ARE YOU REALLY SAVED?
Donna Kupp
Christianity has fallen away from God! Most of the organized church
system has wandered so far from the truth that it refuses to even
listen
to the truth. The apostle Paul warned us that this would happen. He
said:
"For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine;
but wanting to have their ears tickled, they will accumulate
for themselves teachers in accordance to their own desires; and
will turn away their ears from THE TRUTH..."
2 Timothy 4:3 NAS
The Psalmist defines "the truth":
"and THY LAW is THE TRUTH."
Psalms 119:142 KJV
In both the business world and the religious world the formula for
success has become: "Give the people whatever they want!" The
people do not want the truth, they want their ears tickled with
"smooth things." Therefore it has been unpopular for the churches
to teach that we must obey God's law and give up our lives on this
earth to the service of Jesus Christ. It may be unpopular, but that
is exactly what Jesus asked for, our life and nothing less. He said:
"...but whosoever shall lose his life for my sake and the
gospel's,
the same shall save it."
Mark 8:35 KJV
He gave us no options; we must surrender this lifetime to Him, no
matter what it may cost! The first act of our surrender is to obey
God's law, just as Jesus said:
"...but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments."
Matthew 19:17 KJV
Sadly, many who have turned to Jesus for salvation have been led
away from obedience to the Ten Commandments by false teachers
who tell them that they may remain a "carnal" Christian (one who
disobeys God's Commandments) and yet still be saved.
ALL WHO ACCEPT THEIR LIE WILL BE LOST!
IS THE CARNAL CHRISTIAN A BELIEVER?
Many professing Christians have been persuaded to think that they
have
received eternal life despite their ongoing bondage to sin. They are
told they are born again children of God and saved forever the moment
they say: "I believe in Jesus and receive Him as my Saviour." Their
teachers offer this verse as proof of the sinner's instant salvation:
"He who believes in the Son has eternal life;"
However, the rest of that verse is seldom quoted:
"but he who does not OBEY the Son shall not see life,
but the WRATH OF GOD abides on him."
John 3:36 NAS
They are being told that they do not have to obey; the only
requirement is that they "believe." Yet the apostle Paul said that
the mind that will not subject itself to the law of God is a carnal
(sinful) mind and hostile toward God. He wrote:
"...the CARNAL MIND is enmity (hostile) against God:
for it IS NOT SUBJECT TO THE LAW OF GOD,"
Romans 8:7 KJV
Is it possible that a person will inherit eternal life even if that
person is hostile toward God and will not obey His law? All major
denominations now say: "YES!", the carnal person will still be
saved if he "believes." The apostle Paul says "NO!":
"For to be carnally minded is death;"
Romans 8:6 KJV
This devastating doctrine of "The saved (but still carnal) Christian"
has been firmly established in our churches because the meaning of the
word believe is not always clear. The only true definition of what it
means to "believe" is the scriptural one found in John 3:36 (see
above).
Examine it carefully and you will see that ONLY THOSE WHO
OBEY TRULY BELIEVE.
THE PROOF! (John 3:36)
IF: One who believes in the Son has eternal life,
AND: One who does not obey shall not see life,
THEN: The one who does not obey, does not believe.
For it is clear that the one who shall not see life, could not
possibly have eternal life. Scripture does not allow any one who
will not obey to be counted a "believer." Thus any church that
considers a willfully disobedient person to have eternal life is
teaching a fatal error. One may be either disobedient or a believer,
but not both. There are no carnal believers...
Satan's lie ("the carnal Christian") is carefully designed to soothe
the conscience of those who seek the easy way. You may be sure
that all who profess it to be an option are deceived to some degree.
Paul did not teach that we had a third choice; quite to the contrary
he said:
1."For if you live according to the flesh YOU WILL DIE, but
2. If by the Spirit
you put to death the deeds of the body YOU WILL LIVE."
Romans 8:13 RSV
In the New Testament, just as in the Old Testament, there are only
two choices: death or life; sin or righteousness. Paul gave no hope
to the sinful man when he said:
"You are slaves of the one whom you obey, either of sin, which
leads
to death, or of obedience, which leads to righteousness."
Romans 6:16 RSV
In his letter to the Galatians, verse 5:19, Paul described the deeds
of the flesh (our sinful nature) and then went on to make the
requirement for the cleansing of the flesh absolutely clear.
"Now those who belong to Christ Jesus
have crucified the flesh with its passions and desires."
Galatians 5:24 NAS
Please stop and take note of the past tense that Paul used. The
apostle did not say they will crucify the flesh, he did not say that
they had a choice or that it would be done for them. He said they
had already crucified the flesh.
Those who truly belong to Christ Jesus - those who are "His" -
have already crucified their own sinful nature. Therefore, by that
verse those who are seeking God have an infallible measuring stick
within hemselves. They have only to look at their own lifestyle to
see where they stand with God. If they have not yet totally
committed themselves to put to death the deeds of the body
through obedience to God's law, they do not yet "belong" to Jesus.
No one can deceive you, nor can you deceive yourself if you
measure by the Ten Commandments.
The strategy of Satan in the modern church has been to make
people believe that they have eternal life the moment they accept
Jesus as their personal Saviour. (A very easy path indeed!) The
act of receiving Jesus does bring joy to the heart; however, it
reveals that they now have the right (or power) to become a child
of God. (born-again) They now have the gift of faith from God
which enables them to surrender this life to God. (If they will!)
The apostle John showed us the process of salvation when he wrote
this verse:
"But as many as RECEIVED Him,
to them He gave the right TO BECOME children of God..."
(born-again)
John 1:12 NAS
Jesus said:
"the way is narrow that leads to life,
and FEW are those who find it."
Matthew 7:14 NAS
The first step on that narrow path to life is to repent of our sin and
accept (receive) Jesus as our Saviour. The next step is to accept
Jesus as our LORD and surrender all of our heart, our soul, our
strength and our mind to serve Him forever. The mark of a servant
is that he obeys the commandments of his Master.
These ideas were commonly taught in the early church Fathers
(pre 300 AD) but have been largely discarded by modern
Christianity. The modern day church is unable to recognize the
"man of LAWlessness" because they have set aside God's law
and/or the necessity of obedience in order to inherit eternal life.
HK
I am not a Seventh Day Adventist (and never have been), a natural
Jew, or a Catholic. I am simply the least of Christ's brethren who
love Him and keep His Commandments.
The Seven Deadly Deceptions Of Counterfeit Christianity
http://www.freetruth.info
Nicodemus
4ac88b...@d19g2000prm.googlegroups.com:
I stopped reading The Scriptures, it was better for my mental health.
There is only One God, The Creator of The Universe, and everyone must
face his place in the tapestry of wonder and amazement.
bob young
If there were an all powerful god no-one would need to lie,
there would be nothing to lie about
That one myth among thousands of other myths needs to be
propped up
means people who ask questions and make observations MUST be
termed liars.
Think about it.
Oooops ! - sorry - I forgot......... few religionists 'think'.
bob young
"john w
>
> x-no-archive: yes
> On Mon, 30 Jun 2008 09:47:38 -0700 (PDT), Donna Kupp
> <dk...@charter.net> wrote:
> © 2008 John D Weatherly all rights reserved; no portion of this post
> may be used anywhere else without written permission of the author.
> >ARE YOU REALLY SAVED?
>
> Only two people know. God knows, and I know.
Must be nice to have your own god.
Gives you a feeling of power and superiority does it?
The psychiatric profession, of course, has a name for that
>
> "Yes." I am born again.
>
> I may not be perfect, but I rest in His Love.
> >
> >Christianity has fallen away from God!
>
> Much of it has, yes.
LOL. It was never even close
and the reason for the falling away
is the steady march of scientific progress
that daily chips away at the imaginary edifice of religions
>
> Most of the organized church
> >system has wandered so far from the truth that it refuses to even
> >listen
> >to the truth.
>
> Very true. Today, we have many groups that don't even recognize the
> Godness of the Savior, God in flesh.
see above
>
> Others want us to pretend He didn't die in our stead, and they want
> to hold our feet to the fire, and demand that we keep the Old Law,
> when no one who has ever tried, has done so.
>
> The apostle Paul warned us that this would happen. He
> >said:
> >
> > "For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine;
> > but wanting to have their ears tickled, they will accumulate
> > for themselves teachers in accordance to their own desires; and
> > will turn away their ears from THE TRUTH..."
> > 2 Timothy 4:3 NAS
Yes - intelligent people doubted suppression,
even back in the days when almost everyone was that way inclined.
>
> True.
> There are those who say, as does Oprah Winfrey. "There are MANY
> ways to God. Jesus can't be the only way; He just CAN'T be!"
> And many worship at the Church of Oprah.
>
> >
> >The Psalmist defines "the truth":
> >
> > "and THY LAW is THE TRUTH."
> > Psalms 119:142 KJV
> >
> >In both the business world and the religious world the formula for
> >success has become: "Give the people whatever they want!" The
> >people do not want the truth, they want their ears tickled with
> >"smooth things." Therefore it has been unpopular for the churches
> >to teach that we must obey God's law and give up our lives on this
> >earth to the service of Jesus Christ. It may be unpopular, but that
> >is exactly what Jesus asked for, our life and nothing less. He said:
> >
> > "...but whosoever shall lose his life for my sake and the
> >gospel's,
> > the same shall save it."
> > Mark 8:35 KJV
> >
> >He gave us no options; we must surrender this lifetime to Him, no
> >matter what it may cost! The first act of our surrender is to obey
> >God's law, just as Jesus said:
> >
> > "...but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments."
> > Matthew 19:17 KJV
>
> And yet, if we sit down and very carefully examine JUST the
> commandments Jesus gave us, and that James gave us, and that Paul gave
> us and that John gave us, (which is most of the New Testament), we
> find we can't even be faithful and 100 % keep EVERY command in the New
> Testament.
Sorry to burst our bubble, but the commandments were
theorized by frightened humanity
of the time who put a powerful imaginary god there in an
effort to have them stick.
It failed of course.
>
> Jesus gave us new commands because He knew that NO MAN could keep
> the Old Commandments perfectly. It wasn't possible.
I know
>
> John Weatherly
Why do you need then, to go to such great lengths in writing,
quoting ancient theories, trying to justify your belief?
Nature tells man to consult reason, and to take it for his
guide: religion teaches him that his reason is corrupted,
that it is only a treacherous guide, given by a deceitful
God to lead his creatures astray. Nature tells man to
enlighten himself, to search after truth, to instruct
himself in his duties: religion enjoins him to examine
nothing, to remain in ignorance, to fear truth.
[Paul Henry Thirty D'Holbach]
Bob
Humanist, atheist, realist, sentimentalist Brit.
Man creates gods in his own image;
then spends the rest of his life
manipulating them to his heart's content
Andrew
> Jesus gave us new commands because He knew that NO MAN
> could keep the Old Commandments perfectly. It wasn't possible.
>
> John Weatherly
Have you considered Zachariah and Elisabeth, the parents of John
the Baptist? It says, "they were both righteous before God, walking
in all of the commandments and ordinances of the Lord blameless."
Luke 1:6
And God says, "Have you considered My servant Job, that there is
none like him on the earth, a blameless and upright man, one who
fears God and shuns evil?" Job 1:8
Therefore, although they had sinned (for all have sinned), they turned
from it and by His grace did in fact keep His commandments.
Jesus speaks to us today also saying.."Go and sin no more."
John 8;11
So we see that He offers full forgiveness for all our sins, but He
also gives us grace to obey as shown in the examples above.
Andrew
bob young
Andrew wrote:
>
> "john w @yahoo.com>" wrote in message news:h2pi649e1ivbg3pli...@4ax.com...
>
> > Jesus gave us new commands because He knew that NO MAN
> > could keep the Old Commandments perfectly. It wasn't possible.
> >
> > John Weatherly
WOW a mere human who *KNOWS* what a so called 'son of a god'
was thinking over two thousand years ago WOW.
[May we have an introduction, or even an audience with you,
Your Honour......!
They do say that religion os for the arrogant. Thanks for
proving it.
Jesus by the way is nothing more than a myth, with nothing
to back him up, aggravated by the lack of any data at all
from the cradle up to the time they claimed he started
preaching at age around twenty
Grow up
You never see animals going through the absurd and often
horrible fooleries of magic and religion. Only man behaves
with such gratuitous folly. It is the price he has to pay
for being intelligent but not, as yet, quite intelligent
enough.
[Aldous Leonard Huxley]
Donna Kupp
> x-no-archive: yes
> On Sat, 5 Jul 2008 00:12:13 -0700, "Andrew" <andrew.321re...@usa.net>
> wrote:
> © 2008 John D Weatherly all rights reserved; no portion of this post
> may be used anywhere else without written permission of the author.
>
>
> >> Jesus gave us new commands because He knew that NO MAN
> >> could keep the Old Commandments perfectly. It wasn't possible.
>
> >> John Weatherly
>
> >Have you considered Zachariah and Elisabeth, the parents of John
> >the Baptist? It says, "they were both righteous before God, walking
> >in all of the commandments and ordinances of the Lord blameless."
> > Luke 1:6
>
>
> #1 You didn't claim, "the Bible is FULL of them! There have been
> THOUSANDS. There have been MILLIONS."
>
> You have pointed out a handful.
>
> Do you believe the Bible's claim that there will be
> 144,000 ?
> That there will be more souls in heaven (just among the martyrs)
> than John could count?
>
> #2 Do you want to believe in a gospel of Inclusion?
> (Go into ALL the world, and preach the good news to EVERYONE.
> Baptize (those who believe).
>
> Or do you want to believe in a gospel of Exclusion?
> Only the 5 who believe PRECISELY the way YOU do... only THEY will
> "get in."
>
> I would like to get to heaven and see every person who ever breathed
> air on Earth, in heaven.
>
> I won't, but I'm going to do what I can do get as many souls as
> possible into God's Kingdom.
> What's the alternative?
>
> The alternative is what you preach.
>
>
>
> >And God says, "Have you considered My servant Job, that there is
> >none like him on the earth, a blameless and upright man, one who
> >fears God and shuns evil?" Job 1:8
>
> >Therefore, although they had sinned (for all have sinned), they turned
> >from it and by His grace did in fact keep His commandments.
>
> >Jesus speaks to us today also saying.."Go and sin no more."
> > John 8;11
>
> anymore?"
>
> Do you know 1,000 who went and didn't sin anymore?
>
> Do you know 100? Do you know 10?
>
> Do you know even One?
>
> Have YOU not sinned since you became a Christian?
>
> I can't say I have!
>
> I believe your expectations are unreasonably high.
>
> And I will continue to follow what makes sense to me.
>
>
>
> >So we see that He offers full forgiveness for all our sins, but He
> >also gives us grace to obey as shown in the examples above.
>
> Jesus mentioned "made it."
>
> Yet John (Revelation) says that Heaven is already filled to the
> rafters with believers who have died and gone to Heaven. More bodies
> than John could even count! "Countless." And they were JUST THE
> MARTYRS!
>
> Do you even believe the woman He said those words to, TRULY "went
> away, and NEVER sinned again." ?
>
> I don't.
>
> I believe you preach a "Gospel" you can't live.
>
> Figure out what actually WORKS in your life.
>
> "I've found _______ works, _______ doesn't. ________ worked for ME,
> ________ didn't.
>
> And when you've figured out those things that work in YOUR life, I'd
> LOVE to hear about THAT.
>
> You aren't even keeping 1 Cor 13.
>
> 1. You don't "think the best of people." You aren't thinking the
> best about ME.
>
> 2. You don't "give everyone the benefit of the doubt. You don't
> give ME the benefit of the doubt.
>
> (I don't CARE/ my point is, you aren't obeying 1 Cor 13 ("The Love
> Chapter")
***************************************************************************
Jesus said:
"...If you would enter into life, keep the commandments." Matt 19:17
Jesus said:
"Enter ye in at the strait gate:
for wide is the gate, and broad is the way,
THAT LEADETH TO DESTRUCTION,
and MANY there be which go in thereat:
Because strait is the gate,
and narrow is the way,
WHICH LEADETH UNTO LIFE, and FEW there be that find it."
Matt 7:13-14 (KJV)
Donna writes:
So, John W, will you contradict Jesus and set aside the
commandments of God to keep the traditions of man? Will you join
the MANY on the broad way that leads to destruction?
Donna Kupp
Andrew
>>> could keep the Old Commandments perfectly. It wasn't possible.
>>>
>>> John Weatherly
>>
>>
>>Have you considered Zachariah and Elisabeth, the parents of John
>>the Baptist? It says, "they were both righteous before God, walking
>>in all of the commandments and ordinances of the Lord blameless."
>> Luke 1:6
>
>
> #1 You didn't claim, "the Bible is FULL of them! There have been
> THOUSANDS. There have been MILLIONS."
>
> You have pointed out a handful.
How many do you want? The point is that some
did. Whereas you thought that it was impossible.
>
> Do you believe the Bible's claim that there will be
> 144,000 ?
> That there will be more souls in heaven (just among the martyrs)
> than John could count?
>
> #2 Do you want to believe in a gospel of Inclusion?
> (Go into ALL the world, and preach the good news to EVERYONE.
> Baptize (those who believe).
>
> Or do you want to believe in a gospel of Exclusion?
> Only the 5 who believe PRECISELY the way YOU do... only THEY will
> "get in."
>
> I would like to get to heaven and see every person who ever breathed
> air on Earth, in heaven.
>
> I won't, but I'm going to do what I can do get as many souls as
> possible into God's Kingdom.
> What's the alternative?
>
> The alternative is what you preach.
>
>>
>>And God says, "Have you considered My servant Job, that there is
>>none like him on the earth, a blameless and upright man, one who
>>fears God and shuns evil?" Job 1:8
>>
>>Therefore, although they had sinned (for all have sinned), they turned
>>from it and by His grace did in fact keep His commandments.
>>
>>Jesus speaks to us today also saying.."Go and sin no more."
>> John 8;11
>
> Yep. Do you know 10,000 who have managed to "go and don't sin anymore?"
>
> Do you know 1,000 who went and didn't sin anymore?
>
> Do you know 100? Do you know 10?
>
> Do you know even One?
>
> Have YOU not sinned since you became a Christian?
>
> I can't say I have!
>
> I believe your expectations are unreasonably high.
Do you believe that God is unreasonable because He
expects us to obey Him..even if He provides the means
for us to do so?
> And I will continue to follow what makes sense to me.
Sadly most will follow their own way and reject the pathway
of life, by doing so they embrace death. "There is a way that
seems right to a man, but in the end it leads to death."
Proverbs 16:25
NOSPAM
>
> I won't, but I'm going to do what I can do get as many souls as
>possible into God's Kingdom.
How so? By cursing at them, calling them 'ass holes',
'shit-for-brains', and of course, "Gxx damned liars", liar- johnnie?
HOW does THAT win anyone over to Christ?
You're a disgrace.
bob young
That is intriguing, how does 'He' do that ?
Andrew
> Andrew wrote:
>> Do you believe that God is unreasonable because He
>> expects us to obey Him..even if He provides the means
>> for us to do so?
>
> That is intriguing, how does 'He' do that ?
"By His divine power, God has given us everything we need for living a
godly life. We have received all of this by coming to know Him, the one
who called us to Himself by means of His marvelous glory and excellence.
And because of His glory and excellence, He has given us great and
precious promises. These are the promises that enable you to share His
divine nature and escape the world's corruption caused by human desires."
2 Peter 1:3-4
GQ
I have no argument with this at all. These verses alone say that ALL can
be saved, including gay people.
Not only gay people have "human desires", most hets have worse desires
than gays. So be aware of Romans 2:1 before you go criticizing anyone.
Andrew
> Andrew wrote:
>> "bob young" wrote:
>>> Andrew wrote:
>>
>>>> Do you believe that God is unreasonable because He
>>>> expects us to obey Him..even if He provides the means
>>>> for us to do so?
>>>
>>> That is intriguing, how does 'He' do that ?
>>
>>
>> "By His divine power, God has given us everything we need for living a
>> godly life. We have received all of this by coming to know Him, the one
>> who called us to Himself by means of His marvelous glory and excellence.
>>
>> And because of His glory and excellence, He has given us great and
>> precious promises. These are the promises that enable you to share His
>> divine nature and escape the world's corruption caused by human desires."
>>
>> 2 Peter 1:3-4
>
> I have no argument with this at all. These verses alone say that ALL can
> be saved, including gay people.
Yes, ALL can be saved, including gay people. Therefore accept Him now.
Give your life to Him and receive the glorious future He has for you in His
eternal kingdom of Glory, because of the merits of Jesus Christ who died
for you.
> Not only gay people have "human desires", most hets have worse desires
> than gays. So be aware of Romans 2:1 before you go criticizing anyone.
Jesus came not to criticize and condemn..but rather to -save- sinners.
"For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the
world; but that the world through him might be saved."
John 3:17
However, He did condemn the religionists of the day who
worked against Him.
Andrew
bob young
Andrew wrote:
>
> "bob young" wrote in message news:487090CE...@netvigator.com...
> > Andrew wrote:
>
> >> Do you believe that God is unreasonable because He
> >> expects us to obey Him..even if He provides the means
> >> for us to do so?
> >
> > That is intriguing, how does 'He' do that ?
Nice to see you back Andrew, missed you around for a while
>
> "By His divine power,
There's no 'power' if there were there would be no
earthquakes
burying alive children that the church claims using a book
of theirs
that their god made all humans in 'his' image.
It is all a 'man' thing.
sorry about that.
God has given us everything we need for living a
> godly life.
You mean like 'cancer' ?
We have received all of this by coming to know Him, the one
> who called us to Himself by means of His marvelous glory and excellence.
I see no glory of any kind and certainly no excellence.
All I see is confusion, like everyone else sees.
>
> And because of His glory and excellence, He has given us great and
> precious promises. These are the promises that enable you to share His
> divine nature and escape the world's corruption caused by human desires."
>
> 2 Peter 1:3-4
Peter. yes - just another human !
bob young
Andrew wrote:
>
> "GQ" wrote in message news:1215360379.177470@wblv-ip-nnrp-2...
> > Andrew wrote:
> >> "bob young" wrote:
> >>> Andrew wrote:
> >>
> >>>> Do you believe that God is unreasonable because He
> >>>> expects us to obey Him..even if He provides the means
> >>>> for us to do so?
> >>>
> >>> That is intriguing, how does 'He' do that ?
> >>
> >>
> >> "By His divine power, God has given us everything we need for living a
> >> godly life. We have received all of this by coming to know Him, the one
> >> who called us to Himself by means of His marvelous glory and excellence.
> >>
> >> And because of His glory and excellence, He has given us great and
> >> precious promises. These are the promises that enable you to share His
> >> divine nature and escape the world's corruption caused by human desires."
> >>
> >> 2 Peter 1:3-4
> >
> > I have no argument with this at all. These verses alone say that ALL can
> > be saved, including gay people.
>
> Yes, ALL can be saved, including gay people.
What are you going to do for them?
Modify their brains that evolution provided them with,
a tendency for love towards their own sex.
for thousands of years people with these feelings locked
themselves away
in abject fear and misery in case they might be 'discovered'
and punished.
Therefore accept Him now.
I reject him because he does not exist.,
> Give your life to Him and receive the glorious future He has for you in His
> eternal kingdom of Glory, because of the merits of Jesus Christ who died
> for you.
Prove it
>
> > Not only gay people have "human desires", most hets have worse desires
> > than gays. So be aware of Romans 2:1 before you go criticizing anyone.
>
> Jesus came not to criticize and condemn..but rather to -save- sinners.
He was most likely a myth based on earlier myths of similar ilk.
>
> "For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the
> world; but that the world through him might be saved."
> John 3:17
>
> However, He did condemn the religionists of the day who
> worked against Him.
no it was religionist of the day who did the condemning.
They were scared and it is still the same today.
Bob
Humanist, atheist, realist, sentimentalist, Brit.
Man creates gods in his own image;
and then spends the rest of his life
manipulating them to his heart's content.
>
> Andrew
THE VEGETARIAN RETURNS!!!
he that endures to the end, the same shall be saved.
"bob young" <alasp...@netvigator.com> wrote in message
news:4869B270...@netvigator.com...
Andrew
> none of us are saved yet. we're still on earth and we're
not in heaven YET. he that endures to the end, the same
shall be saved.
'The preaching of the cross is to them that perish
foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the
power of God."
1 Corinthians 1:18
Most translations now say, "are being saved."
And Jesus said several times that salvation
was conditional on, "enduring until the end."
Matt 10:22,24:18
Through a vital connection with the living
Savior, all may have of this grace enabling
us to endure until the end, and be saved at
last in His eternal kingdom of glory.
Andrew
bob young
"THE VEGETARIAN RETURNS!!!" wrote:
>
> none of us are saved yet. we're still on earth and we're not in heaven YET.
> he that endures to the end, the same shall be saved.
Someone in heaven heard that his best friend down on earth
had just passed away.
ÒOh I'm so looking forward to seeing him againÓ the man
said.
ÒSorryÓ said God, ÒBut he will not be coming here because he
has been a little more sinful than you, so we will be
sending him to that other place we call HellÓ.
So here's this man, sitting for eternity in paradise next to
his loving God, whilst his friend, who had been just a
little more sinful than he, is about to roast for eternity
on burning coals in a place called Hell.
Is it conceivable that anything could be more banal,
juvenile, or crassly stupid?
Bob
Humanist Brit.
Hong Kong
Andrew
"THE VEGETARIAN" wrote:
>
> none of us are saved yet. we're still on earth and we're not in heaven YET.
> he that endures to the end, the same shall be saved.
Someone in heaven heard that his best friend down on earth
had just passed away.
Oh I'm so looking forward to seeing him again the man
said.
Sorry said God, But he will not be coming here because he
has been a little more sinful than you, so we will be
sending him to that other place we call Hell.
So here's this man, sitting for eternity in paradise next to
his loving God, whilst his friend, who had been just a
little more sinful than he, is about to roast for eternity
on burning coals in a place called Hell.
Is it conceivable that anything could be more banal,
juvenile, or crassly stupid?
Bob
_________________________________________
Perhaps, but your analogy is false. Therefore it is simply a
strawman argument. People are not saved or lost based on
how sinful they were,but rather if they had accepted the pro-
vision that God has made in order that they may be eternally
saved through the merits of Jesus Christ.
Also, your idea that God "roasts people for eternity" is an
unbiblical, satanic deception accepted by some who have
not studied their Bible.
Andrew
bob young
Andrew wrote:
>
> "bob young" wrote in message news:488AAEFD...@netvigator.com...
>
> "THE VEGETARIAN" wrote:
> >
> > none of us are saved yet. we're still on earth and we're not in heaven YET.
> > he that endures to the end, the same shall be saved.
>
> Someone in heaven heard that his best friend down on earth
> had just passed away.
>
> Oh I'm so looking forward to seeing him again the man
> said.
>
> Sorry said God, But he will not be coming here because he
> has been a little more sinful than you, so we will be
> sending him to that other place we call Hell.
>
> So here's this man, sitting for eternity in paradise next to
> his loving God, whilst his friend, who had been just a
> little more sinful than he, is about to roast for eternity
> on burning coals in a place called Hell.
>
> Is it conceivable that anything could be more banal,
> juvenile, or crassly stupid?
>
> Bob
> _________________________________________
>
> Perhaps, but your analogy is false. Therefore it is simply a
> strawman argument.
so you would like to think or imagine
People are not saved or lost based on
> how sinful they were,
Crass lying and you know it. Sin is preached from the
pulpit everywhere and every Sunday.
The problem with Xtians is you want it all ways, well it
does not work that way.
but rather if they had accepted the pro-
> vision that God has made in order that they may be eternally
> saved through the merits of Jesus Christ.
Garbage. In fact 'weak garbage'
>
> Also, your idea that God "roasts people for eternity" is an
> unbiblical, satanic deception accepted by some who have
> not studied their Bible.
Yea Yea Andrew...... Enjoy your holiday and when you get
back remember that commandment about bearing false witness.
Fire and brimstone Is mentioned in that old book of fables
as you FULL WELL KNOW
Andrew
> Andrew wrote:
>> "bob young" wrote:
>>
>> Someone in heaven heard that his best friend down on earth
>> had just passed away.
>>
>> Oh I'm so looking forward to seeing him again the man
>> said.
>>
>> Sorry said God, But he will not be coming here because he
>> has been a little more sinful than you, so we will be
>> sending him to that other place we call Hell.
>>
>> So here's this man, sitting for eternity in paradise next to
>> his loving God, whilst his friend, who had been just a
>> little more sinful than he, is about to roast for eternity
>> on burning coals in a place called Hell.
>>
>> Is it conceivable that anything could be more banal,
>> juvenile, or crassly stupid?
>>
>> Bob
>> _________________________________________
>>
>> Perhaps, but your analogy is false. Therefore it is simply a
>> strawman argument.
>
>
> so you would like to think or imagine
>
> People are not saved or lost based on
>> how sinful they were,
>
> Crass lying and you know it. Sin is preached from the
> pulpit everywhere and every Sunday.
And you go every Sunday, which is why you know?
> The problem with Xtians is you want it all ways, well it
> does not work that way.
No, there is only ONE WAY - JESUS who loves you and
who died for you.
> but rather if they had accepted the pro-
>> vision that God has made in order that they may be eternally
>> saved through the merits of Jesus Christ.
>
> Garbage. In fact 'weak garbage'
Eternal life is not 'garbage,' but a most wonderful gift.
>> Also, your idea that God "roasts people for eternity" is an
>> unbiblical, satanic deception accepted by some who have
>> not studied their Bible.
>
> Yea Yea Andrew...... Enjoy your holiday and when you get
> back remember that commandment about bearing false witness.
> Fire and brimstone Is mentioned in that old book of fables
> as you FULL WELL KNOW
True, but this "fire" devourers and consumes those who reject
salvation -not- "roast them for eternity" "Fire came down from
God out of heaven, and devoured them" -- Revelation 20:9
"The wicked shall perish, and the enemies of the LORD shall
be as the fat of lambs: they shall consume; into smoke shall
they consume away." -- Psalm 37:20
> Bob
> Humanist, atheist, realist, sentimentalist, Brit.
Andrew
bob young
Are you denying the truth in what I said, or, as is usual
when religionists are in a corner, simply being cute?
Yes went to chuch/chapel for over twenty years. I was
confirmed also
>
> > The problem with Xtians is you want it all ways, well it
> > does not work that way.
>
> No, there is only ONE WAY - JESUS who loves you and
> who died for you.
Prove it
>
> > but rather if they had accepted the pro-
> >> vision that God has made in order that they may be eternally
> >> saved through the merits of Jesus Christ.
> >
> > Garbage. In fact 'weak garbage'
>
> Eternal life is not 'garbage,' but a most wonderful gift.
Prove it
>
> >> Also, your idea that God "roasts people for eternity" is an
> >> unbiblical, satanic deception accepted by some who have
> >> not studied their Bible.
> >
> > Yea Yea Andrew...... Enjoy your holiday and when you get
> > back remember that commandment about bearing false witness.
> > Fire and brimstone Is mentioned in that old book of fables
> > as you FULL WELL KNOW
>
> True, but this "fire" devourers and consumes those who reject
> salvation -not- "roast them for eternity" "Fire came down from
> God out of heaven, and devoured them" -- Revelation 20:9
Prose from some primitive as far as I am concerned is 'water
off a duck's back'
In case you had not noticed........ it is now year 2008
>
> "The wicked shall perish, and the enemies of the LORD shall
> be as the fat of lambs: they shall consume; into smoke shall
> they consume away." -- Psalm 37:20
Yes they were scared of the wicked back then, no police, no
criminal laws and no Courts all they had were imaginary gods
to scare the baddies.
Andrew
> Andrew wrote:
>> "bob young" wrote in message news:488AE391...@netvigator.com...
>> >> had just passed away.
>> >>
>> >> Oh I'm so looking forward to seeing him again the man said.
>> >>
>> >> Sorry said God, But he will not be coming here because he
>> >> has been a little more sinful than you, so we will be
>> >> sending him to that other place we call Hell.
>> >>
>> >> So here's this man, sitting for eternity in paradise next to
>> >> his loving God, whilst his friend, who had been just a
>> >> little more sinful than he, is about to roast for eternity
>> >> on burning coals in a place called Hell.
>> >>
>> >> Is it conceivable that anything could be more banal,
>> >> juvenile, or crassly stupid?
>> >>
>> >> Bob
>> >> _________________________________________
>> >>
>> >> Perhaps, but your analogy is false. Therefore it is simply a
>> >> strawman argument.
>> >
>> > so you would like to think or imagine
>> >
>> > People are not saved or lost based on
>> >> how sinful they were,
>> >
>> > Crass lying and you know it. Sin is preached from the
>> > pulpit everywhere and every Sunday.
>>
>> And you go every Sunday, which is why you know?
>
> Are you denying the truth in what I said,
We are not saved or lost based on our sinfulness, but rather
on our acceptance of the wonderful provision that God has
made for our salvation through the merits of Jesus Christ.
> Yes went to chuch/chapel for over twenty years. I was
> confirmed also
If you experienced abuse or other trauma in those times, it
would be immature for you to blame God and to turn away
from Him because of that.
>> > The problem with Xtians is you want it all ways, well it
>> > does not work that way.
>>
>> No, there is only ONE WAY - JESUS who loves you and
>> who died for you.
>
> Prove it
OK I'll prove it to you. Here's what to do. Start a daily Bible
reading program going through the four gospels that tell of
the life and ministry of Jesus. Read with a humble heart and
precede each reading with prayer and ask Jesus to reveal His
love to you. If you do this, then you will know that He loves
you and that He died for you.
Andrew
bob young
ROFL. All I did was see thru the con.
>
> >> > The problem with Xtians is you want it all ways, well it
> >> > does not work that way.
> >>
> >> No, there is only ONE WAY - JESUS who loves you and
> >> who died for you.
Jesus = mythology
> >
> > Prove it
>
> OK I'll prove it to you. Here's what to do. Start a daily Bible
> reading program going through the four gospels that tell of
> the life and ministry of Jesus.
more ROFL. How can anything be proven by a mythogical yarn?
Read with a humble heart and
> precede each reading with prayer and ask Jesus to reveal His
> love to you. If you do this, then you will know that He loves
> you and that He died for you.
Been there - done that and seen thru it
Bob
Humanist, atheist, realist, sentimentalist, Brit.
Man creates gods in his own image;
THE VEGETARIAN RETURNS!!!
"Andrew" <andrew....@usa.net> wrote in message
news:qfidnTeE2oMXHhfV...@earthlink.com...
Pastor Dave
<VE...@NOWHERE.COM> spake thusly:
The problem here, is that he is reading it in a time vacuum.
What was true then, because of the Mosaic economy still
standing and Christ not having returned yet, is not always
true today.
--
"If the Bible is too old fashioned for Christians
then no one else can be expected to obey."
- unknown
vegie
in danger of trusting to themselves. They lose sight of their own weakness
and their constant need of divine strength. They are unprepared for Satan's
devices, and under temptation many, like Peter, fall into the very depths of
sin. We are admonished, "Let him that thinketh he standeth, take heed lest
he fall." 1 Cor. 10:12. Our only safety is in constant distrust of self, and
dependence on Christ. {COL 155.2}