Re: Pope in Hospital Again - Please Pray!
Edmond Wollmann - The Arthurian One
place?
Amazing what gullibility is rampant on the planet.
Edmond H. Wollmann P.M.A.F.A.
© 2005 Altair Publications, SAN 299-5603
Astrological Consulting http://www.astroconsulting.com/
Artworks http://www.astroconsulting.com/personal/
http://www.astroconsulting.com/SDSU
+Jesus Saves+ wrote:
> Catholics Pray for Pope's Recovery
>
> By KRZYSZTOF KOPACZ, Associated Press Writer
>
> WADOWICE, Poland - In big cities and quiet villages, Roman Catholics
> around the world stopped Thursday to pray for Pope John Paul II as
> word spread that he had again been rushed to the hospital with
> flu-like symptoms and breathing difficulties.
>
> In Wadowice, the small town in southern Poland where the pope was
> born, people offered special prayers at an afternoon mass at St.
> Mary's Church, where Karol Wojtyla was baptized and attended Mass for
> years before he became a priest.
>
> "We have prayed for the pope to live as long as possible so we can
> still share our joy with him," said Zofia Gebala, a 73-year-old
> retiree, as she left the service. "We are praying for him every day,
> for his well-being. But it's all in God's hands now."
>
> Gebala said the pope should have taken it easy and not appeared at an
> open window in St. Peter's Square to say Sunday Angelus prayers. "He
> should really take better care of himself - he would be healthier
then
> and rested," she said. "Why is he working so hard?"
>
> In Warsaw, a fresh bouquet of yellow tulips lay at the base of a
> statue of the pope holding a crucifix-engraved pastoral staff. In
> overwhelmingly Catholic Poland, love for the pope mingles piety and
> patriotism.
>
> The news spread quickly, with the pope's illness flashed on
television
> just as news shows were ending in the Philippines. Church officials
> flashed a prayer request to the faithful by text message on their
cell
> phones.
>
> Brigid Nolan, 73, saw the news on television in Dublin, Ireland, and
> walked over to St. Columba's church. She lit a candle and offered a
> five-minute prayer for the pope and her own struggle with Parkinson's
> disease, which the pope suffers from too.
>
> "I do draw inspiration from his own fight for life," she said. "He is
> suffering, but he's surviving, and more power to him. I get angry
when
> people say he should quit. He should keep going for every minute God
> gives him."
>
> In central London, people leaving midday Mass at St. Etheldreda's
> Church also had the pope on their minds.
>
> "I think he has a lot of work to do yet," said businesswoman Patricia
> Cullen, 43. She's hoping to go see John Paul when he visits Cologne,
> Germany later this year.
>
> Fidelis Adeyemi prayed Thursday at the Church of Assumption in the
> Ikoyi district of Nigeria's biggest city, Lagos. "Every time I pray,
I
> remember the pope," Adeyemi said.
>
> Fellow parishioner Adaora Okolo said all prayed regularly for the
> pope's health. "We believe God will hear our prayers and keep him
> alive," said Okolo.
>
> In Detroit, Polish-American Cardinal Adam Maida, a longtime friend of
> the pope, called on the people to remember John Paul and issued a
> suggested prayer.
>
> "Father of all life, we ask your special blessing and protection for
> our Holy Father on earth," Maida, who filled in for the pope at a
1999
> service in Poland when John Paul fell ill, said in his message.
>
> "We pray that through his suffering we may deepen our own faith in
the
> mystery and hope of sharing in Christ's Resurrection. According to
> your will, restore him to the service of your church and keep us all
> in your peace."
Pedantus
> Why didn't "God" intervene and keep him from getting ill in the first
> place?
>
> Amazing what gullibility is rampant on the planet.
Now if they were only gullible enough to believe that you have the one
true religion....:)
>
> Eddy
wollma...@spam.free
http://www.nocem.org/
http://www.rahul.net/falk/quickrefs.html#W
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alt.religion.islam talk.religion.newage alt.astrology soc.motss
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Mather
+Jesus Saves+ <stpeters...@onearth.com> wrote:
>
> Catholics Pray for Pope's DEATH
>
Fixed.
1MAN4ALL
> Why didn't "God" intervene and keep him from getting ill in the first
> place?
Sickness and death are subject to laws of nature, which were
established by God at the time the world was created, and they apply
equitably to all. Neither piousness nor sinfulness by itself creates an
obligation for God to alter these laws.
> Amazing what gullibility is rampant on the planet.
You are part of it:-)
ric...@domani.net
wouldn't be too pleased with the tone I'm takin' with the Lord.
rpj
Gary Duncan
>Catholics Pray for Pope's Recovery
The Pope is an evil man. Let us hope the church picks
someone better soon.
Edmond H. Wollmann The Pleiadian One!
> Edmond Wollmann - The Arthurian One wrote:
> > Why didn't "God" intervene and keep him from getting ill in the
first
> > place?
> Sickness and death are subject to laws of nature, which were
> established by God at the time the world was created, and they apply
> equitably to all. Neither piousness nor sinfulness by itself creates
an
> obligation for God to alter these laws.
The laws of nature are set, hhhmmm...then why not just study nature?
Skip the middleman?
Then why was the pope himself saying that he believed that God
intervened when he was shot so that the bullet did not hit any vital
organs? Again, the question would be why even believe in such non-sense
if it has no effect whatever anyway? Why didn't god stop the shooter
first?
> > Amazing what gullibility is rampant on the planet.
> You are part of it:-)
I see, because I don't believe in fairy tales about some after life? If
there is an omnipotent creator, IT (not he or she) has an infinite
amount of space, time and far larger and more complex issues that would
preoccupy it (if such a notion is even feasible) than even giving a
second glance to whatever is going on on this insignificant planet, in
an insignificant solar system on the outskirts of this insignificant
galaxy in which we find ourselves.
"Everybody needs his memories. They keep the wolf of insignificance
from the door." Saul Bellow
Replace memories with religion and there you have it.
"Anyone who thinks they're important is usually just a pompous moron
who can't deal with his or her own pathetic insignificance and the fact
that what they do is meaningless and inconsequential..." William Thomas
Bruce Morgen
The frightening thing is
that he's been one of the
better ones in many
respects -- no John XXIII
for sure and quite a
throwback theologically,
but not so much evil as
mistaken.
................................................................
Posted via TITANnews - Uncensored Newsgroups Access
>>>> at http://www.TitanNews.com <<<<
-=Every Newsgroup - Anonymous, UNCENSORED, BROADBAND Downloads=-
Pedantus
"Edmond H. Wollmann The Pleiadian One!" <alcha...@yahoo.com> wrote in
message news:1109286156....@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Is that what you have done, Ed? Tried to replaced all your actual memories
with the imaginary astral religion you spinically call knowledge?
"Anyone who thinks they're important is usually just a pompous moron
who can't deal with his or her own pathetic insignificance and the fact
that what they do is meaningless and inconsequential..." William Thomas
Are you "important", Eddy? Or do you just kookfart in public for all the
attention your anti-social behavior can attract?
Edmond de Pompuss
Anonymous
"1MAN4ALL" <fora...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1109275433.6...@l41g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
> Edmond Wollmann - The Arthurian One wrote:
>
> > Why didn't "God" intervene and keep him from getting ill in the first
> > place?
>
> Sickness and death are subject to laws of nature, which were
> established by God at the time the world was created, and they apply
> equitably to all. Neither piousness nor sinfulness by itself creates an
> obligation for God to alter these laws.
If so, why one should pray for Pope's recovery ? Why can't nature to take
its own course.
Shari Boone
> place?
For the same reason you got mailbombed, your Beemer broken into, your
credit cards ripped off, your accounts TOSsed, you friend killed, your
Misdemeanor Criminal Conviction, and a slap in the face from Yours Truly.
Because God has nothing to do with that shit, and neither does "creating
your own reality", you stupid fuck.
>
> Amazing what gullibility is rampant on the planet.
It's the only thing that keeps you in clients, fraud.
That Wollmann Asshole
> 1MAN4ALL wrote:
>> Edmond Wollmann - The Arthurian One wrote:
>
>> > Why didn't "God" intervene and keep him from getting ill in the
> first
>> > place?
>
>> Sickness and death are subject to laws of nature, which were
>> established by God at the time the world was created, and they apply
>> equitably to all. Neither piousness nor sinfulness by itself creates
> an
>> obligation for God to alter these laws.
>
> The laws of nature are set, hhhmmm...then why not just study nature?
> Skip the middleman?
> Then why was the pope himself saying that he believed that God
> intervened when he was shot so that the bullet did not hit any vital
> organs? Again, the question would be why even believe in such non-sense
> if it has no effect whatever anyway? Why didn't god stop the shooter
> first?
I'd like to know why your father didn't buttfuck your mother after your
sister was born. It would have saved your Auntie from throwing away good
money to publish your crappy book.
>> > Amazing what gullibility is rampant on the planet.
>
>> You are part of it:-)
>
> I see, because I don't believe in fairy tales about some after life?
Nah, you believe in lessened gravity making the dinosaurs larger, Orion
being a star and that you have degrees. Unfortunately, the existance of a
God is a lot harder to refute than any of your laughable claims, kook.
> If
> there is an omnipotent creator, IT (not he or she) has an infinite
> amount of space, time and far larger and more complex issues that would
> preoccupy it (if such a notion is even feasible) than even giving a
> second glance to whatever is going on on this insignificant planet, in
> an insignificant solar system on the outskirts of this insignificant
> galaxy in which we find ourselves.
He's certainly not helping you any, asshole.
> "Everybody needs his memories. They keep the wolf of insignificance
> from the door." Saul Bellow
>
> Replace memories with religion and there you have it.
Replace you with someone who makes sense and there will be a lot of kook
awards for someone else too. Your point, fucktard?
> "Anyone who thinks they're important is usually just a pompous moron
> who can't deal with his or her own pathetic insignificance and the fact
> that what they do is meaningless and inconsequential..." William Thomas
It's amazing that you think this appies to everyone else but you,
dickhead.
--
Cujo - The Official Overseer of Kooks and Trolls in
dfw.*, alt.paranormal, alt.astrology and alt.astrology.metapsych.
Winner of the 8/2000 & 2/2003 HL&S award. Hail Petitmorte!
Colonel of the Fanatic Legion. FL# 555-PLNTY Motto: ABUNDANCE!.
Charter Member - Digital Brownshirts and Library Gestapo.
"...I COUNSEL PHDS I CAN READ PEOPLE SHE KNOWS NOTHING AND IS ONLY
THERE TO STIR SHIT UP!!!!" - Edmo the calm.
Dan Baldwin
>
> Amazing what gullibility is rampant on the planet.
Yeah, like those idiot so-called astrologers who think people might
beleive him when he says the counsels PhDs, yet can't come up with the
money to "sue the fuck" out of us.
> Edmond H. Wollmann Pretty Much A Fucking Asshole
Yup.
--
Dan Baldwin, unethical *by design*
I am a minion of Satan, but my powers are mainly administrative.
Hail the un-alive
Dan Baldwin
>
>
> The laws of nature are set, hhhmmm...then why not just study nature?
Why not sue the fuck out of us like you've been threatening?
Shari Boone
> 1MAN4ALL wrote:
>
>>Edmond Wollmann - The Arthurian One wrote:
>
>
>>>Why didn't "God" intervene and keep him from getting ill in the
>
> first
>
>>>place?
>
>
>>Sickness and death are subject to laws of nature, which were
>>established by God at the time the world was created, and they apply
>>equitably to all. Neither piousness nor sinfulness by itself creates
>
> an
>
>>obligation for God to alter these laws.
>
>
> The laws of nature are set, hhhmmm...then why not just study nature?
> Skip the middleman?
Your post has nothing to do with astrology. Please stop POSTING OFF
TOPIC, you fucking hypocrite.
Complaints sent.
>
wollma...@spam.free
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Tony P.
stpeters...@onearth.com says...
> Catholics Pray for Pope's Recovery
>
>
> WADOWICE, Poland - In big cities and quiet villages, Roman Catholics
> around the world stopped Thursday to pray for Pope John Paul II as
> word spread that he had again been rushed to the hospital with
> flu-like symptoms and breathing difficulties.
My prayer is that he and any of the other assholes in the Cathlic
hierarchy die a horrible, painful death and never see the face of their
God.
Flash Bazbo
> 1MAN4ALL wrote:
>
>>Edmond Wollmann - The Arthurian One wrote:
>
>
>>>Why didn't "God" intervene and keep him from getting ill in the
>
> first
>
>>>place?
>
>
>>Sickness and death are subject to laws of nature, which were
>>established by God at the time the world was created, and they apply
>>equitably to all. Neither piousness nor sinfulness by itself creates
>
> an
>
>>obligation for God to alter these laws.
>
>
> The laws of nature are set, hhhmmm...then why not just study nature?
> Skip the middleman?
> Then why was the pope himself saying that he believed that God
> intervened when he was shot so that the bullet did not hit any vital
> organs? Again, the question would be why even believe in such non-sense
> if it has no effect whatever anyway? Why didn't god stop the shooter
> first?
This same question can be asked of your own peculiar brand of mysticism.
Can you point to even one measurable physical manifestation attributable
to your astrological hokum? I thought not. Yet your irrational zeal
for and rabid evangelism of an unverifiable belief system surpasses even
that of those "God Hates Fags" idiots.
So where do you get the chutzpa to ridicule the faith of others?
>
>
>>>Amazing what gullibility is rampant on the planet.
>
>
>>You are part of it:-)
>
>
> I see, because I don't believe in fairy tales about some after life?
You believe a fairy tale about concurrent realities.
If
> there is an omnipotent creator, IT (not he or she) has an infinite
> amount of space, time and far larger and more complex issues that would
> preoccupy it (if such a notion is even feasible) than even giving a
> second glance to whatever is going on on this insignificant planet, in
> an insignificant solar system on the outskirts of this insignificant
> galaxy in which we find ourselves.
But by your philosophy the universe exists to reflect aspects of the
human psyche. Which is it? Are we an insiginificant infestation
wallowing in a galactic backwater or are we an apex species capable of
creating universal realities?
>
> "Everybody needs his memories. They keep the wolf of insignificance
> from the door." Saul Bellow
>
> Replace memories with religion and there you have it.
"No one ever went broke underestimating the intelligence of the American
people." H.L. Mencken
Replace "No one ever" with "Bashar never" and "the American people" with
"ed" and you will have a universal truth.
>
> "Anyone who thinks they're important is usually just a pompous moron
> who can't deal with his or her own pathetic insignificance and the fact
> that what they do is meaningless and inconsequential..." William Thomas
"I am the richest, most successful person on the planet!
Yeeeeeehaaaaaw!!!"
- Edmond Wollmann - The Arthurian One
- Edmond Wollmann - The Pleiadian One
- E. Wollmann - The Lofty One
- The Coming One
- The Gatekeeper Edmond Wollmann
- Edmond - The One Who Rules
- Wollmann - The Eyes of Arcturus
- E.H. Wollmann - The Arcturian One
SheBlewHimDidYouBlowHim
to interfere with GOD's DIVINE PLAN.
wollma...@spam.free
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fora...@hotmail.com
Perhaps you didn't understand. God 'can' alter His own laws; but
He doesn't do it ONLY because of somebody's piousness or
sinfulness. If your prayer coincides with God's will-the higher
purpose for which this world was created-it would be granted; if it
doesn't, no matter how much you pray, it won't be.
What is prayer, anyway? Prayer, from an Islamic perspective, means
putting trust. When you are praying for somebody, you are in fact
praying for your own soul; the actual beneficiary of that prayer is
you! By praying for goodness, you become good. By making a plea and
having reassurance that it is heard, you are handing over your deepest
fears and concerns to a Higher Power. As the Quran says, "Those who
believe and whose hearts are set at rest by the remembrance of God; now
surely by God's remembrance are the hearts set at rest."
Dan Baldwin
>
>
> What is prayer, anyway? Prayer, from an Islamic perspective, means
> putting trust.
Prayer, from a rational perspective, is simply another form of spell
casting (i.e. a waste of time).
Edmond Wollmann
> > Edmond Wollmann - The Arthurian One wrote:
> > > Why didn't "God" intervene and keep him from getting ill in the
> first
> > > place?
> > Sickness and death are subject to laws of nature, which were
> > established by God at the time the world was created, and they apply
> > equitably to all. Neither piousness nor sinfulness by itself creates
> an
> > obligation for God to alter these laws.
> The laws of nature are set, hhhmmm...then why not just study nature?
> Skip the middleman?
> Then why was the pope himself saying that he believed that God
> intervened when he was shot so that the bullet did not hit any vital
> organs? Again, the question would be why even believe in such non-sense
> if it has no effect whatever anyway? Why didn't god stop the shooter
> first?
> > > Amazing what gullibility is rampant on the planet.
> > You are part of it:-)
Why? Because I choose not to waste my time praying for something that
has for millenia proven itself untenable?
Instead, I choose to use critical thinking skills and effort--two things
I am sure if there is a creator, would be quite disgruntled with me for
not using after it made the effort itself to give them to me to use
precisely for such things as we are discussing.
--
Edmond H. Wollmann P.M.A.F.A.
© 2005 Altair Publications, SAN 299-5603
Astrological Consulting http://www.astroconsulting.com/
Artworks http://www.astroconsulting.com/personal/
Edmond Wollmann
> Anonymous wrote:
> > "1MAN4ALL" <fora...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> > news:1109275433.6...@l41g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
> > > Edmond Wollmann - The Arthurian One wrote:
> > > > Why didn't "God" intervene and keep him from getting ill in the
> first
> > > > place?
> > > Sickness and death are subject to laws of nature, which were
> > > established by God at the time the world was created, and they
> apply
> > > equitably to all. Neither piousness nor sinfulness by itself
> creates an
> > > obligation for God to alter these laws.
> > If so, why one should pray for Pope's recovery ? Why can't nature to
> take
> > its own course.
> Perhaps you didn't understand. God 'can' alter His own laws; but
> He doesn't do it ONLY because of somebody's piousness or
> sinfulness. If your prayer coincides with God's will-the higher
> purpose for which this world was created-it would be granted; if it
> doesn't, no matter how much you pray, it won't be.
Then what's the point? He will do whatever he wishes anyway! This is
pure rationalization:
Whatever happens is God's will, if it isn't it was anyway!
This is DANGEROUS, because if people act on this non-sense (as I
observed in the case of a Christian Scientist who actually went to her
death and cut short her life simply because she refused to face the
reality of her situation) then people could resign themselves to
someones death simply from the infection that set in from a simple wound
rather than ACTING on it with modern medicine and allowing nature to be
OVERRULED.
Which man has the ability to do. Now, what creator would give man such
an ability and then chastise him for USING it??
> What is prayer, anyway? Prayer, from an Islamic perspective, means
> putting trust. When you are praying for somebody, you are in fact
> praying for your own soul; the actual beneficiary of that prayer is
> you! By praying for goodness, you become good. By making a plea and
> having reassurance that it is heard, you are handing over your deepest
> fears and concerns to a Higher Power. As the Quran says, "Those who
> believe and whose hearts are set at rest by the remembrance of God; now
> surely by God's remembrance are the hearts set at rest."
Then why not then just act with conviction in all that you do, skip the
middleman, POPE, prayer, and ritual and be far more efficient in one's
life?
"We know the whole idea of how we feel in that sense.
We trust ourselves as aspects of the infinite.
Therefore we interact spontaneously, without necessarily having to
"plan" anything, without having to "make sure" everything will go "as
planned,"...
... we do not need the "insurance" of something to "fall back" on should
what we go for "fail."
All of these ideas are doubts and mistrusts of the true
unconditionalness of our love." Bashar, "Southern Exposure"
DOUBT is the reason for the religion folks.
--
Edmond H. Wollmann P.M.A.F.A.
© 2005 Altair Publications, SAN 299-5603
Astrological Consulting http://www.astroconsulting.com/
Artworks http://www.astroconsulting.com/personal/
Edmond Wollmann
> Edmond H. Wollmann The Pleiadian One! wrote:
> > 1MAN4ALL wrote:
> >>Edmond Wollmann - The Arthurian One wrote:
> >>>Why didn't "God" intervene and keep him from getting ill in the
> > first
> >>>place?
> >>Sickness and death are subject to laws of nature, which were
> >>established by God at the time the world was created, and they apply
> >>equitably to all. Neither piousness nor sinfulness by itself creates
> > an
> >>obligation for God to alter these laws.
The why pray?
> > The laws of nature are set, hhhmmm...then why not just study nature?
> > Skip the middleman?
> > Then why was the pope himself saying that he believed that God
> > intervened when he was shot so that the bullet did not hit any vital
> > organs? Again, the question would be why even believe in such non-sense
> > if it has no effect whatever anyway? Why didn't god stop the shooter
> > first?
> This same question can be asked of your own peculiar brand of mysticism.
> Can you point to even one measurable physical manifestation attributable
> to your astrological hokum?
Yes, self-understanding leads to changed perceptions of one's self and
place within the world, this leads to altered will application to
improve the quality of life, which leads to a different reality more
preferable to the individual or society in question.
The charts for these clients can be seen at my website for those skilled
enough to follow along in the delineation.
http://www.astroconsulting.com/FAQs/info.htm
Written 8/86
Saturn Opposition Saturn; View To Reality
© 2005 Edmond H. Wollmann P.M.A.F.A. /Altair Publications
As astrologers we seek to corroborate human behavior and events to
astrological patterns. As human beings experiencing developmental
growth, we seek justification for anxiety and negative experience.
The conscious mind seeks to clarify and justify identity importance.
This conscious focus complicates awareness of necessary developmental
growth within time. The child does not consciously choose responsible
action. Responsibility is the ability to respond to the environment
(it's reality creation).
This is learned (through conscious mind function). The child (conscious
identity, Mars) seeks to prove it's ego importance. The parental
structure is the identity's first arena of reality testing. Ego
projection (first house) and separation instincts are checked or
dominated (socialized) by the external control of the parents (usually
the father, the tenth house).This is the basis for reality creation,
i.e. the identity seeks to establish itself as an individual (first
house) then meets with three dimensional controls (tenth house) which in
turn forms a perception about reality as a belief that structures the
subconscious inner self (e-motional identity establishment). This belief
patterning is then reflected through attempts to be socially accepted,
and possibly projection (seventh house), in interaction through others.
If the identity forms the belief about this projection-that
reinforcement of the identity will be difficult i.e. through perceived
parental indifference, overcompensation must ensue. Overcompensation
itself implies a defense against the self's perceived condition. Whether
tension (opposition=awareness, square=fulfillment) is welcomed or
resisted, determines the level of developmental resolution and /or
fulfillment. The process continues to repeat (spiraling upward or
downward) and is meant to accelerate to greater levels of self awareness
as to how developmental experience has been created by the self's
definitions and beliefs about reality.
Saturn, Capricorn, and the tenth house represent full externalization
in three dimensional reality. The identity's cumulative attempts to
store belief systems that maintain security towards identity e-motional
establishment (the reaction point of the fourth house). Saturn tests
your ability to consciously perceive what your beliefs about reality
actualize and create. Trines to Saturn; the successful integration of
long term attitudinal belief development in pragmatic terms, squares
reflect a need to develop realism (since realism is relative third
density or dimension is what is meant here), and oppositions; a need to
externalize and test the realism or physical manifestation of the planet
opposed.
We must realize that parental conflict is a reflection of existing
belief patterning and momentums. The horoscope exists before parental
interaction at the physical level. The parents and the environment act
as catalysts for belief system developmental tension.
Saturn reflects the externalization of beliefs when entering into
quadrature or conjunction to a planet, to itself, or into other
developmental networks (T-square, Grand cross etc.). The belief system
in question is then challenged by three dimensional confrontation. It is
easy to construct or invent something mentally, however when a model is
physicalized, more often than not, gears do not mesh as imagined. In the
belief system development described above (1st, 4th, 7th and 10th) the
conscious mind may not perceive experiences as the resultant effect of
attempts at belief system reinforcement (to maintain sameness) that are
created by the identity and reflected through the environment. The only
boundaries are the ones imposed by the self determined by awareness. As
counselors we must maintain the perspective that the horoscope only
reflects identity, and the environment reflects
the identity's adjustment through and in development. "Losses" or
"limitations" are the cumulative effects of negative belief system
patterning and the conscious experience of same. We create our own
reality-LITERALLY. Saturn reflects that reality back to us either as a
positive strategic effectiveness of need fulfillment and identity
actualization ("success"=trine) or as a lack of realistic appraisal
(gears that don't mesh) of the strategy necessary for identity
manifestation and externalization ("limitations"=square opposition).
Saturn by sign and house will indicate where overcompensation must
occur as a response to the belief of incompetency in that realm (or
fear, which is the same thing). This life function is so crystallized in
belief patterning that client confirmation is rarely difficult
(depending on aspects, modes etc.). In turn the aspect networks will
suggest how developmentally tense the perceived reality is. However,
Saturn in one house emphasis (Angular, Succeedant, Cadent) implies
tension by reaction in the correlating mode. Saturn in five (difficulty
giving love) implies Saturn in two (low self worth or esteem). Others
opinions (9th) affects thinking (3rd) and perspective (6th and 12th).
Self projection confidence (1st) is dependent upon feelings of emotional
security (4th), and vice-versa.
Connecting belief systems and physical manifestation takes skilled
corroboration from the astrologer to past Saturn quadratures and
aspects, as well as a thorough knowledge of the corresponding rulerships
of signs and planets to physical structures of the body. High blood
pressure can be linked to Mars in Leo , Moon opposition Mars, and Mars
opposition Uranus etc., where it apparent that temperament and a belief
in powerlessness is high. Relating these insights to the client is
usually not necessary, however engaging in dialogue allows us to detect
temperamental situations, and reflect this knowledge back to the client
so that a recognition of the developmental nature of the energy can
enhance self awareness. Not welcoming tension is where all dis-ease
arises from. For most clients, physical events such as "accidents" are
not as easily seen as a creation of unconscious beliefs as are
relationship difficulties. This is because of our strict training to
believe that physical reality exists outside of us.
In philosophical terms, life is an awareness lesson for the conscious
self in the meeting of itself. When the student is ready, the
developmental experience appears, reflected in planetary structure and
signature throughout our development in time. The horoscope (the planets
,signs, galaxy) does not compel, impel, influence or energize. It
reflects the movement and momentum of our will, beliefs, energy and
development, just as we reflect it as a small part of the "All That Is"
whole. The planets are within, and the transits of the planets reflect
at what times these apparently external concepts are physically
manifested. Christ said "The Kingdom of Heaven is within you". Our
actions are just re-actions to the prescription by the inner self
towards the education of the conscious mind, of it's role, narrowness,
and focus on the illusion of three dimensional reality.
The following examples are of typical cliental from this writer's
files. Analysis begins with psychodynamic interpretation, and ends with
belief system physical confirmation. The outside wheel represents the
transits of the planets at the first revolution of transitting Saturn
Opposition natal Saturn. This is the first externalization of implied
overcompensation inherent in the natal premise and sets the tone for
future Saturn quadratures in the externalization of our beliefs about
reality. These methods are used for every client.
Horoscope #1 1/24/51 10:33 am 117w03-32n46 Sat opp Sat 3/21/67
On the following page is the horoscope of a female, age 35, beautiful,
and at the time of consultation, overweight. Upon arrival she presented
a very meek demeanor (Mars in Pisces rules 1, Saturn in Libra). Her
presentation did not accurately reflect the remainder of the horoscope
however. The Sun/Moon blend implies an especially strong conflict
between the intellect and the emotions, giving love (creative extension
Moon in 5 in Leo, Sun rules 5), the identity's sense of emotional
security (Moon rules 4) and the alteration of perspective through deep
emotional value exchange (Moon conjunct Pluto, Pluto rules 8). Self
worth is under awareness tension in relationships and undermines
emotional security (Venus opposition the Moon from 5 to 11. Venus rules
2 and 7, the Moon rules 4). A strong analytical discernment of belief
structure, is made at a glance.
Saturn is in Libra in the 6th house and is retrograde. Overcompensatory
cooperation and inferiority feelings about the life direction that
relationships may take (Saturn rules the 10th). Saturn in Libra implies
a fear of not being socially accepted, a need to acquiesce. The fears of
not being accepted, allow the individual to vacillate between agreement
and rejection. Alternating resentment for being controlled (allowing
themselves to be), followed by acquiescence, resentment, acquiescence,
etc.. Just understanding the Saturn placement allows us a very good
understanding of a very powerful belief momentum. Aspects determine how
developmentally tense the structure is. Saturn forms the base of a
T-square between it and the Mercury/Uranus opposition in Cadent houses.
An information (3rd and 9th)/perspective (6th and 12th)crisis,(Cadent,
Mercury rules 6 and 3) about love received and hopes for the future
(Uranus rules 11). The 5th and 11th emphasis implies sexual concerns. We
know that self worth is under tension and giving love can be
difficult-and yet in this case powerful creative and sexual drives are
evident (Moon conjunct Pluto in Leo in 5). Orgasm was not experienced
during intercourse, but only through fantasy during masturbation. The
Pisces Mars ruling the ascendent complicates the Saturn in Libra by
adding a need for sensitivity and lessens aggression. Venus (the
dispositor of Saturn) is in awareness tension with the Moon/Pluto
conjunction. Temperamental thinking (Mercury opposition Uranus) works
against practical application and communication, making fantasy (Venus
trine Neptune) a less threatening solution. A self isolation pattern
that lasted 19 years.
This experience exists as a belief about reality in probability form at
birth as reflected by our deductions thus far. The transits at the first
Saturn opposed Saturn reflect this probability manifestation powerfully.
Transiting Saturn ruling the tenth (the father) completes a grand cross
with the natal Saturn, Mercury, and Uranus. Transiting Venus squares
the natal Sun; an identity conflict (1st house) about the life direction
(10th house) of love given and creative extension (Sun rules 5). Transit
Mars opposes transit Venus and squares natal Sun. Tremendous
identity/relationship conflict. Venus rules 7, Mars rules 1! Transiting
Moon in four opposes the natal Sun and completes a grand cross from the
fourth house (emotional security). Transiting Neptune also squares the
natal Pluto/Moon opposed Venus and rules 12. The law of momentum flow
continues to reinforce initial deductions, the conclusions are not
difficult.
Client confirmation; During this period this sixteen year old became
pregnant (Sun rules 5, Saturn opposed Saturn from 6 to 12) by her high
school sweetheart whom she admittedly was not in love with at the time.
She decided to have the child (5th) under feelings of guilt (Saturn in
Libra, self worth concerns) and extreme pressure from the father
(Saturn, the 10th). This life of repressed identity and creativity
endured until Saturn returned to the birth position 15 years later, when
she divorced went back to her music and art interests, and concentrated
on self-development. She lost a significant amount of weight on her new
diet (the cessation of "weighting").
The tensions discussed in the natal analysis became physically
externalized through this period of unfulfilling relationship. A harsh
lesson in the manifestation of relationship fears (uz) verses
individuality development (q,i-bg), within time (u).
Horoscope #2 11/30/37 2:18 am 087w39 41n52 Sat opp Sat 11/2/50
This horoscope is that of a male, age 49 at the time of consultation.
Saturn, the ruler of the 4th house (the establishment of the identity)
is in a T-square configuration, opposition Neptune and square Mercury
from the 6th in Pisces. Again Saturn in the 6th implies overcompensatory
discrimination in preparation for relationship (the 6th is the 12th of
the 7th). Saturn in Pisces reflects fears of self-introspection and a
belief that the identity may be severely misunderstood and have to
suffer to gain insight. Under developmental tension this self pity may
be magnified. Saturn opposed Neptune (the dispositor of Saturn) and in
square to Mercury in Sagittarius, reflects a dissolving, confusing, and
impressionable (Neptune) rationalizing and blurry (Mercury in
Sagittarius square Saturn) thinking and perspective (3rd, 6th, 9th, 12th
houses, with Mercury ruling two of them). Jupiter, the Sun sign ruler
and dispositor of Mercury opposes Pluto, the ruler of 2. Self worth
concerns do not allow for clear thinking. Cooperation will be difficult.
Saturn completes a grand trine with Pluto (10), and Venus (2) creating
an emotional closed circuit defense against the perceived threat to
value interaction (Pluto rules 2, and Venus rules 8). The early
environment threatened the identity's emotional security and
establishment (Saturn rules 4). A belief about reality that will be
reflected through the early environment and parental structure. The Moon
(mother) is in Scorpio. The reigning need for emotional self worth
significance (2nd), implies a severe deprivation of same. The Moon
opposes Uranus and squares Mars, with Uranus disposing of Mars. The need
for individuality recognition (Uranus) tries to prove this uniqueness by
being different (Aquarius).
Relationships (the 7th, ruled by Mars) would need to be different and
difficult to maintain (Uranus in 7), and giving love would threaten
emotional security (Moon) and individuality (Uranus).
The impact and externalization crisis as shown by transiting Saturn
opposed natal Saturn at age thirteen is the first of three oppositions.
Saturn retrograded and again opposed Saturn, turned direct, and opposed
it a final time. This process occurs often and signifies a complex
belief structure with accompanying issues, not easily resolved. Space
limits a discourse on this subject, and we will deal with the most
important for the purpose of this example, the initial opposition.
At first glance, we see Saturn opposed Saturn from the 12th square
transiting Mars in 3 conjunct natal Mercury. The informational
perspective complex discussed in natal delineation, is being profoundly
challenged through relationships (Mars ruling 7) possibly involving
brothers and sisters (3rd house). The natal Moon, Uranus, Mars T-square
is being triggered by transit Venus, Sun, Mercury (self worth
references, the mother). The transiting Pluto opposition transiting
Jupiter from 11 to 5, completes a T-square with natal Venus (self worth,
love given and received).
The prudent question to the client about these
issues of self worth with the mother at this time, prompted immediate
discourse on the mother's alcoholism (Neptune) and violence (Mars) at
this time. The beatings and unwarranted abuse stemmed from her
favoritism of his brother and distaste for him (3rd house references).
He couldn't do anything right. This belief manifested in his
relationships with women until one year before this consultation, during
which all of his relationships were homosexual. His reason for
consultation was tension over his first close female relationship
(Saturn transiting Venus) during the past year and the probability of
break up based on his tremendous fear of being taken advantage of (Moon
in Scorpio, 2nd house reference, Grand trine in Water signs) and not
being valued over others in the relationship. His response was to go
back to living alone with his own interests (Grand trine in Water,
Mercury, Neptune, Saturn T-square) as women would just never be
sensitive and understanding enough (Saturn in Pisces) and disrupt his
security (Saturn ruling 4). The challenge is to build self worth and
analytical insight through successful relationships with trust. We are
not responsible for people-only responsible to them, to be as much as we
can be with integrity.
Horoscope #3 8/31/57 9:50 am cdt 087w39 41n52 Sat opp Sat 5/15/72
This chart is that of a female, 22 years of age at consultation. Self
worth issues (2nd house) are obviously very problematic. The Sun, Mars
and Pluto in 11 (love received, future speculation) are all squaring the
Moon/Saturn conjunction. Saturn in 2 implies a feeling of low self worth
and with the Moon and Saturn in Sagittarius (the greatest need and fear)
a strong belief that the opinions and intellect will not be respected.
The Moon and Saturn both rule the parental axis (4th and 10th)-a crisis
in personal worth reflected through parental relationship. Saturn
squares the Sun ruler of 11 (love received), Pluto ruler of the 2nd
(self worth), Mars ruler of the 7th (relationship reflection), and is
the ruler of the 4th (identity establishment and emotional security).
The Moon squares the same planets. Venus in 12 in Libra, indicates a
very refined and isolated sense of beauty and relationship needs. There
are no oppositions, and all of the planets are grouped on the eastern
hemisphere of the chart, to defend the sensitivity of the self
projection and identity (the ascendent). Externalization would be
difficult. Neptune in 1 confirms idealism and identity sacrifice. A loss
of focus and direction. Mars square Saturn implies poor judgement
(analytical discernment) in clarifying (Mars in Virgo) the kind of love
needed for identity establishment and self worth reinforcement (Saturn
in 2, ruler of 4) in relationships (Mars rules 7). Energy for acclaim
and love, clashes with a feeling of being undeserving.
The transits at transit Saturn opposition Saturn at age 15, graphically
illustrates the probability of belief manifestation promised in the
natal chart. Transiting Saturn, ruler of 4 is in 8 and squares the natal
Sun and opposes natal Saturn. Self worth belief systems would be
powerfully externalized (opposition=awareness) through love received by
others (Sun in 11). Transiting Sun is opposed the natal Moon and square
natal Pluto.
How will this identity/worth tension be manifested into reality? Transit
Uranus (the avant guard, and awakener) is exactly conjunct the private
idealism Venus in 12 and rules 5. The refined, idealistic, and private
sense of beauty (Venus) was shocked behind the scenes (Uranus and 12)
triggering self worth/identity concerns through the parental structure
(Saturn and Moon ruling the parental axis of 4/10). She was raped by her
stepfather on this date. This incident was known only by her and the
stepfather and now myself. She reported that intercourse continued for
several years. There was great anxiety and self worth conflicts and
feared that her mother knew (Moon aspects). She came for the
consultation originally to get reinforcement for her decision to marry
her fiance, and left deciding that she probably wasn't ready.
The challenge is to develop a healthy sense of self worth through self
directed fulfillment, and a recognition that every individual is as
powerful as he or she needs to be to create whatever they desire to
create in their reality, without having to hurt themselves or anyone
else in order to create it.
It is very striking, the photograph of developmental challenge
signified by transiting Saturn opposed natal Saturn. Not only can it
indicate probable events connected to an individual's
beliefs/perceptions about reality, but can confirm the call to
fulfillment at the Saturn return.
They are not always this dramatic. Many individuals choose not to
remember them, so confirmation may be difficult.
It is obvious to this writer that restructuring the conscious and
subconscious belief systems through an analytically discerning awareness
of self-which is operationally demonstrable through a skilled
delineation of an accurate horoscope-is the path to restructuring
externalized physical reality. The point of power is always in the
present. Mind and matter are the same thing! Plato said "The purpose of
living, is to discover the purpose of living". When this level of
perspective and awareness are reached, fate certainly becomes
unrecognized choice.
Edmond H. Wollmann P.M.A.F.A.
© 2005 Altair Publications, SAN 299-5603
Astrological Consulting http://www.astroconsulting.com/
Artworks http://www.astroconsulting.com/personal/
Daedalus
<arctur...@earthlink.net>, wrote:
>Flash Bazbo wrote:
>> Edmond H. Wollmann The Pleiadian One! wrote:
>> > 1MAN4ALL wrote:
>> >>Edmond Wollmann - The Arthurian One wrote:
>> >>>Why didn't "God" intervene and keep him from getting ill in the
>> > first
>> >>>place?
>
>> >>Sickness and death are subject to laws of nature, which were
>> >>established by God at the time the world was created, and they apply
>> >>equitably to all. Neither piousness nor sinfulness by itself creates
>> > an
>> >>obligation for God to alter these laws.
>
>The why pray?
>
Because it's no less reliable than astrological silliness?
>> > The laws of nature are set, hhhmmm...then why not just study nature?
>> > Skip the middleman?
>> > Then why was the pope himself saying that he believed that God
>> > intervened when he was shot so that the bullet did not hit any vital
>> > organs? Again, the question would be why even believe in such non-sense
>> > if it has no effect whatever anyway? Why didn't god stop the shooter
>> > first?
>
>> This same question can be asked of your own peculiar brand of mysticism.
>
>> Can you point to even one measurable physical manifestation attributable
>> to your astrological hokum?
>
>Yes, self-understanding leads to changed perceptions of one's self and
>place within the world, this leads to altered will application
Perception, thought and will are not physical things, dummy. You
failed again.
> to
>improve the quality of life, which leads to a different reality more
>preferable to the individual or society in question.
>
If this is true why can't you make yourself successful?
<spam snipped>
Jade
Dan Baldwin
>
> Edmond H. Wollmann The Pleiadian One! wrote:
> > 1MAN4ALL wrote:
> > > Edmond Wollmann - The Arthurian One wrote:
> > > > Why didn't "God" intervene and keep him from getting ill in the
> > first
> > > > place?
>
> > > Sickness and death are subject to laws of nature, which were
> > > established by God at the time the world was created, and they apply
> > > equitably to all. Neither piousness nor sinfulness by itself creates
> > an
> > > obligation for God to alter these laws.
>
> > The laws of nature are set, hhhmmm...then why not just study nature?
> > Skip the middleman?
> > Then why was the pope himself saying that he believed that God
> > intervened when he was shot so that the bullet did not hit any vital
> > organs? Again, the question would be why even believe in such non-sense
> > if it has no effect whatever anyway? Why didn't god stop the shooter
> > first?
>
> > > > Amazing what gullibility is rampant on the planet.
>
> > > You are part of it:-)
>
> Why?
Because you are a lying, cowardly, abusive, deluded, plagiarizing,
misogynist, bilious convicted criminal who ought to have been a blow
job.
HTH. HAND.
Dan Baldwin
>
Yet another metric assload of canned screed.
I thought you didn't have time to reply to "spinics", you fucking liar.
Dan Baldwin
>
>
> Then what's the point?
There is none, so why don't you just get on with sucking on the end of a
shotgun and making the world a much brighter place by leaving it, you
diseased old prick? Just please line the walls of the room with plastic
bags out of consideration for the cleaning staff.
The Softy One: Edmond H. Wollmann
> fora...@hotmail.com wrote:
>
>>Anonymous wrote:
>>
>>>"1MAN4ALL" <fora...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>>>news:1109275433.6...@l41g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
>>>
>>>>Edmond Wollmann - The Arthurian One wrote:
>
>
>>>>>Why didn't "God" intervene and keep him from getting ill in the
>>
>>first
>>
>>>>>place?
>
>
>>>>Sickness and death are subject to laws of nature, which were
>>>>established by God at the time the world was created, and they
>>
>>apply
>>
>>>>equitably to all. Neither piousness nor sinfulness by itself
>>
>>creates an
>>
>>>>obligation for God to alter these laws.
>
>
>>>If so, why one should pray for Pope's recovery ? Why can't nature to
>>
>>take
>>
>>>its own course.
>
>
>
>>Perhaps you didn't understand. God 'can' alter His own laws; but
>>He doesn't do it ONLY because of somebody's piousness or
>>sinfulness. If your prayer coincides with God's will-the higher
>>purpose for which this world was created-it would be granted; if it
>>doesn't, no matter how much you pray, it won't be.
>
>
> Then what's the point?
There is no point.
Did you have any astrology to discuss, abuser?
The Softy One: Edmond H. Wollmann
>>>>Amazing what gullibility is rampant on the planet.
>
>
>
>>>You are part of it:-)
>
>
> Why?
Because you make a living by feeding bullshit to gullible people.
The Softy One: Edmond H. Wollmann
> Flash Bazbo wrote:
>
>>Edmond H. Wollmann The Pleiadian One! wrote:
>>
>>>1MAN4ALL wrote:
>>>
>>>>Edmond Wollmann - The Arthurian One wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>Why didn't "God" intervene and keep him from getting ill in the
>>>
>>>first
>>>
>>>>>place?
>
>
>>>>Sickness and death are subject to laws of nature, which were
>>>>established by God at the time the world was created, and they apply
>>>>equitably to all. Neither piousness nor sinfulness by itself creates
>>>
>>>an
>>>
>>>>obligation for God to alter these laws.
>
>
> The why pray?
Your post has naught to do with alt.astrology. Please refrain from
making off-topic posts, abuser.
fora...@hotmail.com
Edmond Wollmann wrote:
> > Perhaps you didn't understand. God 'can' alter His own laws; but
> > He doesn't do it ONLY because of somebody's piousness or
> > sinfulness. If your prayer coincides with God's will-the higher
> > purpose for which this world was created-it would be granted; if it
> > doesn't, no matter how much you pray, it won't be.
>
> Then what's the point? He will do whatever he wishes anyway! This is
> pure rationalization:
> Whatever happens is God's will, if it isn't it was anyway!
You have a reading comprehension problem. Concentrate on the word
"ONLY."
> This is DANGEROUS, because if people act on this non-sense (as I
> observed in the case of a Christian Scientist who actually went to
her
> death and cut short her life simply because she refused to face the
> reality of her situation) then people could resign themselves to
> someones death simply from the infection that set in from a simple
wound
> rather than ACTING on it with modern medicine and allowing nature to
be
> OVERRULED.
In my religion, Islam, God has said that He "helps those who help
themselves." God never said, let nature take its course and do
nothing. What you are referring to is the issue of predestination which
I would be more than happy to discuss in another thread. Tell you what,
do a Google Groups search and find all my posts relating to that
subject.
> Which man has the ability to do. Now, what creator would give man
such
> an ability and then chastise him for USING it??
You are confusing "ability" with "freedom."
> > What is prayer, anyway? Prayer, from an Islamic perspective, means
> > putting trust. When you are praying for somebody, you are in fact
> > praying for your own soul; the actual beneficiary of that prayer is
> > you! By praying for goodness, you become good. By making a plea and
> > having reassurance that it is heard, you are handing over your
deepest
> > fears and concerns to a Higher Power. As the Quran says, "Those who
> > believe and whose hearts are set at rest by the remembrance of God;
now
> > surely by God's remembrance are the hearts set at rest."
>
> Then why not then just act with conviction in all that you do, skip
the
> middleman, POPE, prayer, and ritual and be far more efficient in
one's
> life?
What middleman? If for the sake of this argument it is assumed that God
is the author of laws of nature, He is the Principal. You are not being
very logical or coherent.
> "We know the whole idea of how we feel in that sense.
> We trust ourselves as aspects of the infinite.
> Therefore we interact spontaneously, without necessarily having to
> "plan" anything, without having to "make sure" everything will go "as
> planned,"...
> ... we do not need the "insurance" of something to "fall back" on
should
> what we go for "fail."
> All of these ideas are doubts and mistrusts of the true
> unconditionalness of our love." Bashar, "Southern Exposure"
>
> DOUBT is the reason for the religion folks.
You lost me here. A word of advice: You need to be clear in what you
are trying to convey. Pulling stuff from here and there, most of which
is irrelevant, is not going to help you.
The Eyes of a Crybaby: Edmond H. Wollmann
Thank you for gently chastising Ed. Now get ready for him to go
ballistic and start insulting you.
Cujo DeSockpuppet
news:421F63...@earthlink.net:
> fora...@hotmail.com wrote:
>> Anonymous wrote:
>> > "1MAN4ALL" <fora...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>> > news:1109275433.6...@l41g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
>> > > Edmond Wollmann - The Arthurian One wrote:
>
>> > > > Why didn't "God" intervene and keep him from getting ill in the
>> first
>> > > > place?
>
>> > > Sickness and death are subject to laws of nature, which were
>> > > established by God at the time the world was created, and they
>> apply
>> > > equitably to all. Neither piousness nor sinfulness by itself
>> creates an
>> > > obligation for God to alter these laws.
>
>> > If so, why one should pray for Pope's recovery ? Why can't nature
>> > to
>> take
>> > its own course.
>
>> Perhaps you didn't understand. God 'can' alter His own laws; but
>> He doesn't do it ONLY because of somebody's piousness or
>> sinfulness. If your prayer coincides with God's will-the higher
>> purpose for which this world was created-it would be granted; if it
>> doesn't, no matter how much you pray, it won't be.
>
> Then what's the point?
I've been asking you about your point for years now, kook.
--
Cujo - The Official Overseer of Kooks and Trolls in
dfw.*, alt.paranormal, alt.astrology and alt.astrology.metapsych.
Winner of the 8/2000 & 2/2003 HL&S award. Hail Petitmorte!
Colonel of the Fanatic Legion. FL# 555-PLNTY Motto: ABUNDANCE!.
Charter Member - Digital Brownshirts and Library Gestapo.
"Get help sir, you are seriously ill. What a shame, the mentally
disturbed are now the only thing posting on usenet, too bad they can't
recognize real counselors like me and be helped." - Eddieeee, still
shilling illegal services.
Cujo DeSockpuppet
> Edmond H. Wollmann The Pleiadian One! wrote:
>> 1MAN4ALL wrote:
>> > Edmond Wollmann - The Arthurian One wrote:
>> > > Why didn't "God" intervene and keep him from getting ill in the
>> first
>> > > place?
>
>> > Sickness and death are subject to laws of nature, which were
>> > established by God at the time the world was created, and they
>> > apply equitably to all. Neither piousness nor sinfulness by itself
>> > creates
>> an
>> > obligation for God to alter these laws.
>
>> The laws of nature are set, hhhmmm...then why not just study nature?
>> Skip the middleman?
>> Then why was the pope himself saying that he believed that God
>> intervened when he was shot so that the bullet did not hit any vital
>> organs? Again, the question would be why even believe in such
>> non-sense if it has no effect whatever anyway? Why didn't god stop
>> the shooter first?
>
>> > > Amazing what gullibility is rampant on the planet.
>
>> > You are part of it:-)
>
> Why? Because I choose not to waste my time praying for something that
> has for millenia proven itself untenable?
No, because you pay some fraud like "Bashar" money for a load of
horseshit and try to get the money back by selling that swill to people
smart enough to know it's crap.
--
Cujo - The Official Overseer of Kooks and Trolls in
dfw.*, alt.paranormal, alt.astrology and alt.astrology.metapsych.
Winner of the 8/2000 & 2/2003 HL&S award. Hail Petitmorte!
Colonel of the Fanatic Legion. FL# 555-PLNTY Motto: ABUNDANCE!.
Charter Member - Digital Brownshirts and Library Gestapo.
"Take some vitamins, get some excercise [sic], and try to build up
your perceptions, critical thinking and powers of observation. Then
come back and play with us big boys." - Ed on a delusional power trip.
Cujo DeSockpuppet
> Flash Bazbo wrote:
>> Edmond H. Wollmann The Pleiadian One! wrote:
>> > 1MAN4ALL wrote:
>> >>Edmond Wollmann - The Arthurian One wrote:
>> >>>Why didn't "God" intervene and keep him from getting ill in the
>> > first
>> >>>place?
>
>> >>Sickness and death are subject to laws of nature, which were
>> >>established by God at the time the world was created, and they
>> >>apply equitably to all. Neither piousness nor sinfulness by itself
>> >>creates
>> > an
>> >>obligation for God to alter these laws.
>
> The why pray?
Incoherence noted, kook.
>> > The laws of nature are set, hhhmmm...then why not just study
>> > nature? Skip the middleman?
>> > Then why was the pope himself saying that he believed that God
>> > intervened when he was shot so that the bullet did not hit any
>> > vital organs? Again, the question would be why even believe in such
>> > non-sense if it has no effect whatever anyway? Why didn't god stop
>> > the shooter first?
>
>> This same question can be asked of your own peculiar brand of
>> mysticism.
>
>> Can you point to even one measurable physical manifestation
>> attributable to your astrological hokum?
>
> Yes, self-understanding leads to changed perceptions of one's self and
> place within the world, this leads to altered will application to
> improve the quality of life, which leads to a different reality more
> preferable to the individual or society in question.
You sure aren't proving that by being an example. You're a destitute
kook.
--
Cujo - The Official Overseer of Kooks and Trolls in
dfw.*, alt.paranormal, alt.astrology and alt.astrology.metapsych.
Winner of the 8/2000 & 2/2003 HL&S award. Hail Petitmorte!
Colonel of the Fanatic Legion. FL# 555-PLNTY Motto: ABUNDANCE!.
Charter Member - Digital Brownshirts and Library Gestapo.
"Supernews is going to lose their posting priviledges if I have
anything to do with it." - Ed the Powerless.
Flash Bazbo
<snipped for brevity>
Your reply is not an example of a physical manifestation of the power of
astrology. A physical manifestation would be something akin to the
story of St. Elizabeth of Hungary, whose cloak was supposedly filled
with rose blooms in the middle of a bitterly cold winter through God's
intercession. Your example is of someone using astrology to reassess
their life circumstances and altering their behavior to mitigate
negative personality traits. In what way is that different from
meditative prayer or Transcendental Meditation or the Magic Eightball?
At least prayer offers the faithful the hope of God's intercession in
their lives. Tm promises its adepts the power of levitation. Even
Scientology claims to enable its followers have power over the physical
world.
You clamor about how your astrology enables one to actually create new
realities but really it is just another tool for self-evaluation.
Stroll through any bookstore and you will find thousands of titles that
offer the same. You mock christians for believing in the power of
intercessory prayer yet you can't demonstrate the efficacy of your own
philosophy. You laugh at the lack of historical evidence of Jesus'
existence yet you can not prove a relationship between a person's
personal circumstances and the celestial position of Saturn.
Can you show that your astrology has any effect on reality beyond the
mundane changes in circumstances acheivable by anyone through behavior
modification? Can you create a reality where you can levitate a pencil
using only your mind?
wollma...@spam.free
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alt.religion.islam talk.religion.newage alt.astrology soc.motss
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alt.religion.islam talk.religion.newage alt.astrology soc.motss
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Pedantus
"Edmond Wollmann" <arctur...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:421F63...@earthlink.net...
[................................]
>
> Then why not then just act with conviction in all that you do, skip the
> middleman, POPE, prayer, and ritual and be far more efficient in one's
> life?
Hey , Ed, I found some people who act with conviction....now they are your
superiors....:)
Kepler College Graduation
http://www.kepler.edu/images/grads.jpg
Wherrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrre's Eddy ?
>
> --
> Eddy
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<421F63...@earthlink.net> news.admin.net-abuse.sightings
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John Pez
By the same token, one can blame life's fuck-ups and failures on the
position of a planet, or some other lame astrology excuse. Believing
astrology is easier than facing reality.
Andy
"Edmond Wollmann - The Arthurian One" <alcha...@yahoo.com> wrote in
message news:1109270645.9...@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Why didn't "God" intervene and keep him from getting ill in the first
place?
Amazing what gullibility is rampant on the planet.
Did not you hear about Fatima Prophecy ?
http://www.vatican.va/roman_curia/congregations/cfaith/documents/rc_con_cfaith_doc_20000626_message-fatima_en.htmlIt was said that Pop will suffer for Russia , so Russia will convert back toChristianity. And this prophecy is being fulfilled, Russian people gotfreedom to practise Christianity.
George Spum
<alcha...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>1MAN4ALL wrote:
>> Edmond Wollmann - The Arthurian One wrote:
>
>> > Why didn't "God" intervene and keep him from getting ill in the
>first
>> > place?
>
>> Sickness and death are subject to laws of nature, which were
>> established by God at the time the world was created, and they apply
>> equitably to all. Neither piousness nor sinfulness by itself creates
>an
>> obligation for God to alter these laws.
>
>The laws of nature are set, hhhmmm...then why not just study nature?
>Skip the middleman?
>Then why was the pope himself saying that he believed that God
>intervened when he was shot so that the bullet did not hit any vital
>organs? Again, the question would be why even believe in such non-sense
>if it has no effect whatever anyway? Why didn't god stop the shooter
>first?
>
>> > Amazing what gullibility is rampant on the planet.
>
>> You are part of it:-)
>
>I see, because I don't believe in fairy tales about some after life? If
>there is an omnipotent creator, IT (not he or she) has an infinite
>amount of space, time and far larger and more complex issues that would
>preoccupy it (if such a notion is even feasible) than even giving a
>second glance to whatever is going on on this insignificant planet, in
>an insignificant solar system on the outskirts of this insignificant
>galaxy in which we find ourselves.
>
>"Everybody needs his memories. They keep the wolf of insignificance
>from the door." Saul Bellow
>
>Replace memories with
PU! Snip remaining stinky crap. You are really off your rocker, Edmo.
fora...@hotmail.com
Dan Baldwin wrote:
> fora...@hotmail.com wrote:
> >
> >
> > What is prayer, anyway? Prayer, from an Islamic perspective, means
> > putting trust.
>
> casting (i.e. a waste of time).
Rational? Just because that's your opinion, it's "rational?"
Dr.Tulip
news:1109275433.6...@l41g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
:
: > Why didn't "God" intervene and keep him from getting ill in the first
: > place?
:
: Sickness and death are subject to laws of nature, which were
: established by God at the time the world was created, and they apply
: equitably to all. Neither piousness nor sinfulness by itself creates an
: obligation for God to alter these laws.
Hey I agree with this statement whoever wrote it! Edmond Wollmann ?
Are you this good?
Many people prayed at the right time, when the healing power is out ready to
come in with or without your prayers.
Now watch this Fall 2005, the Pope will fall, let's see if you can pray to
save him.
Dr. Tulip.
Glenn (Christian Mystic)
>> Edmond H. Wollmann The Pleiadian One! wrote:
>> > 1MAN4ALL wrote:
>> >>Edmond Wollmann - The Arthurian One wrote:
<snip>
>> > The laws of nature are set, hhhmmm...then why not just study nature?
>> > Skip the middleman?
>> > Then why was the pope himself saying that he believed that God
>> > intervened when he was shot so that the bullet did not hit any vital
>> > organs? Again, the question would be why even believe in such non-sense
>> > if it has no effect whatever anyway? Why didn't god stop the shooter
>> > first?
>
>> This same question can be asked of your own peculiar brand of mysticism.
>> Can you point to even one measurable physical manifestation attributable
>> to your astrological hokum?
>
> Yes, self-understanding leads to changed perceptions of one's self and
> place within the world, this leads to altered will application to
> improve the quality of life, which leads to a different reality more
> preferable to the individual or society in question.
WOW ! So please show me how to get into the 'reality' preferable to me, like
one in which my wife never physically died, and will be in bed with me
*tonight* :-)
<snippers>
Glenn (Christian Mystic)
"Bob Officer" <bobof...@invalid.net> wrote in message
news:104k12h0f1dtd81ou...@4ax.com...
> Glenn you do know that Edmond is a loon/kook and nutbar. The false
> belief of him creating his own reality has it so everyone alive is
> just a copy of himself, but un-enlighten, and this so called
> "All-that-is" is just a version of himself as godhood.
>
> But then you have to understand Edmond has considered himself
> qualified to give counsel and has offered himself as a counselor to
> the public before he dropped out of high school. It took threat of
> legal action by the California AG Office and the California Psych
> board to have a club organization remove his ad for "psychological
> based readings" from their web page.
>
> Glenn, I feel sorry for you loss of companionship, and I Wish There
> was some way I could console you for your loss. I am afraid we are
> stuck with the here and now. Make the most of your time, honor the
> memory of what you had. As long as you don't forget part of her will
> stay with you forever.
>
>
> --
> Ak'toh'di
Glenn (Christian Mystic)
"SheBlewHimDidYouBlowHim" <kil...@killgod.com> wrote in message
news:wavTd.13956$x53....@newsread3.news.atl.earthlink.net...
> exactly, maybe it's in GOD's DIVINE PLAN to MURDER the pope. We don't want
> to interfere with GOD's DIVINE PLAN.
You keep forgetting, withn God, there is no death, the pope presently lives,
only his body died, also God makes the rules, murder is taking a life
wrongfully.
There was no "murder"
Eric Brze
<christi...@ev1.net> wrote:
>
>"SheBlewHimDidYouBlowHim" <kil...@killgod.com> wrote in message
>news:wavTd.13956$x53....@newsread3.news.atl.earthlink.net...
>
>> exactly, maybe it's in GOD's DIVINE PLAN to MURDER the pope. We don't want
>> to interfere with GOD's DIVINE PLAN.
>
>You keep forgetting, withn God, there is no death, the pope presently lives,
>only his body died, also God makes the rules, murder is taking a life
>wrongfully.
>
>There was no "murder"
Don't be so sure. According to Jesus, there is this great dark force
that is capable to kill souls. He warned all of us to fear that great
evil force. Personally, I'm not so sure the Pope even had a soul
before he died, considering his inability to discipline his pedophile
priests and many other things...
Werner -the Christian Agnostic- Kurator
on 2006-03-26 announced this statement:
> On Sat, 25 Mar 2006 13:28:15 -0600, "Glenn \(Christian Mystic\)"
><christi...@ev1.net> wrote:
>
>>
>>"SheBlewHimDidYouBlowHim" <kil...@killgod.com> wrote in message
>>news:wavTd.13956$x53....@newsread3.news.atl.earthlink.net...
>>
>>> exactly, maybe it's in GOD's DIVINE PLAN to MURDER the pope. We don't want
>>> to interfere with GOD's DIVINE PLAN.
>>
>>You keep forgetting, withn God, there is no death, the pope presently lives,
>>only his body died, also God makes the rules, murder is taking a life
>>wrongfully.
>>
>>There was no "murder"
>
> Don't be so sure. According to Jesus, there is this great dark force
> that is capable to kill souls. He warned all of us to fear that great
> evil force. Personally, I'm not so sure the Pope even had a soul
> before he died, considering his inability to discipline his pedophile
> priests and many other things...
The devil is just "imagination" of us humans, you told me.
in <ab6jp1ln883ja71bq...@4ax.com>:
Jehovah the evil lord only came into existence after Adam/Eve
fell. In truth, he is nothing but an imagination of the human mind
out of the human ignorance.
== end quote
Werner Kurator
--
===========================================================
"Like all translations of the Bible, made as they are by
imperfect man, this one falls short of it goal. Yet we are
grateful to God for the extend to which he has enabled us to
realize these goals and for the strength he has given us and our
colleagues to complete our task"
Preface to the "New International Version" of the Bible
August 1983......
==============================================================
"In fact, many professing agnostics are nearer belief in
the true God then are many conventional church-goers who
believe in a bogey that does not exist whom they miscall God."
Leslie D. Weatherhead; Preface to his "The Christian Agnostic"
==============================================================
To an archer, chainmail is simply a sheet of linked holes.
Glenn (Christian Mystic)
"Eric Brze" <br...@no.spam.mail.com> wrote in message
news:t9pb22haek6rohitv...@4ax.com...
> On Sat, 25 Mar 2006 13:28:15 -0600, "Glenn \(Christian Mystic\)"
> <christi...@ev1.net> wrote:
>>"SheBlewHimDidYouBlowHim" <kil...@killgod.com> wrote in message
>>news:wavTd.13956$x53....@newsread3.news.atl.earthlink.net...
>>
>>> exactly, maybe it's in GOD's DIVINE PLAN to MURDER the pope. We don't
>>> want
>>> to interfere with GOD's DIVINE PLAN.
>>
>>You keep forgetting, withn God, there is no death, the pope presently
>>lives,
>>only his body died, also God makes the rules, murder is taking a life
>>wrongfully.
>>There was no "murder"
>
> Don't be so sure. According to Jesus, there is this great dark force
> that is capable to kill souls. He warned all of us to fear that great
> evil force.
A couple of things, in context, Jesus was talking about not needing to fear
what men can do to you. In the scriptures, "fear" often means nothing more
than *respect*, the Bible also teaches that love casts out all fear, we are
to love God with all our heart, mind, body, and soul. Thus the 'fear' He
speaks of here (the text concerning who to fear), put in context with love
casting out all fear, is that of respecting God (as love casts out all fear,
you can't *fear*{the kind with terror} God and love Him at the same time).
And lastly, being able to do something, and doing it, are not the same
thing.
I see no reason for me to fear that God will harm my soul.
> Personally, I'm not so sure the Pope even had a soul
> before he died, considering his inability to discipline his pedophile
> priests and many other things...
He wasn't God.