herself. None of this does anything
>helpful
>for our cause and the LMT is the forerunner of our cause. I don't know what
>Deana and Tigger have in mind. Apparently they have nothing better to do and
>like their names and postings out in the public. Some of us have asked that
>they stop this destructive activity and they have flatout ignored us.
>
>Frankly, I think that Bob and Stacy have good reason to pull out and say fuck
>you to all of you. Besides the incredibly costly harassment from the
>scientology cult they have had to put up with this non-stop sniping and
>outright attacks from people who claim to be critics. Scientology does need
to
>place any spies in the LMT, the assholes here on the ARS do the dirty work for
them.
>
>JImdbb
the last line should read, "Scientology does NOT need to place any spies in the
LMT.........
Michael Reuss
>I don't know that Mike McClaughry is all that reliable or trustworthy. His
>demeanor in the video is, IMHO, not in keeping with the gravity of the
>offenses he is relating.
He DIDN'T appreciate the gravity of the offenses. That's the whole
point. He was a brainwashed cult thug. Now, his personality bears the
scars of that mind fuck.
Mike was mentally conditioned to think he was doing good when he did
those bad things. He thought he was above the law. You can deduce that
he took great pride in his cleverness at fucking over Scientology's
enemies. You can see that he still thinks he was clever, and that he
gives himself "credit" for not going as far (criminality-wise) as
those who pulled off the LSD in the toothpaste op against the visiting
psychiatrist in San Francisco.
But that's a whole different issue, Deana.
What about the focus of his job? Did you think he was lying when he
said Scientology's first order of business was to get a spy into the
enemy camp? Did you disbelieve him when he said that his spies would
be given Goldenrod declares, and be told it was okay to go along with
certain levels of "suppression" in order to ingratiate themselves
fully? Why?
>I would also note that at one point last year Mike
>thought he was channeling Hubbard. That makes it really hard for me to
>believe anything he says.
Goddamn, Deana. Is this really you? I feel like you're channeling
Diane Richardson with this argument.
Just tell me, what specific claims in his interview do you dispute,
and why?
Then tell me why your speculation about Mike is admirable, while
similar speculations about Teresa are odious.
>I'd also point out that *yet again* you and others are making judgments
>about Teresa and insinuating broadly that she was a spy.
People are speculating that she was an OSA spy. Some will be convinced
without further evidence. Some will need further evidence to decide
either way. I am in the latter group.
But I'm not willing to dismiss this possibility, without knowing more.
Nor should you.
>Frankly, there are
>far easier explanations for this letter: She wasn't getting paid on a
>regular basis, she'd been told that she could buy a condo and then found
>out her job wasn't secure,
So? Lots of people all over the country have similar problems every
day. Generally, they don't suddenly disavow all the people whom the
day before they had called friends, and go on to write affidavits
which consist of laundry lists of innuendo and smears.
>she believed that there were people in the LMT
>engaged in unethical and illegal practices, and she knew that the cult was
>harassing all of them through depositions.
I agree that some of the things Stacy and Bob tried to do to insulate
LMT personnel and records were ill advised. And I don't think it's
necessarily bad for Teresa to protect herself in that situation.
But to me, Teresa isn't acting in a way that simply removes her from
the line of fire. She's acting more like someone who has turned around
180 degrees, and now is joining with the cult, in trying to embarrass
and smear the LMT.
>I think that's reason enough for her letter.
Clearly you do and I don't.
If the letter were restricted to things which impacted Teresa
personally, over which Stacy and Bob had some control, I might agree
with you. But there are enough bizarre and non-sequitur things in the
letter to send it over the top.
>You don't have to be a spy to be pissed off and/or worried that
>you might have to take the fall for your employer's actions or that you
>might have to be grilled by a notorious, litigious cult's attorneys.
That's very true. Still, the letter doesn't eliminate the possibility
that she was a cult spy, either, does it?
Teresa had already made it through her deposition. She claims the
uncertainty of her job, given her purchase of a new condo, justifies
her anger toward Stacy. But then she cavalierly quit her job (with
it's new terms) on the spur of the moment, when arguably, she didn't
have to, and so put her own income and ability to make mortgage
payments at risk anyway. To me, these things don't add up.
>It's amazing how people like you are unwilling to look at the simplest
>explanations, but are leapfrogging to most unreasonable conclusions.
I hate it when people put words in my mouth. Please stop doing that.
I've not arrived at a conclusion. I think there is a reasonable
possibility that Teresa was sent in as a spy by the OSA.
I think it's also possible that she could be just an emotional,
melodramatic person. Or she might be a person who is very easily
manipulated, who is being manipulated by people other than the OSA.
Are you manipulating Teresa, Deana?
Michael Reuss
Honorary Kid
Deana M. Holmes
fv.aol.com:
> Not so fast. You interjected yourself
> nicely right in the middle of this mess. too late to back out.
I'm certainly not going to remain the middleman in this thing. You can
email Teresa just as good as I can.
What amazes me is that nobody who has criticized Teresa has emailed her. I
talked with her tonight, and she can't figure out why that is the case. I
suggested that maybe these people aren't interested in finding out the
truth, but only hearing one side of the story.
Deana M. Holmes
mir...@sonic.net
Dr. Paloma
>>
>Frankly, I think that Bob and Stacy have good reason to pull out and say fuck
>you to all of you.
And fuck yo momma, too.
>
>JImdbb
>
>
JimDBB
>From: smash...@volcanomail.com (Russ K)
>Date: 10/23/01 1:43 PM Central
>To put all of this LMT personal information out here
>> on this newsgroup clearly shows destructive intent.
>
>First of all, it doesn't look like she did it. She's protecting
>herself with that letter, as well she apparently should.
>
>Getting info out there is NOT destructive Jim. It's Good. It's
>important, and it's the only thing that makes sense. sometimes the
>info won't be as sparkly clean as you'd like, but you can't just
>pretend it's not there.
>
>If the LMT was doing what Theresa Summers says, and if Stacy and Bob
>did what she claims, then that's info that should be in the hands of
>all the people who supported the LMT. And hey, if it gets in the
>hands of Bad Guys at the same time, Minton and his cohorts have only
>themselves to blame.
>> I had a brief email exchange with Teresa and It bothered me that she was
>still
>> using scientology lingo. It sounded as though she was still in the cult and
>I suggested to her that she stop using scientologyese.
>
>C'mon Jimbo. You use scientology lingo VERY Frequently in your posts.
>Wanna see? Or is it ok for you to do so, but not Theresa?
Yeah, I want to see. Are you collecting my posts? There must be a line of
people collecting my posts. The only time that I use scientology lingo is in a
mocking sense. Teresas used scientologyese like this..."I had an OT 7 contact
him....." Only a scientologist would use this OT designation like this.
Anyone who has gotten out of the cult knows that an OT designation is
meaningless...it only means that that person has spent hours every day trying
to contact the spirits of dead aliens.
>> I have no clue as to what is going on but the Jolie Steckart perfidy at CAN
>> keeps gnawing at me.
>Wow. Now that's a worthwhile thought. Have you ever seen Theresa
>Summers? Has anyone who has seen Jolie Steckart ALSO seen Theresa
>Summers? Maybe THERESA SUMMERS IS JOLIE STECKHART!!! Or,
I have never seen Teresa Summers but for sure, bob, Stacy and Jess have and
they know Jolie Steckart well.
>> Match this statement up with her earlier statment which I reposted the
>other
>> day. A complete and utter reversal. Something is amiss.
>
>Maybe she changed her mind when she had all the facts. Happens all
>the time. . .
You know Russ K, I begrudgingly admit that you do make some sense and pose
worthwhile questions at times. Why don't we all give this teresa Summers
circus a rest. As I have siad more than once, whatever concern she has with
Stach, Bob and the LMt, she should take it up with them and keep it private.
ptsc
Maybe, for some bizarre reason, they have a strange belief that their "private"
correspondence may end up being posted by anonymous OSA shills.
I wonder why that would be.
ptsc
Deana M. Holmes
> Maybe, for some bizarre reason, they have a strange belief that their
> "private" correspondence may end up being posted by anonymous OSA
> shills.
>
> I wonder why that would be.
Rob,
Ah, in other words, you're scared. Nevertheless...
If you (*or anyone else* for that matter) has any *proof* that Teresa
Summers is OSA or working for OSA, let's hear it. I'm all ears.
I suspect your "evidence" is going to be non-existent, based on hunches,
feelings or speculation. This would not surprise me at all. I do not expect
that you'll be able to crank out a scintilla of evidence, but that won't
stop you or your fellow-travelers from defaming Teresa nonetheless.
Deana M. Holmes
mir...@sonic.net
Deana M. Holmes
> People are speculating that she was an OSA spy. Some will be convinced
> without further evidence. Some will need further evidence to decide
> either way. I am in the latter group.
>
> But I'm not willing to dismiss this possibility, without knowing more.
> Nor should you.
Frankly, this is so incredibly *stupid*. Up until seven weeks ago, Teresa
was working at the LMT, doing what Stacy asked her to do, including writing
what was for all intents and purposes a KR on Patricia Greenway. This was
in addition to her work helping victims of the cult get their money back.
Now we have you and others entertaining the possibility that she might be
an OSA spy. WHERE IS YOUR EVIDENCE? I can't shout too loudly about that.
It seems to me that the ONLY reason you and others are willing to entertain
the possibility that Teresa might be a spy for OSA is that what she says
casts Stacy Brooks, among others, in a very bad light. Never have you
asked, "Perhaps even *some* of this is true." Not at all. You take it on
face value that Stacy would *never* lie and thus, Teresa must be lying, and
on top of that, she must be working for the cult.
You, like Rob, have never written Teresa, never conversed with her, never
done anything to confirm her side of the story. I think you're lazy, and
moreover, I think you're scared. Not scared that she might be an OSA spy
(which I doubt) but that she might be telling the truth.
But we'll never know, because Stacy certainly isn't going to give her side
of the damning charges in the letter and you aren't going to press her on
it.
Deana M. Holmes
mir...@sonic.net
Deana M. Holmes
You know, I have gotten multiple reports that no less of a person than
Stacy Brooks has said nice things about Kendric Moxon in the not-so-distant
past. Now I thought that was mighty *weird*, considering that Stacy's been
going toe-to-toe with Moxon, but stranger things have happened.
Deana M. Holmes
mir...@sonic.net
Deana M. Holmes
news:Xns9143429EF542...@205.232.34.12:
> ptsc <ptsc AT nym DOT alias DOT net> wrote in
> news:ovlatt4pb94vlal06...@4ax.com:
>
>> It reads to me like something that was written for court, and according
>> to a script.
>
> Stacy could confirm or deny that this was the letter she was sent.
No matter. I asked Teresa and she said that this is the letter she sent.
Deana M. Holmes
mir...@sonic.net
ptsc
>ptsc <ptsc AT nym DOT alias DOT net> wrote in
>news:r0ectts5vnj66b57d...@4ax.com:
>> Maybe, for some bizarre reason, they have a strange belief that their
>> "private" correspondence may end up being posted by anonymous OSA
>> shills.
>> I wonder why that would be.
>Rob,
>Ah, in other words, you're scared. Nevertheless...
Ah, in other words, you're a fucking moron.
Could just be that if it's going to end up public, or anyway known to OSA
anyway, why not just keep it in public in the first place?
Why bother going through the pretense of sending it in email at all?
She's entirely capable of posting here, so I imagine she's entirely capable of
reading here, and entirely capable of commenting on it if she sees fit.
Just as Stacy Brooks is entirely capable of responding to questions posted here,
as you so often and so shrilly and so insistently demand.
ptsc
ptsc
>Michael Reuss <michae...@home.com> wrote in
>news:268ctt46t42cog6s9...@4ax.com:
>You, like Rob, have never written Teresa, never conversed with her, never
>done anything to confirm her side of the story. I think you're lazy, and
>moreover, I think you're scared. Not scared that she might be an OSA spy
>(which I doubt) but that she might be telling the truth.
So why would she tell the truth while being mysteriously incapable of doing so
in public like everyone else? She is certainly capable of posting here when it
suits her. Why suddenly the insistence on email?
>But we'll never know, because Stacy certainly isn't going to give her side
>of the damning charges in the letter and you aren't going to press her on
>it.
Why are you so certain of this? She, unlike Teresa, has been willing to answer
questions in detail, rather than throwing hit-and-run attacks our way and then
running and hiding when they get questioned.
This is all more than a trifle hypocritical, considering that both you and
Teresa have engaged in a Scientology-style "disconnection" from Stacy and refuse
to communicate with her directly.
Despite this, you demand that we email Teresa, who you inform us is entirely
aware what is going on in this newsgroup and chooses not to comment.
How very convenient. How very hypocritical.
Or to be more blunt about it, what a huge fucking crock of shit.
ptsc
Beverly Rice
> ptsc <ptsc AT nym DOT alias DOT net> wrote in
> > Maybe, for some bizarre reason, they have a strange belief that their
> > "private" correspondence may end up being posted by anonymous OSA
> > shills.
> > I wonder why that would be.
> Ah, in other words, you're scared. Nevertheless...
Deanna, that was an asshole statement.
By the logic of your own asshole statement . . .
you need to post all private e-mail of yours and Teresa's
on the NG . . .
unless, as you insinuate to someone else . . .
you're "scared".
ARC = As-Ising the Real Co$,
Beverly
Diane Richardson
net> wrote:
>On 23 Oct 2001 10:02:42 -0400, mir...@nospamsonic.net (Deana M. Holmes) wrote:
>
>>I'd also point out that *yet again* you and others are making judgments
>>about Teresa and insinuating broadly that she was a spy. Frankly, there are
>>far easier explanations for this letter: She wasn't getting paid on a
>>regular basis, she'd been told that she could buy a condo and then found
>>out her job wasn't secure, she believed that there were people in the LMT
>>engaged in unethical and illegal practices, and she knew that the cult was
>>harassing all of them through depositions. I think that's reason enough for
>>her letter. You don't have to be a spy to be pissed off and/or worried that
>>you might have to take the fall for your employer's actions or that you
>>might have to be grilled by a notorious, litigious cult's attorneys.
>
>>It's amazing how people like you are unwilling to look at the simplest
>>explanations, but are leapfrogging to most unreasonable conclusions.
>
>It's amazing how people like you are unable to notice that this letter reads
>like it was drafted by Kendrick Moxon. It even compliments Moxon.
It sounds more like it was drafted by Ken Dandar to me, Rob. What is
it, exactly, that makes you believe it was Moxon who drafted the
letter rather than Teresa's one-time employer Ken Dandar?
Diane Richardson
ref...@bway.net
Diane Richardson
net> wrote:
>On Tue, 23 Oct 2001 10:02:44 GMT, m...@manual-override.com (kEvin) wrote:
>
>>On 23 Oct 2001 04:05:01 GMT, jim...@aol.com (JimDBB) wrote:
>
>>> Of course, we don't know if she is disclosing anything or just
>>>wildly throwing figures and accusations around. In any case the financial
>>>figures have no place on this newsgroup. It would seem that she has betrayed
>>>confidences. This is rather sad to see.
>
>>She didn't betray any confidences Jim, she almost certainly didn't
>>post this letter.
>
>She did, however, make it available to people who would almost certainly do so.
I suspect it was made public when it was produced in answer to a
subpoena in a lawsuit in which Teresa Summers was deposed.
>In any case, why is it written for a public audience?
Perhaps because she was following an attorney's advice to cover her
own ass in deposition rather than serving as a patsy being set up to
take the fall for Stacy Brooks. It looks to me that Stacy's put
herself in deep, deep legal trouble by repeatedly lying under oath.
I suspect Stacy was expecting -- perhaps even demanding -- that her
employees lie under oath to cover her own lies. It could be that
Teresa Summers wasn't as willing to dissemble and distort the truth as
her boss was.
>It's packed with material that, if written (as purportedly it is) to another
>single person also familiar with the details involved, would have been necessary
>only to mention in passing. Instead, they are explicitly detailed, as if it is,
>in fact, actually written for a public audience or a court.
Sounds like the prudent thing to do if you were scheduled to return
for yet more depositions about your boss's possibly criminal
activities. Particularly when your employer's attorney notified you
that he would no longer be representing you at deposition.
>In my experience, such letters are generally drafted by legal counsel.
Just remember that Stacy Brooks met Teresa Summers when both
were working in the offices of Ken Dandar. If anyone is giving
Teresa Summers legal advice, my money is on Dandar.
It's odd that you, of all people, are eager to see this imbroglio as
nothing more than a struggle between black and white, good and evil.
You're intelligent enough to see that there's much more involved in
this than just two sides. The Bob-and-Stacy duo have managed to
make more than the CoS their enemy -- they've trampled on plenty
of others in the process, too.
Diane Richardson
ref...@bway.net
Heffer
>jim...@aol.com (JimDBB) wrote in
>news:20011022213454...@mb-cf.aol.com:
>
>> I have no clue as to what is going on but the Jolie Steckart perfidy at
>> CAN keeps gnawing at me.
>
>So Teresa's also a crypto-Scieno or OSA spy? Care to provide more proof
>than your feelings, Jim?
The balance of OSA involvement, pre or post, weighs very
heavily towards being just so. Its like the anthrax
business - the majority of people are convinced that
IRAQ and other associate countries are responsible, in
the light of Sep.11.
All of the OSA/Scientology stunts this year have been
setups -- infiltration and subversion is the working
ethic of Scientology.
I give this case a big tick for the filthy fingerprints
of Scientology being all over this one. If she wasn't
an OSA plant before, she's an OSA stoolie now.
Miss "public posting" Teresa will prove to be an
interesting affair, regardless. Let's see who her
lawyers are.
H
Michael
Lerma is allowed to have a relationship with the premier neo-nazi in the
US/give a speech at liberty lobby and still claim hes *not* an
anti-semite or revisionist.
Any religion haters are welcome here.
Mike
Michael
the same PGP. Minton was Dorian.
Mike
JimDBB
>Date: 10/24/01 8:45 AM Central
>Diane Richardson
>ref...@bway.net
Well, the Beast is back. we had a nice Diane Richardson-free interlude. Gone
were the lies, the innuendos, the fase accusations, the malevolent vitriol.....
Diane must have gotten a weekend pass.
she's back just in the nick of time to get in on yet another Teresa Summers.
Stacy-LMT frenzy.
JImdbb
Icee.
"Diane Richardson" <ref...@bway.net> schreef in bericht
news:3bd6c0a4...@news.giganews.com...
If it was done by _any_ lawyer, the lawyer would have told Teresa
that she only had to use the change of becoming an independent
contractor for LMT if she continued to work there. That reason alone
is enough to get unemployment benefits. Kendar, who works for
LMT knew that.
Teresa's personal reasons or speculations are superfluous, but not to
Moxon in court.
Icee.
Elizabeth Ann Cox
privy to such sensitive information. Much of what was in that letter is the
type of information one shares with an attorney, accountant, and those one
totally trusts. In the case of a "small business" such as the LMT, it is
not outside the scope of reason that such information would be discussed at
home, away from the office environment.
In addition, Teresa's letter does contain many scino aspects. Since you
highlighted many of them, I shall not belabor them in this post.
We are all human, we all err, usually unintentionally. None of us are gods,
and there are no OTs in scientology, regardless of what they like to
believe. Bob and Stacy are no different. To my way of thinking, the error
Bob and Stacy made with Teresa was one of trust. Bob has been known to
trust and be bitten before. The name Patricia Greenway springs immediately
to mind.
--
Elizabeth Ann Cox
FOLO ED ("Flukenet" Online Liaison Office)
ARS Chic with attitude!
aka, Bunnyann
Doubt is not a crime; simply a reasonable response to tyranny!
Michael Reuss <michae...@home.com> wrote in message
news:vq5cttkbusc05q8fr...@4ax.com...
Elizabeth Ann Cox
middle of the mess, she lead the charge.
--
Elizabeth Ann Cox
FOLO ED ("Flukenet" Online Liaison Office)
ARS Chic with attitude!
aka, Bunnyann
Doubt is not a crime; simply a reasonable response to tyranny!
JimDBB <jim...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20011023221506...@mb-fv.aol.com...
Elizabeth Ann Cox
impressed -- not!
--
Elizabeth Ann Cox
FOLO ED ("Flukenet" Online Liaison Office)
ARS Chic with attitude!
aka, Bunnyann
Doubt is not a crime; simply a reasonable response to tyranny!
Dr. Paloma <Dr._m...@newsguy.com> wrote in message
news:9r59t...@drn.newsguy.com...
Elizabeth Ann Cox
--
Elizabeth Ann Cox
FOLO ED ("Flukenet" Online Liaison Office)
ARS Chic with attitude!
aka, Bunnyann
Doubt is not a crime; simply a reasonable response to tyranny!
Deana M. Holmes <mir...@nospamsonic.net> wrote in message
news:Xns9143CA1D473F...@205.232.34.12...
Elizabeth Ann Cox
--
Elizabeth Ann Cox
FOLO ED ("Flukenet" Online Liaison Office)
ARS Chic with attitude!
aka, Bunnyann
Doubt is not a crime; simply a reasonable response to tyranny!
JimDBB <jim...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20011024133302...@mb-mh.aol.com...
LronsScam
In article ID <Xns9143AE370F81...@205.232.34.12>,
On or about 23 Oct 2001 20:06:19 -0400,
In this thy group <alt.religion.scientology> cometh;
Deana M. Holmes says...
>"Icee." <ice...@SPAMpsychassualt.org> wrote in
>news:3bd5...@news2.lightlink.com:
>
>> (2): What a peculiar thing for you to mention Teresa's intentions as
>> such. Did she deliberately write these details for $cientology to be
>> used against LMT, Bob and Stacy?
>
>Why don't you ask her? Amazing thing, you haven't been able to bring
>yourself to drop her an email and ask her not even one question.
It is a general consideration when something is brought up in an open forum
that it is to stay there.
And I ask you, why can't Teresa answer questions openly in an open forum? For
sure she can make these accusations and know it would wind up on ARS. Why
can't she answer some questions once and for all? There is no way I will
believe she isn't aware of these issues on ARS, or even ignorant of this
thread.
>Instead,
>you harass me about it.
Wow, how unbecoming of you. It doesn't surprise me at all. You first claim
you have first hand knowledge of this abuse by Stacy and agree with Teresa in
no uncertain terms that Teresa is in the right. Then when asked for more
information you call it harassment.
You have debated for another by proxy, you post for another by proxy. Why is
it now you believe many here aren't going to ask you to elucidate more, even
if it's for someone else? You claim knowledge of facts, yet when queried
further you have no answers. Why is that? Is it that you don't know all the
facts?
Bah!!
It really sickens me when people get so involved in another's affairs, and to
boot 3,000 miles away. There are obvious things you will never know when one
side claims righteousness. I have seen this in real life and I am witnessing
it right here on this newsgroup.
Nothing surprises me anymore on ARS.
>
>Do your own legwork in the future.
Don't get involved with another's issues in the future!! You're nothing but a
trouble maker who sides with issues when all the facts aren't known.
Bah!!
LronsScam
On or about 23 Oct 2001 20:23:53 -0400,
In this thy group <alt.religion.scientology> cometh;
Deana M. Holmes says...
>"Elizabeth Ann Cox" <eliza...@chesapeake.net> wrote in
>news:ttbqi2p...@corp.supernews.com:
>
>> Well Deana, for somebody who has so vigorously defended Teresa, there
>> appears to be a great deal you cannot respond to.
>
>If you have questions for Teresa, you can email them to her. She can make
>up her mind as to whether she wishes to answer them or not. I see no reason
>why I should be a go-between for you and her, particularly since you don't
>believe anything I say anyway. Let's cut out the middleman, shall we?
Fuck you, Mirele. You are the one who took the responsibility of taking
sides. You are going to have to be the one who takes responsibility, too, for
all answers in this situation.
Why don't you write to Teresa for each question you can't ask and post her
response here. It would be a simple task for the person who is so self
righteousness that no wrong gets by her hairy paw.
Could this be one of the reasons why people don't write to those via email
when issues are brought up in a public forum?
I think you've got your answer sourly with a big foot in our mouth.
You have gone out or your way to defend Teresa. Why can't she now defend you?
LronsScam
On or about 23 Oct 2001 22:50:52 -0400,
In this thy group <alt.religion.scientology> cometh;
Deana M. Holmes says...
>jim...@aol.com (JimDBB) wrote in news:20011023221506.14764.00000968@mb-
This is so hypocritical of her as well as you. Why can't Teresa post her
response on this open forum? Wouldn't that be easier than to have 300 people
write her individually and she respond in kind? By the 10th person she will
realize why that doesn't work well when hundreds of people are involved.
And some people take personal affront to being contacted via email. Has she
advertised on this forum that is her wishes? And what about the issue of
privacy? We would be in the same position you are in now to have knowledge
that is private. And I'll be damned if I'm going to tell others I have
answers in private and at the same time defend her repeatedly like you.
She has a voice on this NG. Let her speak if she wishes to speak. The same
goes for anyone else.
LronsScam
In article ID <3bd55f64...@news2.lightlink.com>,
On or about Tue, 23 Oct 2001 12:23:06 GMT,
In this thy group <alt.religion.scientology> cometh;
Keith Henson says...
>On Tue, 23 Oct 2001 10:02:44 GMT, m...@manual-override.com (kEvin)
>wrote:
>
>snip
>
>>As far as it goes, I think this says that Stacy Brooks managed to
>>alienate one her employees through the kind of management that
>>alienates lots of employees in businesses all over the world.
>
>Though I don't have any inside information about this business, it is
>clear to me that we don't have anything close to the entire story. I
>know the LMT has gone *way* over budget because they were defending
>people where scientology corrupted the forces of the law and/or the
>courts. (Including me in the CW 13 trial.)
>
>Also the amount of money Bob put into a certain movie would have run
>LMT for a number of years. Chances of the movie being distributed are
>hard to estimate but are not good.
This is plainly stupid if Minton invested in the movie that Peter and
(possibly Pat) *didn't* create about Scientology but some likeness to it.
Banks rarely invest in such movies for really good reasons: Independent films
rarely make money above and beyond the cost of the film. There are countless
stories of people losing fortunes in their own film.
There's a good rule a lot of businesses follow: if banks don't invest in your
idea, it's mostly for good reasons. One being the risk/profit ratio is too
high. I'm sure Bob knows this. Why then would he invest in such an incredibly
risky adventure?
LronsScam
In article ID <3bd6c0a4...@news.giganews.com>,
On or about Wed, 24 Oct 2001 13:23:06 GMT,
In this thy group <alt.religion.scientology> cometh;
Diane Richardson says...
That's in interesting theory but one that I'm afraid isn't too plausible.
What makes you think Ken Dandar would represent a person against someone who
was giving/lending him money in his case against Scientology? Or for that
matter, why would Teresa go to a lawyer so close to this situation that there
is a possibility of a conflict of interest?
LronsScam
In article ID <0mmB7.121$%J3.1...@typhoon1.gnilink.net>,
On or about Tue, 23 Oct 2001 22:41:00 GMT,
In this thy group <alt.religion.scientology> cometh;
Nico Kadel-Garcia says...
>
><frees...@justice.com> wrote in message
>news:9r1l9...@drn.newsguy.com...
>> More documents from the courthouse:
>>
>> Teresa S. Summers
>> 1763 Main St. Apt. 172
>> Dunedin, Fl 34698
>> (727) 733-6031
>>
>> September 7, 2001
>>
>> Stacy Brooks
>> C/O 33 North Fort Harrison Ave.
>> Clearwater, FL 33755
>>
>> Dear Stacy:
>>
>> Please be advised that I am severing all professional ties with you, Bob
>Minton
>> and the Lisa McPherson Trust effective September 6, 2001. The events of
>the past
>> few weeks have convinced me, as have others with whom I have consulted,
>that the
>> actions of both you and Bob have placed me in danger of being criminally
>> culpable in what appear to be shady business practices. In detail:
>
>Gack! Teresa, I'm back online after a long time being busy. How precisely
>did you get involved in the LMT yourself, and what precisely was your
>role there?
She can't answer on this NG. According to Mirele, we are only allowed to
respond to her via email. It's those who want answers responsibility of going
after people like Teresa, one by one. Teresa has no responsibility to respond
here, don't you know?
>
>It does sound like Merett screwed up....
I know it's easy to say this. And as a matter of fact it's obvious that
Merett alone is no match for the Scn'gy crew.
Minton has been in court with Scn'gy since he started his ordeal against the
cult. There usually have been several lawyers he has had in many of the
cases. But as time has gone on his funds obviously aren't going to last
forever.
It's easy to blame those who stick their necks out in this case. There are
some lawyers who sound better than they are by claiming victory on a great
amount of cases. What doesn't go into their stat is how much they charge and
what cases they are willing to take on. Merett is courageous. He should be
complimented.
Russ K
> The "Carte Blanche" on truth also applies in reverse Russ. example;
> Lerma is allowed to have a relationship with the premier neo-nazi in the
> US/give a speech at liberty lobby and still claim hes *not* an
> anti-semite or revisionist.
But people don't really buy thaat, do they?
>
>
> Any religion haters are welcome here.
Not quite fair I think. . .there are some pretty cool people here who
I think take their various religions and Gods pretty seriously. But I
guess you didn't say that Everyone herre was a religion hater.
You think Lerma will take us off his OSA List? How the hell has that
thing lasted so long with no one calling him on the hypocrisy of it?
I think I'll do a "Post A Day" to remind people that it sucks. That
way maybe newbies won't run away from people because "Arnie Says".
Rusty
>
> Mike
Icee.
"Elizabeth Ann Cox" <eliza...@chesapeake.net> schreef in bericht
news:ttegdjk...@corp.supernews.com...
> Strange that venom breath chooses to show up at this time.
Well, tiggle is away:-)
Icee
Icee.
"JimDBB" <jim...@aol.com> schreef in bericht
news:20011023221506...@mb-fv.aol.com...
> >Subject: Re: TERESA: A Whistleblower's Look at Criminality
> >> appears to be a great deal you cannot respond to.
> >
> >If you have questions for Teresa, you can email them to her. She can make
> >up her mind as to whether she wishes to answer them or not. I see no
reason
> >why I should be a go-between for you and her, particularly since you
don't
> >believe anything I say anyway. Let's cut out the middleman, shall we?
> >
> >mir...@sonic.net
>
> Not so fast. You interjected yourself
> nicely right in the middle of this mess. too late to back out.
Reading some of the lastest reactions from Deana, it is my impression
that she is not so sure about the whole affair any more.
Icee.
>
> JImdbb
>
Icee.
"Deana M. Holmes" <mir...@nospamsonic.net> schreef in bericht
news:Xns9143AE370F81...@205.232.34.12...
> "Icee." <ice...@SPAMpsychassualt.org> wrote in
> news:3bd5...@news2.lightlink.com:
>
> > (2): What a peculiar thing for you to mention Teresa's intentions as
> > such. Did she deliberately write these details for $cientology to be
> > used against LMT, Bob and Stacy?
>
> Why don't you ask her? Amazing thing, you haven't been able to bring
> you harass me about it.
>
Excuse me! You are the one who claims to knows _all_
about Teresa and also the one who brought it up.
She went public on ars and she stays public on ars. The whole
thing started because of back channeling, so let the sunshine
disinfect!
If she already has faced the bull dogs of the Crime Syndicate
$cientology in court, it must be a piece of cake to appear here.
Icee.
Keith Henson
Yet people keep doing it. In E-P terms they are being rewarded from
the attention they get (or think they will get) from being associated
with a film. People don't make decisions strictly on money and
anytime you see a persistent non economical activity going on,
attention rewards are likely causing it.
>There's a good rule a lot of businesses follow: if banks don't invest in your
>idea, it's mostly for good reasons. One being the risk/profit ratio is too
>high. I'm sure Bob knows this. Why then would he invest in such an incredibly
>risky adventure?
I presume because Patricia and Peter convinced Bob that it would be a
worthwhile thing to do in the overall scheme of things. I rather get
the impression that Bob was not encouraged to make this investment by
those around him, but all that says is that Bob makes his own
decisions.
As I understand it, Peter put all the money he had into it as well.
All may turn out well. Dub the sound in Arabic, put in English sub
titles and spread the rumor it is a take off on Bin Ladin.
Cult leaders are very similar.
Keith Henson
Elizabeth Ann Cox
--
Elizabeth Ann Cox
FOLO ED ("Flukenet" Online Liaison Office)
ARS Chic with attitude!
aka, Bunnyann
Doubt is not a crime; simply a reasonable response to tyranny!
Keith Henson <hkhe...@home.com> wrote in message
news:3bd8601e....@news2.lightlink.com...
Michael Reuss
>> People are speculating that she was an OSA spy. Some will be convinced
>> without further evidence. Some will need further evidence to decide
>> either way. I am in the latter group.
>> But I'm not willing to dismiss this possibility, without knowing more.
>> Nor should you.
>Frankly, this is so incredibly *stupid*.
Deana, if you had to rate the probability of Teresa being a cult spy,
would you say that the probability was 0.0000%?
If so, why?
>Up until seven weeks ago, Teresa
>was working at the LMT, doing what Stacy asked her to do, including writing
>what was for all intents and purposes a KR on Patricia Greenway.
How would the performance of that task preclude the possibility that
Teresa was a spy for the OSA?
>This was
>in addition to her work helping victims of the cult get their money back.
I've already covered that.
According to Mike McClaughry, the OSA would gladly permit a spy to
partake in activities that were contrary to the long term interests of
Scientology, if it helped ingratiate the spy and serve the OSA's black
op in the short run.
>Now we have you and others entertaining the possibility that she might be
>an OSA spy.
Yes, "we" are doing that. And all smart critics are on my side.
Everyone who opposes me is a stupid and evil goat fornicator. ;-)
>WHERE IS YOUR EVIDENCE? I can't shout too loudly about that.
Don't you ever form an opinion based on circumstantial evidence? Yes,
of course you do... you do this in your Minton bashing all the time.
>It seems to me that the ONLY reason you and others are willing to entertain
>the possibility that Teresa might be a spy for OSA is that what she says
>casts Stacy Brooks, among others, in a very bad light.
Horseshit. The reason I'm willing to entertain the possibility is
because the cult is known for doing exactly this type of thing, and
it's extremely UNreasonable to assume that they've NOT tried to place
a spy inside the LMT. And if they have tried to place a spy in the
LMT, and succeeded, Teresa's affidavit would seem to make her a good
candidate.
It's not proof. It's just circumstantial.
If Teresa had simply quit her job, made that first post, and not been
heard from again, I wouldn't be thinking this way. But that affidavit
got me thinking there was a fishy smell to her story.
>Never have you
>asked, "Perhaps even *some* of this is true." Not at all. You take it on
>face value that Stacy would *never* lie and thus, Teresa must be lying,
That's a crock of bullshit, Deana. Fuck you for trying to put words in
my mouth.
If you will go back and reread my reply to Teresa's first "I quit"
message, I think you will see that I have accepted some of what she
said as the truth.
But that's not the point. A cult spy would not tell lies 100% of the
time. They would mix some truth with the lies and disinformation and
innuendo and smears they wished to use as propaganda. Teresa's
affidavit seems to fit that mold.
>and on top of that, she must be working for the cult.
Read my lips. I never said she "must" be working for the cult. I don't
know that. I said that it's a possibility that should not be
discounted.
>You, like Rob, have never written Teresa, never conversed with her, never
>done anything to confirm her side of the story.
If she were a spy, do you think she would admit that to me if I asked
her?
>I think you're lazy, and moreover, I think you're scared.
I admit to being lazy sometimes. But I'm not scared. Why would I be
scared?
>Not scared that she might be an OSA spy
>(which I doubt) but that she might be telling the truth.
But she was telling the truth about non-sequiturs, such as Merritt's
incompetence in court, as if Stacy and Bob were to blame. That just
doesn't make much sense to me.
She talked about how angry she was that her job status had changed,
because she had a new mortgage payment. Fine. But then her remedy was
to quit, and not have any income at all? Again, that doesn't make
sense to me.
She seems to have radically altered her personal opinions about
everyone at the LMT. Most people don't normally do such things. Most
people stay friendly with their former coworkers. Bute Teresa seems
very hostile toward them all. Strange.
>But we'll never know,
Perhaps not.
We'd probably need another good FBI raid on the cult, and even then,
with their burn boxes located in strategic places, the cult could
probably still destroy lots of incriminating records.
Michael Reuss
Honorary Kid
Diane Richardson
Because despite Minton's effusive assurances that he'd continue
funding the case until the CoS was brought to justice, Minton cut off
the money. I suspect Dandar had his fill of the Minton/Brooks efforts
to lie their way through depositions, and that's why Minton cut off
the money. Some folks just aren't willing to sell their souls for
Mintonbux. I suspect Dandar was one of them.
>Or for that
>matter, why would Teresa go to a lawyer so close to this situation that there
>is a possibility of a conflict of interest?
Because Teresa happens to know Dandar and (I imagine) consider him a
friend. Teresa became acquainted with Stacy Brooks through Dandar.
Dandar was the person who brought Teresa into the McPherson
litigation, and it was because of this that Teresa accepted employment
with the LMT. It makes sense that Teresa would turn to someone as
familiar with the details of her situation as she herself was.
Diane Richardson
ref...@bway.net
Diane Richardson
[snip]
>Well, the Beast is back.
Nice to see you've adopted the common tactic of dehumanizing those you
hate by referring to them using inhuman names, Jim. I guess Bunnyann
has been teaching you well.
>we had a nice Diane Richardson-free interlude. Gone
>were the lies, the innuendos, the fase accusations, the malevolent vitriol.....
It's remarkably strange that you are unable and incapable of detailing
those lies you claim I've made, Jim. I know that you don't do so
because they don't exist. The remarkable part of it all is that you
have such little regard for the intelligence of others you believe you
can continue getting away with such dishonesty.
>Diane must have gotten a weekend pass.
It looks as though you have nothing in your life beyond regurgitating
your hatred on this newsgroup 24 hours a day, Jim. I'm sorry your
life is so empty. Don't make the mistake of believing that everyone
else's life is as lonely and empty as your own.
>she's back just in the nick of time to get in on yet another Teresa Summers.
>Stacy-LMT frenzy.
Ah, yes. That frenzy you and your fuzzy friend Bunnyann have been
whipping up these past few weeks. Keep up with the hysterical fits,
Jim. They're most entertaining.
Diane Richardson
ref...@bway.net
Russ K
Well there you have it.
>
>
> >WHERE IS YOUR EVIDENCE? I can't shout too loudly about that.
>
> Don't you ever form an opinion based on circumstantial evidence? Yes,
> of course you do... you do this in your Minton bashing all the time.
>
>
> >It seems to me that the ONLY reason you and others are willing to entertain
> >the possibility that Teresa might be a spy for OSA is that what she says
> >casts Stacy Brooks, among others, in a very bad light.
>
> Horseshit. The reason I'm willing to entertain the possibility is
> because the cult is known for doing exactly this type of thing, and
> it's extremely UNreasonable to assume that they've NOT tried to place
> a spy inside the LMT. And if they have tried to place a spy in the
> LMT, and succeeded, Teresa's affidavit would seem to make her a good
> candidate.
So don't you think Bob learned his lesson from the first ( I think
still totally unProven) "OSA Spy" he says he found?
I will go by the circumstantial proof that Bob checked her out, and
checked her out thoroughly. I also then believe that he didn't find
anything questionable. Seems likely that if he did, he wouldn't have
hired her, non? I don't know if your'e still with me mike, but if you
are, you now have to factor in someone "turning" Theresa while she
worked there.
>
> It's not proof. It's just circumstantial.
>
> If Teresa had simply quit her job, made that first post, and not been
> heard from again, I wouldn't be thinking this way. But that affidavit
> got me thinking there was a fishy smell to her story.
sounds to me like she realised that she'd better protect herself.
Seems like a smart thing to do if she's telling the truth.
>
>
>
> >Never have you
> >asked, "Perhaps even *some* of this is true." Not at all. You take it on
> >face value that Stacy would *never* lie and thus, Teresa must be lying,
>
> That's a crock of bullshit, Deana. Fuck you for trying to put words in
> my mouth.
So, do you think that Stacy would Never lie? One of them HAS to be,
Stacy or Theresa. . .do you think SOME of this Might be true?
I know, more of those pesky questions from Rusty. . .
>
> If you will go back and reread my reply to Teresa's first "I quit"
> message, I think you will see that I have accepted some of what she
> said as the truth.
>
> But that's not the point. A cult spy would not tell lies 100% of the
> time. They would mix some truth with the lies and disinformation and
> innuendo and smears they wished to use as propaganda. Teresa's
> affidavit seems to fit that mold.
>
>
> >and on top of that, she must be working for the cult.
>
> Read my lips. I never said she "must" be working for the cult. I don't
> know that. I said that it's a possibility that should not be
> discounted.
>
>
> >You, like Rob, have never written Teresa, never conversed with her, never
> >done anything to confirm her side of the story.
>
> If she were a spy, do you think she would admit that to me if I asked
> her?
>
>
> >I think you're lazy, and moreover, I think you're scared.
>
> I admit to being lazy sometimes. But I'm not scared. Why would I be
> scared?
>
>
> >Not scared that she might be an OSA spy
> >(which I doubt) but that she might be telling the truth.
>
> But she was telling the truth about non-sequiturs, such as Merritt's
> incompetence in court, as if Stacy and Bob were to blame. That just
> doesn't make much sense to me.
Doncha think she just may have wanted to get all the facts down for
her own defense when that comes up? And, if Stacy convinced her that
she had no choice but to go with Merritt, I can see her pputting a tad
o' blame on Stace and Bobbo...they were in control remember.
>
> She talked about how angry she was that her job status had changed,
> because she had a new mortgage payment. Fine. But then her remedy was
> to quit, and not have any income at all? Again, that doesn't make
> sense to me.
>
This one is easy Mike. If she had continued to work there, to make
her mortgage payments, she would have knowingly been complicit in
whatever illegal actions she was then knowledgeable of. (Even if she
only THOUGHT, or as you are opining ALLEDGED the improprieties, to
continue to work there wouldn't be right, either ethically or
legally.) And, if she wasn't being paid on a regular basis as a
Salaried employee, she probably very corrrectly assumed that it would
be worse as an independant contractor.
> She seems to have radically altered her personal opinions about
> everyone at the LMT. Most people don't normally do such things. Most
> people stay friendly with their former coworkers. Bute Teresa seems
> very hostile toward them all. Strange.
Not strange at all if her coworkers and bosses did what she says they
did. Think of folks who join cults and then leave...if they think the
people in the cult lied, cheated etc them, they generally don't stay
"friendly."
If what Theresa said is true, do you still think it would be "strange"
that she would change her "opinion" of them? Remember, there still
exists that little teeny tiny remote possiblility that Theresa is spot
on and that she's not the second or third OSA Whore who has elbowed
her way in somewhere to sabatoge Bob and Stacy's world.
>
>
> >But we'll never know,
>
> Perhaps not.
I dunno. I think we will know. And I can't wait.
>
> We'd probably need another good FBI raid on the cult, and even then,
> with their burn boxes located in strategic places, the cult could
> probably still destroy lots of incriminating records.
Oh that's right...if, in a court of law, Scientology wins, it's
because they bought the judge or burned the evidence. Only
possibiltiy. 00.0% chance that it was anything else.
Moron.
Rusty
>
>
>
>
>
> Michael Reuss
> Honorary Kid
Icee.
"Russ K" <smash...@volcanomail.com> schreef in bericht
news:399e7ee7.01102...@posting.google.com...
> Michael Reuss <michae...@home.com> wrote in message
news:<sv8ftt4br642tlf1d...@4ax.com>...
> > > mir...@nospamsonic.net (Deana M. Holmes) wrote:
> > >> Michael Reuss <michae...@home.com> wrote in
> > She talked about how angry she was that her job status had changed,
> > because she had a new mortgage payment. Fine. But then her remedy was
> > to quit, and not have any income at all? Again, that doesn't make
> > sense to me.
> This one is easy Mike. If she had continued to work there, to make
> her mortgage payments, she would have knowingly been complicit in
> whatever illegal actions she was then knowledgeable of. (Even if she
> only THOUGHT, or as you are opining ALLEDGED the improprieties, to
> continue to work there wouldn't be right, either ethically or
> legally.) And, if she wasn't being paid on a regular basis as a
> Salaried employee, she probably very corrrectly assumed that it would
> be worse as an independant contractor.
I may have missed it, but I don't remember reading that Teresa
_did_ buy a house and now has a new mortgage to pay.
Icee.
Tigger
actively for ten years with a short hiatis after the demise of CAN.
Tigger
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"I DON'T GIVE THEM HELL. I JUST TELL THEM THE TRUTH AND THEY THINK IT'S
HELL."'
Harry S. Truman (GIVE 'EM HELL, HARRY)
U. S. President
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Tigger
On Tue, Oct 23, 2001, 4:05am (CDT+5) From: jim...@aol.com (JimDBB)
Subject: Re: TERESA: A Whistleblower's Look at Criminality wrote:
>From: mir...@nospamsonic.net (Deana
> M. Holmes)
>>Date: 10/22/01 9:42 PM Central
>> md...@aol.com (JimDBB) wrote
>>>I have no clue as to what is going on
>>> but the Jolie Steckart perfidy at CAN\
>>> keeps gnawing at me.
>>So Teresa's also a crypto-Scieno or
>> OSA spy? Care to provide more proof
>> than your feelings, Jim?
>I said that I had no clue and that would
> include no proff of anything...hence no
> accusation. But there is something very
> weird about Teresa's completely
> conflicting statements and her appalling
> disclosure of internal LMT information.
> Of course, we don't know if she is
> disclosing anything or just wildly
> throwing figures and accusations
> around. In any case the financial figures
> have no place on this newsgroup. It
> would seem that she has betrayed
> confidences. This is rather sad to see.
>JImdbb
Jimdbb:
And IF Stacy betrayed eveyone, that's perfectly all right with you as
long as she doesn't post about it? Of course we don't know if ANYTHING
Stacy has said is ture, either do we?
I've noticed SCN behavior in Stacy too. So what do you think that
means?
I figured if Teresa's letter ever was ppublished no matter what it said,
some of you would just make up more excuses for Minton and Brooks. One
would wonder how much you are willing to excuse for the "greater good"
of fighting the COS.
Tigger
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"Truth usually hurts in proportion to how much I have ignored or
disbelieved it."
--- Gene Dwyer
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Tigger
The all purpose excuse surfaces again.
"No one is perfect".
Question:
Would any of this have been aired here if Stacy Brooks had not engaged
in underhanded, unethical and dishonest conduct which caused it to
happen?
Tigger
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"One falsehood spoils a thousand truths."
--- African Proverb
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Tigger
You are absolutely reidiculous. Anyone who writes complaint letters,
etc. knows you need to DETAiL waht the problem is if you want to get
the problems settled quickly. And I would have no doubt that Teresa
wanted to get this settled quickly and without any further contact or
harassment from Stacy Brooks who just kept telling her lies.
It is not a compliment to tell what a pereson does. It is just telling
what that person has done and is capable of doing.
Tgger
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"The truth of a matter will always haunt you, no matter how secret the
hiding place."
--- Anon
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Brent Stone
So, would you like to detail the "underhanded, unethical and
dishonest conduct" for us? Are you talking about the "problem" that
Teresa is getting unemployment benefits? The "problem" that
employees of the LMT are subject to attack by the "church" of
Scientology? The "problem" that Stacy is trying to deal with it and
protect the employees as best she can?
My view of the "problem" tends more towards the fact that the
"church" of Scientology is using depositions of a group that was
created a couple of years AFTER the misconduct they are being sued
for, in order to try to harass a group that *couldn't have had
anything to do with the case at hand* -- purely in order to get the
NAMES of further "enemies" to "destroy utterly".
Your stance, that Stacy is a "criminal" for wanting to protect these
victims of the cult, and being reluctant to turn their names over to
an organization with both written policies and criminal convictions
for following those policies of attacking anyone who criticizes
them, leaves me questioning which side you are working for.
- Brent
Elizabeth Ann Cox
cash may have become finite?
--
Elizabeth Ann Cox
FOLO ED ("Flukenet" Online Liaison Office)
ARS Chic with attitude!
aka, Bunnyann
Doubt is not a crime; simply a reasonable response to tyranny!
Diane Richardson <ref...@bway.net> wrote in message
news:3bd8066e...@news.giganews.com...
Elizabeth Ann Cox
And BTW, if this is what you call fighting scientology, then you are surely
one of their favorite critics.
--
Elizabeth Ann Cox
FOLO ED ("Flukenet" Online Liaison Office)
ARS Chic with attitude!
aka, Bunnyann
Doubt is not a crime; simply a reasonable response to tyranny!
Tigger <boobook...@webtv.net> wrote in message
news:6685-3BD...@storefull-215.iap.bryant.webtv.net...
Elizabeth Ann Cox
cult. Do you plan to add Michael to your Nazi page too?
--
Elizabeth Ann Cox
FOLO ED ("Flukenet" Online Liaison Office)
ARS Chic with attitude!
aka, Bunnyann
Doubt is not a crime; simply a reasonable response to tyranny!
Russ K <smash...@volcanomail.com> wrote in message
news:399e7ee7.01102...@posting.google.com...
Michael
crime some would still stand by them.
Mike
Tigger
Re: your comments about Teresa, Deana and Daine Richardson. You are the
ASSHOLE and a STUPID ONE to boot.
Tigger
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"People do not wish to appear foolish; to avoid the appearance of
foolishness, they are willing to remain actually fools.--Alice Walker
(All the Woman Are White, All the Blacks Are Men, But Some of Us are
Brave by Hull, Scott & Smith)
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~