Re: Florist sued for beliefs about marriage

[Adam]

On 04/12/2013 10:50 PM, J wrote:
>
>
> It is cases such as this one that exlpains why those who oppose much
> of the gay agenda refer to "homosexual rights" as "special rights".
> Why should the desires of gays supercede the beliefs of others?
>
>
>
> http://www.citizenlink.com/2013/04/11/washington-florist-sued-for-beliefs-about-marriage/
>
>
>
> Newly elected Attorney General Bob Ferguson filed a lawsuit against a
> florist in Richland, Washington, because she declined to provide
> floral arrangements to a same-sex wedding ceremony. Arlene’s Flowers
> is a small business whose owner, Barronelle Stutzman, had served this
> customer for years. She knew he was gay, and it was never an issue,
> because she’s happy to serve everybody.
>
> But she isn’t willing to lend her services to every activity, and when
> it came to a same-sex wedding, she just couldn’t do it. According to
> her statement, she explained herself, he said he respected it; they
> hugged and he left.
>
> No one notified Ms. Stutzman that under the new regime, kindness and
> understanding, while holding true to your convictions, cannot be
> tolerated. After all, we’re on a mission to make the world more
> tolerant.
>
> The suit asks the florist to promise to never again be so naughty and
> pay a fine of $2,000 for stepping out of line. Should a pacifist web
> designer be fined for telling the National Rifle Association he would
> rather not design their website? Should the Republican printer be
> required to print campaign literature for the Democrats?
>
> During the debate over the redefinition of marriage last year in
> Washington State, proponents of natural marriage argued repeatedly
> that this was not simply about people having the opportunity to form
> relationships, but that redefining marriage had consequences for
> education, parental rights, and religious liberty. Despite dozens of
> examples from around the country, they rolled their eyes.
>
> “This won’t make any difference for anyone except for the loving,
> committed couples who will no longer be treated as second class
> citizens,” they argued.
>
> One wonders how many of those who assured us that no one would lose
> their liberty will come to the defense of Arlene’s Flowers?
>


Without being told where she is coming from, a person can't be sure but
it seems she is being hypocritical because she knew he was a homosexual
before and didn't refuse him service then. Is she only taking her stand
now because the marriage issue is still relatively new and
controversial? What self styled type of moral yardstick is she using
that privately selling a few small flowers to faggots is alright but not
doing open weddings?

The truth is that this net has been closing around moral hypocrites for
a long time, especially worldly nominal Christians who have been
addicted to bourgeois living which involved lots of compromise and
rationalization. The lukewarm "God & country" lodge groups have long
lived plush and comfortable by doing, buying and selling in much
merchandise that they knew they shouldn't as moral people, but knew they
could get away with because fashion and country approved even if God
didn't. They had control of their communities and a few special
interests weren't going to threaten that on their best day. Now their
hegemony is unexpectedly fracturing through the ubiquitous disease of
faggots. Moral people have been flirting with immorality for too long,
thinking that class barriers would always keep consequences from
catching up with them. Keep this from catching up with you.


--
Adam & Eve

[Jeanne Douglas]

In article <6chhm8tgvom5mr34g...@4ax.com>,

J <jdyo...@ymail.com> wrote:

> It is cases such as this one that exlpains why those who oppose much
> of the gay agenda refer to "homosexual rights" as "special rights".
> Why should the desires of gays supercede the beliefs of others?

What you're saying that if a florist is against marriage between the
races, it's okay for her to deny her services to them.

--

JD

"Osama Bin Laden is dead and GM is alive."--VP Joseph Biden

[1,939 murdered in Obama's organized communities]

On Fri, 12 Apr 2013 22:03:25 -0700, Jeanne Douglas
<hlwd...@NOSPAMgmail.com> wrote:

>"My brain is dead and my fascism is alive."--VP Joseph Biden

[Jeanne Douglas]

In article <cebim8tg8je8ite4c...@4ax.com>,
"1,939 murdered in Obama's organized communities"

Got a citation for the quote?

--

JD

"Osama Bin Laden is dead and GM is alive."--VP Joseph Biden

[Mitchell Holman]

J <jdyo...@ymail.com> wrote in
news:6chhm8tgvom5mr34g...@4ax.com:

>
>
> It is cases such as this one that exlpains why those who oppose much
> of the gay agenda refer to "homosexual rights" as "special rights".
> Why should the desires of gays supercede the beliefs of others?
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

> http://www.citizenlink.com/2013/04/11/washington-florist-sued-for-belie

> fs-about-marriage/
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Newly elected Attorney General Bob Ferguson filed a lawsuit against a
> florist in Richland, Washington, because she declined to provide
> floral arrangements to a same-sex wedding ceremony.

If she declined to provide services for a
black wedding or a jewish wedding would you
be defending her "rights"?

[Syd M.]

On Apr 12, 10:50 pm, J <jdyou...@ymail.com> wrote:
> It is cases such as this one that exlpains why those who oppose much
> of the gay agenda refer to "homosexual rights" as "special rights".
> Why should the desires of gays supercede the beliefs of others?
>
>

And why should they not be given the same rights as other people,
asshole?

PDW

[Syd M.]

On Apr 13, 8:23 am, Mitchell Holman <nomailverizon.net> wrote:
> J <jdyou...@ymail.com> wrote innews:6chhm8tgvom5mr34g...@4ax.com:

You know that IBen would.

PDW

[Dakota]

If they had refused to provide services to a neo-Nazi wedding, bigot J
would be calling for the ACLU to step in.

[Yer Pal Al]

On Apr 13, 5:23 am, Mitchell Holman <nomailverizon.net> wrote:
> J <jdyou...@ymail.com> wrote innews:6chhm8tgvom5mr34g...@4ax.com:

Would be living in a free society if she could or could not?

[Yer Pal Al]

Is it OK for her to deny a Nazi wedding and not a homosexual wedding?

[Yer Pal Al]

What is the right? Can I go to any business and demand service? What
about the rights of the business owner?

[Mitchell Holman]

Yer Pal Al <caddys...@gmail.com> wrote in
news:db68bf7e-85fc-476c...@fs2g2000pbd.googlegroups.com:

> On Apr 13, 5:23�am, Mitchell Holman <nomailverizon.net> wrote:
>> J <jdyou...@ymail.com> wrote

>> innews:6chhm8tgvom5mr34g57gaief7r692af4af@4a

> x.com:
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> > It is cases such as this one that exlpains why those who oppose
>> > much of the gay agenda refer to "homosexual rights" as "special
>> > rights". Why should the desires of gays supercede the beliefs of
>> > others?
>>
>> >http://www.citizenlink.com/2013/04/11/washington-florist-sued-for-bel
>> >ie
>> > fs-about-marriage/
>>
>> > Newly elected Attorney General Bob Ferguson filed a lawsuit against
>> > a florist in Richland, Washington, because she declined to provide
>> > floral arrangements to a same-sex wedding ceremony.
>>
>> � �If she declined to provide services for a
>> black wedding or a jewish wedding would you
>> be defending her "rights"?
>
> Would be living in a free society if she could or could not?
>

?????

[Yer Pal Al]

On Apr 13, 8:57 am, Mitchell Holman <nomailverizon.net> wrote:

Would we be living in a freer society if she could not chose who she
does business with?

[Mitchell Holman]

Yer Pal Al <caddys...@gmail.com> wrote in

news:5392a1da-b71d-4cf7...@k6g2000pbq.googlegroups.com:

> On Apr 13, 8:57�am, Mitchell Holman <nomailverizon.net> wrote:
>> Yer Pal Al <caddyshack...@gmail.com> wrote

>> innews:db68bf7e-85fc-476c-ac0d
> -82a7d6...@fs2g2000pbd.googlegroups.com:

>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> > On Apr 13, 5:23�am, Mitchell Holman <nomailverizon.net> wrote:
>> >> J <jdyou...@ymail.com> wrote
>> >> innews:6chhm8tgvom5mr34g57gaief7r692af4af@4a
>> > x.com:
>>
>> >> > It is cases such as this one that exlpains why those who oppose
>> >> > much of the gay agenda refer to "homosexual rights" as "special
>> >> > rights". Why should the desires of gays supercede the beliefs of
>> >> > others?
>>
>> >> >http://www.citizenlink.com/2013/04/11/washington-florist-sued-for-
>> >> >bel ie
>> >> > fs-about-marriage/
>>
>> >> > Newly elected Attorney General Bob Ferguson filed a lawsuit
>> >> > against a florist in Richland, Washington, because she declined
>> >> > to provide floral arrangements to a same-sex wedding ceremony.
>>
>> >> � �If she declined to provide services for a
>> >> black wedding or a jewish wedding would you
>> >> be defending her "rights"?
>>
>> > Would be living in a free society if she could or could not?
>>
>> ?????
>
> Would we be living in a freer society if she could not chose who she
> does business with?


Would we be living in a freer society if

customers could be denied service because of
their race or religion?

[Mitchell Holman]

Yer Pal Al <caddys...@gmail.com> wrote in news:88861272-b7ce-4ca4-9b3c-
d8ad19...@af5g2000pbd.googlegroups.com:

Business owners have to follow the law.


"The Federal Civil Rights Act guarantees all
people the right to "full and equal enjoyment
of the goods, services, facilities, privileges,
advantages, and accommodations of any place of
public accommodation, without discrimination
or segregation on the ground of race, color,
religion, or national origin."

https://www.legalzoom.com/us-law/equal-rights/right-refuse-service

[linuxgal]

Mitchell Holman wrote:
> "The Federal Civil Rights Act guarantees all
> people the right to "full and equal enjoyment
> of the goods, services, facilities, privileges,
> advantages, and accommodations of any place of
> public accommodation, without discrimination
> or segregation on the ground of race, color,
> religion, or national origin."

Needs to be updated to include sexual preference.

--
Halftime at Circvs Maximvs, and the Lions lead the Christians 326-0

[J]

On Sat, 13 Apr 2013 11:40:18 -0800, linuxgal <linu...@cleanposts.com>
wrote:

>Mitchell Holman wrote:
>> "The Federal Civil Rights Act guarantees all
>> people the right to "full and equal enjoyment
>> of the goods, services, facilities, privileges,
>> advantages, and accommodations of any place of
>> public accommodation, without discrimination
>> or segregation on the ground of race, color,
>> religion, or national origin."
>
>Needs to be updated to include sexual preference.

But as the law stands now, doesn't. So why is the deeply moral woman
facing repercussions?



J Young
jdyo...@ymail.com

Honesty. Decency. Integrity

[_ G O D _]

"J" <jdyo...@ymail.com> wrote
news:1hfjm85r4f9065ocl...@4ax.com...

Why do COcksucking sectarian retards
always think about sexual preferences?
--
_____________________________________________________
http://www.un.org/en/documents/udhr/index.shtml
I intend to last long enough to put out of business all COck-suckers
and other beneficiaries of the institutionalized slavery and genocide.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"The army that will defeat terrorism doesn't wear uniforms, or drive
Humvees, or calls in air-strikes. It doesn't have a high command, or
high security, or a high budget. The army that can defeat terrorism
does battle quietly, clearing minefields and vaccinating children. It
undermines military dictatorships and military lobbyists. It subverts
sweatshops and special interests.Where people feel powerless, it
helps them organize for change, and where people are powerful, it
reminds them of their responsibility." ~~~~ Author Unknown ~~~~
___________________________________________________
--

[Mitchell Holman]

J <jdyo...@ymail.com> wrote in news:1hfjm85r4f9065ocllv3vgm2pe9umsd27i@
4ax.com:

"I refuse to serve you because of the way you were born"

What is "deeply moral" about that?

[Jeanne Douglas]

In article <1hfjm85r4f9065ocl...@4ax.com>,

Bigots are never moral.

[casey]

Rights are not innate they are given by the society you live in.

In a free society you are not free to deny others their freedom
to be part of the economic system.

Yes you can in a free society expect to receive the same
service as anyone else. A business thrives because it is
part of a society and the business owner owes society
for providing that essential ingredient in their success.
You might like to google some psychology on the feral rich
and their distorted views of their own importance.

[1,939 murdered in Obama's organized communities]

If she refused to sell you parts for a 747 would you sue her? Who
said she can limit her business to just flowers?

If she chooses to limit her business, that is her choice, not a
fascist government or its proponents.

[1,939 murdered in Obama's organized communities]

On Sat, 13 Apr 2013 13:32:21 -0500, Mitchell Holman

Were you forced to that particular florist at gunpoint?

[1,939 murdered in Obama's organized communities]

On Sat, 13 Apr 2013 11:40:18 -0800, linuxgal <linu...@cleanposts.com>
wrote:

>Mitchell Holman wrote:
>> "The Federal Civil Rights Act guarantees all
>> people the right to "full and equal enjoyment
>> of the goods, services, facilities, privileges,
>> advantages, and accommodations of any place of
>> public accommodation, without discrimination
>> or segregation on the ground of race, color,
>> religion, or national origin."
>
>Needs to be updated to include sexual preference.

And when will ~someone~ think of the shirtless and barefoot?

[1,939 murdered in Obama's organized communities]

On Sat, 13 Apr 2013 13:35:40 -0500, Mitchell Holman
<nomailverizon.net> wrote:

>Yer Pal Al <caddys...@gmail.com> wrote in news:88861272-b7ce-4ca4-9b3c-
>d8ad19...@af5g2000pbd.googlegroups.com:
>
>> On Apr 13, 7:19�am, "Syd M." <pauldavidwri...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>> On Apr 12, 10:50�pm, J <jdyou...@ymail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> > It is cases such as this one that exlpains why those who oppose much
>>> > of the gay agenda refer to "homosexual rights" as "special rights".
>>> > Why should the desires of gays supercede the beliefs of others?
>>>
>>> And why should they not be given the same rights as other people,
>>> asshole?
>>
>> What is the right? Can I go to any business and demand service? What
>> about the rights of the business owner?
>>
>
>
> Business owners have to follow the law.

Business owners have no rights under fascism.

[1,939 murdered in Obama's organized communities]

Occupier bullshit. Begone, foul git!

[Mitchell Holman]

"1,939 murdered in Obama's organized communities"

<Tawana....@whitehouse.gov> wrote in
news:eufkm8hsdvo3jcioi...@4ax.com:

The Federal Civil Rights Act prevents merchants
from denying service to people on the basis of race,

color, religion, or national origin.

The days of "No Jews Need Apply" and "Whites Only"
are over.

[Mitchell Holman]

"1,939 murdered in Obama's organized communities"
<Tawana....@whitehouse.gov> wrote in

news:e7gkm8165ua7l1jng...@4ax.com:

> On Sat, 13 Apr 2013 13:35:40 -0500, Mitchell Holman
> <nomailverizon.net> wrote:
>
>>Yer Pal Al <caddys...@gmail.com> wrote in
>>news:88861272-b7ce-4ca4-9b3c-
>>d8ad19...@af5g2000pbd.googlegroups.com:
>>
>>> On Apr 13, 7:19�am, "Syd M." <pauldavidwri...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>> On Apr 12, 10:50�pm, J <jdyou...@ymail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> > It is cases such as this one that exlpains why those who oppose
>>>> > much of the gay agenda refer to "homosexual rights" as "special
>>>> > rights". Why should the desires of gays supercede the beliefs of
>>>> > others?
>>>>
>>>> And why should they not be given the same rights as other people,
>>>> asshole?
>>>
>>> What is the right? Can I go to any business and demand service? What
>>> about the rights of the business owner?
>>>
>>
>>
>> Business owners have to follow the law.
>
> Business owners have no rights under fascism.

If business owners are that adament about
not serving people then maybe they should not
be in business.

At least in this country........

[Yer Pal Al]

On Apr 13, 11:32 am, Mitchell Holman <nomailverizon.net> wrote:

> Yer Pal Al <caddyshack...@gmail.com> wrote innews:5392a1da-b71d-4cf7...@k6g2000pbq.googlegroups.com:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Apr 13, 8:57 am, Mitchell Holman <nomailverizon.net> wrote:
> >> Yer Pal Al <caddyshack...@gmail.com> wrote
> >> innews:db68bf7e-85fc-476c-ac0d

> > -82a7d6162...@fs2g2000pbd.googlegroups.com:

>
> >> > On Apr 13, 5:23 am, Mitchell Holman <nomailverizon.net> wrote:
> >> >> J <jdyou...@ymail.com> wrote
> >> >> innews:6chhm8tgvom5mr34g57gaief7r692af4af@4a
> >> > x.com:
>
> >> >> > It is cases such as this one that exlpains why those who oppose
> >> >> > much of the gay agenda refer to "homosexual rights" as "special
> >> >> > rights". Why should the desires of gays supercede the beliefs of
> >> >> > others?
>
> >> >> >http://www.citizenlink.com/2013/04/11/washington-florist-sued-for-
> >> >> >bel ie
> >> >> > fs-about-marriage/
>
> >> >> > Newly elected Attorney General Bob Ferguson filed a lawsuit
> >> >> > against a florist in Richland, Washington, because she declined
> >> >> > to provide floral arrangements to a same-sex wedding ceremony.
>
> >> >> If she declined to provide services for a
> >> >> black wedding or a jewish wedding would you
> >> >> be defending her "rights"?
>
> >> > Would be living in a free society if she could or could not?
>
> >> ?????
>
> > Would we be living in a freer society if she could not chose who she
> > does business with?
>
>     Would we be living in a freer society if
> customers could be denied service because of
> their race or religion?

Yes just like I can deny you food out of my refrigerator. Now if the
government forced me to feed you we now live in a less freer society.

[Yer Pal Al]

On Apr 14, 5:41 am, Mitchell Holman <nomailverizon.net> wrote:
> "1,939 murdered in Obama's organized communities"

> <Tawana.Braw...@whitehouse.gov> wrote innews:eufkm8hsdvo3jcioi...@4ax.com:

>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Sat, 13 Apr 2013 07:23:37 -0500, Mitchell Holman
> > <nomailverizon.net> wrote:
>

> >>J <jdyou...@ymail.com> wrote in

> >>news:6chhm8tgvom5mr34g...@4ax.com:
>
> >>> It is cases such as this one that exlpains why those who oppose much
> >>> of the gay agenda refer to "homosexual rights" as "special rights".
> >>> Why should the desires of gays supercede the beliefs of others?
>
> >>>http://www.citizenlink.com/2013/04/11/washington-florist-sued-for-
> belie
> >>> fs-about-marriage/
>
> >>> Newly elected Attorney General Bob Ferguson filed a lawsuit against a
> >>> florist in Richland, Washington, because she declined to provide
> >>> floral arrangements to a same-sex wedding ceremony.
>
> >>   If she declined to provide services for a
> >>black wedding or a jewish wedding would you
> >>be defending her "rights"?
>
> > If she refused to sell you parts for a 747 would you sue her?  Who
> > said she can limit her business to just flowers?
>
> > If she chooses to limit her business, that is her choice, not a
> > fascist government or its proponents.
>
>   The Federal Civil Rights Act prevents merchants
> from denying service to people on the basis of race,
> color, religion, or national origin.
>
>   The days of "No Jews Need Apply" and "Whites Only"
> are over.

It's less freedom though.

[Yer Pal Al]

On Apr 13, 11:35 am, Mitchell Holman <nomailverizon.net> wrote:
> Yer Pal Al <caddyshack...@gmail.com> wrote in news:88861272-b7ce-4ca4-9b3c-
> d8ad19909...@af5g2000pbd.googlegroups.com:

You didn't answer the question. What is the right?

[Mitchell Holman]

Yer Pal Al <caddys...@gmail.com> wrote in

news:9cf42fbb-d074-47c0...@pa2g2000pbb.googlegroups.com:

> On Apr 14, 5:41�am, Mitchell Holman <nomailverizon.net> wrote:
>> "1,939 murdered in Obama's organized communities"
>> <Tawana.Braw...@whitehouse.gov> wrote

>> innews:eufkm8hsdvo3jcioi10hm7bddabr
> 5ok...@4ax.com:

Perhaps you should move to a country with
more of your kind of "freedom", like Sudan or
Somalia.

[Mitchell Holman]

Yer Pal Al <caddys...@gmail.com> wrote in

news:fd4effb7-df16-49ab...@ut5g2000pbc.googlegroups.com:

It is the right to participate in commerce
as a consumber without being victimized by
discrimination.

[MarkA]

On Fri, 12 Apr 2013 19:50:19 -0700, J wrote:

>
>
> It is cases such as this one that exlpains why those who oppose much of
> the gay agenda refer to "homosexual rights" as "special rights". Why
> should the desires of gays supercede the beliefs of others?
>

Come on, J, you know the reason. Stand in front of a mirror and say it
out loud. It will make you feel much better:

"It is against the law, and appropriately so, for a business to
discriminate against customers because of their age, gender, race,
religion, or sexual orientation."

--
MarkA
Keeper of Things Put There Only Just The Night Before
About eight o'clock

[Brian E. Clark]

In article <9cf42fbb-d074-47c0-a783-
8d4282...@pa2g2000pbb.googlegroups.com>,
caddys...@gmail.com says...

> >
> >   The days of "No Jews Need Apply" and "Whites Only"
> > are over.
>
> It's less freedom though.
>

You're thinking only of the freedom of the business owner
-- as people like you are wont to do.


--
-----------
Brian E. Clark

[Yer Pal Al]

On Apr 15, 4:56 am, Mitchell Holman <nomailverizon.net> wrote:

Somalia: Christian is forced by the government to go against his
conscience.
United States: Christian is forced by the government to go against his
conscience.

[Yer Pal Al]

On Apr 15, 4:12 pm, Brian E. Clark <brianecl...@newsgroup.reply.only>
wrote:
> In article <9cf42fbb-d074-47c0-a783-
> 8d4282b1b...@pa2g2000pbb.googlegroups.com>,
> caddyshack...@gmail.com says...

>
>
>
> > >   The days of "No Jews Need Apply" and "Whites Only"
> > > are over.
>
> > It's less freedom though.
>
> You're thinking only of the freedom of the business owner
> -- as people like you are wont to do.

The right not to know who your neighborhood racist is reigns supreme.
That way we can't avoid his business.

[Mitchell Holman]

Yer Pal Al <caddys...@gmail.com> wrote in

news:4f648fad-c5d7-4c1d...@gh3g2000pbd.googlegroups.com:

> United States: Christian is forced by the government to go against his
> conscience.

Proof?

[Yer Pal Al]

On Apr 16, 5:30 am, Mitchell Holman <nomailverizon.net> wrote:

> Yer Pal Al <caddyshack...@gmail.com> wrote innews:4f648fad-c5d7-4c1d...@gh3g2000pbd.googlegroups.com:
>
> > United States: Christian is forced by the government to go against his
> > conscience.
>
>     Proof?

You don't even know what event we are talking about? Also Catholic
health care and Hobby Town forced to provide abortions by Obamacare.
Where have you been?

[Mitchell Holman]

Yer Pal Al <caddys...@gmail.com> wrote in

news:f3a087dc-0c3e-4a82...@k6g2000pbq.googlegroups.com:

> On Apr 16, 5:30 am, Mitchell Holman <nomailverizon.net> wrote:
>> Yer Pal Al <caddyshack...@gmail.com> wrote

>> innews:4f648fad-c5d7-4c1d-9d44
> -91c361...@gh3g2000pbd.googlegroups.com:

>>
>> > United States: Christian is forced by the government to go against
>> > his conscience.
>>
>>     Proof?
>
> You don't even know what event we are talking about? Also Catholic
> health care and Hobby Town forced to provide abortions by Obamacare.
> Where have you been?

Oh, that. And the "religious freedom" to deny ALL
health care insurance for your workers by claiming
you are Christian Scientist and don't believe in
medical treatment. Never mind the health needs of
others, your religious conscience is more important
than them.

How selfish can you be?

[Yer Pal Al]

On Apr 16, 2:04 pm, Mitchell Holman <nomailverizon.net> wrote:

> Yer Pal Al <caddyshack...@gmail.com> wrote innews:f3a087dc-0c3e-4a82...@k6g2000pbq.googlegroups.com:
>
> > On Apr 16, 5:30 am, Mitchell Holman <nomailverizon.net> wrote:
> >> Yer Pal Al <caddyshack...@gmail.com> wrote
> >> innews:4f648fad-c5d7-4c1d-9d44

> > -91c3619e0...@gh3g2000pbd.googlegroups.com:

>
> >> > United States: Christian is forced by the government to go against
> >> > his conscience.
>
> >>     Proof?
>
> > You don't even know what event we are talking about? Also Catholic
> > health care and Hobby Town forced to provide abortions by Obamacare.
> > Where have you been?
>
>   Oh, that. And the "religious freedom" to deny ALL
> health care insurance for your workers by claiming
> you are Christian Scientist and don't believe in
> medical treatment. Never mind the health needs of
> others, your religious conscience is more important
> than them.

It's good that we live in an increasingly mobile society - where it's
not an impossibility to change jobs. I once had a Catholic HMO - had
to pay for my wife's birth control out of my pocket. The camera store
I go to in New York is owned and run by Orthodox Jews. Sometimes I
can't even make a purchase online because it's a Jewish holiday. Isn't
freedom great? That was a rhetorical question because I understand
that you don't really care for other people's freedom.

What you'll find in a free market is that the Christian Scientist is
going to have to pay more to attract employees who aren't Christian
Scientist. Or in Obama's economy they will consider themselves lucky
to just have jobs.

>   How selfish can you be?

How socialist can you be? When will you stop trying to take away
other's freedoms for the common good?

[Mike Cullinan]

On Saturday, April 13, 2013 7:23:37 AM UTC-5, Mitchell Holman wrote:

> If she declined to provide services for a
>
> black wedding or a jewish wedding would you
>
> be defending her "rights"?

Why don't you try this analogy on for size: You're a a flower-shop owner and representatives from the Mormon church come to you and want you to do some centerpieces and decorations for a banquet in which there will be speakers from NOM and the Family Research Council, among others. The theme will be "The Eternal Marriage of Man and Woman." You are very supportive of SSM, have gay friends who are married, donate money to the HRC and enthusiastically support SSM.

The idea of having to provide flower arrangements for an event promoting a message that you despise fills you with disgust and revulsion, horrifies you.

Do you still want to toss aside that first amendment in this case?

[Mike Cullinan]

On Saturday, April 13, 2013 1:35:40 PM UTC-5, Mitchell Holman wrote:
> Yer Pal Al <caddys...@gmail.com> wrote in news:88861272-b7ce-4ca4-9b3c-

>

>
> Business owners have to follow the law.

>
> "The Federal Civil Rights Act guarantees all
>
> people the right to "full and equal enjoyment
>
> of the goods, services, facilities, privileges,
>
> advantages, and accommodations of any place of
>
> public accommodation, without discrimination
>

> or segregation on the ground of race, color,
>
> religion, or national origin."

>
> https://www.legalzoom.com/us-law/equal-rights/right-refuse-service

You need to look up what "public accommodation means"

inns, hotels, motels, or other organizations that provide accommodation to temporary visitors

restaurants, cafeterias, lunchrooms, lunch counters, soda fountains, or other facilities providing food for consumption

motion picture houses, theaters, concert halls, sports arenas, stadiums or other places of exhibition or entertainment

also:

"II. Under the First Amendment, Speech Compulsions Are Generally Treated the Same as Speech Restrictions"

"The United States Supreme Court has long recognized that the First Amendment prohibits speech compulsions as well as speech restrictions. “The right to speak and the right to refrain from speaking are complementary components of the broader concept of ‘individual freedom of mind.’” Wooley, 430 U.S. at 714 (quoting West Va. State Bd. of Ed. v. Barnette, 319 U.S. 624, 637 (1943))."

"In Wooley, the Maynards objected to having to display the state motto on their government-issued license plates, and sought the right to obscure the motto. Wooley, 430 U.S. at 707–08, 715. Of course, no observer would have understood the motto — printed by the government on a government-provided and government-mandated license plate — as the driver’s own words or the driver’s own sentiments. Yet the Court nonetheless held for the Maynards."

"A driver’s “individual freedom of mind,” the Court reasoned, protects her “First Amendment right to avoid becoming the courier” for the communication of speech that she does not wish to communicate. Id. at 717. Drivers have the “right to decline to foster . . . concepts” with which they disagree, even when the government requires merely that drivers display a slogan on a government-issued license plate. Id. at 714."

http://www.volokh.com/2012/11/02/amicus-brief-in-elane-photography-v-willock-the-new-mexico-wedding-photography-case/#more-66932

[1,945 murdered in Obama's organized communities]

On Tue, 16 Apr 2013 16:04:49 -0500, Mitchell Holman

<nomailverizon.net> wrote:

>Yer Pal Al <caddys...@gmail.com> wrote in
>news:f3a087dc-0c3e-4a82...@k6g2000pbq.googlegroups.com:
>
>> On Apr 16, 5:30�am, Mitchell Holman <nomailverizon.net> wrote:
>>> Yer Pal Al <caddyshack...@gmail.com> wrote
>>> innews:4f648fad-c5d7-4c1d-9d44
>> -91c361...@gh3g2000pbd.googlegroups.com:
>>>
>>> > United States: Christian is forced by the government to go against
>>> > his conscience.
>>>
>>> � � Proof?
>>
>> You don't even know what event we are talking about? Also Catholic
>> health care and Hobby Town forced to provide abortions by Obamacare.
>> Where have you been?
>
>
> Oh, that. And the "religious freedom" to deny ALL
>health care insurance for your workers by claiming
>you are Christian Scientist and don't believe in
>medical treatment. Never mind the health needs of
>others, your religious conscience is more important
>than them.
>
> How selfish can you be?

Get another job. There's always a ditch to be dug or a toilet to be
cleaned.