The reason Psychs get away with it

Caswell

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Jul 16, 2005, 9:24:33 PM7/16/05

to

In 2004, Dr. John Friedberg, a neurologist who has researched the effects of ECT
for over 30 years, stated, "It is very hard to put into words just what shock
treatment does to people generally...it destroys people’s ambition, and their
vitality. It makes people rather passive and apathetic. Besides the amnesia, the
apathy and the lack of energy is, in my view, the reason that [psychiatrists]
still get away with giving it.

Lisa Ruby

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Jul 17, 2005, 12:48:18 AM7/17/05

to

Caswell wrote:

>...it [electric shock] destroys people's ambition, >and their vitality. It makes people rather passive >and apathetic.

The Nazis used fluoride in the concentration camps for this purpose. It
causes people to be passive and apathetic. It is no wonder there is a
strong push to fluoridate every community in the United States of
America.

It makes sense that fluoride is an ingredient in many powerful
tranqulizers.

Lisa Ruby
http://www.libertytothecaptives.net

Lisa Ruby

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Jul 17, 2005, 12:55:11 AM7/17/05

to

Just what does Scientology processing treatment do to people?

It enables them to acquire the occult skills necessary to carry out
Scientology's orders in the unfolding deeply satanic globalist society.

Quote from: The Bridge to Scientology "Freedom"
http://libertytothecaptives.net/bridge_scientology_freedom.html

Mike O'Connor

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Jul 17, 2005, 2:06:32 AM7/17/05

to

++++++++++++ SACRED CULT SCRIPTURE +++++++++++++

Our war has been forced to become "To take over absolutely the field of
mental healing on this planet in all forms.

That was not the original purpose. The original purpose was to clear
Earth. The battles suffered developed the data that we had an enemy who
would have to be gotten out of the way and this meant that we were at
war...
[...]

By showing him to be brutal, venal and plotting we get him discarded.

Our direct assault will come when they start to arrest his principals
and troops for crimes (already begun).

Our total victory will come when we run his organisations, perform his
functions and obtain his financing and appropriations.

-- L. Ron Hubbard
"The WAR", 2 Dec 69

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

YUMMY YUMMY YUMMY WORK TO GET THE PSYCHS MONEY!

Forget that altruistic saving the planet by clearing it stuff. This is
the new purpose.

--
LYING IS A SCIENTOLOGY SACRAMENT
ASK THEM ABOUT XENU
Remember Lisa McPherson

Lisa Ruby

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Jul 17, 2005, 2:25:39 AM7/17/05

to

Quoted from L. Ron Hubbard, The War:

>Our total victory will come when we run his organisations, perform his
>functions and obtain his financing and appropriations.

This means that Scientology's goal is to run psychiatry, perform its
functions (they are doing this!) and obtain psychiatry's financing!

Lisa Ruby
http://www.libertytothecaptives.net

Orkeltatte aka Ulf Brettstam

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Jul 17, 2005, 2:33:27 AM7/17/05

to

APA says in "The Practice of Electroconvulsive
Therapy.Recommendations for Treatment,Training and Privileging, a Task
Force Report 2001: "As a major treatment in psychiatry with
well-defined indications,ECT should not be reserved for use only as a
"last resort". Such practice may deprive patients of an effective
treatment,may delay response and prolong suffering,and may possibly
contribute to treatment resistance."
AND
"There is no evidence that repeated courses of ECT lead to permanent
structural braindamage or that a limit on the maximum lifetime number
of treatments with ECT is appropriate"
AND
info to patients: "In light of the accumulated body of data dealing
with structural effects of ECT , "brain damage" should not be included
as a potential risk of treatment"
AND
about memory ," There is no evidence that ECT results in lasting
impairments of executive functions,skill acquisation or
retention"...."it is unkikely that ECT has any long-term effect on the
capacity to learn and retain new information"..."Against this
background of unchanged or improved neuropsychologic performance,ECT
selectively results in anterograde and retrograde amnesia"..."No study
has documented anterograde amnestic effects of ECT more than a few
weeks after the ECT course"

There are two clinical effects from ECT treatment - antidepressive
and
impairment of short term memory. Both well known and validated since
60 or so years of scientific studies. Now you do the math- if this
treatment was dangerous or damaging - would you honestly believe it
was still to be allowed. Just a simple reasoning with common sense,
what would you say?

Two of the most significant studies proving ECT are not damaging to
the brain:
1. Bergshol P, Larsen JL, Rosendahl K et al
Electroconvulsive therapy and cerebral computed tomography. A
prospective study. ACTA Psychiatr Scand 1989:80:566-572 AND
2. Coffey CE, Weiner RD, Djang WT et al
Brain anatomic effects of electro convulsive therapy. A prospective
magnetic resonance imaging study. Arch Gen Psychiatry
1991:48:1013-1021

Ulf Brettstam

"This volume probably contains more promises and less evidence per page
than has any publication since the invention of printing."
- Review of "Dianetics", Scientific American, 1951

pjsavoie

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Jul 17, 2005, 5:44:34 AM7/17/05

to

"Lisa Ruby" <Commis...@groupmail.com> wrote in message
news:1121575698.4...@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...
> Caswell wrote:

> The Nazis used fluoride in the concentration camps for this purpose. It
> causes people to be passive and apathetic. It is no wonder there is a
> strong push to fluoridate every community in the United States of
> America.
>
> It makes sense that fluoride is an ingredient in many powerful
> tranqulizers.

Oh, you're on about the "dangers" of fluoride? First of all, fluoride
is not a chemical, it's PART of a chemical. It is an ion that has to be
joined to something. It can't be a mere "excuse" to resell dangerous toxic
wastes, because the amount used in water is much, much smaller than the
"millions of tons" claimed for those wastes.

http://www.quackwatch.org/03HealthPromotion/fluoride.html

In fact, if you have wacko health beliefs of various sorts, this page
will set you straight:

http://www.quackwatch.org/01QuackeryRelatedTopics/quackweb.html

Fluoride is NOT a chemical, it's NOT a toxin in the doses used in water
(often lower than the natural content in many water sources), and it's NOT a
tool of the evil psychs. Besides, kook, if you crap up on a topic like
fluoride, no one will believe you on more weighty subjects, like the
eternally invisible Jesus Christ.

mail.com

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Jul 17, 2005, 1:26:48 PM7/17/05

to

On 16 Jul 2005 21:48:18 -0700, "Lisa Ruby"
<Commis...@groupmail.com> wrote:

> ThE NAZiS UsED FLuoRiDE iN thE CoNcentRatiON camPs fOr tHIs puRPOSe. iT
> CauseS PEoPle tO be PAssIVe anD ApaThETIC. It IS NO wONder THEre is a
> StrONG Push tO flUorIdate eVErY CoMMunIty in The UnIteD STATes oF
> AmErICa.
>
> it MakeS SENse tHaT FLUoRidE IS aN INgrEDieNT in maNY PoWErFul
> tranQulizeRS.

They're sapping our precious bodily fluids!

> Lisa Ruby

Message has been deleted

Lisa Ruby

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Jul 17, 2005, 2:04:17 PM7/17/05

to

pjsavoie wrote:

>Fluoride is NOT a chemical, it's NOT a toxin in the doses used in water
>(often lower than the natural content in many water sources), and it's NOT a
>tool of the evil psychs.

Scientology's attempts at damage control are unrelenting.

Natural fluoirde is NOT identical to sodium fluoride. Sodium fluoride
is a
"direct byproduct of aluminum production."

Towns and cities receive financial incentives to place this toxic waste
product
into their water supplies.

http://www.garynull.com/Documents/Dental/Fluoride/fluoride12.htm

pjsavoie

unread,

Jul 17, 2005, 4:25:11 PM7/17/05

to

"Lisa Ruby" <Commis...@groupmail.com> wrote in message

news:1121621801.2...@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...

> pjsavoie wrote:
>
>>Fluoride is NOT a chemical, it's NOT a toxin in the doses used in water
>>(often lower than the natural content in many water sources), and it's NOT
>>a
>>tool of the evil psychs.
>

> Scientology's attempts at damage control are unrelenting.
>

> Natural fluoirde is identical to sodium fluoride. Sodium fluoride is a

> "direct byproduct of aluminum production."
>

> http://www.garynull.com/Documents/Dental/Fluoride/fluoride12.htm
>

Hey, braindead! Did you just completely ignore my link? Read it first
before just excerpting the first paragraph of my message and linking to some
"natural foods" nut named Gary Null. You don't make any case. I ALSO
mentioned that it would be silly to claim fluoridation of water is some big
plot to reprocess toxic wastes, since water is fluoridated to one part in a
million and so very little is needed in the water.
By contrast, your unthinking "health-food experts" with no feel for
chemistry claim fluoride compounds are produced in the millions of tons. So
they take a pinch of THAT, fluoridate the water, then what do they do with
the REST of the wastes? Fluoridation can hardly be a profitable market for
them.

Read it again, if you didn't before:

http://www.quackwatch.org/03HealthPromotion/fluoride.html

Barbara Schwarz

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Jul 17, 2005, 4:31:23 PM7/17/05

to

I think so too that many psychiatric victims don't remember all the
crimes that were done to them by psychs.

And also don't let forget that it is a secret psychiatric world. Psychs
have access to the ear implants of politicans, government officials,
police and judges and make them obey to their wishes. That is what Dr.
Friedberg did not mention.

Barbara Schwarz

pjsavoie

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Jul 17, 2005, 4:52:31 PM7/17/05

to

"Lisa Ruby" <Commis...@groupmail.com> wrote in message

news:1121623457.3...@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...

> pjsavoie wrote:
>
>>Fluoride is NOT a chemical, it's NOT a toxin in the doses used in water
>>(often lower than the natural content in many water sources), and it's NOT
>>a
>>tool of the evil psychs.
>
> Scientology's attempts at damage control are unrelenting.
>
> Natural fluoirde is NOT identical to sodium fluoride. Sodium fluoride
> is a
> "direct byproduct of aluminum production."
>
> Towns and cities receive financial incentives to place this toxic waste
> product
> into their water supplies.

You repeated yourself, so I will repeat MYSELF. Read this:

http://www.quackwatch.org/03HealthPromotion/fluoride.html

I am not a Scientologist. I can see your mistake; I was using "evil
psychs" in an ironic sense and poking fun at the lingo of Scientologists. I
am amused at some people making elaborate satires with the elaborate CoS
lingo, and even running to the on-line glossaries doesn't make it totally
clear to me. But funny.

You have no competency to talk about chemical compounds. "Natural"
fluoride and chloride and anything else in that family of elements comes in
the water pre-dissolved. It's an ION, not a compound. It doesn't matter if
it comes from dissolved sodium fluoride or any other ionic compound of
flourine. If you dissolve radioactive uranium hexafluoride in water -- and
remove the uranium by known means -- that water is as safe to use as any
other!
Chemical atoms don't have "history". That's what the layman doesn't
understand. Once they are in a certain form, their precursor forms don't
matter! If you artificially make a Vitamin C molecule from synthetic
chemicals, it is EXACTLY the same as a Vitamin C molecule extracted
physically but unchanged chemically from natural plant sources.
So they can fluoridate the water with sodium fluoride or any other
fluorine compound, the goal is to dissolve the solid and get fluoride IONS
floating in the water at a concentration of one in a million. The origin of
the fluorine compound doesn't matter.

Do you not use toothpaste? Toothpaste contains sodium
monofluorophosphate. You might get all scared of phosphates in the water
from detergent, oooh! They promote algal blooms! But of course it's all a
matter of amounts and concentrations and chemical forms. The same evil
chlorine that caused soldiers in World War I to cough their lungs out is in
your table salt. But you're not going to campaign against Cheetos for that
reason, right?

What's your level of education? How much science did you get? I've
seen very few science students end up agreeing with loony health-food
Web-pages like the one you present. This should tell you something.
Science experts reject your ideas because they know better than you about
matter and nutrients, not because they are all part of some monolithic evil
conspiracy to poison the planet. They like an unpoisoned planet too. They
like nothing better than to roast some weenies in a pristine natural park
where the fish swim instead of float upside-down. Sometimes they even blow
the whistle on health-food nuts poisoning people (**Dolomite!**) But they
don't make vague unsupported claims of vague "toxins" everywhere that we
must "clear" ourselves of. That's just a physical version of the
Scientology nonsense! They NAME the chemicals, one by one, figure out their
chemical form, assess them, and see if the concentrations are really worthy
of the name "toxin".

Cerridwen

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Jul 17, 2005, 7:27:09 PM7/17/05

to

On Sun, 17 Jul 2005, "pjsavoie" <pjsa...@rogers.com> wrote:
>"Lisa Ruby" <Commis...@groupmail.com> wrote in message
>news:1121623457.3...@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
>> pjsavoie wrote:
>>
>>>Fluoride is NOT a chemical, it's NOT a toxin in the doses used in water
>>>(often lower than the natural content in many water sources), and it's NOT
>>>a
>>>tool of the evil psychs.
>>
>> Scientology's attempts at damage control are unrelenting.
>>
>> Natural fluoirde is NOT identical to sodium fluoride. Sodium fluoride
>> is a
>> "direct byproduct of aluminum production."
>>
>> Towns and cities receive financial incentives to place this toxic waste
>> product
>> into their water supplies.
>
> You repeated yourself, so I will repeat MYSELF. Read this:
>
>http://www.quackwatch.org/03HealthPromotion/fluoride.html
>
> I am not a Scientologist. I can see your mistake; I was using "evil
>psychs" in an ironic sense and poking fun at the lingo of Scientologists. I
>am amused at some people making elaborate satires with the elaborate CoS
>lingo, and even running to the on-line glossaries doesn't make it totally
>clear to me. But funny.

I believe Lisa Ruby is one of the insane people that inhabit ars.

I highly recommend you put her in your killfile and be done with her.

Otherwise you will probably get killfiled by the regulars here for
constantly replying to someone that is mentally ill.

Cerridwen

http://www.truthaboutscientology.com/stats/

So much entheta, so little time.

Orkeltatte aka Ulf Brettstam

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Jul 17, 2005, 10:45:28 PM7/17/05

to

But we don´t have access to your ear implants have we?
You are just to smart for us - aren´t you?

Barbara Schwarz

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Jul 18, 2005, 5:29:54 PM7/18/05

to

Orkeltatte aka Ulf Brettstam wrote:
> Barbara Schwarz wrote:
> > Caswell wrote:
> > > In 2004, Dr. John Friedberg, a neurologist who has researched the effects of ECT
> > > for over 30 years, stated, "It is very hard to put into words just what shock
> > > treatment does to people generally...it destroys people's ambition, and their
> > > vitality. It makes people rather passive and apathetic. Besides the amnesia, the
> > > apathy and the lack of energy is, in my view, the reason that [psychiatrists]
> > > still get away with giving it.
> >
> > I think so too that many psychiatric victims don't remember all the
> > crimes that were done to them by psychs.
> >
> > And also don't let forget that it is a secret psychiatric world. Psychs
> > have access to the ear implants of politicans, government officials,
> > police and judges and make them obey to their wishes. That is what Dr.
> > Friedberg did not mention.
> >
> > Barbara Schwarz
>
> But we don´t have access to your ear implants have we?

They have successfully access to your and billions of other ear implant
carriers, Ulf, is that not enough "success"?

> You are just to smart for us - aren´t you?

Yes, I am. SEGNPMSS is devastated. I am going in the SEGNPMSS history
as the one they could not robotize. But they still have you and the
likes of you, Ulf.
>
> Ulf Brettstam

Barbara Schwarz

Homeland Security, Scotland Yard and all others, if you don't go after
the psychiatrists, you'll never get a handle on terrorism.

"I can hypnotize a man without his knowledge and consent into
committing treason against the United States", boasted psychiatrist
George
Estabrooks in the early 1940s. - Estabrooks told how disguised
techniques of hypnosis could be employed to create an entire army of
saboteurs within our own country. "Let us suppose that in a certain
city there lives a group of a given foreign extraction. They are loyal
Americans but still have cultural and sentimental lies to the old
country. A neighborhood doctor, working secretly for a foreign power,
hypnotizes those of this patients who have ties favorable to his plans.
Having done this he would, of course, remove from them all knowledge of
their ever having hypnotized."

There are the suicide bombers and terrorists of today.

Orkeltatte aka Ulf Brettstam

unread,

Jul 18, 2005, 10:32:03 PM7/18/05

to

Barbara Schwarz wrote:
> Orkeltatte aka Ulf Brettstam wrote:
> > Barbara Schwarz wrote:
> > > Caswell wrote:
> > > > In 2004, Dr. John Friedberg, a neurologist who has researched the effects of ECT
> > > > for over 30 years, stated, "It is very hard to put into words just what shock
> > > > treatment does to people generally...it destroys people's ambition, and their
> > > > vitality. It makes people rather passive and apathetic. Besides the amnesia, the
> > > > apathy and the lack of energy is, in my view, the reason that [psychiatrists]
> > > > still get away with giving it.
> > >
> > > I think so too that many psychiatric victims don't remember all the
> > > crimes that were done to them by psychs.
> > >
> > > And also don't let forget that it is a secret psychiatric world. Psychs
> > > have access to the ear implants of politicans, government officials,
> > > police and judges and make them obey to their wishes. That is what Dr.
> > > Friedberg did not mention.
> > >
> > > Barbara Schwarz
> >
> > But we don´t have access to your ear implants have we?
>
> They have successfully access to your and billions of other ear implant
> carriers, Ulf, is that not enough "success"?

Does this mean I do not know what I am doing?All that I do is
controlled by someone and through - ear implants!?
Are you sure you are in a mentally healthy state?

> > You are just to smart for us - aren´t you?
>
> Yes, I am. SEGNPMSS is devastated. I am going in the SEGNPMSS history
> as the one they could not robotize. But they still have you and the
> likes of you, Ulf.

I don´t know what SEGNPMSS is?

Ulf Brettstam

This volume probably contains more promises and less evidence per page
than has any publication since the invention of printing.
- Review of "Dianetics", Scientific American, 1951

> Barbara Schwarz

John

unread,

Jul 19, 2005, 1:25:15 AM7/19/05

to

"Orkeltatte aka Ulf Brettstam" <orkel...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1121740323.5...@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...

> Barbara Schwarz wrote:
> snip

> > > >
> > > > Barbara Schwarz
> > >
> > > But we don´t have access to your ear implants have we?
> >
> > They have successfully access to your and billions of other ear implant
> > carriers, Ulf, is that not enough "success"?

> Does this mean I do not know what I am doing?All that I do is
> controlled by someone and through - ear implants!?
> Are you sure you are in a mentally healthy state?

Are you sure her mental state is healthy enough for her to determine if
she's in a healthy mental state?

Orkeltatte aka Ulf Brettstam

unread,

Jul 19, 2005, 9:46:07 AM7/19/05

to

Excellent point. No I would say she is not healthy enough to determine
wether she is or not mentally healthy.

Ulf Brettstam

Barbara Schwarz

unread,

Jul 19, 2005, 11:47:45 AM7/19/05

to

Orkeltatte aka Ulf Brettstam wrote:
> Barbara Schwarz wrote:
> > Orkeltatte aka Ulf Brettstam wrote:
> > > Barbara Schwarz wrote:
> > > > Caswell wrote:
> > > > > In 2004, Dr. John Friedberg, a neurologist who has researched the effects of ECT
> > > > > for over 30 years, stated, "It is very hard to put into words just what shock
> > > > > treatment does to people generally...it destroys people's ambition, and their
> > > > > vitality. It makes people rather passive and apathetic. Besides the amnesia, the
> > > > > apathy and the lack of energy is, in my view, the reason that [psychiatrists]
> > > > > still get away with giving it.
> > > >
> > > > I think so too that many psychiatric victims don't remember all the
> > > > crimes that were done to them by psychs.
> > > >
> > > > And also don't let forget that it is a secret psychiatric world. Psychs
> > > > have access to the ear implants of politicans, government officials,
> > > > police and judges and make them obey to their wishes. That is what Dr.
> > > > Friedberg did not mention.
> > > >
> > > > Barbara Schwarz
> > >
> > > But we don´t have access to your ear implants have we?
> >
> > They have successfully access to your and billions of other ear implant
> > carriers, Ulf, is that not enough "success"?
>
> Does this mean I do not know what I am doing?All that I do is
> controlled by someone and through - ear implants!?

> Are you sure you are in a mentally healthy state?

I am mentally healthy, but you are not.

>
> > > You are just to smart for us - aren´t you?
> >
> > Yes, I am. SEGNPMSS is devastated. I am going in the SEGNPMSS history
> > as the one they could not robotize. But they still have you and the
> > likes of you, Ulf.
>
> I don´t know what SEGNPMSS is?

Why do you ask me this?

Barbara Schwarz

unread,

Jul 19, 2005, 11:49:37 AM7/19/05

to

John wrote:
> "Orkeltatte aka Ulf Brettstam" <orkel...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:1121740323.5...@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
>
>
> > Barbara Schwarz wrote:
> > snip
> > > > >
> > > > > Barbara Schwarz
> > > >
> > > > But we don´t have access to your ear implants have we?
> > >
> > > They have successfully access to your and billions of other ear implant
> > > carriers, Ulf, is that not enough "success"?
>
> > Does this mean I do not know what I am doing?All that I do is
> > controlled by someone and through - ear implants!?
> > Are you sure you are in a mentally healthy state?
>
> Are you sure her mental state is healthy enough for her to determine if
> she's in a healthy mental state?

A goat farm hand who posts with hundreds of sock puppets like you, Dave
Rice, and who suggested to kill members of the FBI is certainly not
mentally healthy enough to talk about others state of mind.

Barbara Schwarz

unread,

Jul 19, 2005, 11:57:47 AM7/19/05

to

Orkeltatte aka Ulf Brettstam wrote:

> Excellent point. No I would say she is not healthy enough to determine
> wether she is or not mentally healthy.
>
> Ulf Brettstam

John is Dave Rice, a man who took the GPS readings of the orgs, put
them on the net and called them "target" info. Why do you think he did
that when he did not have terrorism in his mind? He suggested to kill
members of the FBI. He supports his twin brother in opening a
degrogramming center with sexual abuse. He called himself earlier on
"Prozac filled gay terrorist psycho" and that is the man who tells you,
the psychiatrist to evaluate the mental health of somebody you both
never met?

You are so ridiculous and unprofessional, Ulf. My guess you, and Dave,
don't know how crazy you guys are.

Next time, Ulf, make a comma after: No, ... and check also your other
spelling. You should do some world clearings instead of defaming
people.

Barbara

Mikhail Bilinski

unread,

Jul 19, 2005, 12:16:55 PM7/19/05

to

"Barbara Schwarz" <barbara...@gmail.com> wrote in
news:1121788667.3...@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com:

Well, I have decided to take the plunge and create a smal niche
business. All the time pweople are having to make their tinfoil (now
aluminium) hats over and over when the original starts to fall apart. I
am going to start offering a line of conspiracy hats with protective
lining to keep the government pyschiatric special forces control rays
away from your gray matter. I will be using a patented protective
lining not unlike tinfoil and you can wear it in publc without all the
jeers and laughter, and wear it secretly knowing you are a carpet
chewing loony! Stay tuned Barbara, I might just make a devil horn
conspiracy hat and call it the barbara.

--
Mikhail:
High grand panjandrumVIII, and great googlymoogly of
Takeyourmoneyandleaveyouapooremotionalwalkingcorpsetology.

Orkeltatte aka Ulf Brettstam

unread,

Jul 19, 2005, 12:27:18 PM7/19/05

to

You poor woman, I really feel for you.
I´d really wish you would contact a collegue of some sort , you are in
great need of help.

Ulf

Barbara Schwarz

unread,

Jul 19, 2005, 1:16:39 PM7/19/05

to

Orkeltatte aka Ulf Brettstam wrote:
> You poor woman, I really feel for you.
> I´d really wish you would contact a collegue of some sort , you are in
> great need of help.
>
> Ulf

You are in need for a prison cell, Ulf, for your disgusting defamation
campaign against me.

Barbara Schwarz
_____________________

Homeland Security, Scotland Yard and all others, if you don't go after
the psychiatrists, you'll never get a handle on terrorism.

"I can hypnotize a man without his knowledge and consent into
committing treason against the United States", boasted psychiatrist
George
Estabrooks in the early 1940s. - Estabrooks told how disguised
techniques of hypnosis could be employed to create an entire army of
saboteurs within our own country. "Let us suppose that in a certain
city there lives a group of a given foreign extraction. They are loyal
Americans but still have cultural and sentimental lies to the old
country. A neighborhood doctor, working secretly for a foreign power,
hypnotizes those of this patients who have ties favorable to his plans.

Having done this he would, of course, remove from them all knowledge of

their ever having hypnotized."

There are the suicide bombers and terrorists of today.

>

David Rice, Esq.

unread,

Jul 19, 2005, 9:48:24 PM7/19/05

to

On 19 Jul 2005 08:57:47 -0700, "Barbara Schwarz"
<barbara...@gmail.com> wrote:

>Orkeltatte aka Ulf Brettstam wrote:

>> Excellent point. No I would say she is not healthy enough to determine
>> wether she is or not mentally healthy.
>>
>> Ulf Brettstam

> John is Dave Rice,

Wrong, of mentally ill one.

> a man who took the GPS readings of the orgs, put
>them on the net and called them "target" info. Why do you think he did
>that when he did not have terrorism in his mind?

Read his affidavit: it explains exactly why, silly.

> He suggested to kill members of the FBI

And every time you were told to produce evidence for that false
claim, you shuddered into silence and FLED IN TERROR at that
demand.

Orkeltatte aka Ulf Brettstam

unread,

Jul 19, 2005, 10:44:06 PM7/19/05

to

Oh It is just me being stupid enough to try to understand what the hec
you are writing .
I have not asked you anything about SEGNPMSS, I simply stated that I
haven´t a clou of what this is.

Ulf Brettstam

You are not a genius just because you are crazy
Johan Henrik Kellgren 1751-1795
Poet and the Swedish Kings secretary

swa...@ozemail.com.au

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Jul 19, 2005, 11:08:24 PM7/19/05

to

Caswell wrote:
> In 2004, Dr. John Friedberg, a neurologist who has researched the effects of ECT
> for over 30 years, stated, "It is very hard to put into words just what shock
> treatment does to people generally...it destroys people's ambition, and their
> vitality. It makes people rather passive and apathetic. Besides the amnesia, the
> apathy and the lack of energy is, in my view, the reason that [psychiatrists]
> still get away with giving it.

According to a Psychiatrist, (of whom I asked the question, "What does
Shock treatment do"), "it disassociates the molecules of the brain."
That means it causes brain damage whish is the cause for the symptoms
you have listed above.

There are a number of reasons why Psychiatrists have got away with
Electo Convulsive Shock Treatments.
1. The general public knows very little about it even after 67 years of
use.
In 1938, an Italian doctor invented it and up to the early 1950's it
was given without anaesthetic and muscle relaxants. Although the doctor
withdrew his support
(date not known by me) before his death in 1963 and that fact was
published in a NSW Higher School Certificate Social Studies Textbook in
the mid 1980's it is still in use, although on one TV programme about a
year ago it was explained in a greater modified form.

http://www.wildestcolts.com/mental health/shock.html

http://www.stephensstory.org/ect.html

2. My information is that doctors cannot be charged if they are giving
treatments according to their training. The issue then goes back to
Tertiary Professors and lecturers who may even be giving infirmation
from their own training programmes, on the basis that their research or
the research that they are support does not indicate adverse reactions
beyond a reasonable amount of time. It could be a relapse or increased
reactions on the part of the 'patient' is evidence of mental
instability and not seen as a symptom, resulting from, a consequence
of, the previous treatment.
Gladys Swager

John

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Jul 19, 2005, 11:27:27 PM7/19/05

to

"David Rice, Esq." <deser...@hottmail.com> wrote in message
news:42ddad0f...@news.aioe.org...

> On 19 Jul 2005 08:57:47 -0700, "Barbara Schwarz"
> <barbara...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>Orkeltatte aka Ulf Brettstam wrote:
>
>>> Excellent point. No I would say she is not healthy enough to determine
>>> wether she is or not mentally healthy.
>>>
>>> Ulf Brettstam
>
>> John is Dave Rice,
>
> Wrong, of mentally ill one.

Indeed, but what's the chances of convincing someone with Ms. Schwarz'
mental problems of that?

Orkeltatte aka Ulf Brettstam

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Jul 20, 2005, 12:23:53 AM7/20/05

to

Note that ECT is an abbreviation of Electro Convulsive Therapy

Actually the origin of convulsive therapy originates from the Hungarian
neurologist Ladislaus Medunas who in the early 30 ies treated a
cathatonic schizophrenic patient with intravasal injection of a campher
substance- Treatment was succesful on the cathatonia but not for the
schizophrenia. Medunas had made valid observations of the fact that
epilepsy and schizophrenia very rarely occured simultaneously , but
came to the false conclusion that the two illnessnes were eclusive to
one another eg if you had epilepsy you couldn´t suffer from
schizophrenia at the same time.

The first electrically induced convulsive treatment wqas made by the
two italian doctors Cerletti and Bini in 1936 when they treated a since
several years chronically depressed woman , who hadn´t uttered a word
for years. Treatment was succesful and the woman was cured from her
depression.

As with all form of successful treatments - indications eventually gets
broadened and before the 1950 ies when chlorpromazine came , there was
very few alternatives of treatments in the therapeutic arsenal to use
with severe mental illnessnes- Anyway when ECT was used on what we know
today is wrong indications, and before the era of general anestetics ,
especially with the use of muscle relaxantia , sideeffects was a
problem with sceletal fractures and muscle ruptures due to the
convulsions. Nevertheless treatment was lifesaving in the cases with
severe depression. The ECT treatment became ill reputed and was , and
still are I might say, always portrayed in movies more as a method of
torture than as the lifesaving treatment it is.

The neurophysiological basis for the positive antidepressive effects
are due to the boosting effects on the monoaminergic containing neurons
eg enhanced production of norepinephrine and enhanced sensitivity of
serotonin receptors.

The benefits in comparison to pharmacological antidepressant treatment,
which by the way , is targeting the same neurons , is like comparing
penicillin to broadspectrum antibiotics , where penicillin is effective
on few bacteria tribes and broadspectrum is just what the term
indicates.

There are two clinical effects from ECT treatment - antidepressive
and
impairment of short term memory. Both well known and validated since
60 or so years of scientific studies. Now you do the math- if this
treatment was dangerous or damaging - would you honestly believe it
was still to be allowed. Just a simple reasoning with common sense,
what would you say?

Two of the most significant studies proving ECT are not damaging to
the brain:
1. Bergshol P, Larsen JL, Rosendahl K et al
Electroconvulsive therapy and cerebral computed tomography. A
prospective study. ACTA Psychiatr Scand 1989:80:566-572 AND
2. Coffey CE, Weiner RD, Djang WT et al
Brain anatomic effects of electro convulsive therapy. A prospective
magnetic resonance imaging study. Arch Gen Psychiatry
1991:48:1013-1021

Finally:

APA says in "The Practice of Electroconvulsive
Therapy.Recommendations for Treatment,Training and Privileging, a Task
Force Report 2001: "As a major treatment in psychiatry with
well-defined indications,ECT should not be reserved for use only as a
"last resort". Such practice may deprive patients of an effective
treatment,may delay response and prolong suffering,and may possibly
contribute to treatment resistance."
AND
"There is no evidence that repeated courses of ECT lead to permanent
structural braindamage or that a limit on the maximum lifetime number
of treatments with ECT is appropriate"
AND
info to patients: "In light of the accumulated body of data dealing
with structural effects of ECT , "brain damage" should not be included
as a potential risk of treatment"
AND
about memory ," There is no evidence that ECT results in lasting
impairments of executive functions,skill acquisation or
retention"...."it is unkikely that ECT has any long-term effect on the
capacity to learn and retain new information"..."Against this
background of unchanged or improved neuropsychologic performance,ECT
selectively results in anterograde and retrograde amnesia"..."No study
has documented anterograde amnestic effects of ECT more than a few
weeks after the ECT course"

Ulf Brettstam

This volume probably contains more promises and less evidence per page
than has any publication since the invention of printing.
- Review of "Dianetics", Scientific American, 1951

Barbara Schwarz

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Jul 20, 2005, 12:02:30 PM7/20/05

to

Orkeltatte aka Ulf Brettstam wrote:

> Note that ECT is an abbreviation of Electro Convulsive Therapy
>
> Actually

If Scientologists would post here articles of Scientologists they would
be attacked of spamming and abusing ARS, despite this newsgroup is
named alt.religion.scientology.

When some post critical information about the psychs here, the posters
are attacked of posting off topic and spamming despite being critical
about psychiatry is a big part of SCN.

But you post here to make business, to fool people into going to the
psychs and make them believe that the drugs and the e-shocks are
harmless despite it is evident that they are not, but nobody of the
psych troll "critics" tells you to stop spamming your dangerous pro
psych garbage on ARS, Ulf Brettstam.

Barbara Schwarz

unread,

Jul 20, 2005, 12:03:21 PM7/20/05

to

Orkeltatte aka Ulf Brettstam wrote:

> Note that ECT is an abbreviation of Electro Convulsive Therapy

If Scientologists would post here articles of Scientologists they would

Norm

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Jul 20, 2005, 8:49:38 PM7/20/05

to

THE PRECEDING POST IS FROM BARBARA SCHWARZ, A MENTALLY DISTURBED AND
DELUSIONAL SCHIZOPHRENIC HIDING FROM THE NON-EXISTENT GERMAN NAZI SPY
AGENCY, SEGNPMSS.

THIS LAZY LUNATIC IS A FORGER, THREAT MAKER, HARASSER, STALKER,
DEFAMER
& NOTORIOUS LIAR LIVING IN THE U.S. ILLEGALLY.

She is so crazy and insane she is routinely ignored by ISPs, state and
federal agencies, media, law enforcement agencies and the courts.

She whines and lies about conspiracies against her and Scientology,
which has denounced her as a kook and not a Scientologist. She will
say
and lie about anything she thinks will draw people to her, including
preaching about remote-controlled killer bees and a secret underwater
submarine village where people never age in the Great Salt Lake (max.
depth 40 feet).

Learn more about this mentally disturbed problem:

** A list of e-mail addresses & nyms that she posts under:
http://holysmoke.org/cos/psychonut.htm

** Barbara Schwarz' lawsuit vs. FBI dismissed after claiming she is
Dwight D. Eisenhower's granddaughter, L. Ron Hubbard's daughter,
went to school in an underwater submarine village, that a German Nazi
conspiracy has taken over the U.S. government. The Court ruled her
actions as "frivolous and malicious."
http://www.holysmoke.org/cos/barbara-schwarz-vs-fbi-dismissed.htm

** Schwarz claims she was born in a non-existent city in Utah called
Chattanooga http://www.holysmoke.org/cos/barbaraschwarz27.htm

** Schwarz claimed to have lived underwater with L. Ron Hubbard at a
secret submarine village where the people never age in a 40-foot deep
lake in Utah: http://www.okkaone.com/detail-1659489.html

** http://www-2.cs.cmu.edu/~dst/Secrets/barbara_schwarz.html (Salt
Lake
City Tribune article on Schwarz that angered her and led to her
lawsuit
against the newspaper, which was later dismissed as frivolous)

And many other others:

Mikhail Bilinski

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Jul 20, 2005, 9:42:03 PM7/20/05

to

"Barbara Schwarz" <barbara...@gmail.com> wrote in

news:1121875401....@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com:

I think that people could care less what "religion" you defend Barbara, the
simple fact is you are mad as a hatter and need help in the worst way. You
are a possible danger to yourself and those around you, and for your sake I
hope you get that one brief moment of sanity that allows you to seek the
help you need.

--
Links I like:
http://www.xenu.net
http://www.clambake.org
http://www.scientology-kills.org
http://www.xenutv.com