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NIMBY: freedom of religion, but not in my backyard

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Steve Hayes

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Jul 4, 2010, 11:28:43 PM7/4/10
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Neighbors object to architecture of Euless church
Posted Friday, Jul. 02, 2010

By TERRY EVANS tev...@star-telegram.com

EULESS -- St. John the Baptist Greek Orthodox Church is bursting at the seams
and has plans to build a new worship center.

The new building's architecture is Byzantine, a design style that originated
in Greece, Turkey and Romania, said Joe Sullivan, building committee chairman.

"We're excited about being able to worship in a church that's the correct
style of architecture," he said.

Greg DeGiovanni, office administrator, said construction should begin within
the next couple of weeks.

"I'm kind of surprised we haven't seen them out there already," he said of
construction crews.

But while the church's 100 or so families eagerly await the construction of
the 8,300-square-foot edifice that will seat about 260, some neighbors aren't
happy with the plans.

Sherry Brauchler isn't looking forward to the new church building in her
Cullum Drive neighborhood.

"I'm not a curmudgeon," she said. "I just feel that there is a responsibility
to the neighborhood."

The architect who developed the concept drawing, Mirela Tudora, is the wife of
the parish priest, the Rev. Vasile Tudora. She's also schooled in the
Byzantine style of architecture, Sullivan said.

That style is a burr under Brauchler's saddle. She had no problem with the
church's first construction project, which in 1987 put an 8,000-square-foot
brick building on the back of the 303 Cullum Drive property. That building
will become classrooms, offices and a fellowship hall when the new building is
finished.

"The building they have now is nothing like what they're going to build, with
turrets and that type of architecture," she said. "The neighborhood is a
beautiful slice of country in the middle of the Metroplex. I don't have
anything against the church, but that drastic architecture doesn't fit in."

Euless Mayor Mary Lib Saleh disagreed.

"The church is gorgeous," she said. "They put a lot of thought into the
architecture. It will enhance the neighborhood, and we're going to see that
it's not going to disrupt the neighborhood."

Saleh and the City Council approved the building's site plan at their June 8
meeting.

But its design wasn't the only subject of protest letters that Brauchler and
another neighbor, Muhuntha Arumugam, filed with the city's planning and zoning
committee.

Arumugam, who lives on Colonial Lane, said that the church's annual Mid-Cities
Greek Food Festival makes him miserable.

"I'm a Christian," he said. "I'm not against church. I'm against having too
much crowd all over the place. We cannot even enter our own house, and the
music goes to 1 or 2 a.m."

Arumugam said he also fears that this expansion won't be the last.

"We are accommodating," he said of himself and his neighbors. "But we're like
the farmer who let the camel put its head in the tent when it rained. The
camel kept coming until the farmer had no room for himself in his tent."

Arumugam said it's fine for the church to grow, but it should "go grow
somewhere else."

He suggested that the festival be moved as well.

Sullivan said that festival -- this year's, on Oct. 8-10, will be the 19th --
is the church's primary fundraiser and draws guests from across the region.
It's critical, considering the $2.4 million cost for the new building and the
2,500-square-foot addition to the current one. The church, he added, has
addressed neighbors' complaints.

"One of the things we've done is enact a parking plan that puts up parking
barriers so nobody can park against their land," he said. "We have parking
monitors and get as many folks as we can to park in an adjacent property we
own to keep them off the street."

Sullivan said the church stakes highly visible marker tape along private
property on Cullum Drive to warn drivers not to park there.

He said that illegally parked vehicles are towed away if owners don't respond
to announcements over the PA system within a reasonable amount of time.

Saleh said the festival has become part of Euless, and she regrets that some
neighbors find it intrusive.

"Yes, it is a big festival," she said. "They have a lot of people and music.
Some people just don't like that."

The mayor urged tolerance.

"Let's be accepting of one another," she said. "If there are true problems,
call us and we'll come out and do what we can to help you."

TERRY EVANS, 817-390-7620

http://www.star-telegram.com/2010/07/02/2311291/neighbors-object-to-architecture.html


--
Steve Hayes from Tshwane, South Africa
Web: http://hayesfam.bravehost.com/stevesig.htm
Blog: http://methodius.blogspot.com
E-mail - see web page, or parse: shayes at dunelm full stop org full stop uk

prophet Muhammud the Child Fucker

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Jul 6, 2010, 10:04:56 PM7/6/10
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Steve hayes , do you consider all East European Orthodox are
wogs ?

> http://www.star-telegram.com/2010/07/02/2311291/neighbors-object-to-a...

Steve Hayes

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Jul 7, 2010, 5:29:21 AM7/7/10
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On Tue, 6 Jul 2010 19:04:56 -0700 (PDT), prophet Muhammud the Child Fucker
<mohamed...@gmail.com> wrote:

>Steve hayes , do you consider all East European Orthodox are
>wogs ?

"No problem at all. Just scroll down to the bottom of the page and
read backwards."
"Only thing is ... I forgot where we started."
"How right you are."
"Yeah ... sure does make us stand out, doesn't it?"
"Maybe they're just not as clever as we are."
"I wonder why nobody else top-posts?"
"That's nice."
"I'm a top-poster too."
"Yes."
"Are you a top-poster?"
"Hi."
"Hi."

--
Steve Hayes from Tshwane, South Africa

Web: http://khanya.wordpress.com
Blog: http://methodius.blogspot.com

"She believed in nothing. Only her scepticism kept her from being an atheist."
-- Jean-Paul Sartre

vjp...@at.biostrategist.dot.dot.com

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Jul 7, 2010, 10:26:24 AM7/7/10
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Well, a lot of USA colleges have a rule requiring "non-prosletysing
dialogue" but then objected to post communist states banning
prosletysation. (I only favor such a ban temporarily, say ten years,
in countries that have previously lived under atheistic
dictatorships.)

- = -
Vasos Panagiotopoulos, Columbia'81+, Reagan, Mozart, Pindus, BioStrategist
http://www.panix.com/~vjp2/vasos.htm http://www.facebook.com/vasjpan2
---{Nothing herein constitutes advice. Everything fully disclaimed.}---
[Homeland Security means private firearms not lazy obstructive guards]
[Urb sprawl confounds terror] [Phooey on GUI: Windows for subprime Bimbos]

Steve Hayes

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Jul 7, 2010, 12:27:22 PM7/7/10
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On Wed, 7 Jul 2010 14:26:24 +0000 (UTC), vjp...@at.BioStrategist.dot.dot.com
wrote:

>Well, a lot of USA colleges have a rule requiring "non-prosletysing
>dialogue" but then objected to post communist states banning
>prosletysation. (I only favor such a ban temporarily, say ten years,
>in countries that have previously lived under atheistic
>dictatorships.)

Aye, but this isn't about proselytism, it's about architecture.

--
Steve Hayes from Tshwane, South Africa

Catherine Jefferson

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Jul 7, 2010, 1:07:10 PM7/7/10
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On 7/7/2010 9:27 AM, Steve Hayes wrote:
> On Wed, 7 Jul 2010 14:26:24 +0000 (UTC), vjp...@at.BioStrategist.dot.dot.com
> wrote:
>
>> Well, a lot of USA colleges have a rule requiring "non-prosletysing
>> dialogue" but then objected to post communist states banning
>> prosletysation. (I only favor such a ban temporarily, say ten years,
>> in countries that have previously lived under atheistic
>> dictatorships.)
>
> Aye, but this isn't about proselytism, it's about architecture.

Aye, and even if it was about proselytizing, this is *America*, not
Russia. Many Americans are ignorant fools on many subjects, but in this
country that's largely a self-inflicted injury where it's true. We have
access to accurate and largely complete information on almost any
subject if we dig a bit for it. Most of us also understand that we
can't safely take just any information from any source at face value.
Most of us have developed a health bit of scepticism and some critical
thinking skills. (Many of us, IMHO, have overdeveloped the first and
become cynics, which is sad but also a different problem.)

I vehemently disapprove of laws restricting exposure to other religions.
As a convert myself, I see those as an attempt by society to decide
something for the individual that the individual is ultimately
responsible for choosing for themselves. However, Russia and other
formerly closed societies that practiced heavy censorship and provided
limited information to their public are facing the fallout from those
policies now. Underneath all of the self-interested attempts to
continue restricting information is a real need not to overwhelm people
who may still be adapting to the new reality.

That simply is not the case in America. There is *NO* excuse for most
attempts to limit free speech between adults.

However, it sounds as if in this case the issue is a couple of neighbors
who don't want their neighborhood to change. At all. Even for the
better. And that is sad. :(


Under His mercy,

--
Catherine Jefferson <ar...@devsite.org>
Personal Home Page * <http://www.devsite.org/>
The SpamBouncer * <http://www.spambouncer.org/>

vjp...@at.biostrategist.dot.dot.com

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Jul 7, 2010, 1:47:26 PM7/7/10
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In the name of tolerance, we also tolerate a lot more fraud. It
happens I was just responding to fraudulent Jewish scriptures and
pointed someone to jewishpub.org and the American Bible Society, which
were created to fight fraudulent scriptures by newly blossomed sects.

It is also worth noting how official status was once enshrined into
state law as seen by the Manhattan Greek Cathedral quote below.. In my
neighborhood, Korean Catholics have private chapels which may
therefore operate independent of the Catholic diocese.

Manhattan Cathedral Centennial: "Up to this time, the Greek Orthodox
churches in New York State could incorporate under its then existing
Religious Corporation Law only as part of the Russian Orthodox Church
jurisdiction. Because of it, neither the Holy Trinity nor the Annunciation
churches had incorporated. The Athena Brotherhood in 1905 petitioned a
special statute, under Chapter 749 of the Laws of the State of New York, and
it was approved. This statute allowed The Holy Trinity to incorporate under
the name of 'The Hellenic Eastern Orthodox Church of New York'."

Nancy Pullus Patseas

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Jul 8, 2010, 1:03:42 PM7/8/10
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My grandaddy punched the Russian archbishop Tihon who wanted to
take over our Brooklyn church. Because the Russian Caesar gave them
money, most Greek churches belonged to him until Lenin tried to sell
them for cash. So we formed masonic self help societies (which became
AHEPA) to own the churches as private chapels so the Russians could
not have them. It is no coincidence the thrity second degre scottish
rite masonic badge is the byzantine two headed eagle. This is why the
goats must be obedient to AHEPA and not the other way around. Ku Klux
Klan is a Greek idea, from the Greek word KUKLOS. The Greeks gone done
right by the confederacy and no good old southern boys ever picked on
Greeks. The KKK canard was invented by Iacovous so he could snuggle
with the Market Looting Koon, because the Greeks and Jews were slave
traders in Catholic New Orleans, which is why David Duke is Catholic.
Greeks fought with Confederates but Russian commies fought for
northern aggression. The finest slave traders were Benaki of
Louisiana and Lehman of Alabama which is how GrecoRoman Venetian
noble Benaki built the New Orleans and Mobile churches and the Athens
museum. When I was growing up the mafia was protecting us from the
nigger riggers while Archie Pigshop Whacko Puss was snuggling with
Market Looting Coon, so bow to Fatima instead of your Harvard Obama
sporting brain washers or we gone and make you eat your yiayia. Russia
never wanted a free Greece, just a Russian Greece like they did to
Armenia. Russian secretary of state Nesselrode sent bishop Uspensky to
make Antioch speak Arab. They failed in Jerusalem but as you see they
still don't give up. Assad & Saddam's party was invented by their
Michel Aflaq in order to spread Slavocommunist domination. In 1845
Moscow provost Masagieff invented Pan Slav Macedonia and their
ambassador Ignatieff tried to implement it at St Stefanous thirty
years later. Russians shriek that we practice "Heresy of Phyletism"
but this refers to Pan Slavocommunists trying to have their way with
poor north Greeks back then. At Berlin, in 1875 the West saved Greece
from Russian domination. Greeks are always West, never East! These
charter revisions want us to dissolve AHEPA and become part of
http://www.OrthodoxFellowship.org/ under http://www.SCOBA.us/ but
Popandrew
Spyridons want us to become unbridled part of http://www.sae.gr/. The
RICO law was designed to protect us against such racketeering by both
sides. Look into the backgrounds of all the Greek pro Russian goats
and you will find communists who fled here from Metaxous. Most Greeks
don't understand that the Russian Church was always communist and
always believed in this Obshchina peasant commune. In fact, their
false proof of Macedonia being Slav is that there were Obshchinas in
Greece. The Russians make the Holy Greco Roman Palioloques look evil
because they crucified them at Florence Ferrari. There was this
usurper called Candacouzinous, with his chief goat, Greg Palamous. You
don't read good things about them in old Greek books, but the Russians
make them look like good guys, and our goats try to sell them to us.
They, not the Crusaders, were the ones who let the Turks into
Constantinople because they used Turk and Slav mercenaries to take
power. They first took Salonica in 1342 as the "Zealots" who set up
an Obshchina and killed all the rich folks so the Russians could take
over Greece. You have to know what the monks are all about. The
black goats defeated the white goats because of the Iconaclasts.
Someone should tell these moslem commie ayatollas that real priests
don't have beards and that men wear pants, shave and bathe. Monk
theology comes from the dualist Zoroastrians, just like the Sufi
Dervish Turks and the Buddhist monks. Alexander the Great crushed the
Russian Magog near Persia. Confucian family values are equally
repulsed by the same Zoroastrian monastic homosexual abomination of
the Buddhists. Real priests are good at baseball and American
football and not sissy games like basket and socker and the metric
system. The black goats have always been agents of the Slavs. This
is why the junta cracked down on Athos, which had become a soviet spy
nest and homosexual bordello and Iacovous banned monasteries from
America. Slavs and Celts are homosexual white booze niggers unlike
Greco Romans. Ain't be no Greco Roman booze niggers, but Russian
national poet, Putkis, was part nigger. The black goats freely
cooperated with the Sufi Dervish Turks, this is why every Greek
government, right or left, keeps taking away goat lands. Thanks to my
college grown friend Suzie Cocas for helping me make this edition more
righteous.

infowolf1

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Jul 9, 2010, 3:49:20 AM7/9/10
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On Jul 8, 10:03 am, Nancy Pullus Patseas <supenelah...@gmail.com>
wrote:

>   My grandaddy punched the Russian archbishop Tihon who  wanted to
> take over our Brooklyn church. Because the Russian Caesar gave them
> money, most Greek churches belonged to him until Lenin tried to sell
> them for cash.  

I recall reading something about Abp Tikhon being outraged, at finding
a STATUE of the FALSE GOD ZEUS in a Greek run church.

This is where culture and ethnic focus gets you, placing FILTHY
ABOMINATIONS the idols of your pagan past in a place of the
worship of God. (and I might add, in ancient times homosexuality
was promoted by some of the escapades of zeus and others.)

You should be ashamed. Whatever was going on regarding finances
or politics, your ethnicism was out of line. So is the rest of your
racist rant. The homosexuality issues you raise may have been true
sometimes. But it was Christianity which OPPOSED ethnicism
which eradicated it from the Greeks who were famous for this
shit.

I have some problems with the slav scene, but it is because of
their ethnicist driven gullibility.

Where errors of practice, morals or even theology start creeping
in, or one bishop is too strict or another too lax, or there is
corruption,
it is good to have different jurisdictions nearby and hop ship. I like
some things about the Greek churches.

But your attitude is the pits.

Justina (OCA, convert, non Greek non slav.)

Alexander Arnakis

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Jul 9, 2010, 1:40:27 PM7/9/10
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On Fri, 9 Jul 2010 00:49:20 -0700 (PDT), infowolf1 <info...@aol.com>
wrote:

>
>But your attitude is the pits.
>
You fell for the joke. "Nancy Pullus Patseas" is a sock puppet for
Vasos, and is meant to be ridiculously provocative. (He has his own
agenda.)

Catherine Jefferson

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Jul 9, 2010, 2:25:28 PM7/9/10
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And his own style. *All* his own. ;)

Nashton

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Jul 9, 2010, 5:30:28 PM7/9/10
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I've kill filed many of his sock puppets. Getting pretty crowded in my
kill file;)

Gene Andreiev

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Jul 13, 2010, 3:24:06 PM7/13/10
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https://sites.google.com/site/novgorodnik10021/

Is Mokosh, only Mokosh!

We must return to the moist, soft, warm, Slavonic,
obshchina, peasant deity of Mokosh and abandon the
urban, reptile, mechantile religion of the Greeks and
Jews, who want to turn us all into wolves while we are
sleeping so they can suck our blood. We Slavs are
just one big extended family with no bounds of
ownership, we are embraced by our great thunder father
Tsar and our long armed earth mother Mokosh. The Tsar
is the most wise thundering high priest of Mokosh. The
land is our fertile mother Mokosh who nourishes us,
that which we put into the ground she returns to us.
Plowing is like taking a knife to tear my mother's
bosom, then when I die she will not take me to her
bosom to rest. Land is loaned, not owned, it is our
mother heifer, the great round egg of fertility, which
holds the blood of our ancestors in its yolk. No, we
must warm the earth with fire and water it so that our
ancestors may be with us when our doors and windows
are open as the roots of our tree, whose crown is
Perun of Thunder, father of all Tsars. We must sew
the scalps of the urban reptile people into a big tent
where our ancestors may visit us to be warmed by our
fire. Cattle are sacred for we must be as cattle and
live in herds and abhor the abomination of
individualism. It is the wondrous glory of our women
to be white heifers. We must get all humans to be as
cattle in one grand obshchina for their salvation.
Fear of censure binds all into collective behavior for
their can be no individualism or privacy. The Greeks
and Jews tried to destroy our great communal bonds,
with greed, inequality and competition, but we softly
fit into the landscape with equality and brotherhood.
Mokosh reveals the weather to those who put an ear to
the ground and even greater secrets to those who sleep
on the ground. Mokosh always works in circles, wind
whirls, seasons cycle, history cycles, the sun is a
round blini. Birds make their nest in circles, for
theirs is the same religion as ours. Moskosh is the
big round toilet bowl which whirls us all back home.
Any attempt to break the cycle of history by
modernization can only result in times of troubles.
Turn East and say: "Moist Mother Earth, subdue every
evil and unclean being so that he may not cast a spell
on us nor do us any harm." Turn West and say: "Moist
Mother Earth, engulf the unclean power Veles in your
boiling pits, in your burning fires." Turn South and
say: "Moist Mother Earth, calm the winds coming from
the south and all bad weather. Calm the moving sands
and whirlwinds." Turn North and say: "Moist Mother
Earth, calm the north winds and the clouds, subdue the
snowstorms and the cold."


Alexander Arnakis

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Jul 13, 2010, 3:58:43 PM7/13/10
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On Tue, 13 Jul 2010 12:24:06 -0700 (PDT), Gene Andreiev
<novgorod...@gmail.com> wrote:

>https://sites.google.com/site/novgorodnik10021/
>
>Is Mokosh, only Mokosh!
>
> We must return to the moist, soft, warm, Slavonic,
>obshchina, peasant deity of Mokosh and abandon the
>urban, reptile, mechantile religion of the Greeks and
>Jews, who want to turn us all into wolves while we are
>sleeping so they can suck our blood. We Slavs are
>just one big extended family with no bounds of
>ownership, we are embraced by our great thunder father
>Tsar and our long armed earth mother Mokosh.

Thank you, Vasos. Now back on your meds.

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