The Republican Plan
Cliff
RD (The Sandman)
news:lr4pe5p6ffn7hlvte...@4ax.com:
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3H3gND4M9HA
>
In that piece he complained that he hadn't heard of any strategy from
Republicans although they have continually stated that they want tort
reform, an end to state boundaries on insurance providers, no loss of
insurance if they lose their jobs, and no preconditions. Perhaps, if
Grayson would shut his mouth for a bit and open his ears he would hear some
of that. ;)
--
Sleep well tonight,
RD (The Sandman)
Let's see if I have this healthcare thingy right. Congress is to pass
a plan written by a committee whose head has said he doesn't understand
it, passed by a Congress that hasn't read it, signed by a president who
hasn't read it, with funding administered by a Treasury chief who didn't
pay his taxes because he didn't understand TurboTax, overseen by an obese
Surgeon General and financed by a country that's nearly broke.
What could possibly go wrong?
Cliff
<Clhuprich...@aoltmovetheperiodc.om> wrote:
John R. Carroll
> Cliff <Clhuprich...@aoltmovetheperiodc.om> wrote in
> news:lr4pe5p6ffn7hlvte...@4ax.com:
>
>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3H3gND4M9HA
>>
>
> In that piece he complained that he hadn't heard of any strategy from
> Republicans although they have continually stated that they want tort
> reform, an end to state boundaries on insurance providers, no loss of
> insurance if they lose their jobs, and no preconditions. Perhaps, if
> Grayson would shut his mouth for a bit and open his ears he would
> hear some of that. ;)
Bellyaching and a plan to achieve your goals aren't the same thing.....
--
John R. Carroll
SgtMinor
> Cliff <Clhuprich...@aoltmovetheperiodc.om> wrote in
> news:lr4pe5p6ffn7hlvte...@4ax.com:
>
>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3H3gND4M9HA
>>
>
> In that piece he complained that he hadn't heard of any strategy from
> Republicans although they have continually stated that they want tort
> reform, an end to state boundaries on insurance providers, no loss of
> insurance if they lose their jobs, and no preconditions. Perhaps, if
> Grayson would shut his mouth for a bit and open his ears he would hear some
> of that. ;)
>
<some cross-posting removed>
You may want to tell that to John Boehner. This is what he stated
earlier today:
"Boehner repeated Saturday the four main elements of the GOP's health
care agenda:
� To let individuals and small businesses look for better insurance
deals in other states.
� To allow them to pool together to receive the kind of insurance deals
typically offered to large corporations.
� To create an environment that gives states greater range to experiment
with cost-saving health care reforms.
� To institute tort reform."
In other words, beyond obstructionism, the GOP got nothing. "Tort
reform" is a joke and, while limiting malpractice victims' rights,
amounts to mere peanuts in potential savings. Grayson nailed it.
We need the public option, and better yet, single payer.
Jerry Okamura
"SgtMinor" <Sa...@the.old.folks.home.invalid> wrote in message
news:R7OdndGYN9puKnHX...@giganews.com...
If you do not put a high value on your freedoms, you want someone else to
pay for what you need or want, like someone else paying for your healthcare.
If you put a high value on your freedom, you don't want anyone to take care
of you, you want to be able to take care of yourself. Or as Benjamin
Franklin said, "They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little
temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety".
SgtMinor
Huh? When we do something together as a society we don't put a high
value on our freedoms? Because I want the police to protect my
community, and the fire department to protect my house, I don't put a
high price on my freedom?
If I receive employer paid health care that means I don't value my freedom?
You go ahead and fight all your battles by yourself. As for me, I"ll go
with Patrick Henry who believed that "united we stand, divided we fall."
Strabo
Inappropriate analogy.
>
> If I receive employer paid health care that means I don't value my freedom?
>
Yes because you encourage your employer, government and corporations
to dictate the terms of your health care. You have no say, no freedom,
in the matter.
As a free man you would buy your services on the free market. There
they are many times cheaper. Below is an example. Compare these prices
with the ridiculous prices charged to insurance companies.
<
http://surgerycenterok.com/pricing.php
>
>
> You go ahead and fight all your battles by yourself. As for me, I"ll go
> with Patrick Henry who believed that "united we stand, divided we fall."
>
"united we stand" means that every one must act *independently according
to shared principles*.
RD (The Sandman)
dkhLnHXnZ2d...@giganews.com:
And which of those do you apply to Grayson?
John R. Carroll
> "John R. Carroll" <nu...@bidness.dev.nul> wrote in news:KpednX18-
> dkhLnHXnZ2d...@giganews.com:
>
>> RD (The Sandman) wrote:
>>> Cliff <Clhuprich...@aoltmovetheperiodc.om> wrote in
>>> news:lr4pe5p6ffn7hlvte...@4ax.com:
>>>
>>>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3H3gND4M9HA
>>>>
>>>
>>> In that piece he complained that he hadn't heard of any strategy
>>> from Republicans although they have continually stated that they
>>> want tort reform, an end to state boundaries on insurance
>>> providers, no loss of insurance if they lose their jobs, and no
>>> preconditions. Perhaps, if Grayson would shut his mouth for a bit
>>> and open his ears he would hear some of that. ;)
>>
>> Bellyaching and a plan to achieve your goals aren't the same
>> thing.....
>>
>
> And which of those do you apply to Grayson?
The part that's going to be enacted into law.
--
John R. Carroll
Jerry Okamura
"SgtMinor" <Sa...@the.old.folks.home.invalid> wrote in message
"If" a group of citizens get together to do something together, they are
doing so because they want to do what they are doing. They are exercizing
their "freedom" to do so. "If" you want the police to protect your
community or the fire department to protect your home, you have said that
you want someone else to protect yourself, or your home, that you are not
willing to protect yourself or protect your own home.
>
> If I receive employer paid health care that means I don't value my
> freedom?
Yes. You are free, when you depend on yourself to provide for your needs.
Anytime you depend on someone else to give you want you want or need, you
are not truly free.
>
> You go ahead and fight all your battles by yourself. As for me, I"ll go
> with Patrick Henry who believed that "united we stand, divided we fall."
I will go with the New Hamshire state motto, "live free or die". By the
way, we are not united, we are divided. Especially on this healthcare
reform bill. You cannot be united, "if" one group of people are trying to
shove down the throats something that many people do not want them to do.
SgtMinor
No, it doesn't mean that. It doesn't have to be a OR b. It can be a
AND b. Just because there are police or fire fighters, or because I
bought home owner's insurance, does not mean in the least that I don't
plan to take care of myself. I am a member of a society, a group of
people living together in a community. We have discovered that it makes
more sense to do certain things together, but that doesn't mean that we
no longer take care of ourselves. Why is the conservative view one of
either/or?
>>
>> If I receive employer paid health care that means I don't value my
>> freedom?
>
> Yes. You are free, when you depend on yourself to provide for your
> needs. Anytime you depend on someone else to give you want you want or
> need, you are not truly free.
Given that definition, it is not possible to be truly free. Even if you
lived on your own little farm, growing you own food, clothing, and
building materials, riding your horse into town, and capturing your own
solar energy, you are still totally dependent on an entire ecosystem.
Your idea of freedom is an illusion.
>>
>> You go ahead and fight all your battles by yourself. As for me, I"ll
>> go with Patrick Henry who believed that "united we stand, divided we
>> fall."
>
> I will go with the New Hamshire state motto, "live free or die". By the
> way, we are not united, we are divided. Especially on this healthcare
> reform bill. You cannot be united, "if" one group of people are trying
> to shove down the throats something that many people do not want them to
> do.
>
I assume you are in favor of open borders, and opposed to those people
who are attempting to shove the idea of "country" down other people's
throats?
SgtMinor
No, it's a pretty good one, actually. His belief is that if something
like an insurance plan pays out, the beneficiary has someone else paying
for his damages. And if that were to happen he doesn't value his
freedom. The poster is renowned for his mastery of twisted logic.
>
> >
>> If I receive employer paid health care that means I don't value my
>> freedom?
>>
>
> Yes because you encourage your employer, government and corporations
> to dictate the terms of your health care. You have no say, no freedom,
> in the matter.
>
> As a free man you would buy your services on the free market. There
> they are many times cheaper. Below is an example. Compare these prices
> with the ridiculous prices charged to insurance companies.
>
> <
> http://surgerycenterok.com/pricing.php
> >
Personally, I'm willing to see an "opt out" provision in any health care
plan. People should be able to carry their own risk. I would ask
however, that they sign a statement to that effect, and place a check
mark next to one of two options:
a) Cease treatments when my money runs out, or
b) If I'm sick and unable to pay for my treatment, I'll throw myself at
the mercy of others, and humbly seek their charity.
A tough guy like you would pick a), no doubt.
>
>
>
> >
>> You go ahead and fight all your battles by yourself. As for me, I"ll
>> go with Patrick Henry who believed that "united we stand, divided we
>> fall."
>>
>
> "united we stand" means that every one must act *independently according
> to shared principles*.
Please buy a dictionary. "United" means "together," or "as a single unit."
Cliff
> When I got fired I was offered medicaid for my familiy for free till I
>started working. FOR FREE! DENTAL TOO!!!
> If you have no job, your whole family is eligable for free
>medicaid...period!
??
Only in Florida, eh?
--
Cliff
Cliff
>
>"Cliff" <Clhuprich...@aoltmovetheperiodc.om> wrote in message
>news:lr4pe5p6ffn7hlvte...@4ax.com...
>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3H3gND4M9HA
>
>I'm too lazy to click on links, especially political ones. But I'm not too
>lazy to post a book about my lousy opinions.
> Health care is broken for some and works fine for others, that's the
>problem. Add to that "both" sides are willing to lie to forward "their"
>cause.
> YES! BOTH SIDES ARE SELF PROMOTING LYING PUKES!!!
>
> If you have a job in America that pays more than minimum wage, chances are
>you have insurance for almost free, considering most people only need
>themselves and their children covered. It's only when a person has a spouse
>at home they have to cover the cost. In our two-working parent family
>culture that is the minority for sure. Those people are hit the hardest,
>from 150-250 a week cash.
> Those people have families and usually have extensive expenses to cover
>and a loss of that much money is devistating.
>
> That can be fixed. As much as I hate to say it..with a government option.
>My wife for example could get her own insurance plan and my boss covers most
>of mine and my kids. The government can enforce health options to make
>people on the plan live healthier. That's the beauty of government programs,
>take it or leave it, you take it, follow the rules. We have a government
>option for hurricane insurance in florida since almost nobody would insure
>us after the 3 in a row week a few years back.
> That government ran insurance company has been profitable to date. Take it
>or get your own.
>
> The next group of people is the so called 40 million uninsured. pfffft.
>It's a lie.
>A total lie.
> When I got fired I was offered medicaid for my familiy for free till I
>started working. FOR FREE! DENTAL TOO!!!
> If you have no job, your whole family is eligable for free
>medicaid...period! There's no poor kids out there with no insurance because
>the resources aren't there! Just like free lunch at school. The dying
>children due to no insurance is just a propaganda gimmic. There's even
>health insurance thru elementary and middle schools for kids, its like 14$ a
>month.
>
>The next group is the minimum wage folks. I feel for them. I'm one bad
>economy from being one of them. They are the victims in this culture. They
>have no money, or benefits.
> However...one minimum wage income is so low you still qualify for medicaid,
>even if your single.
> The problem comes when there's 2 minimum wage workers in a home, now your
>screwed. You make too much for medicaid, and don't get benefits. 200$ a week
>for insurance is 2/3rds or "more of a check(if your in new england)".
>
> They need help, they need a solution. Not the dumb shit sprayed out there,
>but a clever real soluion not thought of yet.
> But...
> Their kids can still get free health care if they bring in less than 40
>grand a year(in florida).
>
>Now there's the self employed. People will NEVER spend 200$ a week on a
>maybe. If its taken from their checks they will, but nobody will pay that
>much for nothing. They would be better off saving their money and have 2
>grand in a couple of months for emergencys.
>
>Billing enforcement would fix that. Forced insurance coverage might be the
>answer, maybe not.
>
>Bottom line is...
>
>There's resources in place. Nothing is going bankrupt, frig, theyv'e
>borrowed from the fund in the past to pay for other stuff. It's not going
>away, if they can grab a trillion out of their ass in the worst of times we
>have NO funding issues with medicare and medicaid.
>
> We need regulation, not new government organisations. That's why everyone
>is so pissed, don't shove nothing up our asses, we just watched the
>government pass plans they never read in 24hrs.
> FUCK THAT!
> They are begging for revolution doing stupid shit like that.
> THATS WHY PEOPLE ARE PISSED! It's not that they are democrats, it's that
>they have the friggen nerve to laugh in our faces and say MIND YOUR OWN
>BUISSINESS< WE ARE THE GOVERNMENT! Learn your role peons!
>
>They could of fixed it all by now, but...there's no plans to fix jack. It's
>simply more government versus less government...
> It's simply been turned into us vs them. problem is we the people are
>neither us nor them.
>
>
>
RD (The Sandman)
All of his goals are going to enacted into law or just his bellyaching?
tankfixer
not_...@bogus.net says...
>
> The ObamaCare bill comes out and Cliff diverts us
> with his anti-Republican rants.
He isn't the only one..
A number of the serial leftists here have launched into non-stop
attempts..
Odd how they all seem to work in concert.. Like they are taking
direction from someone...
Nah..
That would never be the case, right ?
Bret Cahill
Repugs have a plan:
Cut taxes on the rich, starve gummint and utopia will break out.
That's the same plan they use to try to solve every problem.
Bret Cahill
Strabo
As an American I cannot be made a party to any contract outside
my explicit agreement.
Americans don't have to fall for cheap tricks like the inclusive
"opt out." To sign, to opt out, is to acknowledge jurisdiction
automatically placing one under a third party contract.
The default must be that one is automatically out until requesting
to be a part of such a plan.
A tough guy like me wouldn't sign or acknowledge the existence
of the plan.
>>
>> >
>>> You go ahead and fight all your battles by yourself. As for me, I"ll
>>> go with Patrick Henry who believed that "united we stand, divided we
>>> fall."
>>>
>>
>> "united we stand" means that every one must act *independently according
>> to shared principles*.
>
> Please buy a dictionary. "United" means "together," or "as a single unit."
>
Individuals "united" according to shared principles.
pbj
...and never mind that it's never been proven to work.
Beam Me Up Scotty
> On Mon, 02 Nov 2009 21:46:21 -0800, Bret Cahill wrote:
>
>>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3H3gND4M9HA
>> Repugs have a plan:
>>
>> Cut taxes on the rich, starve gummint and utopia will break out.
>>
Government borrows and prints it's way to Utopia. Problem is at the
same time it steals the utopia that belongs to the people and enslaves
us as tax slaves.
--
Bret Cahill
> >> Repugs have a plan:
>
> >> Cut taxes on the rich, starve gummint and utopia will break out.
>
> Government borrows and prints it's way to Utopia.
The obvious solutrion to that is higher taxes on the rich.
Bret Cahill
Beam Me Up Scotty
More regulation on government.
A sunset clause on all Legislation and treaties.
--
Bret Cahill
A constitutional amendment for presidunces that leave no legacy anyone
wants to discuss ("BUTTWATTABOUTBUSH"):
retroactive reversals of his appointees to the bench and fiscal
policy.
Bret Cahill
Jerry Okamura
"SgtMinor" <Sa...@the.old.folks.home.invalid> wrote in message
I did not say it is either/or did I? I said you don't have to depend on
someone else. If you are dependented on someone else, it was the choice you
made.
>
>>>
>>> If I receive employer paid health care that means I don't value my
>>> freedom?
>>
>> Yes. You are free, when you depend on yourself to provide for your
>> needs. Anytime you depend on someone else to give you want you want or
>> need, you are not truly free.
>
> Given that definition, it is not possible to be truly free. Even if you
> lived on your own little farm, growing you own food, clothing, and
> building materials, riding your horse into town, and capturing your own
> solar energy, you are still totally dependent on an entire ecosystem. Your
> idea of freedom is an illusion.
Well, that is a true statement. It is next to impossible to be absolutely
free anymore. But you can have more freedom, if that is important to you.
>
>>>
>>> You go ahead and fight all your battles by yourself. As for me, I"ll go
>>> with Patrick Henry who believed that "united we stand, divided we fall."
>>
>> I will go with the New Hamshire state motto, "live free or die". By the
>> way, we are not united, we are divided. Especially on this healthcare
>> reform bill. You cannot be united, "if" one group of people are trying
>> to shove down the throats something that many people do not want them to
>> do.
>>
>
> I assume you are in favor of open borders, and opposed to those people who
> are attempting to shove the idea of "country" down other people's throats?
No, I am not in favor of open borders. But I also believe that you cannot
stop people from doing what they want to do.
>
Jerry Okamura
"Bret Cahill" <BretC...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:a381be48-d6f9-4d7b...@y28g2000prd.googlegroups.com...
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3H3gND4M9HA
Repugs have a plan:
Perhaps not utopia, but we would have a whole lot more freedom.
pbj
Yeah, Somalia has almost no government to interfere in their lives and
look how free they are!
pbj
s/"Somalia has"/"Somalians have"
Shrikeback
few months until the sewers back up, America
starves, and leftardopia breaks out.
Bret Cahill
>
> > Repugs have a plan:
>
> > Cut taxes on the rich, starve gummint and utopia will break out.
>
> > That's the same plan they use to try to solve every problem.
>
> > Perhaps not utopia, but we would have a whole lot more freedom.
>
> Yeah, Somalia has almost no government to interfere in their lives and
> look how free they are!
A rugged induhvidualist could move to Somalia and land a job as a
pirate.
Bret Cahill
Jerry Okamura
"pbj" <postittoth...@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:4_KdnZ1ca-KYYGzX...@supernews.com...
Well, yes they are free. A whole lot more free than we are in this country.
Some just choose to misuse their freedom. That is the price of freedom.
When you allow people to be free, you are betting the "people" will act
responsibly with their freedom and not misue their freedom. But there is a
difference between Somalia and this country. Our founding fathers gave us
our freedoms. They obviously believed that we would act responsibly with
these freedoms, which we have been for the most part.
Cliff
>On Sat, 07 Nov 2009 06:52:37 -0500, Cliff
><Clhuprich...@aoltmovetheperiodc.om> wrote:
>
>>>Notice the House pulled all the amendments that would prevent illegal
>>>aliens from getting medical care on the new "health care plan"?
>>
>> Good for them !!
>>
>>Cliff
>
>
>Goof for them eh?
Why do you want people working in the US dead?
And their kids?
BTW, Let's see your National Identity implanted RFID chip
and supporting ID cards.
Show at every corner & on demand & I'm demanding.
--
Cliff