Since Baghdad fell, Defense Department hawks have devoted themselves to gloating
about the never-questioned supremacy of the United States' armed forces.
However, the rest of the world's attention has shifted to examine the largely
forgotten rationale for Bush's invasion: the peril posed by Saddam Hussein's
alleged weapons of mass destruction. The April 22 appearance of chief U.N.
weapons inspector Hans Blix before the Security Council has only strengthened
calls for independent verification of U.S. accusations.
Anti-war activists did not dispute that Saddam was an abhorrent dictator. The
tyrant may well have some chemical and biological agents stowed away for
investigators to find, and he no doubt wished to make more in the future.
But key arguments against the war remain valid:
Contrary to President Bush's pronouncements and Colin Powell's satellite photos,
the world had no reason to believe that the Ba'ath regime presented any real
danger to its neighbors, far less to the United States. Saddam's military forces
were decimated in the first Gulf War. Subsequent U.N. inspections made
significant progress in eliminating what weapons remained, and any hidden stocks
of chemical agents would have degraded substantially during a decade of
crippling sanctions. In short, Iraq had been effectively contained as a threat.
Beyond that, the new wave of inspections was working. Saddam's on-going ambition
to produce banned armaments merited international attention, but hardly a 20
billion-dollar blitzkrieg, a subsequent occupation by the Marines, and the loss
of uncounted thousands of lives. Given the hostility with which the Bush
Administration treated the idea of allowing Blix's team time to do its job, it
was always hard to consider weapons of mass destruction a real concern, rather
than a convenient pretext for war.
The media watchdogs at Fairness and Accuracy in Reporting captured the irony of
the situation perfectly by recalling a March 4 article in The New York Times:
"More Missiles Destroyed; Washington Is Concerned Over Complications for Effort
to Disarm Iraq." NBC Nightly News correspondent Andrea Mitchell added, "For the
US, it's a nightmare situation. If Iraq destroys the missiles, it will be much
harder to get support for military action."
Now that George Bush and Tony Blair are again under political pressure to
produce incriminating evidence about banned weaponry, we can be sure that fresh
charges will be forthcoming. Reports of an unnamed Iraqi scientist claiming to
know of destroyed chemical agents qualifies as the military's best lead so far
in a search that has heretofore come up empty-handed.
Yet the world still has reason to be skeptical of the military's claims. And
Americans concerned with genuine global security have reason to support the
global demand for independent investigation.
In the past, the U.S. government has shown itself all too willing to make up the
evidence it needs to justify war. And, too often, the press has dutifully
followed suit. Perhaps the most famous historical precedent is the 1898 sinking
of the USS Maine off the coast of Cuba. Thanks to campaigning on the part of
Hearst newspapers, President McKinley was able to blame Spain for the mysterious
incident, and thus pursue imperial interests in the Spanish-American War.
The fraudulent 1964 Gulf of Tonkin incident, in which President Johnson
announced an unprovoked attack by North Vietnamese PT boats on American
destroyers, provided an excuse for the U.S. to commence air strikes on North
Vietnam. The press corps ate it up. (By 1965, however, Johnson admitted, "For
all I know, our Navy was shooting at whales out there.")
In advance of the 1991 Gulf War, the first Bush Administration perpetuated
accounts of Iraqi soldiers yanking babies from incubators in Kuwait's hospitals.
Why anyone would need to make up stories about a regime that already possessed a
long history of cruel misdeeds is anybody's guess. Nevertheless, this turned out
to be a fake, managed with the help of public relations firm Hill & Knowlton.
Washington's track record for honesty during the current conflict, too, has been
poor. U.S. intelligence sources hyped up forged documents in an attempt to
strengthen support for an invasion. In a recent interview, Hans Blix pointed to
the accusations that Iraq attempted to purchase nuclear materials from the
Central African nation of Niger. "This was a crude lie," Blix explained. "All
false. The information was provided to the International Atomic Energy Agency by
the U.S. intelligence services. As for the mobile laboratories, in attempting to
verify the data that was passed on to U.S. by the Americans, we only found some
trucks dedicated to the processing and control of seeds for agriculture."
Despite such troubling facts, outlets like Fox News always treated suspicions of
illegal weapons as established truth. For them, news items like the April 16
headline in The New York Times reading, "U.S. Inspectors Find No Forbidden
Weapons at Iraqi Arms Plant," are only evidence of that paper's egregious
wimpiness and lingering Communist sympathies.
Yet, Fox's past headlines like "Iraq Arming Troops With Chemical Weapons" now
appear overeager, at best, as justifications for war. They make Bush's "uniquely
evil" adversary seem uniquely restrained in not deploying the banned armaments
during the war, when he faced a force hell-bent on his elimination.
Government deception and suspect reporting has engendered skepticism even within
the intelligence community. The news service Agence France Press recently
published an interview with retired CIA intelligence analyst Ray McGovern, who
says "Some of my colleagues are virtually certain that there will be some
weapons of mass destruction found, even though they might have to be planted."
"I'm just as sure that some few will be found," he argued, "but not in any
amount that by any stretch would justify the charge of a threat against the U.S.
or anyone else."
The Bush Administration's rejection of independent investigations represents a
further step down the road of dangerous unilateralism. Promoting international
cooperation and goodwill is vital to any real pursuit of global security, yet
these are precisely the things undermined by Washington's belligerence.
Even from a narrow view of America's foreign policy interests, the U.S.
government should want independent verification to vindicate its accusations and
to dispel lingering doubts.
That is, unless the old maxim applies, and truth has once again become a
casualty of war.
Tony
"About the time of the end, a body of men will be raised up, who will turn
their attention to the prophecies, in the midst of much clamor and opposition."
Sir Isaac Newton
eric.
"TonyZ2001" <tony...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20030502110442...@mb-m07.aol.com...
:)
"eric davis" <ericd...@hotmail.com> Spat the Words
Saddam obeys orders well. His scuds and air force were depleted after Gulf
War 1. Toothless tyrant, probably on the loose.
...........................
A lot of mayhem, lives lost and money spent deposing Saddam. And now North
Korea and Syria spit in our face. I don't see the improvement, though the
jobless rate and the budget deficit have skyrocketed.
..............
>
> R. Foreman wrote in message ...
>>
>>New US administration, new foreign policy. Tin pot dictators can get
>>burned when dealing with large democracies where leadership changes
>>every few years. Let that be a lesson to dictators of the world.
>>
>>:)
>
>
> A lot of mayhem, lives lost and money spent deposing Saddam. And now
> North Korea and Syria spit in our face. I don't see the improvement,
> though the jobless rate and the budget deficit have skyrocketed.
>
I never said I liked this president. He is what he is, and we've got
him for the duration barring an impeachable offense.
Still, I do believe the bad people and nations of the world respond
best to force. We're a super-power and we should act like it. We're
a democracy with great regard for human rights but it doesn't mean
we should allow terrorist organizations and states to attack our
people and innterests indiscriminately.
Nothing the president can do will replace the dollars that were lost in the
collapse of the stock markets. Wealth must be recreated so that it can be
reinvested. That will take time. Lots of time.
Ed Cregger
"Dee" <reen...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:%r_sa.54120$4P1.5...@newsread2.prod.itd.earthlink.net...
eric davis a écrit :
>
> Saddam had the absolute support of the U.S. when he invaded Iran.
Lies.
> Saddam
> thought he had the acquiesance of the U.S. when he invaded Kuwait. He
> practically asked permission, and that permissions was seemingly given by
> the American Ambassador to Iraq. What a selective memory you have.
>
Another lie.
Eric, you constantly lie. Why else do you pollute this NG?
J.
Dee a écrit :
>
> eric davis wrote in message <0Bysa.642$S%.88465@news20.bellglobal.com>...
> >Saddam had the absolute support of the U.S. when he invaded Iran. Saddam
> >thought he had the acquiesance of the U.S. when he invaded Kuwait. He
> >practically asked permission, and that permissions was seemingly given by
> >the American Ambassador to Iraq. What a selective memory you have.
>
> Saddam obeys orders well.
LOLOL
J.
With what, dead end manufacturing jobs that are produced at the expense of the
national debt?
>
>Nothing the president can do will replace the dollars that were lost in the
>collapse of the stock markets. Wealth must be recreated so that it can be
>reinvested. That will take time. Lots of time.
No dollars were lost in the collapse of the stock markets, they just got
redistributed. Probably to the CEOs of collapsed and failing companies who
continue to receive multi-million dollar salaries, bonuses and percs for their
outstandingly poor performance (while employees have to work harder, longer
and get laid off).
Woods
No offense intended, but the two things are not related in the slightest.
Before you knock the dead-end jobs created by wars, lets not forget that the
Great Depression that existed during the thirties was brought to a close by
putting Americans back to work in military goods production facilities
during WWII.
Ed Cregger
"Woodswun" <wood...@hotmail.dotcom> wrote in message
news:Bz8ta.93427$5f4....@twister.nyroc.rr.com...
Hell, I could do that job, maybe even better<G>
Sean
On Sun, 04 May 2003 13:28:01 GMT, wood...@hotmail.dotcom (Woodswun)
scratched their head and muttered:
If money "just evaporated during the stock market crashes" the value of the
remaining dollars would have gone up. That didn't happen, because the money
(dollars) is still out there.
>
>No offense intended, but the two things are not related in the slightest.
>
>Before you knock the dead-end jobs created by wars, lets not forget that the
>Great Depression that existed during the thirties was brought to a close by
>putting Americans back to work in military goods production facilities
>during WWII.
Yes, I'm aware of that. But you don't seem to realize that the job skills
used in the plants to produce military equipment were readily ported to
another manufacturing position in the growing economy of the late 40s (and 50s
and 60s). We had fairly new factories, a fairly skilled workforce, and a
lot of demand for all kinds of items. They were not dead-end positions in
1941, but those same positions 60+ years are of no value to workers in the US
now or in the foreseeable future.
Woods
If a stock grows to a selling price of $120 a share and then drops to a
value of $6 a share, where is the $114 that was lost?
Granted, the last person that sold the stock has kept the difference between
his/her original buying price and the selling price, minus commissions and
taxes, but the company that was using the inflated value of its stocks to
guarantee loans to be used as operating capital is S.O.L. Without the high
stock value, the company is very much limited financially.
> >
> >No offense intended, but the two things are not related in the slightest.
> >
> >Before you knock the dead-end jobs created by wars, lets not forget that
the
> >Great Depression that existed during the thirties was brought to a close
by
> >putting Americans back to work in military goods production facilities
> >during WWII.
>
> Yes, I'm aware of that. But you don't seem to realize that the job skills
> used in the plants to produce military equipment were readily ported to
> another manufacturing position in the growing economy of the late 40s (and
50s
> and 60s). We had fairly new factories, a fairly skilled workforce, and a
> lot of demand for all kinds of items. They were not dead-end positions in
> 1941, but those same positions 60+ years are of no value to workers in the
US
> now or in the foreseeable future.
Why could that not happen again?
Ed Cregger
I think the tech sector would show money lost. Bankruptcy usually means
money lost. But it is more evident in the tech sector. If you build
computers and nobody wants them, that's a nearly useless machine. The
builders got paid and the execs got paid; but there would be an overall loss
if the machines are monuments to uselessness. Only an example. The machines
depreciated in value before even being used. It would be like building cars
that never get driven. There is a net loss that some people would feel. The
same probably if the cars are firesold at a small fraction of the
anticipated sale price.
Also hackers could get no payment for disruption, and money is lost except
security companies get more work; but again a net loss for the inconvience
and loss from crashes for instance (for those who didn't backup, it would be
worse).
>Woods
> Eric, you constantly lie.
Well he's no different from you then, is he old fool?
"Dee" <reen...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:%r_sa.54120$4P1.5...@newsread2.prod.itd.earthlink.net...
>
"R. Foreman" <eid...@anti-spam.attbi.com> wrote in message
news:Xns9370D15736688rr...@63.240.76.16...
"Ed Cregger" <ecre...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:c20ta.53051$ey1.4...@newsread1.prod.itd.earthlink.net...
Ed Cregger
"Doctor Ago the TimelordŠ" <.> wrote in message
news:vbdagr5...@corp.supernews.com...
The sun will come out tomorrow. Yet every time there is good news; something
else pops up out of the weeds. If it's not terrorist threats to air travel,
it becomes SARS threats to air travel. Mahmoud Abbas seems like a change for
the Middle East, and terrorists strike again in Tel Aviv, and the IDF
retaliates. Partisan politics will start up in force about the tax cut, and
we don't know what's next.
...................
> Our economy is controlled by the stock markets, in one way of looking
> at it. If the fat cows would stop worrying about the oil, they would
> stop creating depressions and inflation. It is filthy wall street
> that causes people to lose jobs. ie: "Oh no we're going to war.
> That means oil MAY go up. Agent, sell all my stocks at once, I want my
> money NOW!" THAT is the fat-assed greedy thinking that hurts the U.S.
> THAT is why unemployment is up. Fat fuckers! If it happens again,
> let's boycott our own American pigs that ruin our economy through
> their greed. Let Daddy Jingle Pockets stand in an unemployment line!
> WE'LL take his business and house. (maybe the maid too;) )
>
>
Some of those financial institutions are so large, they practicallY
ARE the market, that is, if they sell large amounts of securities
then that very action will drive the market down because 'more sellers
than buyers.' So they often can't win or gain buy selling their
equity holdings; its usually their best bet to hold their assets and
drive the business/company managers to perform and increase the
stock price.
Not to argue, just giving you a different perspective; its all in
the point of view.
--
It is one thing to show a man that he is in error, and
another to put him in possession of Truth." - John Locke
"Dee" <reen...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:LWCta.55783$ey1.5...@newsread1.prod.itd.earthlink.net...
"R. Foreman" <eid...@anti-spam.attbi.com> wrote in message
news:Xns9372BD7A9187Frr...@63.240.76.16...
You're a joke TW.
J.
TW a écrit :
"Jean Guernon" <jgue...@globetrotter.net> wrote in message
news:3EB7FE43...@globetrotter.net...
"Doctor Ago the Timelord©" a écrit :
>
> Jean, the moron is a joke ---- without a punch-line. I never can understand
> how losers like him and "Carnal Blunder" can actually *like* to be losers!
Tells a lot about how empty his life must be. :-)
J.
LOL!!!
"Carnal Blunder", good one. ;-)
BWAHAHAHA! Tell us about nuclear missiles and the bay of pigs again
you top posting buffoon.
"Tom" <parr...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:aa5c37da.03050...@posting.google.com...
> "Doctor Ago the TimelordŠ" <.> wrote in message
Are you going to quote the bible at me?
> My 172 IQ
suure... tell us how the Bay Of Pigs was about nuclear weapons again,
us poor saps with lower IQs always thought it was an attempted coup..
"Tom" <parr...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:aa5c37da.03050...@posting.google.com...
> "Doctor Ago the TimelordŠ" <.> wrote in message
> "Tom" <parr...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> > suure... tell us how the Bay Of Pigs was about nuclear weapons again,
> > us poor saps with lower IQs always thought it was an attempted coup..
> Duh Gee, it was a missile crisis;
BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!, no it wasn't you absolute fucking fool. Educate
yourself about YOUR OWN COUNTRY, mr "170 IQ"....
http://search.yahoo.com/bin/search?p=bay+of+pigs&ei=UTF-8
> WHAT was on the damned things? MISTER
> POTATO HEADS?!? The missiles were supplied by Russia. Kruschev(sp) BRAGGED
> TO THE WORLD that he could annihilate anyone, anytime with atomic missiles.
> 1+1=2, 2+2=4. 3+3=6 Get my drift?
I get the drift that you are a top posting imbecile who doesn't know
the difference between the Bay Of Pigs , his arse and a hole in the
ground.
>
>
"Tom" <parr...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:aa5c37da.0305...@posting.google.com...
BWAHAHAHA! You really are quite hilariously ignorant and shrill. I'll
spell it out nice and simply, so that even you and your "170 iq" can
figure it out, dimbulb: Oh, and let' sput the URL back so everyone can
see what a brainless retard you are making of yourself:
http://search.yahoo.com/bin/search?p=bay+of+pigs&ei=UTF-8
1) April 1961 - Bay of Pigs incident occurs when a load of Cuban
exiles and various CIA bakced mercenaries try to stage a coup in Cuba.
The attempt fails.
2) October 1962 - over 18 months later, the completely seperate cuban
missile crisis.
> I WISH TO GOD I COULD LOCATE YOU SO I COULD KICK THE GOD-DAMNED
> SHIT OUT OF YOU!
Do you get this angry with everyone who shows you how stupid you are?
> WHERE ARE YOU FUCKING COWARD PUSSY BASTARD???
BWAHAHAHA! YO're threatening violence from behind teh saftey of your
screen in a CAPS LOCK rant and you call ME a pussy? I'm sure you can
figure out how to email me, then again, seeing what a fool you hae
shown yourself to be with your bay of Pigs comment, maybe you can't...
> I CAN TAKE
> A TRIP ANY TIME! LET ME FIND A WAY TO LOCATE YOU, I'LL BE THERE! Other
> readers: Is there some way to extract a geographic location from the
> message header??? I want to go hunting. I'm tired of this shit!
You keep screaming and beating your keyboard with your tiny impotent
fists, little man. It really is most amusing. You could easily have
emailed me instead of having this meltdown in public, but you're just
too stupid to even figure that out aren't you?
Oh, and be sure to tell us how the Bay Of Pigs crisis was about
nuclear missiles again.
BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHA!!!!!
LOL! The yankie know-it-all having a tantrum!
Happy hunting you fuckin' idiot!
LOL!
WH
Hehe....
Not to mention he has having a tanturm because he is utterly wrong and
rather stupid. Braindead idiot doesn't know the difference between the Bay
Of Pigs and the Cuban Missile Crisis. Nor is he clever enough to realise my
email address and get in touch with me personally. It is in equal part
hilarious and depressing....
"Tom" <parr...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:aa5c37da.03051...@posting.google.com...
"bollogs" <bol...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:a666e2c5.03051...@posting.google.com...
> "Doctor Ago the Timelord Š" <.> wrote in message
"TW" <parris...@SPAMyahoo.com> wrote in message
news:b9nusv$qgl$1...@newstoo.ericsson.se...
>
> "bollogs" <bol...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:a666e2c5.03051...@posting.google.com...
> > "Doctor Ago the Timelord Š" <.> wrote in message
> news:<vbu2ivk...@corp.supernews.com>...
> > > FOLLOW YOUR GOD-DAMNED LINK AND READ THE SHIT YOU STUPID SORRY FUCKING
snip
Backpedalling noted you top-posting moron. So how far back should we
go? Should we say the deposing of Batista was about Russina nukes too
seeing as the Bay Of Pigs incident evolved from that? BWAHAHAHAHA
> You
> found the links but didn't read the 10,000 articles.
NO need, I am fully aware of the difference between a CIA backed coup
to remove a populist government and an attempt to stage MRBMs out of
Cuba. It was you that was getting confused about that.
> I see, Uh Huh. And
> like, a, I send you an email you'll see mine in return and send me a virus,
> right?
Christ, you really are this stupid aren't you? My point was, dimbulb,
why throw a hissy fit and start threatening violence in a newsgroup
when you could have taken it to email and saved yourself the
humiliation. Fine, I'll just spank you right here then...
"Tom" <parr...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:aa5c37da.03051...@posting.google.com...
> "Doctor Ago the Timelord Š" <.> wrote in message
Of course
> This thread is tiresome. I think you and I could be on
> this forever
Why? You were quite clearly wrong about the Bay of Pigs being some sort of
nuclear missile crisis. If you were any sort of a man you would admit that.
Typically, for a godbothering bigot who puts belief above knowledge you
continue to futiley argue that you were right!
CAn't wait for your next meltdown...