Re: On the Do it Yourself, Masterless Path
garlan...@gmail.com
wrote:
> What techniques or practices do people implement who are not part of
> any organized teaching and do not have any teacher? Do they make up
> their own techniques or practices or do they kind of borrow a little
> from one group or teacher or another? Probably mostly the latter.
>
> Al Brand, a man I called Uncle Al, was not part of any organized
> religion and did not seem to emulate any particular teacher. He did
> his own thing. Born into an orthodox Jewish family, his story of his
> first day of being in the Army during World War II was interesting.
>
> He got up before the other men in the barracks on the first day of
> training. He began to silently recite the Jewish morning prayers as he
> had done all his life. He was wearing his yamulke, tallit and
> tefillin. When he finished his prayers he put away his yamulke, tallit
> and tefillin. And then he never prayed as a Jew ever again.
>
> He used to have all the young people gather around him for "Al
> University." Sort of a mini spiritual discourse before a meal or an
> outing. When he told this story, everyone was confused at the
> abruptness of his spiritual change. All he could say about it was that
> it became clear to him that praying as he did, was no longer necessary
> or needed for him.
>
> Later on in years, I overheard my father and Al speaking. Al was
> excited about Julian Johnson's book, The Path of the Masters and about
> Kirpal Singh. My father said that Johnson was "a fraud" and that
> Kirpal Singh was "full of shit." When they saw I was listening to
> their conversation, they quickly changed the subject and would not
> respond to any questions because doing so "might distract me from my
> Jewish studies" they said.
>
> Al died of lung cancer many years ago. His request to be cremated was
> not honored. At his funeral his casket was draped in an Israeli flag
> and a rabbi officiated.
>
> It was a sad day in many ways.
I am going to use round numbers because it's the point I'm trying to
make. Not exact numbers.
There are around 300 million Christians many devoted their lives to
this teaching. Priests, Ministers, Missionaries, many have killed and
died in the name of their saviour. Yet in 2000 years there has not
been another Jesus.
Why?
There are around 300 million Muslims same situation same results. In
around 1500 years there has not been another Mohammed .
Why?
There are around 300 million Buddhists, again same situation same
results.
In around 2500 years there has not been another Buddha.
Why?
There are around 300 million Hindus, Guess what , has there been
another great all knowing guru.
Why?
Look at your own Jewish origins, is there a great teacher that
appeared in the last 2000 years.
Why?
***** Your uncle Al was far more aware than the hundreds of
millions that blindly followed a teaching without questioning.
Take 20 minutes, be honest !
Did you learn more that you can apply in your daily life from your
uncle Al, or from your time spent in Eckankar.
No matter what your beliefs, find some way to ( prove ) them to
yourself.
Sean
"Granola Cruncher" <davemar...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1187960495.5...@i13g2000prf.googlegroups.com...
In many ways yes. Families, if you didn't love them, or tolerate them, then
you'd ............ fill in the blank.
Sean
Christianity: 2.1 billion , of which Roman Catholic Church: 1.05 billion
Islam: 1.3 billion
Secular/irreligious/agnostic/atheist/antitheistic/antireligious: 1.1 billion
Hinduism: 900 million
Buddhism: 376 million
Judaism: 14 million [ wouldn't even qualify as a Major religion anymore, by
any stretch of the imagination, so why it attracts so much focus and
attention and power in the world today seems a little strange to me. ]
Garland, I realise you said it's the point you are making that is important,
not the exact numbers, but any chance of getting at least a little closer
with the facts in "round numbers" occasionally? <smile>
It goes to your overall credibility in other areas as well, in case your
interested.
BTW did you ever get to translate some of that german page about a spiritual
being said to be the same being named by PT as Rebazar Tarzs? I used Babel
Fish quite effectively which translated about 90% of it enough to make sense
what was being said. Or was it all just too much to swallow?
<garlan...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1187994685....@e9g2000prf.googlegroups.com...
garlan...@gmail.com
> FYI @ 2005
>
> Christianity: 2.1 billion , of which Roman Catholic Church: 1.05 billion
>
> Islam: 1.3 billion
>
> Secular/irreligious/agnostic/atheist/antitheistic/antireligious: 1.1 billion
>
> Hinduism: 900 million
>
> Buddhism: 376 million
>
> Judaism: 14 million [ wouldn't even qualify as a Major religion anymore, by
> any stretch of the imagination, so why it attracts so much focus and
> attention and power in the world today seems a little strange to me. ]
>
> Garland, I realise you said it's the point you are making that is important,
> not the exact numbers, but any chance of getting at least a little closer
> with the facts in "round numbers" occasionally? <smile>
>
> It goes to your overall credibility in other areas as well, in case your
> interested.
Garland:
And with your far more precise numbers and greater credibility, why
has there not been one great spiritual leader that could stand forward
and show that there was something to back up his claims.
Anyone who made an impact lived 2000 years ago.
With the billions of followers, mystics, masters, rabbis, gurus and
( invented ) Tibetan masters. Not one has been able to show he has
something the general population is lacking.
Paul Twitchell was a science fiction writer that borrowed others
ideas a claimed them for his own. Initiations that are bought through
the yearly memberships are worthless.
There have been no new ideas in 2000 years.
>
> BTW did you ever get to translate some of that german page about a spiritual
> being said to be the same being named by PT as Rebazar Tarzs? I used Babel
> Fish quite effectively which translated about 90% of it enough to make sense
> what was being said. Or was it all just too much to swallow?
>
Garland:
I'm in the process of conducting an experiment, I cancelled my home
internet connection and gave away me desktop computer.
I now have a laptop with built in wireless that I am using to access
internet through the free access found a internet cafes.
The time available to me is limited but the experiment has been a
good one.
Your question raises another one, with all the HI's who claim to be
able to Soul travel, why does it come down to look on the internet.
A religion built on the fact that Soul can leave the body at will, and
it comes down to translate a German text.
All these self-aware souls and it comes down to Bable - Fish.
> <garland.p...@gmail.com> wrote in message
> > yourself.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
Sean
<garlan...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1188026190.6...@x40g2000prg.googlegroups.com...
Yes Garland. Whatever you say mate! ;-)
>
>
>>
>> BTW did you ever get to translate some of that german page about a
>> spiritual
>> being said to be the same being named by PT as Rebazar Tarzs? I used
>> Babel
>> Fish quite effectively which translated about 90% of it enough to make
>> sense
>> what was being said. Or was it all just too much to swallow?
>>
>
> Garland:
>
>
> I'm in the process of conducting an experiment, I cancelled my home
> internet connection and gave away me desktop computer.
>
> I now have a laptop with built in wireless that I am using to access
> internet through the free access found a internet cafes.
>
> The time available to me is limited but the experiment has been a
> good one.
>
> Your question raises another one, with all the HI's who claim to be
> able to Soul travel, why does it come down to look on the internet.
>
> A religion built on the fact that Soul can leave the body at will, and
> it comes down to translate a German text.
>
> All these self-aware souls and it comes down to Bable - Fish.
>
LOL but but but, anyone who said they have met RT, in the physical or
whatever, and say thay they believe he is real .. i thought you denied it
was so, and that it was just imagination fueled by PT and Eckankar
teachings? So I fail to follow you when you say Soul Travel should trump
Babel Fish ... and I'm also confused because you were the one who asked
about ANY physical earthly information about a being who goes by the name
RT outside of Eckankar, and I clearly gave you one. So what HI's or soul
travel now got to do with that is waaaaaaaaay beyond me. But by all means,
keep grinding the grist in the old mill garland. <g>
Etznab
> <garland.p...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>
> - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
Yes, somebody please do give information about
that "other" person said to be the same being as
Rebazar Tarzs. I, personally, would like to consider
that information. (Long as it's not referring to Babaji,
whom Rebazar Tarzs [via Paul Twitchell in The Far
Country] claimed to be some kind of "neighbor", or
living in the "next-door" mountains. (My quotes -
not the actual The Far Country text)
" '.... There is an adept over seven hundred years old
living within a few miles of this mud hut. He is Babaji -
the master of Yogda Satsang, and there are several
other yoga teachers in the same group.' "
The Far Country, by Paul Twitchell, 8th printing, 1983,
p. 218 (3rd paragraph).
I said "long as it's not referring to Babaji" because,
according to The Far Country (according to Rebazar
Tarzs), Babaji and Rebazar Tarzs are NOT the same
person.
Etznab
Sean
"Etznab" <etz...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:1188046492.0...@l22g2000prc.googlegroups.com...
here ya go ... fyi
http://www.aksharavidya.net/cms/front_content.php?idcatart=43&lang=1&client=1
you'll need to use a translator ... [ assuming your not german ] but if you
are I'd love to read a complete translation, as the online things really
don't cut it.
Etznab
>
> you'll need to use a translator ... [ assuming your not german ] but if you
> are I'd love to read a complete translation, as the online things really
>
> - Show quoted text -
Sean,
Thanks Sean. The translator gave the name of this character
as Shri Jâmbavat. It claimed he appeared to people throughout
time, and that he appeared to Paul Twitchell as Rebazar Tarzs.
One of the current pupils of that teaching system (Akshara
Vidyâ) appears to be Anton Toenz.
Personally, I don't know how many physical records exist for
this being? (whatever). Under the picture on the Web site is has
the name Shri Jâmbavat Mahântâ. However, it does not look like
an actual photograph. Nevertheless, thanks for the data. (Anton
Toenz looks pretty interesting. IMO.)
http://www.aksharavidya.net/cms/front_content.php?client=1&lang=1&idcat=24&idart=30&m=&s=
Etznab
P.S. The translator I used was:
http://babelfish.altavista.com/tr
Sean
Sean,
as Shri Jāmbavat. It claimed he appeared to people throughout
time, and that he appeared to Paul Twitchell as Rebazar Tarzs.
One of the current pupils of that teaching system (Akshara
Vidyā) appears to be Anton Toenz.
Personally, I don't know how many physical records exist for
this being? (whatever). Under the picture on the Web site is has
the name Shri Jāmbavat Mahāntā. However, it does not look like
an actual photograph. Nevertheless, thanks for the data. (Anton
Toenz looks pretty interesting. IMO.)
http://www.aksharavidya.net/cms/front_content.php?client=1&lang=1&idcat=24&idart=30&m=&s=
Etznab
P.S. The translator I used was:
http://babelfish.altavista.com/tr
-------------------
SEAN: You're welcome. yes I realise it isn't the "physical" record that you
are seeking, but i posted that before in regard garland's query if RT had
ever been mentioned outside of Eckankar, and this website pretty confirms
that, though it's a rose by another name ... and from I gather the "being"
Sri Jambavat is not a physical human being, but a spiritual guide. Still
Anton is claiming that RT is one and the same.
I just thought it may have triggered a bit of a review by garland as what
this issue is really all about ... and that Life works in Mysterious ways. I
also like the saying "horses for courses" ..... and there are many ways to
God, with the right way being the one each individual chooses. ;-))
Rich
"Sean" <huc...@blah.com> wrote
> http://www.aksharavidya.net/cms/front_content.php?idcatart=43&lang=1&client=1
>
> you'll need to use a translator ... [ assuming your not german ] but if
> you are I'd love to read a complete translation, as the online things
> really don't cut it.
Google!
http://heh.pl/&3cL
mirror-image-ritual?
Sean
"Rich" <dead...@inorbit.com> wrote in message
news:farl7...@news4.newsguy.com...
Thanks Rich .. that is still fairly close to what i got out of babel-fish,
but may be a little better ... basically I could work out the gist of the
info originally, but it's the grammar and things that don't compute well ...
and the odd words like heliozentrischen, similar it in brown Mönchskutte,
unsterblichen masters, himmlischen origin of ETC that I'd like to have
properly translated just so I knew i got an really accurate translation ..
not just this site , but all those i have tried to translate have this
problem no matter what language ... .. c'est la vie.
And yes, that phrase stuck me too when i first saw it. I'm not quite sure, i
guess it is explained in his discourses etc .. maybe seeing ones-self? ala
self-realization .. realize being observed image of self? I don't know.
And hey how are ya? Won any more trophies mate? Maybe you and Brian could
have a "run-off" one day, see who's really got the ol body together? <smile>
Nah. nah, I just be a spectator mate!!!
Sean
see i get a bit lost here .. although i get the gist, i'm not entirely sure
"Shri Jâmbavat is and was since undenklicher time of the intermediaries
between Shangrila and the world and became even symbolic therefore the
carrier and deliverer of the container (cup) of the immortality. It stepped
and arises the time and situation in accordance with in many different
features and with different names."
maybe i just a dumkoff Col. Klink? <g>
Sean
what you wrote.
it's a good feeling to have nothing to prove anymore, don't you think?
<smile>
"Granola Cruncher" <davemar...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1188098219.9...@57g2000hsv.googlegroups.com...
>> yourself.-
>
> I loved my Uncle Al so much. Al provided me with an example to
> emulate. He was an intricate part of my path. Hundreds of people came
> to his funeral. My brother and I buried him, one shovelful of dirt at
> a time. No strangers buried this man. I miss him but my life continues
> and so does his. Do know, fwiw, that I follow only what I can
> personally prove to myself. Nothing more. So fear and guilt are out
> the window unless I let my guard down. If you read or have ever read
> What God Wants by Neale Donald Walsch, you will understand more from a
> philosophical viewpoint what I'm not conveying so well. And The Light
> and Sound is the real deal. But I don't usually recommend any one
> group to join or any particular leader because I'm not convinced there
> is just one ideal for EVERYONE to initiate with, but would recommend
> people to initiate with the one Light and Sound Teacher that resonates
> best with you.
>
> And to answer all your Why, why, Why questions: People who have God,
> unless their "mission" dictates otherwise, do not need the spotlight
> or any kind of glamor. They already have everything they could ever
> want and have nothing to prove. You might just as easily find a great
> teacher managing a coffee shop or selling hot dogs at a roadside cart
> as in a Temple, or a Board Room or at a spiritual gathering. So not
> every God Realized person writes a book or starts or continues a
> religious movement. IMO, All Religious Organizations have NO spiritual
> power at all, just ritual, administrative and social purposes. You
> have to go within. Having a teacher that right for you to connect to
> the Holy spirit (initiation) has been a blessing for me. Ok, enough is
> enough. <end>
>
Rich
"Sean" <huc...@blah.com> wrote
>
> "Rich" <dead...@inorbit.com> wrote
>> "Sean" <huc...@blah.com> wrote
>>
>>
>>> http://www.aksharavidya.net/cms/front_content.php?idcatart=43&lang=1&client=1
>>>
>>> you'll need to use a translator ... [ assuming your not german ] but if
>>> you are I'd love to read a complete translation, as the online things
>>> really don't cut it.
>>
>> Google!
>> http://heh.pl/&3cL
>>
>> mirror-image-ritual?
>>
>
> Thanks Rich .. that is still fairly close to what i got out of babel-fish,
> but may be a little better ... basically I could work out the gist of the
> info originally, but it's the grammar and things that don't compute well
> ... and the odd words like heliozentrischen, similar it in brown
> Mönchskutte, unsterblichen masters, himmlischen origin of ETC that I'd
> like to have properly translated just so I knew i got an really accurate
> translation .. not just this site , but all those i have tried to
> translate have this problem no matter what language ... .. c'est la vie.
>
> And yes, that phrase stuck me too when i first saw it. I'm not quite sure,
> i guess it is explained in his discourses etc .. maybe seeing ones-self?
> ala self-realization .. realize being observed image of self? I don't
> know.
I searched it and came up with a bunch of other things but none seemed to
explain it...
> And hey how are ya? Won any more trophies mate?
Yep. The Lipton Cup. A perpetual trophy donated by Sri Francis Lipton in
the '30 for competition between yacht clubs in Hawaii.
> Maybe you and Brian could have a "run-off" one day, see who's really got
> the ol body together? <smile>
Ha! Seems as if it's falling apart lately. I'll concede.
> Nah. nah, I just be a spectator mate!!!
Gold bling weighing you down? <G>
` o
|
~/|
_/ |\
/ | \
-/ | \
_/____|___\_
Rich~~~~(__________/~~~~Sailing the CyberSea~~~~~
Rich
"Sean" <huc...@blah.com> wrote in message
news:46d23361$0$12802$afc3...@news.optusnet.com.au...
> PS ..
>
> see i get a bit lost here .. although i get the gist, i'm not entirely
> sure
>
> "Shri Jāmbavat is and was since undenklicher time of the intermediaries
Sean
Wow, do we call you your Lordship now? pretty 'toff' trophy Rich, good show
ol chap! ;-)
>
>> Maybe you and Brian could have a "run-off" one day, see who's really got
>> the ol body together? <smile>
>
> Ha! Seems as if it's falling apart lately. I'll concede.
>
Oooops
>
>> Nah. nah, I just be a spectator mate!!!
>
> Gold bling weighing you down? <G>
>
LOL .. man when ur ona roll hehehe ;-))
Take care hey
Sean
See weez zin munster problemo seniour .... LOL
"Rich" <dead...@inorbit.com> wrote in message
news:fatk...@news2.newsguy.com...
Rich
>
> "Rich" <dead...@inorbit.com> wrote
>>> And hey how are ya? Won any more trophies mate?
>>
>> Yep. The Lipton Cup. A perpetual trophy donated by Sri Francis Lipton in
>> the '30 for competition between yacht clubs in Hawaii.
>>
>
> Wow, do we call you your Lordship now?
Master Mariner will suffice. ;-)
> pretty 'toff' trophy Rich, good show ol chap! ;-)
Actually it's a team sport, and the owner foots all the bills.
>>> Maybe you and Brian could have a "run-off" one day, see who's really got
>>> the ol body together? <smile>
>>
>> Ha! Seems as if it's falling apart lately. I'll concede.
>>
>
> Oooops
>
>>
>>> Nah. nah, I just be a spectator mate!!!
>>
>> Gold bling weighing you down? <G>
>>
>
> LOL .. man when ur ona roll hehehe ;-))
>
> Take care hey
U 2
Sean
>
> "Sean" <huc...@blah.com> wrote in message
> news:46d2c270$0$14825$afc3...@news.optusnet.com.au...
>>
>> "Rich" <dead...@inorbit.com> wrote
>
>>>> And hey how are ya? Won any more trophies mate?
>>>
>>> Yep. The Lipton Cup. A perpetual trophy donated by Sri Francis Lipton
>>> in the '30 for competition between yacht clubs in Hawaii.
>>>
>>
>> Wow, do we call you your Lordship now?
>
> Master Mariner will suffice. ;-)
>
ah yes .. perfect description ... ;-)
>
>> pretty 'toff' trophy Rich, good show ol chap! ;-)
>
> Actually it's a team sport, and the owner foots all the bills.
>
Sure I know that, but you are still part of that team, not only when you won
but when you guys lost and lost and kept at it ... no less important than
the man with the cash, that's his karma and contribution, but at the end of
the day it is a team effort, and all are critical ... therefore so were you.
And I don't know the others, but by all means fwiw [?] pass on the
congratulations of this humble past hoby cat amateur. ;-)
Rich
"Sean" <huc...@blah.com> wrote
>
> "Rich" <dead...@inorbit.com> wrote
>> "Sean" <huc...@blah.com> wrote
>>
>>>>> And hey how are ya? Won any more trophies mate?
>>>>
>>>> Yep. The Lipton Cup. A perpetual trophy donated by Sri Francis Lipton
>>>> in the '30 for competition between yacht clubs in Hawaii.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Wow, do we call you your Lordship now?
>>
>> Master Mariner will suffice. ;-)
>>
>
> ah yes .. perfect description ... ;-)
>
>>
>>> pretty 'toff' trophy Rich, good show ol chap! ;-)
>>
>> Actually it's a team sport, and the owner foots all the bills.
>>
>
> Sure I know that, but you are still part of that team, not only when
> you won but when you guys lost and lost and kept at it ...
In all the years I've been racing it was he first time I was on a crew that
won it, so it was cool.
> no less important than the man with the cash, that's his karma and
> contribution, but at the end of > the day it is a team effort, and all are
> critical ... therefore so were you.
True enough...
> And I don't know the others, but by all means fwiw [?] pass on the
> congratulations of this humble past hoby cat amateur. ;-)
The whole crew are amateurs. In Hawaii it's strictly a Corinthian sport.
http://sailing.about.com/od/glossary_c/f/corinthian.htm
Hobbies are great boats! 100K of those high performance boats have been
built. Basic sailing is the same though. Just different nuances on
different kinds of boats.
Speaking of radical edge high performance, I did get to do one regatta on an
International 14 earlier this year. http://heh.pl/&3cO (not me in the pic,
but so you get the idea) It was a very humbling experience. We were awful,
capsized multiple times and ended up bruised all over. :-} Still *lots* of
fun though.
>>>>> Maybe you and Brian could have a "run-off" one day, see who's really
>>>>> got the ol body together? <smile>
>>>>
>>>> Ha! Seems as if it's falling apart lately. I'll concede.
>>>>
>>> Oooops
Well, I'll race him in sailboats...
>>>>> Nah. nah, I just be a spectator mate!!!
>>>>
>>>> Gold bling weighing you down? <G>
>>>>
>>>
>>> LOL .. man when ur ona roll hehehe ;-))
No chains on me!
JS
46d232af$0$13999$afc3...@news.optusnet.com.au, "Sean" <huc...@blah.com>
wrote:
That curious phrase "mirror-image ritual" is how Google translates the word
"spiritual".
It's been a bug in their translation algorithm ever since I've tried using
it (years).
As near as I can guess, it is related to the fact that "Spiegel" is the
German word for "mirror", so that what the algorithm sees in the word
"spiritual" is "spi" and "ritual": "mirror-image ritual".
The thing is, the mistranslation very often fits!
--JS
Sean
"JS" <j...@127.0.0.1> wrote in message news:C2FDC626.124F%j...@127.0.0.1...
> On 8/26/07 7:10 PM, in article
> 46d232af$0$13999$afc3...@news.optusnet.com.au, "Sean" <huc...@blah.com>
> wrote:
>
Ah, you clever man! <smile>
Spi-Ritual .... i never noticed that before, only ever Spirit-U-all
And Hello JS ... how's it going mate?
>
>
> That curious phrase "mirror-image ritual" is how Google translates the
> word
> "spiritual".
>
> It's been a bug in their translation algorithm ever since I've tried using
> it (years).
>
> As near as I can guess, it is related to the fact that "Spiegel" is the
> German word for "mirror", so that what the algorithm sees in the word
> "spiritual" is "spi" and "ritual": "mirror-image ritual".
>
> The thing is, the mistranslation very often fits!
>
> --JS
>
So trans eng. to ger. is spiritual = geistig
BUT .. geistig = mentally ger. to eng.
And ger. to eng. of spirituelle or spirituellen = mirror-image-ritual
and eng. to ger. is mirror image ritual = Spiegelbildritual
and eng. to ger. is ritual = rituell
OK, well again, thanks ... ;-)
Rich
"JS" <j...@127.0.0.1> wrote in message news:C2FDC626.124F%j...@127.0.0.1...