Planned Parenthood Rant
k
read a listener's letter about one being planned for her town. She wanted to
prevent it ,using zoning laws.
DL was calling for lawyers.
Anyway, the listener had a list of analogies, FI, "my kids can't get their
teeth filled without my permission, but they can get an abortion."
There was a large list like this. Any thoughts?
I'm not trying to stir up an abortion debate...just thoughts on the
analogies.
k
Maddi Hausmann Sojourner
Did she mention the town? Some support for Planned Parenthood may
be in order.
trdm
Big-time Planned Parenthood Supporter since 1975
--
Maddi Hausmann Sojourner mad...@alumni.princeton.edu
dk
"Maddi Hausmann Sojourner" <mad...@alumni.princeton.edu> wrote in message
news:3A9C6CD8...@alumni.princeton.edu...
If I remember correctly, she mentioned the town, the street and the
intersection. It was high anti-abortion rhetoric including phrases such as
a "baby murdering centre" if I remember correctly. She made snide remarks
about Planned Parenthood being a "business" and continued the equation of PP
with radical activists trying to make a buck by "killing children". I
thought the whole thing was highly distorted, inflammatory and offensive.
Lord dk
Wondering what she'll say if their is a violent act against the clinic
k
"Maddi Hausmann Sojourner" <mad...@alumni.princeton.edu> wrote in message
news:3A9C6CD8...@alumni.princeton.edu...
> be in order.
I'm listening to the archived show now. I'll post the info.
k
Marc
My first girlfriend and I had no "protection", and if she had gone to her
drunk, abusive father to ask to go to an OBGYN for a perscription for the
pill, he would have sent her to another state and kicked my ass. We could,
however, go to the local planned parenthood, get her a checkup, and get the
Pill.
Some might say that led us into having sex, but we were having sex already.
The Pill meant we could stop risking pregnancy and abortion.
I have never heard of Planned Parenthood perfroming abortions, but I never
asked PP about it.
I think PP does a great job, and folks who want to stop PP are the same
folks that are against abortion, but wouldn't lift a finger to help kids in
foster care.
Of course, Dr. L sucks dead bears.
"k" <crystal...@davidbowie.com> wrote in message
news:CKZm6.316095$ge4.11...@news2.rdc2.tx.home.com...
Marc
> > Maddi Hausmann Sojourner mad...@alumni.princeton.edu
>
> If I remember correctly, she mentioned the town, the street and the
> intersection. It was high anti-abortion rhetoric including phrases such
as
> a "baby murdering centre" if I remember correctly. She made snide remarks
> about Planned Parenthood being a "business" and continued the equation of
PP
> with radical activists trying to make a buck by "killing children". I
> thought the whole thing was highly distorted, inflammatory and offensive.
Dr. L's ignorance should be used as a standard measurement for comparing
very large things.
Whats bigger? 2 tons of bananas or a Dr. L's ignorance worth of
cinderblocks? (for example)
k
"Maddi Hausmann Sojourner" <mad...@alumni.princeton.edu> wrote in message
news:3A9C6CD8...@alumni.princeton.edu...
>
> Did she mention the town? Some support for Planned Parenthood may
> be in order.
The town is Monrovia, Ca. Here is the city website:
Here is what the city has to say about the protests:
City Moves To Assure Rights, Safety in Planned Parenthood Dispute
Monrovia's City government has pledged to protect the constitutional rights
of both sides in a growing protest over the pending move and expansion of a
Planned Parenthood clinic in the community. Monrovia's Mayor, City Manager
and Chief of Police met this week with ministers from two local churches
spearheading the protests to explain the City's position and to begin
working pro-actively to assure both rights and safety.
The City has received protests over the clinic's pending move for several
weeks, including an organized postcard campaign. Protesters were also
present at the City Council meeting Tuesday night (Feb. 13). Many of the
protests have centered on a belief that the City of Monrovia granted a
Conditional Use Permit to allow the clinic to move to its new site on Myrtle
Avenue, south of Huntington Drive. In fact, no such permit was issued by the
City. Mayor Robert T. Bartlett explained that, "The City's only role in
Planned Parenthood's relocation was to review architectural and construction
plans for the new site, a routine checking of plans for conformity to
building codes and safety regulations. The City was never asked to approve
the relocation because City approval was not necessary. In fact, the City
does not have the discretion to approve or disapprove of such a use, as
zoning regulations already allow medical offices and clinics at that site."
Bartlett also pointed out that the issue of abortion is a federal matter and
outside the purview of the local government. He said the City is working
with the local churches to help direct their message to the federal
government, "where it will be most effective." "What we can do as a City,
and what we have a responsibility to do" he said, "is to assure that the
rights of everyone involved are protected."
Monrovia Chief of Police Joseph Santoro added that his department would be
"working hard to insure the rights and security of all involved." Santoro
said that his department has met with the planners of a public protest
scheduled for this Saturday in Monrovia to insure security and establish
safe ground rules. Monrovia's Police Department worked with anti-abortion
protesters in another demonstration at the site of the clinic several weeks
ago. "Our only involvement can be in the upholding of our national, state
and local laws that allow both the clinic to operate and people to
peacefully protest its operation," he said. "It is our responsibility to
work with everyone involved to protect their constitutional rights and
assure their lawful activities."
# # #
Tinas49ers
Her list was right. We wouldnt do fillings in our office without the parents
consent and from what I've heard, in Calif., at least, a minor can get an
abortion. Now tell me, which is more invasive, which has more of a possible
negative outcome? PS, no mean dental jokes, ok?
Tina
We could learn a lot from crayons: some are sharp, some are pretty, some are
dull, some have weird names, and all are different colors ...but they all have
to learn to live in the same box.
k
"Tinas49ers" <tinas...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20010227232306...@ng-fn1.aol.com...
Now tell me, which is more invasive, which has more of a possible
> negative outcome? PS, no mean dental jokes, ok?
Being forced to have a baby at 15 has potential for a more negative outcome.
But, here's a few key points to consider:
When facing an unplanned pregnancy, most young women (about 60 percent) talk
to their parents. A substantial number of those who do not, cite fear of
physical or emotional abuse as the main reason.
Laws pressuring young women to carry pregnancies to term are dangerous.
Teens are 2.5 times more likely to die in pregnancy or childbirth than adult
women. In addition, young women between the ages of 15 and 19 are 24 times
more likely to die during child- birth than from legal first trimester
abortions.
State laws illogically treat a young woman as mature enough to become a
mother, choose adoption or make health care decisions for her child or
herself - but not mature enough to make her own abortion and contraception
decisions.
Judicial bypasses allow a young woman to forego parental involvement if a
judge rules that she is mature enough to have an abortion. This process is
open to each judge's bias, and many times a judge will refuse to even hear a
young woman's request. In addition, judicial approval is time consuming and
increases physical, emotional and financial hardship.
Maddi Hausmann Sojourner
>
> "Maddi Hausmann Sojourner" <mad...@alumni.princeton.edu> wrote in message
> news:3A9C6CD8...@alumni.princeton.edu...
>
> >
> > Did she mention the town? Some support for Planned Parenthood may
> > be in order.
>
> The town is Monrovia, Ca. Here is the city website:
>
> http://www.ci.monrovia.ca.us/
Thanks, k. I'll follow up and see if PP needs some financial help.
trdm
Wonders if its time for the annual fund-raiser
Marc
> Her list was right. We wouldnt do fillings in our office without the
parents
> consent and from what I've heard, in Calif., at least, a minor can get an
> abortion. Now tell me, which is more invasive, which has more of a
possible
> negative outcome? PS, no mean dental jokes, ok?
You work in a dentists office? I didn't know the depth of evil and sadism
you had sunk to.
On the subject, I see your point.
But in life, we know that kids are not going to go to their parents for
advice on premarital sex and protection. They will simply do without, have
unprotected sex, etc.
PP is the better option - give out information, obgyn examinations, birth
control, etc. I think they are great folks, and I wish we would give as much
to them as we do to make one crappy cluster bomb.
> Tina
> We could learn a lot from crayons: some are sharp, some are pretty, some
are
> dull, some have weird names, and all are different colors ...but they all
have
> to learn to live in the same box.
We could learn a lot from crayons - they are so quiet and cooperative as we
use them to their last breath, then toss them in the trash.
Rick
[snip]
>I have never heard of Planned Parenthood perfroming abortions, but I never
>asked PP about it.
It's big business for them.
from http://www.plannedparenthood.org/library/BIRTHCONTROL/Services.html
Service Procedures Referrals
Contraceptive Clients — Women 1,848,106
Abortion Procedures 167,928 36,870
(statistics from 1998)
- Rick
Marc
never
> >asked PP about it.
>
> It's big business for them.
> from http://www.plannedparenthood.org/library/BIRTHCONTROL/Services.html
> Service Procedures Referrals
> Abortion Procedures 167,928 36,870
> (statistics from 1998)
It looks like they did more referals to abortion providers than they did
abortions.
Anyway, is there a point?
Doyou think that making birth control more available is a bad thing?
Rick
>> >I have never heard of Planned Parenthood perfroming abortions, but I
>never
>> >asked PP about it.
>>
>> It's big business for them.
>> from http://www.plannedparenthood.org/library/BIRTHCONTROL/Services.html
>> Service Procedures Referrals
>> Contraceptive Clients - Women 1,848,106
>> Abortion Procedures 167,928 36,870
>> (statistics from 1998)
>
>It looks like they did more referals to abortion providers than they did
>abortions.
That must be new math. I took arithmetic a long time ago, when 167,928
(abortion procedures) was greater than 36,870 (abortion referrals).
>Anyway, is there a point?
Pointing out facts which perhaps are not widely known, and correcting the
misconception (excuse the pun) that PP only provides contraceptives and
information.
- Rick
Jennifer Martin
>The town is Monrovia, Ca.
Cute little town just east of Pasadena. Lots of Victorian houses. In Tina's
neck of the woods.
Jenn Martin
Tinas49ers
>Doyou think that making birth control more available is a bad thing?
Do you think of abortion as a form of birth control?
Tinas49ers
>On the subject, I see your point.
>But in life, we know that kids are not going to go to their parents for
>advice on premarital sex and protection. They will simply do without, have
>unprotected sex, etc.
>PP is the better option - give out information, obgyn examinations, birth
>control, etc. I think they are great folks, and I wish we would give as much
>to them as we do to make one crappy cluster bomb.
>
>> Tina
>
If kids were just going to PP for birth control, I wouldnt have a problem. I
went there myself when I became sexually active. HOWEVER, we are talking about
minors having abortions without a parents consent, verses such things as they
cant even have their teeth filled without their parents consent. Abortions are
MAJOR INVASIVE surgery.
JAY1BEE
> Tina
It is.
Ivy
Tinas49ers
BOTTOM LINE: Would you want your 15 y/o daughter to have an abortion without
your consent or knowledge?
Andres64
>
>I can only tell you about my experience with Planned Parenthood.
>My first girlfriend and I had no "protection", and if she had gone to her
>drunk, abusive father to ask to go to an OBGYN for a perscription for the
>pill, he would have sent her to another state and kicked my ass. We could,
>however, go to the local planned parenthood, get her a checkup, and get the
>Pill.
>Some might say that led us into having sex, but we were having sex already.
>The Pill meant we could stop risking pregnancy and abortion.
>I have never heard of Planned Parenthood perfroming abortions, but I never
>asked PP about it.
>I think PP does a great job, and folks who want to stop PP are the same
>folks that are against abortion, but wouldn't lift a finger to help kids in
>foster care.
>Of course, Dr. L sucks dead bears.
Thanks for the story. It truly amazes me the stupidity of Laura and her
Laurettes. Is the situation that you described so dificult for then to imagine?
>"k" <crystal...@davidbowie.com> wrote in message
>news:CKZm6.316095$ge4.11...@news2.rdc2.tx.home.com...
>> Did anyone hear DL's rant about Planned Parenthood on today's show? She
>> read a listener's letter about one being planned for her town. She wanted
>to
>> prevent it ,using zoning laws.
>>
>> DL was calling for lawyers.
>>
>> Anyway, the listener had a list of analogies, FI, "my kids can't get their
>> teeth filled without my permission, but they can get an abortion."
>>
>> There was a large list like this. Any thoughts?
>>
>> I'm not trying to stir up an abortion debate...just thoughts on the
>> analogies.
>>
>> k
>>
>>
>
>
--
Sincerely,
Andrés (aa #1624)
You always have a choice.
Deja still sux!
Andres64
Bottom line: Do you doubt that there are 15 year olds that are afraid/unable to
go to their parents?
Irma
>My first girlfriend and I had no "protection", and if she had gone to her
>drunk, abusive father to ask to go to an OBGYN for a perscription for the
>pill, he would have sent her to another state and kicked my ass. We could,
>however, go to the local planned parenthood, get her a checkup, and get the
>Pill.
>Some might say that led us into having sex, but we were having sex already.
>The Pill meant we could stop risking pregnancy and abortion.
>I have never heard of Planned Parenthood perfroming abortions, but I never
>asked PP about it.
>I think PP does a great job, and folks who want to stop PP are the same
>folks that are against abortion, but wouldn't lift a finger to help kids in
>foster care.
>Of course, Dr. L sucks dead bears.
>
similar programs throughout the nation. What I am concern with is that teenagers
can have an abortion without the parents consent. Abortion is major procedure
that can lead to serious complication and for a teenager could be devastating.
Maddi Hausmann Sojourner
The complications from pregnancy are far more devastating than from
abortion. Abortion is NOT a major procedure. It's out-patient
surgery for first trimester.
The problem with asking as to whether you want your minor child to
have this done without consent is that it ignores the alternative:
what will happen if nothing is done. Do I want my daughter to have
this done without my knowledge? No. Do I want her to have the right
anyway? You damned well bet I do.
trdm
Big-time PP and NARAL supporter
M is for Malapert
"Rick" <pl1_alp...@juNOSPAM.com> wrote in message
news:97ia02$m11$1...@sshuraac-i-1.production.compuserve.com...
> Pointing out facts which perhaps are not widely known, and correcting the
> misconception (excuse the pun) that PP only provides contraceptives and
> information.
Most PP affiliates don't provide abortions.
Irma
says...
>
>Irma wrote:
>> In article <97htvb$asl$1...@slb5.atl.mindspring.net>, Marc says...
>
>> >I can only tell you about my experience with Planned Parenthood.
>> >My first girlfriend and I had no "protection", and if she had gone to her
>> >drunk, abusive father to ask to go to an OBGYN for a perscription for the
>> >pill, he would have sent her to another state and kicked my ass. We could,
>> >however, go to the local planned parenthood, get her a checkup, and get the
>> >Pill.
>> >Some might say that led us into having sex, but we were having sex already.
>> >The Pill meant we could stop risking pregnancy and abortion.
>> >I have never heard of Planned Parenthood perfroming abortions, but I never
>> >asked PP about it.
>> >I think PP does a great job, and folks who want to stop PP are the same
>> >folks that are against abortion, but wouldn't lift a finger to help kids in
>> >foster care.
>> >Of course, Dr. L sucks dead bears.
>> >
>> Thanks for your input, since I'm not familiar with Planned Parenthood, there are
>> similar programs throughout the nation. What I am concern with is that teenagers
>> can have an abortion without the parents consent. Abortion is major procedure
>> that can lead to serious complication and for a teenager could be devastating.
>
>The complications from pregnancy are far more devastating than from
>abortion. Abortion is NOT a major procedure. It's out-patient
>surgery for first trimester.
You make pregnancy sound as if it was the black plague.
>The problem with asking as to whether you want your minor child to
>have this done without consent is that it ignores the alternative:
>what will happen if nothing is done. Do I want my daughter to have
>this done without my knowledge? No. Do I want her to have the right
>anyway? You damned well bet I do.
So from what I understand you are trying to say that you don't mind you daughter
have an abortion as long you know or you prefer your daughter has that option
even though you are not made aware of it.
k
>
> BOTTOM LINE: Would you want your 15 y/o daughter to have an abortion
without
> your consent or knowledge?
I would hope she's not that afraid of me. If she were, I'd like her to have
that right.
k
Irma
But don't you think it is a major decision, especially for a teenagers, they
need some support, some guidance.
Marc
> Marc wrote:
> >Doyou think that making birth control more available is a bad thing?
>
> Do you think of abortion as a form of birth control?
Well, it's not the best method of birth control. As a parent I tend to look
upon unborn babies as babies. When my DW was 8 weeks pregnant, she wasn't
carrying a fetus, she was carrying our child. If we had lost him we would
have been pretty heartbroken.
On the other hand, is it better for society as a whole that teenage girls
abort their unwanted babies rather than bring a lot of unwanted babies into
the world to be raised by 13 year olds, I'd say yes.
Not to sound all pro-life or anything, but I look upon legal and safe
abortion is necessary, but not a wonderful thing.
> We could learn a lot from crayons: some are sharp, some are pretty, some
are
> dull, some have weird names, and all are different colors ...but they all
have
> to learn to live in the same box.
Than we could all move in together and save on rent. I just hope their
enough bathrooms.
Irma
Don't have stats, but when a woman has an abortion, doesn't she have a higher
percentage of having a miscarriage.
>
>
Elisabeth Riba
> In article <V3an6.385$45....@www.newsranger.com>, Andres64 says...
>>In article <20010228091629...@ng-ct1.aol.com>, Tinas49ers says...
>>>your consent or knowledge?
>>Bottom line: Do you doubt that there are 15 year olds that are afraid/unable to
>>go to their parents?
> But don't you think it is a major decision, especially for a teenagers, they
> need some support, some guidance.
That's why teens who don't want parental consent often have to go through
the courts and why abortion clinics all provide counseling.
Do you know who gets hurt worst by parental consent laws?
Children who are abused by their parents.
Father rapes daughter; daughter gets pregnant.
Are you saying that girl has to get permission either from her father (the
rapist) or mother (if around, who's allowing this to happen)?
What do you suggest for that situation?
You can't legislate the quality of a relationship. Just because all the
teens you know are able to talk to their parents about sensitive matters
doesn't mean everybody can.
--
----------> Elisabeth Anne Riba * l...@osmond-riba.org <----------
"[She] is one of the secret masters of the world: a librarian.
They control information. Don't ever piss one off."
- Spider Robinson, "Callahan Touch"
Rick
That might be certainly expected, since the facilities to actually do
abortions would be very costly compared to what is needed for just
counseling. However, since only 18% of the total of 204,798 abortion
procedures were referrals (I'm assuming that means they were referred to an
outside source), there must be quite a few facilities that actually do
abortions. Does anyone have statistics on the number of total facilities and
exactly how many do abortions? I don't think I've got the time to look at
the clinic lists for all 50 states. :^)
- Rick
Eve DuJardin
>From: Irma Kla...@my-deja.com
>Date: 2/28/01 10:32 AM Pacific Standard Time
>Message-id: <avbn6.429$45....@www.newsranger.com>
Eve wrote:
Perhaps that's where Planned Parenthood or neutral counseling would come in.
Eve
KADD567
>went there myself when I became sexually active. HOWEVER, we are talking
>about
>minors having abortions without a parents consent, verses such things as they
>cant even have their teeth filled without their parents consent. Abortions
>are
>MAJOR INVASIVE surgery.
>
> Tina
>
>We could learn a lot from crayons: some are sharp, some are pretty, some are
>dull, some have weird names, and all are different colors ...but they all
>have
>to learn to live in the same box.
>
>
>
>
>
>
I have to say that PP is a wonderful place and there should be more of them.
Kids should be able to go get BC if they need it. But Abortions are a no no
with out parents permission.
Carrie
Eve DuJardin
>Message-id: <8Bbn6.430$45....@www.newsranger.com>
Eve wrote:
No. This appears to be one of the nasty myths about abortion that are
supported by the Anti-Abortion groups.
prochoice.about.com/newsissues/prochoice/library/bltenfalse2.htm
Eve
Eve DuJardin
>Message-id: <fhbn6.424$45....@www.newsranger.com>
Eve wrote:
Sometimes an unplanned pregnancy is worse than the black plague. It would
really disappoint me to learn that either of my girls were pregnant sans
marriage; but I still hold with the notion that since it is her body and she is
the one who will have the baby, it's her choice.
Eve
Eve DuJardin
>Message-id: <Ydan6.390$45....@www.newsranger.com>
Eve wrote:
Yes, Irma, an abortion, performed by a neighbor on the kitchen table with a
coathanger can lead to serious health consequences - teenager or not. Here is
another myth exploded: First trimester abortions are safer than full term
deliveries. Same URL applies So you see why it's so important to retain a
woman's right to choice. Hopefully, the RU486 (sounds like an old computer)
pill will do away with medical abortions in the first Trimester.
Eve
LMG
Rick <pl1_alp...@juNOSPAM.com> wrote in message
> Marc wrote in message <97htvb$asl$1...@slb5.atl.mindspring.net>...
> [snip]
> >I have never heard of Planned Parenthood perfroming abortions, but I
never
> >asked PP about it.
>
> It's big business for them.
> from http://www.plannedparenthood.org/library/BIRTHCONTROL/Services.html
> Service Procedures Referrals
> Abortion Procedures 167,928 36,870
> (statistics from 1998)
>
> - Rick
>
Eve DuJardin
>Date: 2/28/01 12:24 PM Pacific Standard Time
>Message-id: <97jmq6$598$1...@sshuraab-i-1.production.compuserve.com>
Eve wrote:
Oh, go on, Rick. Take the time. Isn't it important to you? Certainly seems
to be.
Eve
Eve DuJardin
>Date: 2/28/01 6:16 AM Pacific Standard Time
>Message-id: <20010228091629...@ng-ct1.aol.com>
Eve wrote:
If the other choices were suicide or running away from home, a resounding YES!
Eve
Irma
>
>>Subject: Re: Planned Parenthood Rant
>>need some support, some guidance.
>Eve wrote:
>Perhaps that's where Planned Parenthood or neutral counseling would come in.
> Eve
After I wrote this I thought what about children who are sexually abused by
parents who can not be advised by them. This is a difficult situation for
myself to decide. I imagine if I was a parent, I would be very upset that my
child had an abortion without my council. The million dollar question is how do
you protect children and the same time keep good parents, who want to help
inform of the child’s difficulties. I don’t want to be troll, but I myself don’t
know the answer.
Perhaps the reason I'm not sure is that when I was a teenager I agreed legalized
abortion, because in my own family my aunt died because her country abortion was
illegal, therefore she went to place were the lady was not a doctor. Now in my
early twenties, I think of my own mother who had brother when she was sixteen,
although she was not economically stable, she had the child and we don’t know
what we would do without him.
Maddi Hausmann Sojourner
> >The complications from pregnancy are far more devastating than from
> >abortion. Abortion is NOT a major procedure. It's out-patient
> >surgery for first trimester.
>
> You make pregnancy sound as if it was the black plague.
No, but it isn't a walk in the park, either. I have two children,
and having been through it, there is no waay I would ever force it
upon anyone.
> >The problem with asking as to whether you want your minor child to
> >have this done without consent is that it ignores the alternative:
> >what will happen if nothing is done. Do I want my daughter to have
> >this done without my knowledge? No. Do I want her to have the right
> >anyway? You damned well bet I do.
>
> So from what I understand you are trying to say that you don't mind you
> daughter have an abortion as long you know or you prefer your daughter
> has that option even though you are not made aware of it.
Let me put it this waay. If my teen daughter (who is at this moment,
five) came to me and said she was pregnant, I would advise she have
an abortion. The only other choice I would give her would be adoption.
There is no waay a young teen can do a good job bringing up a child;
it is hard enough for this fortysomething SAHM with a husband who has
a good job and a healthy attitude toward fathering. I don't know how
single parents do it.
I would never make the mistake that a clump of cells is more important
than my living, breathing child who is alive now. Would I grieve the
loss of a potential grandchild? Yes. But I would not place my daughter
in the harm's way of an unwanted pregnancy just to soothe someone else's
misplaced definition of what a baby is.
trdm
Parents for Planned Pregnancies
Tinas49ers
If you're stupid. It can mess up your chances of reproducing in the future and
have major pyschological scars. Getting on the pill is the one I would
recommend or the basic ABSTAIN. That one actually works! Imagine that!
Tinas49ers
>When my DW was 8 weeks pregnant,
I gotta ask, whats a DW? Divorced wife?
>On the other hand, is it better for society as a whole that teenage girls
>abort their unwanted babies rather than bring a lot of unwanted babies into
>the world to be raised by 13 year olds, I'd say yes.
There are PLENTY of people who want these unwanted babies. Just pick up last
weeks People and you can see an article on all the celebs that are adopting, as
an example. With fertility problems rising, I would think there are plenty of
parents willing to adopt.
>
>Not to sound all pro-life or anything, but I look upon legal and safe
>abortion is necessary, but not a wonderful thing.
There is NOTHING wrong with being pro-life, as opposed to pro-death. I agree
with your POV, I would prefer it would be safe and legal, a very fine line in
my book.
Tina
Tinas49ers
>Perhaps that's where Planned Parenthood or neutral counseling would come in.
>
Perhaps, do you know if PP takes this stand?
Tinas49ers
>Do you know who gets hurt worst by parental consent laws?
>Children who are abused by their parents.
>Father rapes daughter; daughter gets pregnant.
>Are you saying that girl has to get permission either from her father (the
>rapist) or mother (if around, who's allowing this to happen)?
>What do you suggest for that situation?
>
>You can't legislate the quality of a relationship. Just because all the
>teens you know are able to talk to their parents about sensitive matters
>doesn't mean everybody can.
>
>--
And then happens how much??? NOT much, I would think.
Tinas49ers
>>BOTTOM LINE: Would you want your 15 y/o daughter to have an abortion without
>>your consent or knowledge?
>
>Bottom line: Do you doubt that there are 15 year olds that are afraid/unable
>to
>go to their parents?
No, now answer my question.
k
>
> If you're stupid. It can mess up your chances of reproducing in the future
and
> have major pyschological scars.
Cite.
k
Rick
<20010228154542...@ng-cp1.aol.com>...
Nope. Only important enough to take a minute or two to look up a couple
simple facts. And I know the math stuff seems really complicated, but it
really wasn't that hard. I just don't like to take unsubstantiated claims at
face value.
- Rick
Tinas49ers
I have no online cites, just 2 girls I know who did it that had to live with
those regrets. Don't tell me you actually believe that a woman would have an
abortion and then go about like like she just had a wart removed.
Get real.
Jim Gray
tinas...@aol.com says...
> Marc wrote:
>
>
> >Not to sound all pro-life or anything, but I look upon legal and
> >safe abortion is necessary, but not a wonderful thing.
>
> There is NOTHING wrong with being pro-life, as opposed to pro-death.
> I agree with your POV, I would prefer it would be safe and legal, a
> very fine line in my book.
>
>
think of abortion, too? It's not like we're standing out on street
corners urging everyone who looks slightly pregnant to go for a D&C.
The ideal for most pro-choicers is to see abortion safe, legal, and
_rare_, not through legislative restriction, but because other methods
of contraception are safer, more available, more reliable, and
_familiar to the users_, including teens.
Unfortunately, it seems like most pro-lifers are also anti-sex-
education and anti-teen-contraception. I'm still trying to figure out
how they think they can have it both ways...
Jim (former pro-lifer (Catholic high school brainwashing), current
pro-choicer) Gray
--
English is what the French look at to strengthen their enthusiasm for
the Academie Francaise.
Tinas49ers
>The ideal for most pro-choicers is to see abortion safe, legal, and
>_rare_
I NEVER hear them say RARE, just it should be safe and legal. Shoot, I'm for
that, I am just FOR LIFE.
>Unfortunately, it seems like most pro-lifers are also anti-sex-
>education and anti-teen-contraception. I'm still trying to figure out
>how they think they can have it both ways...
Most? Do you have a cite for that? I'm pro-life and I'm for plenty of sex ed.
>
>Jim (former pro-lifer (Catholic high school brainwashing), current
>pro-choicer) Gray
>
>--
Then maybe it is just the Catholics that think that. I never heard my church
saying sex ed is a bad thing.
Ruth
>
>Kelly wrote:
>>"Tinas49ers" <tinas...@aol.com> wrote in message
>>news:20010228183712...@ng-ca1.aol.com...
>>>
>>> If you're stupid. It can mess up your chances of reproducing in the future
>>and
>>> have major pyschological scars.
>>
>>Cite.
>>
>>k
>>
>>
>
>I have no online cites, just 2 girls I know who did it that had to live with
>those regrets. Don't tell me you actually believe that a woman would have an
>abortion and then go about like like she just had a wart removed.
>Get real.
>
Some can, some can't. What else is new?
Ruth
JAY1BEE
>I have no online cites, just 2 girls I know who did it that had to live with
>those regrets. Don't tell me you actually believe that a woman would have an
>abortion and then go about like like she just had a wart removed.
>Get real.
If you're using personal experience, then I'll point out that I know several
people who've had abortions and aren't "living with regrets."
I can't speak for people who start out already emotionally needy, of course.
Ivy
JAY1BEE
>>> Tina
>It is.
>>Ivy
>
>If you're stupid. It can mess up your chances of reproducing in the future
>and
>have major pyschological scars. Getting on the pill is the one I would
>recommend or the basic ABSTAIN. That one actually works! Imagine that!
Tina
But of course, it's not user-friendly.
Ivy
JAY1BEE
>your consent or knowledge?
Better that, than having her die from an illegal abortion (yes, they still
exist) because she's too afraid to talk to us.
Of course, DD (who's married now) has an abortion fund in the event of a birth
control failure and would be escorted to the clinic by her husband and her
father, both armed... and with a private nurse...me. (also armed).
Ivy
k
> I have no online cites, just 2 girls I know who did it that had to live
with
> those regrets. Don't tell me you actually believe that a woman would have
an
> abortion and then go about like like she just had a wart removed.
> Get real.
Most women I know felt relief.
k
Tinas49ers
>I can't speak for people who start out already emotionally needy, of course.
>
Are you inferring that my friends were needy or was that a general statement?
Eve DuJardin
>Date: 2/28/01 3:47 PM Pacific Standard Time
>Message-id: <Y5gn6.320852$ge4.11...@news2.rdc2.tx.home.com>
Eve wrote
I can't imagine what would be more psychologically scaring than being forced to
bring an unwanted pregnancy to term, giving the child up for adoption, and
finding said child looking for you 18 years later. There have been hundreds of
calls to DL on this very subject. I agree with her that all adoptions should
be sealed, with just the medical data available.
Eve
k
"Eve DuJardin" <toowilli...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20010228211016...@ng-co1.aol.com...
> Eve wrote
> I can't imagine what would be more psychologically scaring than being
forced to
> bring an unwanted pregnancy to term, giving the child up for adoption, and
> finding said child looking for you 18 years later.
And all that time wondering if the child is _really_ being treated well.
k
Eve DuJardin
>Date: 2/28/01 4:16 PM Pacific Standard Time
>Message-id: <MPG.15076147e...@news.earthlink.net>
Eve wrote:
Some people are certain that humans weren't put on this earth to "have a good
time." Therefore, the stricter the beliefs, the narrower the path. IOW, as DL
says, if you don't plan to have children, keep that penis out of your vagina.
Eve
k
> Eve wrote:
> I've known a couple of women in their late 30's who had an abortion. Both
were
> back to work the next day. I understand both the RU486 and the morning
after
> pill abortions are even easier to recover from.
Yes, if they'll let women have them. It's not looking good right now.
k
Eve DuJardin
>Date: 2/28/01 5:54 PM Pacific Standard Time
>Message-id: <aZhn6.321340$ge4.11...@news2.rdc2.tx.home.com>
Eve wrote:
I've known a couple of women in their late 30's who had an abortion. Both were
back to work the next day. I understand both the RU486 and the morning after
pill abortions are even easier to recover from.
Eve
JAY1BEE
>>I can't speak for people who start out already emotionally needy, of course.
>
>Are you inferring that my friends were needy or was that a general statement?
>
> Tina
Take it any way you want to take it, Tina. I don't believe an intelligent,
emotionally stable woman who has an unplanned pregnancy is going to live with
regrets the rest of her life. I do believe that a woman who is emotionally
unstable already may have problems.
Ivy
Maddi Hausmann Sojourner
> Marc wrote:
> >Not to sound all pro-life or anything, but I look upon legal and safe
> >abortion is necessary, but not a wonderful thing.
>
> There is NOTHING wrong with being pro-life, as opposed to pro-death. I agree
> with your POV, I would prefer it would be safe and legal, a very fine line in
> my book.
Congrats, Tina. That makes you pro-choice. I'm a mother, you know.
I'm not jumping up and down WANTING pregnant women to go get abortions.
I still want them available to those who choose them.
trdm
Mothers For Abortion Rights
Tinas49ers
>Take it any way you want to take it, Tina. I don't believe an intelligent,
>emotionally stable woman who has an unplanned pregnancy is going to live with
>regrets the rest of her life. I do believe that a woman who is emotionally
>unstable already may have problems.
Then you are wrong. Of course, YOU are talking about people you dont know. *I*,
otoh, KNOW my friends. One girl was pregnant by the guy she later married and
had 2 kids with. Do you think she feels no guilt for THEIR child that she
killed? Maybe you can be cold and hearless about killing life, but I
can't...sorry, but I guess that speaks of what you are made of.
Tinas49ers
I'm not talking about being forced to do anything. I'm talking about PARENTS
having a right to know when an EVASIVE medical procedure is being done to their
MINOR CHILD. I didnt say anything about the child being forced to carry the
child to term, I'm talking about a parents right to know what medical procedure
is being done on their child. Shoot, you cant even get your ears pierced
without parental consent, but you can do an evasive procedure????? Yeah, THAT
makes LOTS of sense! <Bill, this is sarcasm>
Eve DuJardin
>Date: 2/28/01 6:21 PM Pacific Standard Time
>Message-id: <Vmin6.321444$ge4.11...@news2.rdc2.tx.home.com>
Eve wrote:
It seems that the RU486 has just recently become available in the San Francisco
area.
Eve
Tinas49ers
>IOW, as DL
>says, if you don't plan to have children, keep that penis out of your vagina.
It sure aint bad advice, afterall, that IS how children are conceived...or was
it you who needed the sex ed?
k
> Eve wrote:
> >IOW, as DL
> >says, if you don't plan to have children, keep that penis out of your
vagina.
>
> It sure aint bad advice, afterall, that IS how children are conceived...or
was
> it you who needed the sex ed?
It's not very realistic advice though. Is it?
k
Maddi Hausmann Sojourner
> I'm not talking about being forced to do anything. I'm talking about PARENTS
> having a right to know when an EVASIVE medical procedure is being done to their
> MINOR CHILD. I didnt say anything about the child being forced to carry the
> child to term, I'm talking about a parents right to know what medical procedure
> is being done on their child. Shoot, you cant even get your ears pierced
> without parental consent, but you can do an evasive procedure????? Yeah, THAT
> makes LOTS of sense! <Bill, this is sarcasm>
Tina, when I asked you something and you said it was your reply to
Eve, that was EVASIVE. A medical procedure can only be EVASIVE if
political types make you jump through hoops to obtain it. Hey, I
guess with the parental consent and all that, it is pretty evasive.
trdm
Your syntax specialist
k
> I'm not talking about being forced to do anything. I'm talking about
PARENTS
> having a right to know when an EVASIVE medical procedure is being done to
their
> MINOR CHILD. I didnt say anything about the child being forced to carry
the
> child to term, I'm talking about a parents right to know what medical
procedure
> is being done on their child. Shoot, you cant even get your ears pierced
> without parental consent, but you can do an evasive procedure????? Yeah,
THAT
> makes LOTS of sense! <Bill, this is sarcasm>
A young woman's reproductive rights transcends her parent's authority.
That's just the way it is, and should be.
k
Eve DuJardin
>Date: 2/28/01 4:42 PM Pacific Standard Time
>Message-id: <20010228194214...@ng-ce1.aol.com>
Eve wrote:
Then you've obviously never listened to Bill Clinton on the subject. It became
de rigueur in his speeches on abortion; i.e., "safe, legal and rare."
Eve
Eve DuJardin
>From: tinas...@aol.com (Tinas49ers)
>Date: 2/28/01 6:40 PM Pacific Standard Time
>Message-id: <20010228214013...@ng-ce1.aol.com>
Eve wrote:
Tina, you're so transparent. Why not just come right out and ask me if I was
pregnant when I got married (either time), instead of just hinting around about
it. I've never known you to be shy about prying into anybody's business.
Eve
Eve DuJardin
>Message-id: <20010228213705...@ng-ce1.aol.com>
Eve wrote:
It also takes the vote away from the person whose body seems to be up for
grabs. And, yes it does make sense, especially in the case where the girl
can't come to the parents for help and support. Not all parents are
understanding or intelligent.
Eve
Eve DuJardin
>Message-id: <20010228184050...@ng-ca1.aol.com>
>
>Marc wrote:
>>When my DW was 8 weeks pregnant,
>
>I gotta ask, whats a DW? Divorced wife?
>
>>On the other hand, is it better for society as a whole that teenage girls
>>abort their unwanted babies rather than bring a lot of unwanted babies into
>>the world to be raised by 13 year olds, I'd say yes.
>
>There are PLENTY of people who want these unwanted babies. Just pick up last
>weeks People and you can see an article on all the celebs that are adopting,
>as
>an example. With fertility problems rising, I would think there are plenty of
>parents willing to adopt.
>
>>
>>Not to sound all pro-life or anything, but I look upon legal and safe
>>abortion is necessary, but not a wonderful thing.
>
>There is NOTHING wrong with being pro-life, as opposed to pro-death. I agree
>with your POV, I would prefer it would be safe and legal, a very fine line in
>my book.
>
>
Eve wrote:
You need to remember, Tina, that you can write whatever you want in YOUR book,
but it isn't your business to dictate what goes in anybody else's book.
Anti-abortionists can't claim that their tax money is being used to fund
abortions, or even abortion counseling. Seems to me, your business stops just
short of somebody elses nose.
Eve
Eve DuJardin
>Message-id: <20010228184323...@ng-ca1.aol.com>
>
>Lis wrote:
>>Do you know who gets hurt worst by parental consent laws?
>>Children who are abused by their parents.
>>Father rapes daughter; daughter gets pregnant.
>>Are you saying that girl has to get permission either from her father (the
>>rapist) or mother (if around, who's allowing this to happen)?
>>What do you suggest for that situation?
>>
>>You can't legislate the quality of a relationship. Just because all the
>>teens you know are able to talk to their parents about sensitive matters
>>doesn't mean everybody can.
>>
>>--
>
>And then happens how much??? NOT much, I would think.
>
> Tina
>
>We could learn a lot from crayons: some are sharp, some are pretty, some are
>dull, some have weird names, and all are different colors ...but they all
>have
>to learn to live in the same box.
Eve wrote:
Once is TOO MANY TIMES.
Eve
Marc
> Marc wrote:
> >When my DW was 8 weeks pregnant,
>
> I gotta ask, whats a DW? Divorced wife?
She better not be divorced! DW = "Dear Wife"
> >On the other hand, is it better for society as a whole that teenage girls
> >abort their unwanted babies rather than bring a lot of unwanted babies
into
> >the world to be raised by 13 year olds, I'd say yes.
>
> There are PLENTY of people who want these unwanted babies. Just pick up
last
> weeks People and you can see an article on all the celebs that are
adopting, as
> an example. With fertility problems rising, I would think there are plenty
of
> parents willing to adopt.
I hear that too, but I also see that foster homes are filled with unwanted
children. I can never figure out why that is - it takes forever to adopt,
but we have to pay a lot of $ in taxes to care for kids in foster homes (I
know its not a lot of money for the Foster Families, before somebody starts
telling me how little it really is). I sure wish that folks wanting to adopt
would adopt older kids, especially children of other races.
>
Tinas49ers
>>From: tinas...@aol.com (Tinas49ers)
>>Date: 2/28/01 3:43 PM Pacific Standard Time
>>Message-id: <20010228184323...@ng-ca1.aol.com>
>>
>>Lis wrote:
>>>Do you know who gets hurt worst by parental consent laws?
>>>Children who are abused by their parents.
>>>Father rapes daughter; daughter gets pregnant.
>>>Are you saying that girl has to get permission either from her father (the
>>>rapist) or mother (if around, who's allowing this to happen)?
>>>What do you suggest for that situation?
>>>
>>>You can't legislate the quality of a relationship. Just because all the
>>>teens you know are able to talk to their parents about sensitive matters
>>>doesn't mean everybody can.
>>>
>>>--
>>
>>
>> Tina
>>
>>We could learn a lot from crayons: some are sharp, some are pretty, some are
>>dull, some have weird names, and all are different colors ...but they all
>>have
>>to learn to live in the same box.
>
>Eve wrote:
>Once is TOO MANY TIMES
So, because it may happen once, all minors should be able to get an abortion
with no parental consent or knowledge?
JAY1BEE
>>emotionally stable woman who has an unplanned pregnancy is going to live
>with
>>regrets the rest of her life. I do believe that a woman who is emotionally
>>unstable already may have problems.
>
>Then you are wrong. Of course, YOU are talking about people you dont know.
>*I*,
>otoh, KNOW my friends. One girl was pregnant by the guy she later married and
>had 2 kids with. Do you think she feels no guilt for THEIR child that she
>killed? Maybe you can be cold and hearless about killing life, but I
>can't...sorry, but I guess that speaks of what you are made of.
Then I strongly urge you never to have an abortion, since you seem to feel
you'd be so devastated. Personally, I consider that adults accept the
responsibility for their actions, make the best decision they can, and get on
with their lives.
There's nothing admirable about self-pity.
Ivy
Tinas49ers
I disagree.
Tinas49ers
>It also takes the vote away from the person whose body seems to be up for
>grabs. And, yes it does make sense, especially in the case where the girl
>can't come to the parents for help and support. Not all parents are
>understanding or intelligent.
But this takes the right away from all parents, even the intelligent and
understanding.
Tinas49ers
Eve, buy a clue...if I was going to infer anything I would have inferred it
clearly. I dont care if you were married whenever you conceived ANYTHING.
Tinas49ers
>You need to remember, Tina, that you can write whatever you want in YOUR
>book,
>but it isn't your business to dictate what goes in anybody else's book.
>Anti-abortionists can't claim that their tax money is being used to fund
>abortions, or even abortion counseling. Seems to me, your business stops
>just
>short of somebody elses nose.
>
Gosh Eve...I didnt know I was writing a book..thought I was sharing an opinion.
Tinas49ers
Sure it is....just not to people who have no control of their actions.
EMF1947
>Date: Wed, Feb 28, 2001 11:12 PM
>Message-id: <20010301001229...@ng-xa1.aol.com>
I think some women see it as a kind of bargain they make with God: if you let
me have this abortion I promise I will feel devestated for the rest of my life.
As Eric Berne once pointed out about bargains people make with God, they tend
to be really one-sided: He isn't really given any say in the matter.
Ellen
-----------
Ellen's attachment to the Mets is the best evidence yet for the existence of
demon possession.-Eric da Red
Tinas49ers
>>
>> I gotta ask, whats a DW? Divorced wife?
>
>She better not be divorced! DW = "Dear Wife"
Sorry, just never saw DW before.
> hear that too, but I also see that foster homes are filled with unwanted
>children. I can never figure out why that is - it takes forever to adopt,
>but we have to pay a lot of $ in taxes to care for kids in foster homes (I
>know its not a lot of money for the Foster Families, before somebody starts
>telling me how little it really is). I sure wish that folks wanting to adopt
>would adopt older kids, especially children of other races.
>
>
>>
Children in foster homes are usually older children, who end up in foster care
because their parents are screw ups, and the children usually have problems,
from the little I have heard of foster children. I'm talking about newborn
babies.
georgann
>> Then I strongly urge you never to have an abortion, since you seem to feel
>> you'd be so devastated. Personally, I consider that adults accept the
>> responsibility for their actions, make the best decision they can, and get on
>> with their lives.
>> There's nothing admirable about self-pity.
>> Ivy
EMF1947:
> I think some women see it as a kind of bargain they make with God: if you let
> me have this abortion I promise I will feel devestated for the rest of my
> life. As Eric Berne once pointed out about bargains people make with God, they
> tend to be really one-sided: He isn't really given any say in the matter.
> Ellen
georgann wrote:
I agree with Berne about people taking an initiative then acting like they
consulted or somehow truly bargained with God. I also know a woman, a born
again Christian, who has never been able to fully accept God's complete
forgiveness on an abortion she had a number of years earlier. She's quite
certain the abortion made it hard for her to conceive when she wanted to get
pregnant. Her anguish a at the time of the abortion, or later, is not what I
would call self-pity.
--
% % % % % % % % % % % % % % % % % %
Exodus 6:2 God spoke further to Moses
and said to him, ""I am the LORD; 3 and
I appeared to Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob,
as God Almighty, but by My name, LORD,
I did not make Myself known to them.""
% % % % % % % % % % % % % % % % % %
JAY1BEE
>>you'd be so devastated. Personally, I consider that adults accept the
>>responsibility for their actions, make the best decision they can, and get
>>on
>>with their lives.
>>
>>There's nothing admirable about self-pity.
>>
>>Ivy
>>
>
>I think some women see it as a kind of bargain they make with God: if you
>let
>me have this abortion I promise I will feel devestated for the rest of my
>life.
> As Eric Berne once pointed out about bargains people make with God, they
>tend
>to be really one-sided: He isn't really given any say in the matter.
>
>Ellen
Maybe, but ultimately it's really immaturity and weak-mindedness and self-pity.
"I had to do it, but I'm going to beat myself up for it for the rest of my
life." (to make me feel better about it, so I don't go to Hell- etc., etc.)-How
childish. If you had to do it, then be adult enough to accept the
responsibility for it.
Ivy
Tinas49ers
>Then I strongly urge you never to have an abortion, since you seem to feel
>you'd be so devastated. Personally, I consider that adults accept the
>responsibility for their actions, make the best decision they can, and get on
>with their lives.
>
>There's nothing admirable about self-pity.
>
And there is nothing admirable about killing your baby because you are too
stupid to use birth control correctly. Taking care of your baby, that YOU
created is being responsible. Having an abortion is a scapegoat for your bad
behavior.
Tinas49ers
>How
>childish. If you had to do it, then be adult enough to accept the
>responsibility for it.
Thats corrct, if you got pregnant, be responsible and take care of the baby you
conceived, dont kill it.
Eve DuJardin
>Date: 3/1/01 6:19 AM Pacific Standard Time
>Message-id: <B6C3C49E.11F77%chen...@mindspring.com>
Eve wrote:
But was her difficulty in conceiving rooted in a medical condition or in her
own mind. Perhaps it was the guy she was with. This is so silly. IMO, if a
person is so conflicted about getting an abortion that their mental health is
at stake, then fer hevvins (and their own) sake, don't get one.
Eve
Eve DuJardin
>Date: 3/1/01 8:27 AM Pacific Standard Time
>Message-id: <97kj7a$g3f$1...@slb1.atl.mindspring.net>
Yes, wouldn't that be wonderful? Unfortunately, most people decide to adopt
only after years of trying to conceive and want an infant to make the picture
come to life. I think there's something emotionally troubled about people like
Mia Farrow, who adopt only children with handicaps or of a different race, but
thank God for them, anyway.
Eve
Eve DuJardin
>Date: 2/28/01 9:35 PM Pacific Standard Time
>Message-id: <20010301003552...@ng-fg1.aol.com>
Eve wrote:
As a parent, Tina, I make sure that my girls feel comfortable coming to me with
anything. It's up to the parents to make teen abortions without parental
notification unnecessary. The abortion laws are to protect the woman having
one, not the parents.
Eve
Eve DuJardin
>Date: 2/28/01 9:15 PM Pacific Standard Time
>Message-id: <20010301001514...@ng-fg1.aol.com>
Eve wrote:
Why are you so insistent that women under age 18 must have parental consent for
an abortion?
Do you think that if the parents knew, they would convince the woman to have
the baby? Somehow, that's what I think, Tina. Again, it's
your business as far as your body goes; it's not your business about anybody
else's body. I saw a mock ad that read as follows: Stop abortions. All women
with unwanted pregnancies can come to the Pro-Life Organizations, where all
medical, and other bills will be paid and the babies put up for adoption.
Those babies not adopted will be paid for by Pro-Life organizations until age
18. How about that one, Tina. Does that seem like a good use for your time
and money?
Eve
k
. . Having an abortion is a scapegoat for your bad
> behavior.
Forcing women to have their babies is punishment for their bad behavior.
Abortion is just too easy. Right?
k
>
FoxTerror
isn't. Was way less intrusive then a root canal.
ag
mr_potter
>>>
>>> If you're stupid. It can mess up your chances of reproducing in the future
>>and
>>> have major pyschological scars.
>>
>>Cite.
>>
>>k
>>
>>
>
>those regrets. Don't tell me you actually believe that a woman would have an
>abortion and then go about like like she just had a wart removed.
>Get real.
Well, I've known at least TWELVE or so gals that had abortions, Tina, and NONE
of them had ANY regrets -- matter 'o fact, their lives were immeasurably
IMPROVED by not popping a sprog. They're all stable, happy, and have good lives
now (and some of 'em went on to have families...). If they had gone through
with their pregnancies, there's a very strong possiblility that most of 'em
would have ended up in life as dead - end losers.
[Of course YOU realize that MY anecdotal examples trump YOURS because I'M using
a LARGER sampling base...that way I can tell MORE stories than YOU can....]
And believe it or not, not ALL women (or men) are fit to be good (or even
mediocre) parents. There's a goodly percentage of people out there that had NO
business having kids (little PUKES grow up to be adult PUKES who breed more
PUKES [to borrow from Jak here]) But there is no safeguard against that,
unfortunately....
Best
Greg who would prefer that ALL kids be WANTED kids
Irma
>
>In article <20010228192713...@ng-ce1.aol.com>, Tinas49ers says...
>>
>>Kelly wrote:
>>>"Tinas49ers" <tinas...@aol.com> wrote in message
>>>news:20010228183712...@ng-ca1.aol.com...
>>>>
>>>> If you're stupid. It can mess up your chances of reproducing in the future
>>>and
>>>> have major pyschological scars.
>>>
>>>Cite.
>>>
>>>k
>>>
>>>
>>
>>I have no online cites, just 2 girls I know who did it that had to live with
>>those regrets. Don't tell me you actually believe that a woman would have an
>>abortion and then go about like like she just had a wart removed.
>>Get real.
>
>Well, I've known at least TWELVE or so gals that had abortions, Tina, and NONE
>of them had ANY regrets -- matter 'o fact, their lives were immeasurably
>IMPROVED by not popping a sprog. They're all stable, happy, and have good
Wow, greg twelve women were they all your babies?
ives
>now (and some of 'em went on to have families...). If they had gone through
>with their pregnancies, there's a very strong possiblility that most of 'em
>would have ended up in life as dead - end losers.
>
>[Of course YOU realize that MY anecdotal examples trump YOURS because I'M using
>a LARGER sampling base...that way I can tell MORE stories than YOU can....]
Yes, but you have believe there is another spectrum to the situation, that some
women do have regrets and have become sterile because of it.
>And believe it or not, not ALL women (or men) are fit to be good (or even
>mediocre) parents. There's a goodly percentage of people out there that had NO
>business having kids (little PUKES grow up to be adult PUKES who breed more
>PUKES [to borrow from Jak here]) But there is no safeguard against that,
>unfortunately....
>
>
>Best
>Greg who would prefer that ALL kids be WANTED kids
Best
Greg who hasn't heard of the word Adoption.
mr_potter
>
>In article <2gzn6.790$45....@www.newsranger.com>, mr_potter says...
>>
>>In article <20010228192713...@ng-ce1.aol.com>, Tinas49ers says...
>>>
>>>Kelly wrote:
>>>>"Tinas49ers" <tinas...@aol.com> wrote in message
>>>>news:20010228183712...@ng-ca1.aol.com...
>>>>>
>>>>> If you're stupid. It can mess up your chances of reproducing in the future
>>>>and
>>>>> have major pyschological scars.
>>>>
>>>>Cite.
>>>>
>>>>k
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>I have no online cites, just 2 girls I know who did it that had to live with
>>>those regrets. Don't tell me you actually believe that a woman would have an
>>>abortion and then go about like like she just had a wart removed.
>>>Get real.
>>
>>Well, I've known at least TWELVE or so gals that had abortions, Tina, and NONE
>>of them had ANY regrets -- matter 'o fact, their lives were immeasurably
>>IMPROVED by not popping a sprog. They're all stable, happy, and have good
>
>Wow, greg twelve women were they all your babies?
>
Uhhhh, NO, DUMBASS...I'm QUEER and I've NEVER had sex with a woman...Ben Affleck
is more my type.
>ives
>>now (and some of 'em went on to have families...). If they had gone through
>>with their pregnancies, there's a very strong possiblility that most of 'em
>>would have ended up in life as dead - end losers.
>>
>>[Of course YOU realize that MY anecdotal examples trump YOURS because I'M using
>>a LARGER sampling base...that way I can tell MORE stories than YOU can....]
>
>Yes, but you have believe there is another spectrum to the situation, that some
>women do have regrets and have become sterile because of it.
Well, gee, there's always adoption...RIGHT???
>
>>And believe it or not, not ALL women (or men) are fit to be good (or even
>>mediocre) parents. There's a goodly percentage of people out there that had NO
>>business having kids (little PUKES grow up to be adult PUKES who breed more
>>PUKES [to borrow from Jak here]) But there is no safeguard against that,
>>unfortunately....
>>
>>
>>Best
>>Greg who would prefer that ALL kids be WANTED kids
>
>Best
>Greg who hasn't heard of the word Adoption.
>
>
How many kids have YOU adopted or taken in as foster children...???? And you
give at LEAST 10% of yer income to the local Foundlings Home...RIGHT???
And hon, a word of advice here: try lurking a bit before you barrel into a NG.
You won't run quite so much risk of looking like a STOOPID MORON PUKE ('though
in yer particular case I suspect it wouldn't make much dif...).
Best
Greg "Harrumph!!"
Best
Greg
mr_potter
mr_potter says...
>>
>>In article
<20010228192713...@ng-ce1.aol.com>,
Tinas49ers says...
>>>
>>>Kelly wrote:
>>>>"Tinas49ers" <tinas...@aol.com> wrote in
message
>>>>news:20010228183712...@ng-ca1.aol.com
..
>>>>>
of reproducing in the future
>>>>and
>>>>> have major pyschological scars.
>>>>
>>>>Cite.
>>>>
>>>>k
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>I have no online cites, just 2 girls I know who
did it that had to live with
>>>those regrets. Don't tell me you actually believe
that a woman would have an
>>>abortion and then go about like like she just had
a wart removed.
>>>Get real.
>>
>>Well, I've known at least TWELVE or so gals that
had abortions, Tina, and NONE
>>of them had ANY regrets -- matter 'o fact, their
lives were immeasurably
>>IMPROVED by not popping a sprog. They're all
stable, happy, and have good
>
>Wow, greg twelve women were they all your babies?
>
Uhhhh, NO, DUMBASS...I'm QUEER and I've NEVER had sex
with a woman...Ben Affleck is more my type.
>ives
>>now (and some of 'em went on to have families...).
If they had gone through
>>with their pregnancies, there's a very strong
possiblility that most of 'em
>>would have ended up in life as dead - end losers.
>>
>>[Of course YOU realize that MY anecdotal examples
trump YOURS because I'M using
>>a LARGER sampling base...that way I can tell MORE
stories than YOU can....]
>
>Yes, but you have believe there is another spectrum
to the situation, that some
>women do have regrets and have become sterile
because of it.
Well, gee, there's always adoption...RIGHT???
>
>>And believe it or not, not ALL women (or men) are
fit to be good (or even
>>mediocre) parents. There's a goodly percentage of
people out there that had NO
>>business having kids (little PUKES grow up to be
adult PUKES who breed more
>>PUKES [to borrow from Jak here]) But there is no
safeguard against that,
>>unfortunately....
>>
>>
>>Best
>>Greg who would prefer that ALL kids be WANTED kids
>
>Best
>Greg who hasn't heard of the word Adoption.
>
>
How many kids have YOU adopted or taken in as foster