My poly life
Aahz Maruch
anniversary with my local secondary, including an excellent but not
particularly romantic dinner at Shadowbrook. We stayed at a cottage a
half-block from the ocean. What's everyone else doing?
--
Hugs and backrubs -- I break Rule 6 http://rule6.info/
<*> <*> <*>
Today's cutting-edge insult: you are not important enough for me to Google
Phoenix
> I just spent last weekend in Santa Cruz to celebrate my fourteenth
> anniversary with my local secondary, including an excellent but not
> particularly romantic dinner at Shadowbrook. We stayed at a cottage a
> half-block from the ocean. What's everyone else doing?
We just got back from a housewarming/house filk in Seattle with
TOCOTOXen, I missed my weekly phone date with my LDR on Sunday
due to travelling, tomorrow another partner is coming to plant
iris corms for me, and this coming Saturday the boytoy is coming
back for the afternoon.
Not to mention a small bunch of what I lovingly refer to as "my
weird friends" (includes several partners-of-one-flavor-or-
another) is working hard to get The Community Canning Station and
The Planet-Wise Kitchen up and running.
My calendar, she is indispensable...
Deborah
who just had her primary come up and say "Hey, baby, wanna smell
my sponge?" :-) Need I note that he is deep into doing
sourdough these days?
--
"Of all the forms of inequality, injustice in health care is the
most shocking and inhumane."-Martin Luther King, Jr.
Kai Jones
this:
>I just spent last weekend in Santa Cruz to celebrate my fourteenth
>anniversary with my local secondary, including an excellent but not
>particularly romantic dinner at Shadowbrook. We stayed at a cottage a
>half-block from the ocean. What's everyone else doing?
Sounds delightful!
My ex-husband had a triple bypass surgery last week, so I've been
emotionally taking care of our sons as well as sending the younger one
on an overnight train trip to be there for his dad (all went well,
he's still recovering in the hospital). I started piano lessons last
week, too, so I've been practicing every day. Spent the weekend
mostly cleaning and organizing parts of the house, along with piano
and a little knitting (fingerless mitts to keep my hands warm given
we've set the thermostat lower than last winter).
--
Kai Jones gelas...@gmail.com
When a man comes to kill you, kill him first. Sanhedrin 72a
Teal
>
> I just spent last weekend in Santa Cruz to celebrate my fourteenth
> anniversary with my local secondary, including an excellent but not
> particularly romantic dinner at Shadowbrook. We stayed at a cottage a
> half-block from the ocean. What's everyone else doing?
I'm continuing with the nigh-on-endless data collection phase of my
study, which involves taking research subjects out for drives while
getting them to do stuff, for a couple of hours at a time, at various
times of the day and night. Lather, rinse, repeat. My partner Martindale
is doing rather more overtime than he'd like at present, but hey, it'll
pay for the dog's dental bills (*sigh*) so that's something at least. My
other partner Artyem is dealing with a family crisis - his father was
carted off to hospital yesterday with chest pains. I've not had any
updates from Artyem since yesterday afternoon about all that, but I
imagine that whatever is going on it's going to be pretty stressful for
Artyem, given that his mother is even more anxiety-prone than he is.
Ah, my thrilling polyamorous lifestlye. It's all sex parties and orgies
as far as the eye can see. (NOT!)
Teal
Susan Davis
>
> I just spent last weekend in Santa Cruz to celebrate my fourteenth
> anniversary with my local secondary, including an excellent but not
> particularly romantic dinner at Shadowbrook. We stayed at a cottage a
> half-block from the ocean. What's everyone else doing?
Talking to recruiters in another city to facilitate a move closer to one
of my primaries. Waiting for one of them to get back to me so I can
leave for a date with my boyfriend/TOCOTOX. Sending email to my other
primary about some logistical things related to the two of us moving.
Other stuff that I can't talk about yet.
--
Susan Davis <s...@sue.net>
Stef
>I just spent last weekend in Santa Cruz to celebrate my fourteenth
>anniversary with my local secondary, including an excellent but not
>particularly romantic dinner at Shadowbrook. We stayed at a cottage a
>half-block from the ocean. What's everyone else doing?
A while ago I got back from visiting my mom in the memory care facility
(she was having a good day).
My dad just called to let me know that one of my folks' miniature
Schnauzers has been diagnosed with diabetes and he's taking him to the
pet hospital.
My sweetie and I are negotiating by email whether to meet at her place
or at our favorite dim sum restaurant.
I'm behind on my work.
I have accumulated 27,993,200 points in the Bejeweled 2 Deluxe endless
game.
--
Stef ** st...@cat-and-dragon.com **
** cat-and-dragon.com/stef ** firecat.livejournal.com **
**
Language is a virus from outer space. -- William S. Burroughs
Guy W. Thomas
uncommon form of leukemia. He seems to be going in and out of
rationality. My partner Carol's other partner, Betty is transferring
back to rehab today from the hospital. She seems better than she has
been in months.
The last two days I've been doing my best not to work on my NaNoWriMo or
at least it seems that way. Just barely get the things done that I
absolutely have to get done. Looking forward to seeing Serene tomorrow.
Yes, and of course the wall-to-wall nonstop orgy we are all enjoying. :-)
--
Guy W. Thomas
San Leandro, CA
http://www.xango.org http://stonebender.livejournal.com/
"If you can't believe what you read in comic books, what can you believe?"
-- Bullwinkle J. Moose
Serene Vannoy
> We just got back from a housewarming/house filk in Seattle with
> TOCOTOXen,
Nice!
> I missed my weekly phone date with my LDR on Sunday due to
> travelling, tomorrow another partner is coming to plant iris corms for
> me, and this coming Saturday the boytoy is coming back for the afternoon.
>
> Not to mention a small bunch of what I lovingly refer to as "my weird
> friends" (includes several partners-of-one-flavor-or- another) is
> working hard to get The Community Canning Station and The Planet-Wise
> Kitchen up and running.
Ooh, tell more.
>
> My calendar, she is indispensable...
Mine doesn't get much of a workout, usually, but we three aren't very
social critters, for the most part.
>
> Deborah
> who just had her primary come up and say "Hey, baby, wanna smell my
> sponge?" :-) Need I note that he is deep into doing sourdough these days?
Hee!
Serene
--
42 Magazine, celebrating life with meaning. Issue 2 is here!
http://42magazine.com
"I tend to come down on the side of autonomy. Once people are grown up,
I believe they have the right to go to hell in the handbasket of their
choosing." -- Pat Kight, on alt.polyamory
Serene Vannoy
> My ex-husband had a triple bypass surgery last week, so I've been
> emotionally taking care of our sons as well as sending the younger one
> on an overnight train trip to be there for his dad (all went well,
> he's still recovering in the hospital).
I'm glad it went well, for all of your sakes.
> I started piano lessons last
> week, too, so I've been practicing every day.
Ooh, have you played before? I'm teaching myself (again) from books, and
having a blast.
> Spent the weekend
> mostly cleaning and organizing parts of the house, along with piano
> and a little knitting (fingerless mitts to keep my hands warm given
> we've set the thermostat lower than last winter).
Nice. I love fingerless gloves. My knitting project is, and will be for
a lonnnnng time, the Dr. Who scarf I'm making for James, but after that,
I want to learn to make fingerless gloves and toeless toe socks. :-)
Serene Vannoy
> Ah, my thrilling polyamorous lifestlye. It's all sex parties and orgies
> as far as the eye can see. (NOT!)
Yep. We sometimes remark on how, for polyfolk, we have a remarkably
small amount of sex.
Serene Vannoy
> A while ago I got back from visiting my mom in the memory care facility
> (she was having a good day).
Good. I am so glad places like that exist, and that they've given your
family some respite.
>
> My dad just called to let me know that one of my folks' miniature
> Schnauzers has been diagnosed with diabetes and he's taking him to the
> pet hospital.
Oy. Best wishes with that.
>
> My sweetie and I are negotiating by email whether to meet at her place
> or at our favorite dim sum restaurant.
Mmmmmmmm, dim summmmmmm.
>
> I'm behind on my work.
Oh, god, me, too. Not my work at the University, but the magazine. I'm
so far behind that I get anxiety attacks just thinking about it, which
doesn't make it more likely that I'll catch up. (Suggestions, geeking,
GAS/MAS are expressly welcome on this, but suggestions to just suck it
up and do it won't be appreciated.)
>
> I have accumulated 27,993,200 points in the Bejeweled 2 Deluxe endless
> game.
I'd better not even go there. :-)
Serene, addictive personality? me???
Serene Vannoy
>
> The last two days I've been doing my best not to work on my NaNoWriMo or
> at least it seems that way.
Heh. I'm busy doing the same on the magazine. Sometimes I just get stuck
where even looking at it feels impossible. Bleah.
> Just barely get the things done that I
> absolutely have to get done. Looking forward to seeing Serene tomorrow.
Yay!
> Yes, and of course the wall-to-wall nonstop orgy we are all enjoying. :-)
Well, I'll tell ya, pal, if we don't manage to carve out some time for
sex tomorrow, I may have to break up with you. ;-)
Serene
Erin
> I just spent last weekend in Santa Cruz to celebrate my fourteenth
> anniversary with my local secondary, including an excellent but not
> particularly romantic dinner at Shadowbrook. We stayed at a cottage a
> half-block from the ocean. What's everyone else doing?
Had a lovely birthday with If and Sarah and Oksana and Lorne about two
weeks ago; felt very loved and spoiled. Really wishing I could move to
Canada right this minute, but that will take some time.
Since then (well, and before then), I have been working on my tenure
portfolio, which is due Monday and is sucking all the life out of me.
My partners have been very supportive through all of this (although
not living with me probably helps right now :).
An on-again off-again flirtation that I had thought was decidedly off
has suddenly turned on, so that's nice, but I also won't be devastated
if nothing happens outside of our email exchange.
Erin, who notes that the tenure process is not as bad as the
dissertation if only because the house hasn't spontaneously combusted
like it did before
Aahz Maruch
Erin <ping...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>Erin, who notes that the tenure process is not as bad as the
>dissertation if only because the house hasn't spontaneously combusted
>like it did before
...yet. ;-)
Guy W. Thomas
> Guy W. Thomas wrote:
>
>>
>> The last two days I've been doing my best not to work on my NaNoWriMo
>> or at least it seems that way.
>
> Heh. I'm busy doing the same on the magazine. Sometimes I just get stuck
> where even looking at it feels impossible. Bleah.
Bleah
> > Just barely get the things done that I
>> absolutely have to get done. Looking forward to seeing Serene tomorrow.
>
> Yay!
Yay!
>> Yes, and of course the wall-to-wall nonstop orgy we are all enjoying. :-)
>
> Well, I'll tell ya, pal, if we don't manage to carve out some time for
> sex tomorrow, I may have to break up with you. ;-)
I'll start doing my stretching! :)
Kai Jones
<ser...@serenepages.org> wrote:
>Kai Jones wrote:
>
>> My ex-husband had a triple bypass surgery last week,
>I'm glad it went well, for all of your sakes.
Thanks, me too.
> > I started piano lessons last
>> week, too, so I've been practicing every day.
>
>Ooh, have you played before? I'm teaching myself (again) from books, and
>having a blast.
Nope. I did study clarinet a couple of years (ages 11 and 12) and
while still in school was always in choir; I could sight read for
several years after school, but it's gone now.
> > Spent the weekend
>> mostly cleaning and organizing parts of the house, along with piano
>> and a little knitting (fingerless mitts to keep my hands warm given
>> we've set the thermostat lower than last winter).
>
>Nice. I love fingerless gloves. My knitting project is, and will be for
>a lonnnnng time, the Dr. Who scarf I'm making for James, but after that,
>I want to learn to make fingerless gloves and toeless toe socks. :-)
Fingerless gloves or mitts? Fingerless gloves actually have a tiny
bity of finger knitted for each appendage, while mitts just have a
straight top. Mitts can be pretty easy; the hardest part for me was
learning to manage knitting in the round on double pointed needles.
Of course there are patterns that are knitted flat, but I hate sewing
up the seams. :)
--
Kai Jones sni...@panix.com
Smartass by nurture as well as nature. Oh yeah, and I'm contrary, too.
Serene Vannoy
> On Tue, 10 Nov 2009 18:05:24 -0800, Serene Vannoy
> <ser...@serenepages.org> wrote:
>> Ooh, have you played [piano] before? I'm teaching myself (again)
from books, and
>> having a blast.
>
> Nope. I did study clarinet a couple of years (ages 11 and 12) and
> while still in school was always in choir; I could sight read for
> several years after school, but it's gone now.
*nodnod* I had to take piano for school (I was a voice major), but I
pretty much sucked at it, especially under the scrutiny. I remembered,
though, how happy I'd been playing as a kid, and mentioned that to Guy,
and well, the rest is history. :-)
>> Nice. I love fingerless gloves. My knitting project is, and will be for
>> a lonnnnng time, the Dr. Who scarf I'm making for James, but after that,
>> I want to learn to make fingerless gloves and toeless toe socks. :-)
>
> Fingerless gloves or mitts?
I like both, though I suppose I like the gloves more, for the cuteness
factor (probably not everyone thinks the gloves are cuter than the
mitts, but I do).
Serene
Darkhawk (H. Nicoll)
> What's everyone else doing?
Tonight is my night for Sitting Under The Baby. (Because we're all
still under the same roof, everyone has a weeknight to be Under The Baby
except for the one we're usually out of the house.)
We did exciting things like go to the grocery store this evening, in
part to pick up the partner's medications for post-dental-surgery. The
lamprey loves the grocery store, so going about with her in the wrap was
full of lots of staring. Especially at the ceiling, which I find
moderately perplexing.
My Celt is a stressbucket, which is ... almost a given, really, but
between the renovations he's doing on the kitchen at their place and his
grad school thing he feels totally overloaded. The fact that his mother
is actively poly-hostile and about yea close to pulling an "it's her or
me" every time it comes up does not help, and I wish I could stop being
stressed and tearful about that bit of situation because I'd do a better
job of dealing with *his* stress about it...
The partner and I have been playing a computer game about abstracted
world conquest. (For the last year and change, really, but we've
actually been active in it recently.) This sort of does and doesn't
take a fair chunk of time. Ah well.
- Darkhawk, mostly occupied with babyness, honestly
--
Darkhawk - K. H. A. Nicoll - http://aelfhame.net/~darkhawk/
Come, take my body (Allelu--)
Come, take my soul (Take my soul--) "Dark Time"
Come, take me over, I want to be whole. October Project
Pat Kight
> I just spent last weekend in Santa Cruz to celebrate my fourteenth
> anniversary with my local secondary, including an excellent but not
> particularly romantic dinner at Shadowbrook. We stayed at a cottage a
> half-block from the ocean. What's everyone else doing?
Directing a play, planning train trips to and from Seattle in between
rehearsals and impending shows, glad my sweetheart has other things to
keep him entertained while my head's wrapped up in theater. (-:
--
Pat Kight
kig...@peak.org
Pat Kight
> Teal wrote:
>
>> Ah, my thrilling polyamorous lifestlye. It's all sex parties and
>> orgies as far as the eye can see. (NOT!)
>
> Yep. We sometimes remark on how, for polyfolk, we have a remarkably
> small amount of sex.
Quality trumps quantity any day, in my book. (-:
--
Pat Kight
kig...@peak.org
Serene Vannoy
I'm poly. I want both. :-)
Serene
Vron McIntyre
>I just spent last weekend in Santa Cruz to celebrate
> my fourteenth anniversary with my local secondary,
> including an excellent but not particularly romantic
> dinner at Shadowbrook. We stayed at a cottage a
> half-block from the ocean. What's everyone else
> doing?
Still catching up on sleep after a trip to Bristol last weekend for
the leaving party of a friend going back to live in Australia after
seven years in the UK, which had lots of good friends, a fire,
fireworks, food, drumming, singing, dancing and an outdoor hot tub.
Going for dinner tonight to a friend's house, someone we see a few
times a year; going to Birmingham on Friday night to see Alice in
Chains. This is an unusually busy week socially for us!
Also, swimming every morning before going to work Monday to Friday,
trying to work out how to make my job less stressful and/or more
enjoyable or how to find one that is. Catching up with lovely people
I'd lost contact with over the years who've found me via Facebook. In
odd moments, trying to write an article for our Queer Pagan Camp
occasional zine about the complexities of fitting and misfitting,
belonging or not belonging, herding cats, and the perils of trying to
promote a sense of community by trying to get everyone to do the same
stuff together. Seasonal pagan observances of various kinds. Sorting
out the fluffKitten's citizenship application. Attempting to keep up
with and occasionally contribute to various online discussions,
including alt.poly.
(Most of this doesn't sound very poly related, but a surprising amount
of it is, one way or another.)
--
Vron McIntyre
vr...@chariot.fsnet.co.uk
nickie{D}
> I just spent last weekend in Santa Cruz to celebrate my fourteenth
> anniversary with my local secondary, including an excellent but not
> particularly romantic dinner at Shadowbrook. We stayed at a cottage a
> half-block from the ocean. What's everyone else doing?
Mmmm - the ocean! :-)
Last weekend one of my primaries, M, went to an indoor rowing
competition and came back with her secondary partner (S); my other
primary, D, had his secondary (L) over for the whole weekend from Friday
night til Monday morning ... so we had a house full.
I was able to get enough alone time though and was happy to accept help
with housework that I hadn't been able to get done.
On Sunday M took me to a local supermarket for an outing and to stock up
on some foods that the delivery company don't carry. I managed the
outing but did find it a bit tiring and definitely had to rest when we
got home.
Later I was able to cheerfully send D and L off to the local Fetish Fair
and afterparty - when I first heard them plotting to go to this event I
was a bit upset as this is something that has been a special part of my
relationship with D in the past, but had dropped under the radar in
recent years, mainly due to my low energy levels. I did tell them both,
separately, that I was feeling a little bit jealous, and how special
that part of my relationship with D was to me ... and L assured me she
would never do anything that I was uncomfortable with, so I then
reassured her that although I might feel a little sad about not being
able to go myself, I was actually OK with them going together and hoped
that when I recover I will be able to take up that thread again with him.
As it happens they came back very early having been disappointed by the
afterparty ... and we all sat around watching TV for an hour before bedtime.
I snuck into the bed D and L were sharing in the morning when she got up
to shower ... so I got some snuggle time too.
I've been sleeping in a separate room lately because of my surgery and
the ongoing health issues ... but I usually sneak into our big bed in
the morning if I can to have a brief snuggle.
--
nickie{D}
nickie{D}
> I just spent last weekend in Santa Cruz to celebrate my fourteenth
> anniversary with my local secondary, including an excellent but not
> particularly romantic dinner at Shadowbrook. We stayed at a cottage a
> half-block from the ocean. What's everyone else doing?
Mmmm - the ocean! :-)
Susan Davis
>
> Had a lovely birthday with If and Sarah and Oksana and Lorne about two
> weeks ago; felt very loved and spoiled. Really wishing I could move to
> Canada right this minute, but that will take some time.
All the cool kids are doing it! Regrettably, I don't see enough of those
guys; I've been remiss about keeping up with a number of local friends.
--
Susan Davis <s...@sue.net>
Susan Davis
> Teal wrote:
>
>> Ah, my thrilling polyamorous lifestlye. It's all sex parties and orgies
>> as far as the eye can see. (NOT!)
>
> Yep. We sometimes remark on how, for polyfolk, we have a remarkably
> small amount of sex.
Seester! This, this is me. I'm just emerging from a lengthy period of
having a vanishingly small amount of sex, and one of my primary
relationships is built primarily about being lovey/kissy/snuggly/cuddly
rather than hot and sexy.
--
Susan Davis <s...@sue.net>
Piglet
>Oh, god, me, too. Not my work at the University, but the magazine. I'm
>so far behind that I get anxiety attacks just thinking about it, which
>doesn't make it more likely that I'll catch up. (Suggestions, geeking,
>GAS/MAS are expressly welcome on this, but suggestions to just suck it
>up and do it won't be appreciated.)
Here's what I do.
Set a timer. 15 minutes. Work (without thinking about how much work
there is!) while it's ticking. Stop. Breathe. Run around in
circles. Lather, rinse, repeat.
--
Piglet, pig...@piglet.org
"That may be YOUR point. MY point is to live each moment so as
to maximize the amount of complaining that can be done about said
moment, after the fact. It's not as easy as it looks." --jankplus
Ben
> Oh, god, me, too. Not my work at the University, but the magazine. I'm
> so far behind that I get anxiety attacks just thinking about it, which
> doesn't make it more likely that I'll catch up. (Suggestions, geeking,
> GAS/MAS are expressly welcome on this, but suggestions to just suck it
> up and do it won't be appreciated.)
<GAS>
Write down a few things that you need to do. Now what's the first itsy
bitsy thing that would get each one started? Once you have a list of itsy
bitsy things, those are much easier to do. Good itsy bitsy things are like
- make sure so-and-so's number is on my phone so I can call her tomorrow.
- make a quick first draft of the overall structure of the report
- surf flickr for five possible royalty free images for the cover
- find all the bits of paper everywhere relating to this thing and put
them in a big pile
You can tell it's NOT an itsy bitsy thing if it will take you more than
half an hour, or if you're not really sure how to do it because before
you do it you need to look up this other thing...
When you have done an itsy bitsy thing, cross it off your list with a
great sense of drama and flourish. Then do another one!
Ben.
Aqua
> Aahz Maruch <aa...@pobox.com> wrote:
>> What's everyone else doing?
>
> Tonight is my night for Sitting Under The Baby. (Because we're all
> still under the same roof, everyone has a weeknight to be Under The Baby
> except for the one we're usually out of the house.)
>
> We did exciting things like go to the grocery store this evening, in
> part to pick up the partner's medications for post-dental-surgery. The
> lamprey loves the grocery store, so going about with her in the wrap was
> full of lots of staring. Especially at the ceiling, which I find
> moderately perplexing.
As I understand it, unless you're planning to go into pediatrics or
infant psych, it's better to be perplexed. It could be that she's
learning that ceilings are at different heights (or different colours)
in different places. (I still have very vivid memories of that Thai
baby who was learning that there are people with non-Thai faces,
starting with mine.)
> My Celt is a stressbucket, which is ... almost a given, really, but
> between the renovations he's doing on the kitchen at their place and his
> grad school thing he feels totally overloaded. The fact that his mother
> is actively poly-hostile and about yea close to pulling an "it's her or
> me" every time it comes up does not help, and I wish I could stop being
> stressed and tearful about that bit of situation because I'd do a better
> job of dealing with *his* stress about it...
I know all, all, all about how useful it would be if I were less
stressed myself and therefore more able to be supportive and/or just
deal with someone I care about's stress.
(If it's any consolation, if she does pull a "her or me" I suspect he
won't find it hard to pick you. That's how that game usually ends.)
Aqua
Aqua
> Erin, who notes that the tenure process is not as bad as the
> dissertation if only because the house hasn't spontaneously combusted
> like it did before
Given my house didn't spontaneously combust, this is not actually
encouraging me in the slightest to ever go through the tenure process.
Aqua
42 hours straight, no chemical assistance, not doing that again.
Aqua
> Stef wrote:
>> I'm behind on my work.
>
> Oh, god, me, too. Not my work at the University, but the magazine. I'm
> so far behind that I get anxiety attacks just thinking about it, which
> doesn't make it more likely that I'll catch up. (Suggestions, geeking,
> GAS/MAS are expressly welcome on this, but suggestions to just suck it
> up and do it won't be appreciated.)
Firstly I have to empathise. I do that, a lot. Other people's helpful
suggestions that I stop worrying about it or that it's not that big a
deal do not help, in fact make it worse (what's wrong with me that I'm
stressing out so much that I can't do this thing, specially if it's not
a big deal????)
I happen to have a strong kinesthetic streak which is still badly
integrated because our society is so anti-kinesthetic, but I am learning
that it helps me to go for a run or a bike ride, or dance madly around
the loungeroom, or even doing the dishes while singing along loudly to
my favourite sing-along songs. I don't know if it's just the
physical-hard-work sweat outcrowding the anxiety sweat, but I'm living
for the day we have full kinesthetic/dance interfaces to
computers/software. Heck, I'll volunteer as a beta-tester.
Aqua
Maureen
> I just spent last weekend in Santa Cruz to celebrate my fourteenth
> anniversary with my local secondary, including an excellent but not
> particularly romantic dinner at Shadowbrook. We stayed at a cottage a
Not a damn thing. On the poly front: occasional phone contact with one
LDR--the other having dumped me. Still with DH. Hanging out in our
self imposed isolation. After 5 months, it's beginning to get to me.
But other things are going well like having enough money to get things
done that need doing.
Maureen
Darkhawk (H. Nicoll)
> Darkhawk (H. Nicoll) wrote:
> > We did exciting things like go to the grocery store this evening, in
> > part to pick up the partner's medications for post-dental-surgery. The
> > lamprey loves the grocery store, so going about with her in the wrap was
> > full of lots of staring. Especially at the ceiling, which I find
> > moderately perplexing.
>
> As I understand it, unless you're planning to go into pediatrics or
> infant psych, it's better to be perplexed. It could be that she's
> learning that ceilings are at different heights (or different colours)
> in different places. (I still have very vivid memories of that Thai
> baby who was learning that there are people with non-Thai faces,
> starting with mine.)
Possibly also still the basic fascination with bright lights.
The Celt commented recently in his journal about watching signs of her
brain development. I have one of those decals for dissuading birds from
flying into windows, the hawk silhouette, on the mirror in the upstairs
bathroom. It used to be when we brought her in there to prep for a
diaper change she would stop wailing and STARE at the silhouette.
Now she talks to the baby in the mirror instead.
> > My Celt is a stressbucket, which is ... almost a given, really, but
> > between the renovations he's doing on the kitchen at their place and his
> > grad school thing he feels totally overloaded. The fact that his mother
> > is actively poly-hostile and about yea close to pulling an "it's her or
> > me" every time it comes up does not help, and I wish I could stop being
> > stressed and tearful about that bit of situation because I'd do a better
> > job of dealing with *his* stress about it...
>
> I know all, all, all about how useful it would be if I were less
> stressed myself and therefore more able to be supportive and/or just
> deal with someone I care about's stress.
It's kind of a mess. I hate the erasure of it. And it was, we dropped
off the gelfling to help with the renovations after running errands and
doing parenty things on Saturday, and normally I'd go in and at least
say hi to him, but his mother was there, so we skipped the drama and
didn't go in, and I cried half the way home. :/
I don't cry easily.
> (If it's any consolation, if she does pull a "her or me" I suspect he
> won't find it hard to pick you. That's how that game usually ends.)
Oh, he's explicitly said so. It's still, y'know. I don't like being
proximate cause of his relationship with his mother tanking. Her
decision, not my fault, but still.
- Darkhawk, sigh
Stef
Serene Vannoy <ser...@serenepages.org> wrote:
>Oh, god, me, too. Not my work at the University, but the magazine. I'm
>so far behind that I get anxiety attacks just thinking about it, which
>doesn't make it more likely that I'll catch up. (Suggestions, geeking,
>GAS/MAS are expressly welcome on this, but suggestions to just suck it
>up and do it won't be appreciated.)
I'm not very good at catching up either but here are a few things that
occur to me:
--Ask for volunteers to help. If you have too much email e.g. maybe a
volunteer could read through it and sort it into different folders.
--I also do Piglet's thing of setting a timer for a few minutes. (10
minutes of work, 10 minutes of Bejeweled :-)
--Write a thorough to-do list, prioritize it, sort it by type of activity
(e.g. phone calls, working at computer, running errands).
--
Stef ** st...@cat-and-dragon.com **
** cat-and-dragon.com/stef ** firecat.livejournal.com **
**
The Hasidic rabbi Menakhem Mendl of Rymanov once said to his teacher,
Rabbi Elimelekh, "Every evening I behold the angel who rolls away the
light before the darkness, and every morning I behold the angel who
rolls away the darkness before the light."
"Yes," said Elimelekh, "when I was young I used to see that too. But
I grew out of it, thank God."
-- Stephen Mitchell, Meetings with the Archangel
Vicki Rosenzweig
>I just spent last weekend in Santa Cruz to celebrate my fourteenth
>anniversary with my local secondary, including an excellent but not
>particularly romantic dinner at Shadowbrook. We stayed at a cottage a
>half-block from the ocean. What's everyone else doing?
I spent the weekend with my long-distance girlfriend, who took me out
for sushi as a (slightly early) birthday dinner, and put candles in
homemade cookies for me to blow out. Yesterday, I celebrated with my
local beloved and my mother (who is in the country for a fortnight or
so).
--
Vicki Rosenzweig | v...@redbird.org
"Regret, by definition, comes too late;
Say what you mean. Bear witness. Iterate." --John M. Ford
Vicki Rosenzweig
(PST):
>Erin, who notes that the tenure process is not as bad as the
>dissertation if only because the house hasn't spontaneously combusted
>like it did before
Oh, dear.
I mean "Whew!" and "story?!"
Aqua
> Aqua <aq...@internode.on.net> wrote:
>> (If it's any consolation, if she does pull a "her or me" I suspect he
>> won't find it hard to pick you. That's how that game usually ends.)
>
> Oh, he's explicitly said so. It's still, y'know. I don't like being
> proximate cause of his relationship with his mother tanking. Her
> decision, not my fault, but still.
Yes, it does truly suck. I'm sorry you have to be in a context like this.
Aqua
866013149e
>I just spent last weekend in Santa Cruz to celebrate my fourteenth
>anniversary with my local secondary, including an excellent but not
>particularly romantic dinner at Shadowbrook. We stayed at a cottage a
>half-block from the ocean. What's everyone else doing?
Looking for work, as my most important client is going away in less than
three weeks.
Driving to upstate New York to visit my father, who is having some
health issues.
Singing in the choir.
That's pretty much it, although I did manage to get a good picture of a
great blue heron the other day.
umar
Rob Wynne
> I just spent last weekend in Santa Cruz to celebrate my fourteenth
> anniversary with my local secondary, including an excellent but not
> particularly romantic dinner at Shadowbrook. We stayed at a cottage a
> half-block from the ocean. What's everyone else doing?
Things in my immediate vicinity are good. I am working on a huge project
at work that is stressy but also engaging and helping me remember why
precisely I enjoy doing this for a living sometimes.
In my extended web...it's been a very stressful time, recently. One of my
sweeties just left her husband, two weeks after giving birth, and I've
spent much of the last six months trying to be as supportive as i can be of
her as she's been working through this, and cursing that I'm 1100 miles
away.
That's honestly what's been occupying most of my spare brain cycles lately,
so I've been kinda quiet on the forums I normally frequent.
--
Rob Wynne / The Autographed Cat / d...@america.net
http://www.autographedcat.com/ / http://autographedcat.livejournal.com/
Gafilk 2010: Jan 8-10, 2010 - Atlanta, GA - http://www.gafilk.org/
Aphelion - Original SF&F since 1997 - http://www.aphelion-webzine.com/
Pat Kight
> Anyone doing PC work, on Windows, might appreciate this:
>
> http://netcult.ch/elmue/ElmueSoft-en.htm
>
> Does a number of things quite neatly, including timers, desktop calendar
> etc.
Google's Desktop application also has widgets for all those things (plus
a nicely functional, compact RSS feed aggregator). I use it on all my
computers, generally in the sidebar configuration, along with Google
Calendar. The nice part is that it's functional across multiple
computers, as long as they're connected to the Internet, so no more
trying to remember to update appointments, etc. on home+work+laptop
machines.
Of course, I'm a screaming Google fangirl ...
--
Pat Kight
kig...@peak.org
Phoenix
> In my extended web...it's been a very stressful time, recently. One of my
> sweeties just left her husband, two weeks after giving birth, and I've
> spent much of the last six months trying to be as supportive as i can be of
> her as she's been working through this, and cursing that I'm 1100 miles
> away.
Oh dear. Sending supportive energy/healing vibes/hugs of all
flavors, if they are welcome and useful.
Deborah
--
"Of all the forms of inequality, injustice in health care is the
most shocking and inhumane."-Martin Luther King, Jr.
Rob Wynne
> Rob Wynne wrote:
>> In my extended web...it's been a very stressful time, recently. One of my
>> sweeties just left her husband, two weeks after giving birth, and I've
>> spent much of the last six months trying to be as supportive as i can be of
>> her as she's been working through this, and cursing that I'm 1100 miles
>> away.
>
> Oh dear. Sending supportive energy/healing vibes/hugs of all
> flavors, if they are welcome and useful.
>
Oh, they very much are. Thank you. *hug*
Erin
> Quoth Erin <pingue...@gmail.com> on Tue, 10 Nov 2009 18:41:10 -0800
> (PST):
>
> >Erin, who notes that the tenure process is not as bad as the
> >dissertation if only because the house hasn't spontaneously combusted
> >like it did before
>
> Oh, dear.
>
> I mean "Whew!" and "story?!"
Over Spring Break in March 2004, I was desperately trying to finish my
dissertation so that I could give it to my committee with a month's
lead time in order to meet my defense date of April 23. I think it was
Wednesday or Thursday, and I was so close to being done, when I got up
from my desk and went into the kitchen to get a drink. I heard a
whooshing sound from under the sink, and I opened up the cabinet under
the sink to discover flames where flames should not have been.
Called 911, called the landlord (who lived in the building), who
immediately came up with a fire extinguisher and put the fire mostly
out. The firefighters arrived and covered my entire kitchen with
yellow spray foam just to make sure. I then called Allan (my partner
at the time), who had graciously gone to visit his other partner for
the week so I could work undisturbed, and sobbingly demanded that he
come home, which he did.
The fire chief's theory was that some of the cleaning chemicals under
my sink had been emitting fumes, and some kind of spark caused the
fumes to ignite and a mop head I was storing under there to catch
fire. I maintain (jokingly) that it was spontaneous combustion due to
displaced stress, or perhaps latent pyrokinesia on my part.
Nothing was really damaged except the bottles of cleaner and the ex-
mop-head, and while I lost some time scrubbing fire extinguisher foam
off of everything in my kitchen and concluding that you *really* do
not want to inhale while doing that, it could have been so much worse
if I hadn't been home. (I felt smug about having off-site backups of
all of my dissertation data in three separate locations, though.)
Erin, hoping history doesn't repeat itself
ShadowEagle
> I just spent last weekend in Santa Cruz to celebrate my fourteenth
> anniversary with my local secondary, including an excellent but not
> particularly romantic dinner at Shadowbrook. We stayed at a cottage a
> half-block from the ocean. What's everyone else doing?
This has been a very lucky time for me lately... as my birthday was on
the 6th, i got to spend 3 days in 3 weeks with my LD g/f... (we
usually only see each other one day a month.). so we celebrated my
birthday 3 times. the first saturday night was dinner, then dancing to
one of her favorite reggae groups, then great sex. then the following
friday night we saw "where the wild things are", (very interesting
movie, i never read the kids book. i didnt feel that was really a kids
movie though. .. )... and then some great sex.... and then the third
week we met for lunch and thheatre... no sex, but a lot of "making
out" afterwards.... so it was the best birthday for me... we probbly
wont hook up again till after the holidays, but we'll see.
you all?
shadow
Aahz Maruch
Erin <ping...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>Nothing was really damaged except the bottles of cleaner and the ex-
>mop-head, and while I lost some time scrubbing fire extinguisher foam
>off of everything in my kitchen and concluding that you *really* do
>not want to inhale while doing that, it could have been so much worse
>if I hadn't been home. (I felt smug about having off-site backups of
>all of my dissertation data in three separate locations, though.)
Wow, that was quite exciting, glad it wasn't lots of damage.
>Erin, hoping history doesn't repeat itself
You remember your history, so probably not. ;-)
(Joke for people on Panix: why am I tempted to stick an "ObDman" here?)
--
Hugs and backrubs -- I break Rule 6 http://rule6.info/
<*> <*> <*>
Today's cutting-edge insult: you are not important enough for me to Google
Aahz Maruch
Maureen <evening...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>Not a damn thing. On the poly front: occasional phone contact with one
>LDR--the other having dumped me. Still with DH. Hanging out in our
>self imposed isolation. After 5 months, it's beginning to get to me.
>But other things are going well like having enough money to get things
>done that need doing.
Glad to hear about the money! Sorry about the isolation and the dumping.
<hugs>
Aahz Maruch
>
>In my extended web...it's been a very stressful time, recently. One of my
>sweeties just left her husband, two weeks after giving birth, and I've
>spent much of the last six months trying to be as supportive as i can be of
>her as she's been working through this, and cursing that I'm 1100 miles
>away.
Wow. <hugs> and feel free to pass them along if you think they'd be
wanted.
Rob Wynne
> In article <hdg6km$ces$1...@news.america.net>, Rob Wynne <d...@america.net> wrote:
>>
>>In my extended web...it's been a very stressful time, recently. One of my
>>sweeties just left her husband, two weeks after giving birth, and I've
>>spent much of the last six months trying to be as supportive as i can be of
>>her as she's been working through this, and cursing that I'm 1100 miles
>>away.
>
> Wow. <hugs> and feel free to pass them along if you think they'd be
> wanted.
Thanks. I know she'll appreciate it. :)
Maureen
> Aahz Maruch <aa...@pobox.com> wrote:
>> In article <hdg6km$ces$1...@news.america.net>, Rob Wynne <d...@america.net> wrote:
>>> In my extended web...it's been a very stressful time, recently. One of my
>>> sweeties just left her husband, two weeks after giving birth, and I've
>>> spent much of the last six months trying to be as supportive as i can be of
>>> her as she's been working through this, and cursing that I'm 1100 miles
>>> away.
>> Wow. <hugs> and feel free to pass them along if you think they'd be
>> wanted.
>
> Thanks. I know she'll appreciate it. :)
>
Maureen
Maureen
> In article <7m0up1F...@mid.individual.net>,
> Maureen <evening...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> Not a damn thing. On the poly front: occasional phone contact with one
>> LDR--the other having dumped me. Still with DH. Hanging out in our
>> self imposed isolation. After 5 months, it's beginning to get to me.
>> But other things are going well like having enough money to get things
>> done that need doing.
>
> Glad to hear about the money! Sorry about the isolation and the dumping.
> <hugs>
Like I said, the isolation is self imposed. If I can stand a couple
years, we're out of here.
Maureen
866013149e
>Of course, I'm a screaming Google fangirl ...
I find it interesting that Google has screaming
fan-[boy|girl|whatever]s. I can't immediately think of any other big
corporation that does, especially in the software or hardware area. Can
one even imagine a screaming Microsoft or IBM fan? or an Apple (as
opposed to a Mac or iPhone) fan?
Google seems somehow to have managed to avoid being tagged as the next
Evil Empire.
umar
David Weinshenker
> Google seems somehow to have managed to avoid being tagged as the next
> Evil Empire.
While letting Microsoft, Amazon, etc, take the heat? That's part of the
scheme. We're soon getting to the point where your computer isn't really
your computer anymore, it's just the terminal where you access your
"myOnlineUniverse" account on the Goomazoft system!
-dave w
Aqua
> Pat Kight <kig...@peak.org> writes:
>
>> Of course, I'm a screaming Google fangirl ...
>
> I find it interesting that Google has screaming
> fan-[boy|girl|whatever]s. I can't immediately think of any other big
> corporation that does, especially in the software or hardware area. Can
> one even imagine a screaming Microsoft or IBM fan? or an Apple (as
> opposed to a Mac or iPhone) fan?
I live with a screaming Apple fan, and zie has plenty of like-mindeds,
FYI. Historically at least there were both screaming Microsoft fan and
IBM fans (I don't know currently); I've known the odd Sun fan, and Boing
fan. I've even met Adobe fans, although they tend to be in
design/visual arts, which you might not meet so much in radio.
> Google seems somehow to have managed to avoid being tagged as the next
> Evil Empire.
There's definitely a population that doesn't trust that.
Aqua
Louise
>I just spent last weekend in Santa Cruz to celebrate my fourteenth
>anniversary with my local secondary, including an excellent but not
>particularly romantic dinner at Shadowbrook. We stayed at a cottage a
>half-block from the ocean. What's everyone else doing?
Getting ready for various houseguests: tidying the clutter at home,
scheduling social events so my local people can meet some of my
out-of-town people, and trying to get ahead at work.
Knitting on a variety of projects for myself, for other people, and
for art.
Louise
p.daniels
> I just spent last weekend in Santa Cruz to celebrate my fourteenth
> anniversary with my local secondary, including an excellent but not
> particularly romantic dinner at Shadowbrook. We stayed at a cottage a
> half-block from the ocean. What's everyone else doing?
Steph is fresh home from three weeks in Seattle, so that's great. God,
that's great. This town is decidedly less cool without her in it.
Also, I just moved back into the city (thus ends my six month exile in
the suburbs), and happened to rent a place about three blocks from
Steph's other partner, and two miles from her work. And Steph happens
to be between permanent residences for the next two months while she's
house-sitting for her folks. And doesn't this sound like it all just
happens to be very convenient for her? ;)
-p.
eilinel
> I just spent last weekend in Santa Cruz to celebrate my fourteenth
> anniversary with my local secondary, including an excellent but not
> particularly romantic dinner at Shadowbrook. We stayed at a cottage a
> half-block from the ocean. What's everyone else doing?
> Hugs and backrubs -- I break Rule 6 http://rule6.info/
> <*> <*> <*>
> Today's cutting-edge insult: you are not important enough for me to Google
Spent last weekend camping in the Smokies with Hubby. Overall, a
pleasant experience, but got treated to numerous examples of him
waiting for me to do his thinking for him (source of much recent
conflict). Dealing with flu season at work. Planning Xmas visits with
family and Sweetums. Working on my weight, and feeling for the first
time ever that I might actually succeed. Getting my diabetes under
control and almost off meds as a result. Life is good.
Eilinel
Piglet
>Knitting on a variety of projects for myself, for other people, and
>for art.
Lucky art!
--
Piglet, pig...@piglet.org
"That may be YOUR point. MY point is to live each moment so as
to maximize the amount of complaining that can be done about said
moment, after the fact. It's not as easy as it looks." --jankplus
Aahz Maruch
eilinel <eili...@earthlink.net> wrote:
>
>Working on my weight, and feeling for the first time ever that I might
>actually succeed.
What makes you think that this time is different? Why do you care
whether you succeed? What's the definition of success, anyway?
Ed
news:hdjvg6$hu2$1...@panix3.panix.com:
> In article
> <171b3f0d-3375-4264...@a31g2000yqn.googlegroups.com>,
> eilinel <eili...@earthlink.net> wrote:
>>
>>Working on my weight, and feeling for the first time ever that I might
>>actually succeed.
>
> What makes you think that this time is different? Why do you care
> whether you succeed? What's the definition of success, anyway?
Oh please!
Is it not alright for someone to have personal goals to attain without
your approval?
--
Ed
Erin
> In article <d4d2bfa5-7afc-40b1-9e70-44deac3ca...@h2g2000vbd.googlegroups.com>,
>
> Erin <pingue...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Wow, that was quite exciting, glad it wasn't lots of damage.
I was too.
>
> >Erin, hoping history doesn't repeat itself
>
> You remember your history, so probably not. ;-)
>
Well, it's in, and the house is not on fire nor did it catch on fire.
Whew.
Erin, very tired of putting things in binders
Aahz Maruch
Erin <ping...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>Well, it's in, and the house is not on fire nor did it catch on fire.
>Whew.
Congratulations!
eilinel
Congrats!
Eilinel
eilinel
I find your questions offensive, but I'll answer them anyway
.> What makes you think that this time is different?
I'm working a different program, which I have now been on for an
entire month without feeling hungry, deprived nor any desire to eat
off-plan. I'm also reading The Beck Diet Solution, which is cognitive
therapy for changing the way I think about food, and finding the
exercises therein to be VERY helpful, despite my initial thought that
they sounded silly/juvenile.
>Why do you care whether you succeed?
Because I became diabetic about 5 years ago due to my weight and I'm
tired of taking medication. Because I'm expected to dress
professionally for my job and I'm tired of walking past acres of
regular-sized clothes to find the tiny section that holds my starting
size. Because I'm tired of being out of breath within minutes when I
attempt to go hiking in the Smokies.
>What's the definition of success, anyway?
There IS no "the" definition of success. For me personally, the
current definitions are: Reach a non-obese BMI. Have a more-defined
waist (I carry all my weight in my belly). Get off, or at least to the
minimum dose, of diabetic medication. To be able to hike a 5-mile
trail without being ready to collapse at the end. Subject to change
without notice.
Eilinel
Cheryl Martin
eilinel <eili...@earthlink.net> wrote:
>Because I became diabetic about 5 years ago due to my weight and I'm
>tired of taking medication. Because I'm expected to dress
>professionally for my job and I'm tired of walking past acres of
>regular-sized clothes to find the tiny section that holds my starting
>size. Because I'm tired of being out of breath within minutes when I
>attempt to go hiking in the Smokies.
Weight does not cause diabetes. I was diagnosed 5 years ago with type
2, this past Spring, my doc changed my diagnosis to pre-diabetic. I
was and am still a fat chick. Healthier now than then to be sure and
fucking hot to boot!
From the American Diabetes Association website:
Myth: If you are overweight or obese, you will eventually develop type
2 diabetes.
Fact: Being overweight is a risk factor for developing this disease,
but other risk factors such as family history, ethnicity and age also
play a role. Unfortunately, too many people disregard the other risk
factors for diabetes and think that weight is the only risk factor for
type 2 diabetes. Most overweight people never develop type 2
diabetes, and many people with type 2 diabetes are at a normal weight
or only moderately overweight.
Cheryl
--
*Moderator: rec.arts.sf.tv.babylon5.moderated ,sci.space.moderated *
*http://www.grumpywitch.org http://dragonnette.livejournal.com *
*I am grey. I stand between the candle and the star. We are grey. *
*We stand between the darkness and the light. ---JMS *
Louise
Martin) wrote:
>
>Weight does not cause diabetes. I was diagnosed 5 years ago with type
>2, this past Spring, my doc changed my diagnosis to pre-diabetic. I
>was and am still a fat chick. Healthier now than then to be sure and
>fucking hot to boot!
Do you have any idea of what changed in the five years to cause that?
Things under your control?
Louise
Dan Abel
zof...@deepthot.org (Cheryl Martin) wrote:
> In article
> <79bded6d-20de-430c...@b15g2000yqd.googlegroups.com>,
> eilinel <eili...@earthlink.net> wrote:
>
> >Because I became diabetic about 5 years ago due to my weight and I'm
> >tired of taking medication. Because I'm expected to dress
> >professionally for my job and I'm tired of walking past acres of
> >regular-sized clothes to find the tiny section that holds my starting
> >size. Because I'm tired of being out of breath within minutes when I
> >attempt to go hiking in the Smokies.
>
> Weight does not cause diabetes.
That's correct, but most diabetics find it easier to say that it does.
For a diabetic, getting fatter makes the diabetes worse, and getting
less fat makes it better.
> I was diagnosed 5 years ago with type
> 2, this past Spring, my doc changed my diagnosis to pre-diabetic. I
> was and am still a fat chick. Healthier now than then to be sure and
> fucking hot to boot!
It's generally not the weight, it's the fat. If by "healthy", you
partly mean that you are in better shape, that often helps diabetics.
> From the American Diabetes Association website:
>
> Myth: If you are overweight or obese, you will eventually develop type
> 2 diabetes.
>
> Fact: Being overweight is a risk factor for developing this disease,
> but other risk factors such as family history, ethnicity and age also
> play a role. Unfortunately, too many people disregard the other risk
> factors for diabetes and think that weight is the only risk factor for
> type 2 diabetes. Most overweight people never develop type 2
> diabetes, and many people with type 2 diabetes are at a normal weight
> or only moderately overweight.
Eilinel's first sentence was an oversimplification, but that doesn't
mean it isn't true. Many diabetics find that their diabetes (and thus
their medicine needs) increase in direct relation to their weight.
Simply losing weight, with no other change, may cause a decrease in the
need for medication.
I don't know what percentage of the US population is classified as
medically obese, but about 70% of type II diabetics in the US are
classified as medically obese.
--
Dan Abel
Petaluma, California USA
da...@sonic.net
Cheryl Martin
I've learned to eat more carefully(as in eat when I need to) and be
more active. Not sure if this was a factor but I also now have my
thyroid issue under control.
Cheryl Martin
Dan Abel <da...@sonic.net> wrote:
>In article <hdq703$359$1...@dent.deepthot.org>,
> zof...@deepthot.org (Cheryl Martin) wrote:
>
>> In article
>> <79bded6d-20de-430c...@b15g2000yqd.googlegroups.com>,
>> eilinel <eili...@earthlink.net> wrote:
>>
>> >Because I became diabetic about 5 years ago due to my weight and I'm
>> >tired of taking medication. Because I'm expected to dress
>> >professionally for my job and I'm tired of walking past acres of
>> >regular-sized clothes to find the tiny section that holds my starting
>> >size. Because I'm tired of being out of breath within minutes when I
>> >attempt to go hiking in the Smokies.
>>
>> Weight does not cause diabetes.
>
>That's correct, but most diabetics find it easier to say that it does.
That is ridiculous. Diabetics owe it to themselves to get educated
about their condition.
>For a diabetic, getting fatter makes the diabetes worse, and getting
>less fat makes it better.
No. Learning to eat properly and getting more active makes it better.
>> I was diagnosed 5 years ago with type
>> 2, this past Spring, my doc changed my diagnosis to pre-diabetic. I
>> was and am still a fat chick. Healthier now than then to be sure and
>> fucking hot to boot!
>
>It's generally not the weight, it's the fat. If by "healthy", you
>partly mean that you are in better shape, that often helps diabetics.
It means that I eat things that are good for me and that I enjoy
eating. I eat when I need to eat. And I am more active.
>> From the American Diabetes Association website:
>>
>> Myth: If you are overweight or obese, you will eventually develop type
>> 2 diabetes.
>>
>> Fact: Being overweight is a risk factor for developing this disease,
>> but other risk factors such as family history, ethnicity and age also
>> play a role. Unfortunately, too many people disregard the other risk
>> factors for diabetes and think that weight is the only risk factor for
>> type 2 diabetes. Most overweight people never develop type 2
>> diabetes, and many people with type 2 diabetes are at a normal weight
>> or only moderately overweight.
>
>Eilinel's first sentence was an oversimplification, but that doesn't
>mean it isn't true. Many diabetics find that their diabetes (and thus
>their medicine needs) increase in direct relation to their weight.
>Simply losing weight, with no other change, may cause a decrease in the
>need for medication.
>
>I don't know what percentage of the US population is classified as
>medically obese, but about 70% of type II diabetics in the US are
>classified as medically obese.
Where did you get this information?
Dan Abel
zof...@deepthot.org (Cheryl Martin) wrote:
> In article <dabel-CA0F94....@c-61-68-245-199.per.connect.net.au>,
> Dan Abel <da...@sonic.net> wrote:
> >In article <hdq703$359$1...@dent.deepthot.org>,
> > zof...@deepthot.org (Cheryl Martin) wrote:
> >
> >> In article
> >> <79bded6d-20de-430c...@b15g2000yqd.googlegroups.com>,
> >> eilinel <eili...@earthlink.net> wrote:
> >>
> >> >Because I became diabetic about 5 years ago due to my weight and I'm
> >> >tired of taking medication. Because I'm expected to dress
> >> >professionally for my job and I'm tired of walking past acres of
> >> >regular-sized clothes to find the tiny section that holds my starting
> >> >size. Because I'm tired of being out of breath within minutes when I
> >> >attempt to go hiking in the Smokies.
> >>
> >> Weight does not cause diabetes.
> >
> >That's correct, but most diabetics find it easier to say that it does.
>
> That is ridiculous. Diabetics owe it to themselves to get educated
> about their condition.
But not necessarily to educate everyone else. When someone asks a
simple question, sometimes a simple answer is enough. That doesn't mean
the diabetic doesn't know any more than that.
> >For a diabetic, getting fatter makes the diabetes worse, and getting
> >less fat makes it better.
>
> No. Learning to eat properly and getting more active makes it better.
There is not one simple answer. There are many paths.
> >> I was diagnosed 5 years ago with type
> >> 2, this past Spring, my doc changed my diagnosis to pre-diabetic. I
> >> was and am still a fat chick. Healthier now than then to be sure and
> >> fucking hot to boot!
> >
> >It's generally not the weight, it's the fat. If by "healthy", you
> >partly mean that you are in better shape, that often helps diabetics.
>
> It means that I eat things that are good for me and that I enjoy
> eating. I eat when I need to eat. And I am more active.
The fact that your doctor says you are doing better means that you have
found the solution that is working for you. That's what counts. You
have my sincere congratulations.
> >I don't know what percentage of the US population is classified as
> >medically obese, but about 70% of type II diabetics in the US are
> >classified as medically obese.
>
> Where did you get this information?
A diabetes management class that I took many years ago. I don't believe
that it was in writing, although we received a lot of other written
information. Some things have changed since then. Perhaps that
percentage is no longer valid.
Steve Pope
>> >I don't know what percentage of the US population is classified as
>> >medically obese, but about 70% of type II diabetics in the US are
>> >classified as medically obese.
>> Where did you get this information?
>A diabetes management class that I took many years ago. I don't believe
>that it was in writing, although we received a lot of other written
>information. Some things have changed since then. Perhaps that
>percentage is no longer valid.
What I have read recently is that a significant percentage
(something like 40% of newly-diagnosed T2 diabetics can
revert to pre-diabetes by losing a modest amount of weight,
around 10 lbs over several months.
But unstated in the above statement is that other health
improvements such as exercise and diet composition go into
the changed behavior that leads to the result.
Steve
Steve Pope
>In alt.polyamory, (Cheryl Martin) wrote in
>>eilinel <eili...@earthlink.net> wrote:
>>>Because I became diabetic about 5 years ago due to my weight [..]
>>Weight does not cause diabetes. I was diagnosed 5 years ago with type
>>2, this past Spring, my doc changed my diagnosis to pre-diabetic. I
>>was and am still a fat chick. Healthier now than then to be sure and
>>fucking hot to boot!
Eilinel made the statement that *her* diabetes was cause by
her weight, not a more general less supportable statement that
weight is always or often responsible for diabetes.
>In fact, there's evidence to suggest that the correlation goes somewhat
>the other way: some people may be fat because they're (undiagnosed)
>diabetics.
Eilinel was not talking about correlation or statistics, she
was talking about herself.
(Not that there's any problem with making a tangential point; but maybe
here it is used to dismiss something someone said in self-description.)
Steve
Steve Pope
>Just to be sure: you're aware that you're replying to two different
>posters, here?
Yes, I think I indented everything correctly to reflect
that.
(Maybe not, sometimes even after checking such things
two or three times I am left with something mid-indented,
what with glazing-over-of-vision...)
Steve
David Weinshenker
> In fact, there's evidence to suggest that the correlation goes somewhat
> the other way: some people may be fat because they're (undiagnosed)
> diabetics.
That actually strikes me as more credible than the reverse interpretation.
-dave w
Dan Abel
Chickpea <chic...@gmx.co.uk> wrote:
> In fact, there's evidence to suggest that the correlation goes somewhat
> the other way: some people may be fat because they're (undiagnosed)
> diabetics.
The evidence I've seen goes the other way. Untreated diabetes can make
people lose weight.
Dan Abel
David Weinshenker <daz...@earthlink.net> wrote:
Not to me (diagnosed in 1972, lots of diabetic relatives on both sides
of the family). To be technical, correlations, of course, don't go
either way, they just are. Once a correlation is established (say
between my weight and the price of rice in China), then people propose
theories about which one causes the other. And, in my experience, the
correlation is between weight and type II diabetics. I have not
observed, or read about, a correlation between weight and type I
diabetes. And, of course, many type II diabetes are thin. I weigh 175
pounds, up from 165 a few months back. I am 6' 2" tall.
So, what are some theories as to how diabetes could cause fatness?
David Weinshenker
I'm not familiar with the studies Chickpea has evidently seen, but,
since (AIUI) the mechanism for the storage and release of energy by
the formation and breakdown of fat would involve a conversion to and
from blood sugar, it would seem expectable that an excess of available
sugar would tend to drive the process in the "storage" (sugar->fat)
direction. (Of course, like all biological regulation processes, there
are undoubtedly inherent quirks, and a great variety of individual
differences... my understanding of the whole business is admittedly
superficial.)
-dave w
Rob Wynne
Well, in the case of Type II diabetes, I'm not so much sure it's a
cause-and-effect relationship in either direction. High sugar/carb diets
in particular may be the root cause of both without their being an
relationship between them.
--
Rob Wynne / The Autographed Cat / d...@america.net
http://www.autographedcat.com/ / http://autographedcat.livejournal.com/
Gafilk 2010: Jan 8-10, 2010 - Atlanta, GA - http://www.gafilk.org/
Aphelion - Original SF&F since 1997 - http://www.aphelion-webzine.com/
Dan Abel
David Weinshenker <daz...@earthlink.net> wrote:
> Dan Abel wrote:
> > In article <Qq-dnW_0GN1g4JzW...@earthlink.com>,
> > David Weinshenker <daz...@earthlink.net> wrote:
> >
> >> Chickpea wrote:
> >>> In fact, there's evidence to suggest that the correlation goes somewhat
> >>> the other way: some people may be fat because they're (undiagnosed)
> >>> diabetics.
> >> That actually strikes me as more credible than the reverse interpretation.
> >
> > Not to me
> > So, what are some theories as to how diabetes could cause fatness?
> >
>
> I'm not familiar with the studies Chickpea has evidently seen, but,
> since (AIUI) the mechanism for the storage and release of energy by
> the formation and breakdown of fat would involve a conversion to and
> from blood sugar, it would seem expectable that an excess of available
> sugar would tend to drive the process in the "storage" (sugar->fat)
> direction. (Of course, like all biological regulation processes, there
> are undoubtedly inherent quirks, and a great variety of individual
> differences... my understanding of the whole business is admittedly
> superficial.)
Interesting theory. Sounds reasonable, but part of the problem with
diabetes is that the sugar is unable to be transported into the cells.
I wonder if that would disrupt the fat-making process, since the sugar
couldn't get into the cells to be converted into fat? What happens to
excess blood sugar in severe diabetes, is that the kidneys recognize
that it is a poison, and remove it. So a simple test for diabetes is to
test for sugar in the urine.
I don't know if this story is true, but supposedly, back before indoor
plumbing, when people tended to pee on the ground, you could tell who
was a diabetic because their urine would draw flies.
Steve Pope
>In alt.polyamory, (Steve Pope) wrote in <hdrq8q$lvl$1...@blue.rahul.net>::
>>Chickpea <chic...@gmx.co.uk> wrote:
>Just checking - your reply seemed to kind of run on..
Really? I don't think so. I replied with a few lines
to each of two previous posters. Hardly a "run-on".
Steve
Steve Pope
>In article <jsc2g59rprkt2rmt8...@4ax.com>,
> Chickpea <chic...@gmx.co.uk> wrote:
>> In fact, there's evidence to suggest that the correlation goes somewhat
>> the other way: some people may be fat because they're (undiagnosed)
>> diabetics.
>The evidence I've seen goes the other way. Untreated diabetes can make
>people lose weight.
That's certianly a classic symptom of Type I diabetes.
It is less clear whether either sudden wieght loss, or sudden
weight gain, without other explanation might signal type II diabetes.
To compound the quesiton, statements such as "adding weight causes X"
usually mean something more like "the combination of factors
and behaviors associated with adding weight also increase the
chance of X".
Steve
Dan Abel
spo...@speedymail.org (Steve Pope) wrote:
> Dan Abel <da...@sonic.net> wrote:
>
> >In article <jsc2g59rprkt2rmt8...@4ax.com>,
>
> > Chickpea <chic...@gmx.co.uk> wrote:
>
> >> In fact, there's evidence to suggest that the correlation goes somewhat
> >> the other way: some people may be fat because they're (undiagnosed)
> >> diabetics.
>
> >The evidence I've seen goes the other way. Untreated diabetes can make
> >people lose weight.
>
> That's certianly a classic symptom of Type I diabetes.
Yes. And it's not a clear and classic symptom of type II diabetes.
It's a symptom of way out of control severe type II diabetes.
> It is less clear whether either sudden wieght loss, or sudden
> weight gain, without other explanation might signal type II diabetes.
I don't think it's a signal or a symptom very often. If people gain
weight, and go to their doctor, the doctor will probably check their
blood sugar to see if they have symptoms of diabetes. It's not that the
weight gain "caused" the diabetes so much as it made the symptoms kick
in.
> To compound the quesiton, statements such as "adding weight causes X"
> usually mean something more like "the combination of factors
> and behaviors associated with adding weight also increase the
> chance of X".
Upon hearing your first statement, someone without a lot of knowledge
might say, "OK". Someone with more knowledge might say "no", and be
correct. Upon hearing your second statement, most would say, "huh?".
There would then need to be a much more detailed explanation of the
factors and relationships.
Steve Pope
> spo...@speedymail.org (Steve Pope) wrote:
>> To compound the quesiton, statements such as "adding weight causes X"
>> usually mean something more like "the combination of factors
>> and behaviors associated with adding weight also increase the
>> chance of X".
>Upon hearing your first statement, someone without a lot of knowledge
>might say, "OK". Someone with more knowledge might say "no", and be
>correct. Upon hearing your second statement, most would say, "huh?".
>There would then need to be a much more detailed explanation of the
>factors and relationships.
Right; so I avoid statements worded as "adding weight causes X"
in favor of statements worded as "adding weight adds to the risk of X",
since the latter doesn't say the simple existence of added weight
is causative of anything.
Steve
Serene Vannoy
> Well, in the case of Type II diabetes, I'm not so much sure it's a
> cause-and-effect relationship in either direction. High sugar/carb diets
> in particular may be the root cause of both without their being an
> relationship between them.
High-carb diets (the "good carb" kinds) have been shown to reverse
diabetes, actually. (Not cure, reverse, in case anyone wants to jump on
me about my verbiage there.)
Serene
--
42 Magazine, celebrating life with meaning. Issue 2 is here!
http://42magazine.com
"I tend to come down on the side of autonomy. Once people are grown up,
I believe they have the right to go to hell in the handbasket of their
choosing." -- Pat Kight, on alt.polyamory
Russ Allbery
> High-carb diets (the "good carb" kinds) have been shown to reverse
> diabetes, actually. (Not cure, reverse, in case anyone wants to jump on
> me about my verbiage there.)
Is there anything to the "type of sugar" theory of diabetes, where there's
one type of sugar that can be easily digested by most organs and another
that has to be processed by the liver, and it's the backup of the liver
processing leading to internal fat build-up around the organs (as opposed
to the post-processing external fat in more expected fat-bearing areas of
the body) that specifically may be related to diabetes?
I've heard this in a few places and it makes some sense (in that it
explains some of the correlation with weight and eating habits that has
been observed without saying that it's about BMI or being fat or not), but
I'm extremely suspicious of all medical reporting around weight and I
don't know if this is just another of the many crocks of shit that have
been published about weight and diabetes.
--
Russ Allbery (r...@stanford.edu) <http://www.eyrie.org/~eagle/>
Steve Pope
>Rob Wynne wrote:
>> Well, in the case of Type II diabetes, I'm not so much sure it's a
>> cause-and-effect relationship in either direction. High sugar/carb diets
>> in particular may be the root cause of both without their being an
>> relationship between them.
>High-carb diets (the "good carb" kinds) have been shown to reverse
>diabetes, actually. (Not cure, reverse, in case anyone wants to jump on
>me about my verbiage there.)
I'll believe this. The one time my blood sugar crept up above
normal, I was deliberately eating a high refined-carb diet rather
than a whole-wheat sort of diet. (Due to concern about gout/purines.)
I had also gone through a course of steroids (again, to treat gout).
Double whammy.
Steve
Steve Pope
>Is there anything to the "type of sugar" theory of diabetes, where there's
>one type of sugar that can be easily digested by most organs and another
>that has to be processed by the liver, and it's the backup of the liver
>processing leading to internal fat build-up around the organs (as opposed
>to the post-processing external fat in more expected fat-bearing areas of
>the body) that specifically may be related to diabetes?
I have not heard that. I have instead heard that refined carbs
are more immediately digested, creating a greater blood sugar spike
that (repeating over time) feeds insulin resistance.
But you're right about "central fat" being another possible issue.
Steve
Rob Wynne
> Rob Wynne wrote:
>
>> Well, in the case of Type II diabetes, I'm not so much sure it's a
>> cause-and-effect relationship in either direction. High sugar/carb diets
>> in particular may be the root cause of both without their being an
>> relationship between them.
>
> High-carb diets (the "good carb" kinds) have been shown to reverse
> diabetes, actually. (Not cure, reverse, in case anyone wants to jump on
> me about my verbiage there.)
>
Yeah, I'm a big believer in the notion that it's not any particular
macronutrient that's bad, but what particular kinds of foods you're eating.
I'm feeling much better since I cut down on the processed crap and got
more "real" foods in my diet.
Russ Allbery
The theory, as I understand it, is that visceral fat (which I believe is
the correct medical term for it that I finally remembered) is theorized to
make insulin less effective, which leads to insulin resistance over time.
But it's very theoretical at this stage, at least in the reporting of it
I've heard.
http://www.jci.org/articles/view/37385 is sort of thing that I'm seeing.
Fructose is the one that has to be processed by the liver, whereas glucose
is the one that everything can process. (Sucrose is, of course, one of
both.)
http://www.wisegeek.com/what-is-visceral-fat.htm is an overview of
visceral fat (warning: mainstream medical weight article, so standard
caveats apply).
http://lowcarbdiets.about.com/od/nutrition/a/fructosedangers.htm goes
through the glucose vs. fructose processing distinction in about the ways
that I've seen elsewhere (warning: well, you can probably figure out the
obvious warning from the host of the URL :/).
Dan Abel
wrote:
> Serene Vannoy <ser...@serenepages.org> wrote:
> > Rob Wynne wrote:
> >
> >> Well, in the case of Type II diabetes, I'm not so much sure it's a
> >> cause-and-effect relationship in either direction. High sugar/carb diets
> >> in particular may be the root cause of both without their being an
> >> relationship between them.
> >
> > High-carb diets (the "good carb" kinds) have been shown to reverse
> > diabetes, actually. (Not cure, reverse, in case anyone wants to jump on
> > me about my verbiage there.)
I tend to jump on people about their verbiage here, because I just don't
understand it well (and worse yet, it seems to be a moving target).
It's important to me to understand what things mean. So does "reverse"
mean to reverse the symptoms? My diabetes person says "once a diabetic,
always a diabetic". That seems harsh, but I think she has a point.
> Yeah, I'm a big believer in the notion that it's not any particular
> macronutrient that's bad, but what particular kinds of foods you're eating.
I tend to believe that it's whatever it is. I don't think it's a
coincidence, however, that the first thing the doctor asks is about
family history. And many type II diabetics have a family history of
diabetes.
> I'm feeling much better since I cut down on the processed crap and got
> more "real" foods in my diet.
Many people do, especially as they get older.
Maureen
Just an FYI: steroids can spike blood sugar on their own. And can
continue to make things crazy for awhile. But it sounds like you know that.
Maureen