Mitt Romney Family Baptizes Dead Atheist Father-in-law into Mormonism

[John Manning]

Romney Family Had Ann Romney's Atheist Father Posthumously Baptized Into
The Mormon Church


Business Insider - Edward Davies, Ann Romney's father, was an
atheist who was also strongly anti-religion. By the time he died,
he was the only member of Ann Romney's immediate family to not
convert to Mormonism.

Fourteen months later, in 1993, he was baptized in a special
ceremony at a Salt Lake City church.

This practice requires a living person who has already been baptized
to undergo the immersion in water again on behalf of the dead. No
word on who this person might have been in Davies' case.

Information on the ceremony was listed on a genealogical database,
and another entry on Ancestry.com detailed a separate sealing
ceremony that linked Davies to his wife in death.

Baptism of the dead is encouraged by the Church of Latter-day
Saints, as it is seen as essential to salvation. But the LDS Church
has been criticized for it often.

After coming under fire in 1995, the Church agreed to stop
baptizing Jewish Holocaust victims posthumously. It had already
added tens of thousands to its baptism registry by that time.

Romney's faith has done little to damage his quest for the
presidency so far. But the issue pops up once in a while, most
recently after Romney's tax returns showed a $4.1 million donation
to the Church. There's also evidence to suggest that anti-
Mormon sentiment could have given votes to Newt Gingrich in
South Carolina.

When Newsweek asked Romney whether he had performed any proxy
baptisms in the past, Romney responded "I have in my life, but
I haven't recently."

http://articles.businessinsider.com/2012-01-27/politics/30669682_1_ann-romney-proxy-baptisms-temple-ceremonies

[Nancy]

> http://articles.businessinsider.com/2012-01-27/politics/30669682_1_an...

~~~
Nancy

Oh, well, it's no difference from what catholics do.....and it hasn't
changed the status of Ann's dad....not one iota....he is still dead.

[John Manning]

Why do you always make false statements, Nancy? Catholics don't do
proxy baptisms for non-members, or anyone else.

Catholics also don't usually baptize by immersion.

See if you can muster enough brain cells to get your facts right when
you post stuff. Okay?

[Uncle Vic]

John Manning <jrob...@terra.com.br> wrote in
news:492dnSvDVbnZirnS...@giganews.com:

Isn't it fun beating people up online, where you don't stand a chance of
getting a well-deserved punch in the nose?

--
Uncle Vic

"The minute someone like you would regard me as a sensible, intelligent
guy, I'd be in deep shit." -Jahnu

Visit my You Tube Channel!
http://www.youtube.com/user/Vicman6311?feature=mhee

[Mulligan]

On Jan 28, 12:34 pm, Uncle Vic <so...@noway.com> wrote:

> > See if you can muster enough brain cells to get your facts right when
> > you post stuff. Okay?
>
> Isn't it fun beating people up online, where you don't stand a chance of
> getting a well-deserved punch in the nose?
>
> --
> Uncle Vic

Haha!

[John Manning]

I'd say that Nancy, an overtly hateful anti-gay and xenophobic
bigot, who relishes the idea of slaughtering all of the
approximately 1.5 billion Muslim men women and children in the
world, in the name of her God, and regularly posts false,
sweeping statements about others - more than well deserves to
be corrected when she does it.

[Nancy]

> you post stuff. Okay?- Hide quoted text -

~~~
Nancy

No kidding.....catholics don't pray people out of purgatory? Muslims
don't believe they will have 70 virgins?
Lets see....I know there are some that believe they'll come back as a
cat, rat or somethng.....

News flash! When your dead..... your dead.....

Oh, do you make your living being a bully? Make you feel like a big
man? Or a you one that has been bullied all you life?

[Mulligan]

> ~~~
> Nancy
>
> No kidding.....catholics don't pray people out of purgatory?

Do they still do mass for the dead?

[John Manning]

In reference to the OP, "Oh, well, it's no difference from what
catholics do," is a false statement, Nancy.

And, BTW, does your religious 'prophet' Neville Stevens at
Zion Ministries teach you that people don't have an afterlife?

[Mulligan]

> Do they still do mass for the dead?- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Requiem

A Requiem or Requiem Mass, also known as Mass for the dead (Latin:
Missa pro defunctis) or Mass of the dead (Latin: Missa defunctorum),
is a Mass celebrated for the repose of the soul or souls of one or
more deceased persons, using a particular form of the Roman Missal. It
is frequently, but not necessarily, celebrated in the context of a
funeral.

The term is also used for similar ceremonies outside the Catholic
Church, especially in the Anglo-Catholic branch of Anglicanism and in
certain Lutheran churches. A comparable service, with a wholly
different ritual form and texts, exists in the Eastern Orthodox and
Eastern Catholic Churches

In earlier forms of the Roman Rite, some of which are still in use, a
Requiem Mass differs in several ways from the usual Mass in that form.
Some parts that were of relatively recent origin, including some that
have been excluded in the 1970 revision, are omitted. Examples are the
psalm Iudica at the start of Mass, the prayer said by the priest
before reading the Gospel (or the blessing of the deacon, if a deacon
reads it), and the first of the two prayers of the priest for himself
before receiving Communion.[1] Other omissions include the use of
incense at the Introit and the Gospel, the kiss of peace, lit candles
held by acolytes when a deacon chants the Gospel, and blessings. There
is no Gloria in excelsis Deo and no recitation of the Creed; the
Alleluia chant before the Gospel is replaced by a Tract, as in Lent;
and the Agnus Dei is altered. Ite missa est is replaced with
Requiescant in pace (May they rest in peace); the "Deo gratias"
response is replaced with "Amen". Black is the obligatory liturgical
colour of the vestments in the earlier forms, while the later form
allows a choice between black and violet, and in some countries, such
as England and Wales, white.[2] The sequence Dies Iræ, recited or sung
between the Tract and the Gospel, is an obligatory part of the Requiem
Mass in the earlier forms. As its opening words, Dies irae (Day of
wrath), indicate, this poetic composition speaks of the Day of
Judgment in fearsome terms; it then appeals to Jesus for mercy

[Mulligan]

> Judgment in fearsome terms; it then appeals to Jesus for mercy- Hide quoted text -

>
> - Show quoted text -

http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/12776d.htm

[Mulligan]

On Jan 28, 2:27 pm, Nancy <nw...@live.com> wrote:

> No kidding.....catholics don't pray people out of purgatory?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1LCNykjEGjE&feature=g-vrec&context=G2426192RVAAAAAAAACQ

[Nancy]

On Jan 28, 2:36 pm, Mulligan <yos...@hotmail.com> wrote:

> Do they still do mass for the dead?-

~~~
Nancy

I don't know.....the only catholic I've ever talked with about the
catholic religion is Duke....8-)

[sully]

No, it changes nothing for him, but it does change
his memory.

Would it be ok if they instead made up a story about
him, wrote it up, and claimed it was true?

It doesn't hurt him, he's still dead.

[Nancy]

> It doesn't hurt him, he's still dead.-

~~~
Nancy

Let's see if I can guess where you are going with this....

Only if after 3 days he arose....8-)

[Mitchell Holman]

Nancy <nw...@live.com> wrote in
news:2adeb754-c1ff-41ce...@m11g2000yqe.googlegroups.com:

> Nancy
>
> No kidding.....catholics don't pray people out of purgatory? Muslims
> don't believe they will have 70 virgins?

What do muslim women do with their 70 virgins?

[Free Lunch]

On Sat, 28 Jan 2012 18:45:32 -0600, Mitchell Holman <nomailcomcast.net>
wrote in alt.atheism:

Housework.

[Mulligan]

On Jan 28, 4:55 pm, sully <sulsn...@yahoo.com> wrote:

Very incorrect.
If he accepts it, he can cross over from spirit prison to paradise to
await being restored to life.
That was christ's mission there to bridge the gulf ....

[Josh Miles]

Please educate yourself before you say something foolish. Here's
something to start with: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Houri

> Lets see....I know there are some that believe they'll come back as a
> cat, rat or somethng.....
>
> News flash! When your dead..... your dead.....

Second grade grammar sure is tough! Here's something to help you:
http://www.wikihow.com/Use-You%27re-and-Your

[Father Haskell]

Zombie Mormon!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vdVwinoP18Y

[sully]

I thought it was a simple question. You said since
Romney's atheist dad-in-law was dead, baptizing
him wouldn't hurt him, he's still dead.

"not one iota".

So based on that, would it be ok if someone
were to make up a story(invent it) about someone that
is dead - claim that he/she was a child
molester, for example, and then publish it
somewhere.

Since the accused molester is dead, it
wouldn't hurt them one iota.

Right?

So that's ok?

[sully]

So dead people can make decisions? A dead person
can choose whether or not to accept such baptism?

What if said dead person rejects it, how can he
tell people on earth to take him off the rolls of
the baptized?

[Nancy]

~~~
Nancy

You got that! 8-)

[Logan Sacket]

On Mon, 30 Jan 2012 14:31:14 -0800 (PST), sully <suls...@yahoo.com>
wrote:

I'll bet that if he knows it, he's either really pissed, hoping it
works, or is laughing his ass off.

[Nancy]

> So that's ok?-

~~~
Nancy

We were talking about getting Ann's dad on the right side of the fence
in the after-life. 8-)

Claiming a person is evil or good will not change a thing in their
status when they die....

[sully]

Ok, assuming there is an afterlife, what happens if Atheist
Ann's dad is offended by being baptised by Mormons?

>
> Claiming a person is evil or good will not change a thing in their
> status when they die....

Doesn't it affect how his friends or family remember him?

Whether or not there is an afterlife, doesn't allegations of
that sort affect his memory? If no afterlife, certainly it
wouldn't affect him directly. If there were an afterlife, and
he still chose to be an atheist, wouldn't being baptized
without his permission offend him?

[Zacharias Mulletstein]

If Mormons ever posthumously baptize me, then I'm going to torture them
extra hard in Hell. They don't know the meaning of the word pain.

[Nancy]

> without his permission offend him?- Hide quoted text -

~~~
Nancy

Ok, Sully, I'll play along.

Excluding Jesus Christ, because He is in a category of His own....no
one else can say they were physically begotten by the Father.

When you die....should your kids want to say you were a saint....if it
makes them feel beter....let them. Should they want to say you were
the devil himself....if it makes them feel better....let them. BUT it
ain't going to change a thing....you will be dead...never to live
again ( this ~is~ what you believe, right). By the time of your great-
grandchildren...
you won't even be a memory.....so what difference does it make who
says what about you.....

This is the difference between humans and Jesus Christ....after all
the thousands of years....He is remembered....8-)

Now, Sully, do you see any need to take this further? I ain't going to
change you....and you are not going to change me.

[sully]

Right, I agree that it makes no difference to me
who is dust. But if one of my kids married
a mormon and they wanted to baptize me,
what if my other kid objected? This is why
I say it does make a difference, even if it
doesn't make a difference to the non-existent
sully.

I'm an atheist, but my Dad's mom was a
devout Catholic, and one who was disturbed
and offended by the changes to church
services in the 60s. She expressed many
times to us that when she died she wanted
a mass said in Latin.

Neither of us were practicing Catholics, I
honestly don't know what my dad believes
anymore, but we had the service said for
her even though I think she's dust.

I do wish to honor her memory and keep
my word.

Now say a cousin wanted to baptize her
a mormon. I'd object. I'd say it's offensive
to her legacy, to her memory, and I think
it rude and presumptuous to do so, just
as if she were to make up stories about her
that were untrue and claim them to be
factual.

>
> This is the difference between humans and Jesus Christ....after all
> the thousands of years....He is remembered....8-)

So is Alexander the Great.

>
> Now, Sully, do you see any need to take this further? I ain't going to
> change you....and you are not going to change me.

I'm not trying to change you, I'm trying to understand
you.

[• R. L. Measures.]

In article
<d76ccf41-8c95-4390...@n6g2000vbz.googlegroups.com>, sully
<suls...@yahoo.com> wrote:

>On Jan 31, 5:03=A0pm, Nancy <nw...@live.com> wrote:
>> On Jan 30, 8:31=A0pm, sully <sulsn...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> > On Jan 30, 3:29=A0pm, Nancy <nw...@live.com> wrote:
>>
>> > > On Jan 30, 5:28=A0pm, sully <sulsn...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>
>> > > > On Jan 28, 2:49=A0pm, Nancy <nw...@live.com> wrote:
>>
>> > > > > On Jan 28, 4:55=A0pm, sully <sulsn...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>
>> > > > > > On Jan 28, 7:21=A0am, Nancy <nw...@live.com> wrote:
>>
>> > > > > > > On Jan 28, 8:55=A0am, John Manning <jrobe...@terra.com.br> wr=
>ote:
>>
>> > > > > > > > Romney Family Had Ann Romney's Atheist Father Posthumously =

>Baptized Into
>> > > > > > > > The Mormon Church
>>

>> > > > > > > > Business Insider - Edward Davies, Ann Romney's father, was =
>an
>> > > > > > > > atheist who was also strongly anti-religion. By the time he=
> died,
>> > > > > > > > he was the only member of Ann Romney's immediate family to =
>not
>> > > > > > > > convert to Mormonism.
>>
>> > > > > > > > Fourteen months later, in 1993, he was baptized in a specia=

>l
>> > > > > > > > ceremony at a Salt Lake City church.
>>

>> > > > > > > > This practice requires a living person who has already been=
> baptized
>> > > > > > > > to undergo the immersion in water again on behalf of the de=

>ad. No
>> > > > > > > > word on who this person might have been in Davies' case.
>>

>> > > > > > > > Information on the ceremony was listed on a genealogical da=
>tabase,
>> > > > > > > > and another entry on Ancestry.com detailed a separate seali=

>ng
>> > > > > > > > ceremony that linked Davies to his wife in death.
>>

>> > > > > > > > Baptism of the dead is encouraged by the Church of Latter-d=
>ay
>> > > > > > > > Saints, as it is seen as essential to salvation. But the LD=

>S Church
>> > > > > > > > has been criticized for it often.
>>
>> > > > > > > > After coming under fire in 1995, the Church agreed to stop

>> > > > > > > > baptizing Jewish Holocaust victims posthumously. It had alr=
>eady
>> > > > > > > > added tens of thousands to its baptism registry by that tim=

>e.
>>
>> > > > > > > > Romney's faith has done little to damage his quest for the

>> > > > > > > > presidency so far. But the issue pops up once in a while, m=
>ost
>> > > > > > > > recently after Romney's tax returns showed a $4.1 million d=

>onation
>> > > > > > > > to the Church. There's also evidence to suggest that anti-
>> > > > > > > > Mormon sentiment could have given votes to Newt Gingrich in
>> > > > > > > > South Carolina.
>>

>> > > > > > > > When Newsweek asked Romney whether he had performed any pro=
>xy
>> > > > > > > > baptisms in the past, Romney responded "I have in my life, =

>but
>> > > > > > > > I haven't recently."
>>

>> > > > > > > >http://articles.businessinsider.com/2012-01-27/politics/3066=
>9682_1_an...
>>
>> > > > > > > ~~~
>> > > > > > > Nancy
>>
>> > > > > > > Oh, well, it's no difference from what catholics do.....and i=
>t hasn't
>> > > > > > > changed the status of Ann's dad....not one iota....he is stil=

>l dead.
>>
>> > > > > > No, it changes nothing for him, but it does change
>> > > > > > his memory.
>>
>> > > > > > Would it be ok if they instead made up a story about
>> > > > > > him, wrote it up, and claimed it was true?
>>
>> > > > > > It doesn't hurt him, he's still dead.-
>>
>> > > > > ~~~
>> > > > > Nancy
>>
>> > > > > Let's see if I can guess where you are going with this....
>>
>> > > > > Only if after 3 days he arose....8-)
>>

>> > > > I thought it was a simple question. =A0 You said since

>> > > > Romney's atheist dad-in-law was dead, baptizing
>> > > > him wouldn't hurt him, he's still dead.
>>
>> > > > "not one iota".
>>

>> > > > So based on that, =A0would it be ok if someone

>> > > > were to make up a story(invent it) about someone that
>> > > > is dead - claim that he/she was a child
>> > > > molester, for example, and then publish it
>> > > > somewhere.
>>
>> > > > Since the accused molester is dead, it
>> > > > wouldn't hurt them one iota.
>>
>> > > > Right?
>>
>> > > > So that's ok?-
>>
>> > > ~~~
>> > > Nancy
>>

>> > > We were talking about getting Ann's dad on the right side of the fenc=

>e
>> > > in the after-life. 8-)
>>

>> > Ok, assuming there is an afterlife, =A0what happens if Atheist

>> > Ann's dad is offended by being baptised by Mormons?
>>
>> > > Claiming a person is evil or good will not change a thing in their
>> > > status when they die....
>>
>> > Doesn't it affect how his friends or family remember him?
>>

>> > Whether or not there is an afterlife, =A0doesn't allegations of
>> > that sort affect his memory? =A0 =A0If no afterlife, certainly it
>> > wouldn't affect him directly. =A0 If there were an afterlife, and

АА understanding Mormon dictrine is a great leap for deep thinkers.

--
Richard L. Measures. AG6K, 805-386-3734, www.somis.org

[Nancy]

~~~
Nancy

...ah, but as a dead man.....8-)

>
> > Now, Sully, do you see any need to take this further? I ain't going to
> > change you....and you are not going to change me.
>
> I'm not trying to change you, I'm trying to understand

> you.-

[sully]

On Feb 1, 1:35 am, r...@somis.org (• R. L. Measures.) wrote:
> In article
> <d76ccf41-8c95-4390-8e32-d789490d0...@n6g2000vbz.googlegroups.com>, sully

> €€  understanding Mormon dictrine is a great leap for deep thinkers.


dictrine? Was that intentional? :^) Given
the great impregnatorium in the Mormon
hereafter, it seems appropriate, not to mention
the made-for-Reality-TV history of the
mormon founders....

[Mulligan]

matt 10:15

King James Bible (Cambridge Ed.)
Verily I say unto you, It shall be more tolerable for the land of
Sodom and Gomorrha in the day of judgment, than for that city.

[ancient...@yahoo.com]

On Feb 1, 1:35 am, r...@somis.org (• R. L. Measures.) wrote:
> In article

> <d76ccf41-8c95-4390-8e32-d789490d0...@n6g2000vbz.googlegroups.com>, sully

> €€  understanding Mormon dictrine is a great leap for deep thinkers.
>
> --
> Richard L. Measures. AG6K,  805-386-3734,www.somis.org- Hide quoted text -

>
> - Show quoted text -

Your guys worry too much about little things. If a one is an atheist
and is baptised by proxy, what effect will that have if one goes to
Heaven or not? The same applies if one is a is a Christian. If
someone calls you an asshole, does that make you one?

[sully]

> > Richard L. Measures. AG6K,  805-386-3734,www.somis.org-Hide quoted text -

>
> > - Show quoted text -
>
> Your guys worry too much about little things.  If a one is an atheist
> and is baptised by proxy, what effect will that have if one goes to
> Heaven or not?  The same applies if one is a is a Christian.  If
> someone calls you an asshole, does that make you one?

As an atheist, I know that any of that stuff has
no affect on the dead. That's not the point. I
think I made it clear w/ the story about my
grandmother.

If mormons baptised her by proxy, I'd object
because it's presumptuous, arrogant, and
dishonorable to her memory.

She was a devout Catholic.

[ancient...@yahoo.com]

> Sodom and Gomorrha in the day of judgment, than for that city.-

Ancientofday Quotes (Intellectual Ed.)
Verily I say unto you, applying quotes from ancient sheep herders to
todays life is nonsense.-

[Mulligan]

On Feb 1, 2:39 pm, sully <sulsn...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> As an atheist,  I know that any of that stuff has
> no affect on the dead.

So as an atheist as you claim you seem to possess some kind of
clairvoyance to assure others that you know that when you are dead
that is it, huh?

A veritable prophet of atheists.

[ancient...@yahoo.com]

> > > Richard L. Measures. AG6K,  805-386-3734,www.somis.org-Hidequoted text -

>
> > > - Show quoted text -
>
> > Your guys worry too much about little things.  If a one is an atheist
> > and is baptised by proxy, what effect will that have if one goes to
> > Heaven or not?  The same applies if one is a is a Christian.  If
> > someone calls you an asshole, does that make you one?
>
> As an atheist,  I know that any of that stuff has
> no affect on the dead.   That's not the point.  I
> think I made it clear w/ the story about my
> grandmother.
>
> If mormons baptised her by proxy,  I'd object
> because it's presumptuous, arrogant, and
> dishonorable to her memory.
>

> She was a devout Catholic.-

I can understand how you feel, but for me I would just ignore it as
nonsense, it has no effect on anything. We are all different, if it
make you feel good to get upset, then by all means, get upset.

[Mulligan]

> todays life is nonsense.-- Hide quoted text -

rfg M.O., come in with other sockpuppet as they cannot explain that
passage and say none of it matters.

[Mulligan]

> > > > Richard L. Measures. AG6K,  805-386-3734,www.somis.org-Hidequotedtext -

>
> > > > - Show quoted text -
>
> > > Your guys worry too much about little things.  If a one is an atheist
> > > and is baptised by proxy, what effect will that have if one goes to
> > > Heaven or not?  The same applies if one is a is a Christian.  If
> > > someone calls you an asshole, does that make you one?
>
> > As an atheist,  I know that any of that stuff has
> > no affect on the dead.   That's not the point.  I
> > think I made it clear w/ the story about my
> > grandmother.
>
> > If mormons baptised her by proxy,  I'd object
> > because it's presumptuous, arrogant, and
> > dishonorable to her memory.
>
> > She was a devout Catholic.-
>
> I can understand how you feel, but for me I would just ignore it as
> nonsense, it has no effect on anything.  We are all different, if it

> make you feel good to get upset, then by all means, get upset.- Hide quoted text -

And this is where we differ on the plan.

See, his plan is to build a refridgerator to get the punished out of
their punishment.

Problem is, they are not getting out of it like that.

GOD has provided a way, and that is the way to take care of it.

[ancient...@yahoo.com]

Atheists rely on science and evidence, Christians live by hearsay.
Now, prove me wrong!

[Mulligan]

On Feb 1, 2:45 pm, ancientofday...@yahoo.com wrote:
> On Feb 1, 11:40 am, Mulligan <quarke...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > On Feb 1, 2:39 pm, sully <sulsn...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > > As an atheist,  I know that any of that stuff has
> > > no affect on the dead.
>
> > So as an atheist as you claim you seem to possess some kind of
> > clairvoyance to assure others that you know that when you are dead
> > that is it, huh?
>
> > A veritable prophet of atheists.
>
> Atheists rely on science and evidence

What is that?

[DanielSan]

What is what?

[sully]

On Feb 1, 11:28 am, Mulligan <quarke...@gmail.com> wrote:

Is this more threats from your 'loving' god?

[Mulligan]

> What is what?- Hide quoted text -

>
> - Show quoted text -

POINTS

[Mulligan]

> POINTS- Hide quoted text -

>
> - Show quoted text -

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cCI18qAoKq4

[Mulligan]

Because GOD loves, he wants you to know NOT TO REJECT THE GOSPEL
MESSAGE FROM HIS APPOINTED MINISTERS OR DIRE CONSEQUENCES WILL FOLLOW.

[ancient...@yahoo.com]

> MESSAGE FROM HIS APPOINTED MINISTERS OR DIRE CONSEQUENCES WILL FOLLOW.- Hide quoted text -

>
> - Show quoted text -

Yup, love me or I will kill you nonsense!

[ancient...@yahoo.com]

Study and find out.

[Mulligan]

> Study and find out.- Hide quoted text -

>
> - Show quoted text -

No, you moron, what is that (points).

[Mulligan]

> Yup, love me or I will kill you nonsense!- Hide quoted text -

The world is filled with wickedness.
GOD has to punish wickedness, as he cannot deny his word.

Because he loves you, he sends prophets to you to warn you to change
your ways.
GOD does not want to destroy the world, which is why he has sent me.
Because he loves you.

But if you do not repent, he cannot deny his word.

[sully]

Is this the sort of wickedness God
should punish?

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_lLZUGokkG6E/SNC2qWyOEeI/AAAAAAAAAgo/7QTx_OSupgQ/s400/Starving+Child+and+Vulture.jpg

[ancient...@yahoo.com]

On Feb 1, 12:46 pm, Mulligan <t2judgm...@gmail.com> wrote:

> But if you do not repent, he cannot deny his word.-

If believing that makes you happy, have at it. I'll go evidence route
myself.

[ancient...@yahoo.com]

> http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_lLZUGokkG6E/SNC2qWyOEeI/AAAAAAAAAgo/7QTx_OS...-

If Mulligan is repesentative of what God is, Satan would be a blessing!

[ancient...@yahoo.com]

> http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_lLZUGokkG6E/SNC2qWyOEeI/AAAAAAAAAgo/7QTx_OS...-


Good one, Sully, wonder what God's response would be,...perhaps more
bullshit?

[Smiler]

On Wed, 01 Feb 2012 05:11:10 -0800, Nancy wrote:

> On Feb 1, 2:27 am, sully <sulsn...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> On Jan 31, 5:03 pm, Nancy <nw...@live.com> wrote:
>>
>> > On Jan 30, 8:31 pm, sully <sulsn...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>
>> > > On Jan 30, 3:29 pm, Nancy <nw...@live.com> wrote:
>>

<snip>

> ...ah, but as a dead man.....8-)
>

Whereas Jesus is just a character in some books of fiction.

--
Smiler,

The godless one. a.a.# 2279

All gods are tailored to order. They're made to

exactly fit the prejudices of their believers.

[ancient...@yahoo.com]

On Feb 1, 12:46 pm, Mulligan <t2judgm...@gmail.com> wrote:

> But if you do not repent, he cannot deny his word.- Hide quoted text -

>
> - Show quoted text -

Ya know, Mulligan, I haven't found a book written by Satan where it
says love me or I will kill you. The only one I know that says that
is the one written by God! Why is that?

[Just Wondering]

On 2/1/2012 5:41 PM, ancient...@yahoo.com wrote:

> Ya know, Mulligan, I haven't found a book written by Satan where it
> says love me or I will kill you.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XhVpoRaTdj0

[ancient...@yahoo.com]

On Feb 1, 5:04 pm, Just Wondering <fmh...@comcast.net> wrote:

> On 2/1/2012 5:41 PM, ancientofday...@yahoo.com wrote:
>
> > Ya know, Mulligan, I haven't found a book written by Satan where it
> > says love me or I will kill you.
>
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XhVpoRaTdj0

Did Jeff Dunham write a Satan book?

[DanielSan]

Are you (or God) threatening me?

[DanielSan]

On 2/1/2012 12:46 PM, Mulligan wrote:
> he cannot

God can't do something? I thought He was all powerful.

[Mulligan]

> Are you (or God) threatening me?- Hide quoted text -

No, because he is concerned for you homey, he lets you know in advance
the outcome of your choices.

[Mulligan]

On Feb 1, 5:03 pm, ancientofday...@yahoo.com wrote:

. I'll go evidence route
> myself.- Hide quoted text -

I have presented tons of evidence, you just won't look.

Are you deaf dumb blind and stupid ?

Braindamaged?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mN3hH8LG4Yw

[Mulligan]

On Feb 2, 12:11 am, DanielSan <danielsan1...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On 2/1/2012 12:46 PM, Mulligan wrote:
>
> > he cannot
>
> God can't do something?

No, when he gives his word, he comes through on it.

He most certainly can.

[Mulligan]

> is the one written by God!  Why is that?- Hide quoted text -

>
> - Show quoted text -

Because you are unaware of the plan of salvation, chump.

[DanielSan]

On 2/2/2012 10:16 AM, Mulligan wrote:
> On Feb 2, 12:11 am, DanielSan<danielsan1...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> On 2/1/2012 12:46 PM, Mulligan wrote:
>>
>>> he cannot
>>
>> God can't do something?
>
> No

Got it.

[DanielSan]

But the "outcome" is something God created specifically against people
like me.

[DanielSan]

On 2/2/2012 10:18 AM, Mulligan wrote:
> On Feb 1, 5:03 pm, ancientofday...@yahoo.com wrote:
>
> . I'll go evidence route
>> myself.- Hide quoted text -
>
> I have presented tons of evidence, you just won't look.

Nope. You've provided unsupported assertions.

[Mulligan]

On Feb 2, 2:10 pm, DanielSan <danielsan1...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On 2/2/2012 10:18 AM, Mulligan wrote:
>
> > On Feb 1, 5:03 pm, ancientofday...@yahoo.com wrote:
>
> > . I'll go evidence route
> >> myself.- Hide quoted text -
>
> > I have presented tons of evidence, you just won't look.
>
> Nope.

Yep.

[Mulligan]

> like me.- Hide quoted text -

Thank you for admitting you are one of those who does not do what GOD
says, fulling knowing the outcome of that.

That is on you, pal.

[ancient...@yahoo.com]

> Because you are unaware of the plan of salvation, chump.-


Are the following an example of God's plan of salvation?

He that sacrificeth unto any god, save unto the LORD only, he shall be
utterly destroyed.--Ex22.20:

The LORD shall smite thee with a consumption, and with a fever, and
with an inflammation, and with an extreme burning, and with the sword,
and with blasting, and with mildew; and they shall pursue thee until
thou perish.--Deuteronomy 28:22

[ancient...@yahoo.com]

Nope

[ancient...@yahoo.com]

On Feb 2, 10:18 am, Mulligan <quarke...@gmail.com> wrote:

Give me an example of these 'tons of evidence'.

[Smiler]

On Thu, 02 Feb 2012 10:17:29 -0800, Mulligan wrote:

> On Feb 1, 11:35 pm, DanielSan <danielsan1...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> On 2/1/2012 11:52 AM, Mulligan wrote:
>> > On Feb 1, 2:35 pm, sully<sulsn...@yahoo.com>  wrote:
>> >> On Feb 1, 11:28 am, Mulligan<quarke...@gmail.com>  wrote:
>>
>> >>> On Jan 30, 5:31 pm, sully<sulsn...@yahoo.com>  wrote:
>>
>> >>>> On Jan 29, 10:24 am, Mulligan<t2judgm...@gmail.com>  wrote:
>>

<snip>

>>
>> >>>>> Very incorrect.
>> >>>>> If he accepts it, he can cross over from spirit prison to paradise to
>> >>>>> await being restored to life.
>> >>>>> That was christ's mission there to bridge the gulf ....
>>
>> >>>> So dead people can make decisions?
>>
>> >>> matt 10:15
>>
>> >>> King James Bible (Cambridge Ed.)
>> >>> Verily I say unto you, It shall be more tolerable for the land of
>> >>> Sodom and Gomorrha in the day of judgment, than for that city.
>>
>> >> Is this more threats
>>
>> > Because GOD loves, he wants you to know NOT TO REJECT THE GOSPEL
>> > MESSAGE FROM HIS APPOINTED MINISTERS OR DIRE CONSEQUENCES WILL FOLLOW.
>>
>> Are you (or God) threatening me?- Hide quoted text -
>
> No, because he is concerned for you homey, he lets you know in advance
> the outcome of your choices.

So does the Mafia. "Pay up or your business will burn down!"

[• R. L. Measures.]

In article
<96b54e59-61c4-4f36...@b10g2000pbd.googlegroups.com>, sully
<suls...@yahoo.com> wrote:

>On Feb 1, 1:35=A0am, r...@somis.org (=95 R. L. Measures.) wrote:
>> In article
>> <d76ccf41-8c95-4390-8e32-d789490d0...@n6g2000vbz.googlegroups.com>, sully
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> <sulsn...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> >On Jan 31, 5:03=3DA0pm, Nancy <nw...@live.com> wrote:
>> >> On Jan 30, 8:31=3DA0pm, sully <sulsn...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>
>> >> > On Jan 30, 3:29=3DA0pm, Nancy <nw...@live.com> wrote:
>>
>> >> > > On Jan 30, 5:28=3DA0pm, sully <sulsn...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>
>> >> > > > On Jan 28, 2:49=3DA0pm, Nancy <nw...@live.com> wrote:
>>
>> >> > > > > On Jan 28, 4:55=3DA0pm, sully <sulsn...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>
>> >> > > > > > On Jan 28, 7:21=3DA0am, Nancy <nw...@live.com> wrote:
>>
>> >> > > > > > > On Jan 28, 8:55=3DA0am, John Manning <jrobe...@terra.com.b=
>r> wr=3D
>> >ote:
>>
>> >> > > > > > > > Romney Family Had Ann Romney's Atheist Father Posthumous=
>ly =3D

>> >Baptized Into
>> >> > > > > > > > The Mormon Church
>>

>> >> > > > > > > > Business Insider - Edward Davies, Ann Romney's father, w=
>as =3D
>> >an
>> >> > > > > > > > atheist who was also strongly anti-religion. By the time=
> he=3D
>> > died,
>> >> > > > > > > > he was the only member of Ann Romney's immediate family =
>to =3D
>> >not
>> >> > > > > > > > convert to Mormonism.
>>
>> >> > > > > > > > Fourteen months later, in 1993, he was baptized in a spe=
>cia=3D

>> >l
>> >> > > > > > > > ceremony at a Salt Lake City church.
>>

>> >> > > > > > > > This practice requires a living person who has already b=
>een=3D
>> > baptized
>> >> > > > > > > > to undergo the immersion in water again on behalf of the=
> de=3D

>> >ad. No
>> >> > > > > > > > word on who this person might have been in Davies' case.
>>

>> >> > > > > > > > Information on the ceremony was listed on a genealogical=
> da=3D
>> >tabase,
>> >> > > > > > > > and another entry on Ancestry.com detailed a separate se=
>ali=3D

>> >ng
>> >> > > > > > > > ceremony that linked Davies to his wife in death.
>>

>> >> > > > > > > > Baptism of the dead is encouraged by the Church of Latte=
>r-d=3D
>> >ay
>> >> > > > > > > > Saints, as it is seen as essential to salvation. But the=
> LD=3D

>> >S Church
>> >> > > > > > > > has been criticized for it often.
>>

>> >> > > > > > > > After coming under fire in 1995, the Church agreed to st=
>op
>> >> > > > > > > > baptizing Jewish Holocaust victims posthumously. It had =
>alr=3D
>> >eady
>> >> > > > > > > > added tens of thousands to its baptism registry by that =
>tim=3D
>> >e.
>>
>> >> > > > > > > > Romney's faith has done little to damage his quest for t=
>he
>> >> > > > > > > > presidency so far. But the issue pops up once in a while=
>, m=3D
>> >ost
>> >> > > > > > > > recently after Romney's tax returns showed a $4.1 millio=
>n d=3D
>> >onation
>> >> > > > > > > > to the Church. There's also evidence to suggest that ant=
>i-
>> >> > > > > > > > Mormon sentiment could have given votes to Newt Gingrich=
> in
>> >> > > > > > > > South Carolina.
>>
>> >> > > > > > > > When Newsweek asked Romney whether he had performed any =
>pro=3D
>> >xy
>> >> > > > > > > > baptisms in the past, Romney responded "I have in my lif=
>e, =3D

>> >but
>> >> > > > > > > > I haven't recently."
>>

>> >> > > > > > > >http://articles.businessinsider.com/2012-01-27/politics/3=
>066=3D
>> >9682_1_an...
>>
>> >> > > > > > > ~~~
>> >> > > > > > > Nancy
>>
>> >> > > > > > > Oh, well, it's no difference from what catholics do.....an=
>d i=3D
>> >t hasn't
>> >> > > > > > > changed the status of Ann's dad....not one iota....he is s=
>til=3D
>> >l dead.
>>
>> >> > > > > > No, it changes nothing for him, but it does change
>> >> > > > > > his memory.
>>
>> >> > > > > > Would it be ok if they instead made up a story about
>> >> > > > > > him, wrote it up, and claimed it was true?
>>
>> >> > > > > > It doesn't hurt him, he's still dead.-
>>
>> >> > > > > ~~~
>> >> > > > > Nancy
>>
>> >> > > > > Let's see if I can guess where you are going with this....
>>
>> >> > > > > Only if after 3 days he arose....8-)
>>
>> >> > > > I thought it was a simple question. =3DA0 You said since
>> >> > > > Romney's atheist dad-in-law was dead, baptizing
>> >> > > > him wouldn't hurt him, he's still dead.
>>
>> >> > > > "not one iota".
>>
>> >> > > > So based on that, =3DA0would it be ok if someone
>> >> > > > were to make up a story(invent it) about someone that
>> >> > > > is dead - claim that he/she was a child
>> >> > > > molester, for example, and then publish it
>> >> > > > somewhere.
>>
>> >> > > > Since the accused molester is dead, it
>> >> > > > wouldn't hurt them one iota.
>>
>> >> > > > Right?
>>
>> >> > > > So that's ok?-
>>
>> >> > > ~~~
>> >> > > Nancy
>>
>> >> > > We were talking about getting Ann's dad on the right side of the f=
>enc=3D
>> >e
>> >> > > in the after-life. 8-)
>>
>> >> > Ok, assuming there is an afterlife, =3DA0what happens if Atheist
>> >> > Ann's dad is offended by being baptised by Mormons?
>>
>> >> > > Claiming a person is evil or good will not change a thing in their
>> >> > > status when they die....
>>
>> >> > Doesn't it affect how his friends or family remember him?
>>
>> >> > Whether or not there is an afterlife, =3DA0doesn't allegations of
>> >> > that sort affect his memory? =3DA0 =3DA0If no afterlife, certainly i=
>t
>> >> > wouldn't affect him directly. =3DA0 If there were an afterlife, and

>> >> > he still chose to be an atheist, wouldn't being baptized
>> >> > without his permission offend him?- Hide quoted text -
>>
>> >> ~~~
>> >> Nancy
>>
>> >> Ok, Sully, I'll play along.
>>
>> >> Excluding Jesus Christ, because He is in a category of His own....no
>> >> one else can say they were physically begotten by the Father.
>>
>> >> When you die....should your kids want to say you were a saint....if it
>> >> makes them feel beter....let them. Should they want to say you were
>> >> the devil himself....if it makes them feel better....let them. BUT it
>> >> ain't going to change a thing....you will be dead...never to live
>> >> again ( this ~is~ what you believe, right). By the time of your great-
>> >> grandchildren...
>> >> you won't even be a memory.....so what difference does it make who
>> >> says what about you.....
>>
>> >Right, I agree that it makes no difference to me

>> >who is dust. =A0 =A0But if one of my kids married

>> >a mormon and they wanted to baptize me,

>> >what if my other kid objected? =A0 This is why

>> >I say it does make a difference, even if it
>> >doesn't make a difference to the non-existent
>> >sully.
>>
>> >I'm an atheist, but my Dad's mom was a
>> >devout Catholic, and one who was disturbed
>> >and offended by the changes to church

>> >services in the 60s. =A0 She expressed many

>> >times to us that when she died she wanted
>> >a mass said in Latin.
>>

>> >Neither of us were practicing Catholics, =A0I

>> >honestly don't know what my dad believes
>> >anymore, but we had the service said for
>> >her even though I think she's dust.
>>
>> >I do wish to honor her memory and keep
>> >my word.
>>
>> >Now say a cousin wanted to baptize her

>> >a mormon. =A0 I'd object. =A0 I'd say it's offensive

>> >to her legacy, to her memory, and I think

>> >it rude and presumptuous to do so, =A0just

>> >as if she were to make up stories about her
>> >that were untrue and claim them to be
>> >factual.
>>
>> >> This is the difference between humans and Jesus Christ....after all
>> >> the thousands of years....He is remembered....8-)
>>
>> >So is Alexander the Great.
>>

>> >> Now, Sully, do you see any need to take this further? I ain't going to
>> >> change you....and you are not going to change me.
>>
>> >I'm not trying to change you, I'm trying to understand
>> >you.
>>
>> =80=80 =A0understanding Mormon dictrine is a great leap for deep thinkers=
>.
>
>
>dictrine? Was that intentional? :^)

АА not - but it fits.


>Given the great impregnatorium in the Mormon
>hereafter, it seems appropriate, not to mention
>the made-for-Reality-TV history of the
>mormon founders....

АА guffaw. Good one.

--
Richard L. Measures. AG6K, 805-386-3734, www.somis.org

[• R. L. Measures.]

In article
<10321fbf-5df9-42e9...@rk3g2000pbb.googlegroups.com>,

>> --
>> Richard L. Measures. AG6K, =A0805-386-3734,www.somis.org- Hide quoted tex=

>t -
>>
>> - Show quoted text -
>

>Your guys worry too much about little things. If a one is an atheist
>and is baptised by proxy, what effect will that have if one goes to
>Heaven or not?

*** As I understand it, no one who is LdS proxy-baptized will be required
to take on the job of impregnating possibly hundreds of perfect-bodied
wives in eternal estrus in the LdS' Celestial Kingdom. Obviously no man
who has ever had the experience of dating two women at the same time would
tbe foolish enough to take on a job like that.

The same applies if one is a is a Christian. If
>someone calls you an asshole, does that make you one?

[• R. L. Measures.]

In article <jgd5tv$9cl$6...@dont-email.me>, DanielSan

• Hell no, He for damn sure can not change history - only the one true
church does that. .

--
Richard L. Measures. AG6K, 805-386-3734, www.somis.org

[Mulligan]

Yep.

[ancient...@yahoo.com]

> Yep.-

Where is it?

[Mulligan]

> Where is it?- Hide quoted text -

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3t4g_1VoGw4

[Mulligan]

> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3t4g_1VoGw4- Hide quoted text -

>
> - Show quoted text -

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EBwqV0QU0i8

[Fidem Turbare, atheist goddess]

On Feb 3, 1:31 am, r...@somis.org (• R. L. Measures.) wrote:
> In article

> <10321fbf-5df9-42e9-9de8-6b6824d21...@rk3g2000pbb.googlegroups.com>,

> >> Richard L. Measures. AG6K, =A0805-386-3734,www.somis.org-Hide quoted tex=

> >t -
>
> >> - Show quoted text -
>
> >Your guys worry too much about little things.  If a one is an atheist
> >and is baptised by proxy, what effect will that have if one goes to
> >Heaven or not?
>
> ***  As I understand it, no one who is LdS proxy-baptized will be required
> to take on the job of impregnating possibly hundreds of perfect-bodied
> wives in eternal estrus in the LdS' Celestial Kingdom.   Obviously no man
> who has ever had the experience of dating two women at the same time would
> tbe foolish enough to take on a job like that.

In the Celestial Kingdom all women are slaves who can only speak when
men give them permission to do so, as evidenced by the way many
polygamist Mormon men abusively mistreat their multiple wives and
daughters in real life (assumedly in preparation for an afterlife in
the Celestial Kingdom that promises more of the same).

> The same applies if one is a is a Christian.  If
>
> >someone calls you an asshole, does that make you one?

"That's what she said."

--
Fidem Turbare, the non-existent atheist goddess
"Religion is a socio-political system for controlling people's
thoughts, lives and actions based on ancient myths and superstitions,
perpetrated through generations of subtle yet pervasive brainwashing."
-- Unknown

[Mulligan]

On Feb 3, 12:24 pm, "Fidem Turbare, atheist goddess"

<fidem.turb...@gmail.com> wrote:

> In the Celestial Kingdom all women are slaves

False.

Only unmarried people are slaves.

[Fidem Turbare, atheist goddess]

The occurrence of non-consentual slavery, regardless of marital
status, is unethical and immoral.

--
Fidem Turbare, the non-existent atheist goddess

"Dictatorship naturally arises out of democracy, and the most
aggravated form of tyranny and slavery out of the most extreme
liberty."
-- Plato of Athens

[Mulligan]

On Feb 3, 1:07 pm, "Fidem Turbare, atheist goddess"

<fidem.turb...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Feb 3, 9:33 am, Mulligan <t2judgm...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > On Feb 3, 12:24 pm, "Fidem Turbare, atheist goddess"
>
> > <fidem.turb...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > In the Celestial Kingdom all women are slaves
>
> > False.
>
> > Only unmarried people are slaves.
>
> The occurrence of non-consentual slavery, regardless of marital
> status, is unethical and immoral.

Perhaps that is rendered poorly in translation.

Those unmarried in heaven are servants.

[ancient...@yahoo.com]

> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3t4g_1VoGw4-

As I suspected, no evidence. And this is what you call, 'tons of
evidence'?

[Mulligan]

As I suspected, you are in denial.
Seek treatment.

[ancient...@yahoo.com]

> Seek treatment.-

This is your 'tons of evidence' ??

[Mulligan]

> This is your 'tons of evidence' ??- Hide quoted text -

You need meds for your living in dnial of reality.

[ancient...@yahoo.com]

> You need meds for your living in dnial of reality.-

This is more of your 'tons of evidence' ???

[Mulligan]

> This is more of your 'tons of evidence'  ???- Hide quoted text -

That you are totally insane?
Yes. Your denial is another symptom.

[Fidem Turbare, atheist goddess]

Another form of slavery.

So not only do people have to be good (in the eyes of their religious
standards), but they also have to be married to enjoy the afterlife?
I've never heard of this marriage requirement before and I contend
that you just made it up.

--
Fidem Turbare, the non-existent atheist goddess

"Usenet is not your social worker."
-- David Silverman, Defender of Civilisation

[Mulligan]

On Feb 4, 12:43 pm, "Fidem Turbare, atheist goddess"

<fidem.turb...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Feb 3, 10:35 am, Mulligan <quarke...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Feb 3, 1:07 pm, "Fidem Turbare, atheist goddess"
> > <fidem.turb...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > On Feb 3, 9:33 am, Mulligan <t2judgm...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > On Feb 3, 12:24 pm, "Fidem Turbare, atheist goddess"
> > > > <fidem.turb...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > > In the Celestial Kingdom all women are slaves
>
> > > > False.
>
> > > > Only unmarried people are slaves.
>
> > > The occurrence of non-consentual slavery, regardless of marital
> > > status, is unethical and immoral.
>
> > Perhaps that is rendered poorly in translation.
>
> > Those unmarried in heaven are servants.
>
> Another form of slavery.
>
> So not only do people have to be good (in the eyes of their religious
> standards), but they also have to be married to enjoy the afterlife?
>

Where does it say being a servant of GOD is not enjoyable in the
afterlife?

[ancient...@yahoo.com]

> afterlife?-

Ya never know, there might be a war there like there was once !

Revelation 12:7
King James Version (KJV)
7And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against
the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,

[Mulligan]

> the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,- Hide quoted text -

With you locked up, how can that happen?

[Fidem Turbare, atheist goddess]

You're trying to evade the question because you know I'm right. If
one is forced to be a servant to your deity, then that's slavery and
your deity is oppressive. Since oppressive regimes are generally
lacking in freedom and compassion, your version of the afterlife is,
by logical deduction, not enjoyable.

--
Fidem Turbare, the non-existent atheist goddess

"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion,
or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of
speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to
assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances."
-- The United States Constitution, Amendments of the Constitution,
Article I

[Mulligan]

On Feb 4, 2:37 pm, "Fidem Turbare, atheist goddess"

You have got to be the stupidest person who has ever lived.
Heaven is a joyous place to be.
Have you ever read the bible?

[ancient...@yahoo.com]

> With you locked up, how can that happen?-

If you could read you would see that my name is not Michael, ( see
above), nor am I an angel.

[Fidem Turbare, atheist goddess]

Ha ha! I'm not an angel either.

--
Fidem Turbare, the non-existent atheist goddess

"Cancel my subscription to the resurrection."
-- Jim Morrison

[Mulligan]

On Feb 4, 3:07 pm, "Fidem Turbare, atheist goddess"

You were.